Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Match Threads & Player Ratings => Topic started by: Legion on September 13, 2013, 07:30:02 PM
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Available Saturday evening @4.45pm.
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Very poor indeed - I'm shocked by this display.
Lowton, Weimann and Westwood all need to be benched - we have options , give sylla , tonev and bacuna a chance at Norwich .
This display has really shaken me -utterly unacceptable!
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Another shit weekend and a shit week beckons avoiding any football discussion at all costs.
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We need a playmaker.
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Pish
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Totally inept today. A big improvement needed or we will have another very tough season ahead of us.
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Terrible stuff. It will be another long season if this continues. Lambert needs to have a long hard look at his home tactics. We give the other team far too much of the ball and space.
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We look shapeless, guileless and technically poor. I think we'll be in for another poor season.
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I didn't see that performance coming. Perhaps expectations got a little bit high with Benteke re-signing etc etc.
We were very shit last year, I'm more down about the Okore injury
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The defence still looks poor. On that performance none of the back 4 are good enough.
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Absolutely diabolical from start to finish, that is as clueless as I've seen us for a while. How Weimann stayed on the pitch as long as he did I'll never know. That was fucking atrocious and an embarrassment to the club. For starters next week Weimann, Lowton and KEA must be dropped , because the first two in particular need to know they're not bullet proof. I think Weimann and Lowton were the worst performers. Also hopefully Okore isn't too badly injured.
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Very poor indeed - I'm shocked by this display.
Lowton, Weimann and Westwood all need to be benched - we have options , give sylla , tonev and bacuna a chance at Norwich .
This display has really shaken me -utterly unacceptable!
Can't disagree with that Eastie
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We look shapeless, guileless and technically poor. I think we'll be in for another poor season.
So sad to see after the events of the summer and the first match.
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Not seen the game, but sounds very disappointing. Let's hope that in some way the stop-start nature of our season so far has been a factor. Or we look like we might struggle for a fourth consecutive season.
Does sound like a few of our players are having exactly what I feared - second season syndrome, at least at the outset. Hopefully they'll recover their form soon. I'm just not sure from what I've seen that Tonev (for Weimann) Bacuna (for Lowton or Westwood) are really ready to go into the side.
For next week, there is certainly a good case for some changes. Think Lowton could really struggle against Redmond.
Remind me why I build my saturdays around football so much? It's such a waste of free time!
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I would say a very shocking result that. to bring it back and then concede again is last season all over again. two goals conceeded against toon at home!? Unacceptable.
looks like we're going to struggle again after all that promise following first 2 games.
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Worst thing is Newcastle are rubbish.
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lambert's shit. he's had enough time and enough money and apart from Benteke his signings have not been great. I know I will get slated for this but time to own up to the reality reality. Newcastle have spend fuck all in the summer and are a club riven by malcontent, yet have double our points tally. utterly disgraceful Villa.
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If we play like that for the rest of season we'll be relegated, so it's critical we improve a lot. We desperately need guile in the midfield.
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Some really, really predictable flaws in that team. Set up to counter attack against a competitor at home, surprisingly we lacked incision when we tried to play on the front foot. No playmaker, and when we sent the big man on and went to an aimless 4-2-4, we looked absolutely atrocious.
£7m, PL. £7m is a lot of money to go on the wrong player, or at best the right player at the wrong time. I didn't think it mattered before as I assumed we wouldn't be in a relegation scrap, but after that? We may well be.
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So many problems
Target men with no wingers ..why
No width leaves the FB exposed time and time again
Lack of drive in midfield
No ability to keep a clean sheet
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Some random thoughts:
1. Newcastle were first to every 50/50 and their players were always first to react
2. The number of times we gave the ball away from restarts (free kicks, throw ins) was unacceptable
3. The number of times we gave the ball away from simple passes, when the passer had time on the ball, was unacceptable
(1-3 suggests our players were not concentrating 100% - maybe they also saw this as an easy win?)
4. The number of times our players made bone-headed decisions (Luna not shooting, Gabby cutting in and running straight into a group of players, allowing Ben-Arfa to cut inside...) was unacceptable.
(4 suggests we lack "football brains" on the pitch)
5. Despite their league position last year, Newcastle have better players than us in most positions.
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lambert's shit. he's had enough time and enough money and apart from Benteke his signings have not been great. I know I will get slated for this but time to own up to the reality reality. Newcastle have spend fuck all in the summer and are a club riven by malcontent, yet have double our points tally. utterly disgraceful Villa.
Yay, I've missed the complete over reactions on the post match thread. I'll agree with this if we're bottom six around xmas.
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New contract = no hunger?
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How many league games is that now without a clean sheet.
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Absolutely unacceptable. Another season of struggle and Lambert and the team will not be afforded the amount of goodwill they had last season
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I can't remember the last time I saw us give the ball away so much. Overall that was shit. Delph motm again. Got away from the ground quick mind.
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Ball retention was awful with the midfield, Weimann and Luna guilty. First half was a waste of time then we then upped the tempo got on level terms but played into the away team's hand bu have 4 strikers on the pitch. A goal from a counter attack was always a threat and duly occurred. Poor tactics by PL today.
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Some random thoughts:
(SNIP)
Another thought: we will win no more that 4 league games at home this season.
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Really poor performance, as bad as anything from last season.
To be honest I don't think we've been that good in any of the games this season. Okore will be a big miss, even though I thought Clarke did ok.
Delph aside I thought every one was below par today. Both full backs were bad in both directions. Westwood, Weimann and goal apart Benteke wern't at the races. Gabby, Luna and Weimann all guilty of terrible misses.
There were moments when we looked all right when we got the tempo of our passing going but I'm not sure if we can carry on with thus line up if Weimann KEA and Westwoods form doesn't improve.
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There's definitely cause for concern, I agree. But I don't think we should discount the possibility that 3 weeks without a top flight game may have been a real factor so early in the season.
I do tend to agree that if we had c £7m to spend on one player, a more assertive and creative central midfielder would have seemed the more obvious choice.
You do wonder what Benteke thinks. He wasn't great today, but it doesn't sound like he had much service. All his international team-mates play for teams that are much better than us.
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And how Weimann stayed on the pitch so long is beyond me. He was awful again. Has to be dropped in my opinion
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I can't remember the last time I saw us give the ball away so much. Overall that was shit. Delph motm again. Got away from the ground quick mind.
Our ball retention and accuracy was about Blue Square Premier level. Lambert has a lot of work to do. Sylla needs to be back in the midfield.
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Another thought. If we had a Ben Arfa type player we'd still be unbeaten.
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The defence is poor, but it's the midfield that's the real problem. It just ain't good enough. Midfielders can do one of two jobs principally: either they sit back and defend, or they make forward runs and create/score.
Which of those categories do our midfielders fall into exactly, because I seriously cannot see what their main purpose is.
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Another thought. If we had a Ben Arfa type player we'd still be unbeaten.
Yep creative midfield is desperately lacking.
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6 wins in 34 home games.
No clean sheet in 26 league games.
Those two stats show you everything you need to know about how poor this group of players are. Benteke must be cursing himself for withdrawing his transfer request.
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And how Weimann stayed on the pitch so long is beyond me. He was awful again. Has to be dropped in my opinion
Him and Lowton, they were both horrendously poor.
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Why has Sylla made way for KEA when he was a vital cog in our resurgence last spring?!?! I know he was injured for a bit, but he should be fit now. Strange.
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Sylla MUST start when he's fit, we need his physicality in our midfield. I really hope this was just due not playing for couple weeks or we're gonna have a really long season ahead. Why the hell didn't he take off Weimann at 50-60min is beyond me, he had his worst game for us I've seen.
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Crap. No playmaker. No formation. No width. Defensively ropey.
My major worries after today:
-Who do we have in midfield who you could call even close to being a decent ball player? I'm talking someone who can dribble with it, and comfortably, good touch and can pick a pass? Newcastle had Ben Arfa. We have no one. Westwood is a tidy player but average in every aspect bar using the ball nicely (when he's on form, which is not at the moment). Delph has great energy, but lacks a first touch. KEA is mediocre and Sylla's more athletic. We've got N'Zog on the books but he's injured, and probably won't figure in PL's plans anyway.
-Our defending. It's awful. The gaps left by the fullbacks are massive and when they are in position defensively, they're isolated.
-Lamberts persistent failure to address issue within a game. Ben Arfa destroyed our fullbacks, mostly Luna, all game. He did nothing about it. He didn't double up, he didn't instruct Luna to get tighter. Nothing.
-Lamberts tactical nous, or thorough lack of. This 4-2-4 madness has to end. This lack of width has to end. Strange substitution choices.
-Wiemann as a wideman. I think he was initially a stop gap there, but he's found out now. He cannot be a long term solution as a right sided forward.
I like Lambert but there's still major problems with the way hes organising things on the pitch. The guy can spot talent. He's got the right ethos, but I think he needs a good number 2 who can fine tune us tactically, and perhaps someone more experienced at this level.
I think we're much the same as last season in all honesty. We also need to realise that our goal to play football the "right" way, or perhaps the Arsenal way, is a long way off. Players like Gabby, Wiemann, Delph, and KEA who started today aren't technically gifted enough.
We passed it poorly. Our movement was poor. We often had four strikers (particularly when Kozak came on) all crammed into central positions up top, isolating our two man midfield.
I think at home we should be looking at a different formation, or at least playing with more width. If Gabby would have stayed wide he could have had some joy.
Man of match today: Delph again. Vlaar also did quite well today.
That said, Arfa was a class apart today from anyone on the pitch.
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It sounded like we played well for twenty five minutes at the start of the second half - we seemed to miss some great chances?
But then let in a bad goal and went pretty long ball 442? And Newcastle seemed to have a fair few more chances than us too?
Was Guzan at fault for the second? Sounded like Ben Arfa had Luna on toast?
Disappointing. Very disappointing. We don't look a top ten contender at the moment, do we?
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Once again, Villa season-ticket holders are being made complete and utter mugs of. Spending all that cash for another 20 games a year of insipid, uninspired dross. This has been going on for years!
You'd have much more fun at a Miley Cyrus concert and save a fortune.
Villa, get twerking you useless bunch of muppets.
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And another random thing while sitting on the 7. Newcastle fans are utter twats. If they had come at me like that I'd have twatted them as well. Wankers.
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The defence is poor, but it's the midfield that's the real problem. It just ain't good enough. Midfielders can do one of two jobs principally: either they sit back and defend, or they make forward runs and create/score.
Which of those categories do our midfielders fall into exactly, because I seriously cannot see what their main purpose is.
They're meant to do both, or at least share those jobs between them. They're main job is to keep the ball - and they didn't really do that either, and they didn't have a chance when Lambo went 4-2-4.
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Some random thoughts:
1. Newcastle were first to every 50/50 and their players were always first to react
2. The number of times we gave the ball away from restarts (free kicks, throw ins) was unacceptable
3. The number of times we gave the ball away from simple passes, when the passer had time on the ball, was unacceptable
(1-3 suggests our players were not concentrating 100% - maybe they also saw this as an easy win?)
4. The number of times our players made bone-headed decisions (Luna not shooting, Gabby cutting in and running straight into a group of players, allowing Ben-Arfa to cut inside...) was unacceptable.
(4 suggests we lack "football brains" on the pitch)
5. Despite their league position last year, Newcastle have better players than us in most positions.
Agree on that last point. And whose fault is that? Lambert has had the freedom to shape the team pretty much how he wants 1 to 11. And with £23 million spent last year and £17 million this, the sums have not been insignificant either.
This is now his team, playing his way and yet we still look garbage defensively and garbage at home.
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Why has Sylla made way for KEA when he was a vital cog in our resurgence last spring?!?! I know he was injured for a bit, but he should be fit now. Strange.
He is fit now and has been for a couple of weeks, sylla must be a starter in midfield for us , and we really must sort out a way of playing at home as our home form in recent seasons has been awful - today is not good enough and lambert has the options in the squad to change things.
I expect to see 3 or 4 changes next week, Lowton and Weimann benched and sylla must start in midfield.
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And another random thing while sitting on the 7. Newcastle fans are utter twats. If they had come at me like that I'd have twatted them as well. Wankers.
Like what ? Can you explain more please , what did they do?
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And why the fuck did Luna keep showing Ben Arfa inside? Basic error time and again. In case you hadn't guessed I'm quite fucked off right now.
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We desperately need Okore fit as well.
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We seem to always want to play at top gear. Occasionally it works and we'll string a decent passing move together, but mostly it's poor, particularly at home. Lamberts got to give us another dimension. I'm not sure we've got the personel.
In all honest, he could turn us into another Stoke City and we'd pick up better results than trying, and failing, to be Arsenal when were playing at home.
Just play the three giants up front and twat it long.
We do seriously lack a Petrov figure in midfield, who can slow the tempo down every now and again. Westwood has the potential but hes started this season poorly, and doesn't yet possess Stans leadership quality.
I'm also thinking we might have missed a trick bringing Barry back on loan. Without wanting to open that Pandoras box of a discussion.
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I wouldn't be surprised if we win less than 3 games at home all season. Utterly clueless on the ball and still possess the worst defense in the league
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It sounded like we played well for twenty five minutes at the start of the second half - we seemed to miss some great chances?
But then let in a bad goal and went pretty long ball 442? And Newcastle seemed to have a fair few more chances than us too?
Was Guzan at fault for the second? Sounded like Ben Arfa had Luna on toast?
Disappointing. Very disappointing. We don't look a top ten contender at the moment, do we?
Was good save from Guzan ,Ben Afra should'nt of been allowed to shoot.
Luna had no support and Ben Afra ran him ragged ..again the big issue no fucking width
We scored then lost the ball from a foul throw they scored and we resorted to long balls to the 2 big men who linked up exactly zero times.Remember Bradford at home ,well thats what we resorted to again.
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Not a great game for Lambert. It's a bit baffling that El Ahmadi starts ahead of Sylla and very baffling that such an obvious substitution never happened. Instead we ended up with an overload of strikers on the pitch, a tactic that has served so poorly in the past.
There were very few positives from the game. Okore is impressive, he is a quality defender, it's worrying that he went of injured. Benteke added another goal to his tally, Guzan still looks one of the best in the dision and that is about it.
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OK it's not going swimmingly as we expect however the good points are no one has ripped us apart and we are developing every match. Newcastle despite their results previous to today's game have some very good players. Just need to keep the belief and trust Lambert to get it right.
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OK it's not going swimmingly as we expect however the good points are no one has ripped us apart and we are developing every match. Newcastle despite their results previous to today's game have some very good players. Just need to keep the belief and trust Lambert to get it right.
We could have conceded many more today.
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It's a shame, because if we could win even just 7/8 games at home, with our away form we could be contenders for Europe again.
But for this current side, set up the way they are, winning 8 at VP would be a huge ask.
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I wouldn't be surprised if we win less than 3 games at home all season. Utterly clueless on the ball and still possess the worst defense in the league
Steady on fella there are 5/6 teams worse than us.
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Absolute fucking garbage. I am furious to have been proved right. I said before that I had seen nothing to suggest that we had the capability to win the game and I was proved dispairingly correct. Christ knows where these predictions from most came from about rolling them over, based on exactly what I have no idea.
That narrow, one dimensional shite signals the fourth year of struggle. Its just not acceptable.
I hate Villa Park and all its soft touch, inviting, easy to play in atmosphere. Its been shit down there for years.
How the fuck you can spend three weeks planning that tedious and aimless crap is beyond me. The midfield is so weak and toothless it defies logic. Why isn't Sylla in there? Why do we have one tactic; give the ball to Benteke, has he scored? No? Lump it back to him.
Total fucking shite, as bad as anything that ****** McLiesh ever served up. Another season struggling to survive. Fuck off Villa.
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That was right back to December/January last year in terms of performance.
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We were shite! What's the point bringing on Tonev a couple of minutes from the end? Did Kozak get a touch?
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It's a shame, because if we could win even just 7/8 games at home, with our away form we could be contenders for Europe again.
But this current side, winning 8 at VP would be a huge ask.
We're the same player short that we have been for a decade at least. And Lambert bought a Big Man Number 9 when we have one of the best in the world in that position, and have absolutely no incision in midfield. It really doesn't look clever at the moment.
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Can't believe we came out to defend and counterattack. How many times does this have to fail before we stop doing it. Plus we were at home against Newcastle. We should have been at them from the start.
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OK it's not going swimmingly as we expect however the good points are no one has ripped us apart and we are developing every match. Newcastle despite their results previous to today's game have some very good players. Just need to keep the belief and trust Lambert to get it right.
Just how long do you keep on saying this, it is now his team and it sucks!
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Really poor today.
Weimann, Westwood and El Ahmadi out next game, Tonev, Sylla and Bacuna in.
Relegation talk at the ground from people. We won't go down like we won't the league after beating Arsenal first game.
We're set up to beat teams away from home, so why not try something different at home?
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Wouldn't be surprised to see something like the following team v Norwich:
Guzan - Bacuna Okore (Clark) Vlaar Baker - Sylla, Westwood,Delph - Tonev, Benteke, Gabby
Anyway, enough villa for one weekend thanks. I just get angry when I start stewing. Everton - Chelsea and then Eliseum for me.
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We could have conceded many more today.
But we didn't Paul and that's a positive. The other two defeats were also vey close.
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OK it's not going swimmingly as we expect however the good points are no one has ripped us apart and we are developing every match. Newcastle despite their results previous to today's game have some very good players. Just need to keep the belief and trust Lambert to get it right.
Just how long do you keep on saying this, it is now his team and it sucks!
Now, it sucked today and he's made a very large fuckup in the transfer market in my opinion. But we have quality and ability through the side as the opening couple of games showed, and Lambert has plenty of goodwill in the bank, and we should have enough to be fine this season. But a lot of what happened today was totally unacceptable.
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OK it's not going swimmingly as we expect however the good points are no one has ripped us apart and we are developing every match. Newcastle despite their results previous to today's game have some very good players. Just need to keep the belief and trust Lambert to get it right.
Just how long do you keep on saying this, it is now his team and it sucks!
Well I wouldn't give up yet, I still have faith in Lambert but his tactics at home need a change.
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OK it's not going swimmingly as we expect however the good points are no one has ripped us apart and we are developing every match. Newcastle despite their results previous to today's game have some very good players. Just need to keep the belief and trust Lambert to get it right.
Just how long do you keep on saying this, it is now his team and it sucks!
Three good games out of four, unlucky not to be on more points. Hardly the end of the world.
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Absolute fucking garbage. I am furious to have been proved right. I said before that I had seen nothing to suggest that we had the capability to win the game and I was proved dispairingly correct. Christ knows where these predictions from most came from about rolling them over, based on exactly what I have no idea.
That narrow, one dimensional shite signals the fourth year of struggle. Its just not acceptable.
I hate Villa Park and all its soft touch, inviting, easy to play in atmosphere. Its been shit down there for years.
How the fuck you can spend three weeks planning that tedious and aimless crap is beyond me. The midfield is so weak and toothless it defies logic. Why isn't Sylla in there? Why do we have one tactic; give the ball to Benteke, has he scored? No? Lump it back to him.
Total fucking shiite, as bad as anything that c*** McLiesh ever served up. Another season struggling to survive. Fuck off Villa.
Yep.
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I wouldn't be surprised if we win less than 3 games at home all season. Utterly clueless on the ball and still possess the worst defense in the league
Steady on fella there are 5/6 teams worse than us.
Maybe there are aftab but this is a club that should not be anywhere near the bottom 6 - today was extremely poor.
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OK it's not going swimmingly as we expect however the good points are no one has ripped us apart and we are developing every match. Newcastle despite their results previous to today's game have some very good players. Just need to keep the belief and trust Lambert to get it right.
Just how long do you keep on saying this, it is now his team and it sucks!
It's just 4 games. I will be concerned at 14 or 24.
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We could have conceded many more today.
But we didn't Paul and that's a positive. The other two defeats were also vey close.
Well true, but I think our level of performance was a massive concern and also the tactics in general.
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Its all well and good to say we wont go down, maybe not, but being close to it again for the fourth season in a row is beyond the pale.
The signs are there for all to see, another year of struggle. I am sick to my back teeth of playing at Villa Park.
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OK it's not going swimmingly as we expect however the good points are no one has ripped us apart and we are developing every match. Newcastle despite their results previous to today's game have some very good players. Just need to keep the belief and trust Lambert to get it right.
Just how long do you keep on saying this, it is now his team and it sucks!
I'll probably get pelters for saying it but I do wonder if Lambert is even capable of getting us back among the top eight.
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Wouldn't be surprised to see something like the following team v Norwich:
Guzan - Bacuna Okore (Clark) Vlaar Baker - Sylla, Westwood,Delph - Tonev, Benteke, Gabby
Anyway, enough villa for one weekend thanks. I just get angry when I start stewing. Everton - Chelsea and then Eliseum for me.
I'd go with that, players need to know they have to perform. Although I'd put Bennett at left back and not Baker.
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Have immediately reached for the beer and extremely loud music to prevent that shite completely ruining my Saturday evening.
So frustrating .. As shit as we were, we still could've nicked that. Already feeling like a continuation of the 'mediocre' phase of last season:
- we rarely seem to start games well, all the more so at home.why?
- our full-backs aren't defensively good enough, and they leave huge gaps in the wide areas
- Vlaar still doesn't appear good enough, at least not without a calmer more assured player (Okore) at his side.
- we appear to have no Plan B when the counter-attacking isn't working. I.e. a diamond midfield - could GG or Tonev work in the advanced role?
As for the players today:
Guzan - 5. bit more wobbly than usual. At fault for their second.
Lowton - 4. Too gung ho, and lots of bad decisions
Luna - 3. Just awful. Only gets 3 cos he managed to get the ball of Ben Arfa twice in the 1st half. No professional should ever do a foul throw.
Vlaar - 5. Headless chicken again at times. Rash in possession.
Okore - 6. Looked good before injury
KEA - 4. Back to last seasons model. So much possession given away, and so lightweight/half-arsed in the challenge.
Westwood - 6. Not his best, but still managed 2 or 3 defence-splitting balls the forwards wasted
Delph - 7. Just about our MOTM. all action, some great runs and good on the ball. Silly yellow card yet again though.
Weimann - 3. Crap. Needs benching and a couple of run outs in the reserves. As others have said, still looks a bit out of position but still.
Gabby - 5. The usual effort,but quality not there today. As for that bloody miss...
Benteke - 6. Great header for the goal, not his best day otherwise, albeit without much service.
Subs:
Clark - 6. Didn't do too much wrong - that miss aside.
Kozak - 5. Hard to judge on this game - didn't look tuned in yet to Benteke headers.
Tonev - given way too little time
Lambert - 5. Got them fired up for the second half, but continuing inability to dictate the game at Villa Park, and then ridiculous 4-2-4 which never looked like producing from open play.
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That style of football is horrible to watch. All graft and no craft. Can't see us beating Norwich.
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That style of football is horrible to watch. All graft and no craft. Can't see us beating Norwich.
I really hope that the Kozak signing instead of another midfielder doesn't indicate Lambert's instincts, ie knock it long first then pass later - because all-too-often with that type of football you lose it and don't get the chance to pass later.
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We could have conceded many more today.
But we didn't Paul and that's a positive. The other two defeats were also vey close.
Well true, but I think our level of performance was a massive concern and also the tactics in general.
Agree that performance today was poor.
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Could have nicked it how? We created fuck all. We had two efforts on goal and one was a shite cross from Lowton.
We have created fuck all in two home games, at least we had an excuse of playing a good team in Liverpool, but today we played mid-table bilge.
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Putting big men up front and not using the midfield will maybe work one in ten games, it's not a way to get back into the game.
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The defence is worrying. Bennett was rubbish last season and Luna doesn't look to be any better.
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OK it's not going swimmingly as we expect however the good points are no one has ripped us apart and we are developing every match. Newcastle despite their results previous to today's game have some very good players. Just need to keep the belief and trust Lambert to get it right.
Just how long do you keep on saying this, it is now his team and it sucks!
Well I wouldn't give up yet, I still have faith in Lambert but his tactics at home need a change.
I won't mind if PL just tries something different at home and at least make us hard to beat for once! Just a very bad day at the office!
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We had shit loads of chances to pass the ball, its just that today our passing was horrendous.
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9 wins in 40 at home ...
Benteke has more goals than we have points
Same points tally as Crystal fucking Palace..
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That style of football is horrible to watch. All graft and no craft. Can't see us beating Norwich.
Is that the same Norwich we beat twice last season?
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Conceding in every game is going to make it difficult to get wins especially when its the opening goal. Sorting the defence out has got to be high priority.
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Could have nicked it how? We created fuck all. We had two efforts on goal and one was a shite cross from Lowton.
We have created fuck all in two home games, at least we had an excuse of playing a good team in Liverpool, but today we played mid-table bilge.
Yep we deserved to get beat and we got beat, changes must happen for the next game.
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Rubbish. Totally rubbish.
Only green shoot out of today was how good Delph is (apart from his obligatory yellow card)
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Lambert wasn't some God-like genius because of our strong end to the season last year (admittedly against some of the weaker/ out of form sides in this division). But he isn't a rotter because of our current duff form either.
I must say the oft trotted out comparisons with the Dortmund way of doing things baffle me though. Day 1 Lesson 1 in any German blueprint for success would include the importance of structure: sound defence and organization.
He spent one year of his life there, one season out of a 20 + season career. I don't doubt that Hitzfeld would have been a positive influence to learn from- even for that relatively short window in time. Maybe he was out of the room whenever defensive planning was being discussed. That, and the approach to going after sides at home with a bit of nous and creativity.
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Delph is the only positive.
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Surely every defender in the premiership should know you don't let Ben Arfa come inside on his left foot, so frustrating watching the naive defending again. Bringing on Kozak left us totally in balanced. Yes it was like last 20 minutes of Bradford.
Wasn't expecting that, very disappointed.
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424 didnt work against bradford lambert... Why try it today?
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I'm sick to death of watching that crap at home, teams must love coming here. I think we'll struggle again this season the players just aren't good enough and they're still making the same stupid mistakes as last season.
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Delph is the only positive.
and he was only good for a half. I think Okore will be excellent but we need him fit.
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Weiman, KEA, Lowton dont want to be anywhere near the team against Norwich.
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Credit to Delph , hard to find many positives about the rest to be honest .
Lowton, luna, Westwood , kea , and Weimann all well below par ,
We look a very poor side at home and need to change things in that respect , deeply disappointing to lose 3 in a row after the opening game and today was a real sickener - okore looked a pretty bad knee injury and is a concern.
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The alarm bells were ringing in the first 20-30 minutes against Rotherham where we failed to take control of the game and allowed a very poor team all the time in the world to pass the ball about, have a few dangerous attacks whilst we chased shadows. Today against better opposition we got punished.
I'm not sure what Lambert has in mind tactically, I really expect much more from him than gung-ho, counter attacking football. It's great when it works but we're leaving ourselves too open, we don't dictate the game from midfield, we don't seem to have a Plan B other than hoofing it up front. The last manager that played that way had a piss poor record at Villa Park and I just hope Lambert has more too him than that, otherwise we really are fcuked.
Today was bloody embarrassing. He needs to fucking wake up and quickly find a way to start winning games at Villa Park or it's going to be a very long season.
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Just got back as for the match total rubbish. Highlights of the game was the guy with the big belly who thought fuck this i'm going for a little walk. Also the train wasn't completely rammed those were the highlights. Also i think i got my guess the crowd prediction 30 or 40 off the actual attendance. Yes.
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really need a win at norwich given the two games after that. thing is id prob settle for nil nil as sick to death of conceding every match. so bloody fragile
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Putting big men up front and not using the midfield will maybe work one in ten games, it's not a way to get back into the game.
Worryingly, he tried it pretty early in the game as well - it wasn't stoppage time desperation, he tried it before the 70th minute. And it didn't work for the remaining quarter of the game. A quarter of the game up in smoke through less-than-neanderthal tactics. Not good at all.
I must say the oft trotted out comparisons with the Dortmund way of doing things baffle me though. Day 1 Lesson 1 in any German blueprint for success would include the importance of structure: sound defence and organization.
He spent one year of his life there, one season out of a 20 + season career. I don't doubt that Hitzfeld would have been a positive influence to learn from- even for that relatively short window in time. Maybe he was out of the room whenever defensive planning was being discussed. That, and the approach to going after sides at home with a bit of nous and creativity.
It's not Klopp's Day 1 Lesson 1 - that would be 'always press the ball wherever you are whatever minute of the game.' And Lambert wants us to do that, but they're not fit enough yet. He also did his badges in Germany, alongside Klopp as it happens, and the amount of importance he places on his German education is enormous.
One thing I wish he hadn't picked up from Hitzfeld is the 'big man is better than playmaker' ideology of 1990s German football. It's outdated and it's what made us look abysmal today.
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The alarm bells were ringing in the first 20-30 minutes against Rotherham where we failed to take control of the game and allowed a very poor team all the time in the world to pass the ball about, have a few dangerous attacks whilst we chased shadows. Today against better opposition we got punished.
I'm not sure what Lambert has in mind tactically, I really expect much more from him than gung-ho, counter attacking football. It's great when it works but we're leaving ourselves too open, we don't dictate the game from midfield, we don't seem to have a Plan B other than hoofing it up front. The last manager that played that way had a piss poor record at Villa Park and I just hope Lambert has more too him than that, otherwise we really are fcuked.
Today was bloody embarrassing. He needs to fucking wake up and quickly find a way to start winning games at Villa Park or it's going to be a very long season.
Agreed, our tactics at home have been poor for a long time across various managers. There's been plenty of time to sort it out.
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Well wasn't that just the pits. As bad as anything from last season. Our defence is just plain awful.
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Well wasn't that just the pits. As bad as anything from last season. Our defence is just plain awful.
As was our midfield(Delph apart) and attack.
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Here's a simple lesson for Lambert, you need your midfield to create opportunities for your attackers. It sounds simple, but since we seem to adopt a tactic where we empty the midfield and just go straight from defence to attack and it fails each time, it may not be clear to him. The midfield has to produce our chances and the attackers finish them off.
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Delph is the only positive.
and he was only good for a half. I think Okore will be excellent but we need him fit.
He was good the whole game.
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Diabolical to lose that after working hard to get back to 1-1.
Yet again a home performance that wasn't good enough for the 3 points, it was very similar to the Liverpool game bar the miracle of actually scoring from a corner.
I think a problem is a lot of our players like playing the game at 100mph, good when the momentum is with us (as we saw the 15 minute spell around the goal when we were making some good moves) but when we're behind and the pressure is on us you see some really basic errors like foul throws and sloppy passing.
No idea what Luna was doing when he had a chance of shooting at Krul and squared it across the goal which Weimann should've done in the 1st half. Gabby aswell for that sitter, would it have been that bad to actually take a touch and control yourself?
Our tactics aswell, having Ben Arfa up against Luna 1-1 and Remy against Lowton was not a good idea at all and cost us two goals. Very often when teams attack us, you'll see Gabby and Weimann standing either side of Benteke on the halfway line just watching play. Sometimes that pays off away from home when we can spring quick breaks but I think we need to modify that at home and play a bit more conservatively e.g. actually once in a while making sure we have a player to help out the full back.
Looks like Newcastle just watched a video of the Liverpool game and played in the exact same manner and it payed off. For all the circus that surrounds the club, they have some excellent players, Sissoko was quality first half and oh for a player like Ben Arfa in our squad as I was saying pre match. We saw today those players can be quite useful on occasions.
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Absolutely, utterly, thoroughly pissed off after watching that.
No ideas, no threat,no composure, no plan b and a questionable plan a.
I have wanted to defend Vlaar since he has been with us, but he really is shit, although no quite so shit if okore is playing.
4 games, 3 defeats on the bounce....are things that much better than last year?
It's going to be a long season.
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We need Sylla back in the team. KEA is great for away games and biting at the opposition's midfield but I think I'd rather see big Sylla when we are looking to dominate games and win at home.
Today's result did not totally surprise me and it's definitely a wake up call but I still feel we are more than capable of getting into the top half once more. It's early days yet.
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Width required.
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Miserable..apply it all round. I am, they were and the world is...
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Could have nicked it how? We created fuck all. We had two efforts on goal and one was a shite cross from Lowton.
We have created fuck all in two home games, at least we had an excuse of playing a good team in Liverpool, but today we played mid-table bilge.
In the sense that despite being so poor, when it went to 1-1 we could and should have kicked on and won it. Our inability to do so due to defensive frailties and lack of variety going forward is what's worrying.
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Lowton - nowhere near last years levels . Needs a kick up the arse do I'd bring in Bacuna.
El Ahmadi - garbage - always will be.
Wiemann - pieman . Needs to lay off the lager
Gabby - can't afford to miss sitters
Benteke - apart from goal - nothing - again.
Lambert - made changes too late and inexplicable. Bit like Bradford at home.
We needed width and we needed a decent midfielder in the transfer window.
That's a poor effort - and I hate pardew with a passion . Twat .
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I wouldn't be surprised if we win less than 3 games at home all season. Utterly clueless on the ball and still possess the worst defense in the league
Steady on fella there are 5/6 teams worse than us.
Oh fuck, we're not banking on that already are we.
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I am so sick and tired of reading in the papers something along the lines of "defensive mistakes cost Villa...". It's such a shit Groundhog Day joke. Please make it end.
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Some random thoughts:
1. Newcastle were first to every 50/50 and their players were always first to react
2. The number of times we gave the ball away from restarts (free kicks, throw ins) was unacceptable
3. The number of times we gave the ball away from simple passes, when the passer had time on the ball, was unacceptable
(1-3 suggests our players were not concentrating 100% - maybe they also saw this as an easy win?)
4. The number of times our players made bone-headed decisions (Luna not shooting, Gabby cutting in and running straight into a group of players, allowing Ben-Arfa to cut inside...) was unacceptable.
(4 suggests we lack "football brains" on the pitch)
5. Despite their league position last year, Newcastle have better players than us in most positions.
Nail.on.head
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The 4th game running that we go out to play counter attack. Looks like a theme for the season.
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We're soft all over the pitch. No bottle, no brains in the team, and again, no leadership on the pitch. Years sin e we had someone to bollock people when they f**k up. So predictable. Another relegation battle? Not what was expected Mr Lambert. Get it sorted.
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That is all 5 games this season, including Rotherham, where we have started crap. Be nice to start a game well for once. Not going 1-0 down in a league game would be a bonus as well.
The slow starts are leaving us too much to do.
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Oh for fucks sake. Why are we so shit at home?
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Oh for fucks sake. Why are we so shit at home?
Because we adopt the completely wrong tactics, and there are too many players guaranteed a place.
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I wouldn't be surprised if we win less than 3 games at home all season. Utterly clueless on the ball and still possess the worst defense in the league
Steady on fella there are 5/6 teams worse than us.
Oh fuck, we're not banking on that already are we.
No we are not and there is no need for that after 4. It's a comment on "worst defence in the league".
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On the way back from the game we agreed that the last full back Villa could trust to defend and attack properly was Luke Young, even when he had to fill in at left back.
Ben Arfa has days like this. Not many but he looks very good when he is on his game. James Collins or Hutton would have stopped him running the game but we havent got defenders of that ilk any more.
The first half was best forgotten. Delph played well in the second half but most of the others looked very ordinary.Some looked less than that.
We had chances to win it , Gabby/Weimann/Luna but we got what we deserved......nothing!
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Benteke - apart from goal - nothing - again.
4 goals in 4 games, i'll take that kind of lack of contribution all year long.
And that's before taking into account how many headers he wins, the defenders he occupies and so on. It's not his fault so many of the other players aren't firing yet.
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I've not read any of the rest of the thread yet so will be interested to see if others feel the same, but the way I see it is this.
Shocking lack of width.
Two blokes in Westwood and KEA doing EXACTLY the same job - not necessary esp at home.
Only Delph who can carry the ball and beat a man. And he nearly always receives the ball in his own half. - Pointless.
Lambert is either naive, stupid or both when it comes to tactical substitutions.
Luna is barely an upgrade on Bennett based on that performance.
We lack real know how, a consequence of either immature players or those that are not good enough - you decide which.
Yet again, movement non existant. It's surprising how easy it is to hide on a football pitch if you want to.
I really am struggling to find a positive. We were that bad. Even our goal was a toss of a coin effort.
Why oh why are the catering staff / management still unable to cope with standard numbers of customers at half time. Here's a clue geniuses, spend a day at the cricket or rugby to see how its done. Have the beers poured ready. Have a counter just for bottles. If you are expecting a crowd of 35000+ there is no excuse for the barrels to run out. Arrrgghh!!!
I need a drink now to calm down.
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Benteke - apart from goal - nothing - again.
4 goals in 4 games, i'll take that kind of lack of contribution all year long.
And that's before taking into account how many headers he wins, the defenders he occupies and so on. It's not his fault so many of the other players aren't firing yet.
Agreed. Benteke does very good things, but there are two problems at the moment: 1) he's better than just as an object to hit with long balls; 2), even when he manages to win the ball and win it well, there's no Eriksen, no Ben Arfa, fuck it no Hoolahan there to give it to to calm things down or move things forward.
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They wont have to worry about crowds for much longer at this rate.
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Oh for fucks sake. Why are we so shit at home?
Because we adopt the completely wrong tactics, and there are too many players guaranteed a place.
Yes its painful. We are not good enough yet to play in a different style at home. This will come given time. Our style will yield us points to make us comfortable mid table.
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What a football club we are btw, we must be the only one who'd go to Arsenal and win 3-1 and then lose our next three league games even if two of those looked pretty difficult.
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Benteke - apart from goal - nothing - again.
4 goals in 4 games, i'll take that kind of lack of contribution all year long.
And that's before taking into account how many headers he wins, the defenders he occupies and so on. It's not his fault so many of the other players aren't firing yet.
Agreed. Benteke does very good things, but there are two problems at the moment: 1) he's better than just as an object to hit with long balls; 2), even when he manages to win the ball and win it well, there's no Eriksen, no Ben Arfa, fuck it no Hoolahan there to give it to to calm things down or move things forward.
The amount of long punts he won but too often the rest weren't supporting him so we lost possession.
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Excellent post, Mr Woo, especially the points about our midfield.
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Oh for fucks sake. Why are we so shit at home?
Because we adopt the completely wrong tactics, and there are too many players guaranteed a place.
Well, that's exactly what we're meant to be getting away from. It was Lambert who stressed we need competition for places and now he needs to start dropping players.
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Villa Park os too easy to play at.
Also, why dont the club do something to stop cuntish fuck bubbles getting on our pitch week in week out?
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What Lambert needs to do is drop Lowton and Weimann.
1) Neither are justifying starting
2) Send out a sign that if you don't perform you are out. It concerns me a bit that too many of our starting 11 seems pretty nailed on to start regardless of form.
Based on both league home games Luna and KEA should be worried as well.
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What Lambert needs to do is drop Lowton and Weimann.
1) Neither are justifying starting
2) Send out a sign that if you don't perform you are out. It concerns me a bit that too many of our starting 11 seems pretty nailed on to start regardless of form.
Based on both league home games Luna and KEA should be worried as well.
Completely agree there needs to be genuine competition for your place whoever you are.
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Villa Park os too easy to play at.
Also, why dont the club do something to stop cuntish fuck bubbles getting on our pitch week in week out?
And I bet the Villa fan who tried laying into the one who ran to the hoardings in front of R1 now has a life ban. I'd have smacked the twat as well.
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I just don't get the going to four up front thing. Has it ever worked for us? It's like the kind of thing a ten year old would do in a football manager game.
Bring back Sylla. We desperately need him in the team as he shores things up.
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That was very poor indeed, especially the first half. Gave them far too much space and kept on giving possession back to them. KEA had a stinker. As did Weimann. Lowton was not brilliant either. We played far too narrow. Delph was my MotM.
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I just don't get it with KEA. His better performances for the club have been below average.
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Some of their fans were a throwback to the seventies but without the fear factor. Numpties.
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Sad to say but Weimann like Albrighton may have reached his peak already. Not just today but he's not showing any signs of being effective this season. Benteke needs help and I cant see what Lambert has in mind.
At the moment Weimann is nuisance value with his hard running but little else.
In fact he is a latter day Brian Greenhalgh.
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What Lambert needs to do is drop Lowton and Weimann.
1) Neither are justifying starting
2) Send out a sign that if you don't perform you are out. It concerns me a bit that too many of our starting 11 seems pretty nailed on to start regardless of form.
Based on both league home games Luna and KEA should be worried as well.
Completely agree there needs to be genuine competition for your place whoever you are.
I thought it was the point of signing Bacuna, Tonev etc. No use having them on the bench when the bloke starting is out of form.
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Just home from the match. Poor passing, naive defending and no ability to break down the opposition at home. We kept passing backwards for the whole match. We kept failing to track runners, hence both of their goals and the injury to Okore. The 3 midfielders are too alike and only Deph is on form. Benteke has been reduced to John Fashanu because his team mates cannot pass reliably.
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I was on a promise if we won.
Bastards.
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I just don't get it with KEA. His better performances for the club have been below average.
To me, the midfield seems flat with KEA in it. Bring back Sylla.
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I thought Westwood wasn't that good today either. The ideal midfield three for us would be Sylla, Delph and a hypothetical creative midfielder we have been lacking for a decade.
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I just don't get it with KEA. His better performances for the club have been below average.
To me, the midfield seems flat with KEA in it. Bring back Sylla.
KEA deserved to keep his place after the Arsenal game, but he has steadily dropped in form since then. I believe if you start and play well you stay in, but especially at home he doesn't seem to add anything.
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I wish we had someone in midfield who could actually pick the ball up, lift his head and play a controlled,composed, accurate pass to a teammate, rather than our lot who want to play at 100 miles an hour, all the bloody time.
I still think we missed a trick not taking Barry back.
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I wish we had someone in midfield who could actually pick the ball up,
Wouldn't he get booked for that?
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Sad to say but Weimann like Albrighton may have reached his peak already. Not just today but he's not showing any signs of being effective this season. Benteke needs help and I cant see what Lambert has in mind.
At the moment Weimann is nuisance value with his hard running but little else.
In fact he is a latter day Brian Greenhalgh.
Let's not get too carried away, he's out of form he just needs to be dropped.
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I wish we had someone in midfield who could actually pick the ball up, lift his head and play a controlled,composed, accurate pass to a teammate, rather than our lot who want to play at 100 miles an hour, all the bloody time.
I still think we missed a trick not taking Barry back.
Barry might help calm things down a bit, but he is hardly the man to go and make things happen. With him in our midfield for years we still lacked the creative player.
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I'm also thinking we might have missed a trick bringing Barry back on loan. Without wanting to open that Pandoras box of a discussion.
We did indeed.
As one for the future - no, but as an upgrade on El Ahmadi................all day long.
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I'm also thinking we might have missed a trick bringing Barry back on loan. Without wanting to open that Pandoras box of a discussion.
We did indeed.
As one for the future - no, but as an upgrade on El Ahmadi................all day long.
Its hard to see what wouldn't be an an upgrade on El Ahmadi to be honest!
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I would hope after today one or two of the lads will be expecting a place on the bench in the coming weeks. It's all good and well having faith in certain players but if they are not doing it they'll need to accept change and disappointment.
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It concerns me that Lambert is saying we lost due to a poor start, it's not just that it's the fact that our tactics at home aren't good enough.
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Stuck in traffic on the M6 for an hour on the way there. Stuck in traffic on the M6 for an hour on the way back. Shit performance. Sloppy passing, no shape, no guile, missed sitter - ffs their second came after we'd conceded possession of a fucking throw-in. Too pissed off to be rational. The worst I've felt getting home from a Villa game for years
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Goals (http://www.101greatgoals.com/gvideos/aston-villa-1-newcastle-2-3/)
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I didn't expect us to win today but anticipated a well fought draw. We looked like we might get that but, no. This is the Villa. At home. Depressingly familiar stuff.
Not sure how Lambert rationalised it. I heard his post match interview but didn't get a word.
Too early to tell but my gut says a long, hard season with one or two moments of excitement away from home and staying up because, hopefully, there are three teams worse than us.
But this is the current Villa isn't it? We're not a big wealthy club and we never will be under the current ownership. Just got to put up with it and rejoice in the rare moments of success, fleeting as they are.
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Paul Lambert bemoaned a slow start as Villa went down 2-1 at home to Newcastle.
Lambert was frustrated his team didn't show the usual drive and energy from the off against the Magpies.
Villa boss Lambert believes that was a fundamental reason for the loss, as well as the concession of two poor goals from his perspective.
He was happier with the second half display but is keen for his emerging team to score first in games, so they don't give themselves a mountain to climb each week.
He said: "It was frustrating, very much so.
"We never got going in the first half. It was unlike us. But we can't lose goals like the way we did.
"We started the second half really well. But the first half, we lost a really poor goal and the second I thought was even worse.
"They get back into it then. The impetus and ascendancy was with us. But you can't defend that way.
"We don't set them out to play that way. You have to give Newcastle credit for starting the game well. We are not a team who can play slow football. We don't have that knowhow yet to play that way.
"A big part of our game is our energy and tempo. We started slowly. In the second half, it was much more like us.
"It wasn't like us, especially in the first half. In the second half it was a lot better.
"You pick them up and go again on Monday now. We have Norwich on Saturday.
"I can't fault them for effort. They gave me everything they had to try and retrieve it. But the disappointing thing was the two goals.
"I am not one for making excuses. We got beat because we didn't start the game in the right manner.
"The frustrating thing in the games we've played is we have always conceded the first goal. We have had to come back from that. That's a lot to ask every time. It's a lot to do. It's disappointing to start in the manner we did.
"But I can't fault my team for effort. I'd like to get results and more points. But I can't fault them for the way they try to do the right things."
Lambert is also waiting on news of Jores Okore, after the defensive ace came off injured on the half hour mark.
He added: "I think he's hurt his knee. I will speak to the doctor and see what his opinion is and what he thinks."
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I can fault the team for effort I thought Newcastle fought much harder than us.
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Sad to say but Weimann like Albrighton may have reached his peak already. Not just today but he's not showing any signs of being effective this season. Benteke needs help and I cant see what Lambert has in mind.
At the moment Weimann is nuisance value with his hard running but little else.
In fact he is a latter day Brian Greenhalgh.
Yes but no way he will score 13 goals in a season on this form.
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I just don't get it with KEA. His better performances for the club have been below average.
In fairness hes looked fairly decent in the opening 3 games and would have been difficult to leave out but his display today surely means sylla must return next week, tonev needs to replace Weimann and Lowton , luna and Westwood all need to get their act together fast as today none of them were anywhere near good enough.
Lambert now has the options and he must use them to show players that if they don't perform they will lose their place .
Today leaves a very bitter taste- i was really shocked by how poor we played and as a home team we gave newcastle far too much respect and space .
We should have started on the front foot and took the game to them - it was bitterly disappointing.
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Today was a reality check for us, but we should not have got carried away that we any better than we were last season & in truth if we keep doing the same thing, with the same players, we're going to get the same outcome.
The team is basically the same as the last half of last season.
Those who have been bought are, at best, sub-standard replacements for first teamers.
We are unable to keep a clean sheet.
We cannot or do not believe we can win at home. The team seem be apprehensive.
We have no movement, width or creativity.
Without Benteke's goals we would have been relegated last season.
The last 20 minutes today was as clueless as the second half against Bradford & that is unacceptable for a club like Aston Villa. There are no excuses, this is Lamberts team & Lamberts tactics.
That was an ordinary Newcastle team & our team, with the exception of Delph & Gabby, were just not at the races. The decision making today by the players & the manager was truly abysmal.
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One attempt on target against a team like newcastle is really poor stuff, 26 league games without a clean sheet is quite frankly disgraceful and embarrassing - there can be no excuse for that!
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One attempt on target against a team like newcastle is really poor stuff, 26 league games without a clean sheet is quite frankly disgraceful and embarrassing - there can be no excuse for that!
Indeed.
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and to make matters worse Gareth Barry having an outstanding game in midfield for Everton on his debut
because the man is fucking top quality
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and to make matters worse Gareth Barry having an outstanding game in midfield for Everton on his debut
because the man is fucking top quality
Totally agree , would have made a big difference to us , good teams generally have a mixture and blend of youth and experience - our team is packed with players who have little experience in the premiership.
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Just back, not surprised at defeat as I predicted a loss of 1-2.
However, thoroughly shocked and worried at Lamberts tactics. Equally, he appears to have made the defence worse than last season.
Why has he reverted to this narrow formation bullshit and ditched Sylla for KEA??
Very worrying, 3 straight defeats and another negative GD now already. Next 3 games are pivotal to Lamberts future here in my opinion.
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Should have kept Bannan.
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Why has Sylla made way for KEA when he was a vital cog in our resurgence last spring?!?! I know he was injured for a bit, but he should be fit now. Strange.
Agreed. KEA ball retention today was abysmal, he offered nothing offensively.
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We got the tactics and substitutions wrong today - that can happen, unfortunately. We're an average team that will have some good days, some off days. Today was one of the latter, but we'll be back.
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Should have kept Bannan.
As a ball boy.............
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I'd have had Wieman of as soon as he messed up that two on one opportunity, that was unforgivable in football terms, hes not started the season that well so that's what you got subs for
never been all that impressed with Westwood,
doesn't have enough of an effect on games, I would put Sylla in for him as KEA gets a lot of stick on here, and i'm not saying he had a great game, he didn't, but he showed up more than Westwood did, and doesn't hide away
it was a big setback today, very disappointing , but my main problem with the season so far is the way we start games
every match this season we are shit in the first 30/40 mins, I mean what are we waiting for, Lambert needs to address this, I don't know how, but he's got to do something, its ridiculous, we are giving teams a head start every match,
whats going on is he sending them out in the right frame of mind, once or twice and you can excuse it, but every fucking game even the one against Rotherham is doing my brains in
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I just don't get it with KEA. His better performances for the club have been below average.
In fairness hes looked fairly decent in the opening 3 games and would have been difficult to leave out but his display today surely means sylla must return next week, tonev needs to replace Weimann and Lowton , luna and Westwood all need to get their act together fast as today none of them were anywhere near good enough.
Lambert now has the options and he must use them to show players that if they don't perform they will lose their place .
Today leaves a very bitter taste- i was really shocked by how poor we played and as a home team we gave newcastle far too much respect and space .
We should have started on the front foot and took the game to them - it was bitterly disappointing.
Says it pretty well for me eastie.
We gave possession away far too easily and too many players are not performing as well as they did towards end of last season - thought Lowton, Westwood and Andi were all poor today, as were others.
A team can carry 1 or 2 below par but not 5, 6 or 7!
We need to forget about this and......
....go again?
UTV!
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How can we be this bad at home for this long?
Why does Lambert keep playing a '4 strikers on the edge of the box with no width whatsoever' formation when we're chasing the game?
Why did we sign another target man when we have two already?
Why is El Ahmedi back in favour? Awful last year and absent when we improved.
Why do we always let Ben Arfa destroy us when every other team can stop him easily?
Will we ever keep a clean sheet again?
Why do we always start games at Villa Park with little or no urgency?
How many of our new signings will actually improve the team?
Is it too much to ask that we could be spared yet another relegation battle this season?
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Having just watched Gareth Barry put in a MOTM performance for Everton, he would have walked into our team today.
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Is there a problem with Gabby and Weimann?
Second game running I have seen them having a benny with one another.
Both times it was over Weimann not passing,and both times I would agree with Gabby.
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I haven't seen the game, but reading this thread, it seems a bit familiar.
I was worried when the transfer window ended that we had just bought more of the same sort of player we bought last season, and hadn't really added anything from an elevated quality level.
That midfield creativity didn't happen, and by the sounds of it, it might cost us a few points this season
The vast majority of us understood what he was doing last season and therefore put up with what was, at times, a wretched year, but it all has to be for something, that kind of season can't become our football life, year after year - that's the difference between a club trying to move places, and a Wigan, buying cheaply to survive.
It all has to be for something, and to that end, this can not be like last season.
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Luna was Bennettssque today . Just awful.
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Great post caster. villa depress me. i prefer weekends when we don't play
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Pissed off as the rest of you. My thoughts
No width. After the sub, Gabby came inside more making us even more narrow. Crazy.
Nobody seems able to read Benteke's flick on's
Weimann is playing out too wide. He needs to get closer to Tekkers. Drop Gabby and bring in Tonev to provide some width. Get Sylla instead of Kea, allowing Delph to push forward
Just watched a masterclass frm Barry for Everton great passing asusual. Simple but effective, exactly what we need.
Most away sides winning in the last 10 mins would be battered by the home side. Not us.
Newcastle are average we made em look good.
Ben Arfa. Great player. Wish we had him or similar.
As bad as Wigan last season
The front 3 as started today doesnt work.
Thought we were lucky against Arsenal but played really well in losing a Chelsea. Need a performance like chelseas at Norwich next week.
I think we all got carried away with lots of summer signings forgetting the midfield is the same as last year. Just not good enough
Why buy 2 centre forwards when money should have been spent in midfield
Off to get drunk
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What happened to westwood today ? I rate the guy but he played like he was Bevvy'd up today. So inaccurate with his passing which is so unlike him.
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I'm not going to hang myself after our start to the season. Played three bastard teams done well against all but Liverpool first half and Newcastle today.
I think a lot on here would be very happy with 8th place, the boggies got that despite losing 17 games last year. (not saying that we will finish 8th but you can still lose a lot games and finish high up)
Conceding two goals in a game at some points last year would have been seen as a step forward.
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I haven't seen the game, but reading this thread, it seems a bit familiar.
I was worried when the transfer window ended that we had just bought more of the same sort of player we bought last season, and hadn't really added anything from an elevated quality level.
That midfield creativity didn't happen, and by the sounds of it, it might cost us a few points this season
The vast majority of us understood what he was doing last season and therefore put up with what was, at times, a wretched year, but it all has to be something, that kind of season can't become our football life, year after year - that's the difference between a club trying to move places, and a Wigan, buying cheaply to survive.
It all has to be for something, and to that end, this can not be like last season.
Agree that it's vital that we progress this season.
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Just had my tea after getting back from the game. They bossed us in midfield, Ben Arfa was quality. KEA had a bad game but I thought Westwood had a shocker. Lowton had is Friday 13th today.
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If we haven't improved after this season ie. 16/17th again where does that leave the club ? Lambert? The fans ? I don't think I can do another season of fighting relegation. It affects me too much .
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As someone else has said, its a reality check. We won the first match, very unlucky in the second, distinctly average in the third and awful today. We have all these attacking options but no plan b. And it depresses me how many teams go home with 3 points from Villa Park. Compare Everton's performance today to ours. Different gravy.
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Is Ben Arfa the fatest player in the league? His arse makes Barry's look anorexic.
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If we haven't improved after this season ie. 16/17th again where does that leave the club ? Lambert? The fans ? I don't think I can do another season of fighting relegation. It affects me too much .
Why do we deserve/expect more than 16th/17th?
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"You pick yourselves up when you go behind and go again. We gave it a right go but you can't start the way we did."
You pick yourselves up when you go behind and go again. Friggin' deja vu or what?
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Seemed like there was a serious lack of chemistry today, with players constantly misreading flick-ons and run intentions. We also seemed really out of shape, and only seemed relatively strong after the half time break, all of which are hopefully just as a result of the 3 week break.
We need a play-maker, and Lambert needs a plan B. I got awful flashbacks to the Bradford second leg when he went with 4 up front towards the end. We looked totally desperate.
I thought Newcastle were quite good today though. They dealt with Benteke very well (aside from one goalkeeping error for the goal) and seemed very organised at the back while being dangerous going forward.
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Unmitigated shit. No point mincing words. If this is any any indication of things to come, we can look forward to yet another relegation struggle in our (insert your own figure) 'th season of transition.
I was also struck by the realisation that the atmosphere against Malaga was far better than today, even though we were being comprehensively outplayed for much of that game, and the crowd was much smaller.
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I am not that fussed at the moment,a nothing season of 10-14th will do me after the last 3 seasons.
I would see that as small progress.
No need to hide the rope yet.
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on a positive note we had 55% of the ball at home!
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Luna was Bennettssque today . Just awful.
In defence the team formation means our fullbacks are regularly exposed to one on one duels and it wasn't pretty watching seeing Remy easily get past Lowton for the first goal and Ben Arfa giving Luna a torrid time today.
We'll get away with it with other teams who play narrow like Arsenal but today it might've made more sense to actually put Bacuna (or Sylla) in rather than doing that against Liverpool.
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I must say the oft trotted out comparisons with the Dortmund way of doing things baffle me though. Day 1 Lesson 1 in any German blueprint for success would include the importance of structure: sound defence and organization.
He spent one year of his life there, one season out of a 20 + season career. I don't doubt that Hitzfeld would have been a positive influence to learn from- even for that relatively short window in time. Maybe he was out of the room whenever defensive planning was being discussed. That, and the approach to going after sides at home with a bit of nous and creativity.
It's not Klopp's Day 1 Lesson 1 - that would be 'always press the ball wherever you are whatever minute of the game.' And Lambert wants us to do that, but they're not fit enough yet. He also did his badges in Germany, alongside Klopp as it happens, and the amount of importance he places on his German education is enormous.
One thing I wish he hadn't picked up from Hitzfeld is the 'big man is better than playmaker' ideology of 1990s German football. It's outdated and it's what made us look abysmal today.
Any yet as radical as Klopp's approach may be in some respects, he still understood the importance of a solid defence and a solid midfield. He would do, as an ex defender.
Subotic was with him at Mainz, and was one of his first signings at Dortmund. Sven Bender and Hummels were signed within his first 12 months and he inherited Kehl, so the importance of the spine was there to see. You build the rest from that point onwards.
No teams -even good ones- can ignore the importance of defending, or achieve any agree of success with a gung-ho "You score 2 we'll score 3" approach. And we are light years away from being a good side.
Being more organized doesn't mean adopting McLeish's turgid brand of football either.
But we currently have on the books some of the worst defenders at the club in 20 years (most of them signed by Lambert, at this point) and that more than anything contributes to this constant need to play catch up.
In my lifetime, Villa Park has rarely been a venue where you'd expect to see free flowing entertaining football. But any two from a McGrath, Teale, Southgate, Ugo, Mellberg, Laursen or even an Alpay in that side this afternoon might have been enough to get away with a below average performance and sneak an uninspiring 1-0 win. This side can't do that. If we turn in below average performances, we lose.
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As someone else has said, its a reality check. We won the first match, very unlucky in the second, distinctly average in the third and awful today. We have all these attacking options but no plan b. And it depresses me how many teams go home with 3 points from Villa Park. Compare Everton's performance today to ours. Different gravy.
Yes Everton were good today however please don't disregard our performance at SB a few weeks ago.
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Very down, was excited about my first visit to VP this season but soon had the wind knocked out of my sails, most of the time it's a torture at home games and god help season ticket holders, changes must be made for the Norwich game, KEA out Sylla in, Weimann out Tonev in, only plus point for me is Delph who looks a proper player, my sons and I don't go to many home league games maybe 7/8 a season, the last home win we saw was Blackburn at home in the McLeish season, JESUS.
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Not denying that this was a very poor perfomance, but its early in the season.
Swinging from optimism to pessimism with every single game is bad for your health. Lets see how we are in another 3 or 4 games before we start breaking out the orange dots and lucky pies.
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I also thought our support today was non-existent, as is often the case when playing the "lesser" teams. The team needs support against all teams, no matter how we're playing.
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Load of shite.
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on a positive note we had 55% of the ball at home!
and scored from a corner!
and didn't concede from a corner!
and were really quite shit!
Bugger!
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Very down, was excited about my first visit to VP this season but soon had the wind knocked out of my sails, most of the time it's a torture at home games and god help season ticket holders, changes must be made for the Norwich game, KEA out Sylla in, Weimann out Tonev in, only plus point for me is Delph who looks a proper player, my sons and I don't go to many home league games maybe 7/8 a season, the last home win we saw was Blackburn at home in the McLeish season, JESUS.
Great idea Steve!
Get Jesus in!
On loan would be fine by me!
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I think my biggest concern would be around Weimann and Lowton. Lowton in particular had issues with positioning last year, but I put it down to lack of experience. However he still seems to have exactly the same issues and he hasn't learnt. Likewise Weimann still loses concentration and it affects his game badly. This are issues that should be disappearing from both of their games.
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He's used to crosses...
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How many league games is that now without a clean sheet.
A record number I believe for the Premier league.
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26
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If we haven't improved after this season ie. 16/17th again where does that leave the club ? Lambert? The fans ? I don't think I can do another season of fighting relegation. It affects me too much .
Why do we deserve/expect more than 16th/17th?
Because we are Aston Villa and a big club with tradition, history, pride, and a huge fan base and are one of the biggest 10 clubs in the country at the very least - there is no way clubs like stoke, west brom, Swansea , etc should be expected to achieve more than us.
Fair enough , top 6 is beyond us but we should be aiming higher than 16th!
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Why when we are attacking on the halfway line do all the players run off toward the goal and away from our player in possession? What about making runs down the channels or out wide to some support
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He's used to crosses...
And on the third day, he'd go again!
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9 home wins in just over 2 seasons. Not good enough.
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Why when we are attacking on the halfway line do all the players run off toward the goal and away from our player in possession? What about making runs down the channels or out wide to some support
Our movement off the ball is really poor.
We regularly struggle to take a throw in to one of our own players - no-one seems to be prepared to move to create space or even want the ball.
Few of our players today looked hungry, keen for the ball, or prepared to offer themselves to a team mate in possession.
It's very, very basic stuff.
Isn't it?
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If we haven't improved after this season ie. 16/17th again where does that leave the club ? Lambert? The fans ? I don't think I can do another season of fighting relegation. It affects me too much .
Why do we deserve/expect more than 16th/17th?
Because we are Aston Villa and a big club with tradition, history, pride, and a huge fan base and are one of the biggest 10 clubs in the country at the very least - there is no way clubs like stoke, west brom, Swansea , etc should be expected to achieve more than us.
Fair enough , top 6 is beyond us but we should be aiming higher than 16th!
We have one of the best strikers playing for us in the league aswell, too bad there's still nobody in midfield to create chances for him.
If WBA can finish 9th last season, I really don't see why it's unrealistic for us to aim for that spot although no chance with performances like that today. Mind you West Brom finished their season in January and still finished 9th so who knows?
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Was second best for most parts of the game, Delph and Vlaar were our only 2 who had a half decent game, Where has the Lowton of last season gone?
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9 home wins in just over 2 seasons. Not good enough.
That's over £100 per win for the price of my season ticket .
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Just back. Didn't get going until the second half and bringing another forward on destroyed our shape. Delph was great in parts but once KEA came off he disappeared.
Thatchers on BBC2, head out to find some ale.
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Just back. Didn't get going until the second half and bringing another forward on destroyed our shape. Delph was great in parts but once KEA came off he disappeared.
Thatchers on BBC2, head out to find some ale.
Know how you feel.
Even a gallon or two of Thatcher's isn't enough after today's tripe! ;-)
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Just back from game...agree with most only delph was a positive. Benteke non existant and wiemann needs to take a break. Vlaar needs new boots he must have slipped on 5 occasions. Sissoko bosses midfield. Needed syla on him. Onwards and upwards
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It appears Lambert has just bought a brand new subs bench, and failed to really address the defence and the midfield. The 'swallow' at Arsenal didn't make a summer and today's show was probably more typical of what we are like, especially at home.
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Luna was Bennettssque today . Just awful.
As a fellow member of the left back union (and have played that position at Villa Park) - Luna got injured several times and Michael Dean being the wonderful referee he is - didn't allow the trainer on either time. For Newcastle's 2nd goal Luna was left exposed to face Ben Arta in full flight and could not cover which led to the start of the defensive cock ups that followed.
Gabby had wandered off from covering on the left side so we were vulnerable.
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Both of the fullbacks even if they were poor, particularly Lowton, they were left completely isolated all the time. When Okore was playing his pace covered it a bit, but after that we were stuffed.
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To depressed to say anything other than just like most matches at Villa park under this clueless manger we were shite .
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When Benteke re signed in the summer and we made early and positive moves to bring in new young players I genuinely believed that I would never see another game as bad as that one today but there it was like some sort of horrible blast from the past played out with all the same old slap dash finishing, feeble midfield and casual defending.
If we spend another season wallowing about at the bottom of the table, that's me finished. Gone.
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We need the midfield to produce more everything, goals, opportunities and control. Delph played well today but he needs to add goals to his game. Westwood and whoever plays alongside him need to control the game and actual create chances for our forwards to score. The reality is that today the midfield didn't offer much at all.
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It was the Bradford game all over again.
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Both of the fullbacks even if they were poor, particularly Lowton, they were left completely isolated all the time. When Okore was playing his pace covered it a bit, but after that we were stuffed.
Common theme sadly, too often teams come at our exposed defence and there is no cover for them - defence is a key part of the game - for all his attacking instincts lambert didnt exactly get us scoring freely last season and the fact we have gone 26 league games without a clean sheet says a lot .
We do not defend well enough and the defence are too often left exposed , we do not score often enough as there is little width to get balls in for the strikers from the wing and our midfield lacks creativity and provides little in the way of chances or know how when it comes to breaking teams down - crying out for creativity.
Today has been a very bad day indeed and things need to improve - we need to get a result at Norwich and there need to be changes made to the starting line up at Norwich.
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-Lamberts tactical nous, or thorough lack of. This 4-2-4 madness has to end. This lack of width has to end. Strange substitution choices.
4-2-4 could be explainable if 2 of the 4 were wide....why were all 4 straight through the middle....? Again?
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I said before today that this game would be the marker for our season... how right I was.
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I am totally pissed off by that result.
But, it's only the fourth game and we have won one. It will get better.
That is what I'm hanging on to.
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Very disheartening display.
First half we looked like 11 players who'd never played together before. Poor passing, no
Movement, creativity, urgency or ideas.
Thought we could only improve in the second half, and we did, for the first 20 mins. Then what happened next was truly embarrassing, a repeat of the bradford debacle with a CM going off and a 4th striker coming on.
Cue 4-2-4 with no width, no one knowing where they were playing
Or what to do. Looked very
Much like Lambert shoehorning a CF into the side that we barely need. Hope he finds a solution because 7m is a big signing for us at the moment.
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After watching fatpants perform well todayfor everton i really think we could have done with that sort of experience sat in front of the back 4. Lamberts way it is though, hope he can sort it quick.
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I said before today that this game would be the marker for our season... how right I was.
You know what the next 34 games are going to be like then do you?
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I think Gareth barry debut was a marker it highlights what we miss in villa midfield .... I don't think kea and Westwood should be together as there needs to be more than delph as a progressive player . Westwood annonys me in that he is very cautious and plays 2 yard passes patrols the centre circle and dosent offer any attacking nous ... Kea is worse than Ikea . If Gareth Barry was in team we woukd have won
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Villa Park os too easy to play at.
Also, why dont the club do something to stop cuntish fuck bubbles getting on our pitch week in week out?
In former times, we sorted this type of transgression out ourselves. Now we sit on our arseholes and grow a tumour. That is progress for you.
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Thing is KEA looked out of his depth last season and through being dropped and then injury Lambert looked at other options and we improved a lot in the midfield.
I've no idea how he's found his way back in to be honest and if Lambert wanted a play maker then he needed to sign one, relying on someone whose already let you down already without looking for other options is the sort of thing MON would have done.
I'll be at the Citeh game for the first Villa match in 10 years, was hoping a win today would mean we could go in with confidence and give it a real go. Unless we get something at Norwich to lift the team I fear it'll be a hammering.
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We'll fucking hammer Norwich next week.
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We'll fucking hammer Norwich next week.
We kind of need to now. If we play 5 and lose 4 we'll be looking at real trouble to start the season with.
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I will state it for the second time tonight. If you sign three 6 foot + strikers. Give them ammo. Wingers and crosses from natural width. Lowton and Luna are not the answers.
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Thing is KEA looked out of his depth last season and through being dropped and then injury Lambert looked at other options and we improved a lot in the midfield.
I've no idea how he's found his way back in to be honest
It happens a lot. If they sign them they shoehorn them in. Pride before judgement.
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Thing is KEA looked out of his depth last season and through being dropped and then injury Lambert looked at other options and we improved a lot in the midfield.
I've no idea how he's found his way back in to be honest
It happens a lot. If they sign them they shoehorn them in. Pride before judgement.
KEA played very well at Arsenal, but Sylla is vital to our midfield. He was an inspired signing really, but he completely changes our game.
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After a bottle of wine and a nice meal my seething anger has subsided to....seething anger.
It is a clear case of Groundhog Day as we have a slight change in personnel but the same shit results.
We still cannot defend, and try to pass the ball through impossibly tight areas, we play a sort of franic football with no cohesion, sort of of the cuff where one touch can be a touch of genius or disaster.
Too much play in the centre of midfield, no width (one cross from Lowton caused Mayhem...why not get players wider and stretch the pitch in tight games such as this.
Defending? If i see Ron Vlarr try another drag-back in his own penalty area I think I'll expolde, too many players of the same 'type' in midfield, and a soft touch at home, I think we are in for another world of pain on that show fellow Villains.
Their no. 7 Sissoko continued a recent trend of 'doubling up' on Benteke, rendering him, and therefore Villa, innefecive, and we must find a way around this if we ony have a one-man threat other players like Gabby must come to the party.
And what happened to Lowton today ? A truly shocking performance, and Weimann looks poor so far, we have options now so Mr Lambert you will have to earn your corn and change things around.
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Vlaar didn't actually play too badly today. The main reason we struggled was our tactics, our sitting midfielders and our right back.
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Well that was utter, utter shit. Newcastle played well but, still, no excuses.
That said, I'm willing to accept an utterly abysmal performance so long as it doesn't happen again any time soon. I expect a much better performance next game. Let's put that crap behind us and move on as soon as possible.
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Thing is KEA looked out of his depth last season and through being dropped and then injury Lambert looked at other options and we improved a lot in the midfield.
I've no idea how he's found his way back in to be honest
It happens a lot. If they sign them they shoehorn them in. Pride before judgement.
KEA played very well at Arsenal, but Sylla is vital to our midfield. He was an inspired signing really, but he completely changes our game.
Arsenal's midfield is all lightweight ,like KEA that's why he looked ok.Against the likes of Sissoko he is not strong enough and all he can do is pass sideways.
The problems from last season have not gone -
Defence still looks suspect with FB's covering all the width either too deep to be effective attacking wise or up to far leaving us exposed on the break.
Midfield to many side ways passes in the middle and you can't see a goal out of the three of them.In thier defence you see them often looking wide for an option and no one there
Attack Benteke is left isolated and flicking on to no one.The wide 2 like the FB's are doing too much.They are supposed to be getting onto Benteke's flick on's ,provide cross's/pass's to him and cover the FB's when attacking.
Lambert himself says in his post match interview the team can only play one way ..high tempo.But after a year in job and 3 transfers windows you have to ask why this hasn't been addressed.After a performance and result like todays there are going to be knee jerk reactions but the poor defending ,going behind in all 4 games so far ,no plan B other than top loading the team with attackers these are all issues we have had for a while.
Need a much better performance and result against Norwich
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After a bottle of wine and a nice meal my seething anger has subsided to....seething anger.
It is a clear case of Groundhog Day as we have a slight change in personnel but the same shit results.
We still cannot defend, and try to pass the ball through impossibly tight areas, we play a sort of franic football with no cohesion, sort of of the cuff where one touch can be a touch of genius or disaster.
Too much play in the centre of midfield, no width (one cross from Lowton caused Mayhem...why not get players wider and stretch the pitch in tight games such as this.
Defending? If i see Ron Vlarr try another drag-back in his own penalty area I think I'll expolde, too many players of the same 'type' in midfield, and a soft touch at home, I think we are in for another world of pain on that show fellow Villains.
Their no. 7 Sissoko continued a recent trend of 'doubling up' on Benteke, rendering him, and therefore Villa, innefecive, and we must find a way around this if we ony have a one-man threat other players like Gabby must come to the party.
And what happened to Lowton today ? A truly shocking performance, and Weimann looks poor so far, we have options now so Mr Lambert you will have to earn your corn and change things around.
Vlarr tried to play out our penalty area against Rotherham, and got away with it -just.I remember thinking , you wont get away that in the Premiership.
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Whatever the reasons for today's abject performance, however much people want to say "give it 10 matches", I'm basically fed-up with watching this. It's just not very good is it? Never expected miracles just wanted good football, skill, focus and determination. This is basically rubbish. Season after season of boring rubbish.
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Forgot to say hello to the debutant - did he touch the ball?
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We need a win against Norwich, we also need a change in personnel to send a message that poor performance is not acceptable.
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We look a different team away from home. We're set up as a counter attacking team, so playing at home is as frustrating as hell.
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It is, but a different team selection and approach is quite clearly needed at home. Teams come, string a full 5 across midfield, get full width with the wide players of the 5 pegging back Luna and Lowton, KEA and Westwood don't move much, so you are left with Delph as the only runner from midfield. Gabby and Weimann naturally come central, we then have 0 width, and 0 idea. We need to change the formation, or approach at home. I even think a 4-4-2 with genuine wingers and 1 behind Benteke would work better as it would at least give us an out. At the moment we are stuck with no out ball.
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Missed a big trick not getting Barry back for a season. Our loss is Everton's gain as his experience, ability to keep possession and leadership skills would have made such as difference to our shitty midfield. Barry or KEA?
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I thought it was a poor game contested by two teams who looked poor on the day. We looked dodgy at the back, gave the ball away in midfield and impotent up front. I was surprised KEA started and thought he was the worst of a bad bunch. I would play Sylla in his place next game, but then I would have done that today anyway. Weimann's place must be in danger too. I won't go over the top about one performance but it was pretty grim.
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Lose against Norwich and we will go to Hull having lost five from six and be in December again.
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Lose against Norwich and we will go to Hull having lost five from six and be in December again.
Yep that's why we must win at Norwich.
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2 even teams who were both shite.
Ben Arfa was the only real flair today.
I know it's only been 2 home games so far, but it's really pissing me off watching the rest of our midfield & attackers standing about & watching Delph taking on about 3 or 4 players without any of them thinking about moving/getting in space to support him.
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Lose at Norwich and it is going to be a very, very long season.
At home, and you can all laugh if you want, I would give Joe Bennett a game, or a few run outs, on the left of the front 3 and shift Gabby to the right, with the purpose of getting the ball into the box. I genuinely think he has the talent to make things happen.
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That is what makes it so utterly infuriating; that Newcastle are a load of utter, utter fucking shite as well.
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Lose at Norwich and it is going to be a very, very long season.
At home, and you can all laugh if you want, I would give Joe Bennett a game, or a few run outs, on the left of the front 3 and shift Gabby to the right, with the purpose of getting the ball into the box. I genuinely think he has the talent to make things happen.
We really do need to win that game. Bennett offers a lot down the left and he was really improving towards the end of last season.
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I am not bothered about Norwich. I just want PL to have a very good response to Newcastle -type moves in training.
Watching MOTD, every promising move started from Lowton. Cannot believe posts trashing him. Well done to Benteke as well.
Brad also seemed immense.
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That is what makes it so utterly infuriating; that Newcastle are a load of utter, utter fucking shite as well.
If you listened to Pardew's post match interview you would think that it would be a good idea to put money on them winning the title.* He didn't fool me though because I was at the game.
*And double it up by betting on Ben Arfa winning the Ballon d 'Or.
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I am not bothered about Norwich. I just want PL to have a very good response to Newcastle -type moves in training.
Watching MOTD, every promising move started from Lowton. Cannot believe posts trashing him. Well done to Benteke as well.
Brad also seemed immense.
I'm quite bothered about Norwich, since we need a result there. MOTD might have presented Lowton in a different light, he had a very very poor game.
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Just got back - long day - sons first game - I thought we were awful
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Missed a big trick not getting Barry back for a season. Our loss is Everton's gain as his experience, ability to keep possession and leadership skills would have made such as difference to our shitty midfield. Barry or KEA?
We haven't got him so what's the point?
We have the guys in the squad. They can do it, just a matter of time and training.
Barry was inept once, and I remember he had to learn his job!
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That is what makes it so utterly infuriating; that Newcastle are a load of utter, utter fucking shite as well.
But what they do have is a player like Ben Arfa, who is very obviously the sort of player we need. It doesn't have to be a naturally wide creative player, but a creative player of some sort.
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Ok, i wasn't at the game but i did watch the game. Pardew has every right to be pleased, we are a decent-ish team, and they came down and played pretty well and deserved their victory. I would have been disappointed with a draw at kickoff, but have no complaints. It could have been more as well if we are honest, we looked vulnerable every time they attacked.
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I am not bothered about Norwich. I just want PL to have a very good response to Newcastle -type moves in training.
Watching MOTD, every promising move started from Lowton. Cannot believe posts trashing him. Well done to Benteke as well.
Brad also seemed immense.
I'm quite bothered about Norwich, since we need a result there. MOTD might have presented Lowton in a different light, he had a very very poor game.
Didn't look that bad, but there was editing.
Or sound bad, according to the radio, when I was trying to follow. Lowton was in there on the comments.
Would quite like us to win against Norwich!
UTV
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how weimann stayed on ?? our No 8 - awful . Lowton was shocking . Luna could not even take a throw in and I think Newcastle scored more or less after that .
i saw one Villa player let the ball go out for a throw in , when it was better to whip a cross in .
Could not pass the ball , we must have kicked it out 6 times off the pitch , no players showing , dreadful mistakes , no cutting edge
It was worse than England . Felt like I was watching Stoke .
I noticed Gareth Barry was excellent . f**k we needed that experience
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I find it hard to understand people who say that Newcastle were rubbish. They looked a bit out of sorts after we equalised but apart from that they controlled the game and had the key man in Ben Arfa.
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I find it hard to understand people who say that Newcastle were rubbish. They looked a bit out of sorts after we equalised but apart from that they controlled the game and had the key man in Ben Arfa.
Yes, they have some very good players who looked like a team today. This I think was due to them gaining confidence from a good start and an early goal. Lambert is right about us needing to start better however obvious that sounds.
The Bradford Revisited forward line did my crust in.
Agree with everyone that Delph played well, disagree with nearly everyone about Vlaar, thought he played quite well.
Tonev and Sylla next week please PL.
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I am not bothered about Norwich. I just want PL to have a very good response to Newcastle -type moves in training.
Watching MOTD, every promising move started from Lowton. Cannot believe posts trashing him. Well done to Benteke as well.
Brad also seemed immense.
lowton was awful today I thought
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We're going to have to change our formation at home. It's not working with three immobile forwards when we're not counter-attacking. I think Weimann is going to have to step aside unless he can prove himself undroppable. And if we're using target men, we need to cross the ball now and then. We really need that creative midfielder more than ever.
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I am not bothered about Norwich. I just want PL to have a very good response to Newcastle -type moves in training.
Watching MOTD, every promising move started from Lowton. Cannot believe posts trashing him. Well done to Benteke as well.
Brad also seemed immense.
lowton was awful today I thought
Picked out on MOTD and mentioned positively in dispatches on the radio, mainly on the wing. He is doing something!
Ok, I wasn't there, but I like him, as a player I mean.
Every good midfielder has to learn his job.
That said, we need somebody creative in the middle, as well.
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After the second half against Liverpool, this team deserved another run out. We regressed, which can happen after 3 weeks off.
If I was there I would have been pissed off too. It was a gamble to chuck Kozak on, especially since he hadn't even trained with the side yet. That was such a low percentage play that even my blood optimism finds hard to justify.
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This is my 10th straight season ticket and I genuinely can't remember us ever being that good at home. Even in the multiple 5th/6th finishes we'd regularly throw in terrible performances and struggle to break teams down.
Lambert's n.o.1 priority this season should have been to sort out our home form, yet in the two games we've seen I can't see any evidence that he has given it any extra thought whatsoever. His signings don't exactly say 'here comes a new plan' either. Kozak seems like the last player on earth we should have signed, why not a touchline hugging winger to give a different angle of attack if required? Or someone to play just off Benteke with a bit of guile? It's not rocket science is it?
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I sat next to a lovely guy who's been going down for 67 years. He didn't rate anyone on the pitch yesterday he had me entertained the whole game with some of the things he was saying, I was going to get him a drink afterwards but he was driving back.
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Lose against Norwich and we will go to Hull having lost five from six and be in December again.
<scrathes head>
Are we going to lose to someone else before Norwich?
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Missed a big trick not getting Barry back for a season. Our loss is Everton's gain as his experience, ability to keep possession and leadership skills would have made such as difference to our shitty midfield. Barry or KEA?
We haven't got him so what's the point?
We have the guys in the squad. They can do it, just a matter of time and training.
Barry was inept once, and I remember he had to learn his job!
KEA is 28 (29 by the turn of the year). How much time and training do you give him to learn his job?
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I am not bothered about Norwich. I just want PL to have a very good response to Newcastle -type moves in training.
Watching MOTD, every promising move started from Lowton. Cannot believe posts trashing him. Well done to Benteke as well.
Brad also seemed immense.
lowton was awful today I thought
Picked out on MOTD and mentioned positively in dispatches on the radio, mainly on the wing. He is doing something!Ok, I wasn't there, but I like him, as a player I mean.
Every good midfielder has to learn his job.
That said, we need somebody creative in the middle, as well.
He had an absolute shocker. Gave the ball away almost every time he had it and was caught out of position on numerous occasions. By far his worst performance in a Villa shirt,but hopefully it is just a blip in form.
I accept that I don't see the players in training on a daily basis, but I can't understand why Sylla hasn't featured yet this season. I thought KEA was pedestrian and just doesn't offer enough for me.
Lambert really needs to come up with a different plan at home because we have become very predictable.
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Good point. At 28/29 and in his second season there is no time to wait. He should be now or never.
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Missed a big trick not getting Barry back for a season. Our loss is Everton's gain as his experience, ability to keep possession and leadership skills would have made such as difference to our shitty midfield. Barry or KEA?
We haven't got him so what's the point?
We have the guys in the squad. They can do it, just a matter of time and training.
Barry was inept once, and I remember he had to learn his job!
KEA is 28 (29 by the turn of the year). How much time and training do you give him to learn his job?
He seemed OK last time I saw him! Give the man a chance, anybody can have a bad day.
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He's had more bad days than most.
And yes, for a footballer approaching 30, you'd kind of expect that he might be a bit closer to the finished article.
How much more is he likely to develop?
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I am not bothered about Norwich. I just want PL to have a very good response to Newcastle -type moves in training.
Watching MOTD, every promising move started from Lowton. Cannot believe posts trashing him. Well done to Benteke as well.
Brad also seemed immense.
lowton was awful today I thought
Picked out on MOTD and mentioned positively in dispatches on the radio, mainly on the wing. He is doing something!Ok, I wasn't there, but I like him, as a player I mean.
Every good midfielder has to learn his job.
That said, we need somebody creative in the middle, as well.
He had an absolute shocker. Gave the ball away almost every time he had it and was caught out of position on numerous occasions. By far his worst performance in a Villa shirt,but hopefully it is just a blip in form.
I accept that I don't see the players in training on a daily basis, but I can't understand why Sylla hasn't featured yet this season. I thought KEA was pedestrian and just doesn't offer enough for me.
Lambert really needs to come up with a different plan at home because we have become very predictable.
You know, I don't know why Sylla hasn't started either, but evidently PL has his plans.
It's a white knuckle ride all the way, with this manager, whichever season!
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I am not bothered about Norwich. I just want PL to have a very good response to Newcastle -type moves in training.
Watching MOTD, every promising move started from Lowton. Cannot believe posts trashing him. Well done to Benteke as well.
Brad also seemed immense.
lowton was awful today I thought
Picked out on MOTD and mentioned positively in dispatches on the radio, mainly on the wing. He is doing something!
Ok, I wasn't there, but I like him, as a player I mean.
Every good midfielder has to learn his job.
That said, we need somebody creative in the middle, as well.
just kept giving the ball away ,could not do a simple ball . He wasnt the only one . I thought weimann was poor , should have been off so much earlier and el ahmadi was rubbish . One positive was Delph to be fair . Lambert does take too long to do subs ;( maybe because he cant do them
we should have got steve Staunton off his bike and give him a game .
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I am not bothered about Norwich. I just want PL to have a very good response to Newcastle -type moves in training.
Watching MOTD, every promising move started from Lowton. Cannot believe posts trashing him. Well done to Benteke as well.
Brad also seemed immense.
lowton was awful today I thought
Picked out on MOTD and mentioned positively in dispatches on the radio, mainly on the wing. He is doing something!
Ok, I wasn't there, but I like him, as a player I mean.
Every good midfielder has to learn his job.
That said, we need somebody creative in the middle, as well.
just kept giving the ball away ,could not do a simple ball . He wasnt the only one . I thought weimann was poor , should have been off so much earlier and el ahmadi was rubbish . One positive was Delph to be fair . Lambert does take too long to do subs ;( maybe because he cant do them
by all accounts Villa had a bit of a mare today.
Let's give them a bye/space to go, 'what the hell was that' and move on. I've had days like that.
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Not suprised by that performance as Lambert has not improved the quality of the squad just bought more prospects.Luna, Westwood, Weiman, Kea all of them are not of Premiership standard. The insistance Lambert has in not playing genuine wingers is costing us badly in home games, we become far too narrow and deprives Benteke of decent service. We will struggle again this season.
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Don't think another 'bad day at the office' post will really make a difference!
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I was on a promise if we won.
Bastards.
How do you figure that?
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I am not bothered about Norwich. I just want PL to have a very good response to Newcastle -type moves in training.
Watching MOTD, every promising move started from Lowton. Cannot believe posts trashing him. Well done to Benteke as well.
Brad also seemed immense.
lowton was awful today I thought
Picked out on MOTD and mentioned positively in dispatches on the radio, mainly on the wing. He is doing something!
Ok, I wasn't there, but I like him, as a player I mean.
Every good midfielder has to learn his job.
That said, we need somebody creative in the middle, as well.
just kept giving the ball away ,could not do a simple ball . He wasnt the only one . I thought weimann was poor , should have been off so much earlier and el ahmadi was rubbish . One positive was Delph to be fair . Lambert does take too long to do subs ;( maybe because he cant do them
by all accounts Villa had a bit of a mare today.
Let's give them a bye/space to go, 'what the hell was that' and move on. I've had days like that.
Might have been the case in the last couple of seasons, but there are other options in the squad now and dropping a couple of players might keep others on their toes. Unless he has a fitness or atttude problem, Sylla has to come in for KEA at Norwich and I would also consider starting Tonev instead of Weimann. Lowton should get another chance, but any more performances like today and Bacuna could well take his place.
Forgot to say in my previous post that although I'm not a big fan of his, I thought Clark did pretty well when he came on for Okore. No silly mistakes and he made a couple of good interceptions.
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Yes, Clark did well.
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Wow! I thought it was bad on VT but KEA really is this year's Bannan in terms of scapegoating on here. Yes, he was poor yesterday (along with pretty-much everybody else) but people seem to forget that he was one of our best players in the Arsenal, Chelsea and Rotherham games. Was unduly dropped for Bacuna in the Liverpool game it should be pointed out.
If anybody is to be dropped for Sylla, it should be Westwood who has offered little in any of our games so far this season.
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On KEA, I agree I don't get all the 'why is he starting' comments. He started because he was fundamental to the way we played in our early good performances. But I agree he's the obvious candidate to drop out to improve something.
Not sure who would come in for Westwood though. I don't think Sylla could sit in front of the back two - he's better getting around the pitch.
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In fairness, I would drop Westwood for Sylla and leave KEA in, at least he is looking mobile.
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Westwood has been pretty dire, but he's really the only player suited to that Carrick sort of role. KEA couldn't play the deeper role, he'd struggle even more. I do worry that KEA will mirror last season. A promising few games early on, before disappearing into mediocrity. Personally I don't see what attributes the guy has to make him stand out at this level. He's fairly tidy on the ball ordinarily, but he really needs to stop dwelling sometimes. Yesterday his passing was way off. Even simple balls went astray, but again, he wasn't alone in that.
I felt sorry for Delphy to be honest. He was doing all the work in midfield. The other two were anonymous. I'll give Westy the benefit of doubt that he's just having a slow start, because last season he was very good indeed. As for KEA, unless he starts stamping his authority on games, he'll be back player at a lesser level within a year. You cannot go missing at this level and expect to stay.
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Sylla played much deeper in pre-season and looked good so hopefully that is the position he will play more of this season. He is our only player who can occupy the DM role that we are desperately lacking in.
Westwood for me is simply too lightweight and defensively inept to play there. At least KEA showed against Arsenal that he can get stuck in. That he can tackle and impose himself on the opposition. Something Westwood never has and probably never will be able to do.
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I just think that if you played Sylla there our ball retention would be even worse.
But might be wrong.
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Lose at Norwich and it is going to be a very, very long season.
At home, and you can all laugh if you want, I would give Joe Bennett a game, or a few run outs, on the left of the front 3 and shift Gabby to the right, with the purpose of getting the ball into the box. I genuinely think he has the talent to make things happen.
We really do need to win that game. Bennett offers a lot down the left and he was really improving towards the end of last season.
I think Bennett maybe would be better as a left sided midfielder than as a left back - worth giving him a try .
Certainly we cannot set up the same way at home as we do away as teams will come to villa park and stifle us - we need to change things at home and vary it a bit - lamberts comments that we only know one way to play worry me - teams should be able to adapt to different formations and styles - we have a few problems that he needs to address.
There is no doubt that sylla needs to be in midfield , i understand kea started the season well and was hard to leave out but now sylla must return .
Westwood , Weimann, and Lowton also need to get their game together fast - all three can have no complaints if dropped.
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Westwood has been pretty dire, but he's really the only player suited to that Carrick sort of role.
Where does the 'Carrick role' fit into our team though? We are not a possession-based team so it is pretty pointless. Westwood offers nothing off the ball.
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Westwood has been pretty dire, but he's really the only player suited to that Carrick sort of role.
Where does the 'Carrick role' fit into our team though? We are not a possession-based team so it is pretty pointless. Westwood offers nothing off the ball.
We're not a possession team no, but it's what Lambert sees us as long term. It's the ultimate goal, but we're technically too poor to play it. The other problem is, that we don't really have too many ball playing midfielders left. Westwood is our tidiest passing player (on his day) but currently lacks that incisive pass, that was beginning to find at the tail end of last season. KEA is okay passing 10 yards but not much more. Delph's game is more about his athleticism. I've no problem with Delph because his running in midfield is important.
I do think there was a balance to Delph, Westy and Sylla that we haven't seen from any other combination. Westwood was always available, while the energy and running of Sylla and Delph gave us some presence. KEA, even when hes played quite well, doesn't give us any presence.
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Sylla played much deeper in pre-season and looked good so hopefully that is the position he will play more of this season. He is our only player who can occupy the DM role that we are desperately lacking in.
Westwood for me is simply too lightweight and defensively inept to play there. At least KEA showed against Arsenal that he can get stuck in. That he can tackle and impose himself on the opposition. Something Westwood never has and probably never will be able to do.
I agree. Sylla was fine when he came in towards the end of last season, and his arrival in the side just happened to coincide with an upturn in the team's fortunes. We started looking better as a unit and dominating the midfield more. He's not just physical - from what I saw, his distribution is fine too, but most importantly his movement was better. Last season, he didn't just sit deep, he frequently moved into space and was generally always available for a pass.
However, for me KEA has no impact whatsoever on the game. Seriously, if he got sent off, would anyone even notice? At least Westwood can produce a defence-splitting pass from time to time, although I agree that defensively he's crap.
Let's be honest, if we really want to do well, we need better players than we have in midfield. Which is why I can't understand Lambert blowing 7 million quid on a striker, when up front is the one area we actually have the requisite quality in.
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Westwood proved last season he can play at this level - he has started poorly though this year and can have no qualms if he is dropped-i think we pretty much all agree sylla needs to start ,.
I would line up at Norwich assuming okore is out with -
Guzan
Lowton. Clark. Vlaar Luna
Westwood. Delph. Sylla
Gabby. Benteke. Tonev
With both Lowton and luna needing to vastly improve on yesterday or be the next to be dropped.
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Forgot to say in my previous post that although I'm not a big fan of his, I thought Clark did pretty well when he came on for Okore. No silly mistakes and he made a couple of good interceptions.
Sorry but I don't agree with this.
I'm a fan of Clark, I certainly think he's better than Baker, but the reason for this is his passing. Yesterday his passing was terrible - he seemed to panic every time he got the ball and just launched it forwards, inevitably to one of their players.
He wasn't alone in repeatedly giving the ball away but he certainly didn't help our problems.
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Westwood has been pretty dire, but he's really the only player suited to that Carrick sort of role.
Where does the 'Carrick role' fit into our team though? We are not a possession-based team so it is pretty pointless. Westwood offers nothing off the ball.
We're not a possession team no, but it's what Lambert sees us as long term. It's the ultimate goal, but we're technically too poor to play it. The other problem is, that we don't really have too many ball playing midfielders left. Westwood is our tidiest passing player (on his day) but currently lacks that incisive pass, that was beginning to find at the tail end of last season. KEA is okay passing 10 yards but not much more. Delph's game is more about his athleticism. I've no problem with Delph because his running in midfield is important.
I do think there was a balance to Delph, Westy and Sylla that we haven't seen from any other combination. Westwood was always available, while the energy and running of Sylla and Delph gave us some presence. KEA, even when hes played quite well, doesn't give us any presence.
I thought KEA was a major presence in the Arsenal game. He was the one player consistently dispossessing them and giving them little time on the ball.
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Delph looked fairly decent yesterday in an otherwise poor bunch. His quick bursts over 20 yards gets him away from people and is the equivalent to beating a man on the wing to force the issue with the next defender in line. It appears the only way we actually forced them out of shape. Still go his customary booking though in a stupid position. From what I have seen though, he is clearly the best of our middle three. Sissoko made them all look like amateurs though, by far the best midfielder on show and ben arfa looked like a much better ashley young.
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Another long season beckons, playing KEA Westwood and Delph in same team at home is not right, where is Tonev? Need creativity, Weimann should not be playing every week and neither should Gabby. Slow at home and constantly unable to create. Not Fucking happy
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Sylla played much deeper in pre-season and looked good so hopefully that is the position he will play more of this season. He is our only player who can occupy the DM role that we are desperately lacking in.
Westwood for me is simply too lightweight and defensively inept to play there. At least KEA showed against Arsenal that he can get stuck in. That he can tackle and impose himself on the opposition. Something Westwood never has and probably never will be able to do.
I agree. Sylla was fine when he came in towards the end of last season, and his arrival in the side just happened to coincide with an upturn in the team's fortunes. We started looking better as a unit and dominating the midfield more. He's not just physical - from what I saw, his distribution is fine too, but most importantly his movement was better. Last season, he didn't just sit deep, he frequently moved into space and was generally always available for a pass.
However, for me KEA has no impact whatsoever on the game. Seriously, if he got sent off, would anyone even notice? At least Westwood can produce a defence-splitting pass from time to time, although I agree that defensively he's crap.
Let's be honest, if we really want to do well, we need better players than we have in midfield. Which is why I can't understand Lambert blowing 7 million quid on a striker, when up front is the one area we actually have the requisite quality in.
Surely your KEA comment is equally applicable to Westwood. Would anybody have noticed if he had been sent off in any game so far this season? I certainly wouldn't have.
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Oh and if I could find a bet I'd have us never to keep a clean sheet again
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Lowton and Weimann were very poor yesterday. The latter has been incredibly lucky to be in the team for so long considering his poor form this calendar year. You can add Westwood to the mix as well. In my opinion there's a touch of the 'emperor's new clothes' syndrome about Westwood and Lowton. Never been impressed with either of them but I keep getting told they're fine players who should be in the England squad. Not sure if they're even PL quality myself.
It's really painful watching Villa at home these days. Roll on next week when we're away!
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OK it's not going swimmingly as we expect however the good points are no one has ripped us apart and we are developing every match. Newcastle despite their results previous to today's game have some very good players. Just need to keep the belief and trust Lambert to get it right.
Can't agree with you mate. We were ripped to shreds for their second goal; Newcastle could have scored a couple more today and the scoreline wouldn't be unflattering. I'm also fed up with 'development'. We've had a season of that (and two seasons prior to that flirting with relegation), it's fucking results time.
Monumentally pissed off with this result.
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I find it hard to understand why lambert sets his team up the same way both home and away , surely he must realise that the onus is on the home team to start on th front foot and take the game to the visitors - we allowed newcastle far too much space and quite frankly it is not pleasant to watch - i think away from home we are a decent team but i won't accept his comments that we only know one way to play.
There has to be variation in our formations and the way we play at home - this has gone on far too long and also we need to start games from the first minute instead of waiting 20 minutes before we start to play .
The fans deserve better than the football on offer at villa park in recent seasons - today i am still very angry at what I saw yesterday - it was very very poor .
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Now, it sucked today and he's made a very large fuckup in the transfer market in my opinion. But we have quality and ability through the side as the opening couple of games showed, and Lambert has plenty of goodwill in the bank, and we should have enough to be fine this season. But a lot of what happened today was totally unacceptable.
Hmmm. I'm not sure how much quality is there to be honest. They may well be decent footballers in training, but there's too many that just don't seem to be up to the task of actually playing a game of football.
Lowton, Westwood, Al Ahmadi, Clark, Weimann....they seem to be a bit "all fart and no shit" so far this season.
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Lose against Norwich and we will go to Hull having lost five from six and be in December again.
<scrathes head>
Are we going to lose to someone else before Norwich?
Our next home game is against Man City. I wouldn't bet on our first clean sheet in 28 games coming against them.
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Our midfield creates no danger for the opposition at all.
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PL has screwed up big time with his selection of Bacuna & KEA ahead of Sylla in the 2 home games against Pool & Newcastle. Even against Rotherham Sylla didn't start. He's not getting any decent game time from this and he'll take time to get up to speed if he gets selected. Sylla could've been effective yesterday against Sissoko who bossed the midfield. Our passing and ball retention was shocking.
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Lose against Norwich and we will go to Hull having lost five from six and be in December again.
<scrathes head>
Are we going to lose to someone else before Norwich?
Our next home game is against Man City. I wouldn't bet on our first clean sheet in 28 games coming against them.
Against city i daresay we will play like the away team and look to hit them on the counter attack - i like the way southampton have a go at teams at home and take the game to the top teams - at villa park we have beaten arsenal, man utd and Liverpool something like 3 times in our last 50 home games against those 3 - that is quite staggering.
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Very poor yesterday. Lets hope it was a 'bad day at the office' rather than the sign of things to come. They've earned a break from too much hand-wringing with the first few performances.
Too many if our lot weren't at the races and our fullbacks aren't convincing defensively. Teams know it and exploit it.
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we had to many under performing today! people are slating weimann who has been poor for a while now. but what we have to remember is he is a finisher not a winger! and the same goes for gabby but he gets away with it because of his pace away from home! what lambert needs to do is play weimann up with benteke for the home games at least and play four across the middle. i think that would make us a better team!
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we had to many under performing today! people are slating weimann who has been poor for a while now. but what we have to remember is he is a finisher not a winger! and the same goes for gabby but he gets away with it because of his pace away from home! what lambert needs to do is play weimann up with benteke for the home games at least and play four across the middle. i think that would make us a better team!
I agree with a lot of this , but i would play Bennett as the wide left midfielder as he can provide width going forward , has a decent cross on him and would provide cover for luna at left back .
We have a few strikers to play from if he decides to play 2 up front - obviously benteke would be one of those two.
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The safety and calm of a season of mid-table obscurity looks a long way off this morning.
"hold onto your seats" it's going to be a bumpy 9 months.
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Lambert should have signed that midfield playmaker we've been crying out for. Shocking display from the midfield yesterday (Delph aside).
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4-3-3 Simply doesn't work at home. It's great away from home when teams come onto us and we can counter but when at home when the responsibility is on us to take the game to the opposition the formation is to easy to stop.
Lambert needs to give us some width, for two reasons. A) To give our full backs more support, we NEVER double up in wide positions as there is nobody there to double up and B) To try and get some crosses into the box from better positions.
I also think we can't play Gabby, Benteke and Wiemann, if Lambert is to choose a formation with two up top he needs to leave out one of Gabby or Wiemann. If he went with 4-5-1 at home he could play Gabby wide left/right, but this leads to the problem already mention numerous times we don't have a Ben Arfa type player to play AM.
Shame that young Grealish has gone out on loan, maybe he could have been given some time to play on one wing with Gabby the other.
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Lambert was right yesterday, it was frustrating. I said the same thing walking out the ground.
Looking back, you could argue that Gabby's miss cost us the game. If he puts that away (which he should have done) and makes it 1-1, then Lambert probably would have left the team as it was and kept it's shape. Instead it was all a bit Bradford Part 2 in the end. There were too many poor perfomances to single any one person out but so far Lowton is not looking the same player he was last season.
As for next week, I wouldn't be making too many changes apart from maybe Sylla for KEA. I don't mind KEA that much but I think Westwood looks a better player with Sylla in the midfield. Besides, we're a better side away from home so i'd stick with the majority of the players and see how it goes.
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Its Sunday morning,its cold,the bad weather has hit the West Midlands,and Ive just watched our awful performance again.At the match I didnt realise that KEA had been fouled in the run up to their first goal neither did I notice how far Lowton was away from Ben Arfa before he crossed for their second.
Lambert has to tough this situation out . Wenger got a barrowload of abuse from the fans and the media when we beat them and then they moved up a few gears...we could follow their example.
Lowton and Westwood need to look at themselves closely. They are both good enough but need to step up their game and quickly. Why Lambert has bought another centre forward many of us dont understand. Helenius should have come in to take the weight off Benteke's considerable shoulders but our manager obviously doesnt think he is ready for the rigours of the top flight.
The defence has proved to be consistently unreliable for a considerable ammount of time. That is,like it or not, Lamberts fault. Not Martin O,Neills, Gerard Houlliers, or Alex McCleish's but Lambert's. If his mate's he brought in from Norwich to coach the team are not good enough.
get rid of them and get someone in who can organise a defence. But that would cost money and Randy (remember him?) wouldnt be too pleased to put more finance in.
I am seriously worried about the clubs future. Benteke will be off as soon as he can and when he moves on we will find ourselves in the same situation as we did in the mid 1960s when Tony Hateley left.....No one to score the goals we need to stay up.
I know its only mid September but without a midfielder with top flight skills and a defence that cannot defend we could be in big trouble.
And as others have pointed out KEA and Westwood are basically the same player. It doesnt make any sense to play both of them in the same team. They dont create or look likely to score more than a couple of goals per season.
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I'm hoping okore is not out too long , it looked maybe knee ligaments and if so could be a lengthy one - Clark has looked better this season but i wouldn't want to rely on him for more than the odd game.
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I'm depressed after that to be honest. I was worried we as fans were perhaps getting a bit over-confident but I really didn't see that coming. Newcastle are supposed to be a shambles and a joke, basaed on yesterday what does that make us? I'm not sure what the answer is but I agree that certain players who have appeared undroppable (Weimann, Westwood, Lowton) perhaps need to be left out to give them a kick up the backside.
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Sylla has to play next week in lieu of KEA who should be sold or go out on loan . Tonev and Bacuna on bench and on pitch at HT if things aren't working out.
I'd also consider Bennett ahead of Luna who looks shocking tbh.
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I think the biggest concern is that other than Okore and maybe Luna, not one player that has been signed is an obvious upgrade on what we have already. We really need to add players who are definitely better than what we have already.
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Bennett was finding his feet at the end of last season , it will take Luna a season to reach that level.
Where is Helenius ? He looked decent pre season ? Did kozak even touch the ball yesterday .
Still the blame for this debacle sits with lambert.
I fear it's going to take him til February to figure his best team and tactics again.
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I think the biggest concern is that other than Okore and maybe Luna, not one player that has been signed is an obvious upgrade on what we have already. We really need to add players who are definitely better than what we have already.
Luna like Joe Bennet cannot defend properly. They both have a level of skill but thats about it.
As Ive said earlier in the thread Luke Young was the last full back we had who could defend and attack convincingly.
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and to make matters worse Gareth Barry having an outstanding game in midfield for Everton on his debut
because the man is fucking top quality
our team is packed with players who have little experience in the premiership.
There's a few that I don't think are all that good either, really.
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Two things Lambert must learn from yesterday are that we need to play through the midfield if we're going to produce chances at home, and we have to be much more patient with our build up play. Secondly we should never just sub midfielders for tall attackers and lump it up field, as it doesn't work.
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having slept on
and gave it a lot of thought
that was not good enough
Lambert you need to sort your home tactics etc , quick . They are your players and you have had a season.
I know its going to take time and I expect ups and downs but that was atrocious yesterday and it happens too many times at home.
Fans , will not pay money every week for that tripe when players have not got a clue what to do and looked poor quality to me. Maybe the away games will save us this season . But what a reality check was that .
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It was one of those games yesterday where before the sub was made, I couldn't decide who it was best to take off if anybody. I probably would have left it another 10 minutes and I might have plumped for Weimann, maybe pushed Benteke out wide a bit and played Kozak. I wouldn't have taken off a midfielder because for us it never works. That said, I think making the sub at the time we did brought about the goal because the delay made the Newcastle players switch off for the corner.
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Sylla has to play next week in lieu of KEA who should be sold or go out on loan . Tonev and Bacuna on bench and on pitch at HT if things aren't working out.
I'd also consider Bennett ahead of Luna who looks shocking tbh.
I agree that luna looked awful yesterday but i remember Norwich ripped Bennett apart in both league games last season and would stick with luna at left back in that game .
Bennett would make a better wide left midfielder in my opinion.
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he dont drink Carlsberg , because Lambert cant do subs. They rarely work
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It was one of those games yesterday where before the sub was made, I couldn't decide who it was best to take off if anybody. I probably would have left it another 10 minutes and I might have plumped for Weimann, maybe pushed Benteke out wide a bit and played Kozak. I wouldn't have taken off a midfielder because for us it never works. That said, I think making the sub at the time we did brought about the goal because the delay made the Newcastle players switch off for the corner.
To be honest i thought he should have taken Weimann and kea off at half time and brought on tonev and sylla.
I remember mourinho once accepting he had got it badly wrong and making 3 changes after 20 minutes to change a game , lambert should have acted sooner and when he did he make the wrong subs.
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I agree with most of what's being said here. Lambert has got to stop taking off a midfielder and replacing with a forward it just doesn't work when it leaves you with two in midfield and is pointless with 20-30 minutes left.
Bad day at the office yesterday but looking on the bright side we have 3 more points than the same fixtures last season, still a long way to go. It will be interesting to see how he gets the best out of the new players over the rest of the season.
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It was one of those games yesterday where before the sub was made, I couldn't decide who it was best to take off if anybody. I probably would have left it another 10 minutes and I might have plumped for Weimann, maybe pushed Benteke out wide a bit and played Kozak. I wouldn't have taken off a midfielder because for us it never works. That said, I think making the sub at the time we did brought about the goal because the delay made the Newcastle players switch off for the corner.
To be honest i thought he should have taken Weimann and kea off at half time and brought on tonev and sylla.
I remember mourinho once accepting he had got it badly wrong and making 3 changes after 20 minutes to change a game , lambert should have acted sooner and when he did he make the wrong subs.
The problem with doing that though would have meant all our three subs were used up and it would have been a bit of a risk.
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After a dreadful first half the way we picked it up after half time made me think we'd got away with it and might even sneak a win. Problem was the substitution seemed to totally disrupt us and instead of using the momentum of the goal to push on they got on top.
It's one game though and I'm not drawing any wider conclusions than we played badly yesterday.
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I agree clampy, it would have been a risk but sometimes risks have to be taken - bringing tonev on with 3 minutes to go was pointless, and sylla should have been on at half time, if not earlier as it was clear our midfield was being outplayed .
I guess however , its easy to be wise after the event , if having levelled it we had gone on to win we would all probably be feeling fairly happy with life.
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I don't mind losing when I can see what Lambert is trying to do
but he did not have a clue yesterday from the first minute
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I said to someone a few weeks ago that I can see us losing games against teams we should be beating from time to time but we'll batter a few teams as well so it wouldn't surprise me if we put a few past Norwich next week.
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Started off lacklustre, gave a goal away, did'nt start playing until the 40th minute, only played decently for about 20 mins , scored the equalizer, then gave another goal away.
For me yday was a big worry.KEA, Westwood and Delph, at home is too negative.KEA was poor yday, but Westwood was even worse.He is the "free" midfielder if you like, but he lacks quality and pace to hurt the opposition.One or two good passes in a game is not good enough.Delph played really well by the way, but Sylla need to come in.
Lowton, does'nt look fit to me, not chasing back 2nd half, not really getting foward, a shadow of himself last season.More of a wingback than a FB to me, should have marked the player better for the 2nd goal.
Gabby and Weimann, no competition, no threat, no goals.Worrying.
Positives, Benteke 5 in 5, Delph, only forward player who tried to be creative yday and the only Villa player who actually beat his player.Vlaar was solid, as was Okore before the injury.
I think, unless they play with the urgency and commitment they did in the 1st 2 games, that we are in for a long hard season.
I'd try and turn Bennett into a wide left sided midfielder as well.
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Two things Lambert must learn from yesterday are that we need to play through the midfield if we're going to produce chances at home, and we have to be much more patient with our build up play. Secondly we should never just sub midfielders for tall attackers and lump it up field, as it doesn't work.
This is it in a nutshell.
I was encouraged in some pre-season games and against Arsenal and Chelsea as we played some decent football at times, But yesterday I've no idea why we gave up on that.
I think Brads got to mix it up a bit as well, I don't want our attack from the back to be basically Guzan hoofing it up to Benteke and feeding of the scraps.
KEA was way off the pace yesterday!
When he lost the ball he should have been busting a gut to get back, instead he cantered back and still had a chance to throw himself into cutting out the cross but watched it bypass him.
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The whole game Ben Arfa terrorised our left side and absolutely no tactical change to sort it. Extremely worrying stuff.
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I do think that Bennett could potentially be a really good option as the wide left of our front three. He's got an excellent left foot, and Weimann needs to be dropped and Gabby shifted to the right.
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I do think that Bennett could potentially be a really good option as the wide left of our front three. He's got an excellent left foot, and Weimann needs to be dropped and Gabby shifted to the right.
I see him as left side midfielder in a midfield 4 but certainly not as one of our front three.
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Utter garbage
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Managers need to use substitute wisely as first two can be used for tactics and last one should be kept until after 75th minutes for injuries/tired player.
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I do think that Bennett could potentially be a really good option as the wide left of our front three. He's got an excellent left foot, and Weimann needs to be dropped and Gabby shifted to the right.
I see him as left side midfielder in a midfield 4 but certainly not as one of our front three.
Could he have produced less that Weimann yesterday? I doubt it. Another option at home would be to play Helenius or Tonev in a role behind Benteke and Gabby, and try and drop into space between the opposition defence and midfield.
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Managers need to use substitute wisely as first two can be used for tactics and last one should be kept until after 75th minutes for injuries/tired player.
Tis the championship manager way.
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That was truly dreadful, no better than the first half abomination against Liverpool and once again confirmed my fears that Lambert doesn't have a plan B or anything else up his sleeve
Exactly how bad have Weimann, Lowton and Westwood (to name but three) got to perform before they get dropped ?. They're all massively out of form and should not be starting at the moment. Last season was last season, they should be in or out of the team this season based on what they're doing now
The only player i'd give any credit to yesterday was Delph, and he's still more graft than guile
If, as i suspect our plan B really is replace a midfielder with a striker and lump it then another long season is on the cards yet again.
Where is the style and the will to play football ?. The only time we look half threatening is when we go at teams with some pace/verve, because when we slow things down we're dreadful.
Lowton looks all over the shop this season, on one hand i'm thinking it's because he's expected to be in tow places at once, if he's not bombing up the wing to add some much needed width folks moan, then when he does and we lose possession leaving a huge gap in defence they also moan. Is he really expected to teleport between the two with no one else doing or covering either ?
WHERE IS THE WIDTH ?, WHAT ARE GABBY/WEIMANN DOING ON THAT SCORE ?
WHY ARE WE PLAYING THREE MIDFIELDERS ALL OF WHICH LOOK HAPPY TO SPEND THE ENTIRE GAME IN THE MIDDLE THIRD OF THE PITCH WITHOUT MOVING ?
Where is the football ???
Pah
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I was disappointed with yesterday's game we need to learn from it and make sure it doesn't happen again.
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After a bottle of wine and a nice meal my seething anger has subsided to....seething anger.
It is a clear case of Groundhog Day as we have a slight change in personnel but the same shit results.
We still cannot defend, and try to pass the ball through impossibly tight areas, we play a sort of franic football with no cohesion, sort of of the cuff where one touch can be a touch of genius or disaster.
Too much play in the centre of midfield, no width (one cross from Lowton caused Mayhem...why not get players wider and stretch the pitch in tight games such as this.
Defending? If i see Ron Vlarr try another drag-back in his own penalty area I think I'll expolde, too many players of the same 'type' in midfield, and a soft touch at home, I think we are in for another world of pain on that show fellow Villains.
Their no. 7 Sissoko continued a recent trend of 'doubling up' on Benteke, rendering him, and therefore Villa, innefecive, and we must find a way around this if we ony have a one-man threat other players like Gabby must come to the party.
And what happened to Lowton today ? A truly shocking performance, and Weimann looks poor so far, we have options now so Mr Lambert you will have to earn your corn and change things around.
Exactly this. All or nothing million-mile-an-hour stuff. Either comes off or more likely results in poor ball retention and frustration for supporters.
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We have shopped at Aldi and expect them to turn up like something from Selfridges. It doesnt work.
The funniest thing yesterday was Ben Arfa running at Clark and the latter back pedalling. Ben Arfa then slowed down and Clark just kept going backward meaning the distance between them was even greater. Crazy.
Easy to blame Lambert but the players need to take some responsibility. For example, Gabby being in centre midfield the last 10 mins when we were crying out for some width
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We were quite effective attack wise last season during the tail end. Benteke was on fire, Gabby and Wiemmann chipped in too.
Here's my worry...
Have we been worked out? Just like O Leary after a good first season, or Brian Little after two good seasons. I mean we had a set way of playing but didn't have the ability to switch things round too much with a plan B.
The trouble we have with Lambert is, his plan A, which took him half a season to find, is only partly effective. Our form from Jan was mid-table-ish. Now I worry that teams can soak our attack more effectively, and hit us on the counter attack with full efficiency. Any quick diagonal ball on the counter, opens us up like a can of Tuna.
So what we have now is a big problem. We're struggling, badly, to create chances (how many shots on target in 2 home games? I'll wager no more than 5) and only Benteke looks capable of putting them away. And what about when Benteke forgets his shooting boots, as he did against Liverpool?
That leaves us with an inability to score and a crippling inability to defend. What can we do to change it with our personel? Will Lambert do anything? For better or worse the guy sticks to his guns.
As for width. Last season we started scoring more goals by using the width of the pitch. A lot of our goals, you'd notice came from wider positions. So why we've become so narrowed, I don't know.
It's no good us always going back to the old "we need to learn from this" line. The frustrating thing is, we never do.
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We have shopped at Aldi and expect them to turn up like something from Selfridges. It doesnt work.
The funniest thing yesterday was Ben Arfa running at Clark and the latter back pedalling. Ben Arfa then slowed down and Clark just kept going backward meaning the distance between them was even greater. Crazy.
Easy to blame Lambert but the players need to take some responsibility. For example, Gabby being in centre midfield the last 10 mins when we were crying out for some width
I've always wondered this, and why players seem incapable of thinking for themselves. If they're waiting for management instructions, but not getting it, there's a problem.
The fact we did nothing all fucking game to try and combat Ben Arfa was utterly pathetic. I mean almost Bradford levels of ineptitude. We gave him the freedom of the park, and I'm surprised we didn't send a waiter out with a glass of champagne in the middle of the game to make him feel more comfortable.
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That was truly dreadful, no better than the first half abomination against Liverpool and once again confirmed my fears that Lambert doesn't have a plan B or anything else up his sleeve
Exactly how bad have Weimann, Lowton and Westwood (to name but three) got to perform before they get dropped ?. They're all massively out of form and should not be starting at the moment. Last season was last season, they should be in or out of the team this season based on what they're doing now
The only player i'd give any credit to yesterday was Delph, and he's still more graft than guile
If, as i suspect our plan B really is replace a midfielder with a striker and lump it then another long season is on the cards yet again.
Where is the style and the will to play football ?. The only time we look half threatening is when we go at teams with some pace/verve, because when we slow things down we're dreadful.
Lowton looks all over the shop this season, on one hand i'm thinking it's because he's expected to be in tow places at once, if he's not bombing up the wing to add some much needed width folks moan, then when he does and we lose possession leaving a huge gap in defence they also moan. Is he really expected to teleport between the two with no one else doing or covering either ?
WHERE IS THE WIDTH ?, WHAT ARE GABBY/WEIMANN DOING ON THAT SCORE ?
WHY ARE WE PLAYING THREE MIDFIELDERS ALL OF WHICH LOOK HAPPY TO SPEND THE ENTIRE GAME IN THE MIDDLE THIRD OF THE PITCH WITHOUT MOVING ?
Where is the football ???
Pah
Spot on sir.
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That was truly dreadful, no better than the first half abomination against Liverpool and once again confirmed my fears that Lambert doesn't have a plan B or anything else up his sleeve
Exactly how bad have Weimann, Lowton and Westwood (to name but three) got to perform before they get dropped ?. They're all massively out of form and should not be starting at the moment. Last season was last season, they should be in or out of the team this season based on what they're doing now
The only player i'd give any credit to yesterday was Delph, and he's still more graft than guile
If, as i suspect our plan B really is replace a midfielder with a striker and lump it then another long season is on the cards yet again.
Where is the style and the will to play football ?. The only time we look half threatening is when we go at teams with some pace/verve, because when we slow things down we're dreadful.
Lowton looks all over the shop this season, on one hand i'm thinking it's because he's expected to be in tow places at once, if he's not bombing up the wing to add some much needed width folks moan, then when he does and we lose possession leaving a huge gap in defence they also moan. Is he really expected to teleport between the two with no one else doing or covering either ?
WHERE IS THE WIDTH ?, WHAT ARE GABBY/WEIMANN DOING ON THAT SCORE ?
WHY ARE WE PLAYING THREE MIDFIELDERS ALL OF WHICH LOOK HAPPY TO SPEND THE ENTIRE GAME IN THE MIDDLE THIRD OF THE PITCH WITHOUT MOVING ?
Where is the football ???
Pah
Spot on sir.
I think to be fair Delph tries to get forward and isn't happy to just sit in the middle.
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we need to get out of the guzzan hoof up the middle tactics its a bit dated.
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If we can't comfortably turn over cack outfits like Newcastle, then we're already on another sticky wicket IMO.
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Sad to hear that a newcastle coach was attacked by so called villa fans after the game - pathetic cowardly act!
@dd_ann_61: “@theawayfans: Newcastle fans coach getting their window smashed by Aston Villa fans! #AwayDays #NUFC #AVFC http://t.co/p8oB9ThWIE” *
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Sad to hear that a newcastle coach was attacked by so called villa fans after the game - pathetic cowardly act!
@dd_ann_61: “@theawayfans: Newcastle fans coach getting their window smashed by Aston Villa fans! #AwayDays #NUFC #AVFC http://t.co/p8oB9ThWIE” *
Shame.
They still like to ponce on about us taking the piss out of them getting relegated a couple of years ago. They never mention the coach full of their fans singing "You're just a town full of pakis" on the way down Witton Lane before the game.
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Just plucked up the energy to come on here after that game.
We were v unlucky against Chelsea and Liverpool: yesterday we were just poor.
Positives: the continued good form of Delph; the contributions and all-round play of Gabby (shame about the howling miss); Okore before the injury.
Negatives: poor form of Lowton; Weimann not quite firing on all cyclinders; KEA; Westwood not quite on form either.
Concerned that: we conceded another 2 very poor goals; have little to come off the bench, on current evidence; couldn't shake off the lethargy that seemed to have enveloped us from the start; no appetite for pressing the opposition.
Fair play to the barcodes: they came and did a job, and Ben Arfa does look very classy.
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Lambert is still an average rookie manager trying to learn his trade at the top.
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I can't shake off this awful feeling today that the games against the likes of Sunderland/Hull/Palace/the bitters are already looking like 6 pointers. I know it's way too early to be thinking that way but then we said that last season and seemed to me to sleep walk our way through autumn onto a very sticky wicket by Christmas. I sincerely hope I'm over-reacting. In the crazy world that is the 'results here and now' nature of the premier league, a win next week will put everything right. For another week. A bad defeat and it will be meltdown on here with me probably being as bad as everyone else. Oh well, that's this season's brief honeymoon period over...
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I thought our performance when the opposition had the ball yesterday was a million miles away from the Arsenal and Chelsea games.
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Wouldn't you just die for a regulation, run of the mill 2-0 win against inferior opposition at home? I can just about remember a time when we used to be able to knock them out regularly. I listened to Spurs going 2-0 up yesterday against Norwich at home on R5 and the commentator saying 'that's the game wrapped up' and wondered enviously when was the last time you could think that about us?
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I'm not entirely sure where this idea comes from that we're a decent, or trying to be, a decent footballing side. It's all a million miles an hour, a bit hapless in the attacking third, and when we're really running out of ideas we resort to hoof ball. Yesterday we barely strung 5 decent passes together. We had one good move in 90 minutes, which Wiemann fluffed at the end but for the rest of the time we had no one with any class in midfield to orchestrate anything.
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I'm not entirely sure where this idea comes from that we're a decent, or trying to be, a decent footballing side. It's all a million miles an hour, a bit hapless in the attacking third, and when we're really running out of ideas we resort to hoof ball. Yesterday we barely strung 5 decent passes together. We had one good move in 90 minutes, which Wiemann fluffed at the end but for the rest of the time we had no one with any class in midfield to orchestrate anything.
I think it's because we quite frequently play some really nice passing moves. Yesterday I grant you we were desperately poor, but we do try to pass the ball. It's when we go more direct that we struggle.
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I could accept 3 points out of 9 when weve played the likes of Arsenal, Chelski and Liverpool but when that list now includes Mike Ashleys train set i begin to worry a bit. Why do we make ordinary sides (and yes the "Toon army", you are ordinary) look good, remember Barcelona - sorry Wigan at VP last season, ripping us apart and they were relegated for fucks sake!!. We just dont have enough ball winners to disrupt teams who basically have license to pass us to death. Westwood, lowton and Weimann seriously worry me, their form has collapsed, i honestly felt good about this season but now im not so sure. Oh and a cheery hello to the fucking neanderthals from Newcastle who bailed out of 2 coaches on Witton lane at about five to three yesterday, its heart warming to know that not every society has moved into the 21st Century and that some places are still stuck in the 1980s, what a bunch of fucking Dinosaurs.
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Depressing yesterday.
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I agree clampy, it would have been a risk but sometimes risks have to be taken - bringing tonev on with 3 minutes to go was pointless
Tonev should have been brought on for Weimann much earlier, I agree, but in fact he was waiting to come on for 7 minutes: the ball didn't go out of play for all that time. (Not that we did anything with it)
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Sad to hear that a newcastle coach was attacked by so called villa fans after the game - pathetic cowardly act!
@dd_ann_61: “@theawayfans: Newcastle fans coach getting their window smashed by Aston Villa fans! #AwayDays #NUFC #AVFC http://t.co/p8oB9ThWIE” *
Shame.
They still like to ponce on about us taking the piss out of them getting relegated a couple of years ago. They never mention the coach full of their fans singing "You're just a town full of pakis" on the way down Witton Lane before the game.
They gave it the big one outside and inside the ground. While I don't condone it, they provoked continually and had some payback. It happens.
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We are beginning to look like one of those clubs that just buy a bunch of players that fill up the squad and not really strengthen the first 11, there seems not much improvement from last season and that team nearly got relegated.
Lambert needs to find an 11 that can do a job pretty quick or this will soon turn into a relegation scrap.
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Lambert is still an average rookie manager trying to learn his trade at the top.
The question though, is he learning?
The last 3 months of last season we had a setup that worked, but for some unfathomable reason Lambert seems willing to give KEA another stab at being a premiership player. By Christmas last year I thought we'd all recognised he wasn't up to it. He's a poorer version of Westwood & should never play alongside him. I remember a post on here about KEA being like the arse-end of a pantomime horse & everytime he plays that's all I can think about.
Where is Yacouba Sylla?
Weimann must be in the verge of being dropped, Lowton is never alert to danger & Westwood needs support. Is it a case that by earning a new contract these three feel they no longer have anything to prove?
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the most chilling aspect of yesterday was the return of the post-match Lambertism, and I quote -
"You pick them up and go again on Monday now. We have Norwich on Saturday"
shudders
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We are a one man team. Without him, relegation is a certainty. We need a midfield and to learn how to defend. Delph was our best player yesterday. Westwood? I just don't see it, and thought el ahmadi as much as he isn't very good looked slightly better than him. We're still a poor team at home, set up to counter attack
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We are a one man team. Without him, relegation is a certainty. We need a midfield and to learn how to defend. Delph was our best player yesterday. Westwood? I just don't see it, and thought el ahmadi as much as he isn't very good looked slightly better than him. We're still a poor team at home, set up to counter attack
Delph has been our best player in every game so far for me - he is picking up bookings though and i dread to see our midfield when he gets suspended.
Tonev , sylla, and bacuna are an upgrade on the likes of bannan, Bowery and Ireland- lets see what they can do as there are players in our team who are just not performing .
Kea , Weimann, Lowton and Westwood for starters- mabe being dropped will be the kick up the arse they need.
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Now I've had a chance to calm down and reflect, I'm actually even more shocked and angry At yesterday's debacle. I can see another loss Saturday now.
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Sad to hear that a newcastle coach was attacked by so called villa fans after the game - pathetic cowardly act!
@dd_ann_61: “@theawayfans: Newcastle fans coach getting their window smashed by Aston Villa fans! #AwayDays #NUFC #AVFC http://t.co/p8oB9ThWIE” *
Shame.
They still like to ponce on about us taking the piss out of them getting relegated a couple of years ago. They never mention the coach full of their fans singing "You're just a town full of pakis" on the way down Witton Lane before the game.
They gave it the big one outside and inside the ground. While I don't condone it, they provoked continually and had some payback. It happens.
We got out of a cab under the expressway at 2:55 as a Newcastle coach was stopped on its way to Villa Park. The whole coach was gesticulating, screaming abuse and beckoning us all on. A cretin of about 45 motioned he was going to slit my throat three times. We walked away laughing, marvelling at the magical powers of a pain of glass to contain such powerful rage. Cuddly Geordies.......the best fans in the world!
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We are a one man team. Without him, relegation is a certainty. We need a midfield and to learn how to defend. Delph was our best player yesterday. Westwood? I just don't see it, and thought el ahmadi as much as he isn't very good looked slightly better than him. We're still a poor team at home, set up to counter attack
Tonev , sylla, and bacuna are an upgrade on the likes of bannan, Bowery and Ireland- lets see what they can do as there are players in our team who are just not performing .
There is absolutely no way of knowing whether that's true or not yet.
From Bacuna's showing against Liverpool, he doesn't look much of an upgrade on anything.
Sylla looked ok at the back end of last season
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We are a one man team. Without him, relegation is a certainty. We need a midfield and to learn how to defend. Delph was our best player yesterday. Westwood? I just don't see it, and thought el ahmadi as much as he isn't very good looked slightly better than him. We're still a poor team at home, set up to counter attack
Tonev , sylla, and bacuna are an upgrade on the likes of bannan, Bowery and Ireland- lets see what they can do as there are players in our team who are just not performing .
There is absolutely no way of knowing whether that's true or not yet.
From Bacuna's showing against Liverpool, he doesn't look much of an upgrade on anything.
Sylla looked ok at the back end of last season
Bit harsh on Sylla, he was very good at the back end of last season.
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I was selling opposite the church. I saw those coaches that got pulled, they were giving it the big one all the time there were. Then as they went past they were still doing it to all the Villa fans, it's not a wild guess to assume they did all the way to the coach park.
Then as me and Leeg were walking back up to Dave, a group of a dozen or so walking up and down Witton Lane giving it the big one. One started Shit on the Villa but shut up after the first line and none of the others had the balls to carry it on.
Then as were chatting another few coaches went past and again, they gave it the big one from the safety of the coaches, they looked like puppy dogs scratching at a window. I just took the piss out of them.
And then there was the antics in the ground with the continual goading of, and running at R1.
As I said, I don't condone doing a coach, but if any set of fans provoked retaliation then it them yesterday. Bunch of wannabe twats.
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Judging by the amount of coaches that got there late I would say there were traffic problems. Coach firms nowadays know not to break the rules.
It was Newcastle and they're always like that; I didn't see anything out of the ordinary from them. They always have a surprisingly large number of very gobby teenagers - even their police said as much.
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The way they were banging on them I thought they were going to smash the windows of their own coaches. That was before the game. Two coaches full of them acting like that went past just as I was walking past the church. The God botherers thought it was truly shocking. Did we lose a cup final yesterday no-one told me about? I know they don't win away often but their celebrations were pretty over the top.
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We are a one man team. Without him, relegation is a certainty. We need a midfield and to learn how to defend. Delph was our best player yesterday. Westwood? I just don't see it, and thought el ahmadi as much as he isn't very good looked slightly better than him. We're still a poor team at home, set up to counter attack
Tonev , sylla, and bacuna are an upgrade on the likes of bannan, Bowery and Ireland- lets see what they can do as there are players in our team who are just not performing .
There is absolutely no way of knowing whether that's true or not yet.
From Bacuna's showing against Liverpool, he doesn't look much of an upgrade on anything.
Sylla looked ok at the back end of last season
Bit harsh on Sylla, he was very good at the back end of last season.
Yeah he was decent. However, the sample size is too small to indicate whether he'll be a long term improvement. He seems to have the potential.
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We are a one man team. Without him, relegation is a certainty. We need a midfield and to learn how to defend. Delph was our best player yesterday. Westwood? I just don't see it, and thought el ahmadi as much as he isn't very good looked slightly better than him. We're still a poor team at home, set up to counter attack
Tonev , sylla, and bacuna are an upgrade on the likes of bannan, Bowery and Ireland- lets see what they can do as there are players in our team who are just not performing .
There is absolutely no way of knowing whether that's true or not yet.
From Bacuna's showing against Liverpool, he doesn't look much of an upgrade on anything.
Sylla looked ok at the back end of last season
Bit harsh on Sylla, he was very good at the back end of last season.
Yeah he was decent. However, the sample size is too small to indicate whether he'll be a long term improvement. He seems to have the potential.
In fairness sylla already has done more for us than the likes of bannan and Ireland, and bacuna is young but highly rated in holland - as for tonev a bulgarian international , he is surely an upgrade on Bowery .
We have options now on the bench that lambert has bought and we have several players off form - lets see if he gives the new lads the chance and drops he likes of Weimann, and kea at the weekend.
As for bacuna i think he looks a better right back than midfielder so Lowton needs to pull his socks up and fast.
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The monkey noises and spitting at an old couple on Witton lane probably didnt help matters either.
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After the match at Villa Park when we relegated them I got the train back north and there were a few Newcastle supporters on, most of them were fine but there was a gobby little shit wandering the coaches looking for a Villa fan to fight (his words). I don't wear any colours but a guy sat a bit further down from me who certainly looked like he could handle himself was and had a rather firm word with the gobby little shit who slunk off with his tail between his legs never to be seen or heard again.
I don't condone violence but I'd dearly loved to have seen him get the battering he deserved, well done to the Villa fan for being so controlled and putting him firmly in his place.
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The way they were banging on them I thought they were going to smash the windows of their own coaches. That was before the game. Two coaches full of them acting like that went past just as I was walking past the church. The God botherers thought it was truly shocking. Did we lose a cup final yesterday no-one told me about? I know they don't win away often but their celebrations were pretty over the top.
These are supposed to be these wonderful fanatical Toon army lot, more like a load of fucking sheep, if you painted a horse and cart black and white they`d follow it. Didnt they get an absolute mullering at Brighton 4-0 in the cup or something last year and they clapped them off, that is just blind loyalty of the dumbest kind.
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Judging by the amount of coaches that got there late I would say there were traffic problems. Coach firms nowadays know not to break the rules.
It was Newcastle and they're always like that; I didn't see anything out of the ordinary from them. They always have a surprisingly large number of very gobby teenagers - even their police said as much.
We came down using the same route and it took about 40 minutes longer than usual due to traffic along the A42 and around the M6 by the ground.
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The way they were banging on them I thought they were going to smash the windows of their own coaches. That was before the game. Two coaches full of them acting like that went past just as I was walking past the church. The God botherers thought it was truly shocking. Did we lose a cup final yesterday no-one told me about? I know they don't win away often but their celebrations were pretty over the top.
These are supposed to be these wonderful fanatical Toon army lot, more like a load of fucking sheep, if you painted a horse and cart black and white they`d follow it. Didnt they get an absolute mullering at Brighton 4-0 in the cup or something last year and they clapped them off, that is just blind loyalty of the dumbest kind.
Not that fanatical- when they were playing us once at st James park i remember being there in the mid 80s in a low crowd - willie McFaul was their manager at the time .
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They were about as intimidating as a wet lettuce.
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They never dipped below 20K against us in the 80's. We only went over 20K once against them. We also had 12K at home to them.
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12k? wow. That must have been depressing!
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They never dipped below 20K against us in the 80's. We only went over 20K once against them. We also had 12K at home to them.
What was the gate in 85/86 at their place please pws - i remember it was was a wet midweek night around easter time - seemed a low crowd.
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12k? wow. That must have been depressing!
Not as depressing as our 0-0 draw with southampton in front of about 8,000 at villa park .
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They never dipped below 20K against us in the 80's. We only went over 20K once against them. We also had 12K at home to them.
What was the gate in 85/86 at their place please pws - i remember it was was a wet midweek night around easter time - seemed a low crowd.
20,107.
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I can see another loss Saturday now.
I don't. I can see us beating Norwich.
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They never dipped below 20K against us in the 80's. We only went over 20K once against them. We also had 12K at home to them.
What was the gate in 85/86 at their place please pws - i remember it was was a wet midweek night around easter time - seemed a low crowd.
20,107.
Cheers, seemed lower than that at the time but some people at the toon will tell you they have always had huge crowds - after keegans departure as a player their crowds dropped quite a lot .
I remember once watching them play in division 2 when keegan was a player and it was sold out with massive queues outside the ground - then a year or so later going there with villa and or being half empty - not as loyal as some may like to think.
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I lived in Newcastle in the eighties and attendances weren't great despite what they would have you believe but one thing I will say is that they had a good away following.
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I really like Lowton and he contributed going fwd yday.
But he gets so square on to his winger. He should be learning this by now. Worried about Redmond up against him next week.
Would consider resting him for a more defensive full back. But we don't have one apart from Herd, who I wouldn't want anywhere near the team.
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12k? wow. That must have been depressing!
For a lot of the 80's, anything over 20K was a very good crowd, over 30K and it was a big crowd. It may have 85/86 where we had two league games over 25K, and that was small heath and Manure and both were about 27K.
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Fun(ish) fact of the day: The total attendance for both league games against Spurs in 85/86 totalled less than 29K. 14,099 at VP, 14,854 at WHL.
Can anyone tell I am REALLY bored today?
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Fun(ish) fact of the day: The total attendance for both league games against Spurs in 85/86 totalled less than 29K. 14,099 at VP, 14,854 at WHL.
Can anyone tell I am REALLY bored today?
It's raining.
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Fun(ish) fact of the day: The total attendance for both league games against Spurs in 85/86 totalled less than 29K. 14,099 at VP, 14,854 at WHL.
Can anyone tell I am REALLY bored today?
You clearly have your finger on the ball today pws ;)
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Fun(ish) fact of the day: The total attendance for both league games against Spurs in 85/86 totalled less than 29K. 14,099 at VP, 14,854 at WHL.
Can anyone tell I am REALLY bored today?
It's raining.
I know, I want to go outside and play but i'm not allowed.
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Lowton has got no acceleration.Wingers stand him up, and push it past him, and he can't get back.Bacunas quicker, and as you say against Redmond, i'd probably play him.
Thought Clark was very poor as well yday.His passing has gone, he looks like a player completely devoid of confidence.
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I would play Hutton to stop Redmond. Would stop him in his tracks. For most of the season probably.
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I'd have Chrissie Herd in the team all day long. He gives a shit.
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Herd is an awful footballer.
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The way they were banging on them I thought they were going to smash the windows of their own coaches. That was before the game. Two coaches full of them acting like that went past just as I was walking past the church. The God botherers thought it was truly shocking. Did we lose a cup final yesterday no-one told me about? I know they don't win away often but their celebrations were pretty over the top.
I saw that. They looked like they were tired of behaving that way but knew no other. There was something missing from the centre of their bilious rage. They were banging on the windows but their hearts didn't seem to be in it. I guess they must be deflated knowing that they are going to lose the independence vote.
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Think our record is 1 win and 4 defeats to them in last 5. Pretty much sums up how Shit the last few years have been
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Fun(ish) fact of the day: The total attendance for both league games against Spurs in 85/86 totalled less than 29K. 14,099 at VP, 14,854 at WHL.
Can anyone tell I am REALLY bored today?
It's raining.
I know, I want to go outside and play but i'm not allowed.
Go and chase some parked cars.
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The main issue you guys have is at full back. Lowton is too attacking while Luna was awful defensively. Westwood and Delph were decent though.
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The main issue you guys have is at full back. Lowton is too attacking while Luna was awful defensively. Westwood and Delph were decent though.
Westwood was way below par.
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Fun(ish) fact of the day: The total attendance for both league games against Spurs in 85/86 totalled less than 29K. 14,099 at VP, 14,854 at WHL.
Can anyone tell I am REALLY bored today?
It's raining.
I know, I want to go outside and play but i'm not allowed.
Go and chase some parked cars.
?
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12k? wow. That must have been depressing!
Not as depressing as our 0-0 draw with southampton in front of about 8,000 at villa park .
I was at that game. Brings back bad memories.
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12k? wow. That must have been depressing!
Not as depressing as our 0-0 draw with southampton in front of about 8,000 at villa park .
I was at that game. Brings back bad memories.
Losing 5-0 at home to Bradford in front of 4,500 in the Simod Cup brings back fucking nightmares.
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12k? wow. That must have been depressing!
Not as depressing as our 0-0 draw with southampton in front of about 8,000 at villa park .
I was at that game. Brings back bad memories.
I was there too.
Back In the glory days of clean sheets .
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12k? wow. That must have been depressing!
Not as depressing as our 0-0 draw with southampton in front of about 8,000 at villa park .
I was at that game. Brings back bad memories.
Losing 5-0 at home to Bradford in front of 4,500 in the Simod Cup brings back fucking nightmares.
As does beating them 2-1 infront of 40,000 + in the League Cup!!
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Terrible result. Yes Newcastle have a lot of individual quality but are a dreadful team and club. We should have enough about us to be beating them at home or avoiding defeat at the bare minimum. Real problems for Lambert already. Aside from Benteke's goals, Delph, Okore and Gabby, a lot of players are struggling.
He has a tactical brainfart particularly at home when we are chasing a goal. Enacting the Bradford tactics is a waste of time yet he does it routinely and now with 2 more 6ft6 strikers as options.
A calm head and captain like player in midfield is badly lacking. The player we should have bought played that role superbly for Everton this weekend. A lot of talk about James McCarthy but I think Barry will easily eclipse him this season.
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agreed. We have been fortunate to survive in the last two or three seasons given our appalling home form but sooner or later that will come back to haunt us. We only ever seem to be able to function as a reasonably effective counter attacking side best suited to playing away. The last thing we need is yet more instability with the changing of manager etc., but unless PL develops hitherto unknown tactical depths we might have to contemplate that course again come December.
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I don't know whether I'm angry with PL over this result or the players. Everyone of them seemed to have an off day. One effort on target, the goal, is utterly pathetic from a home team. Allowing a mediocre Newcastle to dominate for long periods is too.
I would put Sylla in for El Hamidi next game to add a bit of muscle, it's desperately needed.
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I am really worried about the Norwich match.We need a performance to get things back on track. Bassong saw off Benteke(when he was at the top of his form) last time we played them and as we rely on CB to provide our major attacking threat that is a worry.
If we lose and play badly again questions will start to be asked as to how good Lambert actually is so we had better treat this one as a match we must win at all costs.
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agreed. We have been fortunate to survive in the last two or three seasons given our appalling home form but sooner or later that will come back to haunt us. We only ever seem to be able to function as a reasonably effective counter attacking side best suited to playing away. The last thing we need is yet more instability with the changing of manager etc., but unless PL develops hitherto unknown tactical depths we might have to contemplate that course again come December.
God No. It will mean Faulkner gets to pick yet another manager. We'd probably end up with Chris Coleman
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we need to get out of the guzzan hoof up the middle tactics its a bit dated.
Last season we started by trying to play football from the back. What has happened to that?
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I am really worried about the Norwich match.We need a performance to get things back on track. Bassong saw off Benteke(when he was at the top of his form) last time we played them and as we rely on CB to provide our major attacking threat that is a worry.
If we lose and play badly again questions will start to be asked as to how good Lambert actually is so we had better treat this one as a match we must win at all costs.
I don't think we rely on Benteke as our main attacking threat. Yes, he's the one getting the goals but Weimann and Gabby on their day are just as effective doing what they do.
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Lowton and Weimann were very poor yesterday. The latter has been incredibly lucky to be in the team for so long considering his poor form this calendar year. You can add Westwood to the mix as well. In my opinion there's a touch of the 'emperor's new clothes' syndrome about Westwood and Lowton. Never been impressed with either of them but I keep getting told they're fine players who should be in the England squad. Not sure if they're even PL quality myself.
It's really painful watching Villa at home these days. Roll on next week when we're away!
agreed. weimann had one decent spark at the start of the second half when he crossed for gabby (who should have scored) but he was poor again, and has been for a while now.
edit: oh, and he had a good chance at the end of the first half when we had an excellent break and he screwed wide.
lowton was woeful on saturday. useless in defence, useless in attack. kept checking inside and wouldn't take his man on, misplaced passes, looked off the boil.
westwood looked every bit the league 1 player on saturday. kea does well away from home when we need someone to close the opposition down and generally cause a nuisance, but he's a complete plodder and it's a waste of time looking to him for inspiration at home.
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kea does well away from home when we need someone to close the opposition down and generally cause a nuisance, but he's a complete plodder and it's a waste of time looking to him for inspiration at home.
I still don't understand why teams change their style depending on whether they're home or away
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Basically we still have the same team that struggled for 90% of last season playing this season. Crap summer.
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Basically we still have the same team that struggled for 90% of last season playing this season. Crap summer.
And without Okore! Rumours on VT that the knee injury is worse than first thought with a possible 6 month lay-off! I hope that's untrue.
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Ok we lsot a game we should've been looking to win and played really poorly but some of the responses on here are ridiculous. To call it a crap summer or start calling us as being in a relegation battle is a massive over-reaction at this point. If we lose a couple more then you can start with that.
Personally I think the extended international break we've had meaning 3 weeks without a league game has affected us rather worse than anyone could've expected, we just didn't look as sharp as we had before. If Lambert addresses that quickly we should still be ok, we have got a good enough squad to be comfortable in mid-table and I doubt many people thought otherwise at 2:55 on saturday, so why is 1 poor performance enough to cause so much upset?
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how many bad days at the office are we going to have
that is all I hear - oh well just a bad day at the office . how many bloody times ?
our home record over the past few seasons including PL season is pathetic . And needs to be addressed now !!!
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If Okore is out for a prelonged period of time we're in trouble.
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If Okore is out for a prelonged period of time we're in trouble.
I'm not a big fan of Clark as a centre half but i think he's done ok this season. Okore would be a miss though.
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bump
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so why is 1 poor performance enough to cause so much upset?
you are having a laugh ? one poor performance?
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Basically we still have the same team that struggled for 90% of last season playing this season. Crap summer.
And without Okore! Rumours on VT that the knee injury is worse than first thought with a possible 6 month lay-off! I hope that's untrue.
what makes my blood boil is he should never have been in that position to start . A villa player stupidly gave the ball away seconds before which put us in danger . If the professional player had actually kept possession , which nobody seemed to be able to do on Saturday, we might still have a fit Okore .
Its a shame because he seems the only player we bought in the summer who would actually start in this team .
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If Okore is out for a prelonged period of time we're in trouble.
I'm not a big fan of Clark as a centre half but i think he's done ok this season. Okore would be a miss though.
When Baker stepped in for Clark last season we improved slightly, just enough to take us over the line. Okore would be my first choice, Baker second but if we have Clark in that position again for any length of time I think we are in for a long, hard season.
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so why is 1 poor performance enough to cause so much upset?
you are having a laugh ? one poor performance?
so what are the other poor performances this season then?
I guess you're going to bring up that we've been shit at home for years, which is true, but also has very bearing on our performances this season, other than maybe a mental factor of the players being scared of playing at home. Otherwise you're judging this squad on the performances of previous squads, which is pretty unfair.
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so why is 1 poor performance enough to cause so much upset?
you are having a laugh ? one poor performance?
so what are the other poor performances this season then?
I guess you're going to bring up that we've been shit at home for years, which is true, but also has very bearing on our performances this season, other than maybe a mental factor of the players being scared of playing at home. Otherwise you're judging this squad on the performances of previous squads, which is pretty unfair.
Last season was littered with performances like the Newcastle one. You must have your head firmly buried in the ground if you can't see that.
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We seemed to ahve turned a corner with recent performances, even if results weren't matching them, but this was a relapse to what we saw for large prtions of last season. Whether it's just a blip or not we'll find out at Norwich.
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Last season we were a couple of results away from relegation and the same the season before.
All around us teams have improved, changed managers, tactics etc... what we have to look at is have we moved on enough to compete with the other teams around us.
Have Lamberts tactics that were proved at times to be nightmarish last season adapted enough to make us a better team.
Can we expect to get results agains teams like Everton, Stoke, Swansea, Fulham, West Ham, Fulham and Norwich? We have already lost to Liverpool, Chelsea, and Newcastle and I struggle to see us getting much out of Man City, Many Utd, Spurs or the visit of Arsenal.
So I am concerned about this season but I hope that its still too early to really get an idea of how we will perform, we just have to hope that Lambert can bring about the changes that we can see that we need
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What we needed amongst other things on Saturday was a midfielder general who could hold up the ball, spray accurate passes to the forwards and make last ditch tackles to prevent goals. Who was Everton's man of the match on Saturday? A certain Gareth Barry who I'm sure would have loved to come to the Villa on loan. Instead we spend money on two more 6' + forwards. Priorities!
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If Okore is out for a prelonged period of time we're in trouble.
I'm not a big fan of Clark as a centre half but i think he's done ok this season. Okore would be a miss though.
There is a picture of Jack woodward on the clubs official twitter feed at the team photo. Okore is in the background and looks like he is on crutches although its hard to see clearly.
If he has an ACL injury then that would explain why he tried to play on although he looked in pain when he was on the ground when being treated by the physio. Horrible injury for a young player if true.
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I'll be really concerned if we don't play like all think we can next week at Norwich. If we really are a counter attacking team then we need to start making the away days count while we work on the problems at Villa Park. If we start getting done away then we will be in trouble.
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so why is 1 poor performance enough to cause so much upset?
you are having a laugh ? one poor performance?
so what are the other poor performances this season then?
I guess you're going to bring up that we've been shit at home for years, which is true, but also has very bearing on our performances this season, other than maybe a mental factor of the players being scared of playing at home. Otherwise you're judging this squad on the performances of previous squads, which is pretty unfair.
Last season was littered with performances like the Newcastle one. You must have your head firmly buried in the ground if you can't see that.
This was a wind up right? Or did you completely ignore the bit I've put in bold?
The next post after yours summed it up.
We seemed to ahve turned a corner with recent performances, even if results weren't matching them, but this was a relapse to what we saw for large prtions of last season. Whether it's just a blip or not we'll find out at Norwich.
So, I stand by my assertion that a lot of the negative comments on here are effectively coming after 1 poor performance. If we're this poor again in the next couple of games then we might be seeing a repeat of the last few years but 4 good performances and 1 bad (in my opinion at least) is the evidence we have to judge this squad on, and I don't think many of the comments in this thread are using that sample but instead are, as mentioned, judging things on the basis of last year.
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Clark is a liability. He is not a Premiership player. Neither is Baker but he is marginally better. Clark's actions practically gives the opposition a goal start.
We need to put Sylla in midfield to offer some protection.
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Clark is a liability. He is not a Premiership player. Neither is Baker but he is marginally better. Clark's actions practically gives the opposition a goal start.
We need to put Sylla in midfield to offer some protection.
Clark changed the game against Arsenal, we'd been on the ropes before he came on. He was doing ok against Chelsea as well from what I recall. I think Baker and Clark are both good enough to be in premiership squads, but neither is ready to start regularly right now.
The Okore situation is all a bit 'unknown' right now, until there is something official I'm not worrying about replacing him.
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Clark is a liability. He is not a Premiership player. Neither is Baker but he is marginally better. Clark's actions practically gives the opposition a goal start.
We need to put Sylla in midfield to offer some protection.
Clark changed the game against Arsenal, we'd been on the ropes before he came on. He was doing ok against Chelsea as well from what I recall. I think Baker and Clark are both good enough to be in premiership squads, but neither is ready to start regularly right now.
The Okore situation is all a bit 'unknown' right now, until there is something official I'm not worrying about replacing him.
Start worrying. There's a story emanating from Denmark that he's done his cruciate. All the cub are saying is that he's being scanned.
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Fuck me. Maybe we need to just stop buying Danish centre halves. We're cursed.
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Clark is a liability. He is not a Premiership player. Neither is Baker but he is marginally better. Clark's actions practically gives the opposition a goal start.
We need to put Sylla in midfield to offer some protection.
Clark changed the game against Arsenal, we'd been on the ropes before he came on. He was doing ok against Chelsea as well from what I recall. I think Baker and Clark are both good enough to be in premiership squads, but neither is ready to start regularly right now.
The Okore situation is all a bit 'unknown' right now, until there is something official I'm not worrying about replacing him.
Start worrying. There's a story emanating from Denmark that he's done his cruciate. All the cub are saying is that he's being scanned.
I've just seen the name "Stas" tweeted by a journalist acquaintance of mine......
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Clark is a liability. He is not a Premiership player. Neither is Baker but he is marginally better. Clark's actions practically gives the opposition a goal start.
We need to put Sylla in midfield to offer some protection.
Clark changed the game against Arsenal, we'd been on the ropes before he came on. He was doing ok against Chelsea as well from what I recall. I think Baker and Clark are both good enough to be in premiership squads, but neither is ready to start regularly right now.
The Okore situation is all a bit 'unknown' right now, until there is something official I'm not worrying about replacing him.
Start worrying. There's a story emanating from Denmark that he's done his cruciate. All the cub are saying is that he's being scanned.
Then we are potentially in serious trouble, neither Baker ar Clark are up to playing on a regular basis.
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Clark is a liability. He is not a Premiership player. Neither is Baker but he is marginally better. Clark's actions practically gives the opposition a goal start.
We need to put Sylla in midfield to offer some protection.
Clark changed the game against Arsenal, we'd been on the ropes before he came on. He was doing ok against Chelsea as well from what I recall. I think Baker and Clark are both good enough to be in premiership squads, but neither is ready to start regularly right now.
The Okore situation is all a bit 'unknown' right now, until there is something official I'm not worrying about replacing him.
Start worrying. There's a story emanating from Denmark that he's done his cruciate. All the cub are saying is that he's being scanned.
I've seen something similar but until something is announced we have no idea how serious it is, that's all I meant.
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If we had bought a Eriksen type £10 million player and got Barry on loan for experience , instead of another £7 million striker . I would not be to worried as we would have something to beat teams at home . At the moment the system PL is using is not going to work and he needs to sort it quick or we are going to struggle and will the players he bought in the summer be prem regular starters , we will have to wait and see , but I was hoping for players good enough to come in straight away and start .
Weimann has been poor but have we got anyone better who should start instead of him . You would think so , but I dont know .
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Do t think I could stomach another season of seeing Vlaar lining up along side Clark/Baker. Oh dear.
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so why is 1 poor performance enough to cause so much upset?
you are having a laugh ? one poor performance?
so what are the other poor performances this season then?
I guess you're going to bring up that we've been shit at home for years, which is true, but also has very bearing on our performances this season, other than maybe a mental factor of the players being scared of playing at home. Otherwise you're judging this squad on the performances of previous squads, which is pretty unfair.
Last season was littered with performances like the Newcastle one. You must have your head firmly buried in the ground if you can't see that.
This was a wind up right? Or did you completely ignore the bit I've put in bold?
The next post after yours summed it up.
We seemed to ahve turned a corner with recent performances, even if results weren't matching them, but this was a relapse to what we saw for large prtions of last season. Whether it's just a blip or not we'll find out at Norwich.
So, I stand by my assertion that a lot of the negative comments on here are effectively coming after 1 poor performance. If we're this poor again in the next couple of games then we might be seeing a repeat of the last few years but 4 good performances and 1 bad (in my opinion at least) is the evidence we have to judge this squad on, and I don't think many of the comments in this thread are using that sample but instead are, as mentioned, judging things on the basis of last year.
I was pointing out your comment about judging us on one bad performance when in reality we've just had 12 months littered with performances like the Newcastle one.
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Does sound like a few of our players are having exactly what I feared - second season syndrome, at least at the outset. Hopefully they'll recover their form soon. I'm just not sure from what I've seen that Tonev (for Weimann) Bacuna (for Lowton or Westwood) are really ready to go into the side.
Given where we finished last season I dread to think of players having 2nd season syndrome as that would indicate they lit up the Premier League skies last season. The only exception to that being the obvious.
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On reflection and having watched the highlights of the Everton Chelsea game I can't help but think Barry in either defence or midfield would have seen a different outcome in Saturday's result. No, he's not the future, I know, but he's steadying influence would be most welcome now.
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On reflection and having watched the highlights of the Everton Chelsea game I can't help but think Barry in either defence or midfield would have seen a different outcome in Saturday's result. No, he's not the future, I know, but he's steadying influence would be most welcome now.
I said this previously there is no point planning for the future without dealing with the present. A player like Barry in the midfield would do our team a world of good.
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Lots of stick for baker and Clark when Vlaar is a major part of the problem. For a big bloke the amount of times he's beaten in the air and rolled off the ball is nowhere near PL standard.
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Lots of stick for baker and Clark when Vlaar is a major part of the problem. For a big bloke the amount of times he's beaten in the air and rolled off the ball is nowhere near PL standard.
Vlaar's most consistent period of sustained fitness coincided with our best form last season. He may not be a great defender, but he is a very good leader. In a team with no other leader's he's important. I'm not a big fan of Baker, his positioning is woeful which is why he always lunges in. Clark lacks concentration and pace.
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Vlaar did alright on Saturday I thought.
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Vlaar did alright on Saturday I thought.
He was at fault for goal 1 but he wasn't alone. KEA dilly dallied and brushed aside, Lowton all at sea no challenge , Ben Arfa beats the static Vlaar to the ball and buries far too easily.
A microcosm of our problems captured there.
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Sorry, I should have added I meant after Okore went off. And in the second half especially. As i'm Lower North it's hard to judge much Holte end of the pitch as you can't much, but from what I saw when he was in front of me he did alright, not great but pretty much everything you'd expect of a CB.
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I thought Lowton let Remy get around him far too easily for the first, but then he got a massive stroke of luck when he missed controlled and the ball bounced straight back to him.
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Vlaar did alright on Saturday I thought.
Delph, Vlaar and Guzan were our only players who had average games.
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Perhaps the thing I was most annoyed about Saturday, and in fairness we saw precious little of it in the last couple of months of last season or the games before it this, was us running out of ideas.
There were countless times at the weekend where we weren't moving off the ball and Delph in particular found himself a yard, looked up, and there was no bugger to pass it to.
I thought we had eradicated that from our game. I said before the match that this was a test of how far we have come. Norwich is now an even bigger examination of that.
Play the same up there and I will start to be concerned that we haven't moved on as I had hoped we would for this season.
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Its easy for me to say, but...
We needed some unpredicatability. Tonev running into those spaces in between the midfield and the forwards, Gabby really hugging the touch line, the full backs getting close to him. Sylla putting some presence into the midfield and given Delph licence to use his pace.
Not four up front, launch it, get it back after they have spurned their attack.
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Vlaar did alright on Saturday I thought.
Delph, Vlaar and Guzan were our only players who had average games.
I'm adding Clark to that list had a decent game by his standards not at fault for goal 2 as it was Lowton ball watching!
I think Zog was missed .