Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: jwarry on November 30, 2025, 06:46:56 PM
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Ok I confess it’s a bit bizarre but….. we have Arsenal to play twice over Xmas and who knows what will happen…. In Unai I trust
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Not this season.
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No chance this season. I'd be ecstatic with 3rd.
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No. That's not the sort of thing that happens. Someone fucking dreadful will win it, as always.
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Looking at the top four,we're about eight goals short of really challenging.Which would normally be what Ollie scores.
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We don't create anywhere near enough really good chances.
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No. For a number of reasons, but we don’t create enough simple chances to sustain a push. We’re scoring brilliant long range goals, which is great, but just isn’t sustainable.
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No, obviously not.
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No
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With a prolific CF we’d be contenders
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The fact we’re even having the conversation is confirmation of Unai’s genius.
I think we’ll finish 5th but won’t need the UCL spot as we’ll win The Europa.
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Will reserve judgement until I see MOTD tonight.
In last few weeks when they talk about title, they only show Arses, Man City* and Chelski. Now we are on level points with Chelsea and have second best defence in the league will they show top 4.
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No. In the mix for CL though.
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We're overperforming our xG due to the long-range goals. History suggests you can't keep the thundercvnts coming at that rate all season. So we'll regress to the mean unless we get St Asensio or similar in in Jan.
Meaning 5th to 7th at best.
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Today’s result was one of a short series that could, if we beat Brighton, give us the right to “have our say” in who wins the league.
If we were to then beat Arsenal twice, and pick up some points against Chelsea and United, we could consider ourselves as among the challengers.
But the odds of that are very long. I’d be pretty happy with “having our say” this year.
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Well definitely not now someone has made this thread.
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Almost certainly.
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Ok I confess it’s a bit bizarre but….. we have Arsenal to play twice over Xmas and who knows what will happen…. In Unai I trust
FFS, we might allude to it but you're not supposed to start a thread about it. It's the sort of thing visitors from other clubs will point at as evidence of our arrogance and delusion (when it inevitably goes tits up).
Can we please put this discussion in the CL thread until the eve of the Liverpool game?
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Naaaah mate :-(
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If we didn't have such a shit start to the season, we'd have been right up there with Arsenal. Still not looking all that convincing though. We can't wondergoal our way to the title. We need a bit more about us I'm afraid.
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I’m going to start a ‘Will I Have A Threesome With Emily Blunt and Scarlett Johannson?’ thread.
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If we didn't have such a shit start to the season, we'd have been right up there with Arsenal. Still not looking all that convincing though. We can't wondergoal our way to the title. We need a bit more about us I'm afraid.
Arse are cornalities to the top of the league at the moment, no one is stating it won't last for them.
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Our star striker can’t score and we have no pace. Fix that in january and who knows.
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We achieved 4th with a leaky defence and playing some of the best football I have seen.
We now sit 3rd after a third of a season despite not having played particularly well or having our forwards click. But we seem much improved in defence
hmmm. If the forwards were to click....hmmmm
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I do want to bet against us.
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Thread shouldn't have been made until we at least went top, if we ever do.
This is asking for trouble.
This is asking for a heavy loss against Brighton to be honest.
I am optimistic to the point of delusion and even I didn't post this thread.
Also you've got to be somewhat realistic. When your only striker has scored 1 goal in 19 apps you've got no hope.
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I’m going to start a ‘Will I Have A Threesome With Emily Blunt and Scarlett Johannson?’ thread.
I've had two. You haven't had one?
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If we don't win the league, we'll know who to blame. Luckily for him, he's in Northern Cyprus.
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Would you bet against us?
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No.
And if we could I'd rather we were under the radar.
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I am struggling to understand how we are equal 3rd.
We are not playing that well, we seem to be scraping results and giving the opposition lots of opportunities which fortunately they are not taking or because of Martinez magnificence at times.
I think our summer transfer business will be our major setback, Elliot Guessand and Sancho ffs.
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I’m going to start a ‘Will I Have A Threesome With Emily Blunt and Scarlett Johannson?’ thread.
I've had two. You haven't had one?
You were drunk, it was Emily Bishop and Scarlett Moffatt.
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Can we get this merged with the Champions League one, please?
I abhor all this jinxing.
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And the “critical games” thread.
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We lack pace and natural width. Address those issues, alongside a dominant centre half and we might compete. I think Unai needs two or three more transfer windows of permissible spending. Also, by that time one or two others may need to be upgraded too.
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Can we get this merged with the Champions League one, please?
I abhor all this jinxing.
I will never not agree with this.
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We're about 150/1 with the bookies. Sounds about right.
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We're about 150/1 with the bookies. Sounds about right.
We were 300/1 with PP during the week. Sunderland were 200/1.
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Jinxing should forever be abhorred. Ban this sick stunt.
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We'll probably beat Brazil in the World Cup Final with Emi in goal.
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I am struggling to understand how we are equal 3rd.
We are not playing that well, we seem to be scraping results and giving the opposition lots of opportunities which fortunately they are not taking or because of Martinez magnificence at times.
I think our summer transfer business will be our major setback, Elliot Guessand and Sancho ffs.
Alot of it is because how bad everyone else. Liverpool, spurs and newcastle all not having good seasons in the league thus far. I think that will change.
Like you i dont think we have been playing well either- a good thing though. Also we have been a tad bit fortunate with injuries thus far.
I seriously doubt this squad will finish top if we dont sign any players in January. Elliots done here it seems, Guessand doesnt look close to scoring a goal, sanchos shit and ollies on terrible form. The team needs support thats for sure
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Probably not but the idea that scoring the goals we have been is unsustainable is, in my opinion, ignoring how we're scoring those goals, we've scored a lot from outside the box but they haven't been speculative. Tielemans had a couple of genuinely pingers yesterday and those efforts have little in common with goals like Kamara, Onana and Rogers have scored from the edge of the box recently (and I don't mean the free kick).
A big part of the reason we're not getting more chances in the box is that we're often outnumbered by 5-6 defenders to 1-2 of our players, which creates time and space around the box and we've clearly been working on ways to take advantage of that, which means lots of efforts from just outside the box where the player has the time to really concentrate on a clean strike and picking a spot. If these chances were a couple of yards further forward and we were scoring loads from just inside the box I doubt anyone would be saying we can't keep doing it.
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I am struggling to understand how we are equal 3rd.
We are not playing that well, we seem to be scraping results and giving the opposition lots of opportunities which fortunately they are not taking or because of Martinez magnificence at times.
I think our summer transfer business will be our major setback, Elliot Guessand and Sancho ffs.
One of the complaints from last year and beyond was that we let in way too many goals. He has fixed that for sure - the stats back that up, there is no disputing that.
I think we are playing a little more pragmatically and are able to grind out results knowing that we aren't going to have to score 3+ goals.
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Probably not but the idea that scoring the goals we have been is unsustainable is, in my opinion, ignoring how we're scoring those goals, we've scored a lot from outside the box but they haven't been speculative. Tielemans had a couple of genuinely pingers yesterday and those efforts have little in common with goals like Kamara, Onana and Rogers have scored from the edge of the box recently (and I don't mean the free kick).
A big part of the reason we're not getting more chances in the box is that we're often outnumbered by 5-6 defenders to 1-2 of our players, which creates time and space around the box and we've clearly been working on ways to take advantage of that, which means lots of efforts from just outside the box where the player has the time to really concentrate on a clean strike and picking a spot. If these chances were a couple of yards further forward and we were scoring loads from just inside the box I doubt anyone would be saying we can't keep doing it.
I was suprised the pundits used that yesterday to sort of beat/criticise emery for. I mean if its that easy to do why are no other sides capabale of doing it consistently like we have?
I mean i do think Paul, that we will have to adapt our game as this way of playing can only take you so far. We desperately are lacking from pace in this side ans i think fundamentally thats why we take so long to get the ball forward
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Probably not but the idea that scoring the goals we have been is unsustainable is, in my opinion, ignoring how we're scoring those goals, we've scored a lot from outside the box but they haven't been speculative. Tielemans had a couple of genuinely pingers yesterday and those efforts have little in common with goals like Kamara, Onana and Rogers have scored from the edge of the box recently (and I don't mean the free kick).
A big part of the reason we're not getting more chances in the box is that we're often outnumbered by 5-6 defenders to 1-2 of our players, which creates time and space around the box and we've clearly been working on ways to take advantage of that, which means lots of efforts from just outside the box where the player has the time to really concentrate on a clean strike and picking a spot. If these chances were a couple of yards further forward and we were scoring loads from just inside the box I doubt anyone would be saying we can't keep doing it.
I was suprised the pundits used that yesterday to sort of beat/criticise emery for. I mean if its that easy to do why are no other sides capabale of doing it consistently like we have?
I mean i do think Paul, that we will have to adapt our game as this way of playing can only take you so far. We desperately are lacking from pace in this side ans i think fundamentally thats why we take so long to get the ball forward
We wwill have to adapt but so will our opponents. We're getting a reputation for these goals now, and that's going to mean teams start trying to occupy those spaces, which creates space elsewhere. We just need to have the players be composed and confident enough to adapt their play to the game and start exploiting the new gaps that open up. I think that's exactly what we're training them to do because we can score the simpler goals when we see a less crowded box as we've done a couple of times.
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I am struggling to understand how we are equal 3rd.
We are not playing that well, we seem to be scraping results and giving the opposition lots of opportunities which fortunately they are not taking or because of Martinez magnificence at times.
I think our summer transfer business will be our major setback, Elliot Guessand and Sancho ffs.
Agree with this, Elliot is turning into Lord Lucan, Guessand is out of his depth in this league and Sancho has the body language of put In the odd half arsed cameo, take the £160 K a week and bugger off at the end of the season. Shocking business.
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I am struggling to understand how we are equal 3rd.
We are not playing that well, we seem to be scraping results and giving the opposition lots of opportunities which fortunately they are not taking or because of Martinez magnificence at times.
I think our summer transfer business will be our major setback, Elliot Guessand and Sancho ffs.
Agree with this, Elliot is turning into Lord Lucan, Guessand is out of his depth in this league and Sancho has the body language of put In the odd half arsed cameo, take the £160 K a week and bugger off at the end of the season. Shocking business.
I don't understand, why Unai doesn't give Elliott a chance and to put George Hemmings on the bench instead of him against Leeds, was an insult.
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Honestly? No, I don't think we will. If we get in to the Champions League again this season it'll be a huge achievement.
If this is still possible on 18th May it might be worth revisiting. But not before.
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I am struggling to understand how we are equal 3rd.
We are not playing that well, we seem to be scraping results and giving the opposition lots of opportunities which fortunately they are not taking or because of Martinez magnificence at times.
I think our summer transfer business will be our major setback, Elliot Guessand and Sancho ffs.
Agree with this, Elliot is turning into Lord Lucan, Guessand is out of his depth in this league and Sancho has the body language of put In the odd half arsed cameo, take the £160 K a week and bugger off at the end of the season. Shocking business.
I don't understand, why Unai doesn't give Elliott a chance and to put George Hemmings on the bench instead of him against Leeds, was an insult.
It really wasn't. Look at who else was on the bench, the 'gap' created by Onana being out and Bogarde not being fully fit meant we needed another option who could come in as injury cover as a 6 if we needed someone on for more than the 5-6 minutes Bogarde got.
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I don't think we can but top 6 v v achievable. V solid goalkeeper, defence and midfield. Just a bit light up front but I still think once Olliengets one he will be back to his best.
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I don't think we can but top 6 v v achievable. V solid goalkeeper, defence and midfield. Just a bit light up front but I still think once Olliengets one he will be back to his best.
No doubt people thought that would be the case when he scored his only goal abiht two months ago.
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Can we get this merged with the Champions League one, please?
I abhor all this jinxing.
I will never not agree with this.
I couldn't not agree less.
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If we're still in the top four after the festive season I'll start to believe anything is possible. The PL are doing their utmost to give certain clubs a boost. While we have to travel to London twice in three days Chelsea, Arsenal, Liverpool and Man Yoo all have two home games.
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If we're still in the top four after the festive season I'll start to believe anything is possible. The PL are doing their utmost to give certain clubs a boost. While we have to travel to London twice in three days Chelsea, Arsenal, Liverpool and Man Yoo all have two home games.
That’s just the luck of the draw. If the fixtures were fixed then the Premier League wanted us to be top after a couple of months.
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We’ve just stumbled to a 1-0 win against a comically inept Wolves side. So no.
Also, this is the type of thread that gives credence to our neighbours’ claims of us being arrogant and having ideas above our station.
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I can't envisage anything going wrong ever again. Absolutely nailed on.
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As for our neighbours, they think they're in line for global domination despite not having won a PL game in getting on 15 years. Imagine what they'd be like if they were as good as us.
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We’ve just stumbled to a 1-0 win against a comically inept Wolves side. So no.
Also, this is the type of thread that gives credence to our neighbours’ claims of us being arrogant and having ideas above our station.
We didn't stumble our way to anything, we had more shots, more possession, more corners and free kicks, they had 4 bookings and probably got away with a couple more.
It isn't particularly arrogant to start considering ourselves part of the title race when we're 1 point off 2nd place with 1/3rd of the season gone, especially when we're one of the most in forms sides in Europe.
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If we come through this month well then Champions League is really on. This month is so hard - 5 league games, 3 away and 2 at home. Play Arsenal twice, Chelsea (including those two away back to back in the space of 3 days) and our bogey team. If we got 10 points we’ll have done very well.
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We're not ready for a serious title challenge, looking at Liverpool and Arsenal, they both spent a good few seasons finishing runners up before really challenging, that's probably realistic.
But then remember Leicester. Unai is the kind of manager who could put a run of results together at the right time.
Let's talk about it again in late April.
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From another perspective on this .i have just put on Sky sports and they are talking about Chelsea being challengers showing the top 3 with them on 24 points. Sorry but when did they not show the top 4 especially when on equal points ??? I am glad everyone has dodgy sticks ,wankers
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I don't have a dodgy stick.
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From another perspective on this .i have just put on Sky sports and they are talking about Chelsea being challengers showing the top 3 with them on 24 points. Sorry but when did they not show the top 4 especially when on equal points ??? I am glad everyone has dodgy sticks ,wankers
The other week they showed the top 11 to include Liverpool on the chart.
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It isn't particularly arrogant to start considering ourselves part of the title race when we're 1 point off 2nd place with 1/3rd of the season gone, especially when we're one of the most in forms sides in Europe.
But as soon as we next don't win a game, we'll be flooded with posts about how we don't have the consistency to even finish in the top five, how our underlying numbers prove that we're not good enough, the squad's not big enough, that we need to buy a whole new attack in January...
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And that is only from Demi_C.....
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And that is only from Demi_C.....
Glad your a fan 👍
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I would absolutely love it if we did but realistically top 4 or 5 would be a fantastic achievement.
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Imagine if we'd just started playing when everyone else did rather than giving them a 4 or 5 game head start.
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Can we get this merged with the Champions League one, please?
I abhor all this jinxing.
I will never not agree with this.
Thirded.
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It's better to shoot the breeze about how good we are when we win every week than all the doom and gloom when we don't. There's no such thing as a jinx. What we do, say, think has no bearing whatsoever on how the Villa play and what result we get.
🤞
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Burn the witch!
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It's better to shoot the breeze about how good we are when we win every week than all the doom and gloom when we don't. There's no such thing as a jinx. What we do, say, think has no bearing whatsoever on how the Villa play and what result we get.
🤞
You've jinxed that.
INJECTION INJECTION NO INFECTION!
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Burn the witch!
He probably walks under ladders, and all sorts.
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I don't have a dodgy stick.
I do, on both counts.
There's no way this frontline is winning a Premier League title. No. Fucking. Way. We might blag Champions League if we can get to January in decent shape and do good business. I think 9 of the 11 could win the league (excluding squad depth...there is plenty of quality behind the 9) and with Asensio and Rashford in there last season, making it 11 from 11, we showed that form. Watkins, and I say this as someone who appreciates our Premier League top goalscorer, is toast, whilst the only thing stopping us from having zero width is Matty Cash.
They're doing well, but let's not kid ourselves.
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If we're still in the top four after the festive season I'll start to believe anything is possible. The PL are doing their utmost to give certain clubs a boost. While we have to travel to London twice in three days Chelsea, Arsenal, Liverpool and Man Yoo all have two home games.
That’s just the luck of the draw. If the fixtures were fixed then the Premier League wanted us to be top after a couple of months.
I don't think it's just the luck of the draw that Arsenal, Chelsea, Liverpool and Man U all have two home games in 3 days. Our pre two fixtures on Boxing Day have been Newcastle away last year and Man U away the year before. If its just down to the luck of the draw we are very unlucky.
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We wwill have to adapt but so will our opponents. We're getting a reputation for these goals now, and that's going to mean teams start trying to occupy those spaces, which creates space elsewhere. We just need to have the players be composed and confident enough to adapt their play to the game and start exploiting the new gaps that open up. I think that's exactly what we're training them to do because we can score the simpler goals when we see a less crowded box as we've done a couple of times.
I think this is the key. Even the worst teams in the PL have top analysts able to identify strengths of opposition. We've seen a lot of stodgy games over the last year as teams defend deep and crowd the middle of the pitch to deny our passing lanes.
It makes sense to take advantage of that, and I'm sure that Emery will have a plan for when teams inevitably set 2 or 3 players to rush at players just outside the box.
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We wwill have to adapt but so will our opponents. We're getting a reputation for these goals now, and that's going to mean teams start trying to occupy those spaces, which creates space elsewhere. We just need to have the players be composed and confident enough to adapt their play to the game and start exploiting the new gaps that open up. I think that's exactly what we're training them to do because we can score the simpler goals when we see a less crowded box as we've done a couple of times.
I think this is the key. Even the worst teams in the PL have top analysts able to identify strengths of opposition. We've seen a lot of stodgy games over the last year as teams defend deep and crowd the middle of the pitch to deny our passing lanes.
It makes sense to take advantage of that, and I'm sure that Emery will have a plan for when teams inevitably set 2 or 3 players to rush at players just outside the box.
It could equally be argued that Arsenal depend too much on corners. Last weekend, when down to 10 men, Chelsea left 3 forwards up by the halfway line when the Arses had a corner. The Arses had to keep 4 players back and the Chelsea goalie caught the ball unimpeded.
That problem was solved easily. But stopping players shooting from outside the box in open play is not so easy.
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It could equally be argued that Arsenal depend too much on corners. Last weekend, when down to 10 men, Chelsea left 3 forwards up by the halfway line when the Arses had a corner. The Arses had to keep 4 players back and the Chelsea goalie caught the ball unimpeded.
Someone has explained this to me before and I recall it making sense, but I still don't understand why teams don't just do this as standard. Leave your two nippiest players in the centre circle, and any sort of decent clearance or goalkeeper claiming the ball and you're away, unless the opponent sacrifice players who they'd want to otherwise be attacking the corner.
At the very least, it's going to mess up whatever clever, pre-prepared corner routine they had in mind.
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I mean, I would rather like us to start scoring a few more normal goals, or indeed just goals in general (Unai's commented on this too). Goal of the season will be fun though.
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I mean, I would rather like us to start scoring a few more normal goals, or indeed just goals in general (Unai's commented on this too). Goal of the season will be fun though.
no one will complain about more goals but since the spell at the start where we couldn't score our goalscoring record has been fine.
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It could equally be argued that Arsenal depend too much on corners. Last weekend, when down to 10 men, Chelsea left 3 forwards up by the halfway line when the Arses had a corner. The Arses had to keep 4 players back and the Chelsea goalie caught the ball unimpeded.
Someone has explained this to me before and I recall it making sense, but I still don't understand why teams don't just do this as standard. Leave your two nippiest players in the centre circle, and any sort of decent clearance or goalkeeper claiming the ball and you're away, unless the opponent sacrifice players who they'd want to otherwise be attacking the corner.
At the very least, it's going to mess up whatever clever, pre-prepared corner routine they had in mind.
Yes, that rings a bell with me as well, wasn’t it (something like) if you left, say, 4 players up when defending a corner then, theoretically, you wouldn’t necessarily need four defenders to mark them as they would all be facing the clearance and a lesser number of defenders who can attack the ball whilst it’s in the air to reach them, again theoretically, should be able to deal with it. So you can commit more forward to your attacking corner.
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I mean, I would rather like us to start scoring a few more normal goals, or indeed just goals in general (Unai's commented on this too). Goal of the season will be fun though.
no one will complain about more goals but since the spell at the start where we couldn't score our goalscoring record has been fine.
Sure, but let's be real here - we're really going to go the whole of the rest of the season, competitive, with over half of our goals being awesome long shots? I just don't see it. We need to start getting back to opening teams a up a bit more somehow.
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Clough used to leave a couple up, the theory being the box was less cluttered so it was easier for Shilton to come and take the ball, and it should work for us as Martinez is easily the best around at coming out to catch the ball.
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Whilst I don't think we'll win the league, if we got some consistency in our front 3 then I think we could make top 6 without a problem.
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Whilst I don't think we'll win the league, if we got some consistency in our front 3 then I think we could make top 6 without a problem.
We're better than we were last season before we had the January injection. Repeat it again an we should get into the Champions League with room to spare.
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I mean, I would rather like us to start scoring a few more normal goals, or indeed just goals in general (Unai's commented on this too). Goal of the season will be fun though.
no one will complain about more goals but since the spell at the start where we couldn't score our goalscoring record has been fine.
Sure, but let's be real here - we're really going to go the whole of the rest of the season, competitive, with over half of our goals being awesome long shots? I just don't see it. We need to start getting back to opening teams a up a bit more somehow.
We’re going to start scoring penalties. :)
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I mean, I would rather like us to start scoring a few more normal goals, or indeed just goals in general (Unai's commented on this too). Goal of the season will be fun though.
no one will complain about more goals but since the spell at the start where we couldn't score our goalscoring record has been fine.
Sure, but let's be real here - we're really going to go the whole of the rest of the season, competitive, with over half of our goals being awesome long shots? I just don't see it. We need to start getting back to opening teams a up a bit more somehow.
To repeat though, the goals we've scored aren't hit and hope, they're placed efforts from the edge of the box in the main. That, for me, is a lot more sustainable than people are suggesting but also it means that analyst teams from the rest of the league will be trying to work out how to nullify us and whatever they do it's going to leave space elsewhere.
Take sunday for example:
(https://i.ibb.co/Fvhfm6T/Screenshot-2025-12-02-110952.png) (https://ibb.co/Fvhfm6T)
That's 9 defenders in their box with 7 of them effectively marking 3 players, with one keeping an eye on Digne. You can get pictures like that for a few other goals we've scored as well because teams seem to have decided that the way to stop us is this really low block defence. Shooting from the edge f the box is our response to that change and means there's going to have to be a bit of a rethink.
