Post by: eric woolban woolban on September 30, 2020, 10:30:18 AM
Post by: aev on September 30, 2020, 10:33:28 AM
Post by: Ger Regan on September 30, 2020, 10:33:50 AM
Post by: itbrvilla on September 30, 2020, 10:35:07 AM
Post by: frank black on September 30, 2020, 10:35:21 AM
Post by: Chap on September 30, 2020, 10:38:17 AM
Post by: Goldie.7 on September 30, 2020, 10:38:38 AM
Post by: VILLA MOLE on September 30, 2020, 10:39:36 AM
https://twitter.com/AVFCOfficial
Welcome Ross , now take the make up off ?
Post by: Keeno on September 30, 2020, 10:39:49 AM
Post by: ROBBO on September 30, 2020, 10:40:16 AM
Post by: chrisw1 on September 30, 2020, 10:40:49 AM
Welcome Ross and please be brilliant.
Post by: Russ aka Big Nose on September 30, 2020, 10:40:58 AM
Welcome Ross - it's a big season for him to prove that he can deliver what he is capable of - most immediately to earn a place in the England squad for the Euros.
I hope he can a bit more than I expect he will and I will be delighted to be proved wrong.
Post by: john e on September 30, 2020, 10:41:06 AM
I know others have some concerns which is fair enough but I think he will improve us and add a bit more physically to the team
Post by: Clampy on September 30, 2020, 10:41:53 AM
Post by: chrisw1 on September 30, 2020, 10:42:37 AM
He was on the bench for Chelski last night, but didn't get on. Does anyone know if that means he can play for us in the League Cup, even in time for tomorrow night? (old school name).I think he played in the last round so pretty sure he's cup tied.
Welcome Ross - it's a big season for him to prove that he can deliver what he is capable of - most immediately to earn a place in the England squad for the Euros.
I hope he can a bit more than I expect he will and I will be delighted to be proved wrong.
Post by: Sexual Ealing on September 30, 2020, 10:42:55 AM
In conclusion, I have no idea.
Post by: Ad@m on September 30, 2020, 10:45:49 AM
Barkley - not sure. He seems to have lost his way in recent years. But on his day he's a player who can create something out of nothing and we've only currently got Jack in the squad who can do that so at absolute worst he's cover in case Jack gets injured.
Post by: kippaxvilla2 on September 30, 2020, 10:48:31 AM
Post by: cdbearsfan on September 30, 2020, 10:48:36 AM
Post by: Mister E on September 30, 2020, 10:50:14 AM
Post by: jwarry on September 30, 2020, 10:51:19 AM
A quick look at Twitter (I know) tells me that Chelsea fans are a bit nonplussed about letting him go, which is good. They also think that this means they'll be getting Declan Rice, which is weird because they don't play in the same position (and in my opinion Rice is barely better than Ashley Westwood - but I was one of the few who rated him while he was at Villa).
In conclusion, I have no idea.
Reading the Everton forums he clearly left under a cloud and they seem to think there is not much between his ears, with comments like ‘cotton wool brains’ and ‘crayon eater’. Just hope he understands Deano!
Post by: SaddVillan on September 30, 2020, 10:51:25 AM
He was on the bench for Chelski last night, but didn't get on. Does anyone know if that means he can play for us in the League Cup, even in time for tomorrow night? (old school name).I think he played in the last round so pretty sure he's cup tied.
Welcome Ross - it's a big season for him to prove that he can deliver what he is capable of - most immediately to earn a place in the England squad for the Euros.
I hope he can a bit more than I expect he will and I will be delighted to be proved wrong.
He started for Chelsea in their 6-0 win against Barnsley and also scored.
Definitely cup tied.
Post by: ASHTONVILLA on September 30, 2020, 10:51:30 AM
We now have proper competition for the tree midfield places, which can only improve us.
Post by: Clampy on September 30, 2020, 10:51:45 AM
Post by: Duncan Shaw on September 30, 2020, 10:52:35 AM
Post by: Dick Edwards on September 30, 2020, 10:54:52 AM
Post by: Goldie.7 on September 30, 2020, 10:55:34 AM
A quick look at Twitter (I know) tells me that Chelsea fans are a bit nonplussed about letting him go, which is good.
They aren't thrilled he's gone here either:
https://www.theshedend.com/topic/31484-welcome-ross-barkley/page/47/#comments
Post by: Smithy on September 30, 2020, 10:55:54 AM
He improves our squad without question, and almost certainly improves our first 11 when he plays ahead of Hourihane.
He'll be motivated, with the Euros at the end of the season, so I see nothing but positives. It's a shame there's no mention of an option to buy, but let's hope that becomes a problem at the end of the season and we're desperate to keep him - even if it means we have to throw money at the issue next summer.
Post by: Rigadon on September 30, 2020, 10:55:57 AM
Post by: Drummond on September 30, 2020, 10:57:18 AM
He was brilliant for Everton, and has done ok for Chelsea. For where we are right now he's a good signing and adds to the first team squad.
I'm pleased.
Post by: LeeB on September 30, 2020, 10:57:48 AM
Welcome and please ram my words down my throat.
Post by: Brend'Watkins on September 30, 2020, 10:57:54 AM
I think it possibly pushes the likes of Lansbury towards the exit door and possibly Ramsey out on loan but I hope not in Ramsey's case although it would be understandable.
Ramsey will be a League Cup starter and in the squad. Marvelous is surplus now. Lansbury is a wart that just won't go away.
Post by: DB on September 30, 2020, 10:58:13 AM
Post by: Keeno on September 30, 2020, 11:00:24 AM
The front six of Luiz-McGinn-Barkley; Grealish-Watkins-Traore is an order of magnitude better than what we entered last season with.
Post by: Monty on September 30, 2020, 11:01:43 AM
Post by: Towser on September 30, 2020, 11:02:39 AM
Just spoke to a Everton ST holder at work. He says good ball carrier, will create but also will make a few mistakes and has not improved in 5 years after a lot of early promise. Let's see...Chelsea fan at work just said exactly the same to me, he also said he was convinced Ross was staying and Loftus-Cheek would be the one coming to us.
Post by: WilliamStanding on September 30, 2020, 11:02:54 AM
Love it
Post by: hilts_coolerking on September 30, 2020, 11:03:47 AM
Post by: kippaxvilla2 on September 30, 2020, 11:03:59 AM
Worcester Blue
10:56, Wed 30 Sep
Sir Digby Chicken Caesar
With Barkley now coming in, I just can't see them being in relegation trouble this season. Their recruitment has been decent compared to their previous forays
None of this would be happening if it wasn't for their spawny goal-line technology malfunction, the lucky bar stewards
Post by: jwarry on September 30, 2020, 11:05:25 AM
Post by: lovejoy on September 30, 2020, 11:06:00 AM
Post by: manic-road on September 30, 2020, 11:06:08 AM
Post by: Hairbandinho on September 30, 2020, 11:08:29 AM
Post by: Sexual Ealing on September 30, 2020, 11:09:09 AM
A quick look at Twitter (I know) tells me that Chelsea fans are a bit nonplussed about letting him go, which is good.
They aren't thrilled he's gone here either:
https://www.theshedend.com/topic/31484-welcome-ross-barkley/page/47/#comments
That's reassuring to read. As much as they're a club for wankers, racists and people with pony tails, Chelsea currently operate at a much higher level than we do. If he's good enough for them, he'll do a job for us.
Post by: old man villa fan on September 30, 2020, 11:11:13 AM
Non-plussed, is midfield really where we need to strengthen?
Yes, we keep on getting overrun at times. Also, we struggle to get central midfield players up quickly to support our central striker.
Post by: tomd2103 on September 30, 2020, 11:11:27 AM
Post by: Jon Crofts on September 30, 2020, 11:11:34 AM
Post by: OCD on September 30, 2020, 11:11:58 AM
A quick look at Twitter (I know) tells me that Chelsea fans are a bit nonplussed about letting him go, which is good.
They aren't thrilled he's gone here either:
https://www.theshedend.com/topic/31484-welcome-ross-barkley/page/47/#comments
Very encouraging.
Post by: Somniloquism on September 30, 2020, 11:13:12 AM
Post by: VILLA MOLE on September 30, 2020, 11:13:20 AM
A quick look at Twitter (I know) tells me that Chelsea fans are a bit nonplussed about letting him go, which is good.
They aren't thrilled he's gone here either:
https://www.theshedend.com/topic/31484-welcome-ross-barkley/page/47/#comments
That's reassuring to read. As much as they're a club for wankers, racists and people with pony tails, Chelsea currently operate at a much higher level than we do. If he's good enough for them, he'll do a job for us.
Definitely give us some physical presence in there
Post by: Tayls_7 on September 30, 2020, 11:14:05 AM
Post by: sid1964 on September 30, 2020, 11:14:18 AM
Hope we have not just borrowed another Stephen Ireland!!!
Post by: Risso on September 30, 2020, 11:19:50 AM
Post by: Dave on September 30, 2020, 11:19:55 AM
Post by: Risso on September 30, 2020, 11:23:27 AM
Cool. Not that sure he is who I'd have picked, but the squad is unquestionably stronger with him than without him.
I'd guess the thinking is he can play anywhere in the midfield, or in Jack's spot if needed.
Post by: SamTheMouse on September 30, 2020, 11:23:30 AM
Good player, though, no question. I'm sure he'll do well for us.
Post by: Drummond on September 30, 2020, 11:24:21 AM
Just spoke to a Everton ST holder at work. He says good ball carrier, will create but also will make a few mistakes and has not improved in 5 years after a lot of early promise. Let's see...Chelsea fan at work just said exactly the same to me, he also said he was convinced Ross was staying and Loftus-Cheek would be the one coming to us.
Maybe we'll buy RLC.
Post by: maidstonevillain on September 30, 2020, 11:24:53 AM
""On his day"...yes, correct. However, having watched him for years at Everton...his day is the 29th February..."
Post by: Sexual Ealing on September 30, 2020, 11:24:57 AM
@WhoScored
Ross Barkley is one of only 12 players to have started 20+ Premier League games since 18/19 to boast a pass accuracy in excess of 90% (90.2%)
Not bad for an attacking midfielder.
@AVFCOfficial's new signing
Post by: Risso on September 30, 2020, 11:25:30 AM
Post by: ROBBO on September 30, 2020, 11:28:51 AM
Post by: maidstonevillain on September 30, 2020, 11:31:24 AM
A quick look at Twitter (I know) tells me that Chelsea fans are a bit nonplussed about letting him go, which is good.
They aren't thrilled he's gone here either:
https://www.theshedend.com/topic/31484-welcome-ross-barkley/page/47/#comments
Interesting. Some pretty disparaging comments about Loftus-Cheek as well.
Post by: darren woolley on September 30, 2020, 11:32:46 AM
Post by: sickbeggar on September 30, 2020, 11:33:02 AM
Post by: GordonCowansisthegreatest on September 30, 2020, 11:35:52 AM
Post by: Dave on September 30, 2020, 11:36:25 AM
A quick look at Twitter (I know) tells me that Chelsea fans are a bit nonplussed about letting him go, which is good.
They aren't thrilled he's gone here either:
https://www.theshedend.com/topic/31484-welcome-ross-barkley/page/47/#comments
Interesting. Some pretty disparaging comments about Loftus-Cheek as well.
Yup, that all reads very well - pretty much universal that they'd rather he stayed and got minutes for them.
Post by: sickbeggar on September 30, 2020, 11:40:50 AM
He makes us stronger, gives us much needed experience and his record show he can play a lot of games a season without breaking down (RLC). The only downside is if its just a loan we could be selling Chelsea's players for them. Not ideal.
Such a contrast to the Drinkwater loan though eh buddy?
We can enjoy this one with his proven talent.
yeah the two players are not comparable really. Also shows he's not prepared to just sit on his fat contract and wants to play. If him and jack gel he could be back in the England team which is probably in his thinking.
Post by: ASHTONVILLA on September 30, 2020, 11:41:22 AM
Hoping we have a pre agreed fee to buy. Lets hope he does as well for us as Andy Townsend did back in the day.
Post by: Rudy Can't Fail on September 30, 2020, 11:42:34 AM
A quick look at Twitter (I know) tells me that Chelsea fans are a bit nonplussed about letting him go, which is good.
They aren't thrilled he's gone here either:
https://www.theshedend.com/topic/31484-welcome-ross-barkley/page/47/#comments
Interesting read that, Goldie. Seems to be highly rated but ideal to play 60 minutes rather than 90. Also the comments on LC make me happy we chose Barkley ahead of him.
Welcome, Ross. Do us proud.
Post by: Big Ming on September 30, 2020, 11:47:29 AM
Another giggle from our mates on SHA, they are imploding again, more references to the ghost goal and we shouldn’t even be in this position to sigh such players.
Love it
Surprised the sty-dwellers can even log onto the internet.
Post by: Mister E on September 30, 2020, 11:51:31 AM
Here's the only disparaging remark about us from theshedend:A quick look at Twitter (I know) tells me that Chelsea fans are a bit nonplussed about letting him go, which is good.They aren't thrilled he's gone here either:
https://www.theshedend.com/topic/31484-welcome-ross-barkley/page/47/#comments
Quote
That's an odd decision to say the least, and to Villa? That's a team battling relegation, how's that going to help him be a starter at Chelsea in 12 months time
Post by: Villa Lew on September 30, 2020, 11:52:47 AM
Post by: Big Ming on September 30, 2020, 11:53:40 AM
Post by: chrisw1 on September 30, 2020, 11:54:19 AM
Marvelous isn't surplus. Who plays DM when Luiz gets injured or needs a rest?I think it possibly pushes the likes of Lansbury towards the exit door and possibly Ramsey out on loan but I hope not in Ramsey's case although it would be understandable.
Ramsey will be a League Cup starter and in the squad. Marvelous is surplus now. Lansbury is a wart that just won't go away.
Post by: Brazilian Villain on September 30, 2020, 11:54:34 AM
I'm going to stay firmly on the fence for this one and hope that I get pushed over to the "he's done well and I should have had more faith" side!
This for me but prefer to have Ross than RLC. The truth is nobody knows e.g. half the comments on the Man U forum think he's rubbish and the other half think it's a great signing and that we're building a decent team. Only one way to find out.
Post by: Pat Mustard on September 30, 2020, 11:54:49 AM
Also, unlike when we signed the likes of Ireland and Drinkwater, we have a strong enough squad that he is going to have to work hard to justify a starting place in the team. Say what you like about a player like Hourihane (who I actually rate very highly for what he brings to the team), but there is no way he will stand idly by if someone is getting in ahead of him and not performing. I think we have sot some exciting times ahead.
Post by: lovejoy on September 30, 2020, 11:55:08 AM
Non-plussed, is midfield really where we need to strengthen?
Yes, we keep on getting overrun at times. Also, we struggle to get central midfield players up quickly to support our central striker.
Ahead of a left back and centre forward? Really?
Post by: LukeJames on September 30, 2020, 11:58:40 AM
Kind of like if Jack had gone to Man Utd and then joined Newcastle a couple of years later.
Post by: richtheholtender on September 30, 2020, 12:00:17 PM
Im a fan of Barkleys ability but going from his boyhood club to a 'top 4' club and then to us, I just hope hes got the hunger too match his ability.
Kind of like if Jack had gone to Man Utd and then joined Newcastle a couple of years later.
I’d look at it as Everton - made his name, Chelsea - made his money, Villa - winning stuff.
Post by: Risso on September 30, 2020, 12:00:52 PM
Marvelous isn't surplus. Who plays DM when Luiz gets injured or needs a rest?I think it possibly pushes the likes of Lansbury towards the exit door and possibly Ramsey out on loan but I hope not in Ramsey's case although it would be understandable.
Ramsey will be a League Cup starter and in the squad. Marvelous is surplus now. Lansbury is a wart that just won't go away.
Anybody except Marvelous hopefully.
Post by: sickbeggar on September 30, 2020, 12:05:31 PM
Post by: chrisw1 on September 30, 2020, 12:06:19 PM
Go on then?Marvelous isn't surplus. Who plays DM when Luiz gets injured or needs a rest?I think it possibly pushes the likes of Lansbury towards the exit door and possibly Ramsey out on loan but I hope not in Ramsey's case although it would be understandable.
Ramsey will be a League Cup starter and in the squad. Marvelous is surplus now. Lansbury is a wart that just won't go away.
Anybody except Marvelous hopefully.
Post by: Smithy on September 30, 2020, 12:08:11 PM
Then I saw this: https://twitter.com/ChelseaFC/status/1155727404566032389
:-)
Post by: Sexual Ealing on September 30, 2020, 12:09:24 PM
Post by: West Derby Villan on September 30, 2020, 12:14:25 PM
Post by: Axl Rose on September 30, 2020, 12:16:12 PM
Post by: fbriai on September 30, 2020, 12:18:33 PM
Post by: Footy-Vill on September 30, 2020, 12:20:52 PM
But also can at inside forward as one of 2 behind a striker.
His flexibility in midfield both as attacker and box to box provides Smith with so much variety in the tactical formation in-game during the match.
Ross class qualities will further enhance the team and how we play. Fantastic as long as he keeps limted off field distraction and focus on football. Though covid and curfews can help that.
Supremely looking forward to the link up with Grealish, Traore, Watkins and McGinn
Post by: jwarry on September 30, 2020, 12:26:01 PM
Post by: john e on September 30, 2020, 12:26:53 PM
How many of our existing midfielders would get a starting spot in that Chelsea squad? Good player that can't get regular football in a squad full of extremely good players.
We now have proper competition for the tree midfield places, which can only improve us.
Doug McGinn & Grealish
Post by: paul_e on September 30, 2020, 12:27:44 PM
Post by: dicedlam on September 30, 2020, 12:28:44 PM
Welcome Ross. Have a belter of a season, lad.
Post by: Shrek on September 30, 2020, 12:30:21 PM
Played 31 and 48 games last two seasons too
Post by: Shrek on September 30, 2020, 12:32:06 PM
How many of our existing midfielders would get a starting spot in that Chelsea squad? Good player that can't get regular football in a squad full of extremely good players.
We now have proper competition for the tree midfield places, which can only improve us.
Doug McGinn & Grealish
Only Grealish imo. Kante is better than Luiz and they have a number of players better than Mcginn.
I’m really excited by Barkley signing
Post by: sickbeggar on September 30, 2020, 12:36:09 PM
Post by: Bad English on September 30, 2020, 12:37:17 PM
Post by: RamboandBruno on September 30, 2020, 01:00:01 PM
However, my older brother is in his early 60s and for some reason only know to himself is a life long chelsea fan, a proper supporter as well, home away for decades even when they were shit throughout the 80s and early 90s.
Anyway asked his opinion and he basically said, chelsea never played him in the right way as a forward, driving, goal scoring midfielder and if we play him in that way, we have a very good player. He, like a lot of chelsea fans it seems are disappointed he’s gone and my bro actually said he’d rather loftus-cheek had gone, who he labelled ‘useless’. This seems a pretty consistent view across a lot of chelsea supporters, which hopefully bodes well.
And As an Evertonian, he’ll be dying to score against Liverpool on Sunday!!
Post by: Toronto Villa on September 30, 2020, 01:01:08 PM
He has 33 England caps.
He was brilliant for Everton, and has done ok for Chelsea. For where we are right now he's a good signing and adds to the first team squad.
I'm pleased.
That’s what’s important. It’s where we are now. A side that just stayed up, not in Europe, Barkley has left his club who will play in the CL, and with the exception of the LC, will challenge for titles. We now have three current England internationals in the side. Takes some stress off the current players in those central positions. One injury like we saw a With SJM last year and you saw just how thin we were. This is a very solid addition.
Post by: in exile on September 30, 2020, 01:04:04 PM
Please be better than the last Ross we signed.
Post by: dave shelley on September 30, 2020, 01:07:53 PM
Post by: OCD on September 30, 2020, 01:09:42 PM
Post by: Toronto Villa on September 30, 2020, 01:12:01 PM
Post by: chrisw1 on September 30, 2020, 01:13:16 PM
Exactly. We were very light in midfield and we now have McGinn, Hourihane and Barkley (and Ramsey) to compete for 2 places the way we currently set up. We're still a bit light at DM and have to hope Luiz can stay fit.He has 33 England caps.
He was brilliant for Everton, and has done ok for Chelsea. For where we are right now he's a good signing and adds to the first team squad.
I'm pleased.
That’s what’s important. It’s where we are now. A side that just stayed up, not in Europe, Barkley has left his club who will play in the CL, and with the exception of the LC, will challenge for titles. We now have three current England internationals in the side. Takes some stress off the current players in those central positions. One injury like we saw a With SJM last year and you saw just how thin we were. This is a very solid addition.
Post by: jwarry on September 30, 2020, 01:18:03 PM
He has 33 England caps.
He was brilliant for Everton, and has done ok for Chelsea. For where we are right now he's a good signing and adds to the first team squad.
I'm pleased.
We now have three current England internationals in the side.
Cant recall that ever happening before. Probably goes back to the 1800s!
Post by: Lastfootstamper on September 30, 2020, 01:21:56 PM
Non-plussed, is midfield really where we need to strengthen?
Yes, we keep on getting overrun at times. Also, we struggle to get central midfield players up quickly to support our central striker.
Ahead of a left back and centre forward? Really?
How is getting Barkley in on loan stopping us still strengthening elsewhere?
Post by: jwarry on September 30, 2020, 01:26:04 PM
He has 33 England caps.
He was brilliant for Everton, and has done ok for Chelsea. For where we are right now he's a good signing and adds to the first team squad.
I'm pleased.
We now have three current England internationals in the side.
Cant recall that ever happening before. Probably goes back to the 1800s!
Ah just checked, Euro qualifiers 83/4, Sid, Morley and Withe
Post by: Hookeysmith on September 30, 2020, 01:29:31 PM
But
Much capped England international, comes here from a challenging on all fronts team, a team in CL and a player that most Cheski fans are not too happy has left - all bodes well
Martinez
Cash
Traore
Watkins
and now Barkley
Better quality in all areas than we had previously
What a fantastic window.
I wonder if Nas was at Fulham to seal the deal? I also would be amazed if we had not agreed a deal to buy if it works out - we are so more professional nowadays
Was this the name linked with Jack when the club stated their ambition?
Do we think that is it for the window?
Post by: Dave on September 30, 2020, 01:30:27 PM
He has 33 England caps.
He was brilliant for Everton, and has done ok for Chelsea. For where we are right now he's a good signing and adds to the first team squad.
I'm pleased.
We now have three current England internationals in the side.
Cant recall that ever happening before. Probably goes back to the 1800s!
Ah just checked, Euro qualifiers 83/4, Sid, Morley and Withe
Surely we would have had at least three in the Barry / Milner / Young / Gabby / Downing / Heskey era?
Post by: Toronto Villa on September 30, 2020, 01:37:00 PM
Post by: rob_bridge on September 30, 2020, 01:37:12 PM
Ask only this - work your fucking bollocks off day in and day out and you can become a better player and Villa a better team.
Post by: Hookeysmith on September 30, 2020, 01:44:31 PM
Hookey I can still see us getting a forward in and a winger. I would like to see a LB. I think the international window closes next week so if Rashica is to happen it will by then. After that it will be the domestic market until the 16th I think where I can see a number of deals being done and for us especially outgoing.
I think if this is it then i would be more than happy
If stories are correct (and i mean that in the loosest term) then if Rashica does not fancy it then fuck him. I actually think we may have enough with the front 6 and cover for now.
I agree on a LB and let Taylor go and if Engels is not in Smiths mind maybe another, old head to act as cover
Post by: rob_bridge on September 30, 2020, 01:47:17 PM
First choice one as well.
Targett can be back up / impact player
Post by: dave.woodhall on September 30, 2020, 01:47:37 PM
He has 33 England caps.
He was brilliant for Everton, and has done ok for Chelsea. For where we are right now he's a good signing and adds to the first team squad.
I'm pleased.
We now have three current England internationals in the side.
Cant recall that ever happening before. Probably goes back to the 1800s!
Ah just checked, Euro qualifiers 83/4, Sid, Morley and Withe
Dublin, Merson and Hendrie v Czech Republic 1998.
Post by: Rudy Can't Fail on September 30, 2020, 01:53:25 PM
I know we are all thinking he’s competition for Conor but I suspect he will also allow McGuinn a rest too, which he sometimes needs, or even Jack come to think of it
Having watched a few highlight videos he does remind me of SJM. On top of that he, maybe to instruction, loves to supply the wingers. I'd be more than happy if we bring in another winger before the window closes, somebody that can consistently get the ball into the 6 yard box for Ollie to do his magic.
Post by: paul_e on September 30, 2020, 01:54:51 PM
He has 33 England caps.
He was brilliant for Everton, and has done ok for Chelsea. For where we are right now he's a good signing and adds to the first team squad.
I'm pleased.
We now have three current England internationals in the side.
Cant recall that ever happening before. Probably goes back to the 1800s!
Ah just checked, Euro qualifiers 83/4, Sid, Morley and Withe
Surely we would have had at least three in the Barry / Milner / Young / Gabby / Downing / Heskey era?
Barry, Young and Carson were all in the squad when we lost to croatia in 2007
Post by: jwarry on September 30, 2020, 01:55:00 PM
He has 33 England caps.
He was brilliant for Everton, and has done ok for Chelsea. For where we are right now he's a good signing and adds to the first team squad.
I'm pleased.
We now have three current England internationals in the side.
Cant recall that ever happening before. Probably goes back to the 1800s!
Ah just checked, Euro qualifiers 83/4, Sid, Morley and Withe
Surely we would have had at least three in the Barry / Milner / Young / Gabby / Downing / Heskey era?
Looks like it was Warnock, Heskey and Young for friendlies in 2010
Post by: Toronto Villa on September 30, 2020, 01:56:03 PM
Post by: olaftab on September 30, 2020, 01:56:14 PM
Post by: mike on September 30, 2020, 01:57:07 PM
He has 33 England caps.
He was brilliant for Everton, and has done ok for Chelsea. For where we are right now he's a good signing and adds to the first team squad.
I'm pleased.
We now have three current England internationals in the side.
Cant recall that ever happening before. Probably goes back to the 1800s!
Ah just checked, Euro qualifiers 83/4, Sid, Morley and Withe
Surely we would have had at least three in the Barry / Milner / Young / Gabby / Downing / Heskey era?
I remember O' Wanker once saying that all four of the England midfielders could be Villa players. He was including Nigel Reo-Coker in that equation.
Post by: rob_bridge on September 30, 2020, 01:58:19 PM
He has 33 England caps.
He was brilliant for Everton, and has done ok for Chelsea. For where we are right now he's a good signing and adds to the first team squad.
I'm pleased.
We now have three current England internationals in the side.
Cant recall that ever happening before. Probably goes back to the 1800s!
Ah just checked, Euro qualifiers 83/4, Sid, Morley and Withe
Dublin, Merson and Hendrie v Czech Republic 1998.
Hendrie replaced Merse I think. Have we had 3 on the pitch at the same time anytime since. Spinksy and Cowans played in a friendly but Nige didn't get anymore caps.
Post by: olaftab on September 30, 2020, 02:00:43 PM
Post by: olaftab on September 30, 2020, 02:02:19 PM
Did we not have Barry, Young, Milner and Downing in the squad once at the same time?He has 33 England caps.
He was brilliant for Everton, and has done ok for Chelsea. For where we are right now he's a good signing and adds to the first team squad.
I'm pleased.
We now have three current England internationals in the side.
Cant recall that ever happening before. Probably goes back to the 1800s!
Ah just checked, Euro qualifiers 83/4, Sid, Morley and Withe
Dublin, Merson and Hendrie v Czech Republic 1998.
Hendrie replaced Merse I think. Have we had 3 on the pitch at the same time anytime since. Spinksy and Cowans played in a friendly but Nige didn't get anymore caps.
Post by: KevinGage on September 30, 2020, 02:02:22 PM
A quick look at Twitter (I know) tells me that Chelsea fans are a bit nonplussed about letting him go, which is good. They also think that this means they'll be getting Declan Rice, which is weird because they don't play in the same position (and in my opinion Rice is barely better than Ashley Westwood - but I was one of the few who rated him while he was at Villa).
In conclusion, I have no idea.
Reading the Everton forums he clearly left under a cloud and they seem to think there is not much between his ears, with comments like ‘cotton wool brains’ and ‘crayon eater’. Just hope he understands Deano!
He was a big mover and shaker in the Chelsea card school, apparently. Until he started eating the cards.
It's not a huge issue in the grand scheme of things, but it probably means Hourihane is more likely to wind his contract down now in 2021 if a loanee gets priority over him.
Conor has his faults, but is a good squad player and seems popular with the group. Ideally we'd have got that sorted before now.
Post by: olaftab on September 30, 2020, 02:04:26 PM
LB is a must.Can Ross play left back? :)
Post by: paul_e on September 30, 2020, 02:11:11 PM
A quick look at Twitter (I know) tells me that Chelsea fans are a bit nonplussed about letting him go, which is good. They also think that this means they'll be getting Declan Rice, which is weird because they don't play in the same position (and in my opinion Rice is barely better than Ashley Westwood - but I was one of the few who rated him while he was at Villa).
In conclusion, I have no idea.
Reading the Everton forums he clearly left under a cloud and they seem to think there is not much between his ears, with comments like ‘cotton wool brains’ and ‘crayon eater’. Just hope he understands Deano!
He was a big mover and shaker in the Chelsea card school, apparently. Until he started eating the cards.
It's not a huge issue in the grand scheme of things, but it probably means Hourihane is more likely to wind his contract down now in 2021 if a loanee gets priority over him.
Conor has his faults, but is a good squad player and seems popular with the group. Ideally we'd have got that sorted before now.
Hourihane will be 30 in February, if he's not a regular starter at that point I can see him looking to move on and get a couple more seasons playing regularly at the highest level he can. It'll be a shame because he's a decent player who's been important for us, but the truth is Ramsey will overtake him in the next 12-18months even if we hadn't signed anyone.
Post by: Border villan on September 30, 2020, 02:11:21 PM
He has 33 England caps.
He was brilliant for Everton, and has done ok for Chelsea. For where we are right now he's a good signing and adds to the first team squad.
I'm pleased.
We now have three current England internationals in the side.
Cant recall that ever happening before. Probably goes back to the 1800s!
Heaton, Mings, Grealish.
Post by: jwarry on September 30, 2020, 02:16:31 PM
Post by: paul_e on September 30, 2020, 02:18:58 PM
He has 33 England caps.
He was brilliant for Everton, and has done ok for Chelsea. For where we are right now he's a good signing and adds to the first team squad.
I'm pleased.
We now have three current England internationals in the side.
Cant recall that ever happening before. Probably goes back to the 1800s!
Heaton, Mings, Grealish.
Should be the correct answer but Hudson-Odoi had played 15 matches for Chelsea by the time the squad was announced last November and therefore had to be picked ahead of Grealish.
Post by: simon ward 50 on September 30, 2020, 02:19:13 PM
Post by: Fred Crump on September 30, 2020, 02:19:34 PM
Post by: rob_bridge on September 30, 2020, 02:22:57 PM
LB is a must.Can Ross play left back? :)
Still doing his Chatshow
Post by: rob_bridge on September 30, 2020, 02:31:38 PM
Looks like securing Jack secured this deal judging by Barkley’s comments. Can’t help feeling the best signing of all this window is bailing him down
Defo
I remember when Keane signed an extension at OT turn of the century and one of the pundits (Hansen I think) said it was a better signing than Yorke, Stam etc..as it was like signing (at the time) a 10m player every season for 10 years.
Post by: Brazilian Villain on September 30, 2020, 02:34:58 PM
Post by: maidstonevillain on September 30, 2020, 02:35:04 PM
He has 33 England caps.
He was brilliant for Everton, and has done ok for Chelsea. For where we are right now he's a good signing and adds to the first team squad.
I'm pleased.
We now have three current England internationals in the side.
Cant recall that ever happening before. Probably goes back to the 1800s!
Ah just checked, Euro qualifiers 83/4, Sid, Morley and Withe
Milner, Young, Heskey, James, plus one other I seem to recall.
Post by: maidstonevillain on September 30, 2020, 02:36:56 PM
50+ posts in they're not happy on Molineux Mix, we're in danger of overtaking them apparently.
Overtaking! We simply let them pass temporarily.
Post by: KevinGage on September 30, 2020, 02:37:38 PM
And Dublin, Merson and Southgate may have been on the pitch when Hendrie made his debut.
Post by: rob_bridge on September 30, 2020, 02:37:44 PM
He has 33 England caps.
He was brilliant for Everton, and has done ok for Chelsea. For where we are right now he's a good signing and adds to the first team squad.
I'm pleased.
We now have three current England internationals in the side.
Cant recall that ever happening before. Probably goes back to the 1800s!
Ah just checked, Euro qualifiers 83/4, Sid, Morley and Withe
Milner, Young, Heskey, James, plus one other I seem to recall.
James left in 2001. Milner was 15 and Young was in Watford's youth team.
Post by: SoccerHQ on September 30, 2020, 02:39:34 PM
Post by: maidstonevillain on September 30, 2020, 02:39:46 PM
He has 33 England caps.
He was brilliant for Everton, and has done ok for Chelsea. For where we are right now he's a good signing and adds to the first team squad.
I'm pleased.
We now have three current England internationals in the side.
Cant recall that ever happening before. Probably goes back to the 1800s!
Ah just checked, Euro qualifiers 83/4, Sid, Morley and Withe
Milner, Young, Heskey, James, plus one other I seem to recall.
James left in 2001. Milner was 15 and Young was in Watford's youth team.
Forget James, and put in Barry.
Post by: maidstonevillain on September 30, 2020, 02:42:10 PM
Pretty sure Downing, Bent and Young all started for England v Wales in a euro 2012 qualifier when they were all here.
I'm sure I recall there were 5 Villa players on the pitch for England in a game around about 2012. They didn't all start.
Post by: Chris Smith on September 30, 2020, 02:44:49 PM
Post by: SoccerHQ on September 30, 2020, 02:49:14 PM
A player I’ve always found a bit underwhelming in spite of or perhaps because of the hype. Hoping to be convinced that I misjudged him.
There is a bit of Tom Cleverley vibes about it given he's mid 20s now and it hasn't worked out for him at a top 6 club.
Still for where we are it's a very decent signing to continue building upwards.
It's surprising how often he's started for England in last 2 years so Southgate in his wisdom rates him higher than Grealish and there's still a chance he could make the euros squad if he plays well enough for us.
Post by: Dante Lavelli on September 30, 2020, 02:54:42 PM
Post by: maidstonevillain on September 30, 2020, 02:57:19 PM
What are the loan rules? Is there a limit on how many a club can make and where from?
Only one from the same club.
Post by: brian green on September 30, 2020, 03:01:19 PM
Post by: enigma on September 30, 2020, 03:08:23 PM
I really like the look of our midfield now. That first 11 is starting to look hugely improved over last season.
Post by: chrisw1 on September 30, 2020, 03:22:07 PM
Bang goes getting Tammy back.Bearing in mind he started and scored in their last league game I'd say that chance had already gone anyway.
Post by: Smithy on September 30, 2020, 03:25:14 PM
Post by: Matt C on September 30, 2020, 03:30:43 PM
Bang goes getting Tammy back.
On loan at least.
Post by: brontebilly on September 30, 2020, 03:36:46 PM
Big opportunity for Barkley with us to get his career back on track but think the budget could/should have gone elsewhere.
Post by: Pat Mustard on September 30, 2020, 03:37:32 PM
50+ posts in they're not happy on Molineux Mix, we're in danger of overtaking them apparently.
They are so f*cking weird. Wolves could sign Neymar and I doubt there would be more than a ripple on here - we sign Barkley on loan and they have a whole dedicated thread! If Wolves were a person we'd be taking out a restraining order.
Post by: hipkiss92 on September 30, 2020, 03:50:14 PM
Barry left before Downing signed. But I think Hesket, Gabby, Milner, Young and C Davies were at least all called up to the squad around 2010, even if they weren't all on the pitch at the same time.Did we not have Barry, Young, Milner and Downing in the squad once at the same time?He has 33 England caps.
He was brilliant for Everton, and has done ok for Chelsea. For where we are right now he's a good signing and adds to the first team squad.
I'm pleased.
We now have three current England internationals in the side.
Cant recall that ever happening before. Probably goes back to the 1800s!
Ah just checked, Euro qualifiers 83/4, Sid, Morley and Withe
Dublin, Merson and Hendrie v Czech Republic 1998.
Hendrie replaced Merse I think. Have we had 3 on the pitch at the same time anytime since. Spinksy and Cowans played in a friendly but Nige didn't get anymore caps.
Post by: Ian. on September 30, 2020, 03:50:30 PM
Post by: tim on September 30, 2020, 03:51:45 PM
Post by: KRS on September 30, 2020, 03:56:00 PM
Now please bring in Rashica and buy a quality LB...please!!!
Post by: Deano's Mullet on September 30, 2020, 03:59:54 PM
Post by: Risso on September 30, 2020, 04:07:31 PM
Decent signing but keeping all these midfield players happy is what will worry me. I suppose it’s part and parcel of having a big squad.
That's the last of Dean's worries. We're one injury or suspension from having to play Nakamba or Lansbury every game, and if either of them aren't happy, well here's 10p for them to phone somebody who gives a shit!
Post by: rob_bridge on September 30, 2020, 04:11:18 PM
50+ posts in they're not happy on Molineux Mix, we're in danger of overtaking them apparently.
They are so f*cking weird. Wolves could sign Neymar and I doubt there would be more than a ripple on here - we sign Barkley on loan and they have a whole dedicated thread! If Wolves were a person we'd be taking out a restraining order.
Strange bunch the Dingles - easiest way to wind them up is to tell them they have turned into Baggies fans, being obsessed with us even though they have had a better team for a couple of years+.
Post by: rooboy316 on September 30, 2020, 04:11:40 PM
I also would be amazed if we had not agreed a deal to buy if it works out - we are so more professional nowadays
Haven’t seen anything quoted about loan to buy. Agree we seem much more switched on about this than previously, but I can also see Chelsea wanting to loan him out to give him game time but wanting to keep their options open if some of their signings don’t impress.
He’s a good addition for a year, regardless of buyout clause, and keeps our budget/ffp open for other purchases.
Post by: N'ZMAV on September 30, 2020, 04:12:33 PM
Let's hope it's not another Jermaine Jenas though :D
Post by: teamvillage on September 30, 2020, 04:19:02 PM
Barry left before Downing signed. But I think Hesket, Gabby, Milner, Young and C Davies were at least all called up to the squad around 2010, even if they weren't all on the pitch at the same time.Did we not have Barry, Young, Milner and Downing in the squad once at the same time?He has 33 England caps.
He was brilliant for Everton, and has done ok for Chelsea. For where we are right now he's a good signing and adds to the first team squad.
I'm pleased.
We now have three current England internationals in the side.
Cant recall that ever happening before. Probably goes back to the 1800s!
Ah just checked, Euro qualifiers 83/4, Sid, Morley and Withe
Dublin, Merson and Hendrie v Czech Republic 1998.
Hendrie replaced Merse I think. Have we had 3 on the pitch at the same time anytime since. Spinksy and Cowans played in a friendly but Nige didn't get anymore caps.
Gabby, Barry, Carson, Davies, Ash - Switzerland 2008.
Post by: rob_bridge on September 30, 2020, 04:20:04 PM
This is a good signing - better than what we have in most aspects of centre midfield.
Let's hope it's not another Jermaine Jenas though :D
Barclay played 30+ games last season. He only has to play 4 this season to beat JJ
Post by: Nunkin1965 on September 30, 2020, 04:21:56 PM
Exciting times lads & lasses!
Post by: Risso on September 30, 2020, 04:22:45 PM
Post by: john e on September 30, 2020, 04:23:26 PM
technically very gifted and not lightweight
Grealish Luiz McGinadine Barkley
its a long time since we put a stronger midfield out than that
if Barkley and Grealish click it could be exciting times
Post by: supertom on September 30, 2020, 04:23:45 PM
I've always thought Barkley was overhyped, but that's the same for most English players. I think he moved to a top four side earlier than he should have. We've seen that with many players over the years and they don't get the game time they need to improve or they struggle to shine among more stars. It's a good move for him and a good move for us. He probably needs to drop a level, and he's also good enough to help move ourselves up a level too.
Post by: SoccerHQ on September 30, 2020, 04:43:50 PM
Main complaint from Chelsea fans is his decision making in final third is poor, shooting miles over the bar when the easy pass is on either side of him etc.
Still the key is to start signing players on Jack's wavelength and Barkley will certainly be that in his best games for us.
Post by: Ian. on September 30, 2020, 04:47:38 PM
Post by: Damo70 on September 30, 2020, 04:50:34 PM
I'll be honest, I've never been a massive fan and I've never understood why he's rated so highly. It'll be interesting to see how he fits in though, it's an intriguing one. Hope he has a belter of a season.
I have never been a big fan of his either but he has played 150 times for Everton, 50 times for Chelsea and 33 times for England so he must have something about him. To be fair he does have some skill and he is quite a big guy too so can obviously handle the physical side of the game. Also at 26 coming up 27 he should be at his peak.
Post by: BC Villain on September 30, 2020, 05:15:58 PM
Good to see Sky's condescending, anti-Villa agenda is still alive and kicking
Post by: JJ-AV on September 30, 2020, 05:31:21 PM
Post by: cdbearsfan on September 30, 2020, 05:45:07 PM
Post by: N'ZMAV on September 30, 2020, 05:52:23 PM
Just now Talk sport are to be discussing Ross Barkley move to Villa.no thanks
Durham and Gough.
https://talksport.com/radioplayer/live/index.html?interstitial=true
Post by: Clampy on September 30, 2020, 06:01:14 PM
Just now Talk sport are to be discussing Ross Barkley move to Villa.no thanks
Durham and Gough.
https://talksport.com/radioplayer/live/index.html?interstitial=true
I actually just put TS on for the first time in years. It's still absolute shite.
Post by: CT on September 30, 2020, 06:01:55 PM
"Next up , as he joins Aston Villa on loan, we look at where it all went wrong for Ross Barkley"
Good to see Sky's condescending, anti-Villa agenda is still alive and kicking
Following on from Monday where Alan Smith told the nation how embarrassing it was for Fulham to be losing at home to us.
Post by: Mister E on September 30, 2020, 06:02:10 PM
Why would yer?!Just now Talk sport are to be discussing Ross Barkley move to Villa.no thanks
Durham and Gough.
https://talksport.com/radioplayer/live/index.html?interstitial=true
Post by: PaulTheVillan on September 30, 2020, 06:03:47 PM
Post by: dave shelley on September 30, 2020, 06:04:57 PM
If he gives us as much as Andy Townsend did when we signed him from Chelsea I will be very happy.
Don't forget Kenny Swain!
Post by: Rory on September 30, 2020, 06:07:47 PM
"Next up , as he joins Aston Villa on loan, we look at where it all went wrong for Ross Barkley"
Good to see Sky's condescending, anti-Villa agenda is still alive and kicking
I think that's quite funny, I've got to be honest.
Post by: Rory on September 30, 2020, 06:08:42 PM
Post by: London Villan on September 30, 2020, 06:10:18 PM
Post by: johnc on September 30, 2020, 06:30:13 PM
Post by: N'ZMAV on September 30, 2020, 06:31:17 PM
Post by: maidstonevillain on September 30, 2020, 06:42:19 PM
Post by: alan_clarke on September 30, 2020, 07:08:56 PM
My Everton supporting mate today said he’s technically superb but makes a lot of frustrating decisions. He’s like a stupid Zidane he said...
Post by: JimmyV on September 30, 2020, 07:18:15 PM
Post by: Mister E on September 30, 2020, 07:21:39 PM
More than happy with a stupid Zidane at our stage of evolution.... and we have McGinn ("Super John McGinn")
Post by: KevinGage on September 30, 2020, 07:30:15 PM
Without that option to buy it's a danger.
But against that, if he has designs on getting back in the England squad he'll need to be performing regularly. He also has better players around him already than Cleverly did back then, so if it goes well, making the move permanent could suit all.
Post by: saunders_heroes on September 30, 2020, 07:31:58 PM
Post by: PaulWinch again on September 30, 2020, 07:40:02 PM
Post by: dave shelley on September 30, 2020, 07:41:50 PM
Post by: Allan C on September 30, 2020, 07:55:20 PM
Post by: Monty on September 30, 2020, 07:56:58 PM
Post by: RamboandBruno on September 30, 2020, 08:07:31 PM
Cleverley was never good enough anyway irrespective of the direction we were heading.
Just my opinion, but I thought cleverly made Connors hologram games seem electric, a totally average at best player.
I too love the idea of having a stupid zidane in the side 😊
Post by: john2710 on September 30, 2020, 08:27:25 PM
Post by: john e on September 30, 2020, 08:29:05 PM
How many of our existing midfielders would get a starting spot in that Chelsea squad? Good player that can't get regular football in a squad full of extremely good players.
We now have proper competition for the tree midfield places, which can only improve us.
Doug McGinn & Grealish
Only Grealish imo. Kante is better than Luiz and they have a number of players better than Mcginn.
I’m really excited by Barkley signing
It was a bit tongue in cheek mate
I’d have put in one of those smily face emojis but they don’t tend to come out on this forum
Post by: Smithy on September 30, 2020, 08:35:53 PM
It's an exciting prospect, certainly. Not just what Ross will bring to the team directly, but how having another genuinely talented and creative player in midfield will give Jack a little more freedom, and perhaps a little less attention from opposition defences...
Bring it on!
Post by: Lastfootstamper on September 30, 2020, 08:49:37 PM
He’s precisely the type of player we need, good technique & can go at teams in the final third. Provided he’s up for it & I think he is, this is a good move for both.
Last night on Chelsea's bench, this morning he's training at Bodymoor Heath, and all smiles on the photos doing the rounds. I think he's up for it.
Post by: rougegorge on September 30, 2020, 08:53:09 PM
Many Chelsea fans seem aghast that he's gone rather than Loftus-Cheek or Mount!
Post by: ktvillan on September 30, 2020, 08:57:44 PM
Post by: mallo on September 30, 2020, 09:02:23 PM
Post by: London Villan on September 30, 2020, 09:09:10 PM
Post by: Astnor on September 30, 2020, 09:11:45 PM
Post by: pauliewalnuts on September 30, 2020, 09:27:18 PM
https://twitter.com/DeadlineDayLive/status/1311237731771723777/photo/1
Post by: Monty on September 30, 2020, 09:36:07 PM
No reflection whatsoever on his ability - I think he's a good player - but in this picture at least, he looks about 43.
https://twitter.com/DeadlineDayLive/status/1311237731771723777/photo/1
I'm really pleased with this. Getting (as I now am) too old to qualify for Lange's transfer policy, I'm starting to wonder if players look younger now than they did in, say, the 90s simply because I was younger then, or because they actually look younger now. I mean, I watch videos of Ronald Koeman when he was my age, and the dude still looks like a f***ing man back then, and I think 'there's no way I look that old, people must have looked older then'. Barkley, with his older face, proves that I'm right. That's what a 26 year old footballer should look like.
Does anyone know what I'm talking about or am I just rambling incoherently?
Post by: Sexual Ealing on September 30, 2020, 09:56:53 PM
No reflection whatsoever on his ability - I think he's a good player - but in this picture at least, he looks about 43.
https://twitter.com/DeadlineDayLive/status/1311237731771723777/photo/1
I'm really pleased with this. Getting (as I now am) too old to qualify for Lange's transfer policy, I'm starting to wonder if players look younger now than they did in, say, the 90s simply because I was younger then, or because they actually look younger now. I mean, I watch videos of Ronald Koeman when he was my age, and the dude still looks like a f***ing man back then, and I think 'there's no way I look that old, people must have looked older then'. Barkley, with his older face, proves that I'm right. That's what a 26 year old footballer should look like.
Does anyone know what I'm talking about or am I just rambling incoherently?
Nobody looks older than old footballers. I have no idea why, but a 36 year old player will always look three times as weathered as a 36 year old real life human. I'm 42 and balding and I look younger than Mark Hughes did when he was 27.
Post by: cdbearsfan on September 30, 2020, 09:58:08 PM
Post by: dave.woodhall on September 30, 2020, 10:00:29 PM
No reflection whatsoever on his ability - I think he's a good player - but in this picture at least, he looks about 43.
https://twitter.com/DeadlineDayLive/status/1311237731771723777/photo/1
I'm really pleased with this. Getting (as I now am) too old to qualify for Lange's transfer policy, I'm starting to wonder if players look younger now than they did in, say, the 90s simply because I was younger then, or because they actually look younger now. I mean, I watch videos of Ronald Koeman when he was my age, and the dude still looks like a f***ing man back then, and I think 'there's no way I look that old, people must have looked older then'. Barkley, with his older face, proves that I'm right. That's what a 26 year old footballer should look like.
Does anyone know what I'm talking about or am I just rambling incoherently?
Nobody looks older than old footballers. I have no idea why, but a 36 year old player will always look three times as weathered as a 36 year old real life human. I'm 42 and balding and I look younger than Mark Hughes did when he was 27.
And Wayne Rooney when he was 19.
Post by: Tayls_7 on September 30, 2020, 10:00:37 PM
Post by: kippaxvilla2 on September 30, 2020, 10:11:32 PM
Post by: Meanwood Villa on September 30, 2020, 10:16:47 PM
Post by: cdbearsfan on September 30, 2020, 10:22:01 PM
Post by: ASHTONVILLA on September 30, 2020, 10:28:06 PM
I don't know if this is a barometer of anything or not really but I've had more neutral fans messaging about Barkley today than any signing I can remember since I don't know when. Seems to be quite big news. They all think it's a better signing than me too.
Same here. Man U fan, and Everton fan at work both brought it up. Had a WhatsApp message about it from a friend in Jordan (Chelsea fan), and my PNE supporting neighbor collated me on my way in the house to tell me what a good signing it was.
It is a signing I was hoping would happen, but I am taken aback how much it has changed the way neutral fans regard us.
Post by: Dave on September 30, 2020, 10:45:08 PM
No reflection whatsoever on his ability - I think he's a good player - but in this picture at least, he looks about 43.
https://twitter.com/DeadlineDayLive/status/1311237731771723777/photo/1
I'm really pleased with this. Getting (as I now am) too old to qualify for Lange's transfer policy, I'm starting to wonder if players look younger now than they did in, say, the 90s simply because I was younger then, or because they actually look younger now. I mean, I watch videos of Ronald Koeman when he was my age, and the dude still looks like a f***ing man back then, and I think 'there's no way I look that old, people must have looked older then'. Barkley, with his older face, proves that I'm right. That's what a 26 year old footballer should look like.
Does anyone know what I'm talking about or am I just rambling incoherently?
Nobody looks older than old footballers. I have no idea why, but a 36 year old player will always look three times as weathered as a 36 year old real life human. I'm 42 and balding and I look younger than Mark Hughes did when he was 27.
I've cumulatively lost hours on this Twitter account:
https://mobile.twitter.com/80sAging
Photos of footballers from the 80s who looks far older than they should.
For example, Nivaldo of Portimonense.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EauwoBVX0AUtUJJ?format=jpg)
Every one of his 29 years at the time of photo, showing on his face.
Post by: Sexual Ealing on September 30, 2020, 10:50:12 PM
Post by: dave shelley on September 30, 2020, 10:55:06 PM
Post by: Brazilian Villain on September 30, 2020, 11:12:38 PM
Post by: Sexual Ealing on September 30, 2020, 11:17:32 PM
Some beauts on there, unfortunately Des Bremner is one. I cry foul!
Remind me to never let you set me up on a blind date, Dave!
Post by: JD on September 30, 2020, 11:19:29 PM
Obviously still upset about the way he left Everton ;D
Post by: Monty on September 30, 2020, 11:35:50 PM
No reflection whatsoever on his ability - I think he's a good player - but in this picture at least, he looks about 43.
https://twitter.com/DeadlineDayLive/status/1311237731771723777/photo/1
I'm really pleased with this. Getting (as I now am) too old to qualify for Lange's transfer policy, I'm starting to wonder if players look younger now than they did in, say, the 90s simply because I was younger then, or because they actually look younger now. I mean, I watch videos of Ronald Koeman when he was my age, and the dude still looks like a f***ing man back then, and I think 'there's no way I look that old, people must have looked older then'. Barkley, with his older face, proves that I'm right. That's what a 26 year old footballer should look like.
Does anyone know what I'm talking about or am I just rambling incoherently?
Nobody looks older than old footballers. I have no idea why, but a 36 year old player will always look three times as weathered as a 36 year old real life human. I'm 42 and balding and I look younger than Mark Hughes did when he was 27.
I've cumulatively lost hours on this Twitter account:
https://mobile.twitter.com/80sAging
Photos of footballers from the 80s who looks far older than they should.
For example, Nivaldo of Portimonense.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EauwoBVX0AUtUJJ?format=jpg)
Every one of his 29 years at the time of photo, showing on his face.
This is the best thing.
Post by: LeeB on September 30, 2020, 11:37:32 PM
Post by: cdbearsfan on September 30, 2020, 11:46:58 PM
Got a text from an Everton supporting mate at 5am this morning saying Villa have signed Ross the Rat.
Obviously still upset about the way he left Everton ;D
Kind of appropriate that they still employ Fabian the Snake. We can have a boo off next time they allow fans in.
Both players will have retired by then but we both know our 'istry so shouldn't be a problem.
Post by: Ian. on September 30, 2020, 11:57:13 PM
Post by: villadelph on October 01, 2020, 12:43:44 AM
Got a text from an Everton supporting mate at 5am this morning saying Villa have signed Ross the Rat.
Obviously still upset about the way he left Everton ;D
Kind of appropriate that they still employ Fabian the Snake. We can have a boo off next time they allow fans in.
Amazing.
Post by: eamonn on October 01, 2020, 01:54:25 AM
Have a feeling this might be similar to the Tom Cleverly loan - whereby Barkley sees out time with us until he gets a more attractive move, turning in the odd decent game here and there.
Without that option to buy it's a danger.
But against that, if he has designs on getting back in the England squad he'll need to be performing regularly. He also has better players around him already than Cleverly did back then, so if it goes well, making the move permanent could suit all.
Benteke and Delph weren't exactly bad team-mates.
Post by: Scott Nielsen on October 01, 2020, 04:23:04 AM
Have a feeling this might be similar to the Tom Cleverly loan - whereby Barkley sees out time with us until he gets a more attractive move, turning in the odd decent game here and there.
Wouldn't it be easier for him to simply remain at Chelsea in that case? Why uproot himself just to pointlessly coast through a season in a new environment and the risks that come with that?
No telling if he'll be a success for us but I see no reason to question his commitment.
Post by: algy on October 01, 2020, 06:13:57 AM
That's a fantastic Twitter account.No reflection whatsoever on his ability - I think he's a good player - but in this picture at least, he looks about 43.
https://twitter.com/DeadlineDayLive/status/1311237731771723777/photo/1
I'm really pleased with this. Getting (as I now am) too old to qualify for Lange's transfer policy, I'm starting to wonder if players look younger now than they did in, say, the 90s simply because I was younger then, or because they actually look younger now. I mean, I watch videos of Ronald Koeman when he was my age, and the dude still looks like a f***ing man back then, and I think 'there's no way I look that old, people must have looked older then'. Barkley, with his older face, proves that I'm right. That's what a 26 year old footballer should look like.
Does anyone know what I'm talking about or am I just rambling incoherently?
Nobody looks older than old footballers. I have no idea why, but a 36 year old player will always look three times as weathered as a 36 year old real life human. I'm 42 and balding and I look younger than Mark Hughes did when he was 27.
I've cumulatively lost hours on this Twitter account:
https://mobile.twitter.com/80sAging
Photos of footballers from the 80s who looks far older than they should.
For example, Nivaldo of Portimonense.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EauwoBVX0AUtUJJ?format=jpg)
Every one of his 29 years at the time of photo, showing on his face.
Post by: rooboy316 on October 01, 2020, 07:00:37 AM
Post by: Ads on October 01, 2020, 07:15:58 AM
The playing of two 8s doesn't appear to do Liverpool harm and given how effective our press has been the past 8 games (and across different squads) I think/I hope Barkley can add to that.
Its interesting to read briefly not just across the local forums, but also other teams and their reactions to this signing.
Post by: algy on October 01, 2020, 08:16:22 AM
Steer
Guilbert - Elmo(?) - Hause - Taylor
Ramsey - Nakamba - Hourihane
Trez - Davies/Wesley - AEG
That's not a bad side really - probably struggle in the Premier League, but I'd put money on them beating our first team from 2 years ago.
Post by: The Edge on October 01, 2020, 08:18:42 AM
Some things are genuine concerns like a previous injury record for instance and are worthy of debate but speculation about what someone's intentions are really aren't. I could say that I think Barkley's intentions are to light up the club with brilliant performances and force his way into the England squad but unless he comes out and says that I'm just going to live in hope that that's the case.Have a feeling this might be similar to the Tom Cleverly loan - whereby Barkley sees out time with us until he gets a more attractive move, turning in the odd decent game here and there.
Wouldn't it be easier for him to simply remain at Chelsea in that case? Why uproot himself just to pointlessly coast through a season in a new environment and the risks that come with that?
No telling if he'll be a success for us but I see no reason to question his commitment.
Post by: chrisw1 on October 01, 2020, 09:11:43 AM
If you look at our second eleven nowChrist I hope you're not a betting man. I'm pretty confident that team would be relegated from the Championship not get to the play off final.
Steer
Guilbert - Elmo(?) - Hause - Taylor
Ramsey - Nakamba - Hourihane
Trez - Davies/Wesley - AEG
That's not a bad side really - probably struggle in the Premier League, but I'd put money on them beating our first team from 2 years ago.
Post by: Mister E on October 01, 2020, 09:21:06 AM
Quote
Powerful running with the ball from deep. Can play cute passes to spring forwards free. Has looked v good for us coming off the bench. I would have kept him for that reason. My concern is he might be a flat track bully, often fails to produce against the good or well organised teams.
There will be a few times when he makes a great run, you drop your (metaphorical) chocolate digestive into your (metaphorical) coffee you're so excited, Grealish has made a great run and is clear, "pass Ross, PASS". He does. Too late. Grealish is offside. You look down at your coffee. You wonder what it's all for....
There is, I think, a potentially really good player inside a very good athlete. Frank Lampard is not a coach. J reckon Guardiola or Klopp would make him a better player, so the question is, will Dean improve him?
Post by: malckennedy on October 01, 2020, 09:42:33 AM
If you look at our second eleven nowChrist I hope you're not a betting man. I'm pretty confident that team would be relegated from the Championship not get to the play off final.
Steer
Guilbert - Elmo(?) - Hause - Taylor
Ramsey - Nakamba - Hourihane
Trez - Davies/Wesley - AEG
That's not a bad side really - probably struggle in the Premier League, but I'd put money on them beating our first team from 2 years ago.
And me.
Post by: Chris Smith on October 01, 2020, 09:43:26 AM
Here's what my reliable Chelsea supporting (STH) mate says:QuotePowerful running with the ball from deep. Can play cute passes to spring forwards free. Has looked v good for us coming off the bench. I would have kept him for that reason. My concern is he might be a flat track bully, often fails to produce against the good or well organised teams.
There will be a few times when he makes a great run, you drop your (metaphorical) chocolate digestive into your (metaphorical) coffee you're so excited, Grealish has made a great run and is clear, "pass Ross, PASS". He does. Too late. Grealish is offside. You look down at your coffee. You wonder what it's all for....
There is, I think, a potentially really good player inside a very good athlete. Frank Lampard is not a coach. J reckon Guardiola or Klopp would make him a better player, so the question is, will Dean improve him?
That’s a more eloquent version of what I said to my lad about him. He’s got all the attributes but too often he makes the wrong decision, plays it left when there are two players free on the right or holds on to it when a forward pass is on. If he can be coached out of it then Chelsea will be getting a decent player back next season.
Post by: The Edge on October 01, 2020, 09:52:51 AM
Here's what my reliable Chelsea supporting (STH) mate says:Good stuff. I posted yesterday comparing him to Mortimer in that he makes driving runs straight at the heart of defences. That can really cause havoc and that's what excites me about the prospect of having him. As the Chelsea fan says it's all about whether our coaching staff can get the best out of him.QuotePowerful running with the ball from deep. Can play cute passes to spring forwards free. Has looked v good for us coming off the bench. I would have kept him for that reason. My concern is he might be a flat track bully, often fails to produce against the good or well organised teams.
There will be a few times when he makes a great run, you drop your (metaphorical) chocolate digestive into your (metaphorical) coffee you're so excited, Grealish has made a great run and is clear, "pass Ross, PASS". He does. Too late. Grealish is offside. You look down at your coffee. You wonder what it's all for....
There is, I think, a potentially really good player inside a very good athlete. Frank Lampard is not a coach. J reckon Guardiola or Klopp would make him a better player, so the question is, will Dean improve him?
Post by: Drummond on October 01, 2020, 10:01:25 AM
Good times ahead!
Post by: Brend'Watkins on October 01, 2020, 10:10:45 AM
Here's what my reliable Chelsea supporting (STH) mate says:QuotePowerful running with the ball from deep. Can play cute passes to spring forwards free. Has looked v good for us coming off the bench. I would have kept him for that reason. My concern is he might be a flat track bully, often fails to produce against the good or well organised teams.
There will be a few times when he makes a great run, you drop your (metaphorical) chocolate digestive into your (metaphorical) coffee you're so excited, Grealish has made a great run and is clear, "pass Ross, PASS". He does. Too late. Grealish is offside. You look down at your coffee. You wonder what it's all for....
There is, I think, a potentially really good player inside a very good athlete. Frank Lampard is not a coach. J reckon Guardiola or Klopp would make him a better player, so the question is, will Dean improve him?
That’s a more eloquent version of what I said to my lad about him. He’s got all the attributes but too often he makes the wrong decision, plays it left when there are two players free on the right or holds on to it when a forward pass is on. If he can be coached out of it then Chelsea will be getting a decent player back next season.
I see that too. I'm hoping that it's a case of a bit part player trying to impress quickly when he's not the first choice. Playing for us he will be in from the start and can allow himself to grow into the team with his starting place not so much under pressure. That's my hope anyway.
Post by: Lastfootstamper on October 01, 2020, 10:23:57 AM
Post by: Mister E on October 01, 2020, 10:26:03 AM
As much as I'd love us to 'do a Leicester', I very much doubt we will. If as part of our progression we have indeed got hold of a flat-track bully for a season, I'm happy with that. I'm under no illusions about what our shortcomings will probably be when we come up against the top sides, but if we've got a player that will help us put a dozen lesser sides to the sword twice this season, well then he's alright by me.We 'only' need 10 more wins and a few draws to finish comfortably mid-table ...
Post by: algy on October 01, 2020, 11:48:56 AM
Ha, well thankfully I don't bet. But i'd disagree there - practically that exact team beat Bristol City 3-0 a week ago, and will play & hopefully beat Stoke tonight. They'd do fine in the Championship.If you look at our second eleven nowChrist I hope you're not a betting man. I'm pretty confident that team would be relegated from the Championship not get to the play off final.
Steer
Guilbert - Elmo(?) - Hause - Taylor
Ramsey - Nakamba - Hourihane
Trez - Davies/Wesley - AEG
That's not a bad side really - probably struggle in the Premier League, but I'd put money on them beating our first team from 2 years ago.
Post by: Drummond on October 01, 2020, 12:04:56 PM
Ha, well thankfully I don't bet. But i'd disagree there - practically that exact team beat Bristol City 3-0 a week ago, and will play & hopefully beat Stoke tonight. They'd do fine in the Championship.If you look at our second eleven nowChrist I hope you're not a betting man. I'm pretty confident that team would be relegated from the Championship not get to the play off final.
Steer
Guilbert - Elmo(?) - Hause - Taylor
Ramsey - Nakamba - Hourihane
Trez - Davies/Wesley - AEG
That's not a bad side really - probably struggle in the Premier League, but I'd put money on them beating our first team from 2 years ago.
I'd agree.
Post by: Dave on October 01, 2020, 12:07:01 PM
Ha, well thankfully I don't bet. But i'd disagree there - practically that exact team beat Bristol City 3-0 a week ago, and will play & hopefully beat Stoke tonight. They'd do fine in the Championship.If you look at our second eleven nowChrist I hope you're not a betting man. I'm pretty confident that team would be relegated from the Championship not get to the play off final.
Steer
Guilbert - Elmo(?) - Hause - Taylor
Ramsey - Nakamba - Hourihane
Trez - Davies/Wesley - AEG
That's not a bad side really - probably struggle in the Premier League, but I'd put money on them beating our first team from 2 years ago.
I'd agree.
Me too.
Post by: paul_e on October 01, 2020, 12:10:48 PM
Ha, well thankfully I don't bet. But i'd disagree there - practically that exact team beat Bristol City 3-0 a week ago, and will play & hopefully beat Stoke tonight. They'd do fine in the Championship.If you look at our second eleven nowChrist I hope you're not a betting man. I'm pretty confident that team would be relegated from the Championship not get to the play off final.
Steer
Guilbert - Elmo(?) - Hause - Taylor
Ramsey - Nakamba - Hourihane
Trez - Davies/Wesley - AEG
That's not a bad side really - probably struggle in the Premier League, but I'd put money on them beating our first team from 2 years ago.
I agree, I'd also say that the team from as close as possible to 2 years ago today that played preston was:
Bunn, Elmo, Tuanzebe, Chester, Hutton, Thor, McGinn, Kodjia, Hourihane, Grealish, Abraham
Hourihane and Elmo are in both so there's 9 players to compare:
Steer vs Bunn - Steer is better
Guilbert vs Tuanzebe - not a direct comparison so a draw
Hause vs Chester - Chester is better
Taylor vs Hutton - as a left back I'd go with Taylor
Nakamba vs Thor - Nakamba for me
Ramsey vs McGinn - McGinn by a long way
Trez vs Kodj - Trez for me
Grealish vs AEG - Jack obviously
Davis vs Tammy - Tammy wins
You'd end up with a pretty even split between the 2 but with the real quality being Jack and John who are still with us in the first 11.
Put that team in the championship and it'd be comfortably top half. Also remember you still have Engels, Lansbury, Jota and Heaton to add in who are all either too good for the championship or have proven they can be important players in that league.
Post by: chrisw1 on October 01, 2020, 12:32:48 PM
Steer
Guilbert - Elmo(?) - Hause - Taylor
Ramsey - Nakamba - Hourihane
Trez - Davies/Wesley - AEG
Whereas any team with Jack, McGinn and Tammy has always got a chance.
Post by: dave.woodhall on October 01, 2020, 12:34:16 PM
Well obviously we'll never know, but to me this team looks incredibly average with no stand out quality and a makeshift centre back.
Steer
Guilbert - Elmo(?) - Hause - Taylor
Ramsey - Nakamba - Hourihane
Trez - Davies/Wesley - AEG
Whereas any team with Jack, McGinn and Tammy has always got a chance.
It doesn't have to be average to avoid relegation from the Championship. Small Heath manage it and the day they're average is the day they stop thinking about us.
Post by: chrisw1 on October 01, 2020, 12:37:27 PM
Post by: SoccerHQ on October 01, 2020, 01:27:44 PM
Post by: Hookeysmith on October 01, 2020, 01:38:45 PM
But this is what got him into the England squad in the first place
If we get half of that form then this is going to be a great bit of business
Post by: Toronto Villa on October 01, 2020, 01:49:30 PM
Post by: mallo on October 01, 2020, 02:04:59 PM
I know it was with Everton and was 2 years agoThink I saw a Richards / Lescott masterclass in there...
But this is what got him into the England squad in the first place
If we get half of that form then this is going to be a great bit of business
He's good in that video - between him and Jack we should be able to switch play and they don't need to hang on to the ball as long.
Post by: CT Villan on October 01, 2020, 02:19:28 PM
Post by: kippaxvilla2 on October 01, 2020, 02:30:13 PM
Post by: Brazilian Villain on October 01, 2020, 03:52:46 PM
Official announcement (https://www.avfc.co.uk/news/2020/september/Villa-announce-Barkley-loan-signing/). Season long loan, no word on any option to buy.
Does Johan Lange (our SD not the botanist) remind anyone else of Bingo from The Banana Splits or is it just me?
Post by: Duncan Shaw on October 01, 2020, 04:46:45 PM
Post by: Duncan Shaw on October 01, 2020, 04:48:11 PM
https://www.hitc.com/en-gb/2020/10/01/report-west-ham-couldnt-pay-11m-deal-for-ross-barkley-hes-now-joined-aston-villa/
Post by: Brazilian Villain on October 01, 2020, 05:00:15 PM
I've just been told by a Chelsea fan that we have paid an £11 million loan fee??!!??!?!?
That includes his wages and agent's fees. If he's on 100k a week that would mean a loan fee of approx 6m which seems reasonable for a 20-25m player.
Post by: eamonn on October 01, 2020, 05:22:43 PM
Post by: kippaxvilla2 on October 01, 2020, 05:35:30 PM
Post by: eamonn on October 01, 2020, 06:06:41 PM
Post by: Drummond on October 01, 2020, 06:26:22 PM
Post by: Dinas_Caerdydd on October 01, 2020, 09:52:24 PM
Not even in the England set-up... Rubbish.
your saying Ross Barkley is rubbish ??
you must be off your trolley if you think that !
Post by: olaftab on October 01, 2020, 09:56:21 PM
Post by: Risso on October 01, 2020, 09:56:59 PM
Not even in the England set-up... Rubbish.
your saying Ross Barkley is rubbish ??
you must be off your trolley if you think that !
Not sure what it makes you if you couldn't see that he was joking?
Post by: Brazilian Villain on October 01, 2020, 09:57:39 PM
Not even in the England set-up... Rubbish.
your saying Ross Barkley is rubbish ??
you must be off your trolley if you think that !
No, it's more a case he joins Villa and a day later he's out of the England squad. Typical Southgate anti-Villa bias. ;)
Post by: Dinas_Caerdydd on October 01, 2020, 10:02:11 PM
Not even in the England set-up... Rubbish.
your saying Ross Barkley is rubbish ??
you must be off your trolley if you think that !
oh looks like i got the wrong end of the stick then
to me one of the best 3 midfield players in the prem . wish he had a welsh grandad so we could poach him !!
Not sure what it makes you if you couldn't see that he was joking?
Post by: PeterWithe on October 01, 2020, 10:10:34 PM
Post by: PaulTheVillan on October 02, 2020, 11:34:41 AM
Post by: algy on October 02, 2020, 07:40:34 PM
If you look at our second eleven nowThis post didn't age well :(
Steer
Guilbert - Elmo(?) - Hause - Taylor
Ramsey - Nakamba - Hourihane
Trez - Davies/Wesley - AEG
That's not a bad side really - probably struggle in the Premier League, but I'd put money on them beating our first team from 2 years ago.
Post by: Risso on October 03, 2020, 09:26:21 AM
:o
Post by: Jimsta on October 03, 2020, 05:06:02 PM
Post by: GarTomas on October 04, 2020, 08:16:08 PM
Always free when we’re breaking and carrying the ball tremendously.
Post by: manic-road on October 04, 2020, 08:19:47 PM
A massive improvement to us based on that 45.Yes could have had three in the first half, he's playing further up the pitch than I thought he would.
Always free when we’re breaking and carrying the ball tremendously.
Post by: Toronto Villa on October 04, 2020, 08:50:57 PM
Post by: LeeB on October 04, 2020, 08:55:54 PM
Post by: Damo70 on October 04, 2020, 08:59:18 PM
The missing piece in the jigsaw.
I know it is relatively easy to shine in a team performance like this but I think he has been magnificent and the best of the lot. Although that new striker we bought hasn't been bad either ;)
Post by: paul_e on October 04, 2020, 08:59:32 PM
Post by: PeterWithesShin on October 04, 2020, 09:03:59 PM
Post by: PaulWinch again on October 04, 2020, 09:11:47 PM
Post by: Ian. on October 04, 2020, 09:17:22 PM
Post by: Proposition Joe on October 04, 2020, 09:23:33 PM
Great signing.
Post by: Dinas_Caerdydd on October 04, 2020, 09:24:00 PM
I’m not sure that even his gran would rate him in the top 3 midfielders.
you were saying :D
Post by: Mister E on October 04, 2020, 09:25:10 PM
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
Post by: themossman on October 04, 2020, 09:26:32 PM
Post by: LukeJames on October 04, 2020, 09:27:33 PM
Post by: Toronto Villa on October 04, 2020, 09:28:33 PM
Post by: stevo_st on October 04, 2020, 09:44:03 PM
Post by: supertom on October 04, 2020, 09:50:02 PM
I feel like we've got elements in place to have an exciting season that we've not had since the early days of O Neill, and going back to Little's side in 95-96.
Post by: WarszaVillan on October 04, 2020, 09:51:47 PM
Post by: themossman on October 04, 2020, 09:53:08 PM
Post by: robleflaneur on October 04, 2020, 09:54:09 PM
The missing piece in the jigsaw.Just posted that on the post match thread.I was undecided whether Loftus-Cheek would be a better choice but he makes us more powerful in midfield and he must have enjoyed playing with Jack,he will get lots of chances.
Post by: Proposition Joe on October 04, 2020, 09:58:25 PM
Post by: Toronto Villa on October 04, 2020, 10:00:42 PM
Post by: Smithy on October 04, 2020, 10:06:28 PM
If he carries on like that and Chelsea don't challenge for the title, I can see Fat Frank getting Hell's abuse for the decision to lend him to us.
I'm already wondering what the plan is to sign him for keeps next summer!
Post by: SaddVillan on October 04, 2020, 10:07:53 PM
https://youtu.be/JMOBxjIvLBE
Post by: Risso on October 04, 2020, 10:08:12 PM
dare I say it, and not meaning to get too carried away, but he reminded me of Jimmy Milner.
He's more skilful than Milner.
Post by: Toronto Villa on October 04, 2020, 10:50:01 PM
Post by: PeterWithe on October 04, 2020, 10:52:07 PM
Post by: Risso on October 04, 2020, 10:55:07 PM
at 2-0 Barkley missed a pretty easy chance after a brilliant through ball by Jack. That run he made is one we haven't seen any of our players do at this level since we came back up. Expect to see that relationship get much better and that run seen more often and goals come from it.
He'll get sharper, and then he'll be even better.
Post by: Monty on October 04, 2020, 10:57:44 PM
Post by: LeeB on October 04, 2020, 10:59:36 PM
I love him already. A huge contributor to one of the most famous nights in our recent history.
He seems to open up a kaleidoscope of options for us going forward.
Post by: tomd2103 on October 04, 2020, 11:02:38 PM
Post by: Ads on October 04, 2020, 11:03:48 PM
I said before that I liked him, but he took me by surprise firstly by his condition, I don't know why, but I'd never really taken in just how big, strong and quick he is. He gives us a real pressence.
He has a great touch, finds space supremely well, hits the box and also drags attention off Jack.
A very, very impressive debut.
Post by: Risso on October 04, 2020, 11:05:11 PM
Post by: Toronto Villa on October 04, 2020, 11:09:59 PM
Post by: Somniloquism on October 04, 2020, 11:12:10 PM
Quote
On Barkley giving Villa a new dimension: “He does. We tweaked our system and had two holders in Douglas Luiz and John McGinn and freed up Ross as a 10 and tried to keep them down one side.
Post by: Duncan Shaw on October 04, 2020, 11:12:22 PM
Post by: Steve67 on October 04, 2020, 11:15:21 PM
Post by: The Edge on October 04, 2020, 11:16:49 PM
Barkley and Jack are going to tear a few teams a new one this season. You can't double up on both of them.Totally this.
Post by: Somniloquism on October 04, 2020, 11:18:50 PM
Barkley and Jack are going to tear a few teams a new one this season. You can't double up on both of them.Totally this.
Well you can but that will be 3 other players in McGinn, Trez and Luiz who have acres of space.
Post by: ASHTONVILLA on October 04, 2020, 11:26:44 PM
Post by: Risso on October 05, 2020, 12:02:00 AM
Post by: ozzjim on October 05, 2020, 12:06:03 AM
Are you going to quote yourself all night?!
It is the humble way to act these days clearly.
Post by: darren woolley on October 05, 2020, 12:22:52 AM
Post by: Tayls_7 on October 05, 2020, 12:36:56 AM
Are you going to quote yourself all night?!
It is the humble way to act these days clearly.
I'm on international break now
But do remember Villa have the best 2 English midfielders in the league.
The 2 best English Central defenders
The best Scottish midfielder
And the best Irish one
With the best English coach in the premier league.
UK can be proud.
Up the Villa.
Stay Safe ! And please bask in the glory like I shall Vs all Liverpool supporters see you in a few week Vs Leicester.
Dreamland !
Have a nice time on your international break son.
Post by: danno on October 05, 2020, 12:44:15 AM
I love him already. A huge contributor to one of the most famous nights in our recent history.
He seems to open up a kaleidoscope of options for us going forward.
A week is a long time in football.
I'd rather watch Ramsey develop within our team than watch Barkley chuntering around making wrong decision after wrong decision, for the best part of £100k a week.
And to be fair he should have had three! Good start Ross but don't get cocky.
Post by: LeeB on October 05, 2020, 12:54:48 AM
I love him already. A huge contributor to one of the most famous nights in our recent history.
He seems to open up a kaleidoscope of options for us going forward.
A week is a long time in football.I'd rather watch Ramsey develop within our team than watch Barkley chuntering around making wrong decision after wrong decision, for the best part of £100k a week.
And to be fair he should have had three! Good start Ross but don't get cocky.
I know, what a plum. A very happy plum mind.
Post by: ktvillan on October 05, 2020, 01:27:38 AM
Post by: chrisw1 on October 05, 2020, 08:30:20 AM
Post by: ADVILLAFAN on October 05, 2020, 09:30:25 AM
Post by: West Derby Villan on October 05, 2020, 09:33:59 AM
Post by: itbrvilla on October 05, 2020, 10:26:11 AM
Post by: sickbeggar on October 05, 2020, 11:05:59 AM
Post by: FranzBiberkopf on October 05, 2020, 11:16:52 AM
Post by: PaulWinch again on October 05, 2020, 11:30:23 AM
Post by: OCD on October 05, 2020, 11:54:13 AM
Post by: Somniloquism on October 05, 2020, 12:36:31 PM
Played more like a number 10 last night than as a number 8.
Which was the plan according to Smiths post match interview.
Post by: Chris Smith on October 05, 2020, 12:47:51 PM
Post by: OCD on October 05, 2020, 12:47:57 PM
Post by: Damo70 on October 05, 2020, 12:51:46 PM
He was terrific - hope he keeps it up.
He seemed very comfortable on the ball and played as if he had all the time in the world when in possession. It was a very good debut and he and Jack seemed to click.
Post by: paul_e on October 05, 2020, 01:36:05 PM
He was much better than I was expecting. Here’s hoping that I might have underestimated him. Still missed two decent chances though.
The 2 he missed from through balls from Jack don't bother me that much, the one i didn't like was when he broke through and tried to score at the near post (it went for the corner where McGinn scored) because Watkins was completely unmarked at the back post with a tap in for his hat-trick. I'd expect anyone to play the pass there and was disappointed he took on the shot. It's only a very minor criticism after a very good debut performance but it frustrated me at the time.
Post by: Drummond on October 05, 2020, 01:37:03 PM
Post by: LeeB on October 05, 2020, 01:40:42 PM
He was much better than I was expecting. Here’s hoping that I might have underestimated him. Still missed two decent chances though.
The 2 he missed from through balls from Jack don't bother me that much, the one i didn't like was when he broke through and tried to score at the near post (it went for the corner where McGinn scored) because Watkins was completely unmarked at the back post with a tap in for his hat-trick. I'd expect anyone to play the pass there and was disappointed he took on the shot. It's only a very minor criticism after a very good debut performance but it frustrated me at the time.
I thought that at the time, but when I watched the reply Gomez had got in between and it wasn’t as clear cut.
He should have roofed it though.
Post by: Pat Mustard on October 05, 2020, 01:57:13 PM
He was much better than I was expecting. Here’s hoping that I might have underestimated him. Still missed two decent chances though.
The 2 he missed from through balls from Jack don't bother me that much, the one i didn't like was when he broke through and tried to score at the near post (it went for the corner where McGinn scored) because Watkins was completely unmarked at the back post with a tap in for his hat-trick. I'd expect anyone to play the pass there and was disappointed he took on the shot. It's only a very minor criticism after a very good debut performance but it frustrated me at the time.
I thought that at the time, but when I watched the reply Gomez had got in between and it wasn’t as clear cut.
He should have roofed it though.
I like to think that he realised that he might get pulled back for offside, so deliberately forced the corner knowing we'd score from it.
Post by: rooboy316 on October 05, 2020, 02:02:38 PM
He was much better than I was expecting. Here’s hoping that I might have underestimated him. Still missed two decent chances though.
The 2 he missed from through balls from Jack don't bother me that much, the one i didn't like was when he broke through and tried to score at the near post (it went for the corner where McGinn scored) because Watkins was completely unmarked at the back post with a tap in for his hat-trick. I'd expect anyone to play the pass there and was disappointed he took on the shot. It's only a very minor criticism after a very good debut performance but it frustrated me at the time.
Brilliant loan signing... he’s going to make a massive difference for us. But in tighter games where we don’t have 12 clear cut chances and score 7, I can see how his profligacy might prove costly. It’s been a criticism throughout - missing chances and also missing passes to people in better scoring positions. Thing is, like Tammy, he gets into so many goal scoring opportunities with great runs and positioning.
Post by: Somniloquism on October 05, 2020, 02:13:56 PM
He was much better than I was expecting. Here’s hoping that I might have underestimated him. Still missed two decent chances though.
The 2 he missed from through balls from Jack don't bother me that much, the one i didn't like was when he broke through and tried to score at the near post (it went for the corner where McGinn scored) because Watkins was completely unmarked at the back post with a tap in for his hat-trick. I'd expect anyone to play the pass there and was disappointed he took on the shot. It's only a very minor criticism after a very good debut performance but it frustrated me at the time.
I thought that at the time, but when I watched the reply Gomez had got in between and it wasn’t as clear cut.
He should have roofed it though.
TBF, with Adrian in goal, if it is on target it is probably a goal.....
Post by: paul_e on October 05, 2020, 02:50:50 PM
He was much better than I was expecting. Here’s hoping that I might have underestimated him. Still missed two decent chances though.
The 2 he missed from through balls from Jack don't bother me that much, the one i didn't like was when he broke through and tried to score at the near post (it went for the corner where McGinn scored) because Watkins was completely unmarked at the back post with a tap in for his hat-trick. I'd expect anyone to play the pass there and was disappointed he took on the shot. It's only a very minor criticism after a very good debut performance but it frustrated me at the time.
I thought that at the time, but when I watched the reply Gomez had got in between and it wasn’t as clear cut.
He should have roofed it though.
Yeah maybe, as I say it's the only one of the missed chances that I was really annoyed about, didn't matter a minute later though because we scored from the corner anyway.
Post by: tomd2103 on October 05, 2020, 03:12:17 PM
Played more like a number 10 last night than as a number 8.
Yeah, but can also see him dropping a bit deeper in some games and playing more as a central midfield player.
Post by: WarszaVillan on October 05, 2020, 03:16:45 PM
Post by: LeeB on October 05, 2020, 03:42:04 PM
There's a lot of flexibility in that midfield - all three of them can play as an 8 or 10 and interchange with one another
4 really, Good Doug could play further forward, he's got the tools.
Post by: Hookeysmith on October 05, 2020, 04:02:33 PM
This is going to be a great signing - fuck me i hope we have agreed a deal to buy
Post by: LeeB on October 05, 2020, 06:06:06 PM
Was a fabulous debut and looked like he knew our players for years. Could not believe the dynamic and dynamism he brought to the shape of our team. His threat going forward totally confused them and allowed their shape to be pulled to pieces
This is going to be a great signing - fuck me i hope we have agreed a deal to buy
If it carries on like this he won't want to go back.
Post by: Toronto Villa on October 17, 2020, 11:17:48 PM
Post by: eamonn on October 17, 2020, 11:47:49 PM
Post by: dcdavecollett on October 18, 2020, 01:33:15 AM
Oh, hang on...
Post by: Toronto Villa on October 18, 2020, 09:22:18 PM
Post by: Steve67 on October 18, 2020, 10:09:31 PM
Post by: adrenachrome on October 18, 2020, 10:12:53 PM
Post by: darren woolley on October 18, 2020, 10:22:06 PM
Post by: PaulWinch again on October 18, 2020, 10:29:28 PM
Post by: Rudy65 on October 18, 2020, 10:31:50 PM
Loving his influence. He didn’t train all week but played so well again. Adds immense energy and goals too.
I liked the celebration after the goal with the physio who had got him fit. V thoughtful
Post by: Dante Lavelli on October 18, 2020, 10:55:59 PM
long may it continue....
Post by: PeterWithesShin on October 18, 2020, 10:57:11 PM
I already fear we cannot afford him.
long may it continue....
Piece of piss with the CL money next season.
Post by: Drummond on October 18, 2020, 11:10:01 PM
Post by: Steve67 on October 18, 2020, 11:12:26 PM
His decision making is poor. He should have passed.....
Yeah, greedy fucker. Fancy shooting from there!!
Post by: Toronto Villa on October 18, 2020, 11:12:46 PM
I already fear we cannot afford him.
long may it continue....
Cannot afford him? Did you forget who owns us? And he’s not suddenly an £80m player. He’s a reserve at Chelsea. He’ll cost £40m tops. That’s the level of player we will be buying next season.
Post by: AV82EC on October 18, 2020, 11:35:38 PM
I already fear we cannot afford him.
long may it continue....
Cannot afford him? Did you forget who owns us? And he’s not suddenly an £80m player. He’s a reserve at Chelsea. He’ll cost £40m tops. That’s the level of player we will be buying next season.
Never mind next season, get him in January.
Post by: olaftab on October 18, 2020, 11:57:42 PM
Post by: West Derby Villan on October 19, 2020, 09:28:50 AM
Post by: Risso on October 19, 2020, 09:52:53 AM
Post by: Dr Butler on October 19, 2020, 10:30:40 AM
My Everton supporting bezzie sent me a text last night "Coming runners up to a Ross Barkley inspired Villa would be the most Everton thing ever!"
like this :)
UTV
The Doc
Post by: Brend'Watkins on October 19, 2020, 11:43:05 AM
Post by: Dave on October 19, 2020, 11:47:31 AM
I thought he was a brilliant player while at Everton. Then Mr Average when with Chelsea. It’s clear he needs plenty of game time, a squad rotation system doesn’t suit him at all. His shot from outside the box is something he is always capable of and won us the game. And the good thing is that he will improve as he gels into the team. Keep it up Ross.
Something I read yesterday which I think rings true - he needs a setup with enough solidity to allow him to stay forward as much as possible, but with enough other attacking options that he has space to move. Although reading that back, I suppose it could just describe any attacker.
Apparently nobody on either side lost the ball more often than him, but that because he's the one trying things that result in 92nd minute winners.
He's looks much better for us than I thought he would.
Post by: Villa Lew on October 19, 2020, 11:58:04 AM
Post by: paul_e on October 19, 2020, 12:00:47 PM
I thought he was a brilliant player while at Everton. Then Mr Average when with Chelsea. It’s clear he needs plenty of game time, a squad rotation system doesn’t suit him at all. His shot from outside the box is something he is always capable of and won us the game. And the good thing is that he will improve as he gels into the team. Keep it up Ross.
Something I read yesterday which I think rings true - he needs a setup with enough solidity to allow him to stay forward as much as possible, but with enough other attacking options that he has space to move. Although reading that back, I suppose it could just describe any attacker.
Apparently nobody on either side lost the ball more often than him, but that because he's the one trying things that result in 92nd minute winners.
He's looks much better for us than I thought he would.
That's why I don't like looking at passing and dispossessed stats for attacking players, players who never lose the ball in the final third are normally the ones who don't actually make things happen.
Post by: Risso on October 19, 2020, 12:02:48 PM
Post by: Dante Lavelli on October 22, 2020, 09:25:13 PM
Post by: WassallVillain on October 22, 2020, 10:02:48 PM
I thought he was a brilliant player while at Everton. Then Mr Average when with Chelsea. It’s clear he needs plenty of game time, a squad rotation system doesn’t suit him at all. His shot from outside the box is something he is always capable of and won us the game. And the good thing is that he will improve as he gels into the team. Keep it up Ross.
Something I read yesterday which I think rings true - he needs a setup with enough solidity to allow him to stay forward as much as possible, but with enough other attacking options that he has space to move. Although reading that back, I suppose it could just describe any attacker.
Apparently nobody on either side lost the ball more often than him, but that because he's the one trying things that result in 92nd minute winners.
He's looks much better for us than I thought he would.
That's why I don't like looking at passing and dispossessed stats for attacking players, players who never lose the ball in the final third are normally the ones who don't actually make things happen.
There was an article in The Tmes recently that highlighted the players who lost the most possession the top three were KDB, TAA, and Bruno Fernandez. They were also the highest for goal assists. The object of the piece was to highlight the overall benefit of putting the ball at risk. You obviously need the right players to do that and I think we’re getting there.
Post by: West Derby Villan on October 22, 2020, 11:23:30 PM
One of the best things about that article is it doesn’t mention grealish once. A sure sign that other players are stepping up.
Very valid point. The understanding between him and Jack and then add SJM into the mix and it could become quite dynamic
Post by: KevinGage on October 22, 2020, 11:25:21 PM
I thought he was a brilliant player while at Everton. Then Mr Average when with Chelsea. It’s clear he needs plenty of game time, a squad rotation system doesn’t suit him at all. His shot from outside the box is something he is always capable of and won us the game. And the good thing is that he will improve as he gels into the team. Keep it up Ross.
Something I read yesterday which I think rings true - he needs a setup with enough solidity to allow him to stay forward as much as possible, but with enough other attacking options that he has space to move. Although reading that back, I suppose it could just describe any attacker.
Apparently nobody on either side lost the ball more often than him, but that because he's the one trying things that result in 92nd minute winners.
He's looks much better for us than I thought he would.
Aye, same.
Didn't realise how quick he was either.
Post by: PaulWinch again on October 24, 2020, 08:14:34 AM
Post by: Ian. on October 24, 2020, 08:49:23 AM
Post by: ChicagoLion on October 24, 2020, 12:12:59 PM
Post by: brontebilly on October 24, 2020, 12:26:38 PM
Post by: Toronto Villa on October 24, 2020, 01:44:00 PM
Post by: Clampy on October 24, 2020, 01:46:43 PM
He said he was after the Leicester game. Certainly was carrying an attitude and application problem last night. A spell on the bench watching Hourihane start v Southampton might be the trick I think.
What attitude and application problem was this?
Post by: SoccerHQ on October 24, 2020, 01:53:50 PM
Attitude and application problem? Deserves a spell on the bench? Before yesterday’s game he was absolutely brilliant, scored the winner in the last game, having articles written about him about specifically what a great attitude he’s got about joining us and since being at the club.
I was actually disappointed with his performance in Leicester game up to 91st minute. Of course it all gets forgotten with him winning the game and I'd certainly sign up for him doing that another 10 times this season but given what I've seen in the past I thought he'd be one of those midfielders who can take games by scruff of the neck (as he did v Liverpool).
Was a bit Hourihane lite yesterday v high press so hopefully that's a one off.
Post by: itmustbe_it is! on October 24, 2020, 02:02:09 PM
Post by: Toronto Villa on October 24, 2020, 02:14:39 PM
Attitude and application problem? Deserves a spell on the bench? Before yesterday’s game he was absolutely brilliant, scored the winner in the last game, having articles written about him about specifically what a great attitude he’s got about joining us and since being at the club.
I was actually disappointed with his performance in Leicester game up to 91st minute. Of course it all gets forgotten with him winning the game and I'd certainly sign up for him doing that another 10 times this season but given what I've seen in the past I thought he'd be one of those midfielders who can take games by scruff of the neck (as he did v Liverpool).
Was a bit Hourihane lite yesterday v high press so hopefully that's a one off.
He also played with a now well documented injury. It likely limited what he did and reveals why he looked short on fitness in both games since Liverpool. I’d say given that he still played in those games says something about his attitude than the contrary.
Post by: ChicagoLion on October 24, 2020, 02:18:12 PM
If a player is struggling then they should be subbed.
Post by: brontebilly on October 24, 2020, 07:43:45 PM
He said he was after the Leicester game. Certainly was carrying an attitude and application problem last night. A spell on the bench watching Hourihane start v Southampton might be the trick I think.
What attitude and application problem was this?
Rewatch the second goal
Post by: TonyD on October 24, 2020, 10:00:19 PM
Post by: frank black on October 24, 2020, 10:26:48 PM
Post by: pelty on October 25, 2020, 01:18:26 AM
Post by: ChicagoLion on October 25, 2020, 06:40:12 AM
Barkley had a poor game last night, but it would be foolish to sit him. He offers something that Hourihane could only dream about... and I am not knocking Hourihane; but the gap between the two is significant.I would take a fit Hourihane over a crocked Berkeley based on that performance.
Post by: Abbeyfealeavfc on October 25, 2020, 06:43:08 AM
Barkley had a poor game last night, but it would be foolish to sit him. He offers something that Hourihane could only dream about... and I am not knocking Hourihane; but the gap between the two is significant.
Really? And that something is?
Post by: WilliamStanding on October 25, 2020, 07:21:09 AM
Barkley had a poor game last night, but it would be foolish to sit him. He offers something that Hourihane could only dream about... and I am not knocking Hourihane; but the gap between the two is significant.
This All day.
Post by: Ian. on October 25, 2020, 07:21:55 AM
Post by: Abbeyfealeavfc on October 25, 2020, 07:35:55 AM
Barkley had a poor game last night, but it would be foolish to sit him. He offers something that Hourihane could only dream about... and I am not knocking Hourihane; but the gap between the two is significant.
This All day.
An even bigger reason to question what Barclay has that Hourihane can only "dream about"
Post by: chrisw1 on October 26, 2020, 01:51:15 PM
You really need people to explain to you what Ross Barkley offers that Hourihane doesn't?Barkley had a poor game last night, but it would be foolish to sit him. He offers something that Hourihane could only dream about... and I am not knocking Hourihane; but the gap between the two is significant.
This All day.
An even bigger reason to question what Barclay has that Hourihane can only "dream about"
Post by: SoccerHQ on October 26, 2020, 02:44:02 PM
That said I'm a bit bemused how quickly Barkley seems to have become untouchable and little things like subbing him for Conor in games we're actually losing is seen now by some as covid 19 style world ending event.
Believe it or not but I'm sure we can win some games this season with Nakamba and Hourihane starting (Hourihane started our first two league wins) so they remain viable options off the bench in games that aren't going our way.
Post by: eamonn on October 26, 2020, 02:47:04 PM
Post by: chrisw1 on October 26, 2020, 03:00:28 PM
Fully agreed HQ. Any player that is having a poor game, Jack included, shouldn't be immune from being hooked.Of course they shouldn't and yes Barkley was poor against Leeds. Personally I don't think Hourihane is the type of player who would have helped us wrestle back control of a game like that, but he is productive and may have produced something from a set piece..
But the difference in quality is surely as clear as day to anyone who has watched the players play and I'm surprised Abbey needs it explaining.
Post by: PeterWithe on October 26, 2020, 03:08:23 PM
Barkley had a poor game last night, but it would be foolish to sit him. He offers something that Hourihane could only dream about... and I am not knocking Hourihane; but the gap between the two is significant.
This All day.
An even bigger reason to question what Barclay has that Hourihane can only "dream about"
Pace.
Post by: Abbeyfealeavfc on October 26, 2020, 03:36:10 PM
And just to put your mind at ease Chrisw1 I don't need it explaining.
The questions were posed to see what the responses would be and PeterWithe was right when he said "pace". Beyond that nothing.
I'm with SoccerHQ on this. Conor has his qualities and weaknesses as does Barkley (clearly defending, tracking back, tackling are not amongst his strengths along with the occasional misplaced pass.. see Leeds last Sunday).
I would not want any other team's loan cast-off to be seen as someone who is untouchable and can't be replaced not least to send him a message that below par performances won't be tolerated (besides the obvious of subbing to rescue games).
We've been there and had untouchable players before and look what happened to us in 2016.
I personally don't care what Barkley has done previously for Everton, Chelsea and England. It's what he does for Aston Villa that concerns me and whilst I've been pleased with his goal contributions so far, other aspects of his game has left me wondering. Still it's early days and he has a whole season to show what he can do.
Post by: ChicagoLion on October 26, 2020, 04:14:36 PM
Post by: chrisw1 on October 26, 2020, 08:25:48 PM
But the only thing you think he has above Hourihane is pace? What about strength, ball control, dribbling ability, link up play, physicality, ability to control a game, ability to break with the ball...
Frankly the only thing Conor matches him on is set pieces. You could argue passing ability, but when under pressure in open play Barkleys passing and link up is also better.
Post by: Abbeyfealeavfc on October 26, 2020, 08:49:05 PM
Post by: OCD on October 26, 2020, 09:39:21 PM
My biggest concern is his fitness. I just hope we have not signed a player that has recuring injury problems.
They don't normally play 2 games back to back when we've previously signed injury prone players.
Post by: Ian. on October 26, 2020, 09:50:29 PM
Power.Barkley had a poor game last night, but it would be foolish to sit him. He offers something that Hourihane could only dream about... and I am not knocking Hourihane; but the gap between the two is significant.
This All day.
An even bigger reason to question what Barclay has that Hourihane can only "dream about"
Pace.
Post by: SoccerHQ on October 26, 2020, 10:41:51 PM
Fully agreed HQ. Any player that is having a poor game, Jack included, shouldn't be immune from being hooked.
Nah Jack is in the stay on at all costs select group and rightly so.
It's like Spurs tonight at Burnley 0-0 with 20 minutes left. No chance whatsoever they take off either Son or Kane unless they're injured and surprise surprise they combine for the winner 5 minutes later.
Dele Alli however was an untouchable starter not so long ago and now he can't even make their bench.
Post by: SoccerHQ on October 26, 2020, 10:48:17 PM
Just leave likes of Hourihane on the bench without coming on every week will just decrease the desire and then these types become harder to move on.
Reminds me of us signing Habib Beye who'd won POTY at Newcastle and was a perfectly capable premier league FB. Played a few games and looked o.k but then hardly played for a year and then we couldn't shift given the wages he was on.
AEM is a great example of someone who will spend time on bench but will get sub minutes and then come in for a start or two and not let us down so I think there should be a bit more trust.
A year ago Luiz wasn't seen as good enough for our 11 but we kept giving him minutes and amazing improvement in last six months so now he's rightly undroppable.
Post by: ChicagoLion on October 27, 2020, 06:45:28 AM
great against Liverpool, admitted he only just made it against Leicester and looked very leggy against Leeds.My biggest concern is his fitness. I just hope we have not signed a player that has recuring injury problems.
They don't normally play 2 games back to back when we've previously signed injury prone players.
How many consecutive starts did he make for Chelsea?
Post by: DrGonzo on October 27, 2020, 05:01:59 PM
It's more likely a lack of minutes in his legs than any indication of being prone to injury. I have been largely impressed so far and fingers crossed his partnership with Jack is allowed to grow for the next few seasons...great against Liverpool, admitted he only just made it against Leicester and looked very leggy against Leeds.My biggest concern is his fitness. I just hope we have not signed a player that has recuring injury problems.
They don't normally play 2 games back to back when we've previously signed injury prone players.
How many consecutive starts did he make for Chelsea?
Post by: Ian. on October 27, 2020, 06:59:59 PM
My biggest concern is his fitness. I just hope we have not signed a player that has recuring injury problems.I’m not sure how you have come to the conclusion that Barkley has an injury problem. He’s had no serious injuries or ever been a player who has had many knocks through his career has he? I’m sure at Chelsea it was more a case of not fitting in more than anything else.
Post by: PeterWithesShin on October 27, 2020, 07:06:17 PM
Post by: Ian. on October 27, 2020, 08:15:09 PM
Post by: N'ZMAV on October 27, 2020, 08:19:59 PM
Post by: Toronto Villa on October 27, 2020, 08:31:12 PM
from world beater to write-off in one defeat
Lol I was thinking the same. He had a poor game by the standards he’s set and it’s all over for some.
Post by: Ian. on October 27, 2020, 09:03:22 PM
Post by: The_ads on October 28, 2020, 08:38:07 AM
Post by: Risso on October 28, 2020, 09:06:50 AM
Last few pages sums up Aston Villa last 10 years and probably modern football in general. We’re so quick to write people off - we’re lucky to have someone of Ross Barkleys ability. The call for Hourihane to replace him already is laughable
Has anybody written him off? Or have a couple of people merely had the nerve to suggest that if he’s not having a great game maybe he could be subbed?
Post by: ROBBO on October 28, 2020, 09:16:07 AM
Post by: Clampy on October 28, 2020, 09:20:53 AM
Last few pages sums up Aston Villa last 10 years and probably modern football in general. We’re so quick to write people off - we’re lucky to have someone of Ross Barkleys ability. The call for Hourihane to replace him already is laughable
For me, it's more that some people massively over-react after a defeat.
Post by: ChicagoLion on October 28, 2020, 09:39:06 AM
For me the performance of Barkley and Mings were significant.
It’s a valid discussion point.
Post by: Risso on October 28, 2020, 10:06:54 AM
Last few pages sums up Aston Villa last 10 years and probably modern football in general. We’re so quick to write people off - we’re lucky to have someone of Ross Barkleys ability. The call for Hourihane to replace him already is laughable
For me, it's more that some people massively over-react after a defeat.
I don't think that happened after the Leeds game did it? It all seemed remarkably circumspect to me.
Post by: Clampy on October 28, 2020, 10:19:52 AM
Last few pages sums up Aston Villa last 10 years and probably modern football in general. We’re so quick to write people off - we’re lucky to have someone of Ross Barkleys ability. The call for Hourihane to replace him already is laughable
For me, it's more that some people massively over-react after a defeat.
I don't think that happened after the Leeds game did it? It all seemed remarkably circumspect to me.
I think some people did. It has been known on here after a defeat.
Post by: Risso on October 28, 2020, 10:22:29 AM
Post by: AndyB6 on October 28, 2020, 10:29:02 AM
Post by: Damo70 on October 28, 2020, 10:33:44 AM
I'm pretty worried about how a newly promoted team ripped us a new one and how we get on in our next few games. Hopefully it was just a one off!
We ripped Liverpool a new one, Leeds ripped us a new one. It has been that kind of season in general in the Premier League so far. Personally I have been impressed with Barkley, particularly how he links up with Grealish.
Post by: OCD on October 28, 2020, 11:03:11 AM
Post by: Mister E on October 28, 2020, 03:56:27 PM
Post by: Allan C on October 28, 2020, 05:05:04 PM
I think people look at the reasons for the defeat.True but they weren’t the only ones who were poor. The entire midfield were equally poor particularly McGinn and IMO only Konsa came out of the game with any credit at all. Barkley is significantly better than any current replacement
For me the performance of Barkley and Mings were significant.
It’s a valid discussion point.
Post by: in exile on October 29, 2020, 09:02:12 AM
Well, it is a discussion board after all. It would be a bit boring if everybody agreed.Agreed.
Post by: bjfoster on November 01, 2020, 02:39:02 PM
Second time in two games that he’s given the ball away and they’ve waltzed it past our midfield for their striker to put in the net.
At what point does he get dropped and Conor put back in the side?
Post by: SoccerHQ on November 01, 2020, 02:40:59 PM
Last few pages sums up Aston Villa last 10 years and probably modern football in general. We’re so quick to write people off - we’re lucky to have someone of Ross Barkleys ability. The call for Hourihane to replace him already is laughable
For me, it's more that some people massively over-react after a defeat.
Are we allowed to over-react yet?
Does seem already a player we want to leave on the pitch at all costs but he's miles away from that status. Can only hope better for next week.
Post by: N'ZMAV on November 01, 2020, 02:43:10 PM
Post by: TonyD on November 01, 2020, 02:48:09 PM
Post by: CT on November 01, 2020, 02:50:10 PM
We can’t afford to have him and McGinn being passengers in midfield.
Post by: ChicagoLion on November 01, 2020, 02:51:22 PM
Post by: paul_e on November 01, 2020, 03:07:03 PM
Post by: brontebilly on November 01, 2020, 03:17:05 PM
I don’t think he looks well.
Needs to tone down the spray tan. No chance of sweat knocking it off anyway. An absolute joke again today. Shameful.
Post by: villa `cross the mersey on November 01, 2020, 03:23:43 PM
Decent footballer turns to shit shortly after donning Aston Villa Shirt..........
File under "Villa screwing up the to opportunity to go top of the League at home against opposition we should be at least drawing with"
It appears to be written in the stars ;)
Post by: cdbearsfan on November 01, 2020, 03:25:02 PM
I don’t think he looks well.
Needs to tone down the spray tan.
You know he's mixed race, yeah?
Post by: Toronto Villa on November 01, 2020, 03:30:41 PM
I don’t think he looks well.
Needs to tone down the spray tan.
You know he's mixed race, yeah?
LOL I was wondering who was going to point that out. I’ve seen his skin tone mentioned on here before. His old man is Nigerian.
Post by: Bobby Boy on November 01, 2020, 03:32:38 PM
Post by: PaulWinch again on November 01, 2020, 03:35:31 PM
Post by: SoccerHQ on November 01, 2020, 03:52:46 PM
Wouldn't play him at Arsenal. They are not great by any means but we need to compete in midfield there for sure. Cannot afford any passengers and he's been a luxury for the last 2 games.
I'd actually keep him in v Arsenal. They'll push forward and leave gaps between midfield and defence so think he can exploit that space if we pass the bal quickly enough.
Would seriously think about putting Nakamba in for McGinn though. AEM for Cash is another change I expect.
Post by: TonyD on November 01, 2020, 04:03:37 PM
Post by: brontebilly on November 01, 2020, 04:06:02 PM
I don’t think he looks well.
Needs to tone down the spray tan.
You know he's mixed race, yeah?
Cheers !
Post by: Three Spires Villa on November 01, 2020, 05:16:55 PM
Wouldn't play him at Arsenal. They are not great by any means but we need to compete in midfield there for sure. Cannot afford any passengers and he's been a luxury for the last 2 games.
I'd actually keep him in v Arsenal. They'll push forward and leave gaps between midfield and defence so think he can exploit that space if we pass the bal quickly enough.
Would seriously think about putting Nakamba in for McGinn though. AEM for Cash is another change I expect.
I agree
Post by: eamonn on November 01, 2020, 08:42:28 PM
Post by: SoccerHQ on November 01, 2020, 09:26:35 PM
Can clubs be penalised by the parent club if their loanee doesn't play ? Seems a shitty thing to write into a contract - if we're already taking on his wages and a loan fee (did someone on here say it was £7m?), surely we can do with him what we want. Including dropping/hooking him if he isn't at the races.
It's a regular thing with young players. Think Chelsea do it with their youngsters, club that takes them on gets fined if the player dosen't start. Liverpool also apparently did it when Brewster went to Swansea.
As you say given the big loan fee and wages we've taken on for the season you'd like to think we've avoided all of that nonsense.
I don't really get why he's unsubable so far. Spurs took off Son tonight with 10 minutes left on a tight game they were winning so I dunno just keeping the regular 11 on the pitch at all costs just feels to me like we're really going to hit the wall come February or March as in the MON seasons.
Hopefully we've got enough points in the bank by then for any poor run not to hurt too much.
Post by: Lastfootstamper on November 01, 2020, 10:14:32 PM
Can clubs be penalised by the parent club if their loanee doesn't play ? Seems a shitty thing to write into a contract - if we're already taking on his wages and a loan fee (did someone on here say it was £7m?), surely we can do with him what we want. Including dropping/hooking him if he isn't at the races.
It's a regular thing with young players. Think Chelsea do it with their youngsters, club that takes them on gets fined if the player dosen't start. Liverpool also apparently did it when Brewster went to Swansea.
As you say given the big loan fee and wages we've taken on for the season you'd like to think we've avoided all of that nonsense.
I don't really get why he's unsubable so far. Spurs took off Son tonight with 10 minutes left on a tight game they were winning so I dunno just keeping the regular 11 on the pitch at all costs just feels to me like we're really going to hit the wall come February or March as in the MON seasons.
Hopefully we've got enough points in the bank by then for any poor run not to hurt too much.
Regarding the fines thing, I can't believe it'd be a blanket policy wherein they have to play every minute of every game. I don't think it was Brewster that was an issue, he started 19 games for Swansea in half a season. Unlike Kent who went to Bristol City, he only ended up starting half a dozen games for them.
I'd imagine there'll be clauses included that involve percentages of games, but I'd be surprised if those didn't in some way correlate to how much of the wage the parent club still stump up for.
Post by: SoccerHQ on November 02, 2020, 01:07:29 AM
https://www.newsatden.co.uk/71986-millwall-boss-on-difficulty-of-premier-league-loans-but-why-he-doesnt-rule-it-out/
Post by: kippaxvilla2 on November 02, 2020, 07:14:40 AM
Post by: Drummond on November 03, 2020, 07:20:59 AM
Post by: Risso on November 03, 2020, 08:58:14 AM
Jesus wept, we don't half give up on folk quickly.
People can discuss the fact that he hasn't played at all well in the last two games without "giving up" on him, surely?
Post by: Drummond on November 03, 2020, 01:13:37 PM
Jesus wept, we don't half give up on folk quickly.
People can discuss the fact that he hasn't played at all well in the last two games without "giving up" on him, surely?
Yes but there are calls for him to be dropped. He's been a big part of the good start to the season, and yet people want him out of the team after a couple of bad results. See also Cash, Mings, McGinn and people are suggesting Watkins is anonymous too.
Post by: brontebilly on November 03, 2020, 01:26:57 PM
Jesus wept, we don't half give up on folk quickly.
People can discuss the fact that he hasn't played at all well in the last two games without "giving up" on him, surely?
Yes but there are calls for him to be dropped. He's been a big part of the good start to the season, and yet people want him out of the team after a couple of bad results. See also Cash, Mings, McGinn and people are suggesting Watkins is anonymous too.
Getting dropped and giving up on a player are two different things entirely. The only player on our books that the forum (and also the club) has given up on is Lansbury. Getting dropped is no harm, it happens most players at some stage for various reasons unless MON is the manager.
Post by: West Derby Villan on November 03, 2020, 08:55:50 PM
Jesus wept, we don't half give up on folk quickly.
People can discuss the fact that he hasn't played at all well in the last two games without "giving up" on him, surely?
Yes but there are calls for him to be dropped. He's been a big part of the good start to the season, and yet people want him out of the team after a couple of bad results. See also Cash, Mings, McGinn and people are suggesting Watkins is anonymous too.
Getting dropped and giving up on a player are two different things entirely. The only player on our books that the forum (and also the club) has given up on is Lansbury. Getting dropped is no harm, it happens most players at some stage for various reasons unless MON is the manager.
Resting/dropping all them may be a problem in itself
Post by: LukeJames on November 08, 2020, 09:11:17 PM
He's either 9/10 or 3/10, If he can turn the 3's into 6's or 7's he's a £50m player.
Post by: brontebilly on November 08, 2020, 09:23:12 PM
Fucking superb!
He's either 9/10 or 3/10, If he can turn the 3's into 6's or 7's he's a £50m player.
Andy Townsend said the same tonight on commentary. Brilliant assist for the second goal.
Post by: Ian. on November 08, 2020, 09:32:42 PM
Post by: darren woolley on November 08, 2020, 09:50:17 PM
Post by: paul_e on November 08, 2020, 09:52:23 PM
Post by: TonyD on November 08, 2020, 09:53:44 PM
Post by: PaulWinch again on November 08, 2020, 09:54:07 PM
Post by: London Villan on November 08, 2020, 10:00:59 PM
Post by: PeterWithesShin on November 08, 2020, 10:31:37 PM
Post by: Meanwood Villa on November 08, 2020, 10:37:27 PM
Post by: Lastfootstamper on November 08, 2020, 10:46:30 PM
Post by: brontebilly on November 08, 2020, 10:55:54 PM
If he did all the defensive work on top of what he offers attack wise, and did it every game, he wouldn't be on loan to us.
While that might be true, it still shouldnt stop Barkley putting more of a shift in without the ball. At times when Grealish is caught up the pitch it shouldn't be beyond him to cover back. Watkins at times sprinted back to help us out.
Post by: nigel on November 09, 2020, 07:25:37 AM
Post by: frank black on November 09, 2020, 07:31:29 AM
If we can, I think we should try and make it a permanent move in January before Chelsea decide he can do a job for them
I’d rather we spend the money elsewhere January and assess Barkley’s situation in the summer.
Post by: CT on November 09, 2020, 07:35:14 AM
If he did all the defensive work on top of what he offers attack wise, and did it every game, he wouldn't be on loan to us.
While that might be true, it still shouldnt stop Barkley putting more of a shift in without the ball. At times when Grealish is caught up the pitch it shouldn't be beyond him to cover back. Watkins at times sprinted back to help us out.
I thought he was spent on 70 minutes. A couple of times he was trotting around and seemingly unable to run properly. I would’ve taken him off, but then he set up the second goal!
Post by: simboy on November 09, 2020, 08:05:17 AM
If we can, I think we should try and make it a permanent move in January before Chelsea decide he can do a job for them
I don’t think Chelsea will want him back. Their squad is full of midfielders who he’d struggle to get past, Mount, Pulisic, Havertz, Ziyech. They have the strongest midfield in the competition, arguably, which is why we have got Barkley.
More of a worry is that he attracts the attention of another “top six” club, Man United or the Arse for example and we get into a bidding war. Clearly Yanited are in turmoil, with Olly gone I’d imagine before the end of the season. If a new manager goes in and is a big fan of Barkley then, who knows.
Will Smith (as he’s promised) get him in the Euro squad? If so then I think he will stay.
Post by: Dave P on November 09, 2020, 09:55:14 AM
Will Smith (as he’s promised) get him in the Euro squad? If so then I think he will stay.
He certainly is our fresh prince.
Post by: dave shelley on November 09, 2020, 10:24:46 AM
Will Smith (as he’s promised) get him in the Euro squad? If so then I think he will stay.
He certainly is our fresh prince.
He is Legend!
Post by: Drummond on November 09, 2020, 10:49:54 AM
It's great to see him and Grealish just enjoying playing together. It's early days but this could be really interesting to watch develop.
Post by: Risso on November 09, 2020, 12:03:57 PM
Post by: Mister E on November 09, 2020, 12:53:51 PM
I noticed him a couple of times go to track back onto the advancing Arsenal midfield, but he stopped himself. I reckon he was under instruction to stay up top near Watkins, and it's hard to argue that that didn't pay a handsome dividend. Similarly, both Grealish and Trezeguet rarely got dragged deeper than Targett or Cash. Stick to the game plan and trust your teammates.I think this is exactly the point. He's a withdrawn striker, and he's very effective at it when the opposition let him be.
Post by: simboy on November 09, 2020, 12:56:22 PM
Will Smith (as he’s promised) get him in the Euro squad? If so then I think he will stay.
He certainly is our fresh prince.
He is Legend!
Good to see he’s a man in black ... ink.
Post by: ChicagoLion on November 09, 2020, 01:28:25 PM
Post by: paul_e on November 09, 2020, 01:38:40 PM
Begining to see what we have got in Barkley. He only has a forward gear it seems and to an extent other players have got to make up for this. However he has a lot of talent and to get the most out of him Smith is giving him liscence to roam and hurt the opposition offensively. Great performance last night.
I think I agree. Games where we can get control he'll be a key player and will turns draws into wins. When we're struggling to get control in the midfield he becomes a luxury we can't carry.
Post by: DrGonzo on November 09, 2020, 07:00:07 PM
Post by: Risso on November 09, 2020, 07:00:42 PM
Post by: eamonn on November 09, 2020, 09:40:09 PM
Post by: robleflaneur on November 09, 2020, 09:58:18 PM
When I saw him first play for England,I was very critical of his non tracking back but he's still more mobile and a better tackler than Hotlips.Playing SJM deeper is the answer in the way that Saints use Ward-Prowse and Romeu.Begining to see what we have got in Barkley. He only has a forward gear it seems and to an extent other players have got to make up for this. However he has a lot of talent and to get the most out of him Smith is giving him liscence to roam and hurt the opposition offensively. Great performance last night.
I think I agree. Games where we can get control he'll be a key player and will turns draws into wins. When we're struggling to get control in the midfield he becomes a luxury we can't carry.
Post by: Steve67 on November 09, 2020, 10:06:17 PM
Post by: FatSam on November 10, 2020, 12:10:03 AM
There might be a hitch if he’s seen as one of the bad boys, but then his competitors might be seen as the bad boys 2.Good to see he’s a man in black ... ink.He is Legend!Will Smith (as he’s promised) get him in the Euro squad? If so then I think he will stay.He certainly is our fresh prince.
Post by: Lastfootstamper on November 10, 2020, 08:59:42 AM
The biggest problem with Ross is....he pulls his socks over his knees. No, no, no and indeed, no. Sort it out.
Even John Terry managed to ingratiate himself with us despite the same faux pas. Time heals.
Post by: The Edge on November 10, 2020, 09:21:04 AM
I'm glad it's not just me. For some reason I get really pissed off with players who pull their socks over their knees. And from memory I think JT was the first in the Premier league do this affront to football. Time is a great healer but not on this one for me. Anyhow I hope our people are already working on a permanent deal for Barkley. He has helped to take our midfield to another level. And Jack's game has got even better as he seems to be getting a little less attention from the opposition.The biggest problem with Ross is....he pulls his socks over his knees. No, no, no and indeed, no. Sort it out.
Even John Terry managed to ingratiate himself with us despite the same faux pas. Time heals.
Post by: Jon Crofts on November 10, 2020, 09:25:42 AM
I'm glad it's not just me. For some reason I get really pissed off with players who pull their socks over their knees. And from memory I think JT was the first in the Premier league do this affront to football. Time is a great healer but not on this one for me. Anyhow I hope our people are already working on a permanent deal for Barkley. He has helped to take our midfield to another level. And Jack's game has got even better as he seems to be getting a little less attention from the opposition.The biggest problem with Ross is....he pulls his socks over his knees. No, no, no and indeed, no. Sort it out.
Even John Terry managed to ingratiate himself with us despite the same faux pas. Time heals.
Very noticeable re the last point, that said we've yet to come up against the real cloggers like your Burnley's or Albion's.
Post by: Sexual Ealing on November 10, 2020, 09:31:55 AM
The biggest problem with Ross is....he pulls his socks over his knees. No, no, no and indeed, no. Sort it out.
Even John Terry managed to ingratiate himself with us despite the same faux pas. Time heals.
Not all of us!
Post by: OCD on November 10, 2020, 11:29:32 AM
Post by: DrGonzo on November 10, 2020, 08:17:57 PM
To get the best out of him, I think he's got to play as a 10 and have McGinn and Luiz sitting in front of the defence. Then if he does play that role, the front 4 can swap positions.I have a sum total of zero problems with that.
Post by: ChicagoLion on November 10, 2020, 10:00:40 PM
To get the best out of him, I think he's got to play as a 10 and have McGinn and Luiz sitting in front of the defence. Then if he does play that role, the front 4 can swap positions.I think he has to play where he played last night, 'The Mighty Reds YNWA' and Leicester. There are risks when we dont have the ball as mentioned.
If you look at our forward play, Olllie was often pulling out wide and RB was in the 9 position. RB is given liscence to roam and find pockets of space in wide, deep or advanced positions. That is not a 10 in my understanding of the role.
Post by: brontebilly on November 10, 2020, 10:20:32 PM
To get the best out of him, I think he's got to play as a 10 and have McGinn and Luiz sitting in front of the defence. Then if he does play that role, the front 4 can swap positions.
McGinn next to Luiz is so much better for our shape. But not sure that will be McGinns best position in the medium/long term. It's not often a holding midfielder has the ball in the opposition net within 45 mins away from home...He would prefer to be further forward I'm sure.
Equally as important was the shift Trez put in without the ball on the right. I'm struggling to see how Traore gets in. Traore/Barkley/Grealish will leaves us unbalanced no matter what I think.
Post by: OCD on November 11, 2020, 11:32:21 AM
Traore's got a challenge on his hands for sure. Well done for Trez for rising to the challenge of seeing a big money signing made who can play the same position.
Post by: brontebilly on November 11, 2020, 10:30:45 PM
It's ok for McGinn to make breaks forward as long as other players have the intelligence to fill-in. Mings likes to make runs forward which makes me nervous but it's the same principle. Someone has to slot in. The quality and tactics of the opposition is also relevant. Sometimes McGinn (and Luiz) may be allowed a bit more freedom because of the quality/tactics of the opponent.
Traore's got a challenge on his hands for sure. Well done for Trez for rising to the challenge of seeing a big money signing made who can play the same position.
Mings shouldn't be making many runs, hasn't the technical ability. Ridiculous effort at Arsenal again that nearly cost us in the second half. It might be a forlorn hope but I really wish he focused more on the defending side which needs enough improvement as is....not his ball playing inability
Agreed that if McGinn breaks forward then someone should be covering but that appears like it won't be Barkley too often. I think that's going to be a problem for us. Grealish and Watkins don't have an issue in getting back so I'm not sure why Barkley seems to be exempt.
Post by: Risso on November 12, 2020, 09:08:43 AM
Post by: ChicagoLion on November 12, 2020, 09:16:25 AM
i think you have to accept that cetain players are not very good at certain things, what he brings to the team is from getting on to the ball in attacking situations, to do that he can not be one of the ones filling in and chasing down. as someone said, in games where we need gaps plugging and closing down space then Barkley is not your man for that.It's ok for McGinn to make breaks forward as long as other players have the intelligence to fill-in. Mings likes to make runs forward which makes me nervous but it's the same principle. Someone has to slot in. The quality and tactics of the opposition is also relevant. Sometimes McGinn (and Luiz) may be allowed a bit more freedom because of the quality/tactics of the opponent.
Traore's got a challenge on his hands for sure. Well done for Trez for rising to the challenge of seeing a big money signing made who can play the same position.
Mings shouldn't be making many runs, hasn't the technical ability. Ridiculous effort at Arsenal again that nearly cost us in the second half. It might be a forlorn hope but I really wish he focused more on the defending side which needs enough improvement as is....not his ball playing inability
Agreed that if McGinn breaks forward then someone should be covering but that appears like it won't be Barkley too often. I think that's going to be a problem for us. Grealish and Watkins don't have an issue in getting back so I'm not sure why Barkley seems to be exempt.
Post by: Abbeyfealeavfc on November 12, 2020, 09:47:18 AM
Post by: Lastfootstamper on November 12, 2020, 10:15:07 AM
Post by: ChicagoLion on November 12, 2020, 11:14:11 AM
This is fine in principle but needs to be applied to all players in the team/squad. Some players are expected to be without fault or weaknesses, but the tolerance levels for them are very low when they fall short. Allowances can't just be made for certain individuals and not others, not if we want a successful "team"I was skeptical of getting Barkley in because of these issues, now I understand what he is and does its about using him appropriately.
I guess some think that Hourihane is criticised for his contribution without the ball which is also valid, the decision is who gives more to the team overall and right now its Barkley.
Post by: paul_e on November 12, 2020, 11:21:13 AM
Post by: Lastfootstamper on November 12, 2020, 11:27:43 AM
Post by: Risso on November 12, 2020, 11:32:56 AM
Post by: paul_e on November 12, 2020, 11:46:10 AM
Post by: Abbeyfealeavfc on November 12, 2020, 12:02:13 PM
To my knowledge Conor has never played that position.
Jack is the closest we have who could play that role, but he seems to have made the wide left position of the front 3 his own, so even that comparison can't be made.
Post by: Rudy65 on November 12, 2020, 12:24:59 PM
What sort of monetary value are we putting on Ross if we try to sign him? Is he likely to be available? Would you sign him, if so?
£25m and yes definitely, assuming his form continues Could be more if he continues to play as well for the rest of the season. He is a real upgrade on what we have
Post by: paul_e on November 12, 2020, 12:50:55 PM
I don't quite get the comparison between the 2 (Ross and Conor), because although it appeared Barkley was brought in as a midfielder, it appears his best role is as a second striker (playing off Ollie).
To my knowledge Conor has never played that position.
Jack is the closest we have who could play that role, but he seems to have made the wide left position of the front 3 his own, so even that comparison can't be made.
The comparison is because 1 came into the team in place of the other. The discussion isn't about their relative abilities. It's really about the shape of the team. With Barkley you have to play 4231 because you know he's going to, as you say, play as almost a 2nd striker. With Hourihane you can play a 433 because he'll play deeper, but does also offer a threat from set pieces (not just direct free kicks, he's also our best corner taker and indirect free-kick taker, in my opinion). My point is that in some games the 4231 might not work and that's when we need to be willing to rest/replace Barkley, which we haven't done in the 2 games where he really struggled.
Post by: Toronto Villa on November 12, 2020, 12:58:05 PM
An ineffective Barkley is every bit as bad as an ineffective Hourihane. Barkley at his best is a considerable upgrade on Conor though.
We’ve seen Jack ineffective and Douglas and McGinn. I don’t always get the criticism of Conor. He’s a top Championship player, a good PL player, someone who will come in and do a job as part of the squad. He’s not a player who would get into a top six aspirational side and as great as the start has been, realistically we are a season or two away from that.
So right now he fits in well with us. In a years time he will be a little further down the pecking order as we buy better again. But we are at his level in term of players we should have at the club and and he is just about at ours.
Post by: Lastfootstamper on November 12, 2020, 01:05:55 PM
Hourihane and Barkley are, to me anyway, exactly the same type of silky, skillful ball players that get branded as 'luxury'. Their roll is to get you something out of a game, not merely keep you in one. The only way either of them strengthen our midfield is by keeping the ball out of it. If steel's what you want, look elsewhere. Says me.
Post by: Abbeyfealeavfc on November 12, 2020, 01:19:08 PM
I didn't know much about Barkley before he came to Villa. Now I've seen him, he is best suited to playing as an extra striker (L'pool and Arsenal games are proof of that) where he doesn't have to shoulder midfield responsibilities.
If he continues to play this position the only player he could genuinely be compared with is Jack.
If he drops deeper into midfield then he can be compared with the likes of Luiz, John, Conor and Nakamba and in so doing if he plays like he did vs Leeds and Soton he will risk the same level of criticism when he makes mistakes as those players do, when they make mistakes (not necessarily from me I might add).
Post by: Mister E on November 12, 2020, 04:55:28 PM
With Barkley it's all about team formation, so in that I agree with paul_e.Agreed.
I didn't know much about Barkley before he came to Villa. Now I've seen him, he is best suited to playing as an extra striker (L'pool and Arsenal games are proof of that) where he doesn't have to shoulder midfield responsibilities.
If he continues to play this position the only player he could genuinely be compared with is Jack.
If he drops deeper into midfield then he can be compared with the likes of Luiz, John, Conor and Nakamba and in so doing if he plays like he did vs Leeds and Soton he will risk the same level of criticism when he makes mistakes as those players do, when they make mistakes (not necessarily from me I might add).
There are games where we should be playing a 4-4-1-1, with Barkley behind Watkins, another MF in there alongside JG, Luiz and JMcG.
Post by: brontebilly on November 12, 2020, 06:35:51 PM
An ineffective Barkley is every bit as bad as an ineffective Hourihane. Barkley at his best is a considerable upgrade on Conor though.
We’ve seen Jack ineffective and Douglas and McGinn. I don’t always get the criticism of Conor. He’s a top Championship player, a good PL player, someone who will come in and do a job as part of the squad. He’s not a player who would get into a top six aspirational side and as great as the start has been, realistically we are a season or two away from that.
So right now he fits in well with us. In a years time he will be a little further down the pecking order as we buy better again. But we are at his level in term of players we should have at the club and and he is just about at ours.
I know professional football is a ruthless game but Hourihane has been treated very harshly this season with his lack of playing minutes. Arguably he was our best midfielder against Sheff Utd but was first man off (was visibly seething coming off) when McGinn in particular was having a shocker. He got a goal and assist against Fulham in a fine display but hasn't played a single minute since. Against Leeds and Southampton, our midfield was torn apart and should have come on for any of them. While against Liverpool and Arsenal the games were won long before the end so even a sympathy run out could have been warranted.
Not sure if there has been a fall out behind the scenes but I'm not sure why we haven't been emptying the bench more in recent games.
Post by: Pat Mustard on November 13, 2020, 10:28:33 AM
An ineffective Barkley is every bit as bad as an ineffective Hourihane. Barkley at his best is a considerable upgrade on Conor though.
We’ve seen Jack ineffective and Douglas and McGinn. I don’t always get the criticism of Conor. He’s a top Championship player, a good PL player, someone who will come in and do a job as part of the squad. He’s not a player who would get into a top six aspirational side and as great as the start has been, realistically we are a season or two away from that.
So right now he fits in well with us. In a years time he will be a little further down the pecking order as we buy better again. But we are at his level in term of players we should have at the club and and he is just about at ours.
I know professional football is a ruthless game but Hourihane has been treated very harshly this season with his lack of playing minutes. Arguably he was our best midfielder against Sheff Utd but was first man off (was visibly seething coming off) when McGinn in particular was having a shocker. He got a goal and assist against Fulham in a fine display but hasn't played a single minute since. Against Leeds and Southampton, our midfield was torn apart and should have come on for any of them. While against Liverpool and Arsenal the games were won long before the end so even a sympathy run out could have been warranted.
Not sure if there has been a fall out behind the scenes but I'm not sure why we haven't been emptying the bench more in recent games.
I suspect Conor will get plenty of game time in December and January - if anything we might be keeping him back now to reduce the chances of him getting injured ahead of the busiest period of the season. Barkley is new so needs the minutes with the rest of the team (even accounting for the good start he's made with us), plus at the moment we are only really playing one game per week. Come December the schedule ramps up a lot, so we will want players fresh and ready to come in.
Conor also seems like a brilliant professional and not the sort to upset things if he isn't getting a game. I'm sure he will knuckle down and want to prove himself again when he gets the chance, plus he will be coming into a confident team so will have more opportunity to showcase the things he is good at.
Post by: TelfordVilla on November 13, 2020, 11:05:20 AM
Post by: chrisw1 on November 13, 2020, 11:20:18 AM
He has been an incredibly important player for us and created and scored loads of goals during his time with us - including a vital goal in the play off Semis. Whatever his limitations round the park, he has been one of our most productive players for the last 3 years.
It's true that we needed and upgrade or at least competition for him and yes Barkley is a better all round player. But for fucks sake have some respect for a player who has played a massive part in our revival and the good times we have had over the last 3 years.
Post by: OCD on November 13, 2020, 11:32:38 AM
Post by: Abbeyfealeavfc on November 13, 2020, 12:00:02 PM
Post by: Toronto Villa on November 13, 2020, 12:28:12 PM
I wish people wouldn't be so disrepctful and call Conor 'holgram.'
He has been an incredibly important player for us and created and scored loads of goals during his time with us - including a vital goal in the play off Semis. Whatever his limitations round the park, he has been one of our most productive players for the last 3 years.
It's true that we needed and upgrade or at least competition for him and yes Barkley is a better all round player. But for fucks sake have some respect for a player who has played a massive part in our revival and the good times we have had over the last 3 years.
yeh I don't like it either. He may not be the best player in the world and as I said a solid squad player at PL level for a team aspiring for the upper echelons of the table. For us, since he joined he has absolutely played a crucial role in our promotion, survival, our good start this season and comes across as an excellent pro and all round good person.
Post by: dave shelley on November 13, 2020, 12:53:28 PM
Post by: Ian. on November 13, 2020, 01:47:12 PM
I wish people wouldn't be so disrepctful and call Conor 'holgram.'Me too, he's been an excellent signing for us and he's a fantastic pro and a great role model.
He has been an incredibly important player for us and created and scored loads of goals during his time with us - including a vital goal in the play off Semis. Whatever his limitations round the park, he has been one of our most productive players for the last 3 years.
It's true that we needed and upgrade or at least competition for him and yes Barkley is a better all round player. But for fucks sake have some respect for a player who has played a massive part in our revival and the good times we have had over the last 3 years.
Post by: Pat Mustard on November 13, 2020, 01:58:31 PM
Conor should be held up as an example to youngsters let go by clubs. This, is what you can still achieve, pick yourselves up, source a new club, work hard and your opportunities will come. You may never be the best player but you can prove the doubters wrong. Conor has achieved what most of us could only have dreamed of: gaining moves to higher level clubs until finally reaching the Premier League in which he played more than a minor role in helping his club achieve that goal. Conor, you deserve to be remembered by the Villa faithful for the right reasons; as I'm sure you will be.
Exactly right - he's scored at all four levels as well and made his way up the hard way through his own determination. And for someone who apparently isn't that good, you would be hard-pressed to come up with another player with a better top 5 goals for Villa than Conor.
Post by: ChicagoLion on November 13, 2020, 02:35:23 PM
Gray Shaw Daley Withe Yorke Rioch...........Conor should be held up as an example to youngsters let go by clubs. This, is what you can still achieve, pick yourselves up, source a new club, work hard and your opportunities will come. You may never be the best player but you can prove the doubters wrong. Conor has achieved what most of us could only have dreamed of: gaining moves to higher level clubs until finally reaching the Premier League in which he played more than a minor role in helping his club achieve that goal. Conor, you deserve to be remembered by the Villa faithful for the right reasons; as I'm sure you will be.
Exactly right - he's scored at all four levels as well and made his way up the hard way through his own determination. And for someone who apparently isn't that good, you would be hard-pressed to come up with another player with a better top 5 goals for Villa than Conor.
Post by: Sexual Ealing on November 13, 2020, 02:41:31 PM
I wish people wouldn't be so disrepctful and call Conor 'holgram.'
He has been an incredibly important player for us and created and scored loads of goals during his time with us - including a vital goal in the play off Semis. Whatever his limitations round the park, he has been one of our most productive players for the last 3 years.
It's true that we needed and upgrade or at least competition for him and yes Barkley is a better all round player. But for fucks sake have some respect for a player who has played a massive part in our revival and the good times we have had over the last 3 years.
Agreed.
Post by: KevinGage on November 13, 2020, 02:58:08 PM
I like him, and as others said, he did as much as anyone to get us up.
I don't pan El Ghazi for the same reason, even if he frustrates the hell out of me at times. Conor is probably operating at close to his maximum ability-wise to even be an option for a Premier League side. El Ghazi has enough natural ability to be a starter for at least a top 10-12 PL club. But the focus isn't there. Yet, at least.
Post by: Risso on November 13, 2020, 03:32:12 PM
I get some of the criticism of him. Ideally you want a central midfielder who comes in and - if he plays well- dictates the pace of the game. Conor has a good shot on him and does weigh in with valuable assists from dead balls. But the game even in the championship can pass him by at times.
I like him, and as others said, he did as much as anyone to get us up.
I don't pan El Ghazi for the same reason, even if he frustrates the hell out of me at times. Conor is probably operating at close to his maximum ability-wise to even be an option for a Premier League side. El Ghazi has enough natural ability to be a starter for at least a top 10-12 PL club. But the focus isn't there. Yet, at least.
I agree about Conor. At his best he's good enough for any side outside of the 7 or 8 clubs, but as all successful clubs do, we're moving on and steadily improving. Not sure I agree about El Ghazi. I think he's strictly a Championship/lower Premier League level player in terms of ability, and a lack of application means he doesn't make the most of what he has got.
Post by: Sexual Ealing on November 13, 2020, 03:35:32 PM
I get some of the criticism of him. Ideally you want a central midfielder who comes in and - if he plays well- dictates the pace of the game. Conor has a good shot on him and does weigh in with valuable assists from dead balls. But the game even in the championship can pass him by at times.
I like him, and as others said, he did as much as anyone to get us up.
I don't pan El Ghazi for the same reason, even if he frustrates the hell out of me at times. Conor is probably operating at close to his maximum ability-wise to even be an option for a Premier League side. El Ghazi has enough natural ability to be a starter for at least a top 10-12 PL club. But the focus isn't there. Yet, at least.
I agree about Conor. At his best he's good enough for any side outside of the 7 or 8 clubs, but as all successful clubs do, we're moving on and steadily improving. Not sure I agree about El Ghazi. I think he's strictly a Championship/lower Premier League level player in terms of ability, and a lack of application means he doesn't make the most of what he has got.
Yes. I hate saying any of our players are shit, but AEG is, and it's all his own doing. Conor is the opposite. He makes the most of all he's got, which sometimes isn't enough, but that's true of everyone.
Post by: villa for life on November 13, 2020, 03:45:58 PM
We are usually too quick to judge. Trezeguet was deemed surplus to requirements (that’s a nice way of putting it) by most but he has arguably been one of the best players this season. No need to mention all the other ex villa players who were cast aside too early and are currently plying their trade at other clubs, often very successfully.
I think the current upper echelons of our club are pretty decent and will treat everyone with respect and make the right judgement calls, including that of Conor.
Post by: N'ZMAV on November 13, 2020, 03:57:53 PM
Post by: West Derby Villan on November 13, 2020, 04:07:26 PM
Post by: VILLA MOLE on November 13, 2020, 05:11:40 PM
Conor isn’t shit, Ross is an upgrade, which is what teams with aspirations tend to do
He may raise his game now Ross is here but we haven’t seen him play yet
Post by: paul_e on November 13, 2020, 06:01:43 PM
Post by: DrGonzo on November 13, 2020, 06:43:26 PM
Post by: Dave P on November 13, 2020, 07:09:08 PM
Conor isn’t shit, Ross is an upgrade, which is what teams with aspirations tend to do
He may raise his game now Ross is here but we haven’t seen him play yet
See also how Trez has improved since we signed Traore.
Post by: Dante Lavelli on November 13, 2020, 07:13:07 PM
At the moment I’d like us to sign him, but I definitely would not pay over the going rate, say £20-25m, as he isn’t yet Mings and must be signed.
Post by: brentastonb6 on November 13, 2020, 10:04:03 PM
making him a worthy addition to our midfield. It was noticeable watching England v Ireland last night that Conor couldn’t hold his own against the English midfield much in the same way as he can’t in the premier league. He always seems off the pace both when attacking or defending.Hopefully another couple of months of current performances will see Barkley recalled to the national team .
Post by: Sexual Ealing on November 13, 2020, 10:05:43 PM
I’m thankful for all Conor has done for us but as has been said we are moving onwards and upwards with hopefully each signing we make being an upgrade on what we previously had. Barkley definitely is that , his energy, pace and strength
making him a worthy addition to our midfield. It was noticeable watching England v Ireland last night that Conor couldn’t hold his own against the English midfield much in the same way as he can’t in the premier league. He always seems off the pace both when attacking or defending.Hopefully another couple of months of current performances will see Barkley recalled to the national team .
If he was playing behind Ross Barkley and Jack Grealish he'd have looked better.
Post by: old man villa fan on November 14, 2020, 12:02:48 PM
Hourihane had reached his limit as a regular when we were promoted. He is a very good dead ball player but you need to be more than that at PL level. For a player that has had a career playing through the leagues, you cannot just add things to your game that you never had when you reach a higher level, unlike a young player that is still developing. A PL midfield player needs to understand about covering space and tracking a player, just as much as being able to tackle/block. He is not an all action energetic player and therefore is quite easily played around. Having said all of that, he was a good signing by Bruce, although I did not think Bruce got the best out of him by playing him too deep at times.
What I have seen so far from Barkley is that he is an upgrade, particularly going forward. He is new to the team and it takes time to understand how others play. Hopefully, in time he will develop that understanding with the other players on how to cover the opposition in midfield when they are coming forward. It is not unusual with offensive midfield players that they hit the ground running with their offensive game but the defensive game takes time to develop.
Post by: Risso on November 14, 2020, 02:02:05 PM
Post by: RamboandBruno on November 14, 2020, 02:25:20 PM
Saying all of that, as all clubs progressing in the right direction do, we’re moving on and bringing in a better standard of player. I don’t see Connor as a regular starter anymore, though I do wish he’d get the odd run out, 3-0 up at Arsenal with 10 mins to go, don’t see why he wasn’t brought on then, he deserves some game time. A very good servant for the club at an important period in our history.
Post by: OCD on November 14, 2020, 04:18:36 PM
Post by: aj2k77 on November 15, 2020, 10:38:50 AM
Post by: ChicagoLion on November 21, 2020, 07:28:58 PM
Post by: Risso on November 21, 2020, 07:31:19 PM
Post by: OCD on November 22, 2020, 06:42:17 PM
Post by: Villafirst on November 22, 2020, 10:36:14 PM
Post by: Villafirst on November 23, 2020, 10:52:45 PM
Post by: kippaxvilla2 on November 24, 2020, 12:59:17 AM
Post by: darren woolley on November 24, 2020, 03:00:27 PM
Post by: Rudy Can't Fail on November 24, 2020, 05:05:05 PM
Conor isn’t shit, Ross is an upgrade, which is what teams with aspirations tend to do
I wonder how good Barkley would be if like Conor he was shunted back to defensive midfield? I think it was it Bruce who first pushed Conor back to DM following a game where he'd played AM and scored twice with one of his best performances in a Villa shirt.
Post by: Dante Lavelli on November 24, 2020, 07:02:59 PM
They’re more similar players and we looked too open versus Brighton.
Post by: ChicagoLion on November 24, 2020, 07:08:11 PM
I think I’d prefer Ramsey/Hourihane to play than Traore during the interim period.the obvious thing is to push SJM further forward.
They’re more similar players and we looked too open versus Brighton.
Post by: Dante Lavelli on November 24, 2020, 07:33:04 PM
I think I’d prefer Ramsey/Hourihane to play than Traore during the interim period.the obvious thing is to push SJM further forward.
They’re more similar players and we looked too open versus Brighton.
Hmmmm. My only reservation there is you’re moving two players to accommodate one injury. McGinn is without doubt the (next) best in that position but I think he could benefit from more time perfecting the holding role.
In the event that Barkley does not sign permanently then McGinn is an ideal replacement. We can then sign an A+ defensive midfielder who, typically, will be cheaper than an attacking player. Happy days.
Post by: pelty on December 19, 2020, 08:08:26 PM
Post by: Toronto Villa on December 29, 2020, 05:10:14 PM
Post by: eamonn on December 29, 2020, 07:41:54 PM
Any word on his status? Really missing him.
Not!
Post by: Ian. on December 29, 2020, 07:56:41 PM
Post by: Toronto Villa on December 29, 2020, 08:03:05 PM
That’s sitting on the fence a wee bit with that tweet. Soon, like next match or soon like February?
I reckon he’ll be on the bench tomorrow or maybe even starting ahead of Bert to shore up the midfield a bit more.
Post by: Risso on December 29, 2020, 08:24:05 PM
That’s sitting on the fence a wee bit with that tweet. Soon, like next match or soon like February?
I reckon he’ll be on the bench tomorrow or maybe even starting ahead of Bert to shore up the midfield a bit more.
Tomorrow?!
Post by: Toronto Villa on December 29, 2020, 08:31:14 PM
That’s sitting on the fence a wee bit with that tweet. Soon, like next match or soon like February?
I reckon he’ll be on the bench tomorrow or maybe even starting ahead of Bert to shore up the midfield a bit more.
Tomorrow?!
yeh I meant Friday. Getting my days all fucked up.
Post by: Ian. on December 29, 2020, 08:33:13 PM
I haven’t know what day it is for nearly two weeks. Actually saying that, since March.That’s sitting on the fence a wee bit with that tweet. Soon, like next match or soon like February?
I reckon he’ll be on the bench tomorrow or maybe even starting ahead of Bert to shore up the midfield a bit more.
Tomorrow?!
yeh I meant Friday. Getting my days all fucked up.
Post by: PaulWinch again on January 02, 2021, 09:23:20 AM
Post by: CT on January 02, 2021, 09:28:10 AM
We'll see him in March then.
Post by: Ads on January 02, 2021, 09:29:25 AM
Post by: andyh on January 02, 2021, 10:01:11 AM
Smith saying Spurs. Sounds like he's not been match fit generally.The only way you become ‘match fit’ is by playing matches.......see SJM.
He is either over his injury or he’s not.
Post by: Risso on January 02, 2021, 10:02:19 AM
Post by: Drummond on January 02, 2021, 10:32:45 AM
Post by: eamonn on January 02, 2021, 10:40:33 AM
Post by: Luke8 on January 02, 2021, 11:10:50 AM
The more this happens, the more I think it's a deliberate ploy by the club to be as vague as possible.
Think this seems to be becoming more common with clubs now. I’m sure I’ve seen Tootenham fans bemoaning the fact that the club doesn’t put a public timeframe on player injuries.
Post by: Lastfootstamper on January 02, 2021, 11:37:50 AM
Post by: Risso on January 02, 2021, 11:51:22 AM
Post by: Percy McCarthy on January 02, 2021, 11:57:01 AM
Post by: Risso on January 02, 2021, 12:11:26 PM
Get Dele Alli in.
That would be a statement of intent. That kid had a very difficult upbringing which I think is part of the problem with him, so I think coming to a stable club like Villa would be in his best interests.
Post by: Ads on January 02, 2021, 12:59:15 PM
Post by: OCD on January 02, 2021, 01:00:51 PM
Post by: ChicagoLion on January 02, 2021, 02:24:06 PM
Get Dele Alli in.Him an Jack are big mates so it would not surprise me if something happens.
Only problem is dealing with Levi.
Post by: dave.woodhall on January 02, 2021, 02:38:08 PM
Get Dele Alli in.Him an Jack are big mates so it would not surprise me if something happens.
Only problem is dealing with Levi.
Aye, always runs rings round us does Daniel Levy.
Post by: SoccerHQ on January 02, 2021, 02:44:41 PM
I actually heard someone say it would be too risky to play him last night as it was so cold and potentially bad for his hamstring.
We'll see him in March then.
Didn't DS actually come out and say this after West Brom which was two weeks back? Thought he was joking but perhaps not!
Seems from DS comments last night he's not even being considered for Liverpool game which is a bit odd with that being a week away and would be ideal one to give him half an hour at least.
Post by: SoccerHQ on January 02, 2021, 02:48:52 PM
Maybe knowing there's a full week before the FA Cup game was a factor. He can do a full week's preparation rather than risk disrupting some of the side's momentum by coming in late as part of a week in which there were 3 games. Dean does speak about momentum a lot.
With the question last night DS didn't even mention Liverpool, just said he hoped he'd be back for Spurs although reporter could've just asked him if he'd be available for next league game I guess.
Post by: ChicagoLion on January 02, 2021, 03:15:55 PM
Spuds fans think he is a bit of a dick in negotiations.Get Dele Alli in.Him an Jack are big mates so it would not surprise me if something happens.
Only problem is dealing with Levi.
Aye, always runs rings round us does Daniel Levy.
Post by: LukeJames on January 02, 2021, 03:19:23 PM
Post by: Nii Lamptey on January 02, 2021, 03:25:31 PM
Get Dele Alli in.
Poch just signed as new PSG manager. Dele will be off there now - Shame, as I think he could have been the 'fit' Ross Barkley we're looking for.
Post by: Risso on January 02, 2021, 04:25:56 PM
Maybe knowing there's a full week before the FA Cup game was a factor. He can do a full week's preparation rather than risk disrupting some of the side's momentum by coming in late as part of a week in which there were 3 games. Dean does speak about momentum a lot.
With the question last night DS didn't even mention Liverpool, just said he hoped he'd be back for Spurs although reporter could've just asked him if he'd be available for next league game I guess.
He's quoted in the local press as saying:
"I'm not sure if I'll start him in the FA Cup game (vs Liverpool next week). He needs more minutes on the training ground."
Absolute farce.
Post by: ChicagoLion on January 02, 2021, 04:32:56 PM
It is obvious we need someone of his ability because last night showed a much too heavy reliability on Jack.
Post by: aj2k77 on January 02, 2021, 04:35:25 PM
Post by: ChicagoLion on January 02, 2021, 04:37:29 PM
I wouldn't be buying him. Minor hamstring injuries that take months are not for me.When they start playing up it’s difficult to remedy ( see Michael Owen)
Post by: Dante Lavelli on January 02, 2021, 05:36:29 PM
Post by: oldhill_avfc on January 02, 2021, 05:57:41 PM
Again too many injuries. (Not really played for 2 years).
Post by: PaulWinch again on January 02, 2021, 06:00:09 PM
Post by: LeeB on January 02, 2021, 06:01:24 PM
Get Dele Alli in.Him an Jack are big mates so it would not surprise me if something happens.
Only problem is dealing with Levi.
Negotiating with him can be very straussfull.
Post by: Risso on January 02, 2021, 06:06:30 PM
9 games and counting missed this season with a hamstring injury, plus 2 at the start of the season for Chelsea.
13 games missed last season with foot injuries.
38 games missed in the 17/18 season split over two periods for his hamstring.
Post by: villa `cross the mersey on January 02, 2021, 06:06:39 PM
Get Dele Alli in.Him an Jack are big mates so it would not surprise me if something happens.
Only problem is dealing with Levi.
Negotiating with him can be very straussfull.
[/quote
Yes I understand he is a bit of a Wrangler
Post by: Toronto Villa on January 02, 2021, 06:09:38 PM
Here's Ross's injury record. Good a player as he is, I'd probably not be making it a permanent transfer if it was up to me.
9 games and counting missed this season with a hamstring injury, plus 2 at the start of the season for Chelsea.
13 games missed last season with foot injuries.
38 games missed in the 17/18 season split over two periods for his hamstring.
His hamstring injury history explains why we are being extra cautious on bringing him back.
Post by: SoccerHQ on January 02, 2021, 06:30:24 PM
Maybe knowing there's a full week before the FA Cup game was a factor. He can do a full week's preparation rather than risk disrupting some of the side's momentum by coming in late as part of a week in which there were 3 games. Dean does speak about momentum a lot.
With the question last night DS didn't even mention Liverpool, just said he hoped he'd be back for Spurs although reporter could've just asked him if he'd be available for next league game I guess.
He's quoted in the local press as saying:
"I'm not sure if I'll start him in the FA Cup game (vs Liverpool next week). He needs more minutes on the training ground."
Absolute farce.
I thought he was already in light/full training given his return was supposed to be imminent over xmas period? We've got 5-6 days of training before Liverpool so it all seems a bit cloak and dagger for some reason.
Pretty much playing evening kick offs aswell up to end of January so when he does return it will be likely in freezing conditions.
Post by: SoccerHQ on January 02, 2021, 06:34:04 PM
He’s a busted flush.
Again too many injuries. (Not really played for 2 years).
He played 55 games in 18/19. 35 last season but a few of those would've been him as unused sub given Chelsea's number of CMs.
Think the injury problems were more at Everton where he broke his leg and had the hamstring issues that plauge him now.
It's all very frustrating. If he wasn't close to coming back for xmas period just don't say it as disappointing scanning the team news every game and not seeing his name on the bench.
Post by: Brazilian Villain on January 02, 2021, 06:34:40 PM
Get Dele Alli in.Him an Jack are big mates so it would not surprise me if something happens.
Only problem is dealing with Levi.
Negotiating with him can be very straussfull.
Indeed as he's always trying to selvedge a little extra from the deal.
Post by: Risso on January 02, 2021, 06:38:32 PM
Post by: eamonn on January 02, 2021, 07:58:48 PM
Get Dele Alli in.Him an Jack are big mates so it would not surprise me if something happens.
Only problem is dealing with Levi.
Negotiating with him can be very straussfull.
Indeed as he's always trying to selvedge a little extra from the deal.
Best H&V pun ever surely, given the limited framework ?
Post by: Dante Lavelli on January 02, 2021, 08:30:45 PM
Get Dele Alli in.Him an Jack are big mates so it would not surprise me if something happens.
Only problem is dealing with Levi.
Negotiating with him can be very straussfull.
Indeed as he's always trying to selvedge a little extra from the deal.
Yeah, not sure why but I always feared he’d be looking to pocket an extra bit of wedge from a permanent deal.
Post by: Drummond on January 03, 2021, 12:54:59 AM
Get Dele Alli in.Him an Jack are big mates so it would not surprise me if something happens.
Only problem is dealing with Levi.
Negotiating with him can be very straussfull.
Indeed as he's always trying to selvedge a little extra from the deal.
We'd probably get stitched up.
Post by: jwarry on January 03, 2021, 05:11:24 AM
Get Dele Alli in.Him an Jack are big mates so it would not surprise me if something happens.
Only problem is dealing with Levi.
Negotiating with him can be very straussfull.
Indeed as he's always trying to selvedge a little extra from the deal.
We'd probably get stitched up.
Yes with all the wrangling
Post by: oldhill_avfc on January 03, 2021, 08:16:11 AM
He’s a busted flush.
Again too many injuries. (Not really played for 2 years).
He played 55 games in 18/19. 35 last season but a few of those would've been him as unused sub given Chelsea's number of CMs.
Think the injury problems were more at Everton where he broke his leg and had the hamstring issues that plauge him now.
It's all very frustrating. If he wasn't close to coming back for xmas period just don't say it as disappointing scanning the team news every game and not seeing his name on the bench.
I was talking about delve ali
Post by: richtheholtender on January 03, 2021, 08:34:28 AM
Post by: four fornicholl on January 03, 2021, 08:48:23 AM
Didn't someone say he'd link up with Pepe ?Get Dele Alli in.Him an Jack are big mates so it would not surprise me if something happens.
Only problem is dealing with Levi.
Negotiating with him can be very straussfull.
Indeed as he's always trying to selvedge a little extra from the deal.
We'd probably get stitched up.
Yes with all the wrangling
Post by: Demitri_C on January 03, 2021, 09:12:43 AM
Post by: Rigadon on January 03, 2021, 09:21:01 AM
Post by: ChicagoLion on January 03, 2021, 10:01:20 AM
This is a small fee + a 1 year contract with an option to extend type deal.
Chelsea have too many midfielders and will be pleased to get him off the books.
Post by: SoccerHQ on January 03, 2021, 12:49:10 PM
Post by: SoccerHQ on January 03, 2021, 12:52:41 PM
He’s a busted flush.
Again too many injuries. (Not really played for 2 years).
He played 55 games in 18/19. 35 last season but a few of those would've been him as unused sub given Chelsea's number of CMs.
Think the injury problems were more at Everton where he broke his leg and had the hamstring issues that plauge him now.
It's all very frustrating. If he wasn't close to coming back for xmas period just don't say it as disappointing scanning the team news every game and not seeing his name on the bench.
I was talking about delve ali
Dele Alli played 45 times for club and country in 18/19, 38 games last season with no national team call ups.
I wouldn't say averaging 40 games a season is that injury prone. Kienan Davis by contrast has played 42 times for us since January 2018.
Post by: oldhill_avfc on January 03, 2021, 07:18:08 PM
He’s a busted flush.
Again too many injuries. (Not really played for 2 years).
He played 55 games in 18/19. 35 last season but a few of those would've been him as unused sub given Chelsea's number of CMs.
Think the injury problems were more at Everton where he broke his leg and had the hamstring issues that plauge him now.
It's all very frustrating. If he wasn't close to coming back for xmas period just don't say it as disappointing scanning the team news every game and not seeing his name on the bench.
I was talking about delve ali
Dele Alli played 45 times for club and country in 18/19, 38 games last season with no national team call ups.
I wouldn't say averaging 40 games a season is that injury prone. Kienan Davis by contrast has played 42 times for us since January 2018.
My main point is he's been hit severely by injuries, starting at the World Cup, then never fully recovering before being injured again soon after.
His starting appearances in the premier league since have been well down - he wasn't a first choice starter for Pochetino in his last year and hasn't been for Mourinho either.
He may have played more than I though, but injuries have certainly taken their toll on his performance level. The last season he got into double figures for premier league goals was 2016-17.
Post by: ChicagoLion on January 03, 2021, 07:21:01 PM
Post by: Risso on January 03, 2021, 07:23:49 PM
Post by: oldhill_avfc on January 03, 2021, 07:25:52 PM
Post by: oldhill_avfc on January 03, 2021, 07:26:30 PM
Alli has scored a lot more goals in the last few years than Barkley has. Alli 'only' got 8 Premier League goals last season. I'd be amazed if any of our midfielders incuding Barkley get that many this season.
So you think All plays midfield?
Post by: passport1 on January 03, 2021, 07:35:12 PM
Post by: Risso on January 03, 2021, 07:42:47 PM
Alli has scored a lot more goals in the last few years than Barkley has. Alli 'only' got 8 Premier League goals last season. I'd be amazed if any of our midfielders incuding Barkley get that many this season.
So you think All plays midfield?
He's an attacking midfielder, yes. When Spurs play a 4-4-2 he plays behind Son and Kane. When they play a 4-2-3-1 he plays in the attacking three. Not much this season, obviously.
Post by: brontebilly on January 03, 2021, 08:31:26 PM
Still only 24 though and more than capable of getting his career back on track post Mourinho like many have before aka KdeB, Salah etc
Post by: eamonn on January 03, 2021, 09:22:06 PM
Post by: Smithy on January 03, 2021, 09:25:49 PM
Then again, I'd have said similar about Barkley in the summer, so who knows? I'd love us to have a midfield that could play a mixture of McGinn, Grealish, Barkley, Alli, and Luiz. Imagine having had one of those to come off the bench at Old Trafford to try and change things...
Post by: tomd2103 on January 04, 2021, 12:18:09 AM
Post by: ChicagoLion on January 04, 2021, 06:15:59 AM
Post by: Luke8 on January 04, 2021, 08:17:59 AM
He would.compete with Traore Trez AEG and would be an improvement on all 3.
Would he be competing with them though? They are more wingers/inside forwards whereas Alli has generally played as a number ten or an eight hasn’t he?
I agree with Tom in that he is more likely competing with Barkley and McGinn for a place in the starting XI so I’m not really sure where he fits in. And we aren’t quite at the stage where we are going to have players that good on the bench.
Post by: ChicagoLion on January 04, 2021, 09:36:45 AM
He has played wide in a 3, i do not think the Barkley is relevant on the basis that he appears to have long term injury issues. If we are going to compete we need strength in depth.He would.compete with Traore Trez AEG and would be an improvement on all 3.
Would he be competing with them though? They are more wingers/inside forwards whereas Alli has generally played as a number ten or an eight hasn’t he?
I agree with Tom in that he is more likely competing with Barkley and McGinn for a place in the starting XI so I’m not really sure where he fits in. And we aren’t quite at the stage where we are going to have players that good on the bench.
There is no doubt in my opinion that he would strengthen the team and that has to be the criteria.
Post by: Risso on January 04, 2021, 09:46:05 AM
He would.compete with Traore Trez AEG and would be an improvement on all 3.
Would he be competing with them though? They are more wingers/inside forwards whereas Alli has generally played as a number ten or an eight hasn’t he?
I agree with Tom in that he is more likely competing with Barkley and McGinn for a place in the starting XI so I’m not really sure where he fits in. And we aren’t quite at the stage where we are going to have players that good on the bench.
Smith clearly sees McGinn as one of the two in front of the defence with Luiz, so no, Alli wouldn't be competing with him I don't think. In our current set up, he'd be competing with Trez, Traore and El Ghazi. Can't see him being on the bench much on that basis.
Post by: Lastfootstamper on January 04, 2021, 09:54:42 AM
Post by: ChicagoLion on January 04, 2021, 09:54:57 AM
exactlyHe would.compete with Traore Trez AEG and would be an improvement on all 3.
Would he be competing with them though? They are more wingers/inside forwards whereas Alli has generally played as a number ten or an eight hasn’t he?
I agree with Tom in that he is more likely competing with Barkley and McGinn for a place in the starting XI so I’m not really sure where he fits in. And we aren’t quite at the stage where we are going to have players that good on the bench.
Smith clearly sees McGinn as one of the two in front of the defence with Luiz, so no, Alli wouldn't be competing with him I don't think. In our current set up, he'd be competing with Trez, Traore and El Ghazi. Can't see him being on the bench much on that basis.
Post by: Luke8 on January 04, 2021, 10:07:57 AM
Post by: ChicagoLion on January 04, 2021, 10:25:46 AM
Hmm. I’m not sure. You’d effectively be asking one of Alli, Barkley or Grealish to play wide on the right. I’m not that has the right balance for the team.Jesus.
Post by: Luke8 on January 04, 2021, 10:47:26 AM
Post by: chrisw1 on January 04, 2021, 10:48:28 AM
Whether it's a priority when we are 1 injury away from a crisis at both striker and DM I'm not so sure. And then there's FFP which hasn't gone away no matter how much people put fingers in ears and pretend it has. I'd be amazed if we spend anything like £30m+ this window.
Post by: GordonCowansisthegreatest on January 04, 2021, 10:54:23 AM
Post by: Risso on January 04, 2021, 11:00:35 AM
So where would he play then?
McGinn Luiz
Trez/Traore Alli Grealish
Watkins
It's not that hard, in the spot you'd want Barkley in were he ever fit.
Post by: Luke8 on January 04, 2021, 11:05:06 AM
So where would he play then?
McGinn Luiz
Trez/Traore Alli Grealish
Watkins
It's not that hard, in the spot you'd want Barkley in were he ever fit.
Yeah, so it him or Barkley which was my point. Not him or Trez/Traore as Chicago was saying.
If we are taking about him instead of Barkley that’s fine. There is no way we have both of them in a squad in my opinion.
Post by: Drummond on January 04, 2021, 11:13:16 AM
Post by: Lastfootstamper on January 04, 2021, 11:53:09 AM
Post by: Chris Smith on January 04, 2021, 12:02:35 PM
Post by: Monty on January 04, 2021, 12:11:47 PM
Post by: nick harper on January 04, 2021, 12:21:47 PM
Post by: Demitri_C on January 04, 2021, 12:40:25 PM
Post by: Risso on January 04, 2021, 01:12:55 PM
Post by: PaulWinch again on January 04, 2021, 01:13:56 PM
Post by: ChicagoLion on January 04, 2021, 01:14:27 PM
Post by: cdward on January 04, 2021, 01:15:13 PM
So this birthday party business has left him out in the cold under some sort of semblance that he's still recovering from injury but is in fact being told in no uncertain terms he can be fit as he likes but he's not allowed to play in the villa team for a period as he broke rules both in his loan agreement and covid rules.
This party night that Jack was at (and wasn't punished) and was looked into by the club, and found no COVID rule breaking.
Post by: Lastfootstamper on January 04, 2021, 01:27:44 PM
Post by: chrisw1 on January 04, 2021, 01:35:30 PM
Post by: Risso on January 04, 2021, 01:39:12 PM
Grealish was at the same do in Mayfair, so if Barkley was being punished, then you'd have to punish Jack as well.Jack is our guy and the main man a big player. He will be given more slack.
Plus it was Ross birthday
Barkley is a loan part player , a very good one , but has disrupted things with his injury and if he never was Villa then Grealish wouldn't have been at his party.
Now at least when Abraham had his birthday party it was a surprise one rather than being organised by ownself like Ross did.
Just shows the calibre of Tammy that people have surprise birthday parties for him while Barkley has to make his own and invite new best friend from VillaEh? I suspect it’s an injury running on. Barkley has for the most part been outstanding for us.
I suspect some extra time out no doubt hes injured as we all saw v Brighton but it will be over 2 months out now when he next plays
Maybe he's not happy he's been told he can't be in the first team because Villa done so well without him
There is something a miss.
So this birthday party business has left him out in the cold under some sort of semblance that he's still recovering from injury but is in fact being told in no uncertain terms he can be fit as he likes but he's not allowed to play in the villa team for a period as he broke rules both in his loan agreement and covid rules.
This party night that Jack was at (and wasn't punished) and was looked into by the club, and found no COVID rule breaking.
We can agree to disagree.
Won't go over guidelines and what would be more helpful in stopping a spread.
Barkley need for a birthday party has caused this.
I say bring Abraham in send Barkley back.
I like Barkley as a player perhaps one of the best if not the best English midfielder along with Grealosh but he's performed poor he
And anyway getting injured in 1 minutes of the match v Brighton showed he did not do a warm up routine
If he put more care into his pre match training that he did to his birthday planning he wouldn't be injured in first place
You don't half talk a load of nonsense. Deary me.
Post by: Brazilian Villain on January 04, 2021, 01:42:58 PM
There is something a miss.
From the photos I saw of Jack there was definitely a miss involved.
Post by: SteveN on January 04, 2021, 01:49:41 PM
Post by: brontebilly on January 04, 2021, 02:12:59 PM
I think a far better fit than Ali and cheaper would be Buendia from Norwich.
Tidy baller but a bit tubby and I can't see Norwich selling anyone until promotion is assured.
Unless we send Barkley back then I can't see us signing another attacking midfielder this month.
RCB (replace Engels so maybe Tuanzebe ) LCM (upgrade on Hourihane/Nakamba) and backup for Watkins likely to be the priorities. It's going to be a very difficult market to sign or sell anyone.
Post by: paul_e on January 04, 2021, 02:24:22 PM
Post by: Drummond on January 04, 2021, 02:31:22 PM
I'm with Monty when it comes to Alli, I don't know what type of player he is because the one thing he was really good at when he came through (arriving late into the box and scoring lots of goals) hasn't improved (his record in his first 3 years at spurs was far better than his record in the last 3) and he doesn't seem to have added anything else to his game. He's got talent, that's undeniable but I'm not sure he has the attitude or desire anymore. Compare him to Grealish and the difference is stark, Jack had flaws in his game but every summer he comes back having addressed them and goes up a level, that's the sort of attitude we need to be looking for in players (and we've found it in plenty of the signings from last summer).
We could be the perfect place to build him up again. I note Spurs say he's not available, presumably to up the price. Oh what a genius Levi is ::)
Post by: Risso on January 04, 2021, 02:51:55 PM
I'm with Monty when it comes to Alli, I don't know what type of player he is because the one thing he was really good at when he came through (arriving late into the box and scoring lots of goals) hasn't improved (his record in his first 3 years at spurs was far better than his record in the last 3) and he doesn't seem to have added anything else to his game. He's got talent, that's undeniable but I'm not sure he has the attitude or desire anymore. Compare him to Grealish and the difference is stark, Jack had flaws in his game but every summer he comes back having addressed them and goes up a level, that's the sort of attitude we need to be looking for in players (and we've found it in plenty of the signings from last summer).
On the other hand he's playing for Mourinho, and when you get on the wrong side of him there's usually not a way back. He's still only 24, and I reckon Villa Park would be the perfect place for him to get his career back on track.
Post by: paul_e on January 04, 2021, 02:59:04 PM
I'm with Monty when it comes to Alli, I don't know what type of player he is because the one thing he was really good at when he came through (arriving late into the box and scoring lots of goals) hasn't improved (his record in his first 3 years at spurs was far better than his record in the last 3) and he doesn't seem to have added anything else to his game. He's got talent, that's undeniable but I'm not sure he has the attitude or desire anymore. Compare him to Grealish and the difference is stark, Jack had flaws in his game but every summer he comes back having addressed them and goes up a level, that's the sort of attitude we need to be looking for in players (and we've found it in plenty of the signings from last summer).
We could be the perfect place to build him up again. I note Spurs say he's not available, presumably to up the price. Oh what a genius Levi is ::)
Maybe, but into what? Would he be competing for a spot with McGinn and is he enegetic enough for that? Would he be competing for the spot Barkley and Jack have bene playing this season and is he creative enough for it? Would he be happy to play out wide and compete with the wingers? There's a lot of questions over him that I doubt anyone can answer right now because he's badly lost his way. I don't mind taking a player as a rehab project but I wouldn't make him our record signing to do it.
Post by: ChicagoLion on January 04, 2021, 03:00:15 PM
Post by: eamonn on January 04, 2021, 04:36:30 PM
Post by: ktvillan on January 04, 2021, 04:47:00 PM
Murinho will single out a player for special treatment as part of his "management style", see K De Bruyne at Chelsea.
Yep it's part of his MO to ostracise someone, usually someone talented, to show who's boss and he's not afraid to exclude even top talent. See also Pogba at Man Yew.
Post by: Dave on January 04, 2021, 05:45:30 PM
Murinho will single out a player for special treatment as part of his "management style", see K De Bruyne at Chelsea.
Yep it's part of his MO to ostracise someone, usually someone talented, to show who's boss and he's not afraid to exclude even top talent. See also Pogba at Man Yew.
Salah at Chelsea as well. Mata too. Shaw at ManYoo.
Post by: Monty on January 04, 2021, 06:47:06 PM
I'm not saying he's good enough or not good enough. I just don't even know what he is.
Post by: Brazilian Villain on January 04, 2021, 07:11:55 PM
Post by: chrisw1 on January 05, 2021, 10:22:27 AM
I recall similar sceptisism about Barkley, but the moment he played for us his quality just shines through. I'd hope it would be the same with Ali.
With that said, would I spend £40m on him right now? Nope. And I'm pretty convinced we won't even be looking at him with current FFP restrictions.
Post by: passport1 on January 05, 2021, 10:54:30 AM
Post by: Monty on January 05, 2021, 11:03:11 AM
Post by: OCD on January 05, 2021, 11:21:07 AM
I don't know the lower leagues and foreign leagues well enough to know who fits that profile like maybe some do but one name I've heard mentioned who meets that profile is Michael Olise at Reading. French 19-year old.
Post by: SoccerHQ on January 05, 2021, 02:50:16 PM
Mourinho's been at Spurs for a year and before that Alli was already well on the way down. In fact, not even down. What even is he? Where does he play, how does he play there, what does he do that others don't? And not in a Thomas Mueller kind of way, because he doesn't have exceptional awareness or movement either.
I'm not saying he's good enough or not good enough. I just don't even know what he is.
He actually had quite a good scoring run when Mourinho came in, 5 goals in Mourinho's first 8 games. Overall 9 last season.
He's always been a more technical Tim Cahill given his ability to ghost late into the box or make runs from deep. Due to the mad high line we had in the Spurs game last season he must've had about 3 one on ones in that game but missed them all given the form he was in at the time.
If we didn't have Barkley already here I'd be all for going for him but he'd just be a luxury with what we presently have.
Post by: ChicagoLion on January 05, 2021, 02:55:16 PM
Could we add a Poll to this thread.
Post by: olaftab on January 05, 2021, 02:59:00 PM
Post by: ChicagoLion on January 05, 2021, 03:04:40 PM
There is no doubt that Barkley gave opposition an add on to Grealish threat early season but of the 4, Luiz, McGinn, Traore and Ghazi, who would you leave out to bring him back in?I would be rotating Traore and AEG.
Post by: pelty on January 05, 2021, 03:12:26 PM
There is no doubt that Barkley gave opposition an add on to Grealish threat early season but of the 4, Luiz, McGinn, Traore and Ghazi, who would you leave out to bring him back in?
Traore every time; he does not impress me at all.
Post by: LeeB on January 05, 2021, 03:18:06 PM
There is no doubt that Barkley gave opposition an add on to Grealish threat early season but of the 4, Luiz, McGinn, Traore and Ghazi, who would you leave out to bring him back in?
Traore every time; he does not impress me at all.
He does me. I appreciate he can be frustrating, but you can see there is a very high skill level in there and when he's fully up to speed he's going to be immense. I also trust this management team to get the best out of him.
I give it 18 months before you start to get some friendless oddbod creating photoshops of him in a Man Utd kit.
Post by: Percy McCarthy on January 05, 2021, 03:21:27 PM
There is no doubt that Barkley gave opposition an add on to Grealish threat early season but of the 4, Luiz, McGinn, Traore and Ghazi, who would you leave out to bring him back in?
Traore every time; he does not impress me at all.
He does me. I appreciate he can be frustrating, but you can see there is a very high skill level in there and when he's fully up to speed he's going to be immense. I also trust this management team to get the best out of him.
I give it 18 months before you start to get some friendless oddbod creating photoshops of him in a Man Utd kit.
Spot on as always oracle..
Post by: eamonn on January 05, 2021, 03:23:54 PM
Post by: Monty on January 05, 2021, 03:31:34 PM
Mourinho's been at Spurs for a year and before that Alli was already well on the way down. In fact, not even down. What even is he? Where does he play, how does he play there, what does he do that others don't? And not in a Thomas Mueller kind of way, because he doesn't have exceptional awareness or movement either.
I'm not saying he's good enough or not good enough. I just don't even know what he is.
He actually had quite a good scoring run when Mourinho came in, 5 goals in Mourinho's first 8 games. Overall 9 last season.
He's always been a more technical Tim Cahill given his ability to ghost late into the box or make runs from deep. Due to the mad high line we had in the Spurs game last season he must've had about 3 one on ones in that game but missed them all given the form he was in at the time.
If we didn't have Barkley already here I'd be all for going for him but he'd just be a luxury with what we presently have.
I remember it, people were talking about a Dele Alli renaissance. Then nothing. I think this idea about his technique comes from his ball-striking ability but for all of the close-control skills that come off another 99 fail clunkily. I remember at the World Cup, for instance, how often promising moves seemed to hit him like a brick wall.
Post by: SheffieldVillain on January 05, 2021, 03:35:39 PM
There is no doubt that Barkley gave opposition an add on to Grealish threat early season but of the 4, Luiz, McGinn, Traore and Ghazi, who would you leave out to bring him back in?
Traore every time; he does not impress me at all.
Traore for me too. I think there's a decent player in there and he'll be good for us over time but I think we look more balanced with Jack and El Ghazi/Trez on the wings and Ross in the middle. Maybe something about him being so one-footed and coming inside so often, I don't know.
Post by: Brend'Watkins on January 05, 2021, 03:40:31 PM
There is no doubt that Barkley gave opposition an add on to Grealish threat early season but of the 4, Luiz, McGinn, Traore and Ghazi, who would you leave out to bring him back in?
Traore every time; he does not impress me at all.
Traore for me too. I think there's a decent player in there and he'll be good for us over time but I think we look more balanced with Jack and El Ghazi/Trez on the wings and Ross in the middle. Maybe something about him being so one-footed and coming inside so often, I don't know.
Me too. He's got something about him mind. Ross and Jack have a much better understanding. I am sometimes unsure what Traore is going to do or is trying to do as he doesn't appear to look up to see the bigger picture.
Post by: SamTheMouse on January 05, 2021, 06:46:32 PM
Post by: Risso on January 06, 2021, 12:12:26 AM
I'd rather have Barkley than Alli too.
A fit Barkley, certainly. There has to be a big question mark over how many games you'll get out of him over a season though.
Post by: pelty on January 06, 2021, 05:43:15 AM
There is no doubt that Barkley gave opposition an add on to Grealish threat early season but of the 4, Luiz, McGinn, Traore and Ghazi, who would you leave out to bring him back in?
Traore every time; he does not impress me at all.
He does me. I appreciate he can be frustrating, but you can see there is a very high skill level in there and when he's fully up to speed he's going to be immense. I also trust this management team to get the best out of him.
I give it 18 months before you start to get some friendless oddbod creating photoshops of him in a Man Utd kit.
Wow! I hope you are right! His touch is so frustrating at times, but you are right that it takes a bit of time to get up to speed. Still, I prefer Barkley to Traore in the either/or question posed here.
Post by: Ian. on January 06, 2021, 07:45:42 AM
I do like him and really want him fit, it’s another option. I don’t think he should guarantee starting though.
Post by: Mister E on January 06, 2021, 08:07:38 AM
A fit Barkley, certainly. There has to be a big question mark over how many games you'll get out of him over a season though.That's the key issue: at the moment, I'd be sending him back to Chelsea at the first opportunity because the plan to bring him in and use him as a foil for JG is inoperable. I hope Lange is scouring other leagues for a similar no.8.
Post by: chrisw1 on January 06, 2021, 09:01:19 AM
Post by: simboy on January 06, 2021, 09:43:52 AM
Post by: brontebilly on January 06, 2021, 09:44:48 AM
Since Barkley has been injured I’ve thought we’ve been far more balanced, but saying that he does give us yet another dimension to our game when he is on song. I do think we’ve been more consistent with AEG and Traore on each flank.
I do like him and really want him fit, it’s another option. I don’t think he should guarantee starting though.
Think Jack is more of a goal threat out wide though so we are losing out on that by moving him to 10. AEGs work rate has improved a lot so maybe Targett is getting more protection. Certainly Jack at 10 works a lot harder without the ball than Barkley ever did. It's Traores flank where we got overloaded v Chelsea and United.
We did have a somewhat easier run of fixtures during Barkley's injury (West Brom, Burnley, Palace) where both AEG and Traore did very well. Despite both scoring, that wasn't the case really v Chelsea and United.
Definitely need both Barkley and Trez back in the squad, will be picking two from four then. To be honest if Barkley is fit, I think Smith picks him every time. He walked into the starting team v Liverpool despite back to back wins before it.
Post by: ChicagoLion on January 06, 2021, 11:52:59 AM
Another 5 to 10 games is my guess.I'd rather have Barkley than Alli too.
A fit Barkley, certainly. There has to be a big question mark over how many games you'll get out of him over a season though.
Post by: Lastfootstamper on January 06, 2021, 12:39:57 PM
This Barkley injury is a little odd. It reminds me a little of the injury to Jack a few years ago when he was out for what seemed an age. I think he missed two or three months. When he came back he was fitter and stronger than he had ever been. Barkley impressed and seem to add something when he played earlier in the season, although a little off the pace early on in games I thought. Hopefully he will come back ready to kick on, if Smith does keep his promise of getting him back in the England squad before the Euros then we will have got a good player who can help take us to the next level.
I don't think he's missed a game injured since, has he? A couple(?) due to illness, but despite assorted cloggers' finest efforts and a hectic workload, he's not troubled the treatment room.
Post by: Risso on January 06, 2021, 12:43:47 PM
This Barkley injury is a little odd. It reminds me a little of the injury to Jack a few years ago when he was out for what seemed an age. I think he missed two or three months. When he came back he was fitter and stronger than he had ever been. Barkley impressed and seem to add something when he played earlier in the season, although a little off the pace early on in games I thought. Hopefully he will come back ready to kick on, if Smith does keep his promise of getting him back in the England squad before the Euros then we will have got a good player who can help take us to the next level.
I don't think he's missed a game injured since, has he? A couple(?) due to illness, but despite assorted cloggers' finest efforts and a hectic workload, he's not troubled the treatment room.
You're right, considering how much he gets chopped down, his last times of being out for any length were with the shin injury in the Championship, and the kidney damage before that.
Post by: ChicagoLion on January 06, 2021, 12:45:23 PM
Jack seems to have this.
Post by: cdbearsfan on January 06, 2021, 12:58:47 PM
Post by: OCD on January 09, 2021, 01:09:14 PM
Post by: eamonn on January 09, 2021, 02:47:25 PM
The kids are alright
Post by: The Edge on January 09, 2021, 05:31:17 PM
He's not needed, send him backHave to disagree there mate. I'd sign him in a heartbeat.
The kids are alright
Post by: eamonn on January 09, 2021, 06:06:04 PM
Post by: TelfordVilla on January 09, 2021, 06:27:04 PM
Post by: Dante Lavelli on January 09, 2021, 06:32:00 PM
Post by: Three Spires Villa on January 09, 2021, 08:17:58 PM
Post by: Mister E on January 23, 2021, 10:07:38 PM
Maybe that's too harsh, given the time he's had out with injury ....
Post by: SheffieldVillain on January 23, 2021, 10:10:00 PM
I thought he had a poor game tonight. I know that sounds harsh, but his passing was indifferent, his energy was low and he seemed to play into the defensive traffic rather than finding the space.
Maybe that's too harsh, given the time he's had out with injury ....
Certainly wasn't his best game. Seemed like his mind was sharp but his feet weren't willing. As you say, probably down to the time out.
Post by: LukeJames on January 23, 2021, 10:17:07 PM
Post by: Goldie.7 on January 23, 2021, 10:19:43 PM
I think we'll see him back to his best after the Southampton match.
Post by: PaulWinch again on January 23, 2021, 10:21:58 PM
Post by: brontebilly on January 23, 2021, 10:52:37 PM
My problem with Barkley is that he is a ball hog. I know Jack can be at times but Barkley can just be so ponderous on the ball. Holding onto the ball far too long with players left and right of him. Also, he really offers zilch without the ball. Ive never thought he was a good enough player to get away with either flaw really. If he pressed hard like Watkins we would turn a lot of defenders over.
Burnley might be a good game for him though. They will sit deep so we will need guys comfortable at shooting from distance which he is capable of.
Post by: AlexAlexCropley on January 23, 2021, 10:53:56 PM
The sharpness with his touch will come. Ball getting stuck under his feet a bit and easy passes going astray. That's just lack of match sharpness really.So you don't think he's brought us up a level?
My problem with Barkley is that he is a ball hog. I know Jack can be at times but Barkley can just be so ponderous on the ball. Holding onto the ball far too long with players left and right of him. Also, he really offers zilch without the ball. Ive never thought he was a good enough player to get away with either flaw really. If he pressed hard like Watkins we would turn a lot of defenders over.
Burnley might be a good game for him though. They will sit deep so we will need guys comfortable at shooting from distance which he is capable of.
Post by: Ads on January 23, 2021, 10:54:26 PM
Its a bit marshmellowey at the moment with his play, can't quite get his radar working and a little alow out his feet. Think away from hom him and Bertie is perhaps too open. He needs games and was unlucky not to score.
Post by: brontebilly on January 23, 2021, 11:00:04 PM
The sharpness with his touch will come. Ball getting stuck under his feet a bit and easy passes going astray. That's just lack of match sharpness really.So you don't think he's brought us up a level?
My problem with Barkley is that he is a ball hog. I know Jack can be at times but Barkley can just be so ponderous on the ball. Holding onto the ball far too long with players left and right of him. Also, he really offers zilch without the ball. Ive never thought he was a good enough player to get away with either flaw really. If he pressed hard like Watkins we would turn a lot of defenders over.
Burnley might be a good game for him though. They will sit deep so we will need guys comfortable at shooting from distance which he is capable of.
Not really, has played well in three big wins for us alright (Liverpool, Arsenal particularly and Leicester) but been very poor in others and obviously missed a lot of games with injury. I think the pundits are making a bit too much of the Jack/Barkley combo. Traore and AEG have got more goals for us and points for us than Barkley. Jack played quite well at 10 in Barkley's absence too.
Likes of Martinez, Watkins and the improvement in Konsa and Targett have been key for me. We were very weak in those four positions last season.
I don't think it's a certainty we should be pushing the boat out to get Barkley in permanently at the half way point of the season.
Post by: SheffieldVillain on January 23, 2021, 11:07:17 PM
The sharpness with his touch will come. Ball getting stuck under his feet a bit and easy passes going astray. That's just lack of match sharpness really.So you don't think he's brought us up a level?
My problem with Barkley is that he is a ball hog. I know Jack can be at times but Barkley can just be so ponderous on the ball. Holding onto the ball far too long with players left and right of him. Also, he really offers zilch without the ball. Ive never thought he was a good enough player to get away with either flaw really. If he pressed hard like Watkins we would turn a lot of defenders over.
Burnley might be a good game for him though. They will sit deep so we will need guys comfortable at shooting from distance which he is capable of.
Not really, has played well in three big wins for us alright (Liverpool, Arsenal particularly and Leicester) but been very poor in others and obviously missed a lot of games with injury.
Yeah, I wish we still had a choice between Connor or Lansbury for that role too.
Post by: AlexAlexCropley on January 23, 2021, 11:08:48 PM
Think you need another teamThe sharpness with his touch will come. Ball getting stuck under his feet a bit and easy passes going astray. That's just lack of match sharpness really.So you don't think he's brought us up a level?
My problem with Barkley is that he is a ball hog. I know Jack can be at times but Barkley can just be so ponderous on the ball. Holding onto the ball far too long with players left and right of him. Also, he really offers zilch without the ball. Ive never thought he was a good enough player to get away with either flaw really. If he pressed hard like Watkins we would turn a lot of defenders over.
Burnley might be a good game for him though. They will sit deep so we will need guys comfortable at shooting from distance which he is capable of.
Not really, has played well in three big wins for us alright (Liverpool, Arsenal particularly and Leicester) but been very poor in others and obviously missed a lot of games with injury. I think the pundits are making a bit too much of the Jack/Barkley combo. Traore and AEG have got more goals for us and points for us than Barkley. Jack played quite well at 10 in Barkley's absence too.
Likes of Martinez, Watkins and the improvement in Konsa and Targett have been key for me. We were very weak in those four positions last season.
I don't think it's a certainty we should be pushing the boat out to get Barkley in permanently at the half way point of the season.
Post by: Brazilian Villain on January 23, 2021, 11:09:48 PM
Think you need another teamThe sharpness with his touch will come. Ball getting stuck under his feet a bit and easy passes going astray. That's just lack of match sharpness really.So you don't think he's brought us up a level?
My problem with Barkley is that he is a ball hog. I know Jack can be at times but Barkley can just be so ponderous on the ball. Holding onto the ball far too long with players left and right of him. Also, he really offers zilch without the ball. Ive never thought he was a good enough player to get away with either flaw really. If he pressed hard like Watkins we would turn a lot of defenders over.
Burnley might be a good game for him though. They will sit deep so we will need guys comfortable at shooting from distance which he is capable of.
Not really, has played well in three big wins for us alright (Liverpool, Arsenal particularly and Leicester) but been very poor in others and obviously missed a lot of games with injury. I think the pundits are making a bit too much of the Jack/Barkley combo. Traore and AEG have got more goals for us and points for us than Barkley. Jack played quite well at 10 in Barkley's absence too.
Likes of Martinez, Watkins and the improvement in Konsa and Targett have been key for me. We were very weak in those four positions last season.
I don't think it's a certainty we should be pushing the boat out to get Barkley in permanently at the half way point of the season.
Maybe he has already.
Post by: TelfordVilla on January 23, 2021, 11:20:01 PM
Post by: Big Ming on January 24, 2021, 01:26:22 PM
Not convinced we could not do better.
Post by: eamonn on January 24, 2021, 01:39:41 PM
Post by: chrisw1 on January 24, 2021, 01:40:15 PM
Post by: Brend'Watkins on January 24, 2021, 01:43:35 PM
Post by: tomd2103 on January 24, 2021, 01:52:14 PM
Post by: Clampy on January 24, 2021, 01:53:40 PM
Post by: Tuscans on January 24, 2021, 01:56:20 PM
It's his decision making in that role, something you cant afford to be is indecisive, and throughout his career I think that's his downfall. You can hear without fans the screams and gestures from Jack and Ollie when he holds onto the ball, stutters and doesn't release it at the right time.
I'm not too sure about him, I don't think we'll pay anymore than £20-£25 million for him if it comes to that. Possibly Sanson coming in releases McGinn in a role he favours and we see Luiz, Sanson and McGinn as the three in the long term. I dunno.
Post by: Brend'Watkins on January 24, 2021, 02:01:29 PM
Post by: brontebilly on January 24, 2021, 02:10:58 PM
Post by: Clampy on January 24, 2021, 02:15:10 PM
The likes of Alli and Eriksen to mention two will be available come summer time too. With our improvement a lot more players will be interested in coming our way. Sanson will add competition until the season end too, plus Jack is more than capable of playing at 10. Maybe some hard competition for his place will see the best of Barkley. But it needs to start from Wednesday night.
No, it doesn't need to start from Wednesday at all. He's just trying to find his sharpness after a while out. It'll come, he needs time.
Post by: old man villa fan on January 24, 2021, 02:17:43 PM
We do look better going forward and he has a great understanding with Grealish. My only concern is his injury record. It doesn’t matter how good any player is if they are susceptible to hamstring issues. It will be continually stop start.
Any player can pick up an injury. It's when they are in and out of the team through injury that is the problem. If he goes the rest of the season only missing the odd game through knocks, I would go for him at the end of the season for anything less than £30m. Running with the ball through midfield is something we have lacked and can open up the defence. Barkley has this ability to drive at defenders with pace and power.
Post by: nigel on January 24, 2021, 02:23:07 PM
There's a bit of the flat track bully about Barkley. I think he has all the physicality and technique to be a consistently high performer but he could definitely improve off the ball and quicker at releasing the ball. He's still not fully fit though so I'm sure there's more to come from him.
I wouldn’t say that, mate.
His 3 best games have come against Liverpool, Arsenal and Leicester.
A flat track bully would have disappeared in those games.
He’s coming back from an injury, so he’s building his match fitness back again.
Post by: aj2k77 on January 24, 2021, 02:23:17 PM
A sensible transfer fee (if there is such a thing these days) and I'd be all over it.
Post by: brontebilly on January 24, 2021, 02:28:11 PM
The likes of Alli and Eriksen to mention two will be available come summer time too. With our improvement a lot more players will be interested in coming our way. Sanson will add competition until the season end too, plus Jack is more than capable of playing at 10. Maybe some hard competition for his place will see the best of Barkley. But it needs to start from Wednesday night.
No, it doesn't need to start from Wednesday at all. He's just trying to find his sharpness after a while out. It'll come, he needs time.
He might not get too much time though. If Grealish, Luiz and McGinn are nailed on starters when fit, there are only two other spots available. Traore, AEG and Trez (who looked sharp when he came on) are all in decent form for arguably one wide spot but with the option of switching Jack inside. Sanson, Ramsey and even Nakamba after last night other options in the middle. McGinn has played for us in Barkley's position before too so Smith has loads of options. I don't think Barkley will have the luxury of another four or five games to play himself back into form and fitness.
Post by: Luke8 on January 24, 2021, 02:29:43 PM
I like him, there are concerns about his injury record for sure BUT he's got intent in him, he's always looking to drive forward and that's something we've missed in midfield for years.
A sensible transfer fee (if there is such a thing these days) and I'd be all over it.
It’s obviously something to be aware of, but is his injury record really that bad?
I know he had that bad injury three season ago, but he made the vast majority of Chelsea’s Premier League match day squads in the last two season (I think it’s about 85%). That doesn’t strike me as too bad.
Post by: Deano's Mullet on January 24, 2021, 02:44:18 PM
Post by: Goldie.7 on January 24, 2021, 03:22:37 PM
The sharpness with his touch will come. Ball getting stuck under his feet a bit and easy passes going astray. That's just lack of match sharpness really.So you don't think he's brought us up a level?
My problem with Barkley is that he is a ball hog. I know Jack can be at times but Barkley can just be so ponderous on the ball. Holding onto the ball far too long with players left and right of him. Also, he really offers zilch without the ball. Ive never thought he was a good enough player to get away with either flaw really. If he pressed hard like Watkins we would turn a lot of defenders over.
Burnley might be a good game for him though. They will sit deep so we will need guys comfortable at shooting from distance which he is capable of.
Not really, has played well in three big wins for us alright (Liverpool, Arsenal particularly and Leicester) but been very poor in others and obviously missed a lot of games with injury.
Yeah, I wish we still had a choice between Connor or Lansbury for that role too.
I miss Bjarnason and Jota, honest.
Post by: Rudy Can't Fail on January 24, 2021, 04:55:14 PM
I don't think Barkley will have the luxury of another four or five games to play himself back into form and fitness.
I think he will as just like SJM, Dean will give him games to bring him up to speed. We're certainly a better team when he plays though I'm yet to decide just how good he is. We certainly need a player like him, whether he is that player only time will tell. The one characteristic he has that would be difficult finding a better alternative is experience. I think Dean highly values that given the youth of our squad.
Post by: OCD on January 25, 2021, 11:45:48 AM
Post by: Smithy on January 25, 2021, 12:25:12 PM
There will hopefully come a day when we wonder if players like Ross Barkley are good enough for Aston Villa - but that day is not today. He is precisely the sort of player we need as we build into a side capable of challenging regularly for the European places. Think who would have been playing in that position a year or 18 months ago. Barkley is light-years ahead of our previous options.
When he's fit and on form he'll be one of the first names on the teamsheet.
Post by: SheffieldVillain on January 25, 2021, 01:19:51 PM
https://twitter.com/AVFCOfficial/status/1353681473556131841
Post by: cdward on January 25, 2021, 01:33:28 PM
The key to this team evolving is keeping Jack and building around him with better players than we have. Hence Hourihanes departure, and Ross Barkley and Morgan Sanson coming in.
I still feel Barkley is looking a little rusty, but if he can stay injury free, we could see more 7-2 type of perfomances from him.
With the managerial change at Chelsea he may (still) be surplus to requirements.
Post by: ChicagoLion on January 28, 2021, 07:07:01 AM
Post by: N'ZMAV on January 28, 2021, 07:20:50 AM
Post by: aev on January 28, 2021, 07:40:25 AM
Not sure Ross can handle the pace - he's clearly talented; but this high pressing and chasing game, then playing at a high tempo - not sure it's for him.
He looks big boned.
Post by: Ian. on January 28, 2021, 07:43:55 AM
Post by: jwarry on January 28, 2021, 07:47:02 AM
Post by: Clampy on January 28, 2021, 07:54:13 AM
Post by: Vegas on January 28, 2021, 08:30:42 AM
I wouldn’t be anywhere near him for say £30m at the end of the season. I probably wouldn’t have him in my first choice team next week, a few options I’d have a look at instead (new signing in, McGinn further forward; Jack central with Trezeguet back in)
Post by: Mister E on January 28, 2021, 08:50:23 AM
Post by: Risso on January 28, 2021, 08:58:01 AM
Post by: PaulWinch again on January 28, 2021, 09:01:48 AM
Post by: aj2k77 on January 28, 2021, 09:58:41 AM
Post by: KevinGage on January 28, 2021, 10:05:04 AM
I'd still do the deal if Chelsea don't do a pisstake on the price.
Post by: ChicagoLion on January 28, 2021, 10:13:12 AM
Possibly his position is one where we can make a first team improvement. How much would Chelsea want? £40m? Could we find better? It's a tough one.I am concerned that his fitness problems are long term, I would not pay Chelsea anything because I do not think he can make a long term consistant contribution to the team.
Could be another Micah Richards type situation.
Post by: London Villan on January 28, 2021, 10:14:31 AM
Post by: ChicagoLion on January 28, 2021, 10:16:04 AM
He has 20 games to prove himself.Yes good point, I wonder how many he will play.
Post by: eamonn on January 28, 2021, 10:33:55 AM
Post by: ChicagoLion on January 28, 2021, 10:42:29 AM
I'd be interested in those who paid attention to him at Chelsea to judge whether this is as good as it gets from him.someone put the stats up and it wasnt great.
Post by: brontebilly on January 28, 2021, 11:01:45 AM
Possibly his position is one where we can make a first team improvement. How much would Chelsea want? £40m? Could we find better? It's a tough one.
Look at his stats at Chelsea and even at the Everton. Why didn't Conte rate him I wonder? Chelsea won't be getting a fraction of 40m for him no matter where he ends up. He's not top 6-8 club standard. I think there is far more scope in both Luiz and McGinn to improve than Barkley.
Alli and Eriksen to mention two would be better value I think.
Post by: Risso on January 28, 2021, 11:04:42 AM
Possibly his position is one where we can make a first team improvement. How much would Chelsea want? £40m? Could we find better? It's a tough one.I am concerned that his fitness problems are long term, I would not pay Chelsea anything because I do not think he can make a long term consistant contribution to the team.
Could be another Micah Richards type situation.
Yes, as I mentioned yesterday, when talking about Sanson, Smith said they looked at "toughness" as a key attribute when bringing players in, and they wanted everybody to have played 70% of their matches over the last three years (something like that anyway). They must have been hoping that Barkley's talent trumps this requirement, because he very much doesn't fit this criteria.
Post by: Small Rodent on January 28, 2021, 11:52:56 AM
Post by: Bryan on January 29, 2021, 08:54:00 PM
Possibly his position is one where we can make a first team improvement. How much would Chelsea want? £40m? Could we find better? It's a tough one.
Look at his stats at Chelsea and even at the Everton. Why didn't Conte rate him I wonder? Chelsea won't be getting a fraction of 40m for him no matter where he ends up. He's not top 6-8 club standard. I think there is far more scope in both Luiz and McGinn to improve than Barkley.
Alli and Eriksen to mention two would be better value I think.
What would Coutinho cost?
Post by: OzVilla on January 29, 2021, 09:20:45 PM
Post by: The_ads on January 30, 2021, 08:55:21 AM
Post by: Abbeyfealeavfc on January 31, 2021, 09:22:19 AM
Imo he should have been subbed 2nd half to bring new energy to the midfield...
(...got to drive his price down ;)
Post by: PaulWinch again on January 31, 2021, 09:34:17 AM
Post by: Ads on January 31, 2021, 09:40:18 AM
Felt it was their shape of effectively having 3 at the back with the way the full backs stepped out and the wide forwards went narrow to swamp as a press, that caused us issues first half.
Post by: simboy on January 31, 2021, 09:49:31 AM
Post by: PeterWithe on January 31, 2021, 09:56:19 AM
Very good with the ball and the other stuff can be worked at, perhaps his greatest asset is that Jack seems to be very happy linking up with him.
Post by: aj2k77 on January 31, 2021, 10:12:54 AM
Post by: wittonwarrior on January 31, 2021, 11:03:32 AM
Post by: OCD on January 31, 2021, 12:10:35 PM
Post by: chrisw1 on January 31, 2021, 12:14:15 PM
I'm still hopeful he will have a great second half of the season though.
Post by: darren woolley on January 31, 2021, 01:23:26 PM
Post by: Footy-Vill on February 01, 2021, 12:13:28 PM
Well played Ross.
Post by: algy on February 02, 2021, 01:25:49 PM
All in all says absolutely nothing, other than (perhaps) we didn't even attempt to sign him permanently in September.
Link: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-9214223/Chelsea-wait-end-season-decide-Ross-Barkleys-future-Aston-Villa.html
Post by: Dave on February 02, 2021, 03:44:47 PM
Daily Mail saying that there's been no talks over a permanent deal for Ross Barkley, with Chelsea (and presumably us!) deciding whether he makes a permanent move in the summer.
Probably suits all parties really. He's been good, but not "chuck £40m at them to get him tied down quickly" good.
If he, and we carry on our form then he'll probably want to come here and we'll probably want him to.
If we do well and he doesn't, we'll probably want someone else instead of him.
If he does well and we don't, he'll probably have better options than us.
I don't really see a benefit for anyone in committing to it in January.
Post by: Drummond on February 02, 2021, 03:58:45 PM
Post by: algy on February 02, 2021, 04:35:32 PM
From what I've seen so far, I'd like a permanent deal done, providing it's at the right price. I suspect it will be a case of the wining bid. Chelsea will be hoping to move him on and it's a matter of who else might be interested.Tyrone needs to have a word and get him wandering down the Kings Road in full Villa kit when he goes back.
Post by: OCD on February 02, 2021, 04:56:30 PM
Post by: The Edge on February 02, 2021, 04:57:31 PM
Seconded. Barkley is a class act when he's fully on his game and when he and Jack are both in tune teams struggle to deal with them. His injury record remains concern and would have to be factored into any deal the two clubs might agree. I think the signing of Barkley has moved the club up a level. We've progressed from shopping in Tesco and are now shopping in Waitrose. The aim is to be shopping in Harrods. It's coming though ladies and gentlemen. That's why we seem to have gained a lot of haters. We've got em rattled.From what I've seen so far, I'd like a permanent deal done, providing it's at the right price. I suspect it will be a case of the wining bid. Chelsea will be hoping to move him on and it's a matter of who else might be interested.Tyrone needs to have a word and get him wandering down the Kings Road in full Villa kit when he goes back.
Post by: olaftab on February 02, 2021, 04:58:46 PM
Daily Mail saying that there's been no talks over a permanent deal for Ross Barkley, with Chelsea (and presumably us!) deciding whether he makes a permanent move in the summer.We need to play it cool. Need to see how Morgan performs when he gets his chance and also consider Ross’s long term injury outlook.
All in all says absolutely nothing, other than (perhaps) we didn't even attempt to sign him permanently in September.
Link: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-9214223/Chelsea-wait-end-season-decide-Ross-Barkleys-future-Aston-Villa.html
Post by: Toronto Villa on February 02, 2021, 05:54:38 PM
Post by: ChicagoLion on February 02, 2021, 06:51:45 PM
Problem Chelsea have is that they change their manager so often, they don't dare sell him in case the next one wanted to play him. Our problem is he's missed a chunk of the season with a Hamstring injury and we need to see how long he stays fit during the rest of the season.agree if he can stay fit then fine but another breakdown and I think he will be off.
Post by: Ian. on February 02, 2021, 06:57:40 PM
Post by: wittonwarrior on February 02, 2021, 07:46:20 PM
Post by: Russ aka Big Nose on February 02, 2021, 08:30:46 PM
Though with Barkley you also have to factor in:
1. Fitness - can he be kept fit?
2. Attitude/motivation
3. Relationship with key players
For me, 2 and 3 are really important. He looks keen because the next six months probably determine his earning potential and playing involvement for a number of years because he (most likely) won't get in the Chelsea first team.
Any deal has to be well structured because big money without the right incentives and he could be a very different proposition.
I wouldn't ordinarily favour players having undue influence, though his relationship with Grealish seems very strong and if having him at Villa increases the prospect of Grealish being happy, then that also becomes part of the equation. UTV
Post by: Bobby Boy on February 03, 2021, 09:47:08 PM
I know he's been injured but if he's fit enough to be selected then he has to be better than what he's shown tonight.
Post by: Risso on February 03, 2021, 09:49:43 PM
Post by: Tuscans on February 03, 2021, 09:51:24 PM
Post by: danno on February 03, 2021, 09:52:59 PM
Post by: CT on February 03, 2021, 10:01:28 PM
Post by: Ads on February 03, 2021, 10:03:18 PM
Post by: Monty on February 03, 2021, 10:04:02 PM
Post by: Aldridge Villa on February 03, 2021, 10:04:45 PM
Post by: Risso on February 03, 2021, 10:06:59 PM
Post by: Bryan on February 03, 2021, 10:07:57 PM
If he’s not fit, he should not start.
Post by: SoccerHQ on February 03, 2021, 10:08:32 PM
Post by: Monty on February 03, 2021, 10:08:41 PM
With them doubling up on Jack, this was made for him tonight, but he rivalled Martinez for most inept performer.
And he has a lot less goodwill in the bank than Martinez.
Post by: PhilVill on February 03, 2021, 10:09:04 PM
Post by: PeterWithe on February 03, 2021, 10:11:14 PM
Just not fit enough for the side
Post by: Sexual Ealing on February 03, 2021, 10:13:24 PM
Post by: rob_bridge on February 03, 2021, 10:14:14 PM
Not someone I want permanently. IF he had become the player he should have he would be a Champs League regular. File him next to Wilshere and DannyBoy Sturridge in 3 years time. Lingard will be there too
Post by: ChicagoLion on February 03, 2021, 10:14:19 PM
Post by: brontebilly on February 03, 2021, 10:15:14 PM
Seemed to be running in treacle tonight. I’m far from convinced.
Reminded me of Ross McCormack. Carrying timber too. Disgraceful lack of effort without the ball. Didn't try a leg when moved to a midfield three. Not sure where this guy gets his ego from but he certainly isn't good enough with the ball to get away with his walking efforts without it. Throwing a bit of a strop getting taken off too, stayed on 15 mins too long for me.
Post by: PeterWithe on February 03, 2021, 10:16:06 PM
Post by: olaftab on February 03, 2021, 10:32:53 PM
Post by: Steve67 on February 03, 2021, 11:08:33 PM
Post by: TelfordVilla on February 03, 2021, 11:13:25 PM
Post by: Risso on February 03, 2021, 11:15:51 PM
Post by: PaulWinch again on February 03, 2021, 11:19:42 PM
Post by: tomd2103 on February 03, 2021, 11:24:05 PM
Post by: PeterWithe on February 03, 2021, 11:24:55 PM
Good thing these days is that the sports science team should be able to see if his physical stats are improving.
Post by: Allan C on February 03, 2021, 11:37:48 PM
Post by: Luke8 on February 03, 2021, 11:41:38 PM
Maybe it won’t work out, but I think players like Trezeguet, Targett and Luiz showed last season that you need to give it a bit longer. It’s different obviously; he is older, playing in a better and more settled team but I still
think I’ll be giving him a bit longer before making any final judgment.
Post by: PeterWithe on February 03, 2021, 11:43:14 PM
I still think he'll improve with games, he's class. Mostly.
Post by: brontebilly on February 04, 2021, 12:34:23 AM
As a fanbase the qualities we seem to admire most in a player are workrate and effort, for reasons of fitness or other, he isn't showing quite enough yet.
I still think he'll improve with games, he's class. Mostly.
He doesn't need more games to improve his workrate though. That should be the bare minimum expected even if having a stinker. Barkley seems to think it's beneath him for whatever reason. Might be the reason he has never progressed past promising in his career.
Post by: dave17 on February 04, 2021, 04:59:25 AM
Post by: Luke8 on February 04, 2021, 07:08:12 AM
I really like him and get the impression he likes it with us. It’s it rocket science to see he needs careful management which is the obvious worry. Chelsea will clearly want 30-40m and for 15-25 games a season that money might be better spent elsewhere
I’m not sure his injury record is that bad is it? Since his really bad injury, he was in the matchday squad 28 times last season and 36 the season before that (in just the Premier League) and may well make 32 appearances this season.
It’s a factor, and I’m certain the club will monitor it, but again it’s a case of see how it goes and evaluate based on the whole season.
Post by: chrisw1 on February 04, 2021, 09:03:45 AM
I honestly don't know what I'd do. It's ok trying to nurse a player back to form when the team is mostly playing well and winning, but we're struggling to carry him at the moment. I suspect he'll start against Arsenal and hopefully playing a 'big team' will get the best out of him.
Post by: Abbeyfealeavfc on February 04, 2021, 09:12:44 AM
I really like him and get the impression he likes it with us. It’s it rocket science to see he needs careful management which is the obvious worry. Chelsea will clearly want 30-40m and for 15-25 games a season that money might be better spent elsewhere
I wouldn't be going anywhere near him for £30-£40m!
Post by: ChicagoLion on February 04, 2021, 09:51:17 AM
Post by: Duncan Shaw on February 04, 2021, 09:58:12 AM
Post by: chrisw1 on February 04, 2021, 09:59:18 AM
Post by: Martin Carruthers on February 04, 2021, 10:02:04 AM
Post by: Abbeyfealeavfc on February 04, 2021, 10:06:21 AM
Did he look a bit mardy when he went off? Took about ten minutes to walk round the pitch.
I wonder if that had anything to do with southgate in the stands. If he ain't doing it for Villa, he won't be doing it for england.
Post by: in exile on February 04, 2021, 10:49:43 AM
Is he that injury prone? He's missed a decent percentage of matches for us, but from one injury...His recovery rate seems to be slow, imo.
Post by: brontebilly on February 04, 2021, 12:13:22 PM
Did he look a bit mardy when he went off? Took about ten minutes to walk round the pitch.
I wonder if that had anything to do with southgate in the stands. If he ain't doing it for Villa, he won't be doing it for england.
I think Barkley is very much deluded if he thinks he is anywhere near the standard of the players England have in his position. You simply can't afford to take a chance on him in a midfield three. This clip was shared online last night but he has been at this all season off the ball, those defeats from Leeds and Soton I think he made the same carbon copy lack of effort that cost us goals
https://twitter.com/ChipEighteen/status/1357102820260995072?s=08
If he wants an armchair ride at 10, he is up against the likes of Madison and Jack who are streets ahead of him. If he starts focusing on becoming a regular EPL midfielder capable of playing 8 or 10, he has an awful lot of improving to do based on recent seasons.
Post by: Drummond on February 04, 2021, 12:20:12 PM
Post by: London Villan on February 04, 2021, 12:23:18 PM
Post by: nick harper on February 04, 2021, 12:28:32 PM
Did he look a bit mardy when he went off? Took about ten minutes to walk round the pitch.
I wonder if that had anything to do with southgate in the stands. If he ain't doing it for Villa, he won't be doing it for england.
I think Barkley is very much deluded if he thinks he is anywhere near the standard of the players England have in his position. You simply can't afford to take a chance on him in a midfield three. This clip was shared online last night but he has been at this all season off the ball, those defeats from Leeds and Soton I think he made the same carbon copy lack of effort that cost us goals
https://twitter.com/ChipEighteen/status/1357102820260995072?s=08
If he wants an armchair ride at 10, he is up against the likes of Madison and Jack who are streets ahead of him. If he starts focusing on becoming a regular EPL midfielder capable of playing 8 or 10, he has an awful lot of improving to do based on recent seasons.
And what did you make of his goal v Southampton?
Or his goal Vs Leicester
Match Winner
Tracking runners from midfield is basic stuff and a minimum requirement as a midfielder. We know he can score goals but that is a real dereliction of his responsibilities to his team mates.
Post by: Mister E on February 04, 2021, 12:33:33 PM
Against a solid 2-man holding midfield of Rice and Soucek, he was ineffectual.
Post by: brontebilly on February 04, 2021, 12:37:38 PM
Did he look a bit mardy when he went off? Took about ten minutes to walk round the pitch.
I wonder if that had anything to do with southgate in the stands. If he ain't doing it for Villa, he won't be doing it for england.
I think Barkley is very much deluded if he thinks he is anywhere near the standard of the players England have in his position. You simply can't afford to take a chance on him in a midfield three. This clip was shared online last night but he has been at this all season off the ball, those defeats from Leeds and Soton I think he made the same carbon copy lack of effort that cost us goals
https://twitter.com/ChipEighteen/status/1357102820260995072?s=08
If he wants an armchair ride at 10, he is up against the likes of Madison and Jack who are streets ahead of him. If he starts focusing on becoming a regular EPL midfielder capable of playing 8 or 10, he has an awful lot of improving to do based on recent seasons.
And what did you make of his goal v Southampton?
Or his goal Vs Leicester
Match Winner
Nice goals for sure footy. But in truth he didn't play particularly well in either of those games. He was a complete passenger at Soton up to that goal. His best game for us by far was at Arsenal I think. I don't think we are good enough to carry his lack of workrate without the ball, especially if someone like Traore is also in the team. We got away with it at Soton when we were screaming for changes.
They aren't helped that our midfield two haven't been in great form for some time now. They aren't playing like a pair and whether it was per instruction from the sideline or just indiscipline but McGinn particularly was too far ahead of the ball last night. We need a solid two in there to hold their positions.
Post by: danno on February 04, 2021, 12:42:32 PM
Did he look a bit mardy when he went off? Took about ten minutes to walk round the pitch.
I wonder if that had anything to do with southgate in the stands. If he ain't doing it for Villa, he won't be doing it for england.
I think Barkley is very much deluded if he thinks he is anywhere near the standard of the players England have in his position. You simply can't afford to take a chance on him in a midfield three. This clip was shared online last night but he has been at this all season off the ball, those defeats from Leeds and Soton I think he made the same carbon copy lack of effort that cost us goals
https://twitter.com/ChipEighteen/status/1357102820260995072?s=08
If he wants an armchair ride at 10, he is up against the likes of Madison and Jack who are streets ahead of him. If he starts focusing on becoming a regular EPL midfielder capable of playing 8 or 10, he has an awful lot of improving to do based on recent seasons.
And what did you make of his goal v Southampton?
Or his goal Vs Leicester
Match Winner
Nice goals for sure footy. But in truth he didn't play particularly well in either of those games. He was a complete passenger at Soton up to that goal. His best game for us by far was at Arsenal I think. I don't think we are good enough to carry his lack of workrate without the ball, especially if someone like Traore is also in the team. We got away with it at Soton when we were screaming for changes.
They aren't helped that our midfield two haven't been in great form for some time now. They aren't playing like a pair and whether it was per instruction from the sideline or just indiscipline but McGinn particularly was too far ahead of the ball last night. We need a solid two in there to hold their positions.
I inferred from Smith's post match comments that this was instructed:
Quote
“I’ll have to reflect, I changed the system a little bit here, just tweaked it and went one and the two in midfield, upon reflection, a two and one probably would have suited us better. And Ross as well as a No.10.
Post by: brontebilly on February 04, 2021, 01:42:59 PM
Did he look a bit mardy when he went off? Took about ten minutes to walk round the pitch.
I wonder if that had anything to do with southgate in the stands. If he ain't doing it for Villa, he won't be doing it for england.
I think Barkley is very much deluded if he thinks he is anywhere near the standard of the players England have in his position. You simply can't afford to take a chance on him in a midfield three. This clip was shared online last night but he has been at this all season off the ball, those defeats from Leeds and Soton I think he made the same carbon copy lack of effort that cost us goals
https://twitter.com/ChipEighteen/status/1357102820260995072?s=08
If he wants an armchair ride at 10, he is up against the likes of Madison and Jack who are streets ahead of him. If he starts focusing on becoming a regular EPL midfielder capable of playing 8 or 10, he has an awful lot of improving to do based on recent seasons.
And what did you make of his goal v Southampton?
Or his goal Vs Leicester
Match Winner
Nice goals for sure footy. But in truth he didn't play particularly well in either of those games. He was a complete passenger at Soton up to that goal. His best game for us by far was at Arsenal I think. I don't think we are good enough to carry his lack of workrate without the ball, especially if someone like Traore is also in the team. We got away with it at Soton when we were screaming for changes.
They aren't helped that our midfield two haven't been in great form for some time now. They aren't playing like a pair and whether it was per instruction from the sideline or just indiscipline but McGinn particularly was too far ahead of the ball last night. We need a solid two in there to hold their positions.
I inferred from Smith's post match comments that this was instructed:Quote
“I’ll have to reflect, I changed the system a little bit here, just tweaked it and went one and the two in midfield, upon reflection, a two and one probably would have suited us better. And Ross as well as a No.10.
Was that change just after half time? We certainly looked to be playing a flat midfield three in the second half (McGinn/Luiz, Barkley). Didn't work anyway.
Thought it looked a standard midfield two in the first half but they were all over us in midfield throughout.
Post by: danno on February 04, 2021, 02:05:09 PM
So... Rather than
Grealish Watkins El Ghazi Grealish Watkins El Ghazi
Barkley McGinn Barkley
Luiz McGinn Luiz
It was difficult to see what we doing to be honest. I did wonder why McGinn of all people was starting the press last night on occasion. Given that Barkley didn't seem to be tracking anyone...
It ended up being more Leftover Turkey than Christmas Tree formation!
Post by: Risso on February 04, 2021, 02:06:36 PM
Post by: OCD on February 04, 2021, 02:07:40 PM
Post by: Stinkin_Thinkin on February 04, 2021, 02:12:22 PM
He needs to show more urgency off the ball, at the moment its just jockeying and jogging. If he can't win it make the foul don't let people just ghost past.
The good thing is he can learn the bits that are missing. Luiz was similar last season and Traore in his first few games.
Someone really needs to have the chat with him. He's 27 If he doesn't makes a success of this loan there is no way he is going back to chelsea's first team, he'll be sold to a fulham, west brom or at best/worst newcastle. Look at Henri Lansbury, It's a short career Ross.
Post by: brontebilly on February 04, 2021, 02:31:42 PM
The difference between Lingard and Barkley last night was night and day and highlights what we should be looking to get from a number 10. I started the night from quite a neutral viewpoint but I finished it thinking we must be able to do better for that position in the summer. For one, Lingard already looks like he would have been the better bet last summer if Solskjaer was prepared to let him go.
Lets not get ahead of ourselves with Lingard. Last two seasons for United, he got 5 goals in 50 odd league games. His career has been big time on the drift and hasnt been getting a kick with United this season so far. Similar enough age/profile to Barkley really. Martinez helped his two goals into the net last night. Fair play to him, he did very well. Barkley scored for us on his debut too.
Post by: chrisw1 on February 04, 2021, 03:12:19 PM
The difference between Lingard and Barkley last night was night and day and highlights what we should be looking to get from a number 10. I started the night from quite a neutral viewpoint but I finished it thinking we must be able to do better for that position in the summer. For one, Lingard already looks like he would have been the better bet last summer if Solskjaer was prepared to let him go.So you've drawn the conclusion from one game that Lingard would have been a better bet than Barkley last summer? Entitely reasonable to draw your conclusion from such a large pool of evidence. I presume you've similarly concluded that Marinez is rubbish and Jack not all he's cracked up to be?
Remind me, how did Barkley play in his first game for Villa?
Post by: OCD on February 04, 2021, 03:34:09 PM
However, I have had 6 months of watching Barkley, while he's been fit and he can be very passive. He has a really good relationship with Grealish which is a big pro but I would want to see more from him from the second half of the season before I would pay out what Chelsea will demand for him.
Post by: TelfordVilla on February 04, 2021, 03:35:06 PM
Post by: Mister E on February 04, 2021, 03:46:24 PM
I think the plan was for Barkley and McGinn to press high and engage Soucek and Rice. Leaving Luiz spare to track the runs of Lingard.All well and good.
So... Rather than
Grealish Watkins El Ghazi Grealish Watkins El Ghazi
Barkley McGinn Barkley
Luiz McGinn Luiz
It was difficult to see what we doing to be honest. I did wonder why McGinn of all people was starting the press last night on occasion. Given that Barkley didn't seem to be tracking anyone...
It ended up being more Leftover Turkey than Christmas Tree formation!
Except WHU didn't read the script: they had Benrhama and Lingaard running the channels, going wide and generally moving into the spaces outside the congested middle. This left our midfield out of shape.
Post by: chrisw1 on February 04, 2021, 06:18:17 PM
You're quite right to say that it remains to be seen as to whether Lingard just had a very good debut or whether it was just a good start to a 6-month loan.Not wanting to pay what Chelsea might want for him and suggesting Lingard already looks like he would have been the better bet last summer are entirely diferent points.
However, I have had 6 months of watching Barkley, while he's been fit and he can be very passive. He has a really good relationship with Grealish which is a big pro but I would want to see more from him from the second half of the season before I would pay out what Chelsea will demand for him.
Post by: N'ZMAV on February 04, 2021, 06:45:36 PM
Post by: AV82EC on February 04, 2021, 08:19:21 PM
Post by: Toronto Villa on February 04, 2021, 08:23:42 PM
Post by: ChicagoLion on February 04, 2021, 08:31:58 PM
lacking work ethic? Where did you get that from? He said in an interview the other day he's played more games than had training sessions. How do you suppose that would affect him at PL level?based on last night, pretty badly.
Post by: brontebilly on February 04, 2021, 08:55:29 PM
lacking work ethic? Where did you get that from? He said in an interview the other day he's played more games than had training sessions. How do you suppose that would affect him at PL level?
He could always try and track an opponents run from midfield. Just a thought
Post by: john2710 on February 04, 2021, 08:59:15 PM
He's got undoubted talent but doesn't seem to have the interest to do it on a consistent basis.
Injury record also casts doubt on whether he's worth the risk.
Post by: Dante Lavelli on February 04, 2021, 09:02:03 PM
lacking work ethic? Where did you get that from? He said in an interview the other day he's played more games than had training sessions. How do you suppose that would affect him at PL level?
I don’t think it is unreasonable to expect that he gets goal side every now and then. Barkley is the polar opposite of Tommy Johnson and right now I think an all-action player like Johnson, would be better for the team. In fact I think McGinn in that role could work with Sanson as a number 8.
Post by: AV82EC on February 04, 2021, 09:52:15 PM
lacking work ethic? Where did you get that from? He said in an interview the other day he's played more games than had training sessions. How do you suppose that would affect him at PL level?
I don’t think it is unreasonable to expect that he gets goal side every now and then. Barkley is the polar opposite of Tommy Johnson and right now I think an all-action player like Johnson, would be better for the team. In fact I think McGinn in that role could work with Sanson as a number 8.
Yep we ahvent quite got this 6,8,10 thing worked out yet. Are we two sixes and a 10, a 6, 8 and 10 or a two 8s and a 10? when it does click and the opposition don't high press its devastating but too often a simple high press fucks us up. Smith has got to find the right balance and the ability to flex it.
Post by: Mister E on February 05, 2021, 11:07:19 AM
In fact I think McGinn in that role could work with Sanson as a number 8.I certainly think we are not getting the best out of McGinn, and he would make a better #10 than Barkley currently; in my opinion.
Post by: Abbeyfealeavfc on February 05, 2021, 11:34:29 AM
He would be a nuisance for any defender attempting to play out.
The unknown element for me at the moment is Sanson, but it's certainly worth trying. Barkley as an impact sub could be very effective.
Post by: OCD on February 05, 2021, 11:45:02 AM
If not Barkley, I think we will need to look outside the club in the summer. Someone with the athleticism and work ethic that matches the side, presses and gets plenty of goals and assists.
Post by: brontebilly on February 05, 2021, 11:59:45 AM
Watkins benefits from having a player play off him, but I don't think that has to be Barkley. Jack could easily play that role. I don't see McGinn as a natural number 10 but he could definitely do a job there. He links up well with Jack and Ollie when given the opportunity and in terms of pressing, interceptions, tackles higher up the pitch he would be excellent with the energy he has.
He would be a nuisance for any defender attempting to play out.
The unknown element for me at the moment is Sanson, but it's certainly worth trying. Barkley as an impact sub could be very effective.
McGinn played at 10 towards the end of last season, granted he wasn't fully fit, but he wasn't great there. He has had many fine game sitting next to Luiz (Chelsea stands out) this season but it has been mixed with some very average performances too. I don't think he is overly comfortable taking the ball under pressure from the back, lacks tactical discipline (as does Luiz) and seems happier breaking onto the ball higher up the pitch. I think in off the right wing might actually be his best position in a 4231 but Smith didn't buy Traore to sit on the bench.
Maybe it's as simple as likes of Luiz, McGinn, Barkley all need to improve particularly without the ball. We need to go back to two sitting midfielders asap as Smith referred to post game. Let's see what a game sitting on the bench does for a couple of them on Saturday. If I recall when McGinn was dropped previously in the championship (infamous Blues game), he came on that day, changed the game and his form kicked on big time.
Post by: ktvillan on February 05, 2021, 12:22:51 PM
Post by: fredm on February 05, 2021, 12:39:35 PM
Post by: OCD on February 05, 2021, 12:49:05 PM
Dont forget Ramsey will be another 6 months older in August, will have filled out more physically and also (hopefully) developed his game through interaction within the squad. Also are there anymore younger players who could take a position on the bench?
Aaron Ramsay, Chukwuemeka and Philogene-Bidace have been training with the first team squad for a while now.
Post by: eamonn on February 05, 2021, 01:08:40 PM
Dont forget Ramsey will be another 6 months older in August, will have filled out more physically and also (hopefully) developed his game through interaction within the squad. Also are there anymore younger players who could take a position on the bench?
...Chukwuemeka and Philogene-Bidace have been training with the first team squad for a while now.
That's easy for you to say.
Post by: chrisw1 on February 05, 2021, 01:33:35 PM
Watkins benefits from having a player play off him, but I don't think that has to be Barkley. Jack could easily play that role. I don't see McGinn as a natural number 10 but he could definitely do a job there. He links up well with Jack and Ollie when given the opportunity and in terms of pressing, interceptions, tackles higher up the pitch he would be excellent with the energy he has.Agree with this.
He would be a nuisance for any defender attempting to play out.
The unknown element for me at the moment is Sanson, but it's certainly worth trying. Barkley as an impact sub could be very effective.
I'm a fan of Barkley but I don't think we'll know until towards the end of the season if he's right for us / worth the money or not.
Post by: OCD on February 05, 2021, 01:39:57 PM
Dont forget Ramsey will be another 6 months older in August, will have filled out more physically and also (hopefully) developed his game through interaction within the squad. Also are there anymore younger players who could take a position on the bench?
...Chukwuemeka and Philogene-Bidace have been training with the first team squad for a while now.
That's easy for you to say.
I do need to Google it to get the spelling right :)
Post by: algy on February 06, 2021, 08:59:22 AM
My gut feeling at the moment is that he's done a job - our midfield is stronger with him in the squad. When he's on form he's fantastic, but he's not put those performances in regularly enough to justify spending more on him than you would on a standard squad filler. If, come the end of the season, he's having a Trez/Dougie style renaissance I'd be all over him though. We do need a player *like* him, that's for sure.
Post by: Ad@m on February 06, 2021, 01:11:46 PM
I don't know whether he thinks he too good to work hard or he's unfit but he just looks like he's being lazy.
Whatever the answer he needs dropping. At the moment we've got better on the bench.
Post by: Rudy65 on February 06, 2021, 01:27:32 PM
He's starting to piss me off now.
I don't know whether he thinks he too good to work hard or he's unfit but he just looks like he's being lazy.
Whatever the answer he needs dropping. At the moment we've got better on the bench.
I don’t know what position he is supposed to be playing tbh. He provides no support to Ollie nor links the play
Post by: PeterWithe on February 06, 2021, 02:34:32 PM
Also for a physically big lad, he gets knocked off the ball more than he should
Post by: Risso on February 06, 2021, 02:37:35 PM
Post by: danno on February 06, 2021, 02:39:25 PM
I hope that kick when going off was just frustration with his own performance, because if it was a show of petulance to Smith, he can fuck off back to Chelsea.
Willing to give him the benefit of the doubt, but somebody needs to have a word. He's not going to win a popularity contest with 40,000 of us if he disses Dean.
Post by: Abbeyfealeavfc on February 06, 2021, 02:42:01 PM
A passenger without the ball. Ok when on it but this doesn't happen often enough. I'd sooner Ramsey or Sanson in there than someone who appears to think he's something he's not
Post by: Aldridge Villa on February 06, 2021, 02:44:24 PM
Post by: dorsetvillian on February 06, 2021, 02:44:54 PM
Post by: richtheholtender on February 06, 2021, 02:50:07 PM
Post by: tomd2103 on February 06, 2021, 02:55:45 PM
Same as usual today, shows flashes of absolute class but doesn't get involved enough in showing for the ball and his work without it leaves a little to be desired.
Also for a physically big lad, he gets knocked off the ball more than he should
He isn’t giving us that energy we need in that position at the moment. It may be that he’s struggling with his sharpness after his injury, but we need someone buzzing around and putting pressure on the opposition.
Post by: Steve67 on February 06, 2021, 02:59:22 PM
Post by: brontebilly on February 06, 2021, 03:05:49 PM
It will be interesting to know what the bottle kicking was about when he was substituted. Is he disappointed with his performance? Is he fed up by being taken off when he didn’t feel he deserve to? Or, does he think he’s far too good to be taken off for the likes of Aston Villa football club? If it’s the latter, I think he will find that we have caught him up and he has stood still, which is why he is with us in the first place!
He had a right sulk when taken off against Newcastle and West Ham too. Time for a spell on the bench. The guy is deluded about his ability as a footballer, reality check watching others from the bench might help focus his mind. Where does his career go if we don't sign him? Chelsea definitely won't want him back....he's looking at a bottom half team for sure to take him on.
Post by: Moonraker on February 06, 2021, 03:12:50 PM
Post by: PeterWithe on February 06, 2021, 03:13:04 PM
Post by: Pete3206 on February 06, 2021, 03:17:22 PM
Post by: olaftab on February 06, 2021, 03:18:55 PM
Post by: Risso on February 06, 2021, 03:19:31 PM
Barkley was quite right to be very annoyed with himself.
If indeed that's what it was. I can't prove it, but I suspect not.
Post by: jwarry on February 06, 2021, 03:19:59 PM
Post by: Goldenballs on February 06, 2021, 03:29:29 PM
Obviously I don't expect him to be skipping and giggling as he comes off, but if you're largely a passenger for 80 mins you're going to be subbed. Especially if we're trying to improve the size and quality of the squad, and potentially compete in Europe.
Post by: stubbsyandy on February 06, 2021, 03:37:07 PM
Post by: CT on February 06, 2021, 04:06:48 PM
We may never know why he actually kicked the bottle, but Dean’s reaction said it all, and is good enough for me.
Post by: Dante Lavelli on February 06, 2021, 04:10:34 PM
It’d be interesting to compare him versus the other midfielders, and players in that 10 position, as he seems to be on his heels a lot of the time.
Post by: eamonn on February 06, 2021, 04:13:08 PM
Post by: Toronto Villa on February 06, 2021, 04:15:17 PM
Post by: villa `cross the mersey on February 06, 2021, 05:07:03 PM
Post by: Matt C on February 06, 2021, 05:08:07 PM
Post by: PaulWinch again on February 06, 2021, 05:10:20 PM
I think he’s frustrated in himself that he is not showing the player he is. Be it through fitness or just form. Probably both.
I concur.
Post by: OCD on February 06, 2021, 05:12:00 PM
Post by: Risso on February 06, 2021, 05:16:09 PM
Jack had a bit of a strop at being subbed against Newcastle. Nobody was saying 'get rid' then.
You can't honestly think that the two situations are in any way comparable?
Post by: Clampy on February 06, 2021, 05:18:38 PM
Post by: villa `cross the mersey on February 06, 2021, 05:20:08 PM
Jack had a bit of a strop at being subbed against Newcastle. Nobody was saying 'get rid' then.Jack is consistently excellent and was obviously upset he wasn't playing at his high standard .......Ross needs to up his ante and do more " off the ball" - unless of course he isn't match fit in which case Smith is right to sub him for fresh legs
Post by: OCD on February 06, 2021, 05:21:03 PM
Post by: Sexual Ealing on February 06, 2021, 05:22:21 PM
So he kicked something when he got subbed, so what? He may have been disappointed that he didn't score or that he thought he could have played better. Nothing to see here really.
That he kicked the bottle doesn't matter. That there's nothing to see from his performances does.
Post by: The Edge on February 06, 2021, 05:23:54 PM
So he kicked something when he got subbed, so what? He may have been disappointed that he didn't score or that he thought he could have played better. Nothing to see here really.Spot on clampy. Who knows why he reacted the way he did? Disappointed in his performance? Disappointed being took off when he thought he was doing ok? Who knows. I'm just happy that he cares
Post by: Clampy on February 06, 2021, 05:27:06 PM
Post by: Clampy on February 06, 2021, 05:28:35 PM
So he kicked something when he got subbed, so what? He may have been disappointed that he didn't score or that he thought he could have played better. Nothing to see here really.Spot on clampy. Who knows why he reacted the way he did? Disappointed in his performance? Disappointed being took off when he thought he was doing ok? Who knows. I'm just happy that he cares
Exactly.
Post by: PeterWithe on February 06, 2021, 05:28:38 PM
Post by: RamboandBruno on February 06, 2021, 05:29:00 PM
He looked liked he meant business in the first 10 of the 2nd half with some lovely play, but then went missing again. I think the miss hit shot from the corner sums up his confidence at the moment. If he’s on his game, he fires that in.
Let’s see what a week on the training pitch does for him and the others as well.
Post by: Toronto Villa on February 06, 2021, 05:30:04 PM
Post by: PeterWithe on February 06, 2021, 05:30:43 PM
Post by: Allan C on February 06, 2021, 05:32:17 PM
Post by: Tuscans on February 06, 2021, 05:33:45 PM
I said a few pages back, never rated him before there was any sniff of him joining us and I can't just then say I think he's brilliant, always has been just because he now plays for us. I still don't rate him, has little heart on and off the ball for me, arguable over hyped at Everton when England probably had a lack of attacking midfielders and now he's been lapped by a good dozen or so of gifted attacking midfielders.
I think when Sanson gets up and running you may see McGinn given more attacking intent and Sanson in McGinns present role.
Post by: RamboandBruno on February 06, 2021, 05:34:00 PM
Hmmm, that was a really difficult one to hit.
Agree. I suppose my point was he’s a good enough player to hit that in, even though admittedly it was difficult, he’s just off form at the moment. It’s not like he’s nearing the end of his career though, players with his talent rarely just turn crap
Post by: PeterWithe on February 06, 2021, 05:36:23 PM
Post by: The Edge on February 06, 2021, 05:38:40 PM
Well we’ve found another player to kick and blame. It was Mings a bit back and now it’s Barkley. And blimey!! We’re 8th and winning games!!! He, like the rest is clearly knackered and in need of a rest. Yes he’s struggling for form but he’s clearly a class player and it’ll come.We seem to need a scapegoat no matter what. I like Barkley I think he's took us up a level.
I'll have
Post by: ChicagoLion on February 06, 2021, 05:39:04 PM
If he is not properly fit, then get him properly fit.
Right now I would swap him for Hourihane.
Post by: Risso on February 06, 2021, 06:11:26 PM
Well we’ve found another player to kick and blame. It was Mings a bit back and now it’s Barkley. And blimey!! We’re 8th and winning games!!! He, like the rest is clearly knackered and in need of a rest. Yes he’s struggling for form but he’s clearly a class player and it’ll come.We seem to need a scapegoat no matter what. I like Barkley I think he's took us up a level.
I'll have
Go on, say something about David O’Leary being right, you know you’re dying to.
Post by: darren woolley on February 06, 2021, 06:15:03 PM
Post by: brontebilly on February 06, 2021, 06:17:04 PM
He is not contributing nearly enough to start just because he is available.
If he is not properly fit, then get him properly fit.
Right now I would swap him for Hourihane.
Compare him to Jack today. Jack was only ok as per his usual standards but still put in a fair old shift despite being clearly fatigued. Even McGinn who I was disappointed with again finished strongly. Ramsey, Trez, Watkins again proper graft without the ball.
Barkley for whatever reason seems to think that graft and press is beyond him. It's not just a recent fitness issue, he wasnt doing this against the likes of Leeds and Southampton earlier in the season either. The pressure Ramsey applied late on in comparison was like night and day. I think Andy Townsend called it right about Barkley earlier in the season, for every 7 or 8 out of 10, a 3 or 4 tends to follow. If he wants to improve as a player he needs to address that inconsistency, starting with getting fitter, shifting some body weight and taking pride in his work off the ball.
Post by: Tuscans on February 06, 2021, 06:41:03 PM
About right.He is not contributing nearly enough to start just because he is available.
If he is not properly fit, then get him properly fit.
Right now I would swap him for Hourihane.
Compare him to Jack today. Jack was only ok as per his usual standards but still put in a fair old shift despite being clearly fatigued. Even McGinn who I was disappointed with again finished strongly. Ramsey, Trez, Watkins again proper graft without the ball.
Barkley for whatever reason seems to think that graft and press is beyond him. It's not just a recent fitness issue, he wasnt doing this against the likes of Leeds and Southampton earlier in the season either. The pressure Ramsey applied late on in comparison was like night and day. I think Andy Townsend called it right about Barkley earlier in the season, for every 7 or 8 out of 10, a 3 or 4 tends to follow. If he wants to improve as a player he needs to address that inconsistency, starting with getting fitter, shifting some body weight and taking pride in his work off the ball.
Post by: Dante Lavelli on February 06, 2021, 06:48:02 PM
Jack had a bit of a strop at being subbed against Newcastle. Nobody was saying 'get rid' then.
I think it’s his general performances that’s attracting the comments, not the reaction to getting subbed. The fact he is on loan, also raises the “should we, wouldn’t we?” Dilemma each week.
Post by: Ads on February 06, 2021, 07:05:29 PM
Post by: garyellis on February 06, 2021, 07:18:49 PM
On the ball he is good, off it, he is anonymous.100% agree but surely somebody like JT can read him the tea leaves? I would be interested how much ground he covers in 90 minutes compared with similar style players. He is a special talent but the work rate needs to move up a notch.
Post by: Allan C on February 06, 2021, 09:08:11 PM
Well we’ve found another player to kick and blame. It was Mings a bit back and now it’s Barkley. And blimey!! We’re 8th and winning games!!! He, like the rest is clearly knackered and in need of a rest. Yes he’s struggling for form but he’s clearly a class player and it’ll come.We seem to need a scapegoat no matter what. I like Barkley I think he's took us up a level.
I'll have
Go on, say something about David O’Leary being right, you know you’re dying to.
Read some of the comments on this thread and others and tell me different. I thought Barkley played ok today. He was excellent up to his injury and like the rest he’s knackered since COVID and his return. I’m saying give him a chance
Post by: Lastfootstamper on February 06, 2021, 10:29:20 PM
Post by: ASHTONVILLA on February 06, 2021, 10:54:27 PM
I hope we sign him up at the end of the season.
Post by: eamonn on February 06, 2021, 11:55:19 PM
He's a Premier League Lee Trundle, which is why I think Chelsea will let him go, and for a fair bit less than some figures estimated on here. And it's still up to him to do enough in our shirt to convince Aston Villa to part with that money, if he wants to stay.
What was the figure ?
Post by: Lastfootstamper on February 07, 2021, 12:07:32 AM
Post by: olaftab on February 07, 2021, 12:14:34 AM
Post by: nordenvillain on February 07, 2021, 12:17:29 AM
Post by: paul_e on February 07, 2021, 12:22:16 AM
Post by: nordenvillain on February 07, 2021, 12:24:22 AM
Figures as high as £50m have been mentioned.Gosh, is that how much Chelsea will pay us to have him ?
Post by: JD on February 07, 2021, 07:33:46 AM
Acting "Billy Big Bollocks" - get rid , there has to be better options at a lower asking price - none of my Evertonian mates miss him a great deal
Absolutely disagree. I know a few Evertonians who are good friends and they were gutted when he left Everton. They still call him Ross the Rat but think he's a great player.
Post by: London Villan on February 07, 2021, 07:41:09 AM
Post by: OzVilla on February 07, 2021, 07:59:00 AM
Post by: Jockey Randall on February 07, 2021, 08:06:13 AM
Post by: RamboandBruno on February 07, 2021, 08:28:28 AM
Post by: Rigadon on February 07, 2021, 08:45:16 AM
Post by: AV82EC on February 07, 2021, 08:56:48 AM
Post by: john2710 on February 07, 2021, 09:09:28 AM
He’s got another 4 months to convince us to spend £30M+ & salary on him. It’s in both his & our interests. If he delivers we could be looking at Europe next season. If he doesn’t then he’ll be back at Chelsea & I can’t see many teams matching anything close to what Chelsea would want.
From a personal point of view I’d rather Dele Ali. Maybe the club see Ramsey as a better option.
Post by: Dante Lavelli on February 07, 2021, 09:20:11 AM
Based on the seamless step-up by Cash and Watkins I’d happily spend £30m there.
Post by: Smithy on February 07, 2021, 09:25:03 AM
Who is the next big thing in the championship who plays in a similar position?
Based on the seamless step-up by Cash and Watkins I’d happily spend £30m there.
He's just signed permanently for West Ham (Benrahma). Though you could probably make a case for Cantwell or Buendia from Norwich? I wouldn't pay £30m for those though.
One thing I am pretty confident of though, is that our scouting network is paying very close attention to the Championship, given the success we've had recruiting from there (you could argue our entire back four was signed off the back of their performances in the Championship).
Post by: DB on February 07, 2021, 10:37:11 AM
Post by: Baldy on February 07, 2021, 10:42:40 AM
If Fulham get relegated a big club will be in for Ademola Lookman. Followed his career from the England U17 days and think he is a Raheem Sterling in the making.
The ball is in Ross's court. Don't give Villa a decision to make!! :)
Post by: brontebilly on February 07, 2021, 10:44:34 AM
Who is the next big thing in the championship who plays in a similar position?
Based on the seamless step-up by Cash and Watkins I’d happily spend £30m there.
There's a guy at Swansea that's shooting the lights out !
Post by: GordonCowansisthegreatest on February 07, 2021, 10:49:01 AM
Have to get Conor to tap him up! ;)Who is the next big thing in the championship who plays in a similar position?
Based on the seamless step-up by Cash and Watkins I’d happily spend £30m there.
There's a guy at Swansea that's shooting the lights out !
Post by: dave shelley on February 07, 2021, 10:49:33 AM
Who is the next big thing in the championship who plays in a similar position?
Based on the seamless step-up by Cash and Watkins I’d happily spend £30m there.
My opinion on the next big thing in the championship is playing for our old friends at Brentford...Ivan Toney. One way or another I think he will be playing top-flight football next season.
Post by: Mister E on February 07, 2021, 11:02:34 AM
I just think he needs to live up to his billing as well as playing in the style that Smith requires - high energy, quick pass-and-move, combative without the ball.
Reading this back, I seem to be hyper-critical: I don't mean to be excessively so; it's more about making sure we bring in the best we possibly can.
Post by: eamonn on February 07, 2021, 11:13:59 AM
Who is the next big thing in the championship who plays in a similar position?
Based on the seamless step-up by Cash and Watkins I’d happily spend £30m there.
My opinion on the next big thing in the championship is playing for our old friends at Brentford...Ivan Toney. One way or another I think he will be playing top-flight football next season.
If we throw another £30m at Brentford I'll scream blue murder. We should have bought the whole club last summer when negotiating for Watkins.
Anyway The Bees should finally get promoted this season so there should be no need for Brentford to be "raided" by anyone's "war-chest".
Post by: villa `cross the mersey on February 07, 2021, 11:15:29 AM
That's your prerogative JD - it's all about opinions.Acting "Billy Big Bollocks" - get rid , there has to be better options at a lower asking price - none of my Evertonian mates miss him a great deal
Absolutely disagree. I know a few Evertonians who are good friends and they were gutted when he left Everton. They still call him Ross the Rat but think he's a great player.
I was quite excited at the prospect of him joining us but he appears to be displaying some of the traits that I had been told to look out for .....still
"It's no good crying over spilt chips" :)
Still hoping to be proved wrong
Cheers !!
Post by: LeeB on February 07, 2021, 11:34:27 AM
You've got to justify staying on the pitch for the first 75 minutes obviously, but I think that's the crux of his frustration.
Post by: Drummond on February 07, 2021, 11:35:19 AM
He mentioned after the Southampton game I think, that he hasn’t really be able to train since coming back from injury, I think a reference to the fixture schedule than anything else. It will be better to judge him over the next 3 or 4 games, with a weeks training in between each game.
Yep, agree with this. He was doing really well before his injury.
It's something when the things we have to moan about are Tyrone Mings and Ross Barkley not being good enough.
Post by: Abbeyfealeavfc on February 07, 2021, 11:38:25 AM
His reaction for me goes back to what he said after scoring the winner against Leicester, that he rarely got to see out games at Chelsea and the last 15 minutes are where the spaces open up and he can do damage.
You've got to justify staying on the pitch for the first 75 minutes obviously, but I think that's the crux of his frustration.
Maybe he would be better used as an impact sub in that case, when he'd be fresh against tiring defenders.
Post by: eamonn on February 07, 2021, 11:46:23 AM
His reaction for me goes back to what he said after scoring the winner against Leicester, that he rarely got to see out games at Chelsea and the last 15 minutes are where the spaces open up and he can do damage.
You've got to justify staying on the pitch for the first 75 minutes obviously, but I think that's the crux of his frustration.
Interesting point and that could well be at the heart of it.
Post by: Risso on February 07, 2021, 11:49:24 AM
He mentioned after the Southampton game I think, that he hasn’t really be able to train since coming back from injury, I think a reference to the fixture schedule than anything else. It will be better to judge him over the next 3 or 4 games, with a weeks training in between each game.
Yep, agree with this. He was doing really well before his injury.
It's something when the things we have to moan about are Tyrone Mings and Ross Barkley not being good enough.
He'd played really well against Liverpool and Leicester, much less so against Leeds and Southampton. Since then, very little to get excited about. Two great games for us then, ten where he's either been OK or not very good.
Post by: Ian. on February 07, 2021, 11:53:40 AM
He mentioned after the Southampton game I think, that he hasn’t really be able to train since coming back from injury, I think a reference to the fixture schedule than anything else. It will be better to judge him over the next 3 or 4 games, with a weeks training in between each game.
Yep, agree with this. He was doing really well before his injury.
It's something when the things we have to moan about are Tyrone Mings and Ross Barkley not being good enough.
He'd played really well against Liverpool and Leicester, much less so against Leeds and Southampton. Since then, very little to get excited about. Two great games for us then, ten where he's either been OK or not very good.
It’s very frustrating as when on it he’s very very good and gives us and more importantly Jack another dimension to our attacking play. However his impact has been nothing compared to say Traore, who’s impact has been quite superb on regular run out.
Post by: Flamingo Lane on February 07, 2021, 01:56:04 PM
Post by: pelty on February 07, 2021, 09:46:15 PM
The aspect of Barkley's performances that frustrates me most is that now would be an absolutely ideal time to be giving good game time to Jacob Ramsey, and Barkley's continuing presence in the team is impeding that.
I agree with this. I think Ramsey can be a very good player for us. And this is nothing against Barkley who is quite talented and a good player in his own right, but he has not been up to it of late in my opinion.
Post by: Dante Lavelli on February 07, 2021, 11:53:39 PM
Counter intuitive, but having serious wages sat on the bench is a short cut to crisis in my opinion.
Post by: London Villan on February 08, 2021, 07:48:20 AM
Post by: The Edge on February 08, 2021, 08:48:18 AM
Unless you are established the in champs league, playing 20 more games a season then having tens of millions on the bench is difficult to manage.Not to mention the huge bench that would require.
Post by: ChicagoLion on February 13, 2021, 09:56:24 PM
Post by: Ads on February 13, 2021, 10:05:47 PM
Post by: Toronto Villa on February 13, 2021, 10:07:13 PM
Post by: brontebilly on February 13, 2021, 10:08:11 PM
Post by: Dante Lavelli on February 13, 2021, 10:09:25 PM
Post by: taylorsworkrate on February 13, 2021, 10:10:08 PM
I was very much in the make it a permanent signing before his injury, but not now.
Post by: CT on February 13, 2021, 10:10:32 PM
I expect players of his quality and stature to stand out, especially in games like this. He isn’t doing it at all and hasn’t for a long time.
Post by: PaulWinch again on February 13, 2021, 10:13:35 PM
Post by: olaftab on February 13, 2021, 10:13:48 PM
Post by: ChicagoLion on February 13, 2021, 10:13:58 PM
Post by: OzVilla on February 13, 2021, 10:14:51 PM
Post by: PeterWithe on February 13, 2021, 10:15:34 PM
Post by: manic-road on February 13, 2021, 10:15:44 PM
Post by: London Villan on February 13, 2021, 10:15:52 PM
Post by: OzVilla on February 13, 2021, 10:17:39 PM
His job is to dominate when opposition double and treble on Jack and he's failing badly in that. I thought he would be disappointing when we signed him and he's doing his best to prove me right.
In the last few games maybe but he was superb before his injury. I’d be saving the self congratulations for a while longer.
Post by: Flamingo Lane on February 13, 2021, 10:17:48 PM
Post by: ChicagoLion on February 13, 2021, 10:18:15 PM
Poor tonight amongst all of the midfield, he will be lucky to make the next Villa team never mind the England team at the Euros.I bet he starts against Leicester
Post by: OzVilla on February 13, 2021, 10:21:18 PM
Post by: paul_e on February 13, 2021, 10:30:27 PM
Post by: brontebilly on February 13, 2021, 10:36:16 PM
Poor tonight amongst all of the midfield, he will be lucky to make the next Villa team never mind the England team at the Euros.I bet he starts against Leicester
I don't think Deano will give him another start right now. He certainly didn't sugarcoat what he thought of the team performance tonight and Barkley has been hooked in every game recently. I firmly expect he will be in the stand for the Leicester game. Traore and McGinn should be joining him I think but three changes might be a bit drastic.
Post by: richtheholtender on February 13, 2021, 10:41:23 PM
Post by: Des Little on February 13, 2021, 10:50:47 PM
Post by: PeterWithe on February 13, 2021, 10:54:57 PM
Post by: danno on February 13, 2021, 10:57:09 PM
Post by: Ian. on February 13, 2021, 11:01:22 PM
Our midfield isn’t working very well. Not just Ross, but Jack, Doug and McGinn are struggling for form.
Post by: aj2k77 on February 13, 2021, 11:10:41 PM
Post by: TonyD on February 13, 2021, 11:26:17 PM
Apart from his brilliant header - he has been disappointing (shit) the last few game.
But we are in this for the long haul.
I firmly think Ross could be part of our squad to take us on the journey.
Its all about belief and attitude - especially in this day and age - when most of these over paid arses don’t have anything to nail their colours to the mast.
Ross strikes me as someone who is onboard for our journey.
Post by: aj2k77 on February 13, 2021, 11:33:00 PM
Post by: TonyD on February 13, 2021, 11:56:25 PM
He's not worth anything near what we will be quoted by Chelsea though, at the moment he is surely playing himself out of a transfer as no one in their right mind is going to pour £60 odd million in to what he is giving us in fees and wages. Much better value elsewhere if he keeps his current form up.Nobody knows what Chelsea want for Ross - or what we value his services for.
Chelsea’s wage bill is eye watering. Probably the highest in the world if you consider the huge amount of good players - both under 21s - 1st team AND on loan.
Ross isn’t part of their plans TBH.
So to the big question - how much?
I’d say £18/25M.
Post by: aj2k77 on February 14, 2021, 12:00:14 AM
Post by: TonyD on February 14, 2021, 12:04:02 AM
Realistically what do you think Ross Barkley would cost and how much would he demand wage wise? It would be an obscene amount for someone who just doesn't do enough for me.As above £18m
Wages - god knows
Post by: SoccerHQ on February 14, 2021, 12:16:23 AM
Realistically what do you think Ross Barkley would cost and how much would he demand wage wise? It would be an obscene amount for someone who just doesn't do enough for me.
Only thing I can say is getting him full time would impress other players. I doubt they're analysing his 90 minute contribution like we are but it would be...."oh Villa, near euro miss, signing Barkley full time, Jack Grealish, where do I sign etc"
Very hard to justify paying 20m + for him based on his performances since coming back from injury though. I knew he was an inconsistant player who held onto the ball way too long and was very frustrating in final third at Everton and Chelsea but he's not even doing much of that currently and also seems as bad v Hourihane playing mega press teams.
Will be a complete passenger v Leeds in two weeks for example.
Post by: tomd2103 on February 14, 2021, 12:19:36 AM
I’d put Ramsey far ahead of Sansom in the queue.
Possibly. Do think we need some real energy in that position, with someone who can support Watkins in pressing the opposition defence and can work back and help the midfield.
Post by: Risso on February 14, 2021, 12:23:37 AM
Realistically what do you think Ross Barkley would cost and how much would he demand wage wise? It would be an obscene amount for someone who just doesn't do enough for me.
Only thing I can say is getting him full time would impress other players. I doubt they're analysing his 90 minute contribution like we are but it would be...."oh Villa, near euro miss, signing Barkley full time, Jack Grealish, where do I sign etc"
Very hard to justify paying 20m + for him based on his performances since coming back from injury though. I knew he was an inconsistant player who held onto the ball way too long and was very frustrating in final third at Everton and Chelsea but he's not even doing much of that currently and also seems as bad v Hourihane playing mega press teams.
Will be a complete passenger v Leeds in two weeks for example.
I think sending him back would possibly send an even bigger message. "Sorry son, you're not consistent enough for where we want to be."
Post by: TonyD on February 14, 2021, 12:30:14 AM
It’s a gamble.Realistically what do you think Ross Barkley would cost and how much would he demand wage wise? It would be an obscene amount for someone who just doesn't do enough for me.
Only thing I can say is getting him full time would impress other players. I doubt they're analysing his 90 minute contribution like we are but it would be...."oh Villa, near euro miss, signing Barkley full time, Jack Grealish, where do I sign etc"
Very hard to justify paying 20m + for him based on his performances since coming back from injury though. I knew he was an inconsistant player who held onto the ball way too long and was very frustrating in final third at Everton and Chelsea but he's not even doing much of that currently and also seems as bad v Hourihane playing mega press teams.
Will be a complete passenger v Leeds in two weeks for example.
I think sending him back would possibly send an even bigger message. "Sorry son, you're not consistent enough for where we want to be."
How do Dean n Co think of Ramsey’s ability and Morgan to fill the gap.
I am no fan of Nakamba. I could be wrong. But don’t think he is top 6 material.
Post by: Tuscans on February 14, 2021, 12:55:30 AM
The 15-16 games he's had I personally wouldn't take him. I would love him to prove me wrong whilst he's here but I have never and still don't rate him as a No.10.
Post by: Rudy Can't Fail on February 14, 2021, 01:24:31 AM
Post by: Sexual Ealing on February 14, 2021, 05:36:37 AM
I've come to the conclusion Ross has a mental blockage. He's not a happy chap. He's carrying the weight of the world on his shoulders. Thankfully, as Mrs RCF pointed out, he's got a fat neck.
Hahahaha. I always preferred her to you! Wink.
Post by: ChicagoLion on February 14, 2021, 06:55:35 AM
Post by: London Villan on February 14, 2021, 07:06:38 AM
Energetic, can pick a pass, has a decent shot on them? Actually sounds like McGinn.
Post by: ChicagoLion on February 14, 2021, 07:10:52 AM
Who would be the choice to play the number 10 position in our set up from a realistic transfer target point of view.would also offer some energy without the ball.
Energetic, can pick a pass, has a decent shot on them? Actually sounds like McGinn.
We just let a player go that would have loved to have been able to play without any defensive responsibility.
Right now it’s any one but Barkley for me.
Post by: mr underhill on February 14, 2021, 08:17:36 AM
Post by: andyh on February 14, 2021, 08:32:06 AM
Yes, McGinn, Marv, Hourihane (when here) have all been very poor in games as well, but they cost a few £m each.
Unless Chelsea are going to be realistic and sell for £10-15m he should be going back at the end of the season.
Post by: colin69 on February 14, 2021, 08:47:57 AM
Post by: dicedlam on February 14, 2021, 08:51:28 AM
Remember, Chelsea fans were a little annoyed that the club loaned him out to us after having been one of their most consistent performers the previous season.
Post by: Baldy on February 14, 2021, 09:00:21 AM
When the opposition 'cancel out' Jack we clearly see the shortfall in Ross's game.
If you are not prepared to work hard and show the desire for a permanent contract you deserve what is coming your way.
Villa's money should be better spent elsewhere.
Post by: Risso on February 14, 2021, 09:01:52 AM
For the money Chelsea would want, he is showing he is far too inconsistent to spend the kind of money being touted (£30-40m) on him.
Yes, McGinn, Marv, Hourihane (when here) have all been very poor in games as well, but they cost a few £m each.
Unless Chelsea are going to be realistic and sell for £10-15m he should be going back at the end of the season.
I wouldn't take him on a free on this form.
Post by: Brend'Watkins on February 14, 2021, 09:07:11 AM
Post by: Abbeyfealeavfc on February 14, 2021, 09:10:05 AM
Post by: ChicagoLion on February 14, 2021, 09:19:39 AM
I am not ready to write him off just yet. If he can get back to being fully fit over the next few weeks I think he will come good.not one Chelsea fan I know rate Barkley.
Remember, Chelsea fans were a little annoyed that the club loaned him out to us after having been one of their most consistent performers the previous season.
Post by: dicedlam on February 14, 2021, 09:27:43 AM
I am not ready to write him off just yet. If he can get back to being fully fit over the next few weeks I think he will come good.not one Chelsea fan I know rate Barkley.
Remember, Chelsea fans were a little annoyed that the club loaned him out to us after having been one of their most consistent performers the previous season.
Only going on what was reported at the time and comments made on their forums.
Post by: TelfordVilla on February 14, 2021, 09:44:06 AM
Post by: J on February 14, 2021, 09:56:26 AM
Post by: RamboandBruno on February 14, 2021, 10:05:09 AM
I am not ready to write him off just yet. If he can get back to being fully fit over the next few weeks I think he will come good.not one Chelsea fan I know rate Barkley.
Remember, Chelsea fans were a little annoyed that the club loaned him out to us after having been one of their most consistent performers the previous season.
My older brother, in his early 60s, lifelong Chelsea fan, travelled home and away, since late 70s, all over UK and Europe, rated Barclay at Chelsea and was annoyed they let him go. There’s one for ya.
Post by: RamboandBruno on February 14, 2021, 10:06:13 AM
Post by: robleflaneur on February 14, 2021, 10:27:32 AM
With Chelsea and England he could be a flat track bully..Give him space to run into and he is lethal.As teams press more,deny space and give him less time on the ball,Barkley vanishes and I imagine he is not as quick as he once was.
Post by: ChicagoLion on February 14, 2021, 10:29:46 AM
As a teenager at Everton was possibly peak Barkley.He was regarded as one of the best talents in England but had 2 fatal flaws,he didn't track back and he is quite stocky.I think he has overdone the weight training.
With Chelsea and England he could be a flat track bully..Give him space to run into and he is lethal.As teams press more,deny space and give him less time on the ball,Barkley vanishes and I imagine he is not as quick as he once was.
Post by: Mister E on February 14, 2021, 10:30:32 AM
Post by: Risso on February 14, 2021, 10:32:44 AM
There is no way I'd want Villa to be spending anywhere near £30-£40m for Barkley. He simply isn't worth that kind of money on his showings for us. I'm also not happy that he seems undroppable. With him starting we're already down to 10 men and if Traore is having a mare then we are as good as playing with 9 men, which is how it appeared vs Brighton.
Traore is still coming to terms with the Premier League, but you can at least see he is working on his tracking back, and he can make things happen with his unpredictability. With Barkley, I'm not seeing anything at the moment. No effort, no mobility, no distribution, no taking the pressure off Jack. Nothing.
Post by: OzVilla on February 14, 2021, 11:12:55 AM
Let’s all take a breath. Maybe we shouldn’t be making any snap judgments based on a few poor weeks, 1 in which he scored the winner don’t forget.
I still think he’s a player I’d be more than happy to have, just depends on how much Chelsea want for him.
Post by: PaulWinch again on February 14, 2021, 11:25:56 AM
He’s going through a rough spell and DS has indicated he’s not yet at 100% fitness. He was terrific when he first came but looks off the pace now as have the team lately.
Let’s all take a breath. Maybe we shouldn’t be making any snap judgments based on a few poor weeks, 1 in which he scored the winner don’t forget.
I still think he’s a player I’d be more than happy to have, just depends on how much Chelsea want for him.
That’s where I am. He’s in a ropey patch, and I wonder whether a spell coming off the bench might help him build confidence.
Post by: brontebilly on February 14, 2021, 11:26:54 AM
As a teenager at Everton was possibly peak Barkley.He was regarded as one of the best talents in England but had 2 fatal flaws,he didn't track back and he is quite stocky.
With Chelsea and England he could be a flat track bully..Give him space to run into and he is lethal.As teams press more,deny space and give him less time on the ball,Barkley vanishes and I imagine he is not as quick as he once was.
The stats would suggest he wasn't a bully of any description at either Chelsea or England. He hardly got a kick under Conte and even under Lampard last season (when they couldn't sign anyone) he wasn't a regular.
He was anonymous again yesterday but the main problems with our display were further back. But Barkley is 27 and very experienced at this level. Surely he should have the nous to be able to drop into midfield for 10-15mins to get us playing through the lines. He doesn't though.
Post by: Chris Smith on February 14, 2021, 11:42:02 AM
Post by: Ian. on February 14, 2021, 11:45:49 AM
Post by: exigo on February 14, 2021, 11:50:57 AM
Grealish Sanson Traore
McGinn Luiz
Much better balance and work rate to it.
Post by: Gary Penrice on February 14, 2021, 11:54:28 AM
I would rather use whatever money Chelsea would want for him elsewhere in the squad for a player more suited to our work ethic etc.
Post by: wittonwarrior on February 14, 2021, 12:08:16 PM
At prices quoted he is a big swerve right now
Post by: N'ZMAV on February 14, 2021, 12:19:26 PM
Post by: JUAN PABLO on February 14, 2021, 12:24:48 PM
Post by: saunders_heroes on February 14, 2021, 12:31:12 PM
Post by: Clampy on February 14, 2021, 12:33:38 PM
I wasn’t a fan and didn’t want us to sign him. His early performances made me think that perhaps I’d misjudged him but more recently he has looked like the player I thought we were getting. He’s obviously got some ability but is inconsistent and has too many downsides to his game for me to want to make it a permanent signing. I’d rather invest the time in Sanson and Ramsey.
I was along the same lines as never really being a fan but I didn't have a problem with us signing him, as it was only a loan. He made us look a better side going forward almost immediately but he seems to be lacking confidence badly of late. It'll be interesting to see what the club decide but Smith really does seem to rate Ramsey.
Post by: Flamingo Lane on February 14, 2021, 01:01:53 PM
I wasn’t a fan and didn’t want us to sign him. His early performances made me think that perhaps I’d misjudged him but more recently he has looked like the player I thought we were getting. He’s obviously got some ability but is inconsistent and has too many downsides to his game for me to want to make it a permanent signing. I’d rather invest the time in Sanson and Ramsey.
I was along the same lines as never really being a fan but I didn't have a problem with us signing him, as it was only a loan. He made us look a better side going forward almost immediately but he seems to be lacking confidence badly of late. It'll be interesting to see what the club decide but Smith really does seem to rate Ramsey.
Does or doesn't rate Ramsey? From what I'm seeing it's not obvious that Smith does rate Ramsey, who I think is way overdue another start.
Post by: richtheholtender on February 14, 2021, 01:03:21 PM
Post by: oldtimernow on February 14, 2021, 01:21:44 PM
Perhaps part of the reason McGinn/Luiz under pressure.
Add to that Traore being anonymous too we were playing with 9 men.
Watkins was up against 2 brick shit houses who weren't adverse to mixing it with foul play as well thanks to a poor ref.
Lucky to get an undeserved point really.
Post by: eamonn on February 14, 2021, 01:42:05 PM
The way he is playing 12 million to west ham in summer.
Chelsea can throw in Carlton Cole to sweeten the deal.
Post by: Risso on February 14, 2021, 01:50:21 PM
Hasn’t been the same since he came back from his injury. He’ll be back to his best soon enough though. Its way too soon to be writing him off.
He's shown no sign of improvement whatsoever, and yesterday was his 7th game back after injury. If he's going to miss 10 games through injury and then take another ten getting back to some sort of form, then he absolutely is not worth buying on a permanent deal.
Post by: Rudy Can't Fail on February 14, 2021, 02:51:51 PM
I wasn’t a fan and didn’t want us to sign him. His early performances made me think that perhaps I’d misjudged him but more recently he has looked like the player I thought we were getting. He’s obviously got some ability but is inconsistent and has too many downsides to his game for me to want to make it a permanent signing. I’d rather invest the time in Sanson and Ramsey.
Same here, Chris. Ramsey would certainly give us some much needed energy in midfield plus he has an eye for goal. I'd have certainly brought him on to replace Barkley at half time yesterday.
Post by: Allan C on February 14, 2021, 03:35:55 PM
Post by: TelfordVilla on February 14, 2021, 03:41:13 PM
Post by: Ger Regan on February 14, 2021, 03:49:03 PM
Post by: The Edge on February 14, 2021, 04:21:01 PM
I really rate him when he's on form but can't defend him after another no show yesterday. I agree with your point about a permanent deal too. It's a shame really because after the Liverpool demolition job I really thought we were on to something.Hasn’t been the same since he came back from his injury. He’ll be back to his best soon enough though. Its way too soon to be writing him off.
He's shown no sign of improvement whatsoever, and yesterday was his 7th game back after injury. If he's going to miss 10 games through injury and then take another ten getting back to some sort of form, then he absolutely is not worth buying on a permanent deal.
Post by: Nii Lamptey on February 14, 2021, 05:03:58 PM
Just don't think he's going to cut it to be honest - Shame, because after the Liverpool and Leicester games, I really thought we'd found a perfect match of player and club. Unfortunately, it hasn't really turned out that way and I'd send him back to Chelsea at the end of the season with a thanks but no thanks.
He's a passenger in games at the moment (and with the amount of sweating he does, looks unfit!). We can't afford to play another team's player on the feint hope that he hits form again - I'd bring Sanson in against Leicester, as well as take the reigns off McGinn a little.
Post by: London Villan on February 14, 2021, 06:01:01 PM
Post by: Lastfootstamper on February 14, 2021, 06:28:26 PM
A three of Sanson and Doug at the base, with McGinn further forward must be worth a try.
Maybe not even at the base, maybe a flat 3 in a midfield pushing up as one. We can go full Christmas tree.
Post by: eamonn on February 14, 2021, 06:32:27 PM
Post by: algy on February 14, 2021, 06:38:27 PM
Just wondering ... are we obliged to play him if he's fit? It just seems a bit weird the number of games he's playing when he's just come back from injury, and not showing particularly great form.
Post by: The Edge on February 14, 2021, 06:59:19 PM
I'm happy giving Barkley til the end of the season to prove himself. He's shown flashes of absolute brilliance. Needs to be more than just flashes, though, at 27 years old and a big wage to pay. And he's not offered a huge amount post-injury. There's mitigating circumstances for that - lots of games, hardly any training - but now we're not playing 2 games a week, you do expect an improvement.I doubt very much that we're obliged to play him. We're paying his wages so I'd imagine we call the shots. I don't think his fitness levels are where they should be since his injury and my guess is they are trying to play him back to full fitness.
Just wondering ... are we obliged to play him if he's fit? It just seems a bit weird the number of games he's playing when he's just come back from injury, and not showing particularly great form.
Post by: Drummond on February 15, 2021, 11:26:35 AM
Was my Coutinho idea missed or did everyone just find it so laughable that it was brushed over? Barca are broke and he can’t get a game for their reserves from what I have been told.
If he can't get a game for their reserves I wouldn't want him. He's unlikely to take the sort of paycut that would be needed and let's face it, he's nowhere near the player he was. But other than that, maybe.
Post by: Smithy on February 15, 2021, 11:30:39 AM
However, his brilliant start means I'm still willing to give him the benefit of the doubt for the rest of the season. That said, I don't want him to be the automatic first-choice for that position - he has to understand that the players in the wings will play if he doesn't perform.
It would be difficult to drop him given he scored the winner against Leicester last time out, but I also like the idea of bringing him on with 30 mins to freshen up the attack a bit.
If nothing else, it's nice to finally have options, isn't it?
Post by: danno on February 15, 2021, 11:33:28 AM
Was my Coutinho idea missed or did everyone just find it so laughable that it was brushed over? Barca are broke and he can’t get a game for their reserves from what I have been told.
If he can't get a game for their reserves I wouldn't want him. He's unlikely to take the sort of paycut that would be needed and let's face it, he's nowhere near the player he was. But other than that, maybe.
Didn't he help knock them out the champions league last season? That possibly has more to do with it than him not being good enough.
Post by: LeeB on February 15, 2021, 11:33:39 AM
Was my Coutinho idea missed or did everyone just find it so laughable that it was brushed over? Barca are broke and he can’t get a game for their reserves from what I have been told.
If he can't get a game for their reserves I wouldn't want him. He's unlikely to take the sort of paycut that would be needed and let's face it, he's nowhere near the player he was. But other than that, maybe.
See Gareth Bale.
But the idea itself isn't so mad, the quality of options available for this role would be a lot higher for us on the back of this season than when we signed Barkley, I don't think we'll do a deal for him ultimately.
Post by: Brend'Watkins on February 15, 2021, 11:41:17 AM
Post by: OCD on February 15, 2021, 11:42:31 AM
Post by: Pat Mustard on February 15, 2021, 12:05:18 PM
He is 27 now so isn't going to get many more opportunities to prove himself. It's a shame as when he is on it he is a real asset, but the breaking point for me on Saturday was when Trossard had that shot in the first half - Barkley had not bothered to track him, and even when the ball was played back to him on the edge of the area Barkley is barely moving despite being the closest man. In a side that puts as much effort into the defensive side of the game as we do, it must royally piss off his team-mates.
It was said that he was annoyed at being subbed last week as he feels that it is in the last 20 minutes that he can do the most damage. If that's the case then he can start on the bench, and come on if we need it late on, but he can't start games if he continues to be a passenger like he was against Brighton.
Post by: pauliewalnuts on February 15, 2021, 01:02:54 PM
The brilliant / awful ratio is not looking anything like good enough currently, and we don't have a big or good enough squad to be able to live with that sort of non-delivery.
For me, based on events thus far, I wouldn't make the deal permanent.
Post by: chrisw1 on February 15, 2021, 01:39:27 PM
Unless there is still some underlying issue with his fitness than Barkley is rapidly reaching the point of no return. The performance on Saturday night, coming off the back of his hissy fit when subbed last week means he is not going to get cut a lot of slack. He isn't our player so it's not like we lose much if he leaves, we just look for someone more suited to the role we need.Agree with this. I'm a fan oh his and still believe that when on form he can be perfect for us. But unless he can put in a sustained run of top performances between now and the end of the season I'd be looking elsewhere, which is a real shame as it could have been a good fit.
He is 27 now so isn't going to get many more opportunities to prove himself. It's a shame as when he is on it he is a real asset, but the breaking point for me on Saturday was when Trossard had that shot in the first half - Barkley had not bothered to track him, and even when the ball was played back to him on the edge of the area Barkley is barely moving despite being the closest man. In a side that puts as much effort into the defensive side of the game as we do, it must royally piss off his team-mates.
It was said that he was annoyed at being subbed last week as he feels that it is in the last 20 minutes that he can do the most damage. If that's the case then he can start on the bench, and come on if we need it late on, but he can't start games if he continues to be a passenger like he was against Brighton.
Post by: kippaxvilla2 on February 15, 2021, 02:36:45 PM
Don’t win anything with waffer thin squads.
Thank you Mr Creosote.
Post by: kippaxvilla2 on February 15, 2021, 02:37:53 PM
The 27-year-old has just one assist to his name this season and, speaking after Saturday's goalless draw at Brighton, Smith said: "It's been a really difficult time for Roscoe because he got injured against Brighton earlier in the season and missed eight weeks with his injury.
From the meaning evil. We now have the answer we signed the sheriff from Dukes of Hazzard.
Post by: brontebilly on February 15, 2021, 02:48:38 PM
Not unless he goes on a great run of form. The problem is, he may not get the opportunity if he's dropped. If he's looking exhausted with the level of effort he's putting in now it's hard to see how he can improve on his work rate. A big few weeks for Barkley's future career coming up.
Agreed, I think it's getting to the stage where he only has a few weeks left to make a big impression. His position is one where we arguably have the most options. Traore, Jack, McGinn, Ramsey, Sanson can all play there and we own those players. Barkley has proven beyond doubt that he cant be trusted in a midfield three and the no.10 position has huge competition.
No chance he can start next day out for me. Going to have to earn his spot from the bench which might suit him for a few weeks.
Post by: ChicagoLion on February 15, 2021, 02:53:19 PM
I am sticking with this prediction.Poor tonight amongst all of the midfield, he will be lucky to make the next Villa team never mind the England team at the Euros.I bet he starts against Leicester
Post by: London Villan on February 15, 2021, 02:53:53 PM
Post by: rob_bridge on February 15, 2021, 03:22:20 PM
Sanson should start ahead of him next weekend.
I agree or even put Trez wide right and Jack central
Post by: kippaxvilla2 on February 15, 2021, 03:51:13 PM
Post by: Risso on February 15, 2021, 03:52:55 PM
Post by: LeeB on February 15, 2021, 04:05:55 PM
Barkley will be so far down the list of attacking midfielders for England I bet even Steven Gerrard is ahead of him. He's about as much competition for Jack's place as I am.
I fear your reluctance to play on the left will hold you back.
Post by: thick_mike on February 15, 2021, 04:06:52 PM
Barkley will be so far down the list of attacking midfielders for England I bet even Steven Gerrard is ahead of him. He's about as much competition for Jack's place as I am.
I fear your reluctance to play on the left will hold you back.
😆
Post by: frankmosswasmyuncle on February 15, 2021, 04:14:41 PM
I can only imagine that Deano is being very patient and wants him to "play himself into form".I am sticking with this prediction.Poor tonight amongst all of the midfield, he will be lucky to make the next Villa team never mind the England team at the Euros.I bet he starts against Leicester
I wouldn't be so generous.
Post by: Gerrin on February 15, 2021, 05:05:32 PM
Barkley will be so far down the list of attacking midfielders for England I bet even Steven Gerrard is ahead of him. He's about as much competition for Jack's place as I am.
I don't think he was ever going to make it into Southgate's reckoning. England has more than likely past him by now.
If we don't sign him, hard to see where his career goes next. I dare say at some point he'll have a second stint at Everton before the end of his career.
Post by: Drummond on February 15, 2021, 05:15:23 PM
Post by: Risso on February 15, 2021, 05:19:20 PM
Newcastle. Everton have Ancelotti and he's unlikely to want him.
That's a good guess. He's basically an upgraded Jonjo Shelvey. Capable of smashing one in from 25 yards, but mostly doing next to bugger all.
Post by: ChicagoLion on February 15, 2021, 07:58:46 PM
Post by: cdbearsfan on February 15, 2021, 08:32:58 PM
He’s going through a rough spell and DS has indicated he’s not yet at 100% fitness. He was terrific when he first came but looks off the pace now as have the team lately.
Let’s all take a breath. Maybe we shouldn’t be making any snap judgments based on a few poor weeks, 1 in which he scored the winner don’t forget.
I still think he’s a player I’d be more than happy to have, just depends on how much Chelsea want for him.
I'm more than happy not to write him off. As you say, he has already had plenty of good moments in a Villa shirt. On current form though, I feel he should be dropped to the bench. He's said himself he likes playing against tired legs, and it would be nice to have a sub that could, potentially, worry the opposition for once.
I wouldn't be in any hurry to sign him for silly money, but he could always convince me with a run of form before the end of the season.
Post by: brontebilly on February 15, 2021, 10:34:56 PM
Newcastle. Everton have Ancelotti and he's unlikely to want him.
That's a good guess. He's basically an upgraded Jonjo Shelvey. Capable of smashing one in from 25 yards, but mostly doing next to bugger all.
Was thinking the same watching Shelvey tonight. Another one that wants an armchair ride in midfield. Won't run, tackle, track runs.
Post by: danno on February 15, 2021, 10:42:01 PM
Post by: ktvillan on February 16, 2021, 09:46:20 AM
He has two settings - brilliant and awful, not much in between.
The brilliant / awful ratio is not looking anything like good enough currently, and we don't have a big or good enough squad to be able to live with that sort of non-delivery.
For me, based on events thus far, I wouldn't make the deal permanent.
Pretty much what I said a couple of weeks ago he's either 9 out of 10 or 2 out of 10, very little in between. Whereas with someone like Mcginn or Luiz you will get an average of 7 with the odd 9 or 5 chucked in every now and then.
Post by: eamonn on February 16, 2021, 10:00:49 AM
Post by: Risso on February 16, 2021, 10:12:58 AM
McGinn and Luiz have been 5s and 6s quite a lot recently imo (possibly caused by Barkley Big Balls ahead of them not helping out).
It's a good point eamonn. Both have curbed their natural attacking instincts, which is fine, but only really works if the actual attacking players are doing their jobs. Traore is very hit and miss, and Barkley has gone AWOL.
Post by: Ian. on February 16, 2021, 10:35:49 AM
McGinn and Luiz have been 5s and 6s quite a lot recently imo (possibly caused by Barkley Big Balls ahead of them not helping out).Definitely, before our Covid Break McGinn and Luiz were playing very well, not sure if it’s related to that or Barkley being back in the side and upsetting the balance, or extra work they are putting in defensively.
Post by: Andy_Lochhead_in_the_air on February 16, 2021, 04:26:19 PM
Missing vowels. Singers crossed with footballers.
DNR SSB RK LY
https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/m000scp6/only-connect-series-16-22-sliders-v-puzzle-hunters (27 mins 10 seconds)
Lo and behold, less than 15 minutes later
Pairs of names or titles where the last word of the first answer gives the first word of the second answer.
"The play by Shakespeare where Bolingbroke is exiled and a local derby between Birmingham City and Aston Villa".
https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/m000scpb/university-challenge-202021-episode-30 (10 mins 40 seconds)
Post by: Mister E on February 16, 2021, 06:42:44 PM
"The play by Shakespeare where Bolingbroke is exiled and a local derby between Birmingham City and Aston Villa".Students not knowing that Birmingham is the 2nd City is pretty bad!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/m000scpb/university-challenge-202021-episode-30 (10 mins 40 seconds)
Post by: Mister E on February 16, 2021, 06:43:33 PM
Must say I was surprised that he was in the thoughts of the lovely Victoria Coren Mitchell on Only Connect last night.Oh, VC Mitchell ... drools.
Missing vowels. Singers crossed with footballers.
DNR SSB RK LY
Post by: CT on February 21, 2021, 03:59:46 PM
I’ve seen enough, thanks Ross. Look at the energy for the last 15 minutes.
Post by: aev on February 21, 2021, 04:00:28 PM
Post by: Risso on February 21, 2021, 04:01:06 PM
Post by: Nunkin1965 on February 21, 2021, 04:01:18 PM
Both brought energy to the side.
Post by: olaftab on February 21, 2021, 04:01:32 PM
Post by: mr underhill on February 21, 2021, 04:02:07 PM
Post by: colin69 on February 21, 2021, 04:03:01 PM
Post by: richtheholtender on February 21, 2021, 04:04:35 PM
Post by: Tuscans on February 21, 2021, 04:04:51 PM
Post by: Goldie.7 on February 21, 2021, 04:05:13 PM
Lost possession twice in the first half and three times after the break.
Post by: bilsim on February 21, 2021, 04:05:52 PM
Post by: LukeJames on February 21, 2021, 04:06:03 PM
Post by: Nii Lamptey on February 21, 2021, 04:06:15 PM
Ramsay offered more in that last 15 mins than Barkley has in most of his time in a villa shirt.
Needs to be dropped against Leeds. Showing nowhere near enough fight or fitness to be in the starting eleven.
Sanson or Ramsay need to be starting in his place. Thanks very much Chelsea, but no thanks. ☹️
Post by: Stinkin_Thinkin on February 21, 2021, 04:06:32 PM
waste of talent, English lads like maddison barnes even lingard light years ahead of him now. MLS or SPL.
Post by: andyh on February 21, 2021, 04:07:19 PM
We’ll be able to send him back.
Post by: stubbsyandy on February 21, 2021, 04:07:32 PM
He’s on loan, with no option to buy. He has offered nothing since the first Leicester game (his 2nd match for us), and we shouldn’t (*and can’t!) afford to carry him on the hope he hits some kind of form.
Ramsay offered more in that last 15 mins than Barkley has in most of his time in a villa shirt.
Needs to be dropped against Leeds. Showing nowhere near enough fight or fitness to be in the starting eleven.
Sanson or Ramsay need to be starting in his place. Thanks very much Chelsea, but no thanks. ☹️
Agreed
Post by: German James on February 21, 2021, 04:07:58 PM
Post by: TelfordVilla on February 21, 2021, 04:09:06 PM
Post by: Duncan Shaw on February 21, 2021, 04:09:29 PM
+1He’s on loan, with no option to buy. He has offered nothing since the first Leicester game (his 2nd match for us), and we shouldn’t (*and can’t!) afford to carry him on the hope he hits some kind of form.
Ramsay offered more in that last 15 mins than Barkley has in most of his time in a villa shirt.
Needs to be dropped against Leeds. Showing nowhere near enough fight or fitness to be in the starting eleven.
Sanson or Ramsay need to be starting in his place. Thanks very much Chelsea, but no thanks. ☹️
Agreed
Post by: Bobby Boy on February 21, 2021, 04:09:50 PM
Dean has defended Barkley but needs to explain what he is doing on the pitch to justify his place. It isn't a neutral selection. It is damaging our chances.
Post by: brontebilly on February 21, 2021, 04:10:04 PM
A diabolical professional. 27 years old, won't track any opponents runs as seen with both Leicester goals today and behaves like a child once again after being taken off. Get rid, asap.
Post by: jwarry on February 21, 2021, 04:10:36 PM
Post by: Rudy65 on February 21, 2021, 04:10:48 PM
Post by: Ads on February 21, 2021, 04:11:15 PM
Post by: SoccerHQ on February 21, 2021, 04:11:33 PM
Pass up and give Traore more creative responsibility and use money to get another striker in.
Post by: andyh on February 21, 2021, 04:12:16 PM
I know one thing. He wouldn’t have sat down next to the Holte to take his boots off if the fans had been there.Bloody good point !
Post by: levico on February 21, 2021, 04:12:31 PM
Post by: danno on February 21, 2021, 04:13:45 PM
He needs dropping, or Mings needs to kick him ten feet up in the air in training.
Post by: Drummond on February 21, 2021, 04:13:55 PM
Post by: J on February 21, 2021, 04:14:11 PM
Post by: taylorsworkrate on February 21, 2021, 04:15:51 PM
I just don't think he's fit. Physically or mentally.
That and his actual ability is considerably overrated
Post by: andyh on February 21, 2021, 04:18:14 PM
I just don't think he's fit. Physically or mentally.How long is allowed to have the not quite fit excuse?
He had stopped tracking players within 5 minutes of kick off.
Post by: Stinkin_Thinkin on February 21, 2021, 04:18:23 PM
Post by: brontebilly on February 21, 2021, 04:18:48 PM
I just don't think he's fit. Physically or mentally.
That and his actual ability is considerably overrated
He hasn't been anything other than average for a number of seasons. I was against signing him from the start for this reason.
Post by: manic-road on February 21, 2021, 04:20:16 PM
Post by: villa `cross the mersey on February 21, 2021, 04:20:19 PM
Physique - bloated
Transfer value - over inflated
I bet he still plays next week
Post by: Tuscans on February 21, 2021, 04:22:52 PM
Ability - over ratedHa Ha, probably.
Physique - bloated
Transfer value - over inflated
I bet he still plays next week
Post by: Bobby Boy on February 21, 2021, 04:28:19 PM
Post by: Risso on February 21, 2021, 04:32:38 PM
Post by: Dante Lavelli on February 21, 2021, 04:34:08 PM
We should be grateful that he’s not on a fat four year contract. Similarly, with Mings we were happy to pay a premium because we knew he’d ‘fit’. We should be doing this every year despite Barkley being a flop.
Post by: TonyD on February 21, 2021, 04:34:44 PM
It’s a pity as there is a good player in there somewhere.
Luckily we have Ramsey. You can just see he is going to awesome. Needs game time.
Post by: brontebilly on February 21, 2021, 04:37:38 PM
Instead of wasting time persisting with this overweight sad sack, why don't we invest the time into Jacob Ramsey instead? We're surely not going to buy Barkley at the end of the season, and he's providing absolutely nothing in terms of contribution on the pitch, so call time on it, and send him back to Chelsea. We've got options without him, like playing McGinn in a role further forward, or developing Ramsey as already suggested.
Agreed, we don't need him on the pitch and with an attitude like that the last thing we need is someone like him off the pitch. His career is in freefall now.
Post by: Monty on February 21, 2021, 04:43:00 PM
Post by: AV82EC on February 21, 2021, 04:43:08 PM
Post by: junxs on February 21, 2021, 04:47:08 PM
Post by: wittonwarrior on February 21, 2021, 04:51:11 PM
Post by: Risso on February 21, 2021, 05:01:03 PM
People going over the top on Barkley I feel. He was good up to his injury, and has seriously struggled since coming back. He shouldn't start vs. Leeds, but some of this stuff is too much.
Come off it Monty, he's been dreadful and if anything is getting off lightly. He's been shit, but still has the temerity to act like a sulky toddler when subbed off. As somebody said earlier, if he tried that shit in front of a full Villa park he'd soon learn the error of his ways. It hasn't worked, send him back.
Post by: Meanwood Villa on February 21, 2021, 05:03:03 PM
Post by: villa `cross the mersey on February 21, 2021, 05:05:02 PM
Post by: Abbeyfealeavfc on February 21, 2021, 05:28:30 PM
The guy needs benching at the very least. He offers nothing and has contributed to the lack of cohesion in our midfield 3.
I don't really want to see any more loans again if they come with conditions (I'm guessing loaning Barkley has some).
Aston Villa should not be used by a player attached to a different club to further their international ambitions at the expense of our team (especially when they are so lacking). We are better than that. Besides we have our own players we need to be giving game time to to further their ambitions
Post by: Tuscans on February 21, 2021, 05:32:01 PM
Can't change my mind on someone because he plays for Villa now until he shows me something on the pitch like Lingard is doing right now at West Ham.
Post by: Ads on February 21, 2021, 05:32:23 PM
Post by: Tuscans on February 21, 2021, 05:33:37 PM
Did Barkley throw a strop when subbed again (I only saw up to the 65th min)?Head down, sitting on the advertising boards, taking one boots off then walking to the corner, taking another boot off, then sat back down, took a sock off and on and on and on it went until he got to the dug out.
The guy needs benching at the very least. He offers nothing and has contributed to the lack of cohesion in our midfield 3.
I don't really want to see any more loans again if they come with conditions (I'm guessing loaning Barkley has some).
Aston Villa should not be used by a player attached to a different club to further their international ambitions at the expense of our team (especially when they are so lacking). We are better than that. Besides we have our own players we need to be giving game time to to further their ambitions
Post by: Duncan Shaw on February 21, 2021, 05:34:54 PM
Post by: Tuscans on February 21, 2021, 05:39:26 PM
When you look at the difference between the impact he is having on us and that of Lingard as West Ham it is really quite staggeringAttitude. One's realised his career is heading in the wilderness, the penny hasn't dropped for the other.
Post by: simboy on February 21, 2021, 05:41:20 PM
When you look at the difference between the impact he is having on us and that of Lingard as West Ham it is really quite staggering
That’s harsh. You’re forgetting goals against Leicester and Southampton that won games and against Liverpool he was awesome, creating a number of goals.
Accept he’s poor at the minute but he’s played more than Lingard and contributed more than him this season.
Mind you I’d drop him for Ramsey next game.
Post by: Abbeyfealeavfc on February 21, 2021, 05:42:30 PM
Did Barkley throw a strop when subbed again (I only saw up to the 65th min)?Head down, sitting on the advertising boards, taking one boots off then walking to the corner, taking another boot off, then sat back down, took a sock off and on and on and on it went until he got to the dug out.
The guy needs benching at the very least. He offers nothing and has contributed to the lack of cohesion in our midfield 3.
I don't really want to see any more loans again if they come with conditions (I'm guessing loaning Barkley has some).
Aston Villa should not be used by a player attached to a different club to further their international ambitions at the expense of our team (especially when they are so lacking). We are better than that. Besides we have our own players we need to be giving game time to to further their ambitions
Thanks Tuscans.
By the sounds of it, the most deliberate thing he did all game.
Post by: Tuscans on February 21, 2021, 05:47:21 PM
That's not true. Both have 3 goals and one assist.When you look at the difference between the impact he is having on us and that of Lingard as West Ham it is really quite staggering
That’s harsh. You’re forgetting goals against Leicester and Southampton that won games and against Liverpool he was awesome, creating a number of goals.
Accept he’s poor at the minute but he’s played more than Lingard and contributed more than him this season.
Mind you I’d drop him for Ramsey next game.
Post by: SoccerHQ on February 21, 2021, 05:52:07 PM
Did Barkley throw a strop when subbed again (I only saw up to the 65th min)?Head down, sitting on the advertising boards, taking one boots off then walking to the corner, taking another boot off, then sat back down, took a sock off and on and on and on it went until he got to the dug out.
The guy needs benching at the very least. He offers nothing and has contributed to the lack of cohesion in our midfield 3.
I don't really want to see any more loans again if they come with conditions (I'm guessing loaning Barkley has some).
Aston Villa should not be used by a player attached to a different club to further their international ambitions at the expense of our team (especially when they are so lacking). We are better than that. Besides we have our own players we need to be giving game time to to further their ambitions
It's annoying me tbh. Of course no player should be happy subbed and you can understand it if a player one week feels he hasn't done himself justice but he's done this 3-4 times in last month now.
Did he do this every time he was subbed for Chelsea last season? I imagine he just jogged off the pitch so think in his mind it's a status issue and he should be left on as long as possible as we don't have the quality Chelsea do.
Post by: AV82EC on February 21, 2021, 05:55:20 PM
Post by: Mellin on February 21, 2021, 05:58:28 PM
Post by: taylorsworkrate on February 21, 2021, 05:59:05 PM
Post by: Andy_Lochhead_in_the_air on February 21, 2021, 06:00:31 PM
I suggest he starts putting in 110% effort on the training ground and (if selected) on match days, he may then find his form starts to improve.
Post by: Tuscans on February 21, 2021, 06:04:35 PM
Could be. Obviously we don't know him but he does act like how dare you sub me, do you know who I am? He has the Ozils about him, just worse.Did Barkley throw a strop when subbed again (I only saw up to the 65th min)?Head down, sitting on the advertising boards, taking one boots off then walking to the corner, taking another boot off, then sat back down, took a sock off and on and on and on it went until he got to the dug out.
The guy needs benching at the very least. He offers nothing and has contributed to the lack of cohesion in our midfield 3.
I don't really want to see any more loans again if they come with conditions (I'm guessing loaning Barkley has some).
Aston Villa should not be used by a player attached to a different club to further their international ambitions at the expense of our team (especially when they are so lacking). We are better than that. Besides we have our own players we need to be giving game time to to further their ambitions
It's annoying me tbh. Of course no player should be happy subbed and you can understand it if a player one week feels he hasn't done himself justice but he's done this 3-4 times in last month now.
Did he do this every time he was subbed for Chelsea last season? I imagine he just jogged off the pitch so think in his mind it's a status issue and he should be left on as long as possible as we don't have the quality Chelsea do.
Post by: simboy on February 21, 2021, 06:04:47 PM
That's not true. Both have 3 goals and one assist.When you look at the difference between the impact he is having on us and that of Lingard as West Ham it is really quite staggering
That’s harsh. You’re forgetting goals against Leicester and Southampton that won games and against Liverpool he was awesome, creating a number of goals.
Accept he’s poor at the minute but he’s played more than Lingard and contributed more than him this season.
Mind you I’d drop him for Ramsey next game.
However, you could argue scoring the goal in a 1-0 win is more beneficial. In truth comparison of impact has to be over all games played not just the last three or four, Barkley was played in a more withdrawn role for some of his games than Lingard, so clean sheets?
Hes contributed but that has fallen off a cliff since the injury and then the COVID outbreak. That doesn’t mean he should get sympathy, as he’s been poor by the standards we expected over the last few games.
Post by: Andy_Lochhead_in_the_air on February 21, 2021, 06:15:05 PM
He suffers from asthma, maybe he doesn't have it in the tank anymore.
Beckham, Paula Radcliffe, Mo Farah.
Post by: Aldridge Villa on February 21, 2021, 06:20:02 PM
Post by: Duncan Shaw on February 21, 2021, 06:25:09 PM
That's not true. Both have 3 goals and one assist.When you look at the difference between the impact he is having on us and that of Lingard as West Ham it is really quite staggering
That’s harsh. You’re forgetting goals against Leicester and Southampton that won games and against Liverpool he was awesome, creating a number of goals.
Accept he’s poor at the minute but he’s played more than Lingard and contributed more than him this season.
Mind you I’d drop him for Ramsey next game.
However, you could argue scoring the goal in a 1-0 win is more beneficial. In truth comparison of impact has to be over all games played not just the last three or four, Barkley was played in a more withdrawn role for some of his games than Lingard, so clean sheets?
Hes contributed but that has fallen off a cliff since the injury and then the COVID outbreak. That doesn’t mean he should get sympathy, as he’s been poor by the standards we expected over the last few games.
Let's see if Lingard's contribution now falls off a cliff
Post by: aj2k77 on February 21, 2021, 06:27:47 PM
Post by: Nunkin1965 on February 21, 2021, 06:30:55 PM
I feel his antics when subbed are borne out of frustration with his own performance levels as opposed to any petulance in the direction of the management. He knows that a decent start to the season is slowly being frittered away to the point of no return to B6 next season. With that in mind , he has my sympathy but no way is he good enough nor fit enough at present.
I agree with this.
I think he's seeing his England chance disappear after a promising start to his Villa loan spell.
It may change for him but now there is competition for his place big time and he's struggling to find an answer to keep his place in the starting 11.
Post by: danno on February 21, 2021, 06:32:56 PM
Grealish did it against Newcastle, but given that he's captain, given that he saw how the newspapers misrepresented his spat with Ian Woan, I'd be amazed he'd be naive or irresponsible enough to do that again.
With Barkley though, it's not a one off from him. The Sky cameras were looking for it given his reaction to being subbed against Arsenal.
A bad run of results, and clips of his tantrums will be held up as proof our dressing room is in disarray.
Far as Im concerned he can jog on. He's good at jogging.
Post by: simboy on February 21, 2021, 06:33:24 PM
That's not true. Both have 3 goals and one assist.When you look at the difference between the impact he is having on us and that of Lingard as West Ham it is really quite staggering
That’s harsh. You’re forgetting goals against Leicester and Southampton that won games and against Liverpool he was awesome, creating a number of goals.
Accept he’s poor at the minute but he’s played more than Lingard and contributed more than him this season.
Mind you I’d drop him for Ramsey next game.
However, you could argue scoring the goal in a 1-0 win is more beneficial. In truth comparison of impact has to be over all games played not just the last three or four, Barkley was played in a more withdrawn role for some of his games than Lingard, so clean sheets?
Hes contributed but that has fallen off a cliff since the injury and then the COVID outbreak. That doesn’t mean he should get sympathy, as he’s been poor by the standards we expected over the last few games.
Let's see if Lingard's contribution now falls off a cliff
Why? Who cares if it does or doesn’t.
Post by: OCD on February 21, 2021, 06:53:15 PM
Post by: RichardBatchelor on February 21, 2021, 07:03:21 PM
Post by: tomd2103 on February 21, 2021, 07:14:13 PM
Taking 5 minutes to come off the side of the pitch is all a bit 'woe is me' and focussing the attention on himself rather than just being a good pro and getting off the pitch quickly and supporting your teammates.
It was bizarre behaviour really and was like something you would see in a training game. Not sure his walk past the Holte after that performance would have been that slow if it had been full!!
Post by: Mister E on February 21, 2021, 07:16:04 PM
Let's have some energy from Ramsey to start.
Post by: Des Little on February 21, 2021, 08:11:53 PM
Post by: Malandro on February 21, 2021, 08:30:23 PM
Post by: Toronto Villa on February 21, 2021, 08:36:57 PM
Post by: ChicagoLion on February 21, 2021, 08:39:18 PM
Which is it?
Post by: dave.woodhall on February 21, 2021, 08:46:04 PM
Either Smith has a total blind spot or his contract stipulates he plays if he declares himself fit.
Which is it?
Have you ever thought it might be neither?
Post by: ChicagoLion on February 21, 2021, 08:49:12 PM
I am struggling to come up with an alternative.Either Smith has a total blind spot or his contract stipulates he plays if he declares himself fit.
Which is it?
Have you ever thought it might be neither?
Post by: Flamingo Lane on February 21, 2021, 09:22:31 PM
Post by: Bryan on February 21, 2021, 10:34:53 PM
He had 3 goals and 1 assist all season.
Tyrone Ming’s has 2 goals and 2 assists and he doesn’t play at 10 in an attacking minded team.
Get rid. Get better. But more importantly, get him out of the team now for Sansom, Ramsey, El Ghazi or Trez
Post by: olaftab on February 21, 2021, 11:06:50 PM
Post by: Hillbilly on February 22, 2021, 12:49:46 AM
Post by: Allan C on February 22, 2021, 02:02:08 AM
Either Smith has a total blind spot or his contract stipulates he plays if he declares himself fit.Neither
Which is it?
Post by: Sexual Ealing on February 22, 2021, 03:48:28 AM
He's probably looked at Chelsea under Tuchel and realised he's got no place there. He's most likely to end up in the north east somewhere.
Perhaps if Sunderland are promoted or Newcastle relegated.
Post by: Three Spires Villa on February 22, 2021, 06:52:17 AM
Either Smith has a total blind spot or his contract stipulates he plays if he declares himself fit.Neither
Which is it?
So what is it then?
It’s not he has to play?
It’s not Dean wants him to play?
Err it has to be one of the two options. I don’t think we would be stupid enough to agree to a clause saying Ross has to play (would we?) so that means Dean wants to start him, as Dean picks the team
Post by: sid1964 on February 22, 2021, 07:11:42 AM
Post by: Drummond on February 22, 2021, 07:52:55 AM
The worry is that Smith is trying to play him into fitness, a bit like he did with Drinkwater. Of course in the latter's case, it was never going to come whereas we've already seen some great stuff from Barkley.
Post by: Mister E on February 22, 2021, 08:00:07 AM
He's clearly not a bad player, regardless of what many people want to say. As I've said before, I think the issue here is that he's not fit. I'd say mentally as well as physically.I think this is probably right, Drummond, re Smith trying to play him into fitness.
The worry is that Smith is trying to play him into fitness, a bit like he did with Drinkwater. Of course in the latter's case, it was never going to come whereas we've already seen some great stuff from Barkley.
Post by: Bobby Boy on February 22, 2021, 08:16:32 AM
I am struggling to come up with an alternative.Either Smith has a total blind spot or his contract stipulates he plays if he declares himself fit.
Which is it?
Have you ever thought it might be neither?
I don't know whether loan players have ever had it in their contracts that if fit then they have to play. When West Brom were playing West Ham recently West Brom were unable to play Robert Snodgrass who they'd just bought from West Ham on a permanent deal as it was a term in the deal.
I'm more intrigued by the consequences of reneging on such a deal if it were to exist.
An agreed fine?
An immediate termination of the loan agreement?
Hmmm........
Post by: mr underhill on February 22, 2021, 08:18:15 AM
Post by: Ian. on February 22, 2021, 08:22:03 AM
This may account for his frustration when he’s substituted. In his mind and Smith’s another game passed when it’s not clicked for him and to justify this method.He's clearly not a bad player, regardless of what many people want to say. As I've said before, I think the issue here is that he's not fit. I'd say mentally as well as physically.I think this is probably right, Drummond, re Smith trying to pay him into fitness.
The worry is that Smith is trying to play him into fitness, a bit like he did with Drinkwater. Of course in the latter's case, it was never going to come whereas we've already seen some great stuff from Barkley.
Post by: Ian. on February 22, 2021, 08:25:48 AM
We need to be a little more flexible with our shape. This is probably far more so in this division than Smith may be used to. He’s hopefully learning this too and will have to think about it more than just keep sticking by the same eleven week in week out.
Post by: ChicagoLion on February 22, 2021, 09:35:43 AM
:oEither Smith has a total blind spot or his contract stipulates he plays if he declares himself fit.Neither
Which is it?
Post by: aj2k77 on February 22, 2021, 09:42:18 AM
Post by: Smithy on February 22, 2021, 09:45:17 AM
I'd say he's playing himself out of a permanent move at the minute, which is a massive shame, because the Ross Barkley of his first half-dozen or so games would be a massive asset to the club. The Barkley of the last half-dozen or so games would struggle to get in a lower-midtable side.
At his age, he's unlikely to become a much better player than he is right now, so it's all about consistency because his good performances are still very, very good. But, if at 27 we can only rely on him to put in a performance once every three or four games, then I can't see him becoming someone we can rely on week in, week out?
Post by: aj2k77 on February 22, 2021, 09:54:35 AM
Post by: ChicagoLion on February 22, 2021, 09:55:09 AM
Post by: Abbeyfealeavfc on February 22, 2021, 10:34:29 AM
...the Ross Barkley of his first half-dozen or so games would be a massive asset to the club. The Barkley of the last half-dozen or so games would struggle to get in a lower-midtable side.
I'm struggling with "the Ross Barkley of his 1st half dozen games"
Against L'pool it was clear he was playing off Ollie and had no midfield responsibilities at all. He got one goal but should have had 3 or 4. L'pool playing such a high line and the Villa team doing no wrong that day contributed to the 7-2.
Teams that don't play a high line and forces us to press around their penalty area show up Barkley's shortcomings and the huge gap between him and the rest of midfield.
I didn't see the Leicester game but I'm sure reports at that time said he hadn't played well, but he got the winner. I also didn't see the Soton home loss or the win at Arsenal. Did he play well against a team we went 4-0 down to? I'll bow to better judgements re Arsenal.
Leeds at home he was poor and contributed to at least one of their goals.
As we all know he only lasted 2 mins versus Brighton despite not playing for 2 weeks due to internationals, giving him plenty of time to improve his fitness. I know hamstrings can go at any time, but in that Brighton game he hadn't even extended himself.
I'm not convinced his 1st 6 games were all that and the Ross Barkley we've been seeing for a while is the real Barkley as a player, who clearly isn't good enough for Villa and certainly not worth the figures being quoted for him imo.
Post by: Pat Mustard on February 22, 2021, 10:37:42 AM
I have always believed there is an underlying fitness problem. At 27 he should be at his peak.
Something isn't right with him, he looks knackered after 5 minutes despite hardly ever breaking into a sprint as far as I can see. He doesn't track back, and yet when we break forward he is nowhere near close enough to Watkins to provide meaningful support. He constantly looks like he is running through quicksand to me, and shouldn't be starting games ahead of Sanson, Ramsey or Nakamba.
Post by: thick_mike on February 22, 2021, 10:39:38 AM
I have always believed there is an underlying fitness problem. At 27 he should be at his peak.
Something isn't right with him, he looks knackered after 5 minutes despite hardly ever breaking into a sprint as far as I can see. He doesn't track back, and yet when we break forward he is nowhere near close enough to Watkins to provide meaningful support. He constantly looks like he is running through quicksand to me, and shouldn't be starting games ahead of Sanson, Ramsey or Nakamba.
Agreed, he looks knackered all the time.
Post by: eamonn on February 22, 2021, 10:44:44 AM
Post by: Ian. on February 22, 2021, 10:50:46 AM
Post by: spartacuss on February 22, 2021, 11:05:57 AM
D.S. now needs to re-calibrate him as an impact sub with a firm requirement for him to make a difference rather than coast through his limited time on the pitch. He's got to put himself 'back in the shop window' and prove his capabilities rather than being judged by his provenance as having a 'big club' valuation/reputation.
Post by: Risso on February 22, 2021, 11:24:33 AM
Post by: brontebilly on February 22, 2021, 11:42:49 AM
I have always believed there is an underlying fitness problem. At 27 he should be at his peak.
There's an underlying attitude and application problem with him that he has had for years. It's why he never kicked on from a promising young player at Everton.
Like with the OP, I'm not buying the narrative that it's only since Barkley's injury that his form has become a problem. He was appalling in the home defeats to Leeds and Southampton, check back those match threads and you'll see ratings of 3 and 4.
Smith had a chance to lay down a marker then with Barkley then, I'm fairly sure for the Leeds game he was terrible for one or two goals by not bothering to track a runner. Instead he was given 90 mins in both those games and his laziness was tolerated.
Ross Barkley is nowhere near good enough to be given an armchair role in our team and we arent good enough to carry him. The penny should have dropped with him years ago (Conte treated him as a joke player at Chelsea for example) but evidently it still hasn't. Clearly hasn't much respect for Smith or the club if his repeated antics after being deservedly taken off are anything to go by.
Post by: Sexual Ealing on February 22, 2021, 11:52:13 AM
Post by: Risso on February 22, 2021, 11:54:52 AM
I have always believed there is an underlying fitness problem. At 27 he should be at his peak.
There's an underlying attitude and application problem with him that he has had for years. It's why he never kicked on from a promising young player at Everton.
Like with the OP, I'm not buying the narrative that it's only since Barkley's injury that his form has become a problem. He was appalling in the home defeats to Leeds and Southampton, check back those match threads and you'll see ratings of 3 and 4.
Smith had a chance to lay down a marker then with Barkley then, I'm fairly sure for the Leeds game he was terrible for one or two goals by not bothering to track a runner. Instead he was given 90 mins in both those games and his laziness was tolerated.
Ross Barkley is nowhere near good enough to be given an armchair role in our team and we arent good enough to carry him. The penny should have dropped with him years ago (Conte treated him as a joke player at Chelsea for example) but evidently it still hasn't. Clearly hasn't much respect for Smith or the club if his repeated antics after being deservedly taken off are anything to go by.
A fair summary there BB.
Post by: Bobby Boy on February 22, 2021, 12:09:53 PM
I have always believed there is an underlying fitness problem. At 27 he should be at his peak.
There's an underlying attitude and application problem with him that he has had for years. It's why he never kicked on from a promising young player at Everton.
Like with the OP, I'm not buying the narrative that it's only since Barkley's injury that his form has become a problem. He was appalling in the home defeats to Leeds and Southampton, check back those match threads and you'll see ratings of 3 and 4.
Smith had a chance to lay down a marker then with Barkley then, I'm fairly sure for the Leeds game he was terrible for one or two goals by not bothering to track a runner. Instead he was given 90 mins in both those games and his laziness was tolerated.
Ross Barkley is nowhere near good enough to be given an armchair role in our team and we arent good enough to carry him. The penny should have dropped with him years ago (Conte treated him as a joke player at Chelsea for example) but evidently it still hasn't. Clearly hasn't much respect for Smith or the club if his repeated antics after being deservedly taken off are anything to go by.
A fair summary there BB.
Yup. Pretty much nails it.
Post by: pauliewalnuts on February 22, 2021, 12:12:02 PM
Too much of the latter, not enough of the former of late.
Post by: ChicagoLion on February 22, 2021, 12:23:01 PM
If Smith starts Barkley against Leeds he wants a slap round the face with a wet fish. We can't afford any passengers whatsoever against arguably the hardest working side in the Premier League. At least with Traore you get a bit of unpredicatability and goal threat, but we can't afford two players who aren't known for their defensive capabilities, especially when one of them isn't contributing in any sense at all.and you definitely can not start with both of them and Traore is far more productive.
Post by: Bobby Boy on February 22, 2021, 12:28:59 PM
With Barclay;
W 6
D 1
L 7
Without Barkley;
W 5
D 2
L 2
Post by: exigo on February 22, 2021, 01:33:48 PM
(https://i.ibb.co/vYYk1DF/Screen-Shot-2021-02-22-at-13-33-03.png) (https://ibb.co/vYYk1DF)
Post by: Three Spires Villa on February 22, 2021, 01:34:09 PM
Villa's Premier League results this season:
With Barclay;
W 6
D 1
L 7
Without Barkley;
W 5
D 2
L 2
Wow Ok
Post by: placeforparks on February 22, 2021, 02:39:33 PM
Clearly hasn't much respect for Smith or the club if his repeated antics after being deservedly taken off are anything to go by.
agreed. i wonder how a full villa park would have reacted to some of his recent performances and reactions at being subbed?
Post by: brontebilly on February 22, 2021, 03:05:16 PM
Clearly hasn't much respect for Smith or the club if his repeated antics after being deservedly taken off are anything to go by.
agreed. i wonder how a full villa park would have reacted to some of his recent performances and reactions at being subbed?
Well if he had tried sitting down on the advertising hoardings in front of a packed Holte End, I suspect he wouldn't be togging out for us again!
This isn't a kid either, he's 27 ffs, involved in top level football for nearly 10 years. There are no excuses. Shouldn't even need Smith to tear him a new one. Senior pros like Mings and Grealish should be letting him know that he is firmly at a career cross roads right now and his conduct on the pitch isn't remotely acceptable.
Post by: ChicagoLion on February 22, 2021, 03:07:30 PM
It was very strange knowing the cameras were bound to pick it up.
Post by: paul_e on February 22, 2021, 03:07:31 PM
Having a player like Barkley or Traore is a trade off, you sacrifice some defensive stability for a bit more creativity at the other end. Traore has, generally, paid back his part by being involved in creating and taking chances. Barkley just isn't doing that, he's not making us a better team going forward so his lack of effort coming back is all the more noticeable. I had issues with signing him in the summer (either on this thread or the general transfer thread) and they were about this exact thing, at Chelsea he developed a bad habit of doing very little to impact games if he wasn't scoring or creating goals. In his first few games with us he went totally the other way, he was involved in play much more, he was making smart runs off the ball to open space and he was picking key passes in the build up as well. Since he came back from his injury he's done none of that, he's a completely different player and I think it's a lot more than merely fitness.
As it stands I'd be upset if we paid £10-12m for him let alone the £40m that is supposedly being asked, I just don't trust him not to play like this for long spells because it's what he's done for about 4 years now.
Post by: danno on February 22, 2021, 03:13:44 PM
I can put up with people not playing well, but the pantomime stuff when he's taken off is clip round the ear territory.
Post by: CT Villan on February 22, 2021, 03:28:01 PM
Ross is playing like shit to get Chelsea to drop the price. We pay 5m in the Summer then he plays to his full potential and we suddenly have a 50m player.
I'll get my coat.
Post by: Risso on February 22, 2021, 03:28:41 PM
"It's a long way off the mark to say things aren't working out for him," Smith reiterated, with the reporter suggesting things aren't quite going to plan for the England hopeful. "He had just been substituted after 73 full minutes.
"His numbers have been really good in terms of his output on the pitch and we have to remember he's been out for six or seven weeks with a hamstring injury and then had to play games to recapture that fitness because we haven't been able to train."
In terms of output he's been dreadful, and he's played 8 games now since being injured, and if anything he's getting worse. We also haven't had a mid week game in nearly 3 weeks, so the "not training" excuse is wearing a bit thin.
Post by: Paulo on February 22, 2021, 03:51:40 PM
Villa's Premier League results this season:
With Barclay;
W 6
D 1
L 7
Without Barkley;
W 5
D 2
L 2
Wow Ok
We are clearly better without Barkley in the team. The 2 loses were against West Ham (where we dominated, missed a pen and had Watkins last minute goal disallowed) and Man utd (where I thought we matched an inform utd team).
We were playing some great stuff and dominating games with Jack in the middle. Shoehorning Barkley into the team has made our midfield weaker and Jack easier to take out of games.
Post by: aj2k77 on February 22, 2021, 04:09:50 PM
I hope Smith's comments are just him defending a player, because if not they're a bit concerning:
"It's a long way off the mark to say things aren't working out for him," Smith reiterated, with the reporter suggesting things aren't quite going to plan for the England hopeful. "He had just been substituted after 73 full minutes.
"His numbers have been really good in terms of his output on the pitch and we have to remember he's been out for six or seven weeks with a hamstring injury and then had to play games to recapture that fitness because we haven't been able to train."
In terms of output he's been dreadful, and he's played 8 games now since being injured, and if anything he's getting worse. We also haven't had a mid week game in nearly 3 weeks, so the "not training" excuse is wearing a bit thin.
How long do they want to be given after injuries? You can't take months to get back to fitness. Wesley's totally fucked if that's the case, he won't be fit until 2028.
Post by: LeeB on February 22, 2021, 04:49:12 PM
Behind closed doors I would hope it's being pointed out that we expect a lot more.
Post by: Mister E on February 22, 2021, 04:54:25 PM
Post by: olaftab on February 22, 2021, 05:08:59 PM
Villa's Premier League results this season:Well if with Barkley data was pandemic figures we will have to go into total lockdown.
With Barclay;
W 6
D 1
L 7
Without Barkley;
W 5
D 2
L 2
Post by: eamonn on February 22, 2021, 06:57:52 PM
Post by: villa `cross the mersey on February 22, 2021, 07:21:39 PM
I hope Smith's comments are just him defending a player, because if not they're a bit concerning:Those comments from Smith are a bit worrying ......Barkley seems to have some influence on his inclusion in the starting line up ......I do hope Smith is not being stubborn in respect of this particular player - would not be better to play Sanson (our player) for 70 mins and introduce Barkley for the last 20 - which is when he insists he is at his best (a strange statement declaring he is at his best playing against tired players - which I guess sums him up)
"It's a long way off the mark to say things aren't working out for him," Smith reiterated, with the reporter suggesting things aren't quite going to plan for the England hopeful. "He had just been substituted after 73 full minutes.
"His numbers have been really good in terms of his output on the pitch and we have to remember he's been out for six or seven weeks with a hamstring injury and then had to play games to recapture that fitness because we haven't been able to train."
In terms of output he's been dreadful, and he's played 8 games now since being injured, and if anything he's getting worse. We also haven't had a mid week game in nearly 3 weeks, so the "not training" excuse is wearing a bit thin.
Post by: eamonn on February 22, 2021, 11:32:59 PM
Post by: dave shelley on February 23, 2021, 09:11:32 AM
Did you ever bump into Ross, while out walking the dog, Clive ?
If he did then it's likely Barklay would have missed the next few games with injury.
Post by: richtheholtender on February 23, 2021, 10:47:20 AM
Post by: ColonelBarkley on February 23, 2021, 10:55:39 AM
I have noticed that the 9 for 5.99 at KFC has coincided with Ross poor fitness and disappearance on the pitch
Games up. You’ve caught me. Better take advantage - last day today 🍗🍗
Post by: Drummond on February 23, 2021, 11:11:19 AM
I hope Smith's comments are just him defending a player, because if not they're a bit concerning:Those comments from Smith are a bit worrying ......Barkley seems to have some influence on his inclusion in the starting line up ......I do hope Smith is not being stubborn in respect of this particular player - would not be better to play Sanson (our player) for 70 mins and introduce Barkley for the last 20 - which is when he insists he is at his best (a strange statement declaring he is at his best playing against tired players - which I guess sums him up)
"It's a long way off the mark to say things aren't working out for him," Smith reiterated, with the reporter suggesting things aren't quite going to plan for the England hopeful. "He had just been substituted after 73 full minutes.
"His numbers have been really good in terms of his output on the pitch and we have to remember he's been out for six or seven weeks with a hamstring injury and then had to play games to recapture that fitness because we haven't been able to train."
In terms of output he's been dreadful, and he's played 8 games now since being injured, and if anything he's getting worse. We also haven't had a mid week game in nearly 3 weeks, so the "not training" excuse is wearing a bit thin.
No they're not. What manager would publicly shame his players and still hold people's respect?
If, and it's a big if, Barkley gets up to speed, he could be brilliant for us. He's shown it already, however, can he do it consistently. I don't blame Smith for trying with him, though I'd also drop him to the bench for Saturday and bring him on later, if he can do damage in the last 15, then bring him on then!
Post by: JUAN PABLO on February 23, 2021, 11:15:55 AM
Post by: Risso on February 23, 2021, 11:21:34 AM
Post by: Drummond on February 23, 2021, 11:35:37 AM
Socks over the knees. Unless you're Thierry Henry, and even then it's only just acceptable, GTFO.
Maybe he's trying to impress Terry.
Post by: eamonn on February 23, 2021, 11:45:28 AM
Post by: LeeB on February 23, 2021, 01:15:16 PM
Doesn't Bert pull up his socks to the extent that there's little of his long legs to ogle?
It's ok for Bert, it's part of the ensemble. Everything he does is delightful, even his shanked clearances are elegant.
Post by: eamonn on February 23, 2021, 02:54:38 PM
*Sultans Of Ping FC (Forest fans but you can't win 'em all)
Post by: villa `cross the mersey on February 23, 2021, 05:36:13 PM
Ha ha - made me chuckle - I'm still waiting to have a chat with Jurgen after the Cup game ;)Did you ever bump into Ross, while out walking the dog, Clive ?
If he did then it's likely Barklay would have missed the next few games with injury.
Post by: villa `cross the mersey on February 26, 2021, 05:44:39 PM
Don't make him productive though Dean :(
I'm more convinced than ever that if he is "fit" he has to play
Post by: West Derby Villan on February 26, 2021, 05:45:41 PM
Post by: Pete3206 on February 26, 2021, 07:04:18 PM
Post by: Mister E on February 26, 2021, 07:08:44 PM
Good, he's currently one of the best players we have.at what?
Post by: paul_e on February 26, 2021, 07:17:36 PM
Good, he's currently one of the best players we have.
What are you basing that on?
Post by: levico on February 26, 2021, 07:37:17 PM
Post by: Border villan on February 26, 2021, 07:40:48 PM
Post by: Abbeyfealeavfc on February 26, 2021, 08:28:59 PM
I'd love to be proved wrong with a great performance and goal from Barkley with a Villa win. If he starts and doesn't play all that well irrespective of the result the pressure will only increase on him and Deano.
Post by: dorsetvillian on February 26, 2021, 08:34:02 PM
Post by: ChicagoLion on February 26, 2021, 08:35:08 PM
Good, he's currently one of the best players we have.when fit
Post by: eamonn on February 26, 2021, 10:59:52 PM
Post by: olaftab on February 26, 2021, 11:35:09 PM
Post by: rooboy316 on February 27, 2021, 12:58:37 AM
We once had an Australian player, Holman I think, who used to cover twice as much distance as any other player on the pitch whilst contributing nothing in defence or attack.He’d outrun Trez twice over in a game, such was his work rate. But he’d also make Trez look world class in terms of skill and composure, by comparison.
Post by: RamboandBruno on February 27, 2021, 09:26:42 AM
It’s hardly a shock is it.
Wouldn’t it be weaker or in fact just stupid management to publicly berate said big name player who is woefully out of form?
What’s more interesting than a press conference is if Smith drops or plays him and the reaction of the player, we’ll know how that’s all going by about 6pm tonight.
Post by: Rudy65 on February 27, 2021, 09:33:53 AM
I was confused by his exit, was he trying to get attention or was he just knackered?
It was very strange knowing the cameras were bound to pick it up.
100% wanted the attention. It’s why kids through themselves on the floor in supermarkets. In both cases you look ridiculous. Barkley is effectively saying to Smith, how dare you take me off, do you know who I am type of attitude.
Post by: Risso on February 27, 2021, 09:56:29 AM
I was confused by his exit, was he trying to get attention or was he just knackered?
It was very strange knowing the cameras were bound to pick it up.
100% wanted the attention. It’s why kids through themselves on the floor in supermarkets. In both cases you look ridiculous. Barkley is effectively saying to Smith, how dare you take me off, do you know who I am type of attitude.
Given that was the second such example, it makes Smith's continued defence of him a bit strange.
Post by: Drummond on February 27, 2021, 10:18:30 AM
I suspect Barkley is the sort of player who needs an arm round the shoulder and support rather than a dressing down. I hope Smith works it out because on form he could destroy a defence. He just needs to bloody prove it.
Post by: Flamingo Lane on February 27, 2021, 11:06:33 AM
Whatever the case, I will be very disappointed if he gets to start the game tonight given the consistently poor level of his performances since coming back from injury (and yes, I know he scored a goal in a game).
Post by: JUAN PABLO on February 27, 2021, 11:36:08 AM
Post by: Allan C on February 27, 2021, 12:14:51 PM
How can you possibly make that comment without knowing Barkley personally?? I’m more willing to believe that he is frustrated with his form which, like several others, is below parI was confused by his exit, was he trying to get attention or was he just knackered?
It was very strange knowing the cameras were bound to pick it up.
100% wanted the attention. It’s why kids through themselves on the floor in supermarkets. In both cases you look ridiculous. Barkley is effectively saying to Smith, how dare you take me off, do you know who I am type of attitude.
Post by: GordonCowansisthegreatest on February 27, 2021, 01:02:05 PM
He wouldn't make the bench if I had any say in the selection.
Post by: LeeB on February 27, 2021, 01:10:45 PM
Post by: JuanMartinez on February 27, 2021, 01:31:37 PM
He's been poor since coming back from injury, but I think some of the criticism is a bit over the top.
Couldn’t agree more, the criticism borders upon hatred at times and is palpable.
We don’t even own the lad, hope Ross has a blinder later.
Post by: ChicagoLion on February 27, 2021, 01:54:05 PM
Hatred?He's been poor since coming back from injury, but I think some of the criticism is a bit over the top.
Couldn’t agree more, the criticism borders upon hatred at times and is palpable.
We don’t even own the lad, hope Ross has a blinder later.
Really?
Post by: Bobby Boy on February 27, 2021, 02:17:18 PM
Hatred?He's been poor since coming back from injury, but I think some of the criticism is a bit over the top.
Couldn’t agree more, the criticism borders upon hatred at times and is palpable.
We don’t even own the lad, hope Ross has a blinder later.
Really?
If Ross Barkley was performing, showing commitment and a great attitude then there would only be plaudits on here.
He is being criticised because he is not showing the basic levels that would apply to any professional footballer.
If he plays today I hope he is sensational.
Post by: paul_e on February 27, 2021, 02:38:00 PM
He's been poor since coming back from injury, but I think some of the criticism is a bit over the top.
Couldn’t agree more, the criticism borders upon hatred at times and is palpable.
We don’t even own the lad, hope Ross has a blinder later.
No hatred here, I just think he needs to offer more in the final 3rd to justify his lack of defensive ability.
Post by: wittonwarrior on February 27, 2021, 02:51:58 PM
Post by: Allan C on February 27, 2021, 03:04:58 PM
He's been poor since coming back from injury, but I think some of the criticism is a bit over the top.Absolutely it has been. I get that he hasn’t been on form but then many others haven’t either. Some of it is just ridiculous
Post by: Ads on February 27, 2021, 03:10:56 PM
Post by: Three Spires Villa on February 27, 2021, 04:15:34 PM
He's been poor since coming back from injury, but I think some of the criticism is a bit over the top.Absolutely it has been. I get that he hasn’t been on form but then many others haven’t either. Some of it is just ridiculous
So do you think he should start? Taking your view of some of the criticisms out of the equation.
Post by: Mister E on February 27, 2021, 04:20:48 PM
He's been poor since coming back from injury, but I think some of the criticism is a bit over the top.I don't think it's been OTT on here (might be later on, mind). Rather, I see it as a mixture of disappointment and frustration that a supposedly talented lad doesn't do more to prove it.
Post by: JuanMartinez on February 27, 2021, 04:26:16 PM
Post by: TelfordVilla on February 27, 2021, 04:26:30 PM
Post by: jcsutv on February 27, 2021, 04:31:05 PM
Post by: jcsutv on February 27, 2021, 04:31:45 PM
Post by: Allan C on February 27, 2021, 05:10:16 PM
Actually no, but neither should McGinn, Luiz and AEG who have played equally as poor and are off form. The other three haven’t received anything like criticism that Barkley has.He's been poor since coming back from injury, but I think some of the criticism is a bit over the top.Absolutely it has been. I get that he hasn’t been on form but then many others haven’t either. Some of it is just ridiculous
So do you think he should start? Taking your view of some of the criticisms out of the equation.
Post by: Rudy65 on February 27, 2021, 05:18:49 PM
How can you possibly make that comment without knowing Barkley personally?? I’m more willing to believe that he is frustrated with his form which, like several others, is below parI was confused by his exit, was he trying to get attention or was he just knackered?
It was very strange knowing the cameras were bound to pick it up.
100% wanted the attention. It’s why kids through themselves on the floor in supermarkets. In both cases you look ridiculous. Barkley is effectively saying to Smith, how dare you take me off, do you know who I am type of attitude.
I don’t need to know him. Just that he is acting a prat and undermining Smith
Post by: Three Spires Villa on February 27, 2021, 06:33:15 PM
Post by: colin69 on February 27, 2021, 07:42:54 PM
Post by: brontebilly on February 27, 2021, 07:45:20 PM
Post by: villa `cross the mersey on February 27, 2021, 07:49:26 PM
Spoke to a few Evertonians this week about him and to a man none of them miss him........in fact one of them who has met him stated that he is not the "sharpest" intellect wise
His recent petulant behaviour following substitutions indicate he is not the most mature of individuals.
Was worth a try but it's not worked out for him or us- will be nice to see some of our talent given opportunities between now and season end
Post by: taylorsworkrate on February 27, 2021, 07:50:43 PM
"Why are the midfielders running about so much?"
Post by: olaftab on February 27, 2021, 07:57:23 PM
Post by: PaulWinch again on February 27, 2021, 07:58:59 PM
Post by: taylorsworkrate on February 27, 2021, 08:02:48 PM
Do we have to pile in on a player who didn’t play? He’s had a ropey time, but he’s also made important contributions.
His lack of effort and attitude in previous weeks kind of deserves it though.
Post by: JuanMartinez on February 27, 2021, 08:07:27 PM
Post by: eamonn on February 27, 2021, 08:12:22 PM
Post by: Toronto Villa on February 27, 2021, 08:13:37 PM
Post by: Andy_Lochhead_in_the_air on February 27, 2021, 09:02:42 PM
Post by: nigel on February 27, 2021, 09:25:59 PM
Do we have to pile in on a player who didn’t play? He’s had a ropey time, but he’s also made important contributions.
His lack of effort and attitude in previous weeks kind of deserves it though.
He might not have been playing well, but I doubt very much it’s any of the above two.
Post by: KevinGage on February 27, 2021, 09:46:46 PM
Do we have to pile in on a player who didn’t play? He’s had a ropey time, but he’s also made important contributions.
Indeed.
The role he played in the victories against Liverpool, Leicester and Arsenal gave us momentum in that early part of the campaign.
Had we not got that, we might be looking at a similar season to last year.
Post by: Nev on February 27, 2021, 10:14:33 PM
I wouldn't write the lad off at all but we might not have won that game tonight had he been selected and results it what it's all about.
Post by: KevinGage on February 27, 2021, 10:38:06 PM
Whereas other games will see Barkley's nous in the final third tip the balance for us against teams who want to sit in.
It's a long barsteward of a season, going on til the end of May this year. Even if Barkley can't get back in for a month or so, if he comes back energised and hungry to contribute he might still have a massive role to play in the run in.
We've seen the folly of writing El Ghazi and even Nakamaba off in fairly recent history.
Post by: olaftab on February 27, 2021, 10:51:27 PM
Do we have to pile in on a player who didn’t play? He’s had a ropey time, but he’s also made important contributions.Yes if not for nothing else than his petulant attitude when subbed.
Post by: OCD on February 28, 2021, 12:34:54 PM
Do we have to pile in on a player who didn’t play? He’s had a ropey time, but he’s also made important contributions.
His lack of effort and attitude in previous weeks kind of deserves it though.
His lack of effort and attitude deserved him being dropped, not being made a scapegoat. It's a kick up the arse, especially as Southgate was there last night. It's up to him to respond the right way. If he does, he could do well for us the rest of the season.
Post by: Gerrin on February 28, 2021, 01:10:22 PM
Taxi for Barkley ........looked a great loan but it's now obvious why he isn't getting a game for Chelsea .
Spoke to a few Evertonians this week about him and to a man none of them miss him........in fact one of them who has met him stated that he is not the "sharpest" intellect wise
His recent petulant behaviour following substitutions indicate he is not the most mature of individuals.
Was worth a try but it's not worked out for him or us- will be nice to see some of our talent given opportunities between now and season end
I think it's fair to assume we won't be signing him permanently now. Grealish out and Smith drops him. Ramsey will get more minutes next season along with Sanson, no place for Barkley.
Post by: Lastfootstamper on February 28, 2021, 01:29:03 PM
Post by: JUAN PABLO on February 28, 2021, 01:47:03 PM
Post by: Risso on February 28, 2021, 02:11:21 PM
Do we have to pile in on a player who didn’t play? He’s had a ropey time, but he’s also made important contributions.
His lack of effort and attitude in previous weeks kind of deserves it though.
His lack of effort and attitude deserved him being dropped, not being made a scapegoat. It's a kick up the arse, especially as Southgate was there last night. It's up to him to respond the right way. If he does, he could do well for us the rest of the season.
I'd say there's no chance whatsoever of Barkley being picked by Southgate in the foreseeable future. It's not like England are short of good, attacking midfielders, so for somebody to break into the squad now you'd think they'd have to be putting in 10/10 performance for the rest of the season.
Post by: Mister E on February 28, 2021, 04:45:44 PM
Talking of Sanson ( sonson) , he has looked pretty good in his few sub apperances. Definitely a quality player and probably why we wont buy Barkley in the summer.Wouldn't surprise me to see him start against SheffU. It's time to 'blood' him properly.
Post by: LeeB on February 28, 2021, 05:27:37 PM
Do we have to pile in on a player who didn’t play? He’s had a ropey time, but he’s also made important contributions.
His lack of effort and attitude in previous weeks kind of deserves it though.
His lack of effort and attitude deserved him being dropped, not being made a scapegoat. It's a kick up the arse, especially as Southgate was there last night. It's up to him to respond the right way. If he does, he could do well for us the rest of the season.
I'd say there's no chance whatsoever of Barkley being picked by Southgate in the foreseeable future. It's not like England are short of good, attacking midfielders, so for somebody to break into the squad now you'd think they'd have to be putting in 10/10 performance for the rest of the season.
Former favourite Lingaard has found form again as well, there's going to be better players missing out as well.
Post by: Flin5tone on February 28, 2021, 05:39:18 PM
Post by: OCD on February 28, 2021, 06:36:39 PM
Do we have to pile in on a player who didn’t play? He’s had a ropey time, but he’s also made important contributions.
His lack of effort and attitude in previous weeks kind of deserves it though.
His lack of effort and attitude deserved him being dropped, not being made a scapegoat. It's a kick up the arse, especially as Southgate was there last night. It's up to him to respond the right way. If he does, he could do well for us the rest of the season.
I'd say there's no chance whatsoever of Barkley being picked by Southgate in the foreseeable future. It's not like England are short of good, attacking midfielders, so for somebody to break into the squad now you'd think they'd have to be putting in 10/10 performance for the rest of the season.
I agree but his biggest motivation was to get into the England squad. Maybe he's given up himself and that's been a factor in his performances lately.
Post by: algy on February 28, 2021, 07:20:27 PM
I'm starting to think he was never more than a temporary signing, brought in to try to help the squad develop styles of play in readiness for the full-time inclusion of Ramsey, a young player of our own, brought through and now able to be gradually introduced in a way we've been unable to for what feels like forever. I also think there's similar thinking behind the Guilbert loan, he's now unlikely to play much and he's blocking the first team chances of a promising talented youngster.Yeah, have to say that I'm starting to come to a similar conclusion.
Post by: wittonwarrior on February 28, 2021, 07:30:04 PM
Post by: in exile on March 01, 2021, 10:48:53 AM
Post by: Hookeysmith on March 01, 2021, 11:35:28 AM
Be billy big bollocks and sulk - he can go fuck himself
Gets his head down and shows in training he is prepared to graft - then a great asset to have, especially to bring on and play himself back into form.
I would not give up on him yet but it is all about how he reacts. I think Smith has shown he is the boss
Post by: German James on March 01, 2021, 12:17:12 PM
I would not give up on him yet but it is all about how he reacts. I think Smith has shown he is the boss.I agree agree with both these points. Smith has sent a clear message to Barkley and the fans moaning about his (Smith's) lack of flexibility and leadership. Barkley must be fully aware that it's no-one else's fault but his if he cocks up his chance at Villa and gets put in the equivalent of Chelsea's bomb squad next season, until they can offload him to Sheffield United.
Post by: Risso on March 01, 2021, 12:29:13 PM
He's probably got one more big payday contract left in his career, so he needs to buck his idea up a bit. He's most certainly got the talent to do it.
Post by: Brend'Watkins on March 01, 2021, 12:31:58 PM
Post by: Drummond on March 01, 2021, 12:40:07 PM
Post by: Lsvilla on March 01, 2021, 12:43:43 PM
Post by: Risso on March 01, 2021, 02:48:02 PM
I think Saturday. Ramsey deserves to keep his place then take him out for the Wolves game.
Shouldn't we wait to see how he does first?
Post by: LeeB on March 01, 2021, 03:20:34 PM
I think Saturday. Ramsey deserves to keep his place then take him out for the Wolves game.
Shouldn't we wait to see how he does first?
Yeah, after his 4 goal first half salvo on Wednesday, Dean can bring him off on the hour. He'll be fine for Saturday too.
Post by: Smithy on March 01, 2021, 03:24:26 PM
I think Saturday. Ramsey deserves to keep his place then take him out for the Wolves game.
You're right, I'd be reluctant to drop him if he puts in a close to MOTM performance, BUT he's still only 19, playing in possibly the most physical position on the pitch, and Wolves would potentially be his third start in 7 days. That feels like a lot to put on a player who has just broken through, especially when we actually have a bit of competition in that position for a change. I'm happy to see a bit of rotation in midfield, as long as the effort stays the same.
Post by: Risso on March 01, 2021, 04:40:37 PM
I think Saturday. Ramsey deserves to keep his place then take him out for the Wolves game.
Shouldn't we wait to see how he does first?
Yeah, after his 4 goal first half salvo on Wednesday, Dean can bring him off on the hour. He'll be fine for Saturday too.
I bet you it would still be Trez for Bert on 70 minutes! ;)
Post by: usav on March 01, 2021, 05:34:38 PM
I think Saturday. Ramsey deserves to keep his place then take him out for the Wolves game.
You're right, I'd be reluctant to drop him if he puts in a close to MOTM performance, BUT he's still only 19, playing in possibly the most physical position on the pitch, and Wolves would potentially be his third start in 7 days. That feels like a lot to put on a player who has just broken through, especially when we actually have a bit of competition in that position for a change. I'm happy to see a bit of rotation in midfield, as long as the effort stays the same.
Why the heck did Ramsey play for the U23s today if we have a game on Wednesday? I don't understand that at all.
Post by: OCD on March 01, 2021, 05:37:03 PM
Post by: GordonCowansisthegreatest on March 01, 2021, 05:37:04 PM
Post by: Border villan on March 01, 2021, 05:44:56 PM
Which Ramsey?
Alf.
Post by: usav on March 01, 2021, 06:20:27 PM
Aaron Ramsey.
Ah.
Post by: Smithy on March 03, 2021, 05:02:35 PM
Post by: Mister E on March 03, 2021, 05:04:35 PM
Post by: Mister E on March 03, 2021, 08:52:44 PM
Not in the starting lineup today...... and ineffectual on his introduction.
Post by: Risso on March 03, 2021, 09:06:12 PM
Post by: ChicagoLion on March 03, 2021, 09:12:07 PM
Post by: Ads on March 03, 2021, 09:14:04 PM
Post by: KevinGage on March 03, 2021, 09:16:38 PM
Post by: usav on March 03, 2021, 09:19:35 PM
No criticism of him tonight at all. Tried to find some lines to pick in-between the team competition of who could pump the worst ball into the box.
Agreed, had nobody to link up with.
Post by: Ads on March 03, 2021, 09:21:24 PM
Post by: LeeB on March 04, 2021, 07:50:07 PM
No criticism of him tonight at all. Tried to find some lines to pick in-between the team competition of who could pump the worst ball into the box.
That's how I saw it, we looked at least a touch more unpredictable with him on.
Post by: PaulWinch again on March 04, 2021, 08:58:04 PM
No criticism of him tonight at all. Tried to find some lines to pick in-between the team competition of who could pump the worst ball into the box.
That's how I saw it, we looked at least a touch more unpredictable with him on.
Yup.
Post by: Border villan on March 06, 2021, 07:34:14 PM
Post by: Ads on March 06, 2021, 07:35:11 PM
Post by: exigo on March 06, 2021, 07:35:15 PM
Post by: SoccerHQ on March 06, 2021, 07:36:26 PM
Post by: brontebilly on March 06, 2021, 07:36:34 PM
Don't want to see him in a Villa shirt again. Charlatan
Post by: Uknowthescore on March 06, 2021, 07:36:39 PM
Was lucky he never cost us a goal.
Post by: steamer on March 06, 2021, 07:37:30 PM
Post by: Abbeyfealeavfc on March 06, 2021, 07:38:59 PM
Post by: taylorsworkrate on March 06, 2021, 07:40:43 PM
Post by: Rudy65 on March 06, 2021, 07:48:09 PM
Post by: tomd2103 on March 06, 2021, 07:55:58 PM
Post by: olaftab on March 06, 2021, 07:56:36 PM
Post by: frank black on March 06, 2021, 08:08:45 PM
Post by: CT on March 06, 2021, 08:11:57 PM
Show us how good he is and take the game by the scruff of the neck. Show the quality, do something that wins the game.
Nothing. Well, apart from nearly gifting Wolves a goal. The lack or any defensive effort could be excused if was doing the business in the final third. But he isn’t, and hasn’t for ages.
Post by: Goldenballs on March 06, 2021, 08:14:49 PM
£40m is laughable, Chelsea won't get half that.
Post by: colin69 on March 06, 2021, 08:17:31 PM
Post by: Toronto Villa on March 06, 2021, 08:21:13 PM
Post by: villa `cross the mersey on March 06, 2021, 08:31:23 PM
Thinks all he has to do is turn up and claim his no doubt ridiculous pay packet ...send him back asap
Post by: mr underhill on March 06, 2021, 08:35:42 PM
Post by: Allan C on March 06, 2021, 08:41:34 PM
What a complete shame this is. Because before the injury he looked really promising and was absolutely superb in his debut.The most sensible comment so far tonight. He’s a great player and was the difference for us until his injury and COVID. Since COVID none of them have reached the form levels shown before it
Post by: brontebilly on March 06, 2021, 08:45:46 PM
What a complete shame this is. Because before the injury he looked really promising and was absolutely superb in his debut.The most sensible comment so far tonight. He’s a great player and was the difference for us until his injury and COVID. Since COVID none of them have reached the form levels shown before it
I can recall I think three decent performances by Barkley in a Villa shirt, Liverpool, Arsenal and Leicester. Pre his injury, he was appalling in a number of games including the home defeats against Leeds and Soton. He's a terrible professional.
Post by: Villan82 on March 06, 2021, 08:49:03 PM
What a complete shame this is. Because before the injury he looked really promising and was absolutely superb in his debut.The most sensible comment so far tonight. He’s a great player and was the difference for us until his injury and COVID. Since COVID none of them have reached the form levels shown before it
I wonder will we ever get the full story of what went on with our Covid outbreak and how it affected us?
Post by: ChicagoLion on March 06, 2021, 09:38:05 PM
or just a plausible excuse.What a complete shame this is. Because before the injury he looked really promising and was absolutely superb in his debut.The most sensible comment so far tonight. He’s a great player and was the difference for us until his injury and COVID. Since COVID none of them have reached the form levels shown before it
I wonder will we ever get the full story of what went on with our Covid outbreak and how it affected us?
Post by: Zouch Villa on March 06, 2021, 09:45:41 PM
Should have bought him on today, he’d have made the difference I reckon.100% this. I reckon bringing Ross and Keinan on could have been the injection of attacking flare we really needed. Shame that Smith only saw fit to bring Ramsey on, and played it safe.
Post by: Three Spires Villa on March 06, 2021, 09:57:12 PM
Post by: wittonwarrior on March 06, 2021, 09:58:01 PM
Post by: Dante Lavelli on March 06, 2021, 10:46:41 PM
Really can't understand the decision to bring him on in a deeper midfield role tonight and he nearly cost us. Just isn't working out at the moment and I guess it is costing us big money as well.
Was it a strictly deeper role, or just him trying adjust to advice he has been given?
I’m just delighted we didn’t spunk £25m on him, as before this season that would’ve looked an okay fee.
Post by: Risso on March 06, 2021, 11:23:05 PM
Post by: aj2k77 on March 06, 2021, 11:27:31 PM
Post by: Sexual Ealing on March 06, 2021, 11:28:32 PM
I've given up on him to be honest now. He doesn't work hard enough and doesn't bring enough to the team to tolerate his lack of pressing. Mentally now I think he knows this season isn't going anywhere for him and he isn't switched on.
That sounds about right to me.
Post by: algy on March 07, 2021, 07:47:28 AM
It's just a plain "no" from me now.
Post by: Nev on March 07, 2021, 08:04:35 AM
Shame.
Post by: LeeB on March 07, 2021, 09:03:08 AM
Times up. You can see now why he is out on loan. Hopefully we can get something out of him before the end of the season but that should he that.
Shame.
It is, but it also shows the value of loaning a player of his profile (ie talented but erratic) first. You run the risk of paying more should he do well, but rather pay £40m for a player you know will deliver than £30m for one that turns out to be shite.
Post by: Abbeyfealeavfc on March 07, 2021, 09:15:30 AM
Post by: eamonn on March 07, 2021, 11:51:34 AM
Post by: eric woolban woolban on March 07, 2021, 10:20:09 PM
Post by: Steve67 on March 07, 2021, 10:27:46 PM
Post by: Goldie.7 on March 07, 2021, 11:19:35 PM
I'd much rather we went for Rueben Loftus-Cheek at the end of the season than Ross.
1 goal and 0 assists in 26 apps for Fulham playing either CAM, LW or RW.
No thanks!
Post by: ROBBO on March 08, 2021, 01:03:57 AM
Post by: SaddVillan on March 08, 2021, 08:05:12 PM
Can barely get to a jog now.
Won't be wearing claret and blue next season, unless Moyes gets duped.
Post by: SaddVillan on March 08, 2021, 08:10:09 PM
Can barely raise a jog now.
Won't be wearing claret and blue next season (unless Moyes gets conned by Chelsea).
Post by: PeterWithe on March 13, 2021, 09:53:59 AM
Post by: aj2k77 on March 13, 2021, 09:58:30 AM
Post by: mr underhill on March 13, 2021, 10:27:10 AM
Post by: OzVilla on March 13, 2021, 10:28:34 AM
Post by: tomd2103 on March 13, 2021, 10:38:34 AM
Post by: Ads on March 13, 2021, 10:40:21 AM
I dont have an issue with players losing possession trying to run the ball and create. They should have the confidence to be able to try and do that.
He played some much more purposeful balls and if Watkins wasn't having his worst performance for us and stayed onside, he'd have an assist to his name.
Post by: RamboandBruno on March 13, 2021, 10:50:52 AM
Post by: Chris Smith on March 13, 2021, 11:33:39 AM
Post by: OCD on March 13, 2021, 02:05:15 PM
Post by: in exile on March 15, 2021, 10:46:59 AM
Post by: Villan82 on March 15, 2021, 11:39:29 AM
Post by: eamonn on March 15, 2021, 12:06:51 PM
I want him gone.
Sounds a bit Gomorrah-y/Sopranos but...yeah *nods*
Post by: SoccerHQ on March 15, 2021, 12:28:41 PM
Post by: fbriai on March 15, 2021, 12:33:41 PM
He was OK when he came in last night, suicidal ball apart.
I dont have an issue with players losing possession trying to run the ball and create. They should have the confidence to be able to try and do that.
He played some much more purposeful balls and if Watkins wasn't having his worst performance for us and stayed onside, he'd have an assist to his name.
Agree completely with this.
I'd be surprised if he was still with us next season, as I'd imagine Chelsea will want a fair wedge for him, which given his age, doesn't really fit in with what we are trying to do as a club.
He's been off it since he came back from injury, but I still think there's a decent player there and there's still time for him to produce some fine performances again.
Post by: ChicagoLion on March 15, 2021, 12:47:26 PM
Post by: eamonn on March 15, 2021, 02:05:40 PM
Post by: LeeB on March 15, 2021, 06:08:26 PM
I have always believed that there is a long term physical problem and everything I have seen since his time with us supports that view.
I thought he didn't look fit when he came on the other night, like his movement is restricted, certainly compared to what we saw a few months back.
I know form and confidence are big factors, it just looked more than that to me.
Post by: Mister E on March 15, 2021, 06:21:10 PM
Agreed, he doesn't look fit even though Smith talked after about a few players being low in confidence - by which I assume he included Barkley in that.I have always believed that there is a long term physical problem and everything I have seen since his time with us supports that view.I thought he didn't look fit when he came on the other night, like his movement is restricted, certainly compared to what we saw a few months back.
I know form and confidence are big factors, it just looked more than that to me.
Post by: ChicagoLion on March 15, 2021, 10:17:16 PM
Completely different player.
Post by: brontebilly on March 15, 2021, 11:39:55 PM
Check out his physique speed and movement from his Everton and early Chelsea days.
Completely different player.
Carrying a bit too much timber too I think
After a terrible start I thought he did ok at Newcastle, gave us a bit of composure on the ball higher up the pitch, certainly in comparison to the likes of Watkins, Trez and AEG. But he offers absolutely zero without the ball, doesn't even attempt a tackle or pressing an opponent.
Post by: ChicagoLion on March 16, 2021, 09:24:48 AM
Check out his physique speed and movement from his Everton and early Chelsea days.
Completely different player.
Carrying a bit too much timber too I think
After a terrible start I thought he did ok at Newcastle, gave us a bit of composure on the ball higher up the pitch, certainly in comparison to the likes of Watkins, Trez and AEG. But he offers absolutely zero without the ball, doesn't even attempt a tackle or pressing an opponent.
Over done the weight training, has lost mobility and pace.
Post by: frank black on March 17, 2021, 06:50:06 AM
Check out his physique speed and movement from his Everton and early Chelsea days.
Completely different player.
Carrying a bit too much timber too I think
After a terrible start I thought he did ok at Newcastle, gave us a bit of composure on the ball higher up the pitch, certainly in comparison to the likes of Watkins, Trez and AEG. But he offers absolutely zero without the ball, doesn't even attempt a tackle or pressing an opponent.
Over done the weight training, has lost mobility and pace.
Or more likely the two significant hamstring injuries have resulted in him either loosing it or holding back out of fear of yet another one.
Post by: ChicagoLion on March 17, 2021, 11:23:10 AM
which takes you back to my first point.Check out his physique speed and movement from his Everton and early Chelsea days.
Completely different player.
Carrying a bit too much timber too I think
After a terrible start I thought he did ok at Newcastle, gave us a bit of composure on the ball higher up the pitch, certainly in comparison to the likes of Watkins, Trez and AEG. But he offers absolutely zero without the ball, doesn't even attempt a tackle or pressing an opponent.
Over done the weight training, has lost mobility and pace.
Or more likely the two significant hamstring injuries have resulted in him either loosing it or holding back out of fear of yet another one.
Post by: Neil Hawkes on March 17, 2021, 03:43:07 PM
Available in YouTube - Carney Chukwuemeka • Aston Villa Wonderkid - 2020/21 Highlights
Post by: Mister E on March 17, 2021, 04:19:09 PM
We already have his replacement, does everything Ross did before his latest injury:Look at that and notice how Chuk and Barry both have the balance and body strength to make things happen. I really hope they each get a chance of some Premier League minutes this season.
Available in YouTube - Carney Chukwuemeka • Aston Villa Wonderkid - 2020/21 Highlights
Post by: OCD on March 17, 2021, 04:27:29 PM
Post by: Nii Lamptey on March 21, 2021, 09:28:29 PM
Post by: brontebilly on March 21, 2021, 09:31:00 PM
Send him back to Chelsea. Tonight.
Yeah I don't really see the point in flogging this dead horse any longer. See ya Ross.
Post by: OzVilla on March 21, 2021, 09:32:02 PM
Post by: CT on March 21, 2021, 09:33:24 PM
Such a massive disappointment. The early weeks looked so promising.
Post by: Nii Lamptey on March 21, 2021, 09:39:42 PM
At the very least, we expect effort, even if the form isn’t there. He’s far from hitting the required standard so just don’t see why we’re persevering with him when we have our own players who would offer so much more
Post by: PeterWithe on March 21, 2021, 09:41:47 PM
Post by: Aldridge Villa on March 21, 2021, 09:46:51 PM
Post by: CT Villan on March 21, 2021, 09:48:41 PM
He is done in a Villa shirt.
Post by: olaftab on March 21, 2021, 09:50:18 PM
Post by: Goldie.7 on March 22, 2021, 08:38:43 AM
Permanent signing in the summer? I think not!
Post by: Drummond on March 22, 2021, 08:42:21 AM
Post by: mr underhill on March 22, 2021, 09:15:16 AM
Post by: brontebilly on March 22, 2021, 09:48:57 AM
He just looks unfit to me. He's trying stuff that just makes him look shit because he's trying to hard to look great. If he went back to basics I reckon he'd do far, far better.
Don't think we can use the fitness excuse any longer with Barkley. He is back a number of weeks from his hamstring injury and it's slower if anything he is getting. Some players would be bursting a gut with extra training to shift body weight or at least when they come on give the impression they are keen to make an impact. His career at a top half team is very much in the balance but I've seen nothing from him to suggest he realises that.
We are paying this guy (and Chelsea) a kings ransom for his services and it's turned out to be a very expensive flop.
Post by: aj2k77 on March 22, 2021, 09:54:12 AM
Post by: ChicagoLion on March 22, 2021, 10:32:41 AM
Its sad to see a players demise in front of your eyes.
Post by: OCD on March 22, 2021, 11:24:01 AM
Post by: in exile on March 22, 2021, 12:08:27 PM
Post by: Whiney MacWhineface on March 22, 2021, 06:32:54 PM
Roll on Summer.
Post by: TopDeck113 on March 22, 2021, 07:11:58 PM
.
I reckon he genuinely came with every good intention and hence the good start. However, in reality he simply hasn't got the desire to sustain it in the week-in, week-out reality, let alone stepping up to the mark when the top man is out injured.
Dare I say it, but we need someone young and hungry...
Post by: Gerrin on March 22, 2021, 07:24:21 PM
All the focus is on not having Jack fit and playing but we're also missing the pre-Hamstring injury version of Barkley, his goals and assists and the impact having both Jack and Barkley playing their best. Even if Jack was fit, we're back to what we had last season when teams know that if they nullify Jack, they nullify us. More good work needed in the summer.
Totally agree, we're almost as bad now as at the start of last season. The Barkley / Jack combo, especially Arsenal away was an absolute joy to watch. First half v Burnley away I couldn't believe the football we were playing, that was the turning point for me. Ever since that 2nd half we've been rubbish. I guess this happens to teams though, look at Southampton, we're they not top at one point? Definitely top 3, I think.
Post by: brontebilly on March 22, 2021, 08:22:22 PM
All the focus is on not having Jack fit and playing but we're also missing the pre-Hamstring injury version of Barkley, his goals and assists and the impact having both Jack and Barkley playing their best. Even if Jack was fit, we're back to what we had last season when teams know that if they nullify Jack, they nullify us. More good work needed in the summer.
The pre hamstring injury version of Barkley was patchy enough anyway. Mixing up 8/10s with 3/10s. The warning signs were ringing very loudly in the home defeats to Leeds and Southampton where he didn't bother tracking any runners from midfield, thought he was above that kind of graft.
He won't turn it around now anyway. 3 goals and a single assist in 21 games is very poor for the investment in him.
Post by: richtheholtender on March 22, 2021, 08:29:50 PM
Post by: dcdavecollett on March 24, 2021, 01:29:19 AM
Post by: algy on March 24, 2021, 06:29:32 AM
Another season, another loan of another player whose career has floundered after a big-money move to Chelsea.Think this is a good point, and may well be not far off the mark. For whatever reason, the thing that was powering early loan Barkley seems to have vanished. It's a shame, desperately wanted it to work out for both him & us, but it's just not happened. The team's struggled for form, and with that so's he. Think that's less of an issue with a younger player like Dougie, but you need the more senior players - him, Jack, SJM, Tyrone - to push through and help turn that around.
.
I reckon he genuinely came with every good intention and hence the good start. However, in reality he simply hasn't got the desire to sustain it in the week-in, week-out reality, let alone stepping up to the mark when the top man is out injured.
Dare I say it, but we need someone young and hungry...
Post by: eamonn on March 24, 2021, 09:44:09 AM
We weren't exactly 'rubbish' in the home game against Arsenal.
No but we had a little bit of luck with the goal and then happily "held what we have" for the rest of the game notwithstanding some decent chances/breaks. Similar to the Leeds game although we didn't really create anything after scoring there.0
Post by: Percy McCarthy on March 24, 2021, 12:47:33 PM
I don’t know if it’s been mentioned but could have be one that had Covid? Wondering if he’s still suffering as it did take some (saint maximin example) a good while to recover.
I heard this from someone who works at Bodymoor. Didn’t take it as gospel myself, but I did hear about Jack’s injury from the same source before his first game out as well.
“Shin splints, but not as bad as last time”. Seems about the same to me - so far.
Post by: WarszaVillan on March 24, 2021, 01:33:07 PM
I don’t know if it’s been mentioned but could have be one that had Covid? Wondering if he’s still suffering as it did take some (saint maximin example) a good while to recover.
I heard this from someone who works at Bodymoor. Didn’t take it as gospel myself, but I did hear about Jack’s injury from the same source before his first game out as well.
“Shin splints, but not as bad as last time”. Seems about the same to me - so far.
At the beginning of the 'covid break' this season he sent a video message out on social media to someone who was in hospital with covid. He looked pretty rough himself and made a comment about him also suffering or something similar. I think it's been taken down since.
Post by: PeterWithe on March 24, 2021, 01:37:15 PM
Post by: SaddVillan on March 24, 2021, 08:41:18 PM
He just doesn't seem bothered. There's no apparent attempt to track back or mark anybody. Now most of us would forgive him if he made the effort and was either left behind or brushed off by a stronger opponent because he can't compete physically
But instead, there's nothing, nada, zilch.
Can't understand what's going on in his head. Given the good start he made with us, then even if he's suffered from Covid I'd have thought he'd be busting a gut to show Smith that once he's fully recovered he's worth signing permanently.
It's as if he either doesn't care or just isn't bothered anymore
Not exactly the right example to be setting to younger players, who are probably on a fraction of what we're paying him.
Post by: richtheholtender on March 24, 2021, 09:03:59 PM
Post by: richtheholtender on March 24, 2021, 09:05:10 PM
Post by: ChicagoLion on March 24, 2021, 09:19:01 PM
It’s not his game.
Post by: CT on April 10, 2021, 05:05:23 PM
He offers nothing, and why is he so slow to react when asked to come on?
Post by: Des Little on April 10, 2021, 05:09:42 PM
Post by: villa for life on April 10, 2021, 05:10:22 PM
Post by: Brend'Watkins on April 10, 2021, 05:13:09 PM
Post by: baddowvillans on April 10, 2021, 05:15:48 PM
Post by: colin69 on April 10, 2021, 05:16:49 PM
Post by: SheffieldVillain on April 10, 2021, 05:21:35 PM
I really thought from the early performances that he could be a real asset to us but now I hope he never plays for us again. He has had lots of chances but every time when he comes in he gives away possession in dangerous positions. If Dean Smith ever again thinks Ross Barkley then he confirms my suspicions that he doesn't understand the problem.
Exactly my thoughts.
What a shame, I really thought early season we were on to something signing him.
Post by: aldridgeboy on April 10, 2021, 05:25:24 PM
I wouldn’t play him again now. Too many poor Performances.
Post by: richtheholtender on April 10, 2021, 05:30:35 PM
Post by: SoccerHQ on April 10, 2021, 05:31:45 PM
Can't believe he didn't shoot in that counter attack, tried to pass it to his right, gave it away and did his hands on his head routine and Liverpool scored 30 seconds later.
Shows the difficulty of good on paper players actually becoming effective in the type of team we're building. I can see us going after another two of his ilk in the summer for the wide position.
Post by: Deano's Mullet on April 10, 2021, 05:36:21 PM
Wouldn’t mind but one of the things the club were keen to stress at the end of the promotion season was there would be no more loan signings. We were interested in developing our own talents!!!
This one i did think was a worthwhile gamble though. If it hard worked out I think we’d really being seeing dividends. Unfortunately....
Post by: Sexual Ealing on April 10, 2021, 05:42:13 PM
That’ll be the last time he plays for villa. Smith just wanted to see if playing against his old foe would be some kind of catalyst.
Agreed. I thought this was the right game to give him a chance to turn it on for old times' sake. He was shit. Again. Time for one of the U23s to replace him on the bench.
Post by: villa `cross the mersey on April 10, 2021, 06:58:28 PM
I understand he has had a negative affect on Grealish outside of the playing side
He has wasted another opportunity to show his ability .....I stated a while ago he was a " Big time Charlie" and a "Chancer"
I stand by that having spoken to a couple of Everton season ticket holders with contacts within the club ......
Post by: brontebilly on April 10, 2021, 07:35:34 PM
We certainly didn't do our homework on him in respect of his character ......I thought the club now looked at the personality and attitude of new recruits ....I'm glad we didn't buy him.
I understand he has had a negative affect on Grealish outside of the playing side
He has wasted another opportunity to show his ability .....I stated a while ago he was a " Big time Charlie" and a "Chancer"
I stand by that having spoken to a couple of Everton season ticket holders with contacts within the club ......
What's with the Grealish comment?
Post by: villa `cross the mersey on April 10, 2021, 07:42:32 PM
Post by: brontebilly on April 10, 2021, 07:45:55 PM
I am sure you can figure it out - neither of them are averse to attracting the attention of the press and social media -leading to images of them "worse for wear" in the public domain ....
That birthday meal?
Barkley's career is in freefall but it has been for years. He has messed up a big chance to get back on track with us.
Post by: paul_e on April 10, 2021, 07:47:48 PM
I am sure you can figure it out - neither of them are averse to attracting the attention of the press and social media -leading to images of them "worse for wear" in the public domain ....
The fact that, until his injury, Jack was having his best season ever suggests you're making a problem from nothing.
Post by: chrisw1 on April 10, 2021, 07:50:16 PM
I agree he's been shit since the injury, but I think it's a push to say it wasn't worthwhile.
Post by: Flamingo Lane on April 10, 2021, 07:50:19 PM
He’s a total waste of a football career.
I disagree. Considering how bad a footballer he is I'd say he has done remarkably well to get as far as he has and harvest for as long as he has the rewards that come with being a premier league footballer.
Post by: villa `cross the mersey on April 10, 2021, 07:56:15 PM
fine .......you believe what you want ...all will be fine when he is "fit"I am sure you can figure it out - neither of them are averse to attracting the attention of the press and social media -leading to images of them "worse for wear" in the public domain ....
The fact that, until his injury, Jack was having his best season ever suggests you're making a problem from nothing.
Post by: paul_e on April 10, 2021, 08:01:33 PM
fine .......you believe what you want ...all will be fine when he is "fit"I am sure you can figure it out - neither of them are averse to attracting the attention of the press and social media -leading to images of them "worse for wear" in the public domain ....
The fact that, until his injury, Jack was having his best season ever suggests you're making a problem from nothing.
Are you suggesting that Jack has only missed games because Barkley is part of the squad? It looks that way but I just want to check because it seems far too batshit crazy for anyone to actually think.
Post by: villa `cross the mersey on April 10, 2021, 08:16:00 PM
All will unravel when Barkley departs .....fine .......you believe what you want ...all will be fine when he is "fit"I am sure you can figure it out - neither of them are averse to attracting the attention of the press and social media -leading to images of them "worse for wear" in the public domain ....
The fact that, until his injury, Jack was having his best season ever suggests you're making a problem from nothing.
Are you suggesting that Jack has only missed games because Barkley is part of the squad? It looks that way but I just want to check because it seems far too batshit crazy for anyone to actually think.
Post by: aj2k77 on April 10, 2021, 08:19:48 PM
Post by: Risso on April 10, 2021, 08:23:06 PM
He's had about 5 good games for us. Shite.
Three by my reckoning. Liverpool, Leicester and Arsenal. Three and a half if you want to include the Southampton game where he scored but did bugger all else.
Post by: Drummond on April 11, 2021, 01:16:34 AM
All will unravel when Barkley departs .....fine .......you believe what you want ...all will be fine when he is "fit"I am sure you can figure it out - neither of them are averse to attracting the attention of the press and social media -leading to images of them "worse for wear" in the public domain ....
The fact that, until his injury, Jack was having his best season ever suggests you're making a problem from nothing.
Are you suggesting that Jack has only missed games because Barkley is part of the squad? It looks that way but I just want to check because it seems far too batshit crazy for anyone to actually think.
All what will unravel?
Post by: PhilVill on April 11, 2021, 07:39:59 AM
Post by: Abbeyfealeavfc on April 11, 2021, 07:58:18 AM
Post by: Woody17 on April 11, 2021, 08:33:02 AM
“He looks like he doesn’t want to come on”.
Shame Smith doesn’t see it.
Post by: wittonwarrior on April 11, 2021, 11:14:01 AM
Post by: aj2k77 on April 11, 2021, 11:33:41 AM
Post by: N'ZMAV on April 11, 2021, 11:35:17 AM
I wouldn't even bother with him any more.We're not really anyway.
Post by: aj2k77 on April 11, 2021, 02:21:42 PM
Post by: Mister E on April 11, 2021, 02:22:47 PM
As I said on the match thread, his indecision when set up by Watkins directly led to the winning goal: if Barkley had taken the shot as soon as he'd received the ball, he would either have scored or the ball would have gone out for a goalkick or corner. Instead he dallied, the ball was taken from him and the ensuing move produced the goal.
I want dynamism, commitment and quick-thinking: he brings none.
Post by: Toronto Villa on April 11, 2021, 03:04:38 PM
Post by: eamonn on April 11, 2021, 03:11:41 PM
Ramsey seemed to get in his way for that decision in whether to take the shot on or pass but he needed to be more decisive and more importantly, he needed to chase back to try and win the ball again, instead of giving it up as soon as possession was lost. It's that questionable attitude that puts me off him more than anything.
Post by: paul_e on April 11, 2021, 03:32:28 PM
I was pretty pissed off with him yesterday and would be happy for him never to pull on a Villa shirt again.
As I said on the match thread, his indecision when set up by Watkins directly led to the winning goal: if Barkley had taken the shot as soon as he'd received the ball, he would either have scored or the ball would have gone out for a goalkick or corner. Instead he dallied, the ball was taken from him and the ensuing move produced the goal.
I want dynamism, commitment and quick-thinking: he brings none.
Yep, that's just the latest example but he's so ponderous all the time. If he was our player I'd be happy to see him getting time to try to find some form/confidence but we're not going to keep him so I don't see the point.
He dwells on the ball too much and as a substitute that is magnified. When he comes on, he's trying to get used to the pace of the game but he also wants to take his time.
Ramsey seemed to get in his way for that decision in whether to take the shot on or pass but he needed to be more decisive and more importantly, he needed to chase back to try and win the ball again, instead of giving it up as soon as possession was lost. It's that questionable attitude that puts me off him more than anything.
I agree Ramsey ended up in the way but he'd been calling for a pass for 3-4 seconds before that and had plenty of space Barkley freezing up meant all the space for a shot or a pass was lost. If it had bene any of 5-6 other players in the squad I'd have backed them to make it 2-1 to us in the same situation.
Post by: KevinGage on April 11, 2021, 03:37:17 PM
But I'm reminded of Tom Cleverly, who was largely ineffective and on the periphery of things during his time with us. But had a purple patch towards the end of the season and most would have been happy enough to see him remain.
If Barkley has a strong finish to the end of the season and tips the balance in a few games for us, it'll be easy enough to argue that his mid season drop off was due to the injury. Either way, I don't think he'll be here next year.
Post by: Woody17 on April 11, 2021, 03:43:05 PM
We could spend that kind of money much wiser elsewhere.
Post by: ChicagoLion on April 11, 2021, 04:23:32 PM
Post by: Rudy Can't Fail on April 11, 2021, 04:47:37 PM
Be bat shit crazy to sign Barkley and I don’t think our owners are that daft.
Sign him? It would be bat shit crazy to give him another minute in a Villa shirt.
Post by: RamboandBruno on April 11, 2021, 05:02:17 PM
W’eve got 8 games left, of which he can’t play against Chelsea presumably. Yesterday feels a bit like the last chance saloon for him, I don’t think he’ll get many minutes in his 7 games left with us.
We do need to look at filling that role next season, Deli Alli anyone??
Post by: paul_e on April 11, 2021, 05:03:09 PM
As it stands, I wouldn't do the deal.
But I'm reminded of Tom Cleverly, who was largely ineffective and on the periphery of things during his time with us. But had a purple patch towards the end of the season and most would have been happy enough to see him remain.
If Barkley has a strong finish to the end of the season and tips the balance in a few games for us, it'll be easy enough to argue that his mid season drop off was due to the injury. Either way, I don't think he'll be here next year.
I think Cleverly is a perfect example of why you shouldn't sign a loanee on the back of a handful of decent performances, he spent the next 5 years struggling for gametime at Everton and then Watford.
I'll be very upset if Barkley stays mostly because I think most of his problems are in his head and he doesn't seem all that bothered about fixing them.
Post by: eamonn on April 11, 2021, 05:05:44 PM
He’s certainly not worth the £20-£30 million investment that Chelsea will want for him.
We could spend that kind of money much wiser elsewhere.
We've already given them £11m for the loan fee as well as paying his and Drinkwater's wages over the past year. They can send us a bunch of flowers and Tammy Abraham at a cut-price deal to make-up for it.
Post by: DrGonzo on April 11, 2021, 05:20:56 PM
Post by: TelfordVilla on April 11, 2021, 05:36:17 PM
Post by: exigo on April 11, 2021, 05:44:49 PM
I'd much rather have someone in the squad who's desperate to impress. Chukwuemeka would bring more right now for that alone.
Post by: aj2k77 on April 11, 2021, 07:46:20 PM
He’s certainly not worth the £20-£30 million investment that Chelsea will want for him.
We could spend that kind of money much wiser elsewhere.
We've already given them £11m for the loan fee as well as paying his and Drinkwater's wages over the past year. They can send us a bunch of flowers and Tammy Abraham at a cut-price deal to make-up for it.
You seriously think we paid someone £11m to borrow their reserve for one season?
Post by: eamonn on April 11, 2021, 07:58:05 PM
Post by: Lastfootstamper on April 11, 2021, 08:19:06 PM
Post by: Edvard Remberg on April 12, 2021, 07:38:16 PM
https://twitter.com/OcBen/status/1381571443352297478?s=19
Post by: ChicagoLion on April 12, 2021, 07:44:47 PM
Not sure if this clip has been posted before, but shocking how he just strolls aroundIf that has not sealed his fate I do not know what will
https://twitter.com/OcBen/status/1381571443352297478?s=19
Post by: Rudy65 on April 12, 2021, 08:10:03 PM
Not sure if this clip has been posted before, but shocking how he just strolls aroundIf that has not sealed his fate I do not know what will
https://twitter.com/OcBen/status/1381571443352297478?s=19
He had only been on the pitch 5 mins. Big time Charlie. Get shot
Post by: The Edge on April 12, 2021, 08:11:20 PM
Doesn't look remotely fit there. If he isn't fit he shouldn't be anyehere near the team. If he is fit he clearly isn't trying. I was thrilled when they brought him in and my excitement seemed justified but not any more. He's now become a massive disappointment.Not sure if this clip has been posted before, but shocking how he just strolls aroundIf that has not sealed his fate I do not know what will
https://twitter.com/OcBen/status/1381571443352297478?s=19
Post by: Ian. on April 12, 2021, 08:11:47 PM
Post by: CT on April 12, 2021, 08:23:24 PM
You’ve only got to look at his attitude getting him on the pitch in the first place. He doesn’t like being a substitute.
Confidence is one thing, granted, attitude is another. It’s the latter for me and I hope he doesn’t waste a squad place for us again.
....and what a shame, because for a few games, we looked the dogs with him, Jack, Ollie and the rest all firing.
Post by: Abbeyfealeavfc on April 12, 2021, 08:39:05 PM
Doesn't look remotely fit there. If he isn't fit he shouldn't be anyehere near the team. If he is fit he clearly isn't trying. I was thrilled when they brought him in and my excitement seemed justified but not any more. He's now become a massive disappointment.Not sure if this clip has been posted before, but shocking how he just strolls aroundIf that has not sealed his fate I do not know what will
https://twitter.com/OcBen/status/1381571443352297478?s=19
That lack of effort annoyed me on Saturday (in real time). I was watching him do nothing, as I was calling out to the screen. Just something, anything from him and that ball wouldn't have gone forwards. Then to see him on the "D" later in the move (again doing nothing), whilst the defender was teeing himself up for the shot was just utter sh-t. That is why Saturday I said barkley can just f-ck off!
Post by: VILLA MOLE on April 12, 2021, 08:39:59 PM
Post by: paul_e on April 12, 2021, 09:00:54 PM
My only guess as to why he came on ahead of KD was the “Evertonian” thing and that he’d bust a gut to beat Liverpool. Clearly that wasn’t ever going to be a factor.
You’ve only got to look at his attitude getting him on the pitch in the first place. He doesn’t like being a substitute.
Confidence is one thing, granted, attitude is another. It’s the latter for me and I hope he doesn’t waste a squad place for us again.
....and what a shame, because for a few games, we looked the dogs with him, Jack, Ollie and the rest all firing.
it's both, he got dropped because of poor form/lack of confidence and instead of using it as motivation he's decided he can't be arsed.
Post by: Ian. on April 12, 2021, 09:04:38 PM
Post by: Risso on April 12, 2021, 09:31:07 PM
Post by: Malandro on April 12, 2021, 09:37:44 PM
Post by: eamonn on April 12, 2021, 09:40:03 PM
Post by: ChicagoLion on April 12, 2021, 09:40:42 PM
A better manager would've used the pie and stick method.Is that one of Dean Smiths traps?
Post by: ChicagoLion on April 12, 2021, 09:49:04 PM
Bringing a player on because he used to play for Everton and we were playing Liverpool? I really hope that wasn't the reason.on the basis he wasn’t good enough to come on against Fulham, it’s hard to come up with an alternative.
Post by: Andy_Lochhead_in_the_air on April 12, 2021, 10:10:15 PM
Not sure if this clip has been posted before, but shocking how he just strolls around
https://twitter.com/OcBen/status/1381571443352297478?s=19
Got in a couple of hours ago after 12 hours back at work, will be up at 7 to go again. I'm knackered and it pisses me off seeing that. Wanker. >:(
Post by: tony scott on April 12, 2021, 11:22:20 PM
Post by: olaftab on April 12, 2021, 11:29:44 PM
Post by: aev on April 13, 2021, 07:10:31 AM
I wonder if he is "ok".
Post by: Goldenballs on April 13, 2021, 07:54:35 AM
Post by: The Edge on April 13, 2021, 08:58:12 AM
Has the clip been taken down? What was it?It was a clip from twitter and it looks like it's been blocked now. I'm not surprised because it shows Barkley up in an extremely bad way. The camera focused on him for about 20 seconds and showed Liverpool just passing the ball around him while he ambles in the general direction of the ball while putting in no more than 10% effort. Embarrassing.
Post by: LeeB on April 13, 2021, 09:43:11 AM
That clip is really odd - I haven't seen anything like that before.
I wonder if he is "ok".
He was the same coming on against Newcastle, and another game recently.
I commented on here that he looked injured, like it was painful to try and sprint but that can’t be the case if he’s in the squad each week.
Post by: aj2k77 on April 13, 2021, 09:48:58 AM
I think if His attitude is really poor, we wouldn’t play him at all,it just looks like his confidence is shot for whatever reason, and because of his cost we and he have to try and restore it. so he doesn’t start but gets some game time.
Confidence doesn't affect work rate. You don't need to be confident to run.
Post by: LeeB on April 13, 2021, 09:59:58 AM
I think if His attitude is really poor, we wouldn’t play him at all,it just looks like his confidence is shot for whatever reason, and because of his cost we and he have to try and restore it. so he doesn’t start but gets some game time.
Confidence doesn't affect work rate. You don't need to be confident to run.
You’ve never seen me in heels.
Post by: andyh on April 13, 2021, 10:29:47 AM
On the Liverpool match thread I said ‘Barkley looks like he’s running through treacle’ not long after he came on.
I’m guessing the clip shows something like that?
Post by: LukeJames on April 13, 2021, 11:31:11 AM
Post by: Risso on April 13, 2021, 12:22:17 PM
Post by: brontebilly on April 13, 2021, 12:40:48 PM
There was another clip like that after the Leeds home game. His attitude stinks.
Agreed, this lack of application has been very evident from early days, Southampton was another shocker from him. Think he announced on his arrival that he was comfortable playing at 8 or 10. There aren't many 8s that get away with his risible lack of effort without the ball. Any time Smith played him there we had a big problem as a result.
Would be better off sending him packing but with Grealish's injury problem and now Trez I guess there is no chance of that.
Post by: cdward on April 13, 2021, 01:04:05 PM
This is his last chance, if he doesn't turn himself around between now and the end of the season, no PL club will take the chance on him, and his career will dwindle into obscurity.
I really want him to succeed, but it looks like he wont.
Post by: JUAN PABLO on April 13, 2021, 01:06:00 PM
Post by: TaxDodger on April 13, 2021, 01:09:16 PM
I guess we'll just use him as a squad player for the rest of the season before he goes back to Chelsea.
Post by: paul_e on April 13, 2021, 01:32:44 PM
It is shameful but what I can't work out is what he's doing with the shrug at the beginning.
Post by: ChicagoLion on April 13, 2021, 01:37:41 PM
I think the HMS Last Chance has sailed.
This is his last chance, if he doesn't turn himself around between now and the end of the season, no PL club will take the chance on him, and his career will dwindle into obscurity.
Post by: Risso on April 13, 2021, 01:44:41 PM
Post by: Mossie Hennebry on April 13, 2021, 01:52:57 PM
Post by: andyh on April 13, 2021, 01:54:00 PM
Video is still up on facebook - https://www.facebook.com/horace.levy/videos/5932652626760461Christ, that is appalling.
It is shameful but what I can't work out is what he's doing with the shrug at the beginning.
Even if he were critically injured, I’d have still expected a little effort during that passage of play.
He has ‘gone’, hasn’t he?
Post by: ChicagoLion on April 13, 2021, 02:02:59 PM
I don't think his career recovered from that.
Post by: paul_e on April 13, 2021, 02:27:56 PM
Post by: N'ZMAV on April 13, 2021, 03:01:48 PM
Post by: Flamingo Lane on April 13, 2021, 03:20:52 PM
Post by: Mossie Hennebry on April 13, 2021, 03:28:47 PM
he looks so unfit - that's how I'd look on the pitch.He looks bollixed.
Post by: KevinGage on April 13, 2021, 03:48:15 PM
In that clip he looks like he's arguing with himself, or at least talking to himself. I reckon he is not in the right head space at the moment, a bit like Ross McCormack/Stephen Ireland/Drinkwater.
This is his last chance, if he doesn't turn himself around between now and the end of the season, no PL club will take the chance on him, and his career will dwindle into obscurity.
I really want him to succeed, but it looks like he wont.
I'm sure a few PL sides will still take a chance on him.
He looked bright (play wise) during the first part of the season and was a big factor in our early results. Talk of getting into the England squad (which is how Deano sold the loan to him) didn't look outlandish back then.
But if he's not getting in our team he won't be in contention for his parent club, I'd have thought.
Yet the likes of Palace or Newcastle may bite. Or Burnleh. A little closer to home and with cash on the hip now after their recent takeover.
Post by: Brend'Watkins on April 13, 2021, 04:29:23 PM
Post by: Rudy Can't Fail on April 13, 2021, 04:31:15 PM
Post by: eamonn on April 13, 2021, 05:13:52 PM
he looks so unfit - that's how I'd look on the pitch.He looks bollixed.
He's been on the Guinness since Christmas.
Post by: Mister E on April 13, 2021, 05:22:20 PM
Moyes will have him at West Ham for £15-£20m.Here's hoping ...
Post by: N'ZMAV on April 13, 2021, 05:34:48 PM
can't we just furlough the fucker?he looks so unfit - that's how I'd look on the pitch.He looks bollixed.
He's been on the Guinness since Christmas.
Post by: SaddVillan on April 13, 2021, 06:08:36 PM
Given that he's out of the picture at Chelsea and his move to Villa was his big chance to either persuade Smith to sign him fulltime or get a move to another club.
Although he wasn't exactly superfit when he joined us, but put in some performances that gave us a glimpse of the player that we all thought he could become.
Covid and his hamstring seem to have knocked him back to the point that he seems completely devoid of fitness and at the same time his football brain has gone for a walk.
But what's he been doing since he came back? Given his situation, I'd have thought he'd be busting a gut to get properly fit so he can show us how good he can be.
Instead he just doesn't seem interested.
I'm sure that behind the scenes he's been getting every assistance possible.
It looks to me as if he's given up and can't be arsed. Something he'll live to regret?
Post by: Drummond on April 13, 2021, 06:26:19 PM
Post by: N'ZMAV on April 13, 2021, 06:39:17 PM
Because I'm amazed that a professional could seem to perform so badly without a good reason.we've had plenty over the years
Post by: Mossie Hennebry on April 13, 2021, 07:07:04 PM
I'm sure I read that 10 of our first team squad had Covid-19, perhaps it's affecting him. Because I'm amazed that a professional could seem to perform so badly without a good reason.If it is affecting him, you would like to think that the manager would keep him out of the team. I think he's just N'Zogbia'd or Irelanded, or worse, McCormacked!
Post by: Mossie Hennebry on April 13, 2021, 07:07:42 PM
That would make 2 of us!he looks so unfit - that's how I'd look on the pitch.He looks bollixed.
He's been on the Guinness since Christmas.
Post by: PaulWinch again on April 13, 2021, 07:12:43 PM
Post by: Toronto Villa on April 13, 2021, 07:14:07 PM
It’s disappointing how it’s ended up. He was excellent in those first few games.
It’s like he did his hamstring and then lost all his mojo. Like he was scared to test or extend himself again.
Post by: The Edge on April 13, 2021, 07:54:23 PM
I agree with that. I have never seen a players form drop off so rapidly. It's either what you suggest or there's some huge bust up gone on and he's stopped even trying as a form of protest. That's pure speculation from me but I'm baffled by what I'm witnessing from him. One things for sure they can't keep giving him a shirt while he's under performing so massively. It would be great if he could snap out of it but I'm not gonna hold my breath.It’s disappointing how it’s ended up. He was excellent in those first few games.
It’s like he did his hamstring and then lost all his mojo. Like he was scared to test or extend himself again.
Post by: Dante Lavelli on April 13, 2021, 08:05:47 PM
It’s disappointing how it’s ended up. He was excellent in those first few games.
I think he had a big impact but I don’t think his form was that impressive. Or in XG terms he was achieving well above his average based on general performances. From memory there were some deflected goals, an excellent cross and a winning header in a match where I’d been previously moaning how shit he was playing.
Post by: RamboandBruno on April 13, 2021, 09:16:37 PM
Even with Trez and Grealish injured, I don’t think he should be anywhere near the side now until he leaves, potentially toxic. It’s a shame for him, but it can’t be our problem.
Post by: brontebilly on April 13, 2021, 10:22:59 PM
In that clip he looks like he's arguing with himself, or at least talking to himself. I reckon he is not in the right head space at the moment, a bit like Ross McCormack/Stephen Ireland/Drinkwater.
This is his last chance, if he doesn't turn himself around between now and the end of the season, no PL club will take the chance on him, and his career will dwindle into obscurity.
I really want him to succeed, but it looks like he wont.
I'm sure a few PL sides will still take a chance on him.
He looked bright (play wise) during the first part of the season and was a big factor in our early results. Talk of getting into the England squad (which is how Deano sold the loan to him) didn't look outlandish back then.
But if he's not getting in our team he won't be in contention for his parent club, I'd have thought.
Yet the likes of Palace or Newcastle may bite. Or Burnleh. A little closer to home and with cash on the hip now after their recent takeover.
If he tried those antics at Burnley, Dyche wouldn't be long getting rid of him like he did with his mate Drinky. Bruce already has Shelvey taking up the Barkley role at Newcastle.
Post by: Goldenballs on April 13, 2021, 10:31:16 PM
Post by: olaftab on April 13, 2021, 11:00:18 PM
Post by: Risso on April 13, 2021, 11:02:25 PM
I'm sure I read that 10 of our first team squad had Covid-19, perhaps it's affecting him. Because I'm amazed that a professional could seem to perform so badly without a good reason.
It was 9 players, but it could have been anybody out of the first team or U23's. Before the first game back this was reported:
"A lot of the players and staff were asymptomatic, but some symptoms crept up on people. I told one of the players that he'd had a positive test and he felt fine.
"He said, 'No chance, I'm in a good place.' Two days later when I spoke to him he was lying in bed with aches and pains.
"The hard part is to evaluate the players' recovery because we've only had a three-day build-up to Man City," said Smith, who is still without one unnamed coronavirus-affected player but does have Ross Barkley available for the first time in two months after hamstring trouble.
"We can't push them as much as you would like to assess their fitness levels, but that's no excuse.
"We've had an awful lot of players who have not had Covid at all, they've had 10 days of rest which other Premier League players haven't had."
So somebody was ill, but it doesn't sound like it was Barkley from that.
Post by: Drummond on April 13, 2021, 11:14:28 PM
He's never come across as a bad un to me before. Erratic at times and makes some odd choices in possession but he's really off form.
Post by: Ian. on April 13, 2021, 11:15:54 PM
Post by: Neil Hawkes on April 14, 2021, 08:48:31 AM
Post by: JD on April 14, 2021, 08:52:08 AM
We should cut the loan, regardless if we have to pay and just send him back. His headspace has completely gone.
Post by: Nii Lamptey on April 14, 2021, 01:16:46 PM
We're safe, we've blown any remote chance of Europe (and probably for the best), so get the kids in and give them some first team experience. Why play him when it's basically the equivalent of going a man down? Surely we're not thinking of making him permanent in the summer?? Terminating the loan early and sending him back to London would be the best option for us.
Post by: London Villan on April 14, 2021, 01:19:43 PM
Post by: Mossie Hennebry on April 14, 2021, 01:40:12 PM
It would be interesting if there were fans in the ground - I'm sure the message would get through about the lack of effort not being acceptable.I think he would be gone if the away section saw him lumbering around with the game in the mixer.
Post by: Risso on April 14, 2021, 02:26:13 PM
He offers absolutely nothing to our squad. HOW Smith gave him pitch time ahead of Keinan at the weekend still blows my mind?!
We're safe, we've blown any remote chance of Europe (and probably for the best), so get the kids in and give them some first team experience. Why play him when it's basically the equivalent of going a man down? Surely we're not thinking of making him permanent in the summer?? Terminating the loan early and sending him back to London would be the best option for us.
Did the same last year with Drinkwater. Baffling.
Post by: paul_e on April 14, 2021, 02:34:44 PM
Post by: Footy-Vill on April 14, 2021, 03:39:08 PM
The timing is good for him as he is nearing full match fitness just needs to be picking up the sharpness
Every chance Barkley will get a run of games now to season end
Interesting to see how he now performs as he's given the platform
A success in performance and contributing and he'll be signed.
Otherwise he won't be.
So let's see what he can bring.
Post by: Risso on April 14, 2021, 03:46:59 PM
Opportunity calls again now for Ross. Several injuries to other players have now placed him back into the first eleven.
The timing is good for him as he is nearing full match fitness just needs to be picking up the sharpness
I think of all the wrong things you post, that's the wrongest yet. Back in the first eleven my arse.
Post by: CT on April 14, 2021, 03:50:26 PM
Injured around mid November, it’s now mid April, but he’s “nearing full fitness”.
Post by: john e on April 14, 2021, 03:57:05 PM
I think Drinkwater was a panic loan when they realised how long McGinn was going to be out for with the idea that he'd bring a bit of experience into a midfield that was very short on premier league experience.
Always amazes me how 90% of posters on this forum with our limited knowledge could see exactly what we were getting with Drinkwater and said so at the time
Yet the highly paid professionals who have direct access to the player couldn’t
Scarily it’s because of stuff like this that I wouldn’t be surprised if we ended up signing Barkley at some knockdown price
Post by: Bobby Boy on April 14, 2021, 03:59:50 PM
It's hard to think of another English player in the Prem further away from the England team at the minute.....
Post by: Drummond on April 14, 2021, 04:07:36 PM
Dean sold Villa to Ross on the basis that he'd get him into the England picture for the Euros.
It's hard to think of another English player in the Prem further away from the England team at the minute.....
Billy Sharp
Post by: Bobby Boy on April 14, 2021, 04:26:59 PM
Dean sold Villa to Ross on the basis that he'd get him into the England picture for the Euros.
It's hard to think of another English player in the Prem further away from the England team at the minute.....
Billy Sharp
Ha, ha, yes, I guess that's true. Serves me right for not adding 'who isn't injured'.
Post by: Footy-Vill on April 14, 2021, 04:31:25 PM
Opportunity calls again now for Ross. Several injuries to other players have now placed him back into the first eleven.
The timing is good for him as he is nearing full match fitness just needs to be picking up the sharpness
I think of all the wrong things you post, that's the wrongest yet. Back in the first eleven my arse.
How long does he need to get fit from a hamstring injury?I'd like to give people more of the picture. To consider the situation Ross has been in regarding amount of football played.
Injured around mid November, it’s now mid April, but he’s “nearing full fitness”.
Yes lacked full game time sharpness.
Remember the training ground was closed for 10 days and Villa didn't play for 19 days at the start of the year
9 players had covid.
He had to play 6 games in 18 days.
Ross subbed in every game struggling to complete 90mins
The One match he did play 90 (as subbed in 90th min.)He scored v Soton.
In 8 games since January to end of Feb he was unable to be given 90 mins. His minutes were being managed.
And Dean Smith said all along " unfortunately he was having to get his fitness up during games" So during that period he was hardly training because of the hectic fixtures and playing match minutes only after recovering from a hamstring injury.
Then end of Feb vs Leeds because Barkley didn't perform well v Leicester. He was benched. We won. and he hasn't started since.
Let's. Be fair then and the bigger picture.
It's been very difficult for him since start of 2021 both in terms of form and regularly playing.
Frustrating all round. Especially last 6 to 7 weeks.
Barkley hasn't played more than 30 minutes of football in a match coming off the bench off the pace and trying to get to speed with things.
Starting him gives his form , confidence and fitness wonders.
A nice end to the season makes all parties happy.
A player with such provern ability, quality and skill can't be written off when the match sharpness and fitness hasn't always been there its just all been very stop start.
Barkley should now have the fortune (afer all his misfortune,) to be playing in the team and can hope to see his quality again.
Post by: Risso on April 14, 2021, 04:43:13 PM
Post by: paul_e on April 14, 2021, 04:45:46 PM
Opportunity calls again now for Ross. Several injuries to other players have now placed him back into the first eleven.
The timing is good for him as he is nearing full match fitness just needs to be picking up the sharpness
I think of all the wrong things you post, that's the wrongest yet. Back in the first eleven my arse.How long does he need to get fit from a hamstring injury?I'd like to give people more of the picture. To consider the situation Ross has been in regarding amount of football played.
Injured around mid November, it’s now mid April, but he’s “nearing full fitness”.
Yes lacked full game time sharpness.
Remember the training ground was closed for 10 days and Villa didn't play for 19 days at the start of the year
9 players had covid.
He had to play 6 games in 18 days.
Ross subbed in every game struggling to complete 90mins
The One match he did play 90 (as subbed in 90th min.)He scored v Soton.
In 8 games since January to end of Feb he was unable to be given 90 mins. His minutes were being managed.
And Dean Smith said all along " unfortunately he was having to get his fitness up during games" So during that period he was hardly training because of the hectic fixtures and playing match minutes only after recovering from a hamstring injury.
Then end of Feb vs Leeds because Barkley didn't perform well v Leicester. He was benched. We won. and he hasn't started since.
Let's. Be fair then and the bigger picture.
It's been very difficult for him since start of 2021 both in terms of form and regularly playing.
Frustrating all round. Especially last 6 to 7 weeks.
Barkley hasn't played more than 30 minutes of football in a match coming off the bench off the pace and trying to get to speed with things.
Starting him gives his form , confidence and fitness wonders.
A nice end to the season makes all parties happy.
A player with such provern ability, quality and skill can't be written off when the match sharpness and fitness hasn't always been there its just all been very stop start.
Barkley should now have the fortune (afer all his misfortune,) to be playing in the team and can hope to see his quality again.
Most of the problems people have had with him recently and that is clearly shown in the video we've been talking about is that there has been very little evidence of him trying to get up to speed with anything. If he's short of fitness and struggling for form I could forgive that if I thought he was doing his best to change things but right now he looks like he's blaming everything else for his problems and the one thing Villa fans won't let a player do is give up like that.
Post by: Skerra on April 14, 2021, 04:53:07 PM
Post by: Mister E on April 14, 2021, 05:39:36 PM
I'd like to give people more of the picture. To consider the situation Ross has been in regarding amount of football played.We're in a bit of a Catch-22 with Barkley:
Yes lacked full game time sharpness.
Remember the training ground was closed for 10 days and Villa didn't play for 19 days at the start of the year
9 players had covid.
He had to play 6 games in 18 days.
Ross subbed in every game struggling to complete 90mins
The One match he did play 90 (as subbed in 90th min.)He scored v Soton.
In 8 games since January to end of Feb he was unable to be given 90 mins. His minutes were being managed.
And Dean Smith said all along " unfortunately he was having to get his fitness up during games" So during that period he was hardly training because of the hectic fixtures and playing match minutes only after recovering from a hamstring injury.
Then end of Feb vs Leeds because Barkley didn't perform well v Leicester. He was benched. We won. and he hasn't started since.
Let's. Be fair then and the bigger picture.
It's been very difficult for him since start of 2021 both in terms of form and regularly playing.
Frustrating all round. Especially last 6 to 7 weeks.
Barkley hasn't played more than 30 minutes of football in a match coming off the bench off the pace and trying to get to speed with things.
Starting him gives his form , confidence and fitness wonders.
A nice end to the season makes all parties happy.
A player with such proven ability, quality and skill can't be written off when the match sharpness and fitness hasn't always been there its just all been very stop start.
Barkley should now have the fortune (after all his misfortune,) to be playing in the team and can hope to see his quality again.
If we play him and - as F-V says - he gets significantly better, we potentially pay over the odds to secure him on a perm. And, we may sign a player who flatters to deceive and does not add much next season and beyond.
Or, we play him and he continues to do little for the team between now and the end of the season and we sit in the doldrums of the not-quite-relegated group of teams.
My personal prejudice is to move on and find a better option at #10. But then, I've never been a big fan of Barkley at any of his clubs.
Post by: frank black on April 14, 2021, 05:51:08 PM
Opportunity calls again now for Ross. Several injuries to other players have now placed him back into the first eleven.
The timing is good for him as he is nearing full match fitness just needs to be picking up the sharpness
I think of all the wrong things you post, that's the wrongest yet. Back in the first eleven my arse.How long does he need to get fit from a hamstring injury?I'd like to give people more of the picture. To consider the situation Ross has been in regarding amount of football played.
Injured around mid November, it’s now mid April, but he’s “nearing full fitness”.
Yes lacked full game time sharpness.
Remember the training ground was closed for 10 days and Villa didn't play for 19 days at the start of the year
9 players had covid.
He had to play 6 games in 18 days.
Ross subbed in every game struggling to complete 90mins
The One match he did play 90 (as subbed in 90th min.)He scored v Soton.
In 8 games since January to end of Feb he was unable to be given 90 mins. His minutes were being managed.
And Dean Smith said all along " unfortunately he was having to get his fitness up during games" So during that period he was hardly training because of the hectic fixtures and playing match minutes only after recovering from a hamstring injury.
Then end of Feb vs Leeds because Barkley didn't perform well v Leicester. He was benched. We won. and he hasn't started since.
Let's. Be fair then and the bigger picture.
It's been very difficult for him since start of 2021 both in terms of form and regularly playing.
Frustrating all round. Especially last 6 to 7 weeks.
Barkley hasn't played more than 30 minutes of football in a match coming off the bench off the pace and trying to get to speed with things.
Starting him gives his form , confidence and fitness wonders.
A nice end to the season makes all parties happy.
A player with such provern ability, quality and skill can't be written off when the match sharpness and fitness hasn't always been there its just all been very stop start.
Barkley should now have the fortune (afer all his misfortune,) to be playing in the team and can hope to see his quality again.
He’s certainly not a player to rely upon and therefore there’s zero chance of us signing him.
Post by: N'ZMAV on April 14, 2021, 06:25:18 PM
Post by: andyh on April 14, 2021, 07:19:58 PM
West Ham fancy Barkley apparently. Idiots.Foil to get Lingard ?
Post by: Footy-Vill on April 14, 2021, 07:32:17 PM
Did you watch the Liverpool game Footy?Yes Ross was off the pace.
Proves he's not totally ready.
Disappointing and frustrating all round.
Post by: Footy-Vill on April 14, 2021, 07:32:32 PM
West Ham fancy Barkley apparently. Idiots.
West Ham fancy McGinn I read. Nasty rumours that one.
If they get champions league though. They have an incentive for players.
Abraham would be on their radar too
Post by: pauliewalnuts on April 14, 2021, 07:41:54 PM
West Ham fancy Barkley apparently. Idiots.
West Ham fancy McGinn I read. Nasty rumours that one.
If they get champions league though. They have an incentive for players.
Abraham would be on their radar too
There is no way we'd lose SJM to West Ham because they'd pulled off a freak CL place (which they haven't actually done yet).
Post by: Rudy Can't Fail on April 14, 2021, 08:00:27 PM
I feel that Barkley doesn’t really give his all for us.
Reading some old threads on a couple of Everton forums, he didn't really give his all for them either.. and he bloody supports them. Funny how the blame was placed at Martinez's door for telling Barkley he's a top talent so didn't have to do the donkey work.
Post by: Mister E on April 14, 2021, 08:19:35 PM
Martinez from Wigan as opposed to our Emi, I assume :-)I feel that Barkley doesn’t really give his all for us.Reading some old threads on a couple of Everton forums, he didn't really give his all for them either.. and he bloody supports them. Funny how the blame was placed at Martinez's door for telling Barkley he's a top talent so didn't have to do the donkey work.
Post by: Steve67 on April 14, 2021, 08:23:28 PM
Post by: London Villan on April 14, 2021, 08:42:23 PM
My memory is playing me up but I honestly cannot remember another player who arrived with such a fanfair and has disappointed me so much. Alan Thompson, Nigel Reo Coker and Micah Richards are others but Ross Barkley takes the prize.
To add to the list
Curcic
Collymore
Nzogbia
Post by: Brend'Watkins on April 14, 2021, 08:44:23 PM
Post by: villa `cross the mersey on April 14, 2021, 08:47:57 PM
Neale CooperMy memory is playing me up but I honestly cannot remember another player who arrived with such a fanfair and has disappointed me so much. Alan Thompson, Nigel Reo Coker and Micah Richards are others but Ross Barkley takes the prize.
To add to the list
Curcic
Collymore
Nzogbia
Post by: Dante Lavelli on April 14, 2021, 09:09:44 PM
Did you watch the Liverpool game Footy?Yes Ross was off the pace.
Proves he's not totally ready.
Disappointing and frustrating all round.
The clip isn’t a case of fitness. He is either hiding or feels that chasing back is not his responsibility.
Post by: Steve67 on April 14, 2021, 10:10:00 PM
Neale CooperMy memory is playing me up but I honestly cannot remember another player who arrived with such a fanfair and has disappointed me so much. Alan Thompson, Nigel Reo Coker and Micah Richards are others but Ross Barkley takes the prize.
To add to the list
Curcic
Collymore
Nzogbia
Actually, Stan Collymore probably wins the overall award, I stand corrected. Great shout. But what a major disappointment in any case.
Post by: brontebilly on April 15, 2021, 12:08:43 AM
My memory is playing me up but I honestly cannot remember another player who arrived with such a fanfair and has disappointed me so much. Alan Thompson, Nigel Reo Coker and Micah Richards are others but Ross Barkley takes the prize.
Thought Reo Coker did pretty well for us. Limited enough player but effective most of the time.
Post by: thick_mike on April 15, 2021, 06:45:01 AM
Neale CooperMy memory is playing me up but I honestly cannot remember another player who arrived with such a fanfair and has disappointed me so much. Alan Thompson, Nigel Reo Coker and Micah Richards are others but Ross Barkley takes the prize.
To add to the list
Curcic
Collymore
Nzogbia
Actually, Stan Collymore probably wins the overall award, I stand corrected. Great shout. But what a major disappointment in any case.
Didier Six?
Post by: brian green on April 15, 2021, 06:57:56 AM
Post by: N'ZMAV on April 15, 2021, 07:18:09 AM
Post by: Mister E on April 15, 2021, 08:33:05 AM
Baros.Nah, we knew he was shit at the time ...
Post by: richtheholtender on April 15, 2021, 08:37:47 AM
Post by: Nev on April 15, 2021, 08:39:19 AM
Post by: Footy-Vill on April 15, 2021, 08:42:28 AM
3 years at Villa.
Post by: JD on April 15, 2021, 09:16:20 AM
Post by: Villan82 on April 15, 2021, 09:20:24 AM
My memory is playing me up but I honestly cannot remember another player who arrived with such a fanfair and has disappointed me so much. Alan Thompson, Nigel Reo Coker and Micah Richards are others but Ross Barkley takes the prize.
To add to the list
Curcic
Collymore
Nzogbia
Collymore always wins this award for me. Surprised to see Alan Thompson in this discussion, thought he didn't do too bad. Not great not terrible.
Post by: brian green on April 15, 2021, 09:27:27 AM
Post by: Rudy Can't Fail on April 15, 2021, 11:45:49 AM
My memory is playing me up but I honestly cannot remember another player who arrived with such a fanfair and has disappointed me so much. Alan Thompson, Nigel Reo Coker and Micah Richards are others but Ross Barkley takes the prize.
To add to the list
Curcic
Collymore
Nzogbia
Collymore always wins this award for me. Surprised to see Alan Thompson in this discussion, thought he didn't do too bad. Not great not terrible.
Tommy Craig.
Post by: Andy_Lochhead_in_the_air on April 15, 2021, 12:00:22 PM
Stephen Ireland
Bear in mind the Ireland deal also enabled us to offload Milner.
Post by: richtheholtender on April 15, 2021, 12:08:34 PM
Stephen Ireland
Bear in mind the Ireland deal also enabled us to offload Milner.
Exactly
Post by: edgysatsuma89 on April 15, 2021, 12:23:07 PM
Post by: eamonn on April 15, 2021, 01:09:32 PM
Baros.Nah, we knew he was shit at the time ...
Would have been more at home in Bros.
Having said that, aren't we one of the few clubs to have had two Euro Golden Boot winners play for us (albeit not at the time - Savo for Former Yugoslavia in 2000 and Baros for Czech Rep in 2004)?
Post by: N'ZMAV on April 15, 2021, 01:14:07 PM
does it count that Baros was a Liverpool player at the time? :)Baros.Nah, we knew he was shit at the time ...
Would have been more at home in Bros.
Having said that, aren't we one of the few clubs to have had two Euro Golden Boot winners play for us (albeit not at the time - Savo for Former Yugoslavia in 2000 and Baros for Czech Rep in 2004)?
Post by: SaddVillan on April 15, 2021, 01:17:39 PM
"I think he's looking to find the form he was in before his [hamstring] injury."
If that's the case then Barkley''s obviously not looking very hard or in the right places.
It's over for him at Villa. Pat him on theback, wish him well and send him back Chelsea.
Our season's pretty well done. We're safe from relegation and aren't going to make Europe.
Let's not worry about a few League positions here or there, it's time to look to and build for the future.
Give some minutes to the kids and try different formations?
It would be great to see some of them put in an appearance when Villa Park reopens for the last match of the season.
Post by: eamonn on April 15, 2021, 01:54:42 PM
does it count that Baros was a Liverpool player at the time? :)Baros.Nah, we knew he was shit at the time ...
Would have been more at home in Bros.
Having said that, aren't we one of the few clubs to have had two Euro Golden Boot winners play for us (albeit not at the time - Savo for Former Yugoslavia in 2000 and Baros for Czech Rep in 2004)?
I know, I tried to qualify my statement. Savo was also still at the club we sold him to (Zaragoza) in summer 2000 but got a big-money move to Parma on the back of his tournament performance.
Post by: brian green on April 15, 2021, 06:55:55 PM
Post by: LeeB on April 15, 2021, 07:12:14 PM
We have had three golden boot winners/sharers if you include Peter McParland's five for Northern Ireland in Sweden in 1958. Not that it was being called the Golden Boot then. They were far less bullshit times.
As fine an achievement as it was I think Just Fontaine may take issue with that claim
Post by: brian green on April 15, 2021, 07:39:33 PM
Post by: Lastfootstamper on April 15, 2021, 09:37:42 PM
"All-Star Team
The team of the tournament voted by journalists was as follows:[15][16][17]
Goalkeeper: Harry Gregg
Defenders: Orvar Bergmark, Hilderaldo Bellini, Nílton Santos
Midfielders: Yuriy Voynov, Horst Szymaniak
Forwards: Garrincha, Didi, Raymond Kopa, Pelé, Lennart Skoglund
Although Just Fontaine got more votes than any other forward, they were split between the left and right inside forward positions.[15] The All-Star Team scored 12 goals in total. Fontaine scored 13."
Post by: brian green on April 15, 2021, 09:46:58 PM
Post by: ASHTONVILLA on April 15, 2021, 09:54:27 PM
Post by: Smirker on April 15, 2021, 10:32:33 PM
Post by: edgysatsuma89 on April 15, 2021, 10:46:02 PM
Post by: eamonn on April 16, 2021, 01:09:12 AM
I'd take him on a free at this point. That's it. Much better out there.
Pete McParland? In fine fettle from the last interview I saw him give. Would probably still offer more than Barkley.
Post by: Mister E on April 16, 2021, 09:02:27 AM
Someone said to me he's either a 4/10 or a 8 or 9/10. Really though how many 8/9's has he had? 4 games? I don't think I could argue above 4. I also preferred us when he wasn't in the team and Grealish in the middle when we went back to back 3.0's. Maybe we're being harsh and the injury really did set him back but either way I wouldn't want his wages on our books next season.He's had 2 games with us where he's consistently demonstrated some quality and 2 where he scored a goal but played very little part in the rest of the game (which might be okay for a striker but is not acceptable for a midfielder, IMHO).
Post by: chrisw1 on April 16, 2021, 09:32:21 AM
My memory is playing me up but I honestly cannot remember another player who arrived with such a fanfair and has disappointed me so much. Alan Thompson, Nigel Reo Coker and Micah Richards are others but Ross Barkley takes the prize.Are you talking about his entire tenure? Because to my mind he played a big part in our excellent form in the first half of the season. I didn't see Alan Thompson etc contribute in that way. If you're ignoring his excellent initial impact and talking just post injury then yest I'd agree with you he's been very poor.
Post by: eamonn on April 16, 2021, 09:49:40 AM
Post by: stubbsyandy on April 16, 2021, 10:04:38 AM
Post by: aldridgeboy on April 16, 2021, 10:09:10 AM
My memory is playing me up but I honestly cannot remember another player who arrived with such a fanfair and has disappointed me so much. Alan Thompson, Nigel Reo Coker and Micah Richards are others but Ross Barkley takes the prize.Are you talking about his entire tenure? Because to my mind he played a big part in our excellent form in the first half of the season. I didn't see Alan Thompson etc contribute in that way. If you're ignoring his excellent initial impact and talking just post injury then yest I'd agree with you he's been very poor.
I’ll see your Alan Thompson. And raise you a Sasa Curcic?
Post by: brontebilly on April 16, 2021, 10:14:58 AM
Yeah but first half of the season suggests he was great for up to 19 games when in reality it was...three or four?!
Let's get this clarified once and for all...
How many games did Barks get 7/10 or higher....I'll go with Liverpool, Arsenal and Leicester. I know he scored v Southampton but he was poor that night in truth, if I recall correctly Jack carried the team on his back that night. Maybe Burnley...I can't really remember him that night
Post by: in exile on April 16, 2021, 10:31:17 AM
I'd take him on a free at this point. That's it. Much better out there.Still have to pay the waste of skin though.
Post by: Smithy on April 16, 2021, 12:46:05 PM
At this point, I think we have to hold our hands up and say it hasn't really worked out. My concern is that the club will look at the [rare] times he and Grealish started together and wonder if that's something to build on next season. They were good together before Ross got injured, and then OK in the couple of games before Jack got injured - but on his own Ross has not really looked that great.
If we sign him, I'll trust the club knows more about what he will deliver than I do - but I don't see it happening. It would defeat the purpose of a loan to 'try before you buy', because I don't think there are many fans clamouring to sign him at the moment?
Post by: ChicagoLion on April 16, 2021, 01:01:43 PM
Even a free would be a mistake. He is no longer the player signed by Chelsea.
It was a risk and there have been some good moments but it hasn't worked out.
I have said all along that he has fitness issues which has plagued his career for some time now.
Post by: Damo70 on April 16, 2021, 06:14:35 PM
Post by: eamonn on April 16, 2021, 06:32:06 PM
Post by: robbo1874 on April 17, 2021, 12:40:56 AM
Post by: SaddVillan on April 17, 2021, 01:43:03 AM
43 of whom never made a first team appearance.
Part of Chelsea's business model is based on earning income from loan fees and from sales of players deemed not good enough for the first team.
The Academy is seen as a profit centre to make money, rather than a source of players for the first team.
They have over 30 players out on loan this season..
Post by: ChicagoLion on April 17, 2021, 08:37:31 AM
Presumably they’ll refund us 3 mill if we sign him permanently?I think they would pay us to take him off their hands.
Post by: TopDeck113 on April 17, 2021, 09:12:25 AM
It has been said before but it worth repeating: the Chelsea loan model stinks. Whilst accepting that we were the beneficiaries when it came to having Tammy in our promotion season, it is simply not right that a club can hoover up far more talent than it can possibly need to the detriment of both the vast majority of those players and the game in general.
If - IF - the Premier league and the EFL had any backbone, then they would limit the number of players a PL club could loan out. I would suggest a maximum of two to other PL clubs (plus scrap the rule that prevents a player playing against his parent club) and a maximum of five to EFL clubs (from a developmental perspective, I accept that it is often beneficial for a player who will ultimately make it to spend a season playing regularly at a competitive level a rung or two down the ladder).
Post by: RamboandBruno on April 17, 2021, 09:29:35 AM
Post by: ChicagoLion on April 18, 2021, 06:50:12 AM
Hi isn’t getting anywhere near the Chelsea squad let alone the team.
Continual injury problems- probably permanent.
Poor attitude.
£4.8 million salary
28 years old so no sell on value
I think he sits out his contract at Chelsea whilst they try desperately to get him off their books.
Post by: dcdavecollett on April 19, 2021, 01:50:41 AM
Post by: eamonn on April 19, 2021, 01:00:46 PM
Post by: mr underhill on April 19, 2021, 01:21:41 PM
Post by: Dick Edwards on April 19, 2021, 04:16:21 PM
It has been said before but it worth repeating: the Chelsea loan model stinks. Whilst accepting that we were the beneficiaries when it came to having Tammy in our promotion season, it is simply not right that a club can hoover up far more talent than it can possibly need to the detriment of both the vast majority of those players and the game in general.
If - IF - the Premier league and the EFL had any backbone, then they would limit the number of players a PL club could loan out. I would suggest a maximum of two to other PL clubs (plus scrap the rule that prevents a player playing against his parent club) and a maximum of five to EFL clubs (from a developmental perspective, I accept that it is often beneficial for a player who will ultimately make it to spend a season playing regularly at a competitive level a rung or two down the ladder).
I've said this before but the loan system was not designed for this level of abuse. It was primarily for players recovering from injury who could go on loan with a view to signing for the new team when he'd proved his fitness. It should be clamped down on, especially in light of this Super League business. I propose all loans should only be made with an agreed fee at the end of the season to make the deal permanent. This would stop clubs like Chelsea hoovering up all these players as they couldn't just send young players out on loan to get experience and boost their value or make them more first team ready.
Post by: paul_e on April 19, 2021, 04:58:11 PM
It has been said before but it worth repeating: the Chelsea loan model stinks. Whilst accepting that we were the beneficiaries when it came to having Tammy in our promotion season, it is simply not right that a club can hoover up far more talent than it can possibly need to the detriment of both the vast majority of those players and the game in general.
If - IF - the Premier league and the EFL had any backbone, then they would limit the number of players a PL club could loan out. I would suggest a maximum of two to other PL clubs (plus scrap the rule that prevents a player playing against his parent club) and a maximum of five to EFL clubs (from a developmental perspective, I accept that it is often beneficial for a player who will ultimately make it to spend a season playing regularly at a competitive level a rung or two down the ladder).
I've said this before but the loan system was not designed for this level of abuse. It was primarily for players recovering from injury who could go on loan with a view to signing for the new team when he'd proved his fitness. It should be clamped down on, especially in light of this Super League business. I propose all loans should only be made with an agreed fee at the end of the season to make the deal permanent. This would stop clubs like Chelsea hoovering up all these players as they couldn't just send young players out on loan to get experience and boost their value or make them more first team ready.
Only if the player is over a certain age (21 for me). Younger players need the opportunity to go out on loans and lower league teams rely on them, a blanket rule like this would do far more damage than good.
Post by: Dick Edwards on April 20, 2021, 07:05:00 AM
It has been said before but it worth repeating: the Chelsea loan model stinks. Whilst accepting that we were the beneficiaries when it came to having Tammy in our promotion season, it is simply not right that a club can hoover up far more talent than it can possibly need to the detriment of both the vast majority of those players and the game in general.
If - IF - the Premier league and the EFL had any backbone, then they would limit the number of players a PL club could loan out. I would suggest a maximum of two to other PL clubs (plus scrap the rule that prevents a player playing against his parent club) and a maximum of five to EFL clubs (from a developmental perspective, I accept that it is often beneficial for a player who will ultimately make it to spend a season playing regularly at a competitive level a rung or two down the ladder).
I've said this before but the loan system was not designed for this level of abuse. It was primarily for players recovering from injury who could go on loan with a view to signing for the new team when he'd proved his fitness. It should be clamped down on, especially in light of this Super League business. I propose all loans should only be made with an agreed fee at the end of the season to make the deal permanent. This would stop clubs like Chelsea hoovering up all these players as they couldn't just send young players out on loan to get experience and boost their value or make them more first team ready.
Only if the player is over a certain age (21 for me). Younger players need the opportunity to go out on loans and lower league teams rely on them, a blanket rule like this would do far more damage than good.
But big clubs, not necessarily Chelsea wouldn't have so many players if they knew they couldn't send them out on loan to gain experience. The majority have next to no chance coming through the system to first team as the bigger clubs of this world buy the finished article. That would mean youngsters would be more likely to sign for lower league clubs knowing they'd see a route from development through to regular first team action. Once mature, the bigger clubs would have to pay a healthy fee to the developing club instead of smaller clubs having to pay big clubs for the privilege of developing players.
Post by: paul_e on April 20, 2021, 08:11:10 AM
Imagine the harm to Grealish if he either had to come through at Walsall or had been permanently signed by notts county or hadn't been able to have a season at that level and had just played u23s instead.
For young players the loan system works perfectly and benefits everyone.
Post by: manic-road on April 20, 2021, 09:36:06 AM
He's Drinkwater Mark2
He's not though, Drinkwater didn't have a single positive impact on any game in a Villa shirt that I can remember.
Post by: olaftab on April 20, 2021, 09:51:30 AM
Post by: CT on April 21, 2021, 10:13:30 PM
The sending off completely derailed us, but for fucks sake, we bring on a player who clearly can’t be arsed and hasn’t for months. Game over.
I’d have turned that off if my team hadn’t have been involved.
Post by: CT Villan on April 21, 2021, 10:15:53 PM
Post by: Smirker on April 21, 2021, 10:21:19 PM
Post by: paul_e on April 21, 2021, 10:21:20 PM
Post by: Risso on April 21, 2021, 10:24:08 PM
Post by: dorsetvillian on April 21, 2021, 10:25:18 PM
Post by: Diablo on April 21, 2021, 10:25:23 PM
Shite. Had a handful of good moments this season. Send back to Chelsea.100%
Post by: Goldie.7 on April 21, 2021, 10:35:08 PM
https://streamable.com/sdvzqq
Post by: eamonn on April 21, 2021, 10:40:05 PM
Post by: Des Little on April 21, 2021, 10:41:46 PM
Post by: Jon Crofts on April 21, 2021, 10:42:12 PM
Post by: The Edge on April 21, 2021, 10:54:34 PM
Post by: Risso on April 21, 2021, 10:59:04 PM
I think I owe an apology to a few people on here. When we signed him on loan there were a few here less than thrilled. Using my legendary ability to spot a talent i stuck up for him and it seemed for a few games that I was right. But... I can honestly say I have never seen a players form dip so dramatically. He now looks like a lumbering sulking shadow of the player he was. Get rid.
Same for me.
Post by: cdbearsfan on April 21, 2021, 11:54:29 PM
Post by: aj2k77 on April 22, 2021, 12:22:59 AM
Post by: brontebilly on April 22, 2021, 12:29:29 AM
Post by: Brend'Watkins on April 22, 2021, 12:31:08 AM
Post by: cdbearsfan on April 22, 2021, 12:34:48 AM
Post by: cdward on April 22, 2021, 06:38:34 AM
Please do not sign any other player named Ross. It doesn't work.
Thanks.
The fans.
Post by: Tayls_7 on April 22, 2021, 08:10:15 AM
Dear Aston Villa,
Please do not sign any other player named Ross. It doesn't work.
Thanks.
The fans.
Unless preceded by Ian.
Post by: Mister E on April 22, 2021, 08:49:55 AM
Post by: colin69 on April 22, 2021, 08:59:57 AM
Can’t shoot, can’t pass, can’t run and can’t tackle....Jack obviously made him look good at the start of the season.
Post by: caster troy on April 22, 2021, 10:06:17 AM
I can accept poor play, loss of form etc. But the one thing I absolutely cannot accept is that level of effort. If we'd brought Chukwuemeka on sure the game might have passed him by, but I can guarantee he would have run his bollocks off for the team, and it would have been a great reward for the lad after bossing every single u23s game this season. But no, instead we get Barkley again for what seemed like his 10th pointless substitute appearance where he contributed less than zero. He's not even our player FFS! What was the point?
If fans had been there I'm convinced they would have booed like crazy when they saw him coming on, which may not be the right thing to do but at least it might have been the last we see of him.
Post by: Risso on April 22, 2021, 10:07:42 AM
Post by: Three Spires Villa on April 22, 2021, 10:25:34 AM
Post by: Drummond on April 22, 2021, 10:30:50 AM
I think I owe an apology to a few people on here. When we signed him on loan there were a few here less than thrilled. Using my legendary ability to spot a talent i stuck up for him and it seemed for a few games that I was right. But... I can honestly say I have never seen a players form dip so dramatically. He now looks like a lumbering sulking shadow of the player he was. Get rid.
Same for me.
And you two aren't alone. His first few games were brilliant but the injury and Covid break seems to have finished him.
He can't complain he's not had an opportunity either; I wonder if he realises his career is done at a decent level and his motivation etc has gone too.
Post by: cdbearsfan on April 22, 2021, 10:35:18 AM
Post by: eamonn on April 22, 2021, 10:46:00 AM
Post by: CT on April 22, 2021, 11:35:24 AM
Quote:
‘Fuckin shit Barks, fuck off man, fuck off’
I did wonder how long it would take players giving their all to lose patience with someone who barely breaks out of a trot.
Post by: brontebilly on April 22, 2021, 11:37:56 AM
I mentioned Tyrone swearing at someone last night. It was Barkley.
Quote:
‘Fuckin shit Barks, fuck off man, fuck off’
I did wonder how long it would take players giving their all to lose patience with someone who barely breaks out of a trot.
To be fair I think that was the time Mings just wellied one under little pressure straight back to City. Was wondering who he was having a go at alright.
Post by: Risso on April 22, 2021, 11:39:10 AM
I mentioned Tyrone swearing at someone last night. It was Barkley.
Quote:
‘Fuckin shit Barks, fuck off man, fuck off’
I did wonder how long it would take players giving their all to lose patience with someone who barely breaks out of a trot.
Saw that. Signs that things aren't happy in the camp at the moment. It's just utterly baffling why Smith persists with him. He's crap, hasn't offered anything for months, and isn't our player. As I said last night at least with playing one of the kids you'd get effort and energy, and they couldn't affect games less than Fat Ross, because he's not even trying at the moment.
Post by: eamonn on April 22, 2021, 11:40:50 AM
Post by: Bad English on April 22, 2021, 12:12:03 PM
Post by: Risso on April 22, 2021, 12:15:19 PM
It's an interesting point though. Do all his teammates notice his lack of application during the game or on the playback "debrief" afterwards? And if so, do they keep schtum cos he's meant to be one of the "stars"? Dean has said before that he sometimes gets the players to lead the de-brief after a bad result. Can you imagine Barkley doing it?! Doesn't come across as the most articulate. Add that to his performances and the poor bugger would squirm his way back to Chelsea.
I can't imagine Mings keeping quiet, and there were times in the poor runs last season when the players said that home truths were often aired in the changing room. Hopefully this is still the case.
Post by: dave shelley on April 22, 2021, 12:46:08 PM
* I know midfielders carry a higher premium but you get my point.
Post by: Monty on April 22, 2021, 01:22:18 PM
Post by: caster troy on April 22, 2021, 01:45:39 PM
Kiraly
Bradley
Jenas
Dawkins
Holman
Holt
Ilori
Baston
Drinkwater
Post by: dave.woodhall on April 22, 2021, 01:49:18 PM
Does he now feature in our top 10 'worst loans' in recent history? I managed to find 9 that are arguably worse.
Kiraly
Bradley
Jenas
Dawkins
Holman
Holt
Ilori
Baston
Drinkwater
Holman and I think Ilori were frees. Bradley was odd - he didn't show much here but went on to do well in Serie A. There was also Drobny, who didn't play a game and was later killed in a skiing accident.
Post by: caster troy on April 22, 2021, 01:57:29 PM
Does he now feature in our top 10 'worst loans' in recent history? I managed to find 9 that are arguably worse.
Kiraly
Bradley
Jenas
Dawkins
Holman
Holt
Ilori
Baston
Drinkwater
Holman and I think Ilori were frees. Bradley was odd - he didn't show much here but went on to do well in Serie A. There was also Drobny, who didn't play a game and was later killed in a skiing accident.
Gosh that's awful. I remember the name but I don't think I saw him play for us.
Post by: brontebilly on April 22, 2021, 03:21:28 PM
Does he now feature in our top 10 'worst loans' in recent history? I managed to find 9 that are arguably worse.
Kiraly
Bradley
Jenas
Dawkins
Holman
Holt
Ilori
Baston
Drinkwater
Doubt we paid a loan fee for most of those. Drinky and Jenas were predictable flops alright but Barks won't be beaten.
Bolasie was another expensive mistake.
Post by: eamonn on April 22, 2021, 03:34:47 PM
Post by: wittonwarrior on April 22, 2021, 03:41:30 PM
Does he now feature in our top 10 'worst loans' in recent history? I managed to find 9 that are arguably worse.
Kiraly
Bradley
Jenas
Dawkins
Holman
Holt
Ilori
Baston
Drinkwater
Where is Bolasie and Onomah ? Both bloody awful.
Post by: SoccerHQ on April 22, 2021, 04:34:28 PM
Post by: Abbeyfealeavfc on April 22, 2021, 04:48:29 PM
Makes for an interesting changing room.
Post by: Mister E on April 22, 2021, 05:49:54 PM
Post by: wittonwarrior on April 22, 2021, 06:07:17 PM
Post by: Border villan on April 22, 2021, 06:22:18 PM
Post by: exigo on April 22, 2021, 07:44:35 PM
"F****** s*** pass. F*** off Ross. F*** off back."?
Post by: itmustbe_it is! on April 22, 2021, 08:42:47 PM
Post by: caster troy on April 22, 2021, 09:28:43 PM
Post by: Footy-Vill on April 22, 2021, 09:52:23 PM
I never wanna see Ross play again
Guilty feet have got no rhythm
Coz he takes its easy won't extend
I know he plays us for a fool
He should have known better than to cheat his friend
And waste a chance that he's been given
So Ross do you ever wanna play again
The way you played against Liverpool
Post by: andyh on April 22, 2021, 10:46:25 PM
I think his best mate Jack should be having words with Ross too after Grealish careless whispers for Ross to come to Villa
I never wanna see Ross play again
Guilty feet have got no rhythm
Coz he takes its easy won't extend
I know he plays us for a fool
He should have known better than to cheat his friend
And waste a chance that he's been given
So Ross do you ever wanna play again
The way you played against Liverpool
Of course it’s jacks fault. In your eyes.
Post by: eamonn on April 23, 2021, 12:54:26 AM
Post by: Footy-Vill on April 23, 2021, 08:18:04 AM
Mings has had enough of chelski's ross judging by the video doing the rounds from last night's game.
Makes for an interesting changing room.
Exactly so would expected Grealish to have words with Barkley too on opportunities and performance.
The only thing Ross has issue could be the fitness but the misplaced passes everytime he's come on is now just annoying everyone
Post by: RichardBatchelor on April 23, 2021, 11:43:29 AM
Post by: andyh on April 23, 2021, 12:24:01 PM
Blimey, we’d have snapped him up for £30m at Christmas.
Now , I’d rather send him back today and recall Hourihane....that’s how shit Barkley is.
Post by: Andy_Lochhead_in_the_air on April 25, 2021, 10:59:15 PM
But he did at make some positive contributions and for the first time in quite a while was not completely shit.
There I've said it.
Post by: brontebilly on April 25, 2021, 11:07:46 PM
Like many, I was shocked that Barkley started tonight.
But he did at make some positive contributions and for the first time in quite a while was not completely shit.
There I've said it.
Yeah he was ok tonight. Gassed after about 70 mins.
Post by: Pete3206 on April 25, 2021, 11:14:28 PM
Post by: ChicagoLion on April 26, 2021, 05:55:57 AM
Post by: paul_e on April 26, 2021, 08:56:31 AM
Glad when he went off and we looked better for it.
Agreed, he looked decent for the first 15-20minutes but was barely involved for the rest of the first half and shouldn't have come back out at half time. 2nd half he was barely involved and was clearly fucked by the hour mark.
Post by: Drummond on April 26, 2021, 08:58:46 AM
Post by: Ian. on April 26, 2021, 09:02:42 AM
Post by: JUAN PABLO on April 26, 2021, 09:06:19 AM
Post by: brontebilly on April 26, 2021, 09:17:06 AM
Glad when he went off and we looked better for it.
Agreed, he looked decent for the first 15-20minutes but was barely involved for the rest of the first half and shouldn't have come back out at half time. 2nd half he was barely involved and was clearly fucked by the hour mark.
Very harsh, he started the second half well too. Made space nicely for himself for a shot with his left foot that one of their defenders did very well to block. Bit more graft than usual without the ball I thought. Fitness levels are very poor though.
Post by: paul_e on April 26, 2021, 09:19:31 AM
Post by: Mister E on April 26, 2021, 09:19:32 AM
Post by: Risso on April 26, 2021, 09:24:52 AM
Post by: brontebilly on April 26, 2021, 09:38:23 AM
I just don't understand the rationale for starting him. He's been absolutely dreadful every game he's played for months and months. The game yesterday was always going to be the easiest we had left in the run in, so you'd expect everybody to look better, which on the whole they did. Why not then, give Ramsey a start or perhaps even rearrange things slightly so that Davis could start. I expect we'll see Fat Ross starting against Everton, because, well, it's Everton and he played against them.
Ramsey hasn't impressed when he has started though. Not just against City but even the likes of Newcastle. Maybe it's less pressure coming on off the bench where he impressed again yesterday. With Sanson, Trez and Grealish out, I guess options are limited. I'm far from a fan of Barkley but he did ok yesterday as did AEG.
Post by: andyh on April 26, 2021, 09:51:08 AM
I just don't understand the rationale for starting him. He's been absolutely dreadful every game he's played for months and months. The game yesterday was always going to be the easiest we had left in the run in, so you'd expect everybody to look better, which on the whole they did. Why not then, give Ramsey a start or perhaps even rearrange things slightly so that Davis could start. I expect we'll see Fat Ross starting against Everton, because, well, it's Everton and he played against them.Plus, Smith has already said we aren’t going to buy Barkley, so why give him a start ahead of our own players that need developing and experience.
Post by: TelfordVilla on April 26, 2021, 09:52:22 AM
Post by: Risso on April 26, 2021, 10:01:14 AM
I just don't understand the rationale for starting him. He's been absolutely dreadful every game he's played for months and months. The game yesterday was always going to be the easiest we had left in the run in, so you'd expect everybody to look better, which on the whole they did. Why not then, give Ramsey a start or perhaps even rearrange things slightly so that Davis could start. I expect we'll see Fat Ross starting against Everton, because, well, it's Everton and he played against them.
Ramsey hasn't impressed when he has started though. Not just against City but even the likes of Newcastle. Maybe it's less pressure coming on off the bench where he impressed again yesterday. With Sanson, Trez and Grealish out, I guess options are limited. I'm far from a fan of Barkley but he did ok yesterday as did AEG.
When was the last time Barkley impressed, either starting or coming off the bench?
Post by: olaftab on April 26, 2021, 10:04:53 AM
When was the last time Barkley impressed, either starting or coming off the bench?Opening game of season 2016/17 for Everton. Since then he's been shit.
Post by: aj2k77 on April 26, 2021, 10:05:05 AM
I just don't understand the rationale for starting him. He's been absolutely dreadful every game he's played for months and months. The game yesterday was always going to be the easiest we had left in the run in, so you'd expect everybody to look better, which on the whole they did. Why not then, give Ramsey a start or perhaps even rearrange things slightly so that Davis could start. I expect we'll see Fat Ross starting against Everton, because, well, it's Everton and he played against them.
It was a very poor selection by Smith yesterday. Also bringing on the second Striker so late. He's too scared/reluctant to do it earlier and it hampers us.
Post by: wittonwarrior on April 26, 2021, 10:35:22 AM
Post by: Three Spires Villa on April 26, 2021, 12:22:23 PM
Post by: Chris Smith on April 26, 2021, 12:35:47 PM
I thought he had a decent game yesterday. Somethings gone wrong possibly COVID after effects but his energy levels are low but you can tell he has something about him
Reasonable first half but but fairly anonymous in the second. His inconsistency with us is just a reflection of his wider career. He’s just not good enough to hold down a starting place and I hope reports that we’re not looking at him beyond this season are accurate.
Post by: tony scott on April 26, 2021, 01:05:34 PM
What I find puzzling is he is really struggling for breath after about 10 minutes.
Post by: brontebilly on April 26, 2021, 01:43:10 PM
When was the last time Barkley impressed, either starting or coming off the bench?Opening game of season 2016/17 for Everton. Since then he's been shit.
😄
Post by: postal on April 26, 2021, 02:04:45 PM
Post by: Risso on April 26, 2021, 02:12:22 PM
I think that that was the last start for Ross in a villa shirt. He had moments, but not enough.
I bet he starts against Everton.
Post by: colin69 on April 26, 2021, 04:00:14 PM
Post by: chrisw1 on April 26, 2021, 04:12:06 PM
He was probably hoping Barkley could be a bit of a flat track bully against a very shit team and open up sapces in what was bound to be a pretty packed defence. I thought he did reasonably well at times, but nothing like the spark we'd hope for. I don't think he stood out as particulalry worse then the rest of our very mediocre midfield, but that is faint praise.
Smith needs some results and probably still thinks in the absence of Jack playing Barkley into some form is our best chance of getting them.
Post by: SaddVillan on April 26, 2021, 04:14:17 PM
I think that that was the last start for Ross in a villa shirt. He had moments, but not enough.
I bet he starts against Everton.
Here's my starting XI
Emi
Cash, Konsa, Mings,Targett
Luiz, Marvelous
Watkins, McGinn, El Ghazi
Davis
On the bench:
Heaton, Hause, Elmo, Ramsey, Chucky, Philogene-Bidace, Wesley.
On the National Express back to London:
Barkley
McGinn is much more effective playing further forward more of a goal scoring threat and his scuttling around makes fir a better press on the back 4.
Watkins can play slightly behind Davis. Ollie's control and pace combined with Davis's strength and movement should give us a greater attacking threat and more options im terms of an out ball from the back.
Post by: eamonn on April 26, 2021, 04:22:36 PM
He is an expensive signing (loan fee and salary), a senior player with a history of playing at the highest level (Chelsea, England). I think that carries a lot of weight in a manager's minds, they want to coax that calibre out of the player. Also, he's possibly the highest-achieving player Dean has signed/managed so there may be a bit of deference from him towards Ross, even if it's sub-conscious. He'll have to get that out of his system in the summer when our owners want to pull off a marquee signing or three.
Post by: ChicagoLion on April 26, 2021, 05:19:44 PM
But he will start against Everton.
Post by: PaulWinch again on May 01, 2021, 10:02:13 PM
Post by: LukeJames on May 01, 2021, 10:02:16 PM
Post by: darren woolley on May 01, 2021, 10:08:19 PM
Post by: paul_e on May 01, 2021, 10:10:06 PM
Post by: Aldridge Villa on May 01, 2021, 10:27:58 PM
Post by: nigel on May 01, 2021, 10:29:06 PM
Much better, should've done better for their goal but going forward he was involved, wanted the ball and was moving it on with 1-2 touches instead of the dithering that we'd been seeing for the last couple of months. This version of Barkley all season and we'd be challenging for the top 4, which is why it's bene so frustrating watching him.
Would you take the risk on him, mate?
Have to admit, if we could get him for £20m I’d be tempted
Post by: paul_e on May 01, 2021, 10:32:04 PM
Much better, should've done better for their goal but going forward he was involved, wanted the ball and was moving it on with 1-2 touches instead of the dithering that we'd been seeing for the last couple of months. This version of Barkley all season and we'd be challenging for the top 4, which is why it's bene so frustrating watching him.
Would you take the risk on him, mate?
Have to admit, if we could get him for £20m I’d be tempted
Today no, if he plays like this for the rest of the season and it was £20m then I'd consider it, when he plays close to his ability he is exactly what we need to add to push on, I just don't know if I trust him to play at this standard 38 times in a season.
Post by: OzVilla on May 02, 2021, 12:49:53 AM
Post by: KevinGage on May 02, 2021, 12:58:54 AM
Much better, should've done better for their goal but going forward he was involved, wanted the ball and was moving it on with 1-2 touches instead of the dithering that we'd been seeing for the last couple of months. This version of Barkley all season and we'd be challenging for the top 4, which is why it's bene so frustrating watching him.
Would you take the risk on him, mate?
Have to admit, if we could get him for £20m I’d be tempted
Today no, if he plays like this for the rest of the season and it was £20m then I'd consider it, when he plays close to his ability he is exactly what we need to add to push on, I just don't know if I trust him to play at this standard 38 times in a season.
A player like him probably wouldn't give you that over 38 games.
But if if we could get more games like tonight and the early part of the season every second or third game it would still be worth it. We can't carry the Barkley we seen post Covid for long spells if we want to push on next year.
Post by: ChicagoLion on May 02, 2021, 06:43:09 AM
He is completely ineffective defensively and I am sure we can do a lot better than a one decent game in 4 for the sort of money he and Chelsea will want.
Post by: Abbeyfealeavfc on May 02, 2021, 06:58:39 AM
Post by: London Villan on May 02, 2021, 07:58:14 AM
Player's form can come and go, but the effort should always be there. McGinn is a good example of that. But last night Barkely covered more distance than any other player - where has that effort been for the past 4 or 5 months? He wanted the ball, didn't hide and took responsibility on the pitch. Again where has that been - definitely not there when he was stropping off the pitch.
He has bags of talent - when he can be arsed, but last night was about Ross Barkley, not about Villa's number 20. There are plenty of better options for the £20m-£40m we'd need to buy him.
Post by: Chris Smith on May 02, 2021, 08:13:40 AM
I am not the only one frustrated by Barkley's performance last night? It was like he was trying to prove a point, but not to the team that's paying his wages, or his parent club, but the club he left years ago.
Player's form can come and go, but the effort should always be there. McGinn is a good example of that. But last night Barkely covered more distance than any other player - where has that effort been for the past 4 or 5 months? He wanted the ball, didn't hide and took responsibility on the pitch. Again where has that been - definitely not there when he was stropping off the pitch.
He has bags of talent - when he can be arsed, but last night was about Ross Barkley, not about Villa's number 20. There are plenty of better options for the £20m-£40m we'd need to buy him.
Completely agree. You can’t afford his level of inconsistency in central midfield if you want to get anywhere in the PL.
Post by: Baldy on May 02, 2021, 08:17:42 AM
I am not the only one frustrated by Barkley's performance last night? It was like he was trying to prove a point, but not to the team that's paying his wages, or his parent club, but the club he left years ago.
Player's form can come and go, but the effort should always be there. McGinn is a good example of that. But last night Barkely covered more distance than any other player - where has that effort been for the past 4 or 5 months? He wanted the ball, didn't hide and took responsibility on the pitch. Again where has that been - definitely not there when he was stropping off the pitch.
He has bags of talent - when he can be arsed, but last night was about Ross Barkley, not about Villa's number 20. There are plenty of better options for the £20m-£40m we'd need to buy him.
Exactly what I was thinking. He has no future at Chelsea, mostly poor audition at Villa and Everton could be on his radar. Mind you, I am a cynical old git.
Post by: Smithy on May 02, 2021, 08:18:57 AM
But, does the Everton game continue to stand out as his "good one", and he reverts to what we've seen over the last couple of months, or, is it a further sign his injury and fitness issues are behind him and this is what a fit Ross Barkley looks like? There were signs last week, and he was good tonight. Let's see how he does against a much better side next weekend...
Post by: tomd2103 on May 02, 2021, 10:09:41 AM
I am not the only one frustrated by Barkley's performance last night? It was like he was trying to prove a point, but not to the team that's paying his wages, or his parent club, but the club he left years ago.
Player's form can come and go, but the effort should always be there. McGinn is a good example of that. But last night Barkely covered more distance than any other player - where has that effort been for the past 4 or 5 months? He wanted the ball, didn't hide and took responsibility on the pitch. Again where has that been - definitely not there when he was stropping off the pitch.
He has bags of talent - when he can be arsed, but last night was about Ross Barkley, not about Villa's number 20. There are plenty of better options for the £20m-£40m we'd need to buy him.
Might be cynical, but I agree. Was almost as if he was trying to prove a point to Everton, possibly to try and get a move back there.
I wouldn't go for him in the summer. Would much prefer to get a couple of quality wide players in and play Grealish more centrally.
Post by: Mister E on May 02, 2021, 10:54:07 AM
I would not sign him, he was given freedom of the Park by Everton.Bang on.
He is completely ineffective defensively and I am sure we can do a lot better than a one decent game in 4 for the sort of money he and Chelsea will want.
Post by: Risso on May 02, 2021, 10:58:30 AM
Last night we saw the player we all thought we were getting - not perfect by any means - but a solid premier league creative force. I think the next couple of games will be telling - obviously he's done enough to keep his place.
But, does the Everton game continue to stand out as his "good one", and he reverts to what we've seen over the last couple of months, or, is it a further sign his injury and fitness issues are behind him and this is what a fit Ross Barkley looks like? There were signs last week, and he was good tonight. Let's see how he does against a much better side next weekend...
I still woudn't buy him. He's got all his ridiculous childish responses to being subbed on his charge sheet too, as well as way more bad games than good ones.
Post by: saunders_heroes on May 02, 2021, 10:58:41 AM
Post by: Risso on May 02, 2021, 11:00:38 AM
Barclay was excellent before the injury and pretty dodgy since he came back. Maybe he isn’t/wasn’t 100% fit? He looked good again yesterday, and it just seems silly to be writing him off so soon. I think he's been turned into a scapegoat for our poor form since January.
Bloody hell, really?
Post by: Allan C on May 02, 2021, 11:13:33 AM
Barclay was excellent before the injury and pretty dodgy since he came back. Maybe he isn’t/wasn’t 100% fit? He looked good again yesterday, and it just seems silly to be writing him off so soon. I think he's been turned into a scapegoat for our poor form since January.I agree with most of your points, despite what others on here say, he was good before his injury and Covid but I don’t think he was a scape goat. He is an easy target for criticism though despite others playing as badly. Last night was typical, he started well but lost his man for the goal, and immediately it was “hook Barkley”.
Bloody hell, really?
Post by: SaddVillan on May 02, 2021, 11:14:26 AM
His aggregate form over the games he's played just doesn't justify the fee that Chelsea want or the wages he'd expect.
He is one paced and defensively non-existent, hardly ever makes a challenge, puts his foot in , or tracks back
Now that may be acceptable if you're Messi or Ronaldo, but he definitely isn't.
In the same way that a leopard never changes his spots, he will go down as one of those players who, on his day could be brilliant, but for most of the time just went through the motions.
Given the crop of talent we have coming through I wouldn't want to see the progress of one of them blocked by Barkley taking a squad place, nor would I want to risk them being negatively influenced by seeing his half hearted efforts being rewarded by a juicy fat contract from Villa.
He was given the chance, but for whatever reason hasn't taken it.
Thanks and cheerio.
Having said all that, it wouldnt surprise me to see him have a worldy against us next season and beat us single-handed.
Post by: CT on May 02, 2021, 11:31:16 AM
It shows what might have been possible had that performance been shown on a more regular basis. He could have stepped up and led this team. We’d be in the top six and probably looking at spending a fair chunk to keep him permanently.
So well done last night Ross (apart from the defensive corner) , but one good performance in months isn’t what we need, IMO.
Post by: KevinGage on May 02, 2021, 11:42:33 AM
I am not the only one frustrated by Barkley's performance last night? It was like he was trying to prove a point, but not to the team that's paying his wages, or his parent club, but the club he left years ago.
Player's form can come and go, but the effort should always be there. McGinn is a good example of that. But last night Barkely covered more distance than any other player - where has that effort been for the past 4 or 5 months? He wanted the ball, didn't hide and took responsibility on the pitch. Again where has that been - definitely not there when he was stropping off the pitch.
He has bags of talent - when he can be arsed, but last night was about Ross Barkley, not about Villa's number 20. There are plenty of better options for the £20m-£40m we'd need to buy him.
Aye, that was my concern as well.
We'll see over the next few games if he's truly over his slump or whether last night was a one off in a match that mattered to him. They should all matter to him.
I've had a wee bit more sympathy than most in that we don't truly know to what extent the injury sustained in November and then the Covid shutdown blunted his progress. But if he reverts to type in the last five it'll look like he picks and chooses his games.
Post by: jwarry on May 02, 2021, 01:05:14 PM
Post by: aj2k77 on May 02, 2021, 01:19:06 PM
Post by: OCD on May 02, 2021, 02:26:19 PM
I think we'll sign him on another season-long loan deal and use the cash elsewhere. Maybe Abraham.
Post by: frank black on May 02, 2021, 03:23:26 PM
He shouldn't have been on Calvert-Lewin at set-pieces anyway. It was a complete mismatch. McGinn was on him at the next corner, which again wasn't a good match-up.
I think we'll sign him on another season-long loan deal and use the cash elsewhere. Maybe Abraham.
Rumour that our season loan cost a hell of a lot of money. I expect us to move on from Ross Barkley unless there’s a miraculous turn of form.
Post by: TelfordVilla on May 02, 2021, 03:31:36 PM
Post by: The Edge on May 02, 2021, 03:59:26 PM
Post by: SoccerHQ on May 02, 2021, 04:16:11 PM
We need to stop falling into the trap of suddenly handing out new deals to players who suddenly come alive end of the season for 4-5 games. Let's remember Barkley was subbed last week after an hour when we were losing so this was first time in months he's actually done full 90 minutes.
Reminds me a bit of when Hendrie just to score a few goals when his contract was running down and he'd get a new one...and people would be moaning about the exact same things 12 months later.
FWIW I'd have signed Barkley if the option was there in January but he's been massively disappointing since then so in a way a year's loan was the best option and think DS has seen enough to look elsewhere for next season.
Post by: Flamingo Lane on May 02, 2021, 05:19:36 PM
Post by: jwarry on May 02, 2021, 05:23:41 PM
Last night we saw the player we all thought we were getting - not perfect by any means - but a solid premier league creative force. I think the next couple of games will be telling - obviously he's done enough to keep his place.
But, does the Everton game continue to stand out as his "good one", and he reverts to what we've seen over the last couple of months, or, is it a further sign his injury and fitness issues are behind him and this is what a fit Ross Barkley looks like? There were signs last week, and he was good tonight. Let's see how he does against a much better side next weekend...
I still woudn't buy him. He's got all his ridiculous childish responses to being subbed on his charge sheet too, as well as way more bad games than good ones.
Pretty sure Jack would behave the same way now if he were subbed. If you think you are good enough nothing wrong with getting pissed off
Post by: Malandro on May 02, 2021, 11:32:04 PM
Unfortunately he's a shithouse.
Post by: eamonn on May 03, 2021, 01:47:02 AM
Reminds me a bit of when Hendrie just to score a few goals when his contract was running down and he'd get a new one...and people would be moaning about the exact same things 12 months later.
FWIW I'd have signed Barkley if the option was there in January but he's been massively disappointing since then so in a way a year's loan was the best option and think DS has seen enough to look elsewhere for next season.
Lee had/still has plenty of flaws but not caring about doing his best on the pitch for Villa wasn't one of them.
Post by: The Edge on May 03, 2021, 07:04:26 AM
Good few performances.Why is he a shithouse? I don't get that comment.
Unfortunately he's a shithouse.
Post by: Drummond on May 03, 2021, 07:13:50 AM
Post by: The Edge on May 03, 2021, 07:42:31 AM
I hope this is a sign of him being fit, physically and mentally.Let's hope so. A fit and firing Barkley along with a returning Jack playing for an England place and we could have a great end to the season. Beating Man Yoo would be a great start. That would feel like a cup win.
Post by: Sexual Ealing on May 03, 2021, 07:56:53 AM
I hope this is a sign of him being fit, physically and mentally.Let's hope so. A fit and firing Barkley along with a returning Jack playing for an England place and we could have a great end to the season. Beating Man Yoo would be a great start. That would feel like a cup win.
It would not. We are not Crawley.
Post by: Chris Smith on May 03, 2021, 07:57:24 AM
Post by: Axl Rose on May 03, 2021, 07:58:16 AM
Post by: The Edge on May 03, 2021, 08:11:32 AM
It would for me. We've beat them once in 42 attempts. Multiple dodgy penalties, last minute winners, their fans running on our pitch, Vidic not being sent off, stealing our songs, the list is endless. I take your point but beating them arrogant bastards would FEEL like a cup win to me.I hope this is a sign of him being fit, physically and mentally.Let's hope so. A fit and firing Barkley along with a returning Jack playing for an England place and we could have a great end to the season. Beating Man Yoo would be a great start. That would feel like a cup win.
It would not. We are not Crawley.
Post by: Sexual Ealing on May 03, 2021, 08:13:28 AM
Post by: Ad@m on May 03, 2021, 08:16:27 AM
Reminds me a bit of when Hendrie just to score a few goals when his contract was running down and he'd get a new one...and people would be moaning about the exact same things 12 months later.
A Forest fan mate of mine used to say the same about Lansbury and it's fair to say that transfer didn't exactly work out for us.
Barkley is the wrong side of 25 to get noticeably better and I'm convinced there's better value out there for what we'd have to pay Chelsea.
Post by: Drummond on May 03, 2021, 08:48:10 AM
Post by: Risso on May 03, 2021, 08:52:39 AM
Whilst I'd also not be sure about that sort of deal, what about another loan?
Definitely not.
Post by: Ad@m on May 03, 2021, 09:16:50 AM
Whilst I'd also not be sure about that sort of deal, what about another loan?
I'm not sure what the point would be. We've had long enough to see what we get from him. If you take into account wages, potential to improve and potential for onward value creation I'd much rather we invest playing time in Jacob Ramsey than Ross Barkley.
Post by: Clampy on May 03, 2021, 09:23:49 AM
Post by: Steve67 on May 03, 2021, 09:38:53 AM
Whilst I'd also not be sure about that sort of deal, what about another loan?
At £11m a season in loan fees, it would probably cheaper to buy him. He's had three or four decent games for us, the rest have been crap. I hope there is better value out there.
Post by: Risso on May 03, 2021, 09:52:31 AM
Post by: in exile on May 03, 2021, 09:55:52 AM
Post by: ChicagoLion on May 03, 2021, 10:13:19 AM
I still don't want him here.Gets my vote.
Post by: Ads on May 03, 2021, 11:19:36 AM
Post by: OCD on May 03, 2021, 12:43:51 PM
Yes, being charitable you could argue he's just about been worth the loan, as we've stayed up comfortably and he has played a part in that, especially earlier in the season. But it wouldn't show much long term planning with another loan for him. We need to be buying players of his ability (at his best) and developing the youngsters. Neither of which would be helped with another loan. In any case, he's just not consistent enough, and he takes far too long to come back from injury.
If we were to earmark Chukwuemeka or Aaron Ramsey for the number 10 position in future, a loan move could be seen as long-term planning.
Post by: cdbearsfan on May 03, 2021, 12:50:41 PM
Whilst I'd also not be sure about that sort of deal, what about another loan?
Just no. He has had his chance and it, mostly, hasn't worked out.
Post by: Joe S on May 03, 2021, 02:29:15 PM
Post by: Damo70 on May 03, 2021, 02:43:44 PM
Whilst I'd also not be sure about that sort of deal, what about another loan?
Just no. He has had his chance and it, mostly, hasn't worked out.
For me he started very well but has become rather hit and miss since (and more miss than hit) I don't regret us bringing him in but he seems to be inconsistent and rather petulant so I wouldn't want us signing him
permanently.
Post by: N'ZMAV on May 03, 2021, 02:45:06 PM
Post by: PaulWinch again on May 03, 2021, 10:21:46 PM
Post by: Allan C on May 04, 2021, 09:42:50 AM
Agree with that, clearly they’re not ready yetYes, being charitable you could argue he's just about been worth the loan, as we've stayed up comfortably and he has played a part in that, especially earlier in the season. But it wouldn't show much long term planning with another loan for him. We need to be buying players of his ability (at his best) and developing the youngsters. Neither of which would be helped with another loan. In any case, he's just not consistent enough, and he takes far too long to come back from injury.
If we were to earmark Chukwuemeka or Aaron Ramsey for the number 10 position in future, a loan move could be seen as long-term planning.
Post by: chrisw1 on May 04, 2021, 09:46:53 AM
If he plays like he did at the weekend consistently for the rest of the season and we can get him for <£20m, then I'd buy him.This is my thinking too. It's been such an odd season there may be reasons we're not aware of for his poor form since the injury / Covid break. Dean and the staff will know if this is the case and have seen him train throughout. If they think they've seen enough to want to go get him permanently then that would be good enough for me. What I do know is we've played our best football this season when he has been on form.
Post by: VinnieChase84 on May 04, 2021, 11:11:10 AM
Post by: caster troy on May 04, 2021, 11:33:42 AM
Post by: Risso on May 04, 2021, 12:36:15 PM
Post by: Rudy Can't Fail on May 04, 2021, 12:37:21 PM
If he plays like he did at the weekend consistently for the rest of the season and we can get him for <£20m, then I'd buy him.This is my thinking too. It's been such an odd season there may be reasons we're not aware of for his poor form since the injury / Covid break. Dean and the staff will know if this is the case and have seen him train throughout. If they think they've seen enough to want to go get him permanently then that would be good enough for me. What I do know is we've played our best football this season when he has been on form.
One thing is buying him it's another paying him. Do we really want to make him the highest paid player at the club? He's reportedly on £104k a week at Chelsea though probably took a £10k hit for COVID reductions.
Post by: algy on May 04, 2021, 12:41:43 PM
For Ross, he's going to have to be judged against the sort of prices we paid for Sanson and Traore. At the moment, for me he's probably worth spending about £10m-£12m on as a squad player but nothing more. Might be convinced to go up to the £15m-£18m bracket if he plays well for the rest of the season. But not more than that - we'll get better players from the continent for that kind of money.
It's a shame - I quite like him - but you can't just go missing for half the season then expect to be high up the priority list, especially with a club like us (now) who'll no doubt be setting European qualification as a goal for next season.
Post by: paul_e on May 04, 2021, 03:16:20 PM
The problem for Ross here is that there'll be a few clubs on the continent that will need to make COVID-enforced sales, and not so many clubs with the money to pay for them. We're quite lucky in that respect - it's a buyer's market, and we could realistically be the biggest spenders in Europe again.
For Ross, he's going to have to be judged against the sort of prices we paid for Sanson and Traore. At the moment, for me he's probably worth spending about £10m-£12m on as a squad player but nothing more. Might be convinced to go up to the £15m-£18m bracket if he plays well for the rest of the season. But not more than that - we'll get better players from the continent for that kind of money.
It's a shame - I quite like him - but you can't just go missing for half the season then expect to be high up the priority list, especially with a club like us (now) who'll no doubt be setting European qualification as a goal for next season.
Yep, that's about where I'm at, similar for Tammy and McNeil as well, they're both too expensive because they aren't exactly what the squad needs, they're players that we think can do the job we want rather than players who have a record for the last 12-18months of doing it.
Post by: dave.woodhall on May 04, 2021, 03:33:12 PM
Post by: chrisw1 on May 04, 2021, 03:38:18 PM
I would say Tammy is exactly the sort of player we need.Absolutely. It would be a great signing. I get the squad needs work elsewhere, but turning down the opportunity to bring in Tammy would be nuts.
Post by: Abbeyfealeavfc on May 04, 2021, 03:48:50 PM
The only way I would consider him is if chelski just gave him to us (on the basis we've already paid £11m) with no further fee attached. Barkley was to take a significant reduction in his wages and attend intensive training on pressing, tackling and interceptions with the odd attitude tutorial thrown in.
This isn't going to happen, so after the next 4 games he's eligible for wish him the best and say thanks, but no thanks.
Post by: dave.woodhall on May 04, 2021, 04:01:59 PM
I would say Tammy is exactly the sort of player we need.Absolutely. It would be a great signing. I get the squad needs work elsewhere, but turning down the opportunity to bring in Tammy would be nuts.
I think a few of our supporters are headed down the road travelled in 2006, when Thierry Henry wasn't what we wanted because IMG were going to get us Ronaldo.
Post by: LeeB on May 04, 2021, 04:03:34 PM
It's hard for me to describe exactly, but only Jack is capable of doing that in our team, and other players that can tend to be in the £50m + bracket.
His last couple of performances have seen a significant shift in levels of performance. I don't know what the problem was from Jan till the West Brom game, but I suspected something was afoot, and the fact he's back in the side suggests it wasn't down to not giving a shit.
I think if we feel we can get value we'll do a deal.
Post by: dave.woodhall on May 04, 2021, 04:15:00 PM
Post by: Risso on May 04, 2021, 04:52:25 PM
It could be that with Barkley we're getting the same as we did with John Carew. On his day he's world class but if he was more consistent he wouldn't come anywhere near us at the moment. Perhaps the reason Smiffy kept picking him was because he knew that the mystery reason for his drop in form was close to being resolved. Five more performances like his last one and he'd be well worth signing.
Barkley isn’t fit to be mentioned in the same sentence as Carew. I think it was the 08/09 season when he never seemed to go more than a couple of games without scoring.
Post by: chrisw1 on May 04, 2021, 05:01:29 PM
Algy makes some good points about Barkley, but even at £10-12m he would still work out at £21-23m if the loan fee for this season is taken into consideration and he's not worth that kind of money.Why would you take the loan fee for this season into consideration? That money is gone whether we sign him or not. If we did sign him at £10-12m (which there's no chance of) then it would work out at £10-£12m, which is either worth it or isn't depending on your point of view.
The only way I would consider him is if chelski just gave him to us (on the basis we've already paid £11m) with no further fee attached. Barkley was to take a significant reduction in his wages and attend intensive training on pressing, tackling and interceptions with the odd attitude tutorial thrown in.
This isn't going to happen, so after the next 4 games he's eligible for wish him the best and say thanks, but no thanks.
He's obviously been poor for a large part of this season. Fortunately the best people to decide if there's sufficient mitigation for that are the people at Villa who will make the decision on whether we go for him or not. I'm sure they'll take your suggested tutorials on board though.
Post by: TelfordVilla on May 04, 2021, 05:35:46 PM
Abbeyfealeavfc makes a perfectly well structured and sensible suggestion of a possible transfer option that Villa may consider. Any other type of deal should be fended off with a barge pole.Algy makes some good points about Barkley, but even at £10-12m he would still work out at £21-23m if the loan fee for this season is taken into consideration and he's not worth that kind of money.Why would you take the loan fee for this season into consideration? That money is gone whether we sign him or not. If we did sign him at £10-12m (which there's no chance of) then it would work out at £10-£12m, which is either worth it or isn't depending on your point of view.
The only way I would consider him is if chelski just gave him to us (on the basis we've already paid £11m) with no further fee attached. Barkley was to take a significant reduction in his wages and attend intensive training on pressing, tackling and interceptions with the odd attitude tutorial thrown in.
This isn't going to happen, so after the next 4 games he's eligible for wish him the best and say thanks, but no thanks.
He's obviously been poor for a large part of this season. Fortunately the best people to decide if there's sufficient mitigation for that are the people at Villa who will make the decision on whether we go for him or not. I'm sure they'll take your suggested tutorials on board though.
Post by: paul_e on May 04, 2021, 05:57:00 PM
I would say Tammy is exactly the sort of player we need.Absolutely. It would be a great signing. I get the squad needs work elsewhere, but turning down the opportunity to bring in Tammy would be nuts.
I think a few of our supporters are headed down the road travelled in 2006, when Thierry Henry wasn't what we wanted because IMG were going to get us Ronaldo.
Just to be clear on this, I think with a 433 and a 25 man squad we have 7 'spots' for the front 3 and we're going into next season with 6 of them filled (with the 7th being Trez who won't play before Christmas). Bringing Tammy in gives us 4 players who are primarily centre forwards, Grealish as a floating option (between left-wing, 10 and AM) and 2 genuine wingers in AEG and Traore. That's just not the right balance for me when we rarely play with 2 centre forwards, the post you replied to was me saying I don't like the idea of signing Tammy because Watkins could play wide and Tammy says he likes playing wide as well, certainly not when it would be such a big fee.
Post by: KevinGage on May 04, 2021, 05:58:06 PM
I would say Tammy is exactly the sort of player we need.Absolutely. It would be a great signing. I get the squad needs work elsewhere, but turning down the opportunity to bring in Tammy would be nuts.
I think a few of our supporters are headed down the road travelled in 2006, when Thierry Henry wasn't what we wanted because IMG were going to get us Ronaldo.
It's possibly more to do with the potential impact on Watkins. We have a gem of a player on our hands with him who should - without the interference of the twats from Stockley Park - be already close to 20 goals in his first season in the top flight.
We could definitely do with a deputy for Ollie -particularly if he goes to the WC (he'll have effectively been playing two seasons back to back as Brentford played through till Aug last year).
A player coming in at circa £40 million is going to be more than a deputy though.
This ignores that both can interchange position in the same lineup; Ollie does some of his best work foraging wide right and Abraham has expressed a preference for playing wide left before.
Their position at the start of the game doesn't have to be the same throughout.
Post by: brontebilly on May 04, 2021, 06:23:14 PM
Post by: LeeB on May 04, 2021, 06:34:05 PM
Where is the idea coming from that Abraham would be any use on the wing?
The man himself I believe, he said when he was with us he prefers to play from out wide.
Post by: chrisw1 on May 04, 2021, 06:44:52 PM
A free transfer and Barkley goes on some tutorials? You think that's a well structured and sensible suggestion?Abbeyfealeavfc makes a perfectly well structured and sensible suggestion of a possible transfer option that Villa may consider. Any other type of deal should be fended off with a barge pole.Algy makes some good points about Barkley, but even at £10-12m he would still work out at £21-23m if the loan fee for this season is taken into consideration and he's not worth that kind of money.Why would you take the loan fee for this season into consideration? That money is gone whether we sign him or not. If we did sign him at £10-12m (which there's no chance of) then it would work out at £10-£12m, which is either worth it or isn't depending on your point of view.
The only way I would consider him is if chelski just gave him to us (on the basis we've already paid £11m) with no further fee attached. Barkley was to take a significant reduction in his wages and attend intensive training on pressing, tackling and interceptions with the odd attitude tutorial thrown in.
This isn't going to happen, so after the next 4 games he's eligible for wish him the best and say thanks, but no thanks.
He's obviously been poor for a large part of this season. Fortunately the best people to decide if there's sufficient mitigation for that are the people at Villa who will make the decision on whether we go for him or not. I'm sure they'll take your suggested tutorials on board though.
Post by: Abbeyfealeavfc on May 04, 2021, 06:59:20 PM
Post by: TelfordVilla on May 04, 2021, 07:33:19 PM
and a huge drop in his wages. it's just about the only sensible reason for considering taking him off Chelsea's hands. Or he can stay there and be their Micah Richard's if he prefers. I dont mind either wayA free transfer and Barkley goes on some tutorials? You think that's a well structured and sensible suggestion?Abbeyfealeavfc makes a perfectly well structured and sensible suggestion of a possible transfer option that Villa may consider. Any other type of deal should be fended off with a barge pole.Algy makes some good points about Barkley, but even at £10-12m he would still work out at £21-23m if the loan fee for this season is taken into consideration and he's not worth that kind of money.Why would you take the loan fee for this season into consideration? That money is gone whether we sign him or not. If we did sign him at £10-12m (which there's no chance of) then it would work out at £10-£12m, which is either worth it or isn't depending on your point of view.
The only way I would consider him is if chelski just gave him to us (on the basis we've already paid £11m) with no further fee attached. Barkley was to take a significant reduction in his wages and attend intensive training on pressing, tackling and interceptions with the odd attitude tutorial thrown in.
This isn't going to happen, so after the next 4 games he's eligible for wish him the best and say thanks, but no thanks.
He's obviously been poor for a large part of this season. Fortunately the best people to decide if there's sufficient mitigation for that are the people at Villa who will make the decision on whether we go for him or not. I'm sure they'll take your suggested tutorials on board though.
Post by: Dante Lavelli on May 04, 2021, 08:10:44 PM
On that basis, I’d prefer to optimise spending there than buy Barkley. I don’t particularly rate Barkley but, more so, I don’t want him blocking the path to the first team for Chuk/Ramsey/others.
Post by: N'ZMAV on May 04, 2021, 08:12:02 PM
Post by: eamonn on May 05, 2021, 01:24:47 AM
Post by: ChicagoLion on May 09, 2021, 04:18:27 PM
Post by: CT on May 09, 2021, 04:25:36 PM
Post by: SoccerHQ on May 09, 2021, 04:51:51 PM
Post by: SamTheMouse on May 09, 2021, 04:53:44 PM
Post by: ChicagoLion on May 09, 2021, 04:56:08 PM
I would rather - and I genuinely mean this - have Hourihane back. At least he knows how to take a set piece. Other than that, I can't see any difference between them.not a Hourihane fan but I agree.
Just don’t see why Smith is persevering with him.
Post by: Rudy Can't Fail on May 09, 2021, 04:59:25 PM
I would rather - and I genuinely mean this - have Hourihane back. At least he knows how to take a set piece. Other than that, I can't see any difference between them.
Conor cares.
Post by: brontebilly on May 09, 2021, 04:59:39 PM
I would rather - and I genuinely mean this - have Hourihane back. At least he knows how to take a set piece. Other than that, I can't see any difference between them.not a Hourihane fan but I agree.
Just don’t see why Smith is persevering with him.
Options are limited I guess, Ramsey hardly got a kick when he came on for example. Grealish, Sanson and Trez all injured
Barkley is rubbish though. Try Traore in his position instead
Post by: Sexual Ealing on May 09, 2021, 05:02:46 PM
I would rather - and I genuinely mean this - have Hourihane back. At least he knows how to take a set piece. Other than that, I can't see any difference between them.not a Hourihane fan but I agree.
Just don’t see why Smith is persevering with him.
Options are limited I guess, Ramsey hardly got a kick when he came on for example. Grealish, Sanson and Trez all injured
Barkley is rubbish though. Try Traore in his position instead
I'm with you there.
Post by: Abbeyfealeavfc on May 09, 2021, 05:15:33 PM
Post by: paul_e on May 09, 2021, 05:29:13 PM
I would rather - and I genuinely mean this - have Hourihane back. At least he knows how to take a set piece. Other than that, I can't see any difference between them.not a Hourihane fan but I agree.
Just don’t see why Smith is persevering with him.
Options are limited I guess, Ramsey hardly got a kick when he came on for example. Grealish, Sanson and Trez all injured
Barkley is rubbish though. Try Traore in his position instead
I disagree on Ramsey, I think he did ok again today, he gets involved, makes himself available and looks to get the ball moving forward. He had 20 touches and played 15 passes in the 25ish minutes he was given, I'm ok with that, I'd be fine with him in ahead of Barkley for the last few games.
Post by: robleflaneur on May 09, 2021, 05:37:16 PM
I thought Ramsey was good,covered a lot of ground,was involved and passed the ball first time.Considering him and McGinn were alone in central midfield,they both performed well.I would rather - and I genuinely mean this - have Hourihane back. At least he knows how to take a set piece. Other than that, I can't see any difference between them.not a Hourihane fan but I agree.
Just don’t see why Smith is persevering with him.
Options are limited I guess, Ramsey hardly got a kick when he came on for example. Grealish, Sanson and Trez all injured
Barkley is rubbish though. Try Traore in his position instead
I disagree on Ramsey, I think he did ok again today, he gets involved, makes himself available and looks to get the ball moving forward. He had 20 touches and played 15 passes in the 25ish minutes he was given, I'm ok with that, I'd be fine with him in ahead of Barkley for the last few games.
Post by: N'ZMAV on May 09, 2021, 05:50:07 PM
He seems ok so far. Just struggling to see what’s going to be really stand out about him.
I’m not doubting he could be a good player just interested to know more from those that have seen a lot more of him.
Post by: paul_e on May 09, 2021, 06:00:25 PM
I don’t watch any of the u23 or u18 sides - what is Ramsey’s best attributes and what’s he good at?
He seems ok so far. Just struggling to see what’s going to be really stand out about him.
I’m not doubting he could be a good player just interested to know more from those that have seen a lot more of him.
Arriving late into the box and scoring goals, we need to give him a shot in the more attacking role in midfield ahead of Barkley.
Post by: Nev on May 09, 2021, 09:13:58 PM
Shit.
Get rid.
Post by: aj2k77 on May 09, 2021, 09:39:59 PM
Post by: Nii Lamptey on May 09, 2021, 09:41:26 PM
Post by: Steve67 on May 09, 2021, 09:46:16 PM
Post by: ChicagoLion on May 09, 2021, 09:49:50 PM
Post by: LukeJames on May 09, 2021, 10:00:30 PM
Post by: Steve67 on May 09, 2021, 10:03:28 PM
Post by: eamonn on May 10, 2021, 12:25:45 AM
Post by: ROBBO on May 10, 2021, 01:32:33 AM
Post by: CT Villan on May 10, 2021, 03:06:06 AM
Post by: Axl Rose on May 10, 2021, 03:36:33 AM
I would rather - and I genuinely mean this - have Hourihane back. At least he knows how to take a set piece. Other than that, I can't see any difference between them.not a Hourihane fan but I agree.
Just don’t see why Smith is persevering with him.
Entirely my feelings on the matter.
Post by: sid1964 on May 10, 2021, 06:42:31 AM
Post by: Axl Rose on May 10, 2021, 06:45:03 AM
I forgot that he was on the pitch until he took that free kick - hopefully we are not going to spend £40 million on him in the summer?
I don't think we will. If we do buy him, he won't be very popular if he carries on playing as he is
Post by: Ian. on May 10, 2021, 07:02:53 AM
Let’s be honest as well, his very best is pretty good but I’d like us to set our sights higher than that now and if we’re to keep hold of Jack then we must.
Post by: Footy-Vill on May 10, 2021, 06:15:41 PM
Post by: SaddVillan on May 12, 2021, 01:50:43 PM
Ross can't play Vs Chelsea and in front of us fans so this will be his last home game Thursday!
Possibly not if the Meaning Evil is to be believed:
Barkley comments could tempt Aston Villa into bargain transfer
https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/aston-villa-barkley-chelsea-transfer-20580263#ICID=Android_BMNewsApp_AppShare
https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/aston-villa-barkley-chelsea-transfer-20580263#ICID=Android_BMNewsApp_AppShare
Post by: SoccerHQ on May 12, 2021, 01:54:46 PM
I'd have signed him no problem in January if the option had been there but I was wrong and it would be completely wrong decision now given what he's shown last few months.
He'll also be 28 next season so committing to 4 year deal and god knows what in wages with little chance of recouping that fee would be all very Ross McCormack.
Post by: ChicagoLion on May 12, 2021, 02:10:12 PM
Post by: chrisw1 on May 12, 2021, 02:47:47 PM
Christ that's a crap article. Barkley’s comments from 3 years ago when he joined Chelsea could tempt Villa into a cut price deal this summer. I just can't stand Birmingham Live and Matt Kendrick and the barely literate Ashley Preece should be embarrassed working for them.Ross can't play Vs Chelsea and in front of us fans so this will be his last home game Thursday!
Possibly not if the Meaning Evil is to be believed:
Barkley comments could tempt Aston Villa into bargain transfer
https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/aston-villa-barkley-chelsea-transfer-20580263#ICID=Android_BMNewsApp_AppShare
https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/aston-villa-barkley-chelsea-transfer-20580263#ICID=Android_BMNewsApp_AppShare
As for Barkley, I'd play him against Everton. I just want as many points as we can get this season and it seems he likes performing against them.
Post by: SaddVillan on May 12, 2021, 06:51:33 PM
A half price bag of shite is still a bag of shite.
Post by: N'ZMAV on May 12, 2021, 07:46:10 PM
If we sign Barkley it would show that the club has learnt absolutely nothing from our previous transfers debacles.He'll sign then :D
Post by: brontebilly on May 12, 2021, 09:44:54 PM
Post by: ChicagoLion on May 12, 2021, 10:26:29 PM
As much as this experiment should have been put to bed a long time ago, the absence of the likes of Trez and Sanson leaves us thin on other options. I don't even think his attitude was all that bad against United, it's just he was a complete and utter passenger. Whoever buys him in the summer, cut price or not, is going to be muggedhe can’t run, the best is a quickish jog, I have seen quicker blokes with Zimmer frames.
Starts tomorrow though.
Post by: brontebilly on May 13, 2021, 09:46:12 PM
Post by: VILLA MOLE on May 13, 2021, 09:50:47 PM
Post by: Border villan on May 13, 2021, 09:53:44 PM
Post by: Dante Lavelli on May 13, 2021, 10:00:19 PM
i wonder if his issues with running are to do with his hamstrings ?
I’m not sure he’d pass a fitness test. He seems to take ages to get match fit and even then he seems very one paced.
Post by: Cliftonville Villlain on May 13, 2021, 10:09:47 PM
Post by: cdward on May 13, 2021, 10:58:21 PM
It's the inconsistency that stops him becoming the top player he can be, I think he lacks confidence, and has other issues.
Dean Smith has definitely given him enough chances, time to say goodbye. If he was on a free transfer, maybe, but it's a no from me.
Post by: Risso on May 13, 2021, 11:18:27 PM
Post by: cdbearsfan on May 13, 2021, 11:20:32 PM
Given how well we were playing earlier in the season with him on form, we can see what type of player we desperately need. We can't go with someone who will only fulfil that role half a dozen times a season if we're lucky.
Post by: Brend'Watkins on May 13, 2021, 11:44:40 PM
Post by: brontebilly on May 14, 2021, 12:03:04 AM
There has to be something still wrong with him because if he is actually fit and this is his level of form it’s not a question of who is he now going to play for, it’s a question about whether he’s finished in the game.
Felt a bit sorry for him when camera switched to him in the stand, hands on head. His career very much in free fall. Kind of player that without a huge transformation you wouldn't be surprised to see retiring at the end of his Chelsea contract. RLC, who we were also linked to last summer, seems to have been a total flop at Fulham too.
Post by: manic-road on May 14, 2021, 05:57:31 AM
There has to be something still wrong with him because if he is actually fit and this is his level of form it’s not a question of who is he now going to play for, it’s a question about whether he’s finished in the game.
Felt a bit sorry for him when camera switched to him in the stand, hands on head. His career very much in free fall. Kind of player that without a huge transformation you wouldn't be surprised to see retiring at the end of his Chelsea contract. RLC, who we were also linked to last summer, seems to have been a total flop at Fulham too.
He looked gutted at his own performance last night, as others have said he looks in freefall.
Post by: sid1964 on May 14, 2021, 07:12:53 AM
Post by: CT on May 14, 2021, 07:19:35 AM
He had the chance to re-build his career with us and he knows that he has blown it, which is a shame for him as he seemed to get on well with Jack!!! - I am sure that he will get another loan deal somewhere else next season
This.
I think there was a realisation as the camera panned over to him, that he had a great chance to progress with us, but that chance has gone.
Now is the time to give Chucks some valuable game time at Palace