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I don't have a dodgy stick.
errr me neither officer
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That's 9 defenders in their box with 7 of them effectively marking 3 players, with one keeping an eye on Digne. You can get pictures like that for a few other goals we've scored as well because teams seem to have decided that the way to stop us is this really low block defence. Shooting from the edge f the box is our response to that change and means there's going to have to be a bit of a rethink.
Would be worth getting Youri in space at the edge of the box as much as possible - not only is he probably the one you'd want trying to ping it from 25 yards, he's also the one that you'd fancy to have the awareness to slip it through to Malen / Rogers / Watkins if they try to deal with the hit-it-early strategy by charging out to block the shot.
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Whilst I don't think we'll win the league, if we got some consistency in our front 3 then I think we could make top 6 without a problem.
Agreed, Emery had done an excellent job of turning the ship around. There's an experienced group of solid pros there who have delivered three seasons of European football and are odds on to do it again. McGinn has been outstanding, Cash and Konsa very solid. That's with Tielemans mostly injured, Ollie horribly out of form and a disastrous summer transfer window behind us.
Other factors
- PL quality seems a lot weaker this season, the promoted teams all have a good chance of staying up. At the top end, likes of Liverpool and Man City are miles off where they were.
- if Arsenal do cruise the title, I expect a lot of players to start minding themselves well ahead ahead of the WC next summer
- can we get a player or two in January?
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The only good thing about this thread is that the OP didn't say "Premiership".
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That's 9 defenders in their box with 7 of them effectively marking 3 players, with one keeping an eye on Digne. You can get pictures like that for a few other goals we've scored as well because teams seem to have decided that the way to stop us is this really low block defence. Shooting from the edge f the box is our response to that change and means there's going to have to be a bit of a rethink.
Would be worth getting Youri in space at the edge of the box as much as possible - not only is he probably the one you'd want trying to ping it from 25 yards, he's also the one that you'd fancy to have the awareness to slip it through to Malen / Rogers / Watkins if they try to deal with the hit-it-early strategy by charging out to block the shot.
We do quite a lot, he's there in the image I've linked and he had at least 4 chances to get a shot away in the game himself (a couple he took on and couple he didn't), McGinn, Onana and Barkley take up that position a lot as well (and have a few goals between them to show for it).
The next 'step' is to try to create a gap between the defence and midfield (so around the penalty spot) and get someone drifting into that space, so if the midfield do push out to block the shot we can try to find someone in there. If we start doing that teams are going to have to start defending higher and we can get back to the sort of goals we were scoring a lot of in the season before last. Being able to do all 3 (i.e create chances at the edge of the box, the penalty spot or the 6 yard box) gives us the versatility to adapt to how teams try to defend against us.
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I mean, I would rather like us to start scoring a few more normal goals, or indeed just goals in general (Unai's commented on this too). Goal of the season will be fun though.
no one will complain about more goals but since the spell at the start where we couldn't score our goalscoring record has been fine.
Sure, but let's be real here - we're really going to go the whole of the rest of the season, competitive, with over half of our goals being awesome long shots? I just don't see it. We need to start getting back to opening teams a up a bit more somehow.
To repeat though, the goals we've scored aren't hit and hope, they're placed efforts from the edge of the box in the main. That, for me, is a lot more sustainable than people are suggesting but also it means that analyst teams from the rest of the league will be trying to work out how to nullify us and whatever they do it's going to leave space elsewhere.
Take sunday for example:
(https://i.ibb.co/Fvhfm6T/Screenshot-2025-12-02-110952.png) (https://ibb.co/Fvhfm6T)
That's 9 defenders in their box with 7 of them effectively marking 3 players, with one keeping an eye on Digne. You can get pictures like that for a few other goals we've scored as well because teams seem to have decided that the way to stop us is this really low block defence. Shooting from the edge f the box is our response to that change and means there's going to have to be a bit of a rethink.
Agree totally with this. Emery analyses things in minute detail and spends hours drilling in how to approach every match. I'd bet the house on us having made a concious decision to start shooting from further out. Someone (Emery?) has found a chink in other teams' armour, and we are exploiting that - along with the Buendia free kick.
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...
To repeat though, the goals we've scored aren't hit and hope, they're placed efforts from the edge of the box in the main. That, for me, is a lot more sustainable than people are suggesting but also it means that analyst teams from the rest of the league will be trying to work out how to nullify us and whatever they do it's going to leave space elsewhere.
Take sunday for example:
(https://i.ibb.co/Fvhfm6T/Screenshot-2025-12-02-110952.png) (https://ibb.co/Fvhfm6T)
That's 9 defenders in their box with 7 of them effectively marking 3 players, with one keeping an eye on Digne. You can get pictures like that for a few other goals we've scored as well because teams seem to have decided that the way to stop us is this really low block defence. Shooting from the edge f the box is our response to that change and means there's going to have to be a bit of a rethink.
Agree totally with this. Emery analyses things in minute detail and spends hours drilling in how to approach every match. I'd bet the house on us having made a concious decision to start shooting from further out. Someone (Emery?) has found a chink in other teams' armour, and we are exploiting that - along with the Buendia free kick.
Is it too crazy to think we're also shooting when it's more likely the keeper is unsighted (ie too many defenders in eye-line) ? I can't be arsed looking back at the goals, but feels like there's been a few where the keeper has had no chance and/or had to react late.
It seems to me we only shoot when conditions are right, anyway.
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We’ve definitely been shooting more from outside the box. Plenty blocked, but it’s a clear shift as we hardly ever did last season.
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Obviously they're well placed shots, they went in! - but they're necessarily lower percentage than working a tap in from the six yard line, which we'll absolutely have to do if we're going to get that goals tally up. Yes, it's fine to work decent openings from the edge of the area, but relying on them is unsustainable. Obviously!
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Ok I confess it’s a bit bizarre but….. we have Arsenal to play twice over Xmas and who knows what will happen…. In Unai I trust
FFS, we might allude to it but you're not supposed to start a thread about it. It's the sort of thing visitors from other clubs will point at as evidence of our arrogance and delusion (when it inevitably goes tits up).
Can we please put this discussion in the CL thread until the eve of the Liverpool game?
Now, can we please merge it into the CL thread?
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Maybe leave it as is for a bit?
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Maybe leave it as is for a bit?
You will note that I posted just before Ollie scored the first. You're all very welcome.
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Beat Arsenal on Saturday, and we absolutely can, and we’re firmly in the title race.
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We were 18th after 5 games, and yet here we are.
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Beat Arsenal on Saturday, and we absolutely can, and we’re firmly in the title race.
Indeed
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Yes. We will.
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Beat Arsenal on Saturday, and we absolutely can, and we’re firmly in the title race.
Win on Sunday, and yes, we are - even if temporarily. We're already the form team, so beat the 'runaway leaders' and we're right in the mix.
Personally, I'd reserve judgement on whether we're genuine contenders until we play Forest on the 3rd Jan - if we're still in the mix then, that's when I'll start to dream it's possible. It's only a month away, but there is a LOT of football to be played, and 18 points up for grabs there, 12 of them available against teams with Champions League ambitions.
It's a pivotable month.
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No we won’t and we should not get distracted by the question
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Yes we will and yes we should.
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We were 18th after 5 games, and yet here we are.
Wasn't it 19th?
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We were 18th after 5 games, and yet here we are.
Wasn't it 19th?
No.
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No we won’t and we should not get distracted by the question
We should absolutely get distracted by it, dreaming is what its all about
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I think you'll find it's all about neuroses.
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Well, we get to have our say now.
Beat the Gooners and it could be a free for all for the title, and you’d think City would be best placed.
Lose and I can see the Gooners running away with it.
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I think you'll find it's all about neuroses.
Yeah, I'm only in it for the fear and panic. Success is scary, it's not really our kind of thing.
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No we won’t and we should not get distracted by the question
Correct.
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Not winning it now would be a massive disappointment, nay, failure.
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Let's just enjoy the ride. This month is pivotal but if we can come through the games against Arsenal and Chelsea undefeated, we're well-and-truly in the mix.
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I just think it would be looked on by the media as a bit Leicesterish if we win it this season. Be patient and a year or two from now we will start winning regularly with the odd double thrown in.
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Media can kiss our title winning backsides.
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I think you'll find it's all about neuroses.
But surely our dreams are at least partly a creation of our neuroses
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It’s in the bag.
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Media can kiss our title winning backsides.
This
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I think you'll find it's all about neuroses.
But surely our dreams are at least partly a creation of our neuroses
We shouldn't be aspiring to those dreams, brother. I don't want Villa sitting A Level Chemistry in their swimming trunks.
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Looks like we will only finish 2nd. SHA has a "Thank F*K for Arsenal" thread.
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We're about 150/1 with the bookies. Sounds about right.
We were 300/1 with PP during the week. Sunderland were 200/1.
Still 150/1 to win it. Liverpool are 25/1 and Yanited 80/1.
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I just think it would be looked on by the media as a bit Leicesterish if we win it this season. Be patient and a year or two from now we will start winning regularly with the odd double thrown in.
If it was they'd be wrong, this is our 4th season in a row being up in the mix for European places so us getting into the conversation for the title shouldn't be a shock.
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We're about 150/1 with the bookies. Sounds about right.
We were 300/1 with PP during the week. Sunderland were 200/1.
Still 150/1 to win it. Liverpool are 25/1 and Yanited 80/1.
Those bookie cnuts, they always have the better teams at the shortest odds. Tell me it's not a conspiracy.
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It's not a conspiracy. It's a cartel.
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In answer to the post title……
Fuck yeah, we could
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We're about 150/1 with the bookies. Sounds about right.
We were 300/1 with PP during the week. Sunderland were 200/1.
Still 150/1 to win it. Liverpool are 25/1 and Yanited 80/1.
Those bookie cnuts, they always have the better teams at the shortest odds. Tell me it's not a conspiracy.
Do you really think both those teams are currently better? More likely they have received a crap load more bets so the bookies are also attempting to limit their losses on the offchance they do fluke it.
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"They" haven't done anything. It's an algorithm.
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Prove them wrong.
Edit: I have no idea what I mean by that but shut up anyway.
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I want us to kinda hang around near the top and then after 38 games everyone else realises that the Villa are top. Even better if Arsenal were a point behind going into the last day, we lose our last match but they also lose. To Wolves.
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I want us to kinda hang around near the top and then after 38 games everyone else realises that the Villa are top. Even better if Arsenal were a point behind going into the last day, we lose our last match but they also lose. To Wolves.
The most perfect title win ever would be to not go top until the last day.
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I'd rather have it wrapped up in March and be able to rest players for the Europa League and FA Cup.
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I mean, I would rather like us to start scoring a few more normal goals, or indeed just goals in general (Unai's commented on this too). Goal of the season will be fun though.
Ask and you shall receive! Looks like emery read your post and took action 😃
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I want us to kinda hang around near the top and then after 38 games everyone else realises that the Villa are top. Even better if Arsenal were a point behind going into the last day, we lose our last match but they also lose. To Wolves.
The most perfect title win ever would be to not go top until the last day.
Known as 'doing a Burnley'.
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Premier League Winners (https://www.football365.com/news/premier-league-winners-losers-aston-villa-daniel-farke-liverpool-arsenal-depth)
Aston Villa
Having failed to win any of their first five Premier League games of the season, Unai Emery’s side have now won eight of their last nine to saunter through the mass of mid-table mediocrity, into the Champions League places and now to the very fringes of the title race.
Sure, they’re being helped along by the fact that, with the exception of Arsenal, everyone is a bit rubbish in some way or another this year. But that situation has been there for other teams to exploit, and they simply haven’t.
Spurs, Liverpool, Man United, Newcastle and now even perhaps Chelsea have become consumed by that mid-table fug and seem utterly incapable of doing anything like Villa have done to ease themselves clear of it.
The goals have started to flow now for a team who started the season looking like they might never actually score another goal ever again, and even after the three they conceded in a wild win at Brighton on Wednesday night it is still only Arsenal and Crystal Palace who boast a better defensive record than the Villans.
Coming back from 2-0 down to win shows the belief Villa now possess, and sets up a huge game on Saturday lunchtime.
There’s never really a particularly a good time to play Arsenal, but we would strongly contend that this might just be the least bad. Villa’s own form is stunning, especially at Villa Park, while Arsenal’s injury problems mounted further in victory over Brentford, they’ve stumbled on the last couple of away days, and Mikel Arteta is already talking darkly about the sheer unfairness of the Gunners being the first team in football history to be asked to play two games of football per week.
If Villa can rumble on and win that one as well then suddenly, without telling anyone, they’ll have moved within three points of the Premier League leaders approaching the halfway stage of the season.
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Found that article and it's in a section called "Premier League Winners and Losers", based on midweek results. They also list Leeds as one of the "winners" and, presumably, don't expect them to be challenging for the title.
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Given how tight the table is, mid 60s might be enough to guarantee CL football. 10 more PL wins should do it. Can focus after March on winning trophies then.
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Found that article and it's in a section called "Premier League Winners and Losers", based on midweek results. They also list Leeds as one of the "winners" and, presumably, don't expect them to be challenging for the title.
I know where it's from, I've linked to the piece in the post. It was really just for the last line, which I thought made here as sensible a thread as any other to put it.
Sorry that it's caused you distress
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It didn't. What a strange post.
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I havem't put a football bet on in years, but have just gone to stick £100 on @ 150. Get to January 3 points behind Arsenal, sign some more marquee loans. It ain't hapoening, but it ain't 150.
Disappointed to find the best price is now 80 and the conversation was yesterday.
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If by some miracle we ‘win’ the league, I suspect there will be an even more miraculous points deduction to hand it to Arsenal, Man City or whoever.
Paranoid? Moi?
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Premier League Winners (https://www.football365.com/news/premier-league-winners-losers-aston-villa-daniel-farke-liverpool-arsenal-depth)
Aston Villa
Sure, they’re being helped along by the fact that, with the exception of Arsenal, everyone is a bit rubbish
My theory is that having about 17 of the richest clubs in the world in the same league, playing a game where they all have to pick the same number of players from the same sized squad, all of them being able to employ the best coaches and invest massively in academies, scouting, nutrition and fitness, is making that league more competitive.
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Indeed Percy. This ‘it’s a shit league this year’ is utter rubbish. It’s as strong as it’s ever been.
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We don't want too many Leicester Citys.
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I agree, it's a very very good league this year, which means anyone can make anyone else look rubbish on their day. You can tell it's good by the continued underperformance of the two half-arsed Uber Clubs in Manchester and north London.
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Today’s result was one of a short series that could, if we beat Brighton, give us the right to “have our say” in who wins the league.
If we were to then beat Arsenal twice, and pick up some points against Chelsea and United, we could consider ourselves as among the challengers.
But the odds of that are very long. I’d be pretty happy with “having our say” this year.
[/quot
“Pick up some points against United.”
One reason it would be difficult for us to win the league even with Mbappe and Salah up front is because we only really have a 36 game season.
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My theory is that having about 17 of the richest clubs in the world in the same league, playing a game where they all have to pick the same number of players from the same sized squad, all of them being able to employ the best coaches and invest massively in academies, scouting, nutrition and fitness, is making that league more competitive.
I agree completely, the idea that the league is weaker somehow is just buying in to the idea that if Man Utd, Liverpool and Tottenham aren't in the top 6 then something is wrong with them rather it being that other teams have improved.
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I think this means he thinks we're in the title race.
@J_Tanswell
Emery: "I've been asked about the title race. You know how I think. Keep humble. Words of a title race are empty until April or May - we are starting December. These are headline I dislike.Many people who put us there now were thinking in August we were a finished team."#AVFC
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No we won’t as we will certainly have a sticky patch. Aim is CL football.
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Hand it over, hand it over, hand it over Liverpool.
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I would just like to put my thread back to the top 😁
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It’sssss happening.
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We’re genuine contenders. Injury free, one or two in jan, and we’ll be close.
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No because Man City are now allowed to get 5 points for a win according to the beeb.
Manchester City will go level with the leaders if they beat Sunderland at Etihad Stadium, one of five 3pm kick-offs coming up.
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No because Man City are now allowed to get 5 points for a win according to the beeb.
Manchester City will go level with the leaders if they beat Sunderland at Etihad Stadium, one of five 3pm kick-offs coming up.
😂
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I'm getting Leicester City vibes from this team at the moment. Something has clicked and there is a real never say die attitude about us.
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Is it 5 appearances for a medal? Give Elliott another 2 and he'll get back-to-back title medals.
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No we won’t as we will certainly have a sticky patch. Aim is CL football.
Still correct.
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Not happening. Aim for the CL.and be happy. Dillyding dillydong.
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In a perfect world Emery's Aston Villa pip Lego Hair's Arsenal to the title to become our greatest ever manager.
We'd have to erect a statue the size of Barrow-in-Furness bus depot to do him justice.
We can dream but....
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Not yet.
We had our say today, by ensuring that Arsenal won’t Liverpool it, as in get so far ahead everyone gives up in February.
If we keep the current gap steady and get a result back at their place, however…
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Not going to get ahead of ourselves but today is a statement of intent
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Incredible resilience allied to our technical and organisational ability shown today.
The GD is poor for a team that wins nearly every game though. We're not rolling over anyone (even the 4-0 against Bomo didn't tell the story. They score a penalty and we're clenching our arses for the last 20).
All it takes is a bit of bad luck, shit refereeing or dropping a bollock with a backpass that can turn these narrow wins into draws or defeats.
Stay humble, know your place. Get your kicks from 4th or 5th. I don't want it to go to Chelsea.
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In the last 14 months we have beaten Bayern Munich, PSG, Man City, the Arses (plus loads of others) so of course we are title contenders. And on merit as well.
If we are not taken seriously by others, so be it.
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I don't think we are. An inspired January loan signing of a striker to help Ollie's workload , you never know. The fact that Arteta played Rice so deep today suggests he thinks we are title contenders though !
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Not going to get ahead of ourselves but today is a statement of intent
If we sign Ings or Benteke on a free in January, then I might believe.
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Still think we are 2 or 3 players shy of a tilt at the title, top 4 is well within our grasp and then let’s hear the Press try to sell our best players again! Why would anybody want to play anywhere else? UTV
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No. Still
Top 4 we have a chance.
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Still think we are 2 or 3 players shy of a tilt at the title, top 4 is well within our grasp and then let’s hear the Press try to sell our best players again! Why would anybody want to play anywhere else? UTV
Honestly I think 2-3 is more than we need 1 or 2 would be enough to just give us a little boost. If you ignore August, when we were clearly struggling after a summer of not being able to do the business we wanted to, we've scored 22, conceded 11 (for +11 giving us the 3rd best goal difference in the league), and got 29 points from 12 games. Nothing about that run screams that we are desperate for more players. With Watkins, Sancho and Guessand seemingly getting better after a tough start to the season we're in a good place there as well.
Elliott is the clear standout as a 'problem' right now and if we can agree to cancel his loan and use that to add someone who can bring something up front then I'd be happy with where we are. I thought the midfield today with Tielemans ahead of Onana and Kamara looked superb and I'd like to see us use all 3 more often. If we do that the other possible 'gap' is another one in there to compete with Barkley.
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Yes. We’re going to win it all.
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Not going to get ahead of ourselves but today is a statement of intent
If we sign Ings or Benteke on a free in January, then I might believe.
Or Grant Holt?
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Not going to get ahead of ourselves but today is a statement of intent
If we sign Ings or Benteke on a free in January, then I might believe.
Or Grant Holt?
Gilles de Bilde
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Serious option, I'd have a long look at Ueda from Feyenoord in Janaury but really I'd be looking to throw whatever it took to get Panichelli from Strasbourg in the summer, him alongside Rogers and Malen would be an exceptional front 3.
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Ueda would be my preference.
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Ueda would be my preference.
He's a proper goalscorer but I think he's more like Malen than Ollie. Panichelli would be a perfect replacement for Ollie, offering all the hold-up play and ability to 'work over' a defender as well as being a decent goalscorer, and quite a bit younger. Sadly I reckon he'll be £70-80m by the time anyone is seriously looking at him.
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Ueda would be my preference.
He's a proper goalscorer but I think he's more like Malen than Ollie. Panichelli would be a perfect replacement for Ollie, offering all the hold-up play and ability to 'work over' a defender as well as being a decent goalscorer, and quite a bit younger. Sadly I reckon he'll be £70-80m by the time anyone is seriously looking at him.
If Panichelli is any good surely he’ll be going to Chelsea?
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Yes.
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Ueda would be my preference.
He's a proper goalscorer but I think he's more like Malen than Ollie. Panichelli would be a perfect replacement for Ollie, offering all the hold-up play and ability to 'work over' a defender as well as being a decent goalscorer, and quite a bit younger. Sadly I reckon he'll be £70-80m by the time anyone is seriously looking at him.
If Panichelli is any good surely he’ll be going to Chelsea?
You'd expect so but yes, he's seriously good, and fair play to their scouting network for picking up how good he could be, he's a Rogers level signing for me.
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My theory is that having about 17 of the richest clubs in the world in the same league, playing a game where they all have to pick the same number of players from the same sized squad, all of them being able to employ the best coaches and invest massively in academies, scouting, nutrition and fitness, is making that league more competitive.
I agree completely, the idea that the league is weaker somehow is just buying in to the idea that if Man Utd, Liverpool and Tottenham aren't in the top 6 then something is wrong with them rather it being that other teams have improved.
It's not to the level it was when Liverpool and Man City were pushing each other to crazy points totals. Arsenal are a functional rather than outstanding team. They should still win it I think, didn't play badly today but have signed a dud up top.
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My theory is that having about 17 of the richest clubs in the world in the same league, playing a game where they all have to pick the same number of players from the same sized squad, all of them being able to employ the best coaches and invest massively in academies, scouting, nutrition and fitness, is making that league more competitive.
I agree completely, the idea that the league is weaker somehow is just buying in to the idea that if Man Utd, Liverpool and Tottenham aren't in the top 6 then something is wrong with them rather it being that other teams have improved.
It's not to the level it was when Liverpool and Man City were pushing each other to crazy points totals. Arsenal are a functional rather than outstanding team. They should still win it I think, didn't play badly today but have signed a dud up top.
I disagree completely. There isn't a standout team on the level that Man City or Liverpool have managed in the last 5-6 seasons but the league as a whole is incredibly strong. There's a clear top 3 but after that everyone down to Brentford is in the battle for the top 6 and there isn't really a 'mid-table' in the normal sense. Fulham are about the only team that aren't involved in either the battle above or at risk of relegation. Obviously it's very early in the season and things can change but if it plays out like this it'll be one of the most competitive seasons ever, anywhere, and that's down to the fact that most teams in the league now are full of players who be at home playing Champions League football in most other countries.
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My theory is that having about 17 of the richest clubs in the world in the same league, playing a game where they all have to pick the same number of players from the same sized squad, all of them being able to employ the best coaches and invest massively in academies, scouting, nutrition and fitness, is making that league more competitive.
I agree completely, the idea that the league is weaker somehow is just buying in to the idea that if Man Utd, Liverpool and Tottenham aren't in the top 6 then something is wrong with them rather it being that other teams have improved.
It's not to the level it was when Liverpool and Man City were pushing each other to crazy points totals. Arsenal are a functional rather than outstanding team. They should still win it I think, didn't play badly today but have signed a dud up top.
Two teams pushing each other to crazy points totals isn’t indicative of a strong league.
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Yeah, I think it's very strange that a criterion for a good league as a whole is that one team is way better than all the other also-rans. The Greek league must be fan-fucking-tastic then.
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My theory is that having about 17 of the richest clubs in the world in the same league, playing a game where they all have to pick the same number of players from the same sized squad, all of them being able to employ the best coaches and invest massively in academies, scouting, nutrition and fitness, is making that league more competitive.
I agree completely, the idea that the league is weaker somehow is just buying in to the idea that if Man Utd, Liverpool and Tottenham aren't in the top 6 then something is wrong with them rather it being that other teams have improved.
It's not to the level it was when Liverpool and Man City were pushing each other to crazy points totals. Arsenal are a functional rather than outstanding team. They should still win it I think, didn't play badly today but have signed a dud up top.
Two teams pushing each other to crazy points totals isn’t indicative of a strong league.
Spot on, in fact just the opposite.
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Bookies have us as 3rd favourites now at 33/1.
Arsenla and MC ahead.
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The points gap from us in third to Chelsea in fourth is the same as the points gap from Chelsea in fourth to Bournemouth in thirteenth.
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The top sides are still very good, most of the rest are better than ever which is the difference. It's not substandard at all. the standard is better than ever.
Is still my view. Apart from Wolves there's no mugs these days and there's sod all chance they'd be bottom in any other league in world football.
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Are Aston Villa in title hunt - and should Arsenal start to worry?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/articles/c1m8p0n2mzmo
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This is how the media pundits will view our title chances.
"As good as Aston Villa were today, they can't be expected to sustain this over the season as they lack the squad depth of Arsenal".
This is how the media pundits will view our victory today.
"As good as Aston Villa were today and probably deserved their victory, Arsenal did have injuries and when these players are back they will be fine".
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They probably have a point to be fair.
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They probably have a point to be fair.
Which is more than Arsenal got.
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I can’t get carried away, knowing Man Utd are waiting to piss on our chips.
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Also Nuno seems to have Emery's number, especially when we play at his home stadium.
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Whenever we get to this kind of position in December we pick up long term injuries to our best players and fall away. We have a decent squad but some vulnerable positions, just this once it would be nice to see what we can achieve with a relatively injury free season.
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I can’t get carried away, knowing Man Utd are waiting to piss on our chips.
We'll batter Yanited at home. As SQ notes, I'm more concerned with Nuno away.
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Had to Google who he manages.
Next league game. Bugger.
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Yes.
We are defo in it.
If we don’t get injuries.
We are gonna piss it.
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Had to Google who he manages.
Next league game. Bugger.
Me too. I don't care about Nuno, he don't care about me...
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They probably have a point to be fair.
Every team in the league suffers in the same way but as it happens Arsenal suffer less on account of having better players than most. So no, the point is moot.
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It's still a no from me. We have done as much as any team can do and we are still 3 poi nts effectively 4 behind them. Our goal difference is also an issue. What we have done is to solidify top 4 finish.
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Obviously not.
Nice things don't happen to us.
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Deleted...
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If Ron Sunders came from Belfast................Why the fuck not.
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I would love to think we are in it but we just don’t have the squad depth.
Maybe a couple of tweaks in January but we see how long it takes new players to integrate into the team.
We are getting stronger and I doubt any team relishes playing us right now.
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It’s not sustainable because we can only score goals from outside the box.
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No. No. No. We definitely, definitely won’t win it. There is literally absolutely no chance whatsoever that we will win it.
Have I reverse jinxed it enough?
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From The Athletic
ARE ASTON VILLA TITLE CONTENDERS?
by Jacob Tanswell
In the days leading up to Arsenal’s visit, the question about Aston Villa’s title credentials was put to Unai Emery.
“I’ve been asked about the title race,” he wrote in Saturday’s programme notes. “You know how I think. Keep humble. Words of a title race are empty until April or May — we are starting December. These are headlines I dislike. Many people who put us there now were thinking in August we were a finished team.”
Emery’s reluctance to engage in the early rumblings of such a discussion will surely be tested again. Villa’s dramatic 2-1 victory against Arsenal puts them three points off the top, backing up everything Emery has stood for since taking charge in 2022.
“They are,” responded Arsenal manager Mikel Arteta, when asked if Villa were now title challengers. “When you look at where they are, the way they played, they’ve beaten some big teams at home.”
Villa were exceptional and deserved their 95th-minute winner, fittingly delivered by Emiliano Buendia, the player whose personal renaissance symbolises the club’s resurgence this season.
Few teams have identified weaknesses in the Premier League’s strongest side, but Emery knew that breaking down the flanks and through the space left by Arsenal’s full-backs, who occupied high and narrow positions in possession, would offer a transitional threat.
Few teams can follow through with the approach and score, let alone stabilise after a setback, as Villa did here following Arsenal’s equaliser when the match was at risk of swinging away from the hosts.
Few teams have the mentality of this Villa side, who ordered their goalkeeper, Emiliano Martinez, to launch a quick throw in the final minutes of stoppage time and aim to find a winner, sensing the league leaders were tired.
Few teams can ultimately outlast and outmanoeuvre Arsenal, but Villa did just that. Their powerful midfield rivals Declan Rice and his team-mates as the best in the division.
“After the equaliser, we recovered our momentum to dominate, to get the match in our control,” said Emery. “And we were close. We were pushing. Villa Park is something we must feel in how they pushed us. We got the last goal because we believed we could win this match.”
Quite simply, Villa do not lose at home, unless it is against their bogey team, Crystal Palace. Since Arsenal’s last visit in August 2024, Villa have been defeated only twice here (both against Palace).
It is the place where Emery learned the word “fortress” in English. No side in Europe has put together more home wins across the previous three years.
They did not win any of their first five league games this season, yet they have won nine of the next 10. No one else has accrued more points in that time.
The transformation is so stark that the initial malaise now appears anomalous, particularly considering their form at the end of last season. Since March, no team has won more Premier League games than Villa’s 17.
“This year, we started so poor, now we are good,” said Emery last week, matter-of-factly.
Where most are suffering from this season’s volatile, staccato-like Premier League, Villa continue to find a way. If other wins had question marks against them owing to Villa’s discrepancies between underlying metrics and actual performance, the victory against Arsenal was a statement result.
Emery’s side were on a roll before Saturday lunchtime but Buendia’s strike will embolden belief. Senior club figures have long marvelled at the work of Emery and his players, but have been distinctly awestruck in recent weeks, especially following the summer’s ordeals.
Back then, the atmosphere within the club was flat. They had a “nightmare” summer, according to one high-ranking official. Various financial millstones hung around their neck after missing out on Champions League qualification.
The mood was sombre and players discussed their futures. Villa needed to sell, creating uncertainty among the squad. Developing tensions between Emery and sporting director Monchi drew increasing doubt from internal staff. It was felt that Emery’s era was heading down the mountain, rather than scaling new heights.
“It was clear because of the circumstances we had and the period in the transfer window in August, maybe the most punished team was Aston Villa, because we couldn’t spend money until the last moment,” said Emery last week, reflecting on that period.
Coaching staff did not waver. Their answer was to work harder and longer hours, tightening their grip on an ageing but experienced squad that had been accustomed to Emery’s methods for three years.
The Spaniard asserted that if players stayed together, remaining “resilient” and true to his specific tactical framework, confidence and energy would return.
“When we went through a little dip, I saw some things on Twitter like, ‘Unai’s time is up now’, but then we come again,” Ross Barkley told The Athletic. “And then all the fans and people on the outside are like, ‘Wow’. It’s because he is one of the best managers in the world.”
The mood now could not be more different.
“He (Emery) is the king-maker,” says one recruitment staff member.
“The team and the coach are doing a miracle,” adds another senior figure.
While Emery acknowledged Villa’s need to improve offensively — last week, according to Opta, their overall expected goals (xG) of 11.9 was the league’s second-lowest, ahead of Burnley, illustrating their struggles to create clear-cut chances — other staff felt differently. Instead, they were not overly concerned with the discord surrounding data overperformance. Internally, they viewed the high proportion of strikes scored from outside the box as adding a unique variation to goal-getting.
For instance, beating a highly physical Wolverhampton Wanderers 1-0, despite their opponents’ lowly standing, was regarded as a major and overlooked positive. Due to Europa League commitments, Villa had one training session and three hours of video analysis to prepare for the match, with the same limited preparation being replicated for Arsenal’s visit.
Villa’s home record is in line with a title challenger. A remarkable team spirit that had been splintered in the summer but not totally fractured is now evident, demonstrated in the chaotic, joyous scenes following Buendia’s goal.
Emery recently said that it was “better to win five matches 1-0 than one 5-0”, though even he would have to admit the thrill and frenzy which accompanied the 2-1 win tops both. His eccentric celebrations at full time suggested as much.
He gathered himself for post-match media duties, repeating his line that champions are not decided until April and May. Title talk may still be premature, yet there is no doubt Villa are showing they belong among the elite.
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Right now we look like we can beat anyone, but let's have a look again with 10 games left! UTV.
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Looking back at 23/24, we were in a similar position and would have been top of the league for Christmas if we'd beaten Sheffield United at home. I still think drawing that game and then losing to Manchester United on Boxing Day after being 2-0 up took our momentum away and we never really got it back.
Different times, but I think back to when we were genuine contenders in 89/90 and we had a really strong Christmas period and then really emerged as contenders in January before fading in the latter stages.
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Has PWS posted the top of the table comparison with Dec '23 after beating Arsenal on both occasions?
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Looking back at 23/24, we were in a similar position and would have been top of the league for Christmas if we'd beaten Sheffield United at home. I still think drawing that game and then losing to Manchester United on Boxing Day after being 2-0 up took our momentum away and we never really got it back.
For me, we influenced the title race in that Arsenal may not now run away with it. But as you rightly imply, a strong Christmas culminating with a result of some sort at the Emirates could change the conversation. Some very tricky games between now and then though, plus some shedding of albatrosses.
UTV!
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Will we win it, realistically no. But we are currently contenders, so enjoy it until we aren't as it's way better talking about our chances of winning the league than it was if we could finish above Wigan and avoid relegation.
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Will we win it, realistically no. But we are currently contenders, so enjoy it until we aren't as it's way better talking about our chances of winning the league than it was if we could finish above Wigan and avoid relegation.
This is the correct answer. I'd also add that it's very important to imagine it will all come crashing down around our ears ahead of every fixture we play.
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This is the table after Arsenal 2023 as someone asked.
(https://i.ibb.co/SX5RQQ29/Screenshot-326.png)
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We’re a better team this year than 23/24. If we stay injury free and Watkins scores 10-15 goals, I think we’ll stay close to the very top this season for longer than we did that season. This doesn’t feel like a potential flash in the pan anymore, with this group now having real belief we can compete with everyone.
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We need to keep Pau and Kamara fit. Lose either of those and we will stuggle
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We need to keep Pau and Kamara fit. Lose either of those and we will stuggle
And Cash the way he is playing this season.
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I think we were a better team in 23/24. Free flowing going forwards and capable of blowing teams away with quick goals but we didn't have the squad to cope. We have a better squad now.
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We’re a better team this year than 23/24.
Not sure I agree , we may have more potential and a deeper squad.
Here is the team that night.
1
Martínez
Konsa
Cash 66`
Diego Carlos
Torres
Digne
Moreno 78`
Bailey
Diaby 45`
Kamara
Dendoncker 66`
Douglas Luiz
McGinn
Tielemans
Ramsey 56`
Watkins
Substitutes
Cash
Moreno
Lenglet
Diaby
Zaniolo
Durán
Dendoncker
Ramsey
Marschall
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Not much between our best 11 back then and now, our squad is far better now.
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Not much between our best 11 back then and now, our squad is far better now.
Yeah, it's pretty much Onana / Rogers for Bailey/ Douglas Luiz. I'd lean towards the current version but it's definitely close.
If the current squad could get another forward option firing to help out Rogers, Emi and (hopefully now) Ollie in the way that 2023 had Watkins / Bailey / Diaby then things start to look really exciting.
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I wasn’t really thinking about the players individual ability. To me, they look like they properly belong at the level they’re at, and not imposters. We’re probably a prolific CF away from actually winning the league, but fuck me it’s enjoyable right now eh? Brilliant.
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I think we were a better team in 23/24. Free flowing going forwards and capable of blowing teams away with quick goals but we didn't have the squad to cope. We have a better squad now.
Dunno...we seemed sexier when we were a bit younger.
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How tF are Palace on our tails? Their manager and best player don't want to be there. Fuck off back down the table!
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Having thought about it I think if we get a striker we win the league.
So if we're still within 3 points or less if the top by the end of January and we've bought a striker the answer is yes.
Arsenal and Man City are the only others and they don't look as sturdy as us. Both seem very capable of having a disastrous run.
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Arsenal's defensive record suggest they're pretty sturdy, no?
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Having thought about it I think if we get a striker we win the league.
So if we're still within 3 points or less if the top by the end of January and we've bought a striker the answer is yes.
Arsenal and Man City are the only others and they don't look as sturdy as us. Both seem very capable of having a disastrous run.
You saw in Gykores what £55 million gets you, so a lot easier said than done.
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If the right player came along I wouldn't be totally against it but we've scored 13 goals in our last 5 league games. We might well be ok if we keep that up.
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Do we even have money to spend in January? PSR FFP all that stuff.
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Having thought about it I think if we get a striker we win the league.
So if we're still within 3 points or less if the top by the end of January and we've bought a striker the answer is yes.
Arsenal and Man City are the only others and they don't look as sturdy as us. Both seem very capable of having a disastrous run.
You saw in Gykores what £55 million gets you, so a lot easier said than done.
Expected more. But 6 goals in 17 apps is still better than what we have right now. Add that and we're champions.
Arsenal's defensive record suggest they're pretty sturdy, no?
The number of goals conceded is great.
But I'm talking about their ability to throw things away.
They should have beaten a 10 man Chelsea and they should have held on for a draw against us. All they had to do was run it into the corner.
We wouldn't have done that.
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We won’t win the league because the squad depth just isn’t there. If Konsa or Pau got injured I think that not only takes away a great player, but also fundamentally impacts our play and defensive structure. In a similar vein Cash is having a blinding season, and back up is pretty limited. Those are the most exposed areas to drop off, but Rogers being out or Kamara, for example, would have a massive impact.
That’s not really a criticism, unless it’s a freak season, it takes sustained squad building over years to win a title. We’ve progressed amazingly, but with the PSR/FFP limitations it’s very difficult to make that big step.
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We have a chance. We're the form team in the League since March. Our home form is exceptional and we have a team, not a bunch of individuals being managed by one of the best ever.
I'd like to see us bring some pace in up front but we're covered In most areas of the pitch.
Man City are favourites in my view, with Arsenal second favourites. Which is nice.
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We won’t win the league because the squad depth just isn’t there. If Konsa or Pau got injured I think that not only takes away a great player, but also fundamentally impacts our play and defensive structure. In a similar vein Cash is having a blinding season, and back up is pretty limited. Those are the most exposed areas to drop off, but Rogers being out or Kamara, for example, would have a massive impact.
That’s not really a criticism, unless it’s a freak season, it takes sustained squad building over years to win a title. We’ve progressed amazingly, but with the PSR/FFP limitations it’s very difficult to make that big step.
Yep unless we coast through Europa League with 2nd string until SFs and get knocked out of FA Cup early and have the Leicester same 11/12/13/14 with one or two brilliant hungry back ups signed in January I just can't see it.
Arsenal City and Chelsea all have far superior squads.
Are we now in the Top 3/4/5 conversation? Yes. And it didn't seem likely all that long ago.
Personally I don't see Everton or Palace in that conversation. They are in Top 7/8 Euopean qualification conversation. We meed Champions League to drain Newcastle.
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Having thought about it I think if we get a striker we win the league.
So if we're still within 3 points or less if the top by the end of January and we've bought a striker the answer is yes.
Arsenal and Man City are the only others and they don't look as sturdy as us. Both seem very capable of having a disastrous run.
You saw in Gykores what £55 million gets you, so a lot easier said than done.
Yeah, it was the first time I'd really seen anything of him, and he got absolutely bullied by Konsa and Pau. Contributed zero. Makes me inclined to be a bit more appreciative of Watkins.
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Considering we have been the top team since March, and the full PL table since Unai has been our manager, people should really believe we can win the league.
It's been proven over three years we're just class. It's not a freak run of form.
We absolutely can win the league this season. I'm convinced.
Time to believe 8)
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Until we've been top of the table I'm not thinking about it.
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When was the last time we were top of the table? I'm feeling a 3-2 at home to Bolton about 20 years ago, but not sure.
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https://www.premierleague.com/en/news/3830148
Found this, but I'm sure that's wrong and there's a more recent one. Forgot we'd have gone top if not for Cam Archer.
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http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/eng_prem/1620555.stm#:~:text=Aston%20Villa%20went%20top%20of,the%20top%20of%20the%20table.
Fucking knew it.
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When was the last time we were top of the table? I'm feeling a 3-2 at home to Bolton about 20 years ago, but not sure.
1998 and into early 1999. We barely won again all season.
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We were top in the live table in 2020, before Bamford got the first of his eventual hat-trick against us.
We were also top for a couple of hours in 2013 after our 3-1 opening day win at Arsenal, before Man U won 4-1 at Swansea in an evening kick-off to overtake us.
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I think we were the only side to win the first 4 but were a game behind everyone.
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I think we were the only side to win the first 4 but were a game behind everyone.
We were still top, for a bit. Leeds game was on a Friday night so we had played the same number of games as everyone else by its conclusion. Only needed a draw to go top so were in first place until they took the lead.
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I make us third most likely side to win the league. I think Man City are most likely and Arsenal have a deep squad. Both of those have a better record over the last few years getting points than we do.
But there’s not that much in it and they are both vulnerable if they lose a couple of key players.
The build uo and reaction to the game at the weekend shows how hyped one or two teams and their players are. There is a feedback loop as they are over represented and discussed in the media. The last few days has shown how outside of our fanbase people still don’t get what we are capable of.
I’m not moaning about a media conspiracy although if one day they were more balanced and informed it would be nice. But I think sometimes it makes it harder for us to judge our level against some of these overhyped teams and players. I’m beginning to realise we’ve been a lot closer than I thought.
We’re not perfect but neither are those sides around us. We’ve got vulnerabilities but so have they. I thought we’d finish above Chelsea this season and we’d finish behind Liverpool, Arsenal and Man City. I was nervous about Newcastle and Spurs under Frank. Now I’m feeling pretty confident we could stay in the top 3.
Someone in the other games thread just mentioned Bacuna, it was like a wormhole to a parallel universe. These are crazy times.
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Nope. But top 4 would be incredible. And we should not forget that. Emery is a genius. Let other people talk about us and just let’s see where we finish. Big ourselves up…..it rarely ends so well
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When was the last time we were top of the table? I'm feeling a 3-2 at home to Bolton about 20 years ago, but not sure.
1998 and into early 1999. We barely won again all season.
Is he not right about the Bolton game? 01/02, late October? Think we lost at Newcastle, 3-0 the following week. Same as it ever was.
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There is an argument that we should focus on the Premier League at the expense of everything else.
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There is an argument that we should focus on the Premier League at the expense of everything else.
It’s not just an argument, it’s exactly what Unai says we’ll be doing every season.
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There is an argument that we should focus on the Premier League at the expense of everything else.
It’s not just an argument, it’s exactly what Unai says we’ll be doing every season.
No , that isn’t exactly what he says.
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There is an argument that we should focus on the Premier League at the expense of everything else.
It’s not just an argument, it’s exactly what Unai says we’ll be doing every season.
No , that isn’t exactly what he says.
Well, no, if you want to be facetious it isn’t. Although he does say the Premier League is our priority every season and with our squad, that’ll obviously be at the expense of everything else.
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There is an argument that we should focus on the Premier League at the expense of everything else.
It’s not just an argument, it’s exactly what Unai says we’ll be doing every season.
No , that isn’t exactly what he says.
Well, no, if you want to be facetious it isn’t. Although he does say the Premier League is our priority every season and with our squad, that’ll obviously be at the expense of everything else.
I wasn’t being facetious, a good word by the way that suggests you don’t have reading difficulties.
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I’m not sure why you’re being a dick here. I was trying to say that Emery agrees with you and actually says that.
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Regardless of if we win the league (or are even still challenging by the end of the season), we have consistently been the fourth best team in the country since Emery took over. Other than C115y, Arsenal and Liverpool (and even they are wobbling now), no other team has done what we've done and been in the Champions League race solidly for the last 3 years (and had Emery taken over earlier we would probably have qualified in 22/23 too).
I think this is what pisses me off about the media coverage most of all - it is just lazy, talk of lack of squad depth and the expectation that we will eventually fall away. Given the advantages that the three teams named above have had, plus then what the likes of Chelsea, Manure, Spuds and Newcastle should also have on us than what we are doing is remarkable, but it's not an aberration - we are at least the fourth best team in England, and have been for nigh on 3 years now.
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The Opta stats predictions for end of season currently have us ending third, 6 points ahead of Chelski but behind the Arses and the money boys.
Mind you, it does predict the Dingles will end up with 21 points!!
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Regardless of if we win the league (or are even still challenging by the end of the season), we have consistently been the fourth best team in the country since Emery took over. Other than C115y, Arsenal and Liverpool (and even they are wobbling now), no other team has done what we've done and been in the Champions League race solidly for the last 3 years (and had Emery taken over earlier we would probably have qualified in 22/23 too).
I think this is what pisses me off about the media coverage most of all - it is just lazy, talk of lack of squad depth and the expectation that we will eventually fall away. Given the advantages that the three teams named above have had, plus then what the likes of Chelsea, Manure, Spuds and Newcastle should also have on us than what we are doing is remarkable, but it's not an aberration - we are at least the fourth best team in England, and have been for nigh on 3 years now.
Spot on. I'd argue Arse don't have the depth either given the media excuses for them. So what makes them more likely than is?
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Recent history suggests you've a better chance of winning the league with a Brazilian called Alysson. He'll be the final piece in our jigsaw.
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Opta predicts:
(https://i.ibb.co/WvT8hs00/Screenshot-20251209-125701-Chrome.jpg) (https://ibb.co/WvT8hs00)
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For the rest of the season, us and Wolves are going to pick-up a similar amount of points :(
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For the rest of the season, us and Wolves are going to pick-up a similar amount of points :(
Hmm. Kind of discredits the forecast eh?
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This is the predicted league table I looked at:
https://theanalyst.com/competition/premier-league/table
Which shows the actual, expected and predicted league table. Only guessing, but Eamonn's might have been after less games. Not sure though, I am shit at browsing.
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League table for the rest of the season based off that Opta table. We would be 12th.
Arse +47 points
Plop + 46
Bournemouth + 39
Citeh +38
Newcastle + 37
Spuds + 36
Chelsea + 35
Brentford + 34
Manu + 32
Brighton + 32
Palace + 31
Villa +30
Burnley+29
Fulham + 27
Wolves +27
Leeds +24
Sunderland + 23
Everton + 22
Forest + 22
West ham +20
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For the rest of the season, us and Wolves are going to pick-up a similar amount of points :(
Great spot. Great shout. Fuck Opta.
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That’s an old table. They’ve updated it since.
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That’s an old table. They’ve updated it since.
Yup, eamonn's giving us what they thought would happen back at the end of October.
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That’s an old table. They’ve updated it since.
Who, mines or Eamonn's?
Can't believe at beginning of season they expected us to be 16th?
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I predict we will get more points than Wolves in the remaining games. Feel free to check back with me in May.
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That’s an old table. They’ve updated it since.
Who, mines or Eamonn's?
Eamonn’s. The insane one.
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Not that I can be arsed to do the Swing-O-Meter thread any more, but if I could, it would have us finishing on exactly the same points as last season, 66. Which, again, would probably be touch and go for a Champions League spot but nowhere near the title.
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Regardless of if we win the league (or are even still challenging by the end of the season), we have consistently been the fourth best team in the country since Emery took over. Other than C115y, Arsenal and Liverpool (and even they are wobbling now), no other team has done what we've done and been in the Champions League race solidly for the last 3 years (and had Emery taken over earlier we would probably have qualified in 22/23 too).
I think this is what pisses me off about the media coverage most of all - it is just lazy, talk of lack of squad depth and the expectation that we will eventually fall away. Given the advantages that the three teams named above have had, plus then what the likes of Chelsea, Manure, Spuds and Newcastle should also have on us than what we are doing is remarkable, but it's not an aberration - we are at least the fourth best team in England, and have been for nigh on 3 years now.
Bang on. I caught a bit of the Stick to Football podcast last week and it really wound me up. There was a Villa fan on it and Carragher’s opening line was ‘are you in a false position?’
Like you say, we’ve been in the top 4 best teams for 3 years now and all he can come up with is that ill informed shite.
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It makes you wonder how long this needs to be maintained before those opinions would change. 10 years? Fuck knows.
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Soz, got it off social media, there was no context of it being old. The position for Bournemouth also looked odd given their "collapse" in recent weeks.
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Regardless of if we win the league (or are even still challenging by the end of the season), we have consistently been the fourth best team in the country since Emery took over. Other than C115y, Arsenal and Liverpool (and even they are wobbling now), no other team has done what we've done and been in the Champions League race solidly for the last 3 years (and had Emery taken over earlier we would probably have qualified in 22/23 too).
I think this is what pisses me off about the media coverage most of all - it is just lazy, talk of lack of squad depth and the expectation that we will eventually fall away. Given the advantages that the three teams named above have had, plus then what the likes of Chelsea, Manure, Spuds and Newcastle should also have on us than what we are doing is remarkable, but it's not an aberration - we are at least the fourth best team in England, and have been for nigh on 3 years now.
Bang on. I caught a bit of the Stick to Football podcast last week and it really wound me up. There was a Villa fan on it and Carragher’s opening line was ‘are you in a false position?’
Like you say, we’ve been in the top 4 best teams for 3 years now and all he can come up with is that ill informed shite.
I saw that and I thought the Villa bloke was embarrassing. He was talking some bollocks about the plans to build a hotel at the training ground as evidence we ought to get more coverage. He came across as a total whingeing twat to me. I was with Carragher when he interrupted him to ask, "what do you want us to say?"
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If Villa’s squad isn’t enough to win the prem, which I agree with, then it raises questions about Arsenal’s capacity to cope with injuries if two of their defenders being out means they’re going to drop points. I don’t think I’ve heard anyone making that point about them.
I remember when we lost an entire back line for months - no one gave a shit and no one in the press made excuses for us.
With all of that said, I don’t mind the Villa not being talked up anyway.
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It’s the matches where we get it all wrong (or are totally out thought), rather than close defeats, that will be our undoing.
In particular, examples like this…
Man utd
Palace x3 times
Go Ahead Eagles
Monaco
Stop these anomalies and then we’d be in with a shout. These rarely happen to champions and winners.
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Recent history suggests you've a better chance of winning the league with a Brazilian called Alysson. He'll be the final piece in our jigsaw.
That's a fact, and you can't argue with facts.
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Every side is 3 potential injuries away from a derailed season. Apart from Wolves as you can't derail an already wrecked train. That's on fire. Upside down. With emergency services ignoring it.
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It’s the matches where we get it all wrong (or are totally out thought), rather than close defeats, that will be our undoing.
In particular, examples like this…
Man utd
Palace x3 times
Go Ahead Eagles
Monaco
Stop these anomalies and then we’d be in with a shout. These rarely happen to champions and winners.
Every club has shit results, Liverpool won the league while losing to Plymouth and being made to look like fools by Forest and Fulham.
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Every side is 3 potential injuries away from a derailed season. Apart from Wolves as you can't derail an already wrecked train. That's on fire. Upside down. With emergency services ignoring it.
They can't see it, it's at the bottom of the lake. And it's still on fire.
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Every side is 3 potential injuries away from a derailed season. Apart from Wolves as you can't derail an already wrecked train. That's on fire. Upside down. With emergency services ignoring it.
They can't see it, it's at the bottom of the lake. And it's still on fire.
And Legion is driving.
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Every side is 3 potential injuries away from a derailed season. Apart from Wolves as you can't derail an already wrecked train. That's on fire. Upside down. With emergency services ignoring it.
Will it feature in Corriedale?
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Those OPTA predictions are based almost entirely on xG and xGA (expected goals and expected goals against), so it does a little calculation based on those numbers for both teams and predicts a scoreline for every game but never adjusts the underlying numbers and it isn't really taking form into account, just the numbers for the entire season.
From what I can make out there is a little more to it but really it's a pretty flawed model that doesn't add much value, and that's without considering the fact that how we've been playing is almost designed to be 2 fingers up to those underlying stats meaning it doesn't really know what to do with us. Similar predictive models have struggled with other teams (and in other sports) where they step a little too far away from following the data blindly.
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It’s the matches where we get it all wrong (or are totally out thought), rather than close defeats, that will be our undoing.
In particular, examples like this…
Man utd
Palace x3 times
Go Ahead Eagles
Monaco
Stop these anomalies and then we’d be in with a shout. These rarely happen to champions and winners.
Every club has shit results, Liverpool won the league while losing to Plymouth and being made to look like fools by Forest and Fulham.
Not to mention we should have been out of sight in the first 20 minutes against Go Ahead Eagles, so I'm not really sure how that is "getting it all wrong"
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Those OPTA predictions are based almost entirely on xG and xGA (expected goals and expected goals against), so it does a little calculation based on those numbers for both teams and predicts a scoreline for every game but never adjusts the underlying numbers and it isn't really taking form into account, just the numbers for the entire season.
From what I can make out there is a little more to it but really it's a pretty flawed model that doesn't add much value, and that's without considering the fact that how we've been playing is almost designed to be 2 fingers up to those underlying stats meaning it doesn't really know what to do with us. Similar predictive models have struggled with other teams (and in other sports) where they step a little too far away from following the data blindly.
XG and constant stat analysis is utter, utter bollocks.
For instance, if it existed at the time, I wonder what Arsenals XG would have been when they won the league in the ‘1- nil to the Arsenal’ season.
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I find the xG hate quite funny. It's fine in the medium to long term to show how generally (yes, you will get the odd anomaly) teams are doing.
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Not to mention we should have been out of sight in the first 20 minutes against Go Ahead Eagles, so I'm not really sure how that is "getting it all wrong"
I assumed because we weren't out of sight and then contrived (with the ref's help) to give them two goals from no where.
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I find the xG hate quite funny. It's fine in the medium to long term to show how generally (yes, you will get the odd anomaly) teams are doing.
The very fact that the premier league table based on XG puts us 15th in the league, proves it is utter bollocks.
The presenter on Sky for the live game the other night was getting quite upset that Villa were higher in the league that they should be based on XG.
It’s the same as our form being ‘unsustainable because we only score goals for outside the box’.
That rubbish was put to bed very quickly too.
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GAE is exactly the type of game we have regularly buggered up under Unai. A game we (the players) think should be easy, only to get caught out. We also have a habit of getting tactics wrong and receive a hiding. Newcastle, Liverpool, Spurs, Chelsea have all done it to us.
To win the league, the champions don’t tend to lose more than 5 matches - that is a massive challenge from where we are this season.
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I find the xG hate quite funny. It's fine in the medium to long term to show how generally (yes, you will get the odd anomaly) teams are doing.
The problem is that it's not designed to be this catch-all stat that can be used to perfectly predict everything which some people have tried to make it. It's a probability analysis to determine the quality of chances you're creating and that's it.
It's a one statistic that is incredibly useful to data analysts at clubs to identify things coaches should work on, amongst a whole set that most fans will never see but twats with an OPTA premium account realised that this one maps reasonably well with league placings and therefore it was something they could abuse to make all kinds of points that it doesn't support.
For example:
The very fact that the premier league table based on XG puts us 15th in the league, proves it is utter bollocks.
This is clearly a complete misuse of data, it doesn't show that and was never meant to. I'd love to spend some time with the people that created it to see how much they fucking hate this bullshit.
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Before Saturday the bookies had us at 66/1 to win the PL, we're now 28/1, which is quite a jump. Arsenal are 4/6, Man City 7/4, Chelsea 25/1 and Liverpool 25/1, obviously someone has forgotten to put a zero at the end of that figure.
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Before Saturday the bookies had us at 66/1 to win the PL, we're now 28/1, which is quite a jump. Arsenal are 4/6, Man City 7/4, Chelsea 25/1 and Liverpool 25/1, obviously someone has forgotten to put a zero at the end of that figure.
If Arsenal do their regular bottle job and City are finally punished for the 115 charges, and relegated to the Kellogs Cornflakes League, 28/1 might look decent.
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This season we've lost 1 'easy' game.
Last season it was 2, maybe 3 if anyone thinks Monaco away is easy.
It really isn't a regular occurance. Especially as the only 'easy' league we've lost last season or this is Wolves away, even as bad as ManU were a trip to OT is never easy.
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top 4 will be a tough achievement - the squad hasn't got the quality of the second half of last season.
Hopefully we can banish Elliot and Sancho in Jan and replace with quality.
We've been fortunate that Buendia and Bogarde have been useful.
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all this are we in a title race is a load of absolute bollocks because no one is at the stage of the season
We’re not even halfway through yet and that nob Gary Neville said last month it’s Arsenals title to lose, ffs he’s even played the game and he’s talking nonsense
if we’re in this position with 10 games to play then we or anyone else will then be in a title race
at the moment everyone is playing the games and positioning themselves for the end game but the end game is not in December for anyone yet
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It is a title race, and two thirds of the division are already out of it. This is all imo but everyone below 6th is already done when it comes to the title. I also dismiss ManU and Palace as unable to put the consistent run needed from now until 38. That leaves 4, and we're one of them.
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No one’s in a title race at the beginning of December
It’s just modern day media hyping bullshit
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Day 1 of the season everyone is in the title race and then the number of teams in it slowly reduces over the season.
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It's like saying the 10000m isn't a race as they're only at the 3000m mark. It is, there's already some out of contention by then but the stronger ones are still in a race for 1st.
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Let's see where we are after the Man Utd/Arsenal/Chelsea fixtures.
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Let's see where we are after the Man Utd/Arsenal/Chelsea fixtures.
…. and sodding Palace away
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I figure you need a minimum of 80 points to win, I think you need to go back to the 90s for the last time the PL Champs didn't hit at least 80. Plenty of times 80 isn't enough but that's the realistic minimum target to be a contender. So with 23 to go that's 69 points, Liverpool can do a max of 92. Are they only going to drop a max of 12 points in the last 23 games, nope imo so that's how I eliminate clubs. Look at the table and can a club still realistically hit at least 80 without a bonkers run, nope and you're out.
I only see 4 left that have the potential to hit 80.
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Not to mention we should have been out of sight in the first 20 minutes against Go Ahead Eagles, so I'm not really sure how that is "getting it all wrong"
I assumed because we weren't out of sight and then contrived (with the ref's help) to give them two goals from no where.
But I thought the original point about getting it wrong was around tactics/the manager. If it wasn't, then my mistake.
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I figure you need a minimum of 80 points to win, I think you need to go back to the 90s for the last time the PL Champs didn't hit at least 80. Plenty of times 80 isn't enough but that's the realistic minimum target to be a contender. So with 23 to go that's 69 points, Liverpool can do a max of 92. Are they only going to drop a max of 12 points in the last 23 games, nope imo so that's how I eliminate clubs. Look at the table and can a club still realistically hit at least 80 without a bonkers run, nope and you're out.
I only see 4 left that have the potential to hit 80.
Arsenal are currently averaging about 2.2pts/game, which would put the total around 84pts to win the league.
I think PWS is right, there aren’t that many clubs who are still in with a realistic chance of winning the league now. Anything between 2 and 10 depending on how confident you are in teams having a huge uptick in form.(baring in mind that they’ll have to compete with at least a couple of teams who’ll be averaging over 2pts/game)
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I even discount Palace, because of AFCON, their amount of fixtures and lack of squad. ManU have the Amorim drage factor, Everton aren't going to hit 80 and so on. Even for us to hit 82 it's 2 points a game all the way which is tough, so the clubs 5+ points behind us need to be even better than that to get there.
For me it leaves Arsenal, ManC, Chelsea and us that have a non bonkers chance of 80+. A bad month, especially for us or Chelsea right now, will massively drop our chances of it.
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Nice video. Tanswell's very good. First tine I've heard him speak and comes across well.
Interesting that they said NO EUROPEAN TEAM HAS WON MORE GAMES AT HOME THAN ASTON VILLA IN THE LAST THREE YEARS.
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His research is asking me... :P
Since the start of 23/24 we've won more European home games than anyone. Ok it's been across all 3 comps while some others are CL only but it's still pretty impressive.
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Fairly reasonable doscussion
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Were not winning the league - but if were still in the chat come march it likely means well get UCL which would be amazing considering the summer and the start of the season.
I do wonder if the planet align though - one season we could have a title charge under Unai
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We still seem to have that annoying habit of having a really good season, spread over a calendar year rather than a football season year.
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We still seem to have that annoying habit of having a really good season, spread over a calendar year rather than a football season year.
Emery likes his odd years.
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He likes making odd facial gestures and chin-stroking like an evil genius when the camera does close-ups during games.
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No. Delete thread.
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We'll piss it.
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Sign a CF in January and stay relatively injury free. We can do it.
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Find a way to get through the next 3 games in touch. I don't care how, just find a way. 1st Jan get in a top quality centre forward and right winger. IF those two things happen, I'll turn on the belief.
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H ManU
A Chelsea
A Arsenal
H Forest
A Palace
There's the test, playing them in the space of two and a half weeks.
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Sign a CF in January and stay relatively injury free. We can do it.
This.
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Still no.
If we win the next 5 games, we might do it.
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I'd still take 5th.
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Play a top team - pull something out of the bag, win.
Play a tricky midweek European tie - rotate the squad, do the minimum required to get the job done, win.
Play away, concede very early, go behind twice. Win.
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We’ve already had a say on the title race, in that we prevented Arsenal from building up a (psychologically) unassailable lead.
Now, on the back of today’s result, if we beat ManU, then we will have the opportunity to join the title race proper by getting results at both Chelsea and Arsenal.
That’s obviously a massive ask, but then challenging for the title is not supposed to be easy.
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We’ve already had a say on the title race, in that we prevented Arsenal from building up a (psychologically) unassailable lead.
Given that we beat Man City, too, surely we have had precisely zero impact on title race unless we, or a team other than Arsenal/Man City, wins it?
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We’ve already had a say on the title race, in that we prevented Arsenal from building up a (psychologically) unassailable lead.
Given that we beat Man City, too, surely we have had precisely zero impact on title race unless we, or a team other than Arsenal/Man City, wins it?
Wot it says on the tin.
Had Arsenal beaten us last week, thereby maintaining a 6-point lead over City in the wake of one of their harder fixtures, it would have been hard to see past them for the title.
As they didn’t, the race looks pretty open to me.
There are at least two horses in that race. If we can get the results listed above, we can make that a third horse.
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I thought we were already a third horse.
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H ManU
A Chelsea
A Arsenal
H Forest
A Palace
There's the test, playing them in the space of two and a half weeks.
Pau likely to be out until the Forest match as well.
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Not great news.
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H ManU
A Chelsea
A Arsenal
H Forest
A Palace
There's the test, playing them in the space of two and a half weeks.
Pau likely to be out until the Forest match as well.
Has this been told somewhere?
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That’s a massive blow if true.
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H ManU
A Chelsea
A Arsenal
H Forest
A Palace
There's the test, playing them in the space of two and a half weeks.
Pau likely to be out until the Forest match as well.
Has this been told somewhere?
Jacob Tanswell posted on Bluesky that Pau’s return is expected to take two weeks.
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Could be back for Arsenal match 🤷♂️
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From the injury, or from now?
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From the injury, or from now?
He posted it after today’s game, just over an hour ago. Emi Martinez back “this week”.
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All in all not that bad news regarding Pau and Martinez then. Pau to get some rest as Lindeløf doing ok as deputy.
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All in all not that bad news regarding Pau and Martinez then. Pau to get some rest as Lindeløf doing ok as deputy.
Agreed. Pau's arguably in our top three most important players at the moment and his absence could easily be the difference between a win and a loss in one of our next three matches.
And at the same time, him resting now could be the thing that keeps him fresh in April that means we win our FA Cup semi-final against Man Utd.
Take your silver linings where you can get 'em.
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The media make me laugh. We are one win and a couple of points worse off than where we were the same stage two years ago yet we are now being bigged up as if it's the first time we've ever been this high or in contention. Im sure we barely merited a mention of being contenders then and certainly after the Sheffield United game it was barely mentioned ever again. It was the same 98-99 when they clearly forgot the title challenges of 90 and 93. I just cant comprehend it this year. What's changed? Were we seen as a flash in the pan two years ago?
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The media make me laugh. We are one win and a couple of points worse off than where we were the same stage two years ago yet we are now being bigged up as if it's the first time we've ever been this high or in contention. Im sure we barely merited a mention of being contenders then and certainly after the Sheffield United game it was barely mentioned ever again.
I think it's just your memory playing tricks on you. It was about the same:
Aston Villa are title contenders – and Unai Emery knows it
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2023/12/18/aston-villa-title-contenders-unai-emery-premier-league/
Aston Villa's Title Challenge Starts Now
https://www.forbes.com/sites/zakgarnerpurkis/2023/12/31/aston-villas-title-challenge-starts-now/
Aston Villa confirms status as unlikely Premier League title contender
https://www.cnn.com/2023/12/10/sport/aston-villa-premier-league-title-contender-spt-intl
Aston Villa Can Dream of Premier League Title Glory
https://theanalyst.com/articles/aston-villa-premier-league-title-chance
Are Villa title contenders? Only in 1980-81, when they last won the title, have Aston Villa taken more points after 16 games of a top-flight season
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/67598695
From relegation candidates to title contenders
https://www.heraldscotland.com/sport/uk-sport/23981931.relegation-candidates-title-contenders---unai-emerys-impact-villa/
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Maybe we've learnt from that experience in 2023? Maybe we are the real deal now?
-
Maybe we've learnt from that experience in 2023? Maybe we are the real deal now?
I was thinking this the other day. We were wet behind the ears wth playing in Europe then, we're seasoned veterens now.
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Obviously injuries can't be scoped for, but I genuinely think we won't be losing too many in the second half of the season through our players being knackered. Although if Kamara had stayed fit all that season we probably won't have been as bad either.
-
H ManU
A Chelsea
A Arsenal
H Forest
A Palace
There's the test, playing them in the space of two and a half weeks.
It looks like we're laughing in the face of our opponents.
-
We were actually pretty poor that calendar year, relative to this one and the year that preceded it. Kamara did his ACL in February. Go figure.
-
H ManU
A Chelsea
A Arsenal
H Forest
A Palace
There's the test, playing them in the space of two and a half weeks.
It looks like we're laughing in the face of our opponents.
Only until the Man U match. After that, we will be engaging in Alan Partridge impressions or proclaiming our admiration for a Norwegian pop combo.
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Stat heavy article on ESPN
https://www.espn.co.uk/football/story/_/id/47333295/aston-villa-couldnt-crowned-premier-league-champions-they
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3rd at Christmas, whatever happens this weekend.
Impressive doesn’t begin to describe it.
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Talking to an Albion fan today. He was old, guessing 60s/70s.
He said, "When I was younger the Albion didn't have the same rivalry with Wolves. It was Villa back then, I've never really liked Villa but I say fair play to them, I think you've got a real, genuine chance to win the league this season."
Was full of praise for Unai too.
Made me feel all warm and fuzzy inside 8)
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Talking to an Albion fan today. He was old, guessing 60s/70s.
He said, "When I was younger the Albion didn't have the same rivalry with Wolves. It was Villa back then, I've never really liked Villa but I say fair play to them, I think you've got a real, genuine chance to win the league this season."
Was full of praise for Unai too.
Made me feel all warm and fuzzy inside 8)
It’s definitely the more historic derby. 3 FA Cup finals, and (I think) the first reported outbreak of football hooliganism, at the site of a social club called the Calthorpe. Note: not the Calthorpe Arms at the bottom of Wood Lane, which is still open and bedecked in Villa memorabilia.
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Nice.
Btw he also rates Watkins highly and said Blues will 100% get the stadium built so just something to consider.
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60s is old? Why, you little smirker...
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Talking to an Albion fan today. He was old, guessing 60s/70s.
He said, "When I was younger the Albion didn't have the same rivalry with Wolves. It was Villa back then, I've never really liked Villa but I say fair play to them, I think you've got a real, genuine chance to win the league this season."
Was full of praise for Unai too.
Made me feel all warm and fuzzy inside 8)
Funny that, I was out with my old school mates in town last night for annual xmas drink. Quite a few of them are Albion fans and a couple of them, were a little disturbed by their own convictions that we are going to win the league
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Albion was certainly a bigger game for us in 81 than Blues!!
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Albion was certainly a bigger game for us in 81 than Blues!!
Brendan Batson.
-
Albion was certainly a bigger game for us in 81 than Blues!!
Brendan Batson.
Billy Corkhill
Vince Hilaire
-
Albion was certainly a bigger game for us in 81 than Blues!!
Brendan Batson.
What a back pass!
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60s is old? Why, you little smirker...
Yes imo.
Not elderly but old.
Still probably independent but definitely getting on.
Some parts might need replacing but overall the unit should run for a few more years yet.
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Talking to an Albion fan today. He was old, guessing 60s/70s.
He said, "When I was younger the Albion didn't have the same rivalry with Wolves. It was Villa back then, I've never really liked Villa but I say fair play to them, I think you've got a real, genuine chance to win the league this season."
Was full of praise for Unai too.
Made me feel all warm and fuzzy inside 8)
Funny that, I was out with my old school mates in town last night for annual xmas drink. Quite a few of them are Albion fans and a couple of them, were a little disturbed by their own convictions that we are going to win the league
Maybe a Baggies ploy to delude us so they can laugh more if we don't do it?
-
Talking to an Albion fan today. He was old, guessing 60s/70s.
He said, "When I was younger the Albion didn't have the same rivalry with Wolves. It was Villa back then, I've never really liked Villa but I say fair play to them, I think you've got a real, genuine chance to win the league this season."
Was full of praise for Unai too.
Made me feel all warm and fuzzy inside 8)
Funny that, I was out with my old school mates in town last night for annual xmas drink. Quite a few of them are Albion fans and a couple of them, were a little disturbed by their own convictions that we are going to win the league
Maybe a Baggies ploy to delude us so they can laugh more if we don't do it?
It was a little like our collective anxiety when playing man Utd, they feel the same about us potentially winning the league. All fun.
-
Albion was certainly a bigger game for us in 81 than Blues!!
Brendan Batson.
Billy Corkhill
Vince Hilaire
Hello hello hello
-
Albion was certainly a bigger game for us in 81 than Blues!!
Brendan Batson.
What a back pass!
My first ever game
-
We're coming.
-
H ManU
A Chelsea
A Arsenal
H Forest
A Palace
There's the test, playing them in the space of two and a half weeks.
First one down.
-
A win and draw from the next two would be sexy and delicious.
-
One thing I've not seen mentioned yet, after last season and how our goal difference screwed us - we have now have fourth best goal difference in the league, six ahead of the fifth best.
Last season we were joint ninth best.
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https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/videos/cd9z5qlveq1o
Nedum Onuoha was twisting himself into some knots wasn't he during this.
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Not surel about the Prem, but what are our chancex of making the Champions League next season?
From the 2014/15 season to the conclusion of the 2023/24 season, teams have needed between 66 and 76 points to get into the top four. These are the points tallies from those campaigns:
66 points – 2015/16, 2019/20
67 points – 2020/21
68 points – 2023/24
70 points – 2014/15
71 points – 2018/19, 2021/22, 2022/23
75 points – 2017/18
76 points – 2016/17
Within this decade-long sample, the average points for top 4 Premier League places come in at 70.1 points. So, to get into the top bracket in the modern league, teams need to aim for at least 70 points more often than not.
We've got 36pts already, leaving 34pts required from our remaining 21 games.
11 wins and a draw.
We've got 10 home games left at Fortress Villa Park.
10 more games like today's shitty, xG deficient, piss poor performance (according to the nasayers) and 4 juicy/scabby draws away from home might just do the job.
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And this season 5th will do it again most likely. Which gives us a bit more of a cushion.
-
I actually think it will be less points this year than normal, as teams are a lot more competitive (apart from Wolves).
Even newly promoted sides have been decent.
-
Based on results so far, we are still one point worse than last season, when we missed out on the Champions League on goal difference.
-
Based on results so far, we are still one point worse than last season, when we missed out on the Champions League on goal difference.
We just need to win at Palace or Newcastle to turn the tide.
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A draw in our next game would bring us up to zero.
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And realise it isn't last season.
Being realistic we won't win the league, and if that is the case then the main thing is qualify for the CL. I don't see 5 better teams in this league, although we saw with the bench today that some injuries can alter things. That goes for a title challenge as well. Everyone is 3 key injuries away from a season going to shit.
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I think we'll beat Chelsea but draw with Arsenal.
Really think we have a chance. Momentum is a big part of success and we've got it. We're like a snowball that keeps rolling and gaining mass.
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The key will be how we react to a setback when it inevitably comes.
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And realise it isn't last season.
Being realistic we won't win the league, and if that is the case then the main thing is qualify for the CL. I don't see 5 better teams in this league, although we saw with the bench today that some injuries can alter things. That goes for a title challenge as well. Everyone is 3 key injuries away from a season going to shit.
Exactly right, its all about the Champions League now, its about signing the right players in January to make sure that happens, for me finishing top 4, maybe third is pretty much as good as it can be.
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Whenever I look at the table the first place I look is always 6th place. I imagine I'll be doing this until about March, then, who knows?
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I think we'll beat Chelsea but draw with Arsenal.
Really think we have a chance. Momentum is a big part of success and we've got it. We're like a snowball that keeps rolling and gaining mass.
We've got enough of a cushion at the moment where draws would be good results if we're aiming to finish in the top four. If you've got genuine designs on winning the league then Winning games against those around you are key.
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Based on results so far, we are still one point worse than last season, when we missed out on the Champions League on goal difference.
We just need to win at Palace or Newcastle to turn the tide.
Or Molineux
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Our next 4 away matches will be key. We need at least 5 points from them. Big ask.
-
We’re making defensive and attacking mistakes in recent games and still winning. That’s a seriously good sign.
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A seriously good sign is that we are not having major injury disruptions as we have had in previous seasons. That’s in part must go down to how Emery manages games. That’s my theory anyway.
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I’ve just enjoyed looking at the league table and us being near the top rather than with the hoi polloi. Dunno how long that’ll last, but hopefully a bit longer as it’s rather good fun.
Just going back to saddvillan’s post … for 5th place, over the last 10 seasons it’s averaged 66pts with a low of 62pts and a high iirc of 70pts.
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I’ve just enjoyed looking at the league table and us being near the top rather than with the hoi polloi. Dunno how long that’ll last, but hopefully a bit longer as it’s rather good fun.
Just going back to saddvillan’s post … for 5th place, over the last 10 seasons it’s averaged 66pts with a low of 62pts and a high iirc of 70pts.
Spot on Algy 65-66 points is the number we need for 5th . So just another 10 wins and we're there.
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We’re making defensive and attacking mistakes in recent games and still winning. That’s a seriously good sign.
A seriously good sign is that we are not having major injury disruptions as we have had in previous seasons. That’s in part must go down to how Emery manages games. That’s my theory anyway.
See, wouldn't it also be a good sign if we were just playing really well with no mistakes, or had loads of injuries but were third anyway?
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I see what you’re saying Monty, but form can be streaky. If we start playing to our very top level more often (the run we’ve been on is amazing of course, I’m not saying otherwise), we have a chance of doing something generationally great. Injuries absolutely key too.
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The goal is champions league - anything more is a bonus 🙌
Would love finishing in top 4 and winning europa thats the dream
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The goal is champions league - anything more is a bonus 🙌
Would love finishing in top 4 and winning europa thats the dream
Agreed. And after the weekend results we'll still go into 2026 in third, even if we lose the next two games. If we could only take points from one of the upcoming games it would be against Chelsea.
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We’re making defensive and attacking mistakes in recent games and still winning. That’s a seriously good sign.
We have been relying on Rogers scoring crackers last two games and thats not sustainable if it continues.
Nice break now to Chelsea to reassess things. Hopefully Torres is back fit.
Not sure what options we have to change things up front.
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If they introduce three points for a win Ipswich will do it.
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The goal is champions league - anything more is a bonus 🙌
Would love finishing in top 4 and winning europa thats the dream
Agreed. And after the weekend results we'll still go into 2026 in third, even if we lose the next two games. If we could only take points from one of the upcoming games it would be against Chelsea.
Its the key the CL revenue as that massively helps emery bring players on. I still have reservations at our squad depth so im hopeful we can add a few come January then we are in a good position to sustain the challenge
Agree dick. If i had a choice its beat chelsea than arsenal as that massively extends the gap to 4th.
Would be amazing if we finished 3rd or higher
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Aston Villa's surge towards the top end of the Premier League table continues to challenge some of football's most trusted underlying metrics.
Unai Emery's side have now scored 27 goals this season, the sixth-highest tally in the league, despite ranking just 11th for total shots (197). On the surface, those numbers appear contradictory, but they speak to a team extracting maximum value from the chances they do create.
Villa's expected goals (xG) of 18.56 ranks 14th in the division, meaning they have scored over eight goals more than expected - one of the largest positive differentials in the league. Their shot conversion rate of 13.7%, the fourth-best in the Premier League, underlines that clinical edge.
The same pattern emerges when looking at chance creation. Villa sit 13th for expected assists from open play (xA) with 11.3, reinforcing the idea that they are not consistently overwhelming opponents with volume or territorial dominance. Instead, they are selective, direct and decisive.
There is, however, a defensive structure that allows that efficiency to matter.
While Villa's expected goals against (xGA) stands at 23.34, placing them around the middle of the pack, the quality of chances they concede tells a different story. Their xG on target conceded of 18.30 is the third-best in the league, highlighting how effectively they limit high-quality shots and force opponents into less threatening positions.
That balance - conceding chances but controlling their danger - has been a hallmark of Emery's best sides. Villa may allow attempts, but they rarely allow opponents to feel comfortable.
The question, inevitably, is sustainability.
Historically, teams that outperform xG by this margin tend to regress unless elite finishing or repeatable patterns are involved. Villa's efficiency has been driven by moments of individual quality, intelligent movement between the lines and rapid attacking transitions rather than sheer volume.
What strengthens their case is that the overperformance is not one-dimensional. It is supported by defensive control, game management and an ability to win tight moments - all traits associated with teams that remain competitive over long stretches of a season.
As Villa prepare for pivotal fixtures against Chelsea and Arsenal, the numbers frame the debate neatly. They are not winning because they dominate every metric - they are winning because they dominate the moments that matter.
And in a league increasingly driven by fine margins, that may prove just as valuable as statistical supremacy.
(https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/ace/standard/794/cpsprodpb/f120/live/6836fab0-df1b-11f0-a8dc-93c15fe68710.png.webp)
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Our season arguably started at home to Fulham (or maybe away at Sunderland), I'd like to see the stats since then.
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The next two games could be an indicator if we're serious title contenders or just in the hunt for Top 5.
At some point, we've got to break out of the 'just thankful to be here' mentality, and upgrade to 'We're as good as this lot, lets try and win it'. Neither team above us has taken a point off us this season, so on that fact alone, we HAVE to be in the race. If we win at Chelsea, we're TEN points clear of them. If we keep it going and do Arsenal next week...... HAPPY NEW YEAR FOLKS!
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Our season arguably started at home to Fulham (or maybe away at Sunderland), I'd like to see the stats since then.
That was a massive point that Onuoha was missing the other day when he was like "Villa have done a great run but are still third". We gave Plop a 12 point lead, Arse, Spurs and Bournemouth 7 points on us, and Chelsea and Citeh 5 and 4 respectively. We are now 3 behind Arse, 1 behind Citeh and currently staring at a 7 point gap down to Chelsea/Plop.
It was also a shit take from him when the table since Emery started was shown and we were fourth with the host stating "considering our resources" and he just pointed at the three teams who have done better not even acknowledging the expenditure they have done just this season compared to us, let alone the other seasons previously.
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We won't win the league but will have a very good season. It'll be another top 5 season for the champions league and we'll finish either 3rd or 4th.
Well also win the Europa League too so all good fun.
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Comparing results so far this year with equivalent games last season (swapped the relegated and promoted teams).
So far we're three points to the good.
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I last saw that stat after 5 games and it was about -10. I honestly thought we'd completely fucked it, as where were those points, plus the extra we needed to improve on sixth, going to come from?
Turns out the answer was "just win every game, mate".
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The name of the game is to stay in touch with City and Arsenal over the next 10 games, when the “race” becomes the “run-in”.
To do that, I think we need to pick up points in both of the next two matches, or win one of them.
It’s a big ask, as they are incredibly tough games. But we’ve won at both grounds in recent years, so why not?
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I'd be ok with a draw at Arsenal but a win at Chelsea would be massive.
4 points would see us at 40points after half the season despite an awful first 4 games where we couldn't put together an attack.
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I'd be ok with a draw at Arsenal but a win at Chelsea would be massive.
But would you take two draws or a win and a loss? I'd be tempted by the latter if it meant wining at Arsenal, but would be happy with two draws.
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I’d take a win and a defeat over two draws, yes.
I can see benefits to both win scenarios.
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A win at Chelsea would be huge psychologically, and would probably unsettle Arsenal a bit. No reason to fear them, neither will be looking forward to playing us.
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I'd be ok with a draw at Arsenal but a win at Chelsea would be massive.
But would you take two draws or a win and a loss? I'd be tempted by the latter if it meant wining at Arsenal, but would be happy with two draws.
I would take 2 draws over a win and a loss. I'm going to be really annoyed after we beat Chelsea.
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I’m in the win and a loss camp. Feel Chelsea is always a weird one for us, we’re either really good or really poor with not a lot in between. Let’s hope it’s one of the really good performances down there. I’d prefer to be going to Arsenal with either a win or a draw under our belts and then park the bus at the Emirates.
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I’d prefer to be going to Arsenal with either a win or a draw under our belts and then park the bus at the Emirates.
With Chrissy Price breaking away with five minutes to go and slotting it in the corner.
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I’d prefer to be going to Arsenal with either a win or a draw under our belts and then park the bus at the Emirates.
With Chrissy Price breaking away with five minutes to go and slotting it in the corner.
Still the benchmark for absolutely mental celebrations in the away end for me.
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I’m in the win and a loss camp. Feel Chelsea is always a weird one for us, we’re either really good or really poor with not a lot in between. Let’s hope it’s one of the really good performances down there. I’d prefer to be going to Arsenal with either a win or a draw under our belts and then park the bus at the Emirates.
I'm in the win both camp to be honest. If we want to win the league, which - putting aside how that is - we do, then we have to keep winning, game after game after game. We've done more than enough over the past 3 or so seasons to prove that we can beat anyone except Crystal Palace - home or away. It's now time to do that consistently.
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I'd be ok with a draw at Arsenal but a win at Chelsea would be massive.
But would you take two draws or a win and a loss? I'd be tempted by the latter if it meant wining at Arsenal, but would be happy with two draws.
Avoiding defeat is the most important thing in games against the teams around us so I'd accept 2 draws easier than a win and a loss, despite it being fewer points.
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It depends who we consider our main rivals I guess. I think Man City are most likely to win the league. Two draws means we only get 2 points and we drop 4 though we don't lose any ground on either. Arse or Chelsea. A win and a loss means we drop 3 points, lose out to one of the teams we've played, and gain a good amount on the other. So, if it's a choice, a win against Arsenal and loss to Chelsea is preferable to a draw against both. A win against Chelsea and loss to Arsenal, means the pack can close on us a bit and the top 2 will stretch the advantage.
Just go and win them both, but mostly Arsenal.
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I'd be ok with a draw at Arsenal but a win at Chelsea would be massive.
But would you take two draws or a win and a loss? I'd be tempted by the latter if it meant wining at Arsenal, but would be happy with two draws.
Avoiding defeat is the most important thing in games against the teams around us so I'd accept 2 draws easier than a win and a loss, despite it being fewer points.
Yeah, one fewer point for us but two fewer for one of them
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I’m getting royally fucked off with commentators and pundits.
Now it’s the fact we have a ‘tough run’ with Chelsea and Arsenal coming up. So what ? They won’t relish playing us either. We are not plucky underdogs playing above our station.
The last time I looked we were 7 points clear of Chelsea and virtually on par with Arsenal having just beaten them.
The only ‘positive’ coverage always feels a bit patronising and generally contains the word ‘but’ !
I would love it. Love it, if we took 6 points from those 2 games,.
Even then I’m sure it would be seen as unsustainable.
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The transfer window could be a game-changer.
A striker and a right-winger to take some minutes from SJM and keep him fresh.
If we get a couple in who hit the ground running, who knows?
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I think we can only spend 70% of our revenue on the squad for UEFA competitions this season? It’s getting tougher.
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I think we can only spend 70% of our revenue on the squad for UEFA competitions this season? It’s getting tougher.
But that's on last years revenue isn’t it? Which is fine thanks to Duran and the Champions League run. So we could.
Problem is how that then develops into next year, when we won't have those positives bits in the accounts for 25/26.
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I think we can only spend 70% of our revenue on the squad for UEFA competitions this season? It’s getting tougher.
But that's on last years revenue isn’t it? Which is fine thanks to Duran and the Champions League run. So we could.
Problem is how that then develops into next year, when we won't have those positives bits in the accounts for 25/26.
Honestly Dave, I have no idea. The whole thing makes my tiny brain hurt so I’m quite reactionary in binning the whole thing off: firstly because I don’t understand it and the limits seem totally arbitrary, and secondly because it’s quite clearly put in place to stymie disruptive competition.
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I reckon if we can win or at least get to the Final of the Europa League the projected revenue gap vs the CL season would be about £30-£40m rather than the Armageddon of £50m+ some were predicting. But I’m an optimist so we’ll see. The Deloitte report is usually out in January so we’ll have a better idea then.
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I'd be ok with a draw at Arsenal but a win at Chelsea would be massive.
But would you take two draws or a win and a loss? I'd be tempted by the latter if it meant wining at Arsenal, but would be happy with two draws.
Avoiding defeat is the most important thing in games against the teams around us so I'd accept 2 draws easier than a win and a loss, despite it being fewer points.
Yeah, one fewer point for us but two fewer for one of them
This is crazy talk, in my opinion.
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IMO, finishing in the CL places for us is an amazing achievement on its own considering we’re competing against at least 6/7 clubs who make loads more money than we do.
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I refuse to look at this or even consider it and I have come over to tell you that.
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More xG bollocks - this time from The Athletic
CAN ASTON VILLA CONTINUE TO OVERPERFORM?
Morgan Rogers has been on a goalscoring rampage in December, with two excellent finishes against Manchester United complementing his brace against West Ham United the previous week.
Rogers’ technique to strike the ball is as good as any Premier League player, with no player scoring more than his three goals from outside the penalty area. Sunday’s first goal stood out in particular, and it is hardly surprising that no player has outperformed their expected goals (xG) more than Rogers this season (seven goals from 2.8 xG).
“It’s hard work, it’s long hours — and you want every one to go in the top corner like that, so it’s nice when one does go in,” he said after the game on Sunday. “You’ve just got to keep trying it and trying it, and sometimes it’s your day, sometimes it isn’t. Luckily, lately it has been, and I’m happy about that.”
Elite finishing can win you games, but it taps into a broader trend at Aston Villa this season. They are among the biggest xG overperformers in both boxes, which looks unlikely to continue at the same rate.
Villa fans should rightfully be celebrating their third-place position going into the Christmas period. Unai Emery’s side are robust, physical, and strong in transition, and being so well-drilled will undoubtedly be a key factor in their continued success.
It is just that their underlying numbers don’t match that league position. Looking at their xG difference per game — which accounts for the quality of chances created and conceded — can give a good indication of how they compare to others within the Premier League.
Their -0.22 xG difference per game is among the bottom half of teams — meaning each game is near enough a coin flip in the likelihood of victory each week.
Contrast their spot in the table, and the difference is stark.
The truth likely lies somewhere in the middle. Aston Villa’s push for a Champions League spot looks more than achievable, and Emery’s side should be unapologetic in performing above expectations after 10 consecutive wins in all competitions.
It is simply that the underlying numbers suggest this might not be sustainable. Talk of a title push might just be a little overzealous.
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We simply do not have the depth to win the league - we are a couple injuries away from having to draft in relatively inexperienced players (see the bench this weekend), whereas Arsenal / City / Chelsea have that strength.
But top 4 would be an amazing achievement, and continue the climb/momentum under UE.
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We can dream while we're up there but right now the gap we're putting between us and the teams below is hopefully helping towards CL qualification.
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I hope for the sake of mankind I hope we consign this xG bollocks to history by continuing to undermine the numbers with victories while playing well below the respected level.
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We can dream while we're up there but right now the gap we're putting between us and the teams below is hopefully helping towards CL qualification.
This to me is the biggest benefit to the current run. A title challenge is lovely while we can continue to dream about it, but realistically, our form isn't going to continue indefinitely with significant runs of consecutive wins - so from a club-building perspective, I want us to win a trophy, and qualify for the Champions League. It looks like 5th will be good enough again, and we're currently 9 points clear of 6th - which is a great buffer to have. Had we lost to Man Utd, that buffer would have been down to 4 points - that's how significant that result was for us.
I'll continue to enjoy our run for as long as possible, and revel in our unlikely title challenge, but I'll do it while keeping one eye on the gap to 6th...
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We simply do not have the depth to win the league - we are a couple injuries away from having to draft in relatively inexperienced players (see the bench this weekend), whereas Arsenal / City / Chelsea have that strength.
But top 4 would be an amazing achievement, and continue the climb/momentum under UE.
I’m not sure you can state something with such certainty then use something that might not happen as evidence.
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We can loan/sign a couple more players in 8 days time.
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A win at Chelsea would put us miles clear of them, and also put fuel on the fire of what is going on with Maresca and those above him. People talking about us being disruptors/agitators of the top four haven't been following the league much, as we have been amongst it for a while now. Liverpool losing Isak and Salah playing up/looking off it is also a bonus. For me Man City signing Cherki is a bit of a gamechanger for them, and I would expect them to go clear in the new year. The only way we could win the league is if we had another mad January window and bring in 2 real quality players, and be lucky with injuries. No reason we can't be top 3.
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Re revenue, match tickets for Forest seem to be from £71 (North Stand) and up... that's surely higher than the last two seasons for the same game? Has it gone up by a Category level or are match-day tickets this season just generally higher?
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It was seventy odd for Bournemouth, too.
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At the moment injuries are not a problem and within reason we can rotate with the Prem and Europa. When Unai makes subs they tend to make a positive impact despite looking weaker on paper. It looks like we won't be able to really strengthen in Jan compared to those around us so realistically our hope of maintaining a challenge is a fit and healthy squad with Unai rotating as cleverly as possible. It is odd how every pundit has praised Villa and Unai but then says we are not as good as City or Arsenal despite beating both of them. The latest narrative to explain our success, after long range goals is being a one man 'Morgan Rogers, team. Should we continue to challenge it would be a real miracle and we can all but dream...
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I’d prefer to be going to Arsenal with either a win or a draw under our belts and then park the bus at the Emirates.
With Chrissy Price breaking away with five minutes to go and slotting it in the corner.
Still the benchmark for absolutely mental celebrations in the away end for me.
And the Tony Daley one in Easter 93 similar!
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A repeat of the Chrissy Price goal late on after frustrating Arsenal for 85 mins would be wonderful..
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I’d prefer a Tony Moon type goal.
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We simply do not have the depth to win the league - we are a couple injuries away from having to draft in relatively inexperienced players (see the bench this weekend), whereas Arsenal / City / Chelsea have that strength.
But top 4 would be an amazing achievement, and continue the climb/momentum under UE.
Then why is Liverpool losing Salah & Isak such a big deal for them if they’ve such a strong squad?
Fuck it, no self pity here - we’ve got a bloody good squad. Yes, we’ll have problems if the ‘wrong’ players get injured, but so does literally every other team in the league.
No excuses. We are, as it stands, the 3rd best team in the country and it’s a very fine margin between us and 1st place. A single result going our way in the first 5 games would see us level with them for example - it’s far from unthinkable that we could’ve been top now if it hadn’t been for the disruptive summer.
Just beat these clowns and get on with winning the remaining 19 league games afterwards, whoever they’re against. That’s how you win the league, and we are in a position where it’s still a realistic ambition. If we don’t do it, we don’t do it, but we may as well enjoy the ride until we’re forced to get off.
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[...]
Aston Villa’s push for a Champions League spot looks more than achievable, and Emery’s side should be unapologetic in performing above expectations after 10 consecutive wins in all competitions.
It is simply that the underlying numbers suggest this might not be sustainable.
I really don't see what's so bollocks about this. Is it really so crazy to suggest that 10 games unbeaten is performing above our exected level? At the start of the season did any of us expect this s
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[...]
Aston Villa’s push for a Champions League spot looks more than achievable, and Emery’s side should be unapologetic in performing above expectations after 10 consecutive wins in all competitions.
It is simply that the underlying numbers suggest this might not be sustainable.
I really don't see what's so bollocks about this. Is it really so crazy to suggest that 10 games unbeaten is performing above our expected level? At the start of the season did any of us expect this squad to be where it is?
If the next 10 games see us win only 5 - a 'regression', as it were - it would still have us gunning for champions league. Something we'd all have snatched your hand off, if offered at the beginning of the season.
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Citeh are emerging as the strongest team and squad,although I think they are still heavily reliant on Haaland. I am not convinced by Arsenal, they just seem like they are destined to fall short. Chelsea mid summer exploits and boardroom shenanigans will mean they run out of steam.
For us stay in contention we will need a couple of astute recruits, be lucky with injuries and give up on all other competitions.
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The last 4 in the league Cup are the current holders plus 3 of the current top 4 with only Villa not involved. All 4 are in this year's champions league too. So they are competing in champions league, Premier league, league Cup and still likely to have a good go at the fa cup. Proof that you do not have to sacrifice any competition. Go for every game every time and try to win everything. Can we win the Premier league? Yes. Of course we can. We can beat all 4 of that lot.
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Man City signing Semenyo now apparently… that’s nice for them because their squad is so paper thin. Great they have the headroom too.
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The last 4 in the league Cup are the current holders plus 3 of the current top 4 with only Villa not involved. All 4 are in this year's champions league too. So they are competing in champions league, Premier league, league Cup and still likely to have a good go at the fa cup. Proof that you do not have to sacrifice any competition. Go for every game every time and try to win everything. Can we win the Premier league? Yes. Of course we can. We can beat all 4 of that lot.
They have significantly deeper squads.
We are having to use Sancho and Guessand, we have Watkins carrying an injury.
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Man City signing Semenyo now apparently… that’s nice for them because their squad is so paper thin. Great they have the headroom too.
Yeah, I forgot to mention that the rest all have transfer capacity that we can get nowhere near.
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In all honesty I think City will go on to win it. Like our goals from outside the box, Arsenal's over reliance on set piece goals is unsustainable. But nobody questions that statistic. When it comes to the crunch, they just don't have it in them.
Finishing in the top 4-5 would be an incredible achievement, given the start we had & the restrictions the football authorities have put on us.
Like this time last year we need more attacking options. If we can do that, then who knows. Maybe we'll be playing at Man City on the last day to win the league. Emery can perform miracles of that I'm certain.
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In all honesty I think City will go on to win it. Like our goals from outside the box, Arsenal's over reliance on set piece goals is unsustainable. But nobody questions that statistic. When it comes to the crunch, they just don't have it in them.
Finishing in the top 4-5 would be an incredible achievement, given the start we had & the restrictions the football authorities have put on us.
Like this time last year we need more attacking options. If we can do that, then who knows. Maybe we'll be playing at Man City on the last day to win the league. Emery can perform miracles of that I'm certain.
Yep, given the disaster of the last day of last season, and the summer of transfer inactivity it led to, qualifying for the Champions League THIS season would be a huge achievement. I'd still like a trophy (wouldn't we all), but finishing in the top 4/5 after the summer we had, and the start we stumbled through, would be incredible.
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No excuses for Arsenal this season, simply have to get it done.
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No excuses for Arsenal this season, simply have to get it done.
It's going to be hilarious if they don't. Still, they might win the Carabao Cup.
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Arsenal never(apart from that one time) win the League Cup.
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Darragh AKA The Menace from The Chase has given his opinion - https://x.com/FootballJOE/status/2003890919284564397
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Liverpool last season could've won the league with about 72 points.
If it was around that figure (75 points) I absolutely think we could win it given how strong we are at home year in year out.
However think Man. City and Arsenal will both be in 85-90 point range so to get up to that we can't afford to drop more than 15 points so that would be beyond us.
3rd and winning the Europa league would be our best season since 1982 and that should be a realistic target with the squad and manager in place.
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Liverpool last season could've won the league with about 72 points.
If it was around that figure (75 points) I absolutely think we could win it given how strong we are at home year in year out.
However think Man. City and Arsenal will both be in 85-90 point range so to get up to that we can't afford to drop more than 15 points so that would be beyond us.
3rd and winning the Europa league would be our best season since 1982 and that should be a realistic target with the squad and manager in place.
I'm not sure what will be needed this year, us and Man City are in great form at the minute after both being a bit off it at the start of the season whereas Arsenal seem to be wobbling a little recently.
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need to still be in touch after the Xmas/new year fixtures, and assuming the other two are involved in all competitions who knows what could happen
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Liverpool last season could've won the league with about 72 points.
If it was around that figure (75 points) I absolutely think we could win it given how strong we are at home year in year out.
However think Man. City and Arsenal will both be in 85-90 point range so to get up to that we can't afford to drop more than 15 points so that would be beyond us.
3rd and winning the Europa league would be our best season since 1982 and that should be a realistic target with the squad and manager in place.
I'm not sure what will be needed this year, us and Man City are in great form at the minute after both being a bit off it at the start of the season whereas Arsenal seem to be wobbling a little recently.
This season has a very similar feel to 23/24 currently.
Two years ago we had the chance to go top for Xmas if we'd beaten Sheffield United. We didn't and then had a dodgy spell up to end of February, only won two out of seven prem games.
End of that season we were 21 points off second place:
1st Man. City- 91 points
2nd Arsenal - 89 points
Liverpool had a slump end of the season with Klopp going but still got 82 points.
I'd be surprised if the league winners this year won it with fewer than 85 points tbh. If Arsenal beat us and Brighton they'll be on 45 points at halfway point and played most of their tough away fixtures already.
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Darragh AKA The Menace from The Chase has given his opinion - https://x.com/FootballJOE/status/2003890919284564397
Feckin' gobshite (Darragh, not you).
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It's quite the same for me, that year there were effectively 4 'races', the top 3, one for Europe involving 4th-8th, midtable from 9th to 16th and then a 4 team relegation battle and those groups were largely visible by game 17 with the only changes being that we dropped off, Man City had a ridiculous run of form and Chelsea pulled out of midtable into the European places.
This season is very different in the middle section. There's still a top 3 and the relegation battle is now a bottom 3 who all look doomed already but after that there's only 11 points between 4th and 17th and only 7 points if cast off Leeds and Forest at the bottom as a little sub group. In that way the league is more like 15/16 where you had a very congested midtable (this season is even worse than that one was).
However regardless of that I just don't think Arsenal in particular will go on the sort of run needed to get to 90points. Man City are flying (just like us) but defeats to us and Newcastle and sketchy wins against Leeds and Fulham make me think there's enough defensive frailty there to see them drop points unexpectedly. I think both will get 80-85 points and I think we can manage similar, especially if we can get the couple of reinforcements we really need.
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Let's hope it is like 2015-16 when a team nobody thought would win the league did, and 81 points was enough to win it. 67 points would have been enough to claim 4th spot outright.
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I'd bite your hand off for a points total beginning with a 7
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I'd bite your hand off for a points total beginning with a 7
You need to head to Molineux Mix. They're hoping for the same thing.
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I'd bite your hand off for a points total beginning with a 7
You need to head to Molineux Mix. They're hoping for the same thing.
:)
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I'd bite your hand off for a points total beginning with a 7
You need to head to Molineux Mix. They're hoping for the same thing.
I think their hopeless wish is 3, ATM.
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Let's hope it is like 2015-16 when a team nobody thought would win the league did, and 81 points was enough to win it. 67 points would have been enough to claim 4th spot outright.
In 2015/16 Leicester were up against spurs ....yes spursy Hotspur and 115y had really fallen away. This time 115y are on the rise and Arsenal are still strong.
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Let's hope it is like 2015-16 when a team nobody thought would win the league did, and 81 points was enough to win it. 67 points would have been enough to claim 4th spot outright.
In 2015/16 Leicester were up against spurs ....yes spursy Hotspur and 115y had really fallen away. This time 115y are on the rise and Arsenal are still strong.
115 were only on about 67 at that point.
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Let's hope it is like 2015-16 when a team nobody thought would win the league did, and 81 points was enough to win it. 67 points would have been enough to claim 4th spot outright.
In 2015/16 Leicester were up against spurs ....yes spursy Hotspur and 115y had really fallen away. This time 115y are on the rise and Arsenal are still strong.
115 FC could get hit with the verdict before the season is over and Arsenal aren't Spurs but have the same bottling DNA.
I think we're more likely to win the league than people realise.
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Let's hope it is like 2015-16 when a team nobody thought would win the league did, and 81 points was enough to win it. 67 points would have been enough to claim 4th spot outright.
In 2015/16 Leicester were up against spurs ....yes spursy Hotspur and 115y had really fallen away. This time 115y are on the rise and Arsenal are still strong.
115 FC could get hit with the verdict before the season is over and Arsenal aren't Spurs but have the same bottling DNA.
I think we're more likely to win the league than people realise.
Take out the first 4 games this season and we’d be top of the league and on track for a record number of points.
Of course, the season does include the first 4 games and the league title isn’t decided on hypotheticals. I wouldn’t put money on us winning the league, put it that way. But I think there’s a far smaller gap between us and the other title contenders than some folk seem to think.
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But I think there’s a far smaller gap between us and the other title contenders than some folk seem to think.
To channel paul_e, the gap is three points and goal difference.
Every team in the league is still in the title race until they stop being so.
I'd say at the moment that fifteen teams are definitely not in the title race anymore, two others are in the verge of not being so.
If at any point in the next three months the gap between us and first gets to 8-9 points then we're not anymore either.
Until that happens, then we're as much a part of the conversation as the other two.
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I'm starting to believe.
Fuck it... tempting fate be damned!
We're gonna...
Finish above Wolves!
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Still think yes.
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Chelsea was the harder game imo.
Was more convinced we'd beat Arsenal. Now I think we definitely will.
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Massive games against Arsenal and don't forget that Palace at home lurks on the horizon.
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I'm now officially a Believer !
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Massive games against Arsenal and don't forget that Palace at home lurks on the horizon.
We'll beat Palace.
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Massive games against Arsenal and don't forget that Palace at home lurks on the horizon.
We'll beat Palace.
Break the hoodoo!
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H ManU
A Chelsea
A Arsenal
H Forest
A Palace
There's the test, playing them in the space of two and a half weeks.
First one down.
Second one down.
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I thought we needed a minimum of 4 points from three games against Man Utd, Chelsea and Arsenal, to have any hopes of hanging on in the title race. We're at 6 with the Arsenal game still to come. Keeping Man Utd and Chlsea 10 points behind us in the race for Champions League places is itself brilliant.
I think losing Cash and Kamara to suspension is going to be a big factor in whether we can maintain our incredible run against Arsenal. It might be one game too many, unfortunately.
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I thought we needed a minimum of 4 points from three games against Man Utd, Chelsea and Arsenal, to have any hopes of hanging on in the title race. We're at 6 with the Arsenal game still to come. Keeping Man Utd and Chlsea 10 points behind us in the race for Champions League places is itself brilliant.
I think losing Cash and Kamara to suspension is going to be a big factor in whether we can maintain our incredible run against Arsenal. It might be one game too many, unfortunately.
Have to settle for a draw then
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I thought we needed a minimum of 4 points from three games against Man Utd, Chelsea and Arsenal, to have any hopes of hanging on in the title race. We're at 6 with the Arsenal game still to come. Keeping Man Utd and Chlsea 10 points behind us in the race for Champions League places is itself brilliant.
I think losing Cash and Kamara to suspension is going to be a big factor in whether we can maintain our incredible run against Arsenal. It might be one game too many, unfortunately.
Bogarde will play right back on Tuesday
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I still don't think we'll win it but it sure is a fun ride so far.
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Who is the equivalent of the 1990 Wimbledon waiting to ruin it?
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Massive games against Arsenal and don't forget that Palace at home lurks on the horizon.
Palace away, we have already lost to them at home for our obligatory home loss.
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I still don't think we'll win it but it sure is a fun ride so far.
Yeah that’s where I am.
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I thought we needed a minimum of 4 points from three games against Man Utd, Chelsea and Arsenal, to have any hopes of hanging on in the title race. We're at 6 with the Arsenal game still to come. Keeping Man Utd and Chlsea 10 points behind us in the race for Champions League places is itself brilliant.
I think losing Cash and Kamara to suspension is going to be a big factor in whether we can maintain our incredible run against Arsenal. It might be one game too many, unfortunately.
Bogarde will play right back on Tuesday
Could well be needed in midfield, though.
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I thought we needed a minimum of 4 points from three games against Man Utd, Chelsea and Arsenal, to have any hopes of hanging on in the title race. We're at 6 with the Arsenal game still to come. Keeping Man Utd and Chlsea 10 points behind us in the race for Champions League places is itself brilliant.
I think losing Cash and Kamara to suspension is going to be a big factor in whether we can maintain our incredible run against Arsenal. It might be one game too many, unfortunately.
Cash is a massive loss but Kamara hasnt been at his best in recent games. Break might do him no harm.
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I thought we needed a minimum of 4 points from three games against Man Utd, Chelsea and Arsenal, to have any hopes of hanging on in the title race. We're at 6 with the Arsenal game still to come. Keeping Man Utd and Chlsea 10 points behind us in the race for Champions League places is itself brilliant.
I think losing Cash and Kamara to suspension is going to be a big factor in whether we can maintain our incredible run against Arsenal. It might be one game too many, unfortunately.
Bogarde will play right back on Tuesday
Could well be needed in midfield, though.
True. I just can’t see Garcia being thrown off n at Arsenal when he hasn’t played all season. We are going to be light though with Cash, Torres and Kamara
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Villa have been here before - but are they really in title race?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/articles/c33mg5l7g8xo
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Title odds are now 18/1.
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There comes a time in the evolution of really great teams, where they build a bit of an aura around themselves - and I'm not suggesting for one moment that we are actually there yet - but we are definitely building in that direction. "Fergie time" became a thing because his teams regularly pulled out results when it looked beyond them, time and time again. We are starting to do the same thing.
Being ahead against this Aston Villa side means nothing. They will change things and hunt you down. This Aston Villa team has started badly against you? Well, don't get comfortable, because they'll change things up and leave you in their wake.
That's a really powerful thing to carry into each game, and long may it continue.
Last game of the season title decider at the Etihad anyone?
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Last game of the season title decider at the Etihad anyone?
Be hard to be that when they have just given us an honour guard before kick-off.
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If you take the games we've played so far this season and compare the results to those for the same fixtures last season (swapping the relegated and promoted clubs), we're 6 points better off on a like for like basis.
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There comes a time in the evolution of really great teams, where they build a bit of an aura around themselves - and I'm not suggesting for one moment that we are actually there yet - but we are definitely building in that direction. "Fergie time" became a thing because his teams regularly pulled out results when it looked beyond them, time and time again. We are starting to do the same thing.
We're doing the short-term, Tik Tok attention-span version very nicely though.
A month ago it was "Villa are great at free-kicks" because we scored two similar ones in a couple of weeks.
The new one is going to be "don't go ahead against Villa because that's just what they want you to do".
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Maybe Garcia plays a half, then we see where we're at?
Who else can play in the pivot? We've had Yuri rotating in there for 45 mins at a time. Onana and Kamara for a game and a half a piece. You could play SJM there, I guess - but that just leaves us short elsewhere.
Thinking that the elegantly named George Hemmings will see some action from the bench.
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We must be a nightmare to face, how do you stop us? We gave the league a 5 game start and are in the title fight. We went away to one of the best sides in the country, gave them a 60 min head start and still won with their keeper keeping them in it.
If we play well, you're fucked. If we play badly, you're fucked. If we go ahead, you're fucked. If you go ahead, you're fucked. Allow us freekicks, you're fucked. Let us play through balls, you're fucked. Let us shoot from range, you're fucked. Try and stop our key players, someone else steps up and you're fucked.
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Still no, but we're at the stage where Olbiyun and SHA fans are genuinely starting to get worried.
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As it stands right now, wolves are only 37 points behind us.
No room for complacency.
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As it stands right now, wolves are only 37 points behind us.
No room for complacency.
We won more points in half an hour today than Wolves have in 18 games.
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We did the mind the gap, now look what happened.
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In 1980/81 we beat the then champions Liverpool 2-0 at Villa Park in the first week of January. Several of the players subsequently commented that it was this result that really made them believe for the first time that they could win the Title.
I’m thinking Tuesday at Arsenal will be a similar scenario should we get a result.
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They are all massive games from here on. We will lose one eventually, and how we react will be key.
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We need to keep Villa Park as a fortress, noisy and hostile. Tickets are becoming difficult to get, random singles left atm. Our away form, and away support is remarkable. Those in the media are slowly realising we are a decent side. You get the feeling something is building.
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Our last 38 league games shows a record of won 23, drawn 8 and lost 7 for 77 points. Over the last 10 years that would have put us 2nd 3 times, 3rd 5 times and 4th twice.
We won't win the league but unless we fall apart will qualify for the Champions League again which surely should put an end to our FFP/SCR problems for a while.
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Maybe Garcia plays a half, then we see where we're at?
Who else can play in the pivot? We've had Yuri rotating in there for 45 mins at a time. Onana and Kamara for a game and a half a piece. You could play SJM there, I guess - but that just leaves us short elsewhere.
Thinking that the elegantly named George Hemmings will see some action from the bench.
I don't think Emery will risk any inexperience: Bogarde at right-back, Youri and Onana in the double pivot and Watkins / Rogers / McGinn / Buendia ahead. Sancho and Malen will come on second half. Injuries may force a Garcia introduction, but any midfield injury will - I think - be covered by bringing on Digne.
I just don't see our George getting on in the Arsenal game ... but we may well see him in the FAC3 game.
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We must be a nightmare to face, how do you stop us? We gave the league a 5 game start and are in the title fight. We went away to one of the best sides in the country, gave them a 60 min head start and still won with their keeper keeping them in it.
If we play well, you're fucked. If we play badly, you're fucked. If we go ahead, you're fucked. If you go ahead, you're fucked. Allow us freekicks, you're fucked. Let us play through balls, you're fucked. Let us shoot from range, you're fucked. Try and stop our key players, someone else steps up and you're fucked.
One of the real key things for me thus season has been having bench options that can genuinely change games. Of course, you need a manager who knows when and how to use those options, but yesterday was a good example of how substitutions changed the game.
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Maybe teams will counter our rope-a-dope strategy by copying what we do. Draw us on in the first half and then bring on their five "finishers" off the bench.
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By the time the Jan window closes our only away games against 'rivals' are ManU and ManC. Even at home it will only be Chelsea and Liverpool. Be close at the end of the window with a couple of good 'uns in and who knows.
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Our last two games of the season are killer though. Think we'll need to have the title wrapped-up by then.
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By the time the Jan window closes our only away games against 'rivals' are ManU and ManC. Even at home it will only be Chelsea and Liverpool. Be close at the end of the window with a couple of good 'uns in and who knows.
Also, if we keep pace at the top through January, it means players are going to be more keen to join us, and we might feel more comfortable splurging a bit, "safe" in the knowledge that we'll have Champions League money coming in to pay for it.
Opta* have the likelihood of us finishing in the top five at something like 98.3% at the moment, so that's a much happier position to spend money from than it was last January when we were ninth.
*yes, I know it's bullshit.
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Maybe teams will counter our rope-a-dope strategy by copying what we do. Draw us on in the first half and then bring on their five "finishers" off the bench.
Then we’ll counter that with whatever tactic Unai has up his sleeve. He’s playing a different sport altogether. Easily the best coach in the league.
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Maybe teams will counter our rope-a-dope strategy by copying what we do. Draw us on in the first half and then bring on their five "finishers" off the bench.
Then we’ll counter that with whatever tactic Unai has up his sleeve. He’s playing a different sport altogether. Easily the best coach in the league.
This is it. Just look at our attacking at the moment. Up til the tail end of last season we were prolific at shorter range stuff. Other managers worked out how to counter that, by sitting deep, but that now gives us so much space that Rogers & Little Emi can have a field day scoring bangers every week.
Genuinely think we have the best manager and one of the strongest first teams in the league at the moment, and regardless of whether something happens this season or not we’re on the cusp of an era of Villa dominance on a level that hasn’t been seen since the days of Queen Victoria and Edward VII.
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Maybe teams will counter our rope-a-dope strategy by copying what we do. Draw us on in the first half and then bring on their five "finishers" off the bench.
Then we’ll counter that with whatever tactic Unai has up his sleeve. He’s playing a different sport altogether. Easily the best coach in the league.
This is it. Just look at our attacking at the moment. Up til the tail end of last season we were prolific at shorter range stuff. Other managers worked out how to counter that, by sitting deep, but that now gives us so much space that Rogers & Little Emi can have a field day scoring bangers every week.
Genuinely think we have the best manager and one of the strongest first teams in the league at the moment, and regardless of whether something happens this season or not we’re on the cusp of an era of Villa dominance on a level that hasn’t been seen since the days of Queen Victoria and Edward VII.
Was the same with the high line too.
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From The Athletic
ASTON VILLA JUST DON’T KNOW WHEN THEY ARE BEATEN
Jacob Tanswell
The numbers do not lie.
Eleven straight wins across all competitions, equalling a club record set in 1897 and 1914. Eight successive Premier League victories. Nine goals from substitutes, with two of them coming in a 2-1 victory against Chelsea courtesy of Ollie Watkins. In all five of Aston Villa’s away league wins, they have come from behind to earn three points.
Across the last three Premier League seasons, Villa have won more points from losing positions than any other Premier League side (54). Quite simply, they do not know when they are beaten.
Combining a resilient mentality with Unai Emery’s in-game acumen is a heady concoction for success.
Villa have recovered 18 points from losing positions this term, with the 2-1 victory at Stamford Bridge the most startling but in no way a total surprise. In truth, the second-half transformation felt fitting, considering the broader trends of the campaign.
This, however, was the biggest turnaround, with the contrast in performance enormous.
Chelsea's 10 shots to Villa's zero in the first half became 11 to four in the opposite favour in the second.
The game swung violently from the 59th minute, when Emery made a triple change. Until then, Villa were second best in every facet. They were stifled going forward — Donyell Malen had one touch in the opening 20 minutes — with the team completing just 36 passes in that time.
Tactically, there seemed to be problems, not in keeping with Emery’s usually sound structure. Villa struggled with Chelsea’s in-possession 3-2-5 shape, especially the five players across their back line. By protecting the space behind — rather than stepping onto Chelsea’s attacking midfielders, Cole Palmer and Enzo Fernandez, or Marc Cucurella — Villa ceded possession and territory.
Chelsea carried overloads in midfield and on the wings. Villa's narrow ‘wide’ players, Emiliano Buendia and John McGinn, were supposed to carry the ball forward, but spent most of the time running frantically towards their own goal.
Chelsea sucked in Villa with short passes before raking switches of play out wide. They were too slick, too precise and completely dominant, other than on the scoreline, leading by only a goal.
Villa’s back line hung in there, particularly Ezri Konsa and Victor Lindelof, while the front four completed 22 passes between them in the first half, which floundered the plan to hit back on transition.
More than 10 minutes into the second half, Villa’s expected goals (xG) came into focus. Their 0.04 played Chelsea’s 1.99.
But Villa have the greatest, most intangible knack. They just win. This time, it was engineered by Emery’s triple change.
Watkins replaced Malen up front, with Jadon Sancho coming on for McGinn. Most crucially, Amadou Onana's introduction for Buendia pushed Youri Tielemans further forward, with Morgan Rogers, who had been suffocated before then, becoming the second No 10 (attacking midfielder). This enabled Rogers to enjoy a competitive battle with Reece James and have a greater impact.
Rogers could then drift inside to dribble or pick up the ball, in turn proving harder to mark. Having the play in front of him, as opposed to Chelsea's defender wrestling him from behind, brought his best strengths to the fore and saw him slip in Watkins to equalise.
Watkins' winning header was a throwback to the England striker of two years ago, the athletic, high-jumping leader of the line who was clean and clinical.
“He (Emery) changed it because Chelsea were going man for man, but they had the extra centre-back when we were going long,” Watkins explained to Sky Sports after. “When I came on in the second half, he brought Jadon Sancho and Morgan Rogers on the wing and put Youri Tielemans in the No 10 — so we had an extra man in there. He's a tactical genius."
Villa can play average, or even downright poor — they were throughout the first half — yet keep their head down and charge forward, taking punishment but forever wanting to back their opponent up and turn the tide.
Sometimes they do this through one astonishing blow, like a Rogers strike from distance. Here, though, it was the power of the collective. When Watkins equalised, Villa were the team who were going to win the contest.
Watkins threw fist pumps with Onana in perfect synchronisation at full-time. They hurtled towards the away support in the far corner, who for the first time, started to sing, “Now you’re going to believe us, we’re going to win the league.”
Villa are three off the top and continue to do what senior figures at the club insist is a “miracle” after the problems of the summer. Now 10 points ahead of Chelsea, Villa are entrenched in a Champions League spot. This also appeared unthinkable not so long ago.
“(The comebacks) are not a surprise,” said Emery. “It makes us proud, but it is about building a mentality and structure like we are doing. We were so worried in August and September… we didn’t watch the table, but focused on each match. Through creating our stronger structure, we were working hard and we continue to work hard. Our individual players are working hard and are staying responsible and mature.”
It is not yet the new year and Villa have beaten Manchester City, Arsenal, Manchester United, Tottenham Hotspur and Chelsea this season. There is no team or tactical puzzle that Villa cannot end up solving within 90 minutes.
In a league where most teams are plagued with inconsistency, possessing the ability to withstand and weather storms in matches grows in importance. The regularity with which Villa snatch wins from the jaws of defeat has happened too many times under Emery to be down to fortune.
It is an enduring, remarkable trait, with the 2-1 victory at Chelsea the clearest illustration. Arsenal are next.
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Maybe teams will counter our rope-a-dope strategy by copying what we do. Draw us on in the first half and then bring on their five "finishers" off the bench.
It's just a shame Ali used 'rope-a-dope' in the 'Rumble in the Jungle' rather than in the "Thrilla in Manila'.
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The Athletic
ASTON VILLA JUST DON’T KNOW WHEN THEY ARE BEATEN
Jacob Tanswell
The numbers do not lie.
Eleven straight wins across all competitions, equalling a club record set in 1897 and 1914. Eight successive Premier League victories. Nine goals from substitutes, with two of them coming in a 2-1 victory against Chelsea courtesy of Ollie Watkins. In all five of Aston Villa’s away league wins, they have come from behind to earn three points.
Across the last three Premier League seasons, Villa have won more points from losing positions than any other Premier League side (54). Quite simply, they do not know when they are beaten.
Combining a resilient mentality with Unai Emery’s in-game acumen is a heady concoction for success.
Villa have recovered 18 points from losing positions this term, with the 2-1 victory at Stamford Bridge the most startling but in no way a total surprise. In truth, the second-half transformation felt fitting, considering the broader trends of the campaign.
This, however, was the biggest turnaround, with the contrast in performance enormous.
Chelsea's 10 shots to Villa's zero in the first half became 11 to four in Villa's favour in the second.
The game swung violently from the 59th minute, when Emery made a triple change. Until then, Villa were second best in every facet. They were stifled going forward — Donyell Malen had one touch in the opening 20 minutes — with the team completing just 36 passes in that time.
Tactically, there seemed to be problems, not in keeping with Emery’s usually sound structure. Villa struggled with Chelsea’s in-possession 3-2-5 shape, especially the five players across their back line. By protecting the space behind — rather than stepping onto Chelsea’s attacking midfielders, Cole Palmer and Enzo Fernandez, or Marc Cucurella — Villa ceded possession and territory.
Chelsea carried overloads in midfield and on the wings. Villa's narrow ‘wide’ players, Emiliano Buendia and John McGinn, were supposed to carry the ball forward, but spent most of the time running frantically towards their own goal.
Chelsea sucked in Villa with short passes before raking switches of play out wide. They were too slick, too precise and completely dominant, other than on the scoreline, leading by only a goal.
Villa’s back line hung in there, particularly Ezri Konsa and Victor Lindelof, while the front four completed 22 passes between them in the first half, which floundered the plan to hit back on transition.
More than 10 minutes into the second half, Villa’s expected goals (xG) came into focus. Their 0.04 played Chelsea’s 1.99.
But Villa have the greatest, most intangible knack. They just win. This time, it was engineered by Emery’s triple change.
Watkins replaced Malen up front, with Jadon Sancho coming on for McGinn. Most crucially, Amadou Onana's introduction for Buendia pushed Youri Tielemans further forward, with Morgan Rogers, who had been suffocated before then, becoming the second No 10 (attacking midfielder). This enabled Rogers to enjoy a competitive battle with Reece James and have a greater impact.
Rogers could then drift inside to dribble or pick up the ball, in turn proving harder to mark. Having the play in front of him, as opposed to Chelsea's defender wrestling him from behind, brought his best strengths to the fore and saw him slip in Watkins to equalise.
Watkins' winning header was a throwback to the England striker of two years ago, the athletic, high-jumping leader of the line who was clean and clinical.
“He (Emery) changed it because Chelsea were going man for man, but they had the extra centre-back when we were going long,” Watkins explained to Sky Sports after. “When I came on in the second half, he brought Jadon Sancho and Morgan Rogers on the wing and put Youri Tielemans in the No 10 — so we had an extra man in there. He's a tactical genius."
Villa can play average, or even downright poor — they were throughout the first half — yet keep their head down and charge forward, taking punishment but forever wanting to back their opponent up and turn the tide.
Sometimes they do this through one astonishing blow, like a Rogers strike from distance. Here, though, it was the power of the collective. When Watkins equalised, Villa were the team who were going to win the contest.
Watkins threw fist pumps with Onana in perfect synchronisation at full-time. They hurtled towards the away support in the far corner, who for the first time, started to sing, “Now you’re going to believe us, we’re going to win the league.”
Villa are three off the top and continue to do what senior figures at the club insist is a “miracle” after the problems of the summer. Now 10 points ahead of Chelsea, Villa are entrenched in a Champions League spot. This also appeared unthinkable not so long ago.
“(The comebacks) are not a surprise,” said Emery. “It makes us proud, but it is about building a mentality and structure like we are doing. We were so worried in August and September… we didn’t watch the table, but focused on each match. Through creating our stronger structure, we were working hard and we continue to work hard. Our individual players are working hard and are staying responsible and mature.”
It is not yet the new year and Villa have beaten Manchester City, Arsenal, Manchester United, Tottenham Hotspur and Chelsea this season. There is no team or tactical puzzle that Villa cannot end up solving within 90 minutes.
In a league where most teams are plagued with inconsistency, possessing the ability to withstand and weather storms in matches grows in importance. The regularity with which Villa snatch wins from the jaws of defeat has happened too many times under Emery to be down to fortune.
It is an enduring, remarkable trait, with the 2-1 victory at Chelsea the clearest illustration. Arsenal are next.
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You can say that again.
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You can say that again.
I wonder what Jacob Tanswell thinks
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If we beat Arsenal on Tuesday we are absolutely in this and can win the league.
I don't think we will lose the game. Head is saying draw.
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They are all massive games from here on. We will lose one eventually, and how we react will be key.
Exactly, it’s not not winning, it’s how you bounce back. The pressure will mount and the press will love a narrative of 10 point gaps blown etc.
Personally I’m at the point where champions league football is the expectation and anything else is a bonus.
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This season reminds me a bit of 2008/09.
By then we'd had two and a half years of MON so all the squad knew what to do, we had long winning streaks up to the February and won many games from losing positions. Think we had 52 points after beating Blackburn away in early February so we must've been very close to the top positions at that time.
The difference of course was our bench was totally pap apart from the occasions Carew was on it and O'Neill was clueless with rotation while Emery is the master at it.
Winning that game yesterday from the triple sub shows imo our squad is the third strongest in the league after Man. City and Arsenal as Liverpool's bench is awful currently and Chelsea subs really didn't make an impact at all so that bodes very well for the challenge ahead.
Would be incredible to get to 70 points and have 7/8 games still remaining. Then you never know. Think that is what Unai means by referencing "30 games" when the MOTD interviewer was trying to get him to declare we're in the title race. He is far too wily to give silly soundbites like that.
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Would be incredible to get to 70 points and have 7/8 games still remaining.
That would be our highest Premier League points total since 1993, from 75% of the available matches.
Incredible feels like it would be damning it with faint praise.
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The biggest difference was that MON didn't have the first idea of tactics beyond his one 'thing', ie the counter attacking. That's why our away record was so much better than home, when teams came to VP and parked the bus, he had zero idea how to handle it.
He also had no idea how to manage a squad across the demands of a whole season, and as you said re rotation, the very thought that he might have made subs like yesterday's - ie to react to what was going on in the match at the time, and to change things - rather than just changing whoever played at RB and/or throwing Steve Sidwell on on 75 minutes is laughable.
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Maybe teams will counter our rope-a-dope strategy by copying what we do. Draw us on in the first half and then bring on their five "finishers" off the bench.
Liverpool's subs bench yesterday was: Conor Bradley, Cody Gakpo, Trey Nyoni, Mamardashvili, Robertson, Freddie Woodman, Calvin Ramsey, Rio Ngumoha and the delightfully named Wellity Lucky.
So two players I've never heard of (Ngumoha was the 16 year old kid who scored last minute at Newcastle), two keepers and Calvin Ramsey made little impact on loan at Preston and Bolton in last two years.
I don't think people realise how good our squad actually is this season. I'd say it is third best in the league behind Arsenal and Man. City. Think people just rate Chelsea's squad because they sign so many players each transfer window but none of their subs could do anything when put on in high intensity match yesterday.
I didn't rate the signing of Lindelof but he's been brilliant in all three prem games he's started so that is what you want from backup player, comes in to start regularly at congested part of the season and the quality level dosen't drop at all.
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The biggest difference was that MON didn't have the first idea of tactics beyond his one 'thing', ie the counter attacking. That's why our away record was so much better than home, when teams came to VP and parked the bus, he had zero idea how to handle it.
He also had no idea how to manage a squad across the demands of a whole season, and as you said re rotation, the very thought that he might have made subs like yesterday's - ie to react to what was going on in the match at the time, and to change things - rather than just changing whoever played at RB and/or throwing Steve Sidwell on on 75 minutes is laughable.
I did quantify my post above by saying that.
However in 2008/09 despite all that we still had runs winning four prem games in a row a few times. After 18 games that season we had 34 points and then won loads of games in January.
Man. United won the league that season with 90 points, Arsenal finished 4th on 72 so that feels a good barometer points wise for our finishing position this season.
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We won 4 of the last 16 in 08/09, and one of those was against Doncaster. We won 4 in a row once in the league, against Hull, Albion, Portsmouth and Sunderland who were all shit.
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lets not compare MON with Unai.
Unai has more tactical expertise in his left bollock than MON had in his whole career.
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Maybe teams will counter our rope-a-dope strategy by copying what we do. Draw us on in the first half and then bring on their five "finishers" off the bench.
Liverpool's subs bench yesterday was: Conor Bradley, Cody Gakpo, Trey Nyoni, Mamardashvili, Robertson, Freddie Woodman, Calvin Ramsey, Rio Ngumoha and the delightfully named Wellity Lucky.
So two players I've never heard of (Ngumoha was the 16 year old kid who scored last minute at Newcastle), two keepers and Calvin Ramsey made little impact on loan at Preston and Bolton in last two years.
I don't think people realise how good our squad actually is this season. I'd say it is third best in the league behind Arsenal and Man. City. Think people just rate Chelsea's squad because they sign so many players each transfer window but none of their subs could do anything when put on in high intensity match yesterday.
I didn't rate the signing of Lindelof but he's been brilliant in all three prem games he's started so that is what you want from backup player, comes in to start regularly at congested part of the season and the quality level dosen't drop at all.
Wellity Lucky can think himself unfortunate not to have played more.
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They are all massive games from here on. We will lose one eventually, and how we react will be key.
Exactly, it’s not not winning, it’s how you bounce back. The pressure will mount and the press will love a narrative of 10 point gaps blown etc.
Personally I’m at the point where champions league football is the expectation and anything else is a bonus.
This is exactly how I feel.
For the moment, the Champion’s League place is ours to blow with the ten points gap.
But even that is very harsh on my half way through the season
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The biggest difference was that MON didn't have the first idea of tactics beyond his one 'thing', ie the counter attacking. That's why our away record was so much better than home, when teams came to VP and parked the bus, he had zero idea how to handle it.
He also had no idea how to manage a squad across the demands of a whole season, and as you said re rotation, the very thought that he might have made subs like yesterday's - ie to react to what was going on in the match at the time, and to change things - rather than just changing whoever played at RB and/or throwing Steve Sidwell on on 75 minutes is laughable.
I did quantify my post above by saying that.
However in 2008/09 despite all that we still had runs winning four prem games in a row a few times. After 18 games that season we had 34 points and then won loads of games in January.
Man. United won the league that season with 90 points, Arsenal finished 4th on 72 so that feels a good barometer points wise for our finishing position this season.
I used to get excited during the main O’Neil years, but it was nothing like this, nothing like any of the years under Emery, especially this year. We’ve seen a year on year transformation or major tweaking in tactics to combat whatever hurdles have been put in our way. We've also smashed records all over the place. The era’s are incomparable to me.
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Think the big change these days is that once we equalised it kind of seemed inevitable we would go on and win the game.
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The biggest difference was that MON didn't have the first idea of tactics beyond his one 'thing', ie the counter attacking. That's why our away record was so much better than home, when teams came to VP and parked the bus, he had zero idea how to handle it.
He also had no idea how to manage a squad across the demands of a whole season, and as you said re rotation, the very thought that he might have made subs like yesterday's - ie to react to what was going on in the match at the time, and to change things - rather than just changing whoever played at RB and/or throwing Steve Sidwell on on 75 minutes is laughable.
I did quantify my post above by saying that.
However in 2008/09 despite all that we still had runs winning four prem games in a row a few times. After 18 games that season we had 34 points and then won loads of games in January.
Man. United won the league that season with 90 points, Arsenal finished 4th on 72 so that feels a good barometer points wise for our finishing position this season.
I used to get excited during the main O’Neil years, but it was nothing like this, nothing like any of the years under Emery, especially this year. We’ve seen a year on year transformation or major tweaking in tactics to combat whatever hurdles have been put in our way. We've also smashed records all over the place. The era’s are incomparable to me.
Oh yeah for sure. The way we won under MON was conceding lots of possession, rapid counters through Gabby with Young crossing it for Carew or someone else to head in and Laursen steaming in from set pieces.
2007/08 was good fun at least after years of mediocrity. Lots of high scoring games and really good results v Arsenal and Chelsea but we had little control in those type of games compared to now and the using 14 players thing blew up in our faces from March onwards when we'd always have terrible ends to the season.
Now we pace ourselves through the season and we have a far superior squad to 23/24 when we limped towards the finish due to injuries and that cost us in the Europa Conference league.
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I've begun to be very excited about all we're capable of. I'm very sorry to all on here who spend good money following the team around the world, because that's a fucking death sentence for us.
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Will we win the the League? No, but we will have fun whilst not winning it.
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I've begun to be very excited about all we're capable of. I'm very sorry to all on here who spend good money following the team around the world, because that's a fucking death sentence for us.
Wrong fread.
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Maybe teams will counter our rope-a-dope strategy by copying what we do. Draw us on in the first half and then bring on their five "finishers" off the bench.
Liverpool's subs bench yesterday was: Conor Bradley, Cody Gakpo, Trey Nyoni, Mamardashvili, Robertson, Freddie Woodman, Calvin Ramsey, Rio Ngumoha and the delightfully named Wellity Lucky.
So two players I've never heard of (Ngumoha was the 16 year old kid who scored last minute at Newcastle), two keepers and Calvin Ramsey made little impact on loan at Preston and Bolton in last two years.
I don't think people realise how good our squad actually is this season. I'd say it is third best in the league behind Arsenal and Man. City. Think people just rate Chelsea's squad because they sign so many players each transfer window but none of their subs could do anything when put on in high intensity match yesterday.
I didn't rate the signing of Lindelof but he's been brilliant in all three prem games he's started so that is what you want from backup player, comes in to start regularly at congested part of the season and the quality level dosen't drop at all.
This is a point I've been thinking about, that it's all well and good having a huge squad of players, but if you don't manage it properly you can make otherwise capable footballers look like competition winners when you occaisionally throw them on the pitch, usually just to dig you out of some hole, and that the very fact Chelsea's squad is as large as it is actually hinders them in competition with us.
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Third smarmy piece from Wilson in less than a month. Why is he bothering?
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Third smarmy piece from Wilson in less than a month. Why is he bothering?
I genuinely can't see anything to be upset about with it.
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He agitates me.
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I don't know who he is. Nor do I care.
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He agitates me.
Me too, the wingnut.
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Much like Arsenal, no. Not this season.
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Still on, imo.
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Much like Arsenal, no. Not this season.
Think Arsenal will win the league, their squad depth is insane. 0-0 at half time and they still have all of Madueke, Eze, Martinelli and Gabi Jesus to put on.
Different league to us which is no shock with all the restrictions we've had last three summers while they can just drop 200m every year.
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Arsenal will bottle it as they always do. We were ridiculously unlucky to have to play them twice before the Bottling Season starts.
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Dunno about that. We might have had Bouba, Cash, Pau, Barkley on our bench. I'd have felt pretty good about that.
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We were never winning the league this year. If we can finish in the Champions League qualification positions in the league that is a serious achievement.
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We only have Newcastle, ManU and ManC to play away of the current top 10. Added to our home record I fully expect us to win the league.
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Much like Arsenal, no. Not this season.
Think Arsenal will win the league, their squad depth is insane. 0-0 at half time and they still have all of Madueke, Eze, Martinelli and Gabi Jesus to put on.
Different league to us which is no shock with all the restrictions we've had last three summers while they can just drop 200m every year.
Nah. Man City have a centre forwars that scores just about every week. Arsenal have a berk who did it at Coventry and has spent a couple of years bullying shit Portuguese teams. They won't win it and I hope they dont too.
Different financial league maybe. Thats their first win against a top 6 side this season. When we have injuries and suspensions it hits harder. When you spent £250m in a window and the thick end of half a billion net, you don't have too many excuses for why you're only just above Aston Villa in the league.
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No. But we can have a big voice in who does.
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In more ways than one, when the team turns up locked in 3rd or 4th, 4 days post Europa League win, almost as pissed up as the away end at Man City in May.
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On the basis it will not be us does it matter to us whether it is Arse or City115?
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Ci55y as anything they do is tainted anyway
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ManC as it will annoy the right people and anything they win is meaningless. Arsenal not winning it will be very very funny.
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We're winning it.
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Still in there.
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Don't drop points on Arsenal rule still stands. Still an outside chance for me, Clive.
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I hope the club are already in consultation with BCC re arrangements for the victory parade.
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Arse and Man C dropped points at home, we dropped points away. You could argue our chances improved marginally.
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Arse and Man C dropped points at home, we dropped points away. You could argue our chances improved marginally.
It's definitely a good set of results for us.
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Back on lads
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It isn't back on at all. Because it was never off.
Hand it over, hand it over, hand it over Li ver pool.
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Arse and Man C dropped points at home, we dropped points away. You could argue our chances improved marginally.
Won a point away against Crystal Palace. Definitely marginally improved.
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We won't win it, but it's even more than usual a damn fuckin' shame, considering who will win it.
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We played Crystal Palace and didn’t lose, which to me is more of an achievement than us winning a major trophy.
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We can win it, and are 1 of only 3 clubs who can say that. That's enough for now.
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Something very big will depend on our last two games.
I'm not too sure what but i look fowards to it!
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We need to get that Wharton lad from Palace. I rate him over Rice etc etc
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Arse and Man C dropped points at home, we dropped points away. You could argue our chances improved marginally.
Won a point away against Crystal Palace. Definitely marginally improved.
You could agree we have all our hardest fixtures out the way with Arsenal and Palace. No joke. City away is last game of the season, so we'll either be in or out by that stage. Be more than happy to go into that needing a win 🤞
We do need Arsenal to shit themselves a little, but they're pretty reliable for that.
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Posted on the Emery thread earlier, or at least agreed with a comment by SE, Unai’s reaction with the ref at the final whistle last night, to me indicates deep down he believes we can win it. Thats more than good enough for me. Bring it on.
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I'm still not convinced that we are genuine challengers, but if we just for a moment consider that we are, then I just think last night was a big opportunity given the other results this week. You just get certain games throughout the season that feel like cornerstones and I think last night was one if we are going to be really challenging.
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Posted on the Emery thread earlier, or at least agreed with a comment by SE, Unai’s reaction with the ref at the final whistle last night, to me indicates deep down he believes we can win it. Thats more than good enough for me. Bring it on.
Same exact thought crossed my mind.
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Struggling to find the exact quote, but Emery said post match something to the effect that it was a balanced game that we were closer to winning than losing, and while one point is not enough, we must accept it.
To my mind, there's only one outcome one point wouldn't be enough for.
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Apart from a purple patch of 30 minutes against us (when our midfield was depleted) Arses have been distinctly average in the last number of weeks. Barely scraping results. Man City* have a lot of new faces, are in transition and havn't been their normal fluent selves for a while.
They are both capable of leaving the door open for someone else to step in and grab the glory.
With a bit of luck on the injury side and possibly one or two 'experienced' loan signings in January, why not us?
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Or as Jonathan Liew put it graciously in his column, 'Aston Villa, lol, give me a break'. That's nice.
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^ that's exactly why I don't pay any attention to the guardian football pages.
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On an emotional level there can't be many bigger prizes for Unai than beating Arsenal to the league. Might explain his unusual reaction at the end of the Palace game
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Or as Jonathan Liew put it graciously in his column, 'Aston Villa, lol, give me a break'. That's nice.
..the guy from Countdown lol, probably never kicked a ball in his life, file under 'bag of cement'.
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Or as Jonathan Liew put it graciously in his column, 'Aston Villa, lol, give me a break'. That's nice.
..the guy from Countdown lol, probably never kicked a ball in his life, file under 'bag of cement'.
A random dig at a club massively overachieving given what they're up against, gotta love the Guardian.
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Let's be honest, we don't expect to win the league so it's no suprise that nobody else does either..
We could win it, but history shows it's really hard to as a club of our stature (financially and experience of winning a trophy) in the modern game.
One thing is for sure though, were built to keep improving, and we've shown the last 3 years that we want European football each season at least.
The longer people don't talk us up, the longer the big pressure stays off us.
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Or as Jonathan Liew put it graciously in his column, 'Aston Villa, lol, give me a break'. That's nice.
..the guy from Countdown lol, probably never kicked a ball in his life, file under 'bag of cement'.
A random dig at a club massively overachieving given what they're up against, gotta love the Guardian.
It is a bit bizarre.
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Or as Jonathan Liew put it graciously in his column, 'Aston Villa, lol, give me a break'. That's nice.
..the guy from Countdown lol, probably never kicked a ball in his life, file under 'bag of cement'.
A random dig at a club massively overachieving given what they're up against, gotta love the Guardian.
It is a bit bizarre.
Isnt it? Not like it's an Arsenal blog or the BTL comments. Could have just said the squad is a bit light or something.
He writes some decent stuff at times but at others he's an absolute knob.
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I think he was joking.
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I think he was joking.
At Villa's expense, though.
Like I'm not offended or anything. I just found it quite strange to have a pointless swipe at an underdog.
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Hand on heart I don’t think we can win it, but the longer we stay alongside the other two, who knows?
The fact we are saying things like this after our shit start to the season is just amazing.
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It really depends on whether he’s channeling what he thinks Arsenal are trying to omit, which I think he probably is.
We need to stop being so meek about a tilt at the title.
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I think he was joking.
At Villa's expense, though.
Like I'm not offended or anything. I just found it quite strange to have a pointless swipe at an underdog.
I find they do it quite regularly and its not just him, 2-3 of their writers seem to basically think there's 5-6 clubs matter and then a bunch of filler to make up the numbers, it comes across in loads of the articles.
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I think he was joking.
At Villa's expense, though.
Like I'm not offended or anything. I just found it quite strange to have a pointless swipe at an underdog.
I find they do it quite regularly and its not just him, 2-3 of their writers seem to basically think there's 5-6 clubs matter and then a bunch of filler to make up the numbers, it comes across in loads of the articles.
Jonathan Wilson in particular, and I happened to listen to a Rest is History podcast from a few years back with him on this week. He started at Tom Holland (Villa fan if you don't know) about an incident in the 1913 cup final Sunderland weren't happy about, then went on the moan that the early league was really just a Lancashire - West Midlands league as Sunderland had been rejected for being too far. They were having a laugh about it all but it solidified my belief that he really doesn't like us.
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Spiderman, Zendaya and a Villa fan, what a guy! (winky face)
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Let's be honest, we don't expect to win the league so it's no suprise that nobody else does either..
We could win it, but history shows it's really hard to as a club of our stature (financially and experience of winning a trophy) in the modern game.
One thing is for sure though, were built to keep improving, and we've shown the last 3 years that we want European football each season at least.
The longer people don't talk us up, the longer the big pressure stays off us.
This is about where I stand on it all.
I don't expect us to win the league. The system is set up in such a way that it makes it difficult for clubs outside the Sky 6 to do win it.
As you (Drummond) wrote, we've kept improving season on season since Emery came in, to the point where if we're honest this season a good proportion of our supporters would be disappointed if we didn't make the Champions League now. That's a huge leap in a short space of time since we had Gerrard in charge.
With Emery in charge I'd not rule it out yet. He gives the impression that he thinks we can do it, which is good enough for me. However, if we were to win the league it'd go down as a shock win eclipsed maybe only by Leicester City since football was invented in 1992, and before that ... maybe Leeds 91/92 or us 80/81? It'd be huge.
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I think he was joking.
At Villa's expense, though.
Like I'm not offended or anything. I just found it quite strange to have a pointless swipe at an underdog.
I find they do it quite regularly and its not just him, 2-3 of their writers seem to basically think there's 5-6 clubs matter and then a bunch of filler to make up the numbers, it comes across in loads of the articles.
Jonathan Wilson in particular, and I happened to listen to a Rest is History podcast from a few years back with him on this week. He started at Tom Holland (Villa fan if you don't know) about an incident in the 1913 cup final Sunderland weren't happy about, then went on the moan that the early league was really just a Lancashire - West Midlands league as Sunderland had been rejected for being too far. They were having a laugh about it all but it solidified my belief that he really doesn't like us.
Wilson's a bit of a different case, who knows what's up with him. Maybe, like the Tifo twats, he dislikes how we're overperforming our xG difference. Kind of kills his gimmick.
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If we won it then it would be nowhere near as big a shock as Leicester.
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Or as Jonathan Liew put it graciously in his column, 'Aston Villa, lol, give me a break'. That's nice.
He predicted 9th for us in the Guardian pre-season podcast.
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Or as Jonathan Liew put it graciously in his column, 'Aston Villa, lol, give me a break'. That's nice.
He predicted 9th for us in the Guardian pre-season podcast.
Rather incredibly he says his first team is Spurs and his second team is Arsenal:
https://thesetpieces.com/interviews/vox-in-the-box-jonathan-liew/
Which is odd!
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Or as Jonathan Liew put it graciously in his column, 'Aston Villa, lol, give me a break'. That's nice.
He predicted 9th for us in the Guardian pre-season podcast.
Rather incredibly he says his first team is Spurs and his second team is Arsenal:
https://thesetpieces.com/interviews/vox-in-the-box-jonathan-liew/
Which is odd!
North London forever!
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Or as Jonathan Liew put it graciously in his column, 'Aston Villa, lol, give me a break'. That's nice.
He predicted 9th for us in the Guardian pre-season podcast.
Rather incredibly he says his first team is Spurs and his second team is Arsenal:
https://thesetpieces.com/interviews/vox-in-the-box-jonathan-liew/
Which is odd!
It should be odd but it's not particularly surprising, he's always come across to me as someone who fills the "what if you made an AI football fan" niche. All of the knowledge of the game and loads of fancy words to talk about it but no soul or real understanding of what football means to most fans.
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Or as Jonathan Liew put it graciously in his column, 'Aston Villa, lol, give me a break'. That's nice.
He predicted 9th for us in the Guardian pre-season podcast.
Rather incredibly he says his first team is Spurs and his second team is Arsenal:
https://thesetpieces.com/interviews/vox-in-the-box-jonathan-liew/
Which is odd!
It should be odd but it's not particularly surprising, he's always come across to me as someone who fills the "what if you made an AI football fan" niche. All of the knowledge of the game and loads of fancy words to talk about it but no soul or real understanding of what football means to most fans.
See, this is unfair I think. He's written really well about the way the game is being taken away from normal people, being mined for content and all of that. Which makes these occasional lapses into the entitled megaclub fan all the more frustrating.
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If we won it then it would be nowhere near as big a shock as Leicester.
No, of course not. But there's only them and Blackburn since 19929/3 season that've won the league but don't belong to a very exclusive set of clubs ... and Blackburn had the Jack Walker money* at that point.
* obligatory point that Jack Walker was a Blackburn supporter who made his fortune in Blackburn, so IMO was entirely justified in spending a huge wadge of money on the club he and a good proportion of his employees supported. He's quite different from say Abramovic or Mansour who no way would've been idolising Dennis Wise or Nicky Weaver when they were knee high to a grasshopper.
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Or as Jonathan Liew put it graciously in his column, 'Aston Villa, lol, give me a break'. That's nice.
He predicted 9th for us in the Guardian pre-season podcast.
Rather incredibly he says his first team is Spurs and his second team is Arsenal:
https://thesetpieces.com/interviews/vox-in-the-box-jonathan-liew/ (https://thesetpieces.com/interviews/vox-in-the-box-jonathan-liew/)
Which is odd!
It should be odd but it's not particularly surprising, he's always come across to me as someone who fills the "what if you made an AI football fan" niche. All of the knowledge of the game and loads of fancy words to talk about it but no soul or real understanding of what football means to most fans.
See, this is unfair I think. He's written really well about the way the game is being taken away from normal people, being mined for content and all of that. Which makes these occasional lapses into the entitled megaclub fan all the more frustrating.
I'll bow to you on that because I don't read any of their stuff anymore but every time I see articles linked from him or Wilson they give the air either only giving a fuck about 6 clubs or not really understanding that being a football fan involves, at times, being irrational and being hypocritical. Ronay annoys me less but he doesn't seem to do so much football anymore and does have a habit of trying to be a bit too clever at times.
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As you (Drummond) wrote, we've kept improving season on season since Emery came in, to the point where if we're honest this season a good proportion of our supporters would be disappointed if we didn't make the Champions League now. That's a huge leap in a short space of time since we had Gerrard in charge.
When you take a moment to think about it, it is truely wild how quickly champions league expectations have been normalised for us.
I genuinely now think that the only way I'd accept failing to finish in CL places (from where we are now) would be if we won the Europa League - and even then there'd have to be some pretty good mitigating circumstances.
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As you (Drummond) wrote, we've kept improving season on season since Emery came in, to the point where if we're honest this season a good proportion of our supporters would be disappointed if we didn't make the Champions League now. That's a huge leap in a short space of time since we had Gerrard in charge.
When you take a moment to think about it, it is truely wild how quickly champions league expectations have been normalised for us.
I genuinely now think that the only way I'd accept failing to finish in CL places (from where we are now) would be if we won the Europa League - and even then there'd have to be some pretty good mitigating circumstances.
Is that increased expectations or just being 10 points clear of 5th after 22 games though? I'd be disappointed because it'll mean we've had a really shit last 16 games not because I think we're entitled to it. It would mean Brentford/Chelsea/Man U/Newcastle gaining more than half a point on us every round of games which, in reality given their own performances, would mean us losing 8 or 9 of those games.
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I think he was joking.
At Villa's expense, though.
Like I'm not offended or anything. I just found it quite strange to have a pointless swipe at an underdog.
He's usually very complimentary about us. I assume it was meant to be self-deprecating, along the lines of "the outcome that seems least likely may well be most probable", but written in such a way that the unassuming Gooner would just walk on by...
Edit: in other words, he is jokily describing the sense of entitlement among Gooners that many on here rail against.
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Or as Jonathan Liew put it graciously in his column, 'Aston Villa, lol, give me a break'. That's nice.
He predicted 9th for us in the Guardian pre-season podcast.
Rather incredibly he says his first team is Spurs and his second team is Arsenal:
https://thesetpieces.com/interviews/vox-in-the-box-jonathan-liew/
Which is odd!
It should be odd but it's not particularly surprising, he's always come across to me as someone who fills the "what if you made an AI football fan" niche. All of the knowledge of the game and loads of fancy words to talk about it but no soul or real understanding of what football means to most fans.
Read his write up of the Bayern win and, if I recall, the Preston game last year. Great writing and insight, and a lot of respect for the Villa and understanding of our potential.
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Yeah I don't think he dislikes us particularly or anything. I'm sure if we were top he'd be doing loving write-ups of the miracle, whatever Wilson thought about it. I just think we've gone from fashionable-to-like to fashionable-to-dismiss, as the discourse tornado howls round faster than we can keep up with.
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^^Is the Bayern one where he describes Rogers as a 'spinning machete of a player' (or similar)? Great line, that.
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When he did go see us play at Preston, Liew was more interested in the pies he could stuff his face with..
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^^Is the Bayern one where he describes Rogers as a 'spinning machete of a player' (or similar)? Great line, that.
It really was!
If I recall, the thrust of that article was that we should be more ambitious and the best is yet to come.
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Hand on heart I don’t think we can win it, but the longer we stay alongside the other two, who knows?
The fact we are saying things like this after our shit start to the season is just amazing.
We're 21 games in to the league season now. When we were genuine contenders back in 89/90 and 92/93, this was around the time we gained some real momentum before falling away in the last couple of months. I think if we can stay in striking distance from the top two over the next 2 months, then I think we'd be right in it, as we have shown we are capable of putting an 8-10 winning run together.
We are going to need some luck, both with the other two slipping up and us remaining pretty injury free. I'm not saying we will win it at all, but the possibility of it happening isn't very remote at this point either.
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Hand on heart I don’t think we can win it, but the longer we stay alongside the other two, who knows?
The fact we are saying things like this after our shit start to the season is just amazing.
We're 21 games in to the league season now. When we were genuine contenders back in 89/90 and 92/93, this was around the time we gained some real momentum before falling away in the last couple of months. I think if we can stay in striking distance from the top two over the next 2 months, then I think we'd be right in it, as we have shown we are capable of putting an 8-10 winning run together.
We are going to need some luck, both with the other two slipping up and us remaining pretty injury free. .
If we can get through January in touch, the league fixtures the next month look pretty tame. Lets see where everyone is then.
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The question is whether results will decline to match performances or whether performances could rise to match results.
I’d argue that so far, it’s been more of the latter than the former. We’ve benefitted less from the rub of the green in the past three or four games - I think that the balance of fortune favoured Arsenal at the Emirates (to the extent that we were unlucky not to score first half, to lose Onana to injury and to concede in the manner we did did after half time, which changed the game) and although Palace was an even game, our last 10-minute onslaught really should have brought home the points. So the luck is balancing out.
On the other hand, the players are catching fire one after the other as we progress and performances are improving as a result. It started with Cash and Konsa in September, spreading to McGinn, Buendia and Kamara, then Malen, Torres, and Maatsen, then Rogers, Onana, Martinez and Tielemans. Lindelof and Watkins ignited in recent games. Just a couple of pieces of kindling smoulder without flame, in Sancho and Guessand. If they catch light, or we get oven-ready reinforcements this window, we will definitely look like the kind of outfit that can win a trophy.
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We have a great coach who adapts to every match. I can’t see why that shouldn’t continue even with injuries.
Some of the passing yesterday was the best I’ve seen this season. A spell in midfield might suit Youri?
We’ve just got to make sure we keep Unai happy!
I loved yesterday. Still buzzing!
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Bumpety Bump.
Today has been a very good day,
Tomorrow we must start to turn the screw.
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In the words of local pop warbler Steve Winwood, "When you see a chance take it".
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Stop it.
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There are moments in the season that just feel pivotal and that game at Palace just felt like one of those. Seeing as how other results went that night and since then, a win there and then a win tomorrow and we would have been 2 points off top.
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In the words of local pop warbler Steve Winwood, "When you see a chance take it".
In the words of pop legends S Club 7, Don’t Stop Movin’ up the table.
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In the words of Snoop Dogg, Bitches Ain't Shit.
Sorry I mean we're gonna win the league.
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There are moments in the season that just feel pivotal and that game at Palace just felt like one of those. Seeing as how other results went that night and since then, a win there and then a win tomorrow and we would have been 2 points off top.
Imagine where we would be now had we started trying to win matches in August rather than a month later!
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In the words of Snoop Dogg, Bitches Ain't Shit.
Sorry I mean we're gonna win the league.
What you mean to say was, in the words of McFadden & Whitehead, "Ain’t no stoppin’ us now, we've got the groove". 8)
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The odds are absolutely stacked against us , but the way the league is panning out I’m not sure we’ll ever have a better opportunity.
I just hope we can pull something out of the bag in the transfer window to give us the extra momentum we’ll need to get through the next few months.
Most importantly, I think Emery thinks we can do it.
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Stop it.
What's wrong with Winwood?
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In the words of Snoop Dogg, Bitches Ain't Shit.
Sorry I mean we're gonna win the league.
What you mean to say was, in the words of McFadden & Whitehead, "Ain’t no stoppin’ us now, we've got the groove". 8)
Absolutely.
I'm so excited and warm.
8)
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We need Arsenal to lose it, us to run into no problems and to make instant impact signings now, so yes we can.
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How were we doing at this stage 2 years ago? I'm worried my mid-term memory is shot to bits, I honestly can't remember if there was similar talk to now.
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Let’s win our game tomorrow first.
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How were we doing at this stage 2 years ago? I'm worried my mid-term memory is shot to bits, I honestly can't remember if there was similar talk to now.
Points wise we're ahead of where we were.
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We've dropped to 22/1 which is the shortest I've seen us.
Man City are 6/1 and Arsenal are 1/4.
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How were we doing at this stage 2 years ago? I'm worried my mid-term memory is shot to bits, I honestly can't remember if there was similar talk to now.
Game 22 we lost and dropped to 5th on 43 points. Game 18 -24 was a bad patch where we only picked up 8pts in 7 games.
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We've dropped to 22/1 which is the shortest I've seen us.
Man City are 6/1 and Arsenal are 1/4.
...and it's odd on we'll get bugger all coverage from the media until about Easter...which is fine with me... : )
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Makes the last game of the season at C115y away more interesing as each week goes by. It almost certiantly won't be a title decider, but that extra couple of million in finishing 2nd rahter than 3rd is helpful.
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How were we doing at this stage 2 years ago? I'm worried my mid-term memory is shot to bits, I honestly can't remember if there was similar talk to now.
We had already shot our bolt.
The Sheffield United draw made us uneasy. The defeat at Old Trafford knocked the stuffing out of us. We brought kids on that night, as injuries piled up. And that was before the turn of the year. We were about to be turfed out of the cup by Chelsea, then embarrassed at home by the Jaudis. We spent the rest of the year with our foot on Spurs’ neck, trying to make sure they drowned.
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Makes the last game of the season at C115y away more interesing as each week goes by.
Yeah, if Pep's already lost the title a few weeks beforehand, makes it more likely that they'll give us a guard of honour.
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To me - its just take it game by game. If were still in the running when we move into April then maybe.
We're at a distinct disadvantage due to our smaller squad and not being able to spend. But if we just take it game by game - who knows. The longer its a possibility the more likely we are to get CL football which is a step closer to us being able to compete on a level playing field
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I'm most definitely pissed but we are most definitely winning the league
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Newcastle away is a big test as they're right bastards at home. I can see Arsenal dropping points against either Yanited or Leeds.
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Win against Everton and it becomes very interesting.
League games are whittling down, and we are still hanging on in there.
We need to get through the next couple of weeks and get Onana (at least) back, and If we can land a forward who can score in the transfer window, it’s very exciting.
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In the words of local pop warbler Steve Winwood, "When you see a chance take it".
In the words of George Michael, 'You gotta have faith, faith, faith.'
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How were we doing at this stage 2 years ago? I'm worried my mid-term memory is shot to bits, I honestly can't remember if there was similar talk to now.
We had already shot our bolt.
The Sheffield United draw made us uneasy. The defeat at Old Trafford knocked the stuffing out of us. We brought kids on that night, as injuries piled up. And that was before the turn of the year. We were about to be turfed out of the cup by Chelsea, then embarrassed at home by the Jaudis. We spent the rest of the year with our foot on Spurs’ neck, trying to make sure they drowned.
Yeah it wasn't the same after that Sheff Utd game. Won that and we'd have been top at Christmas. We followed that up by blowing a 2 goal lead and losing at Old Trafford and didn't really get that momentum back.again although we dud end up finishing 4th.
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In the words of local pop warbler Steve Winwood, "When you see a chance take it".
In the words of George Michael, 'You gotta have faith, faith, faith.'
In the words of the Jackson Sisters, "I believe in miracles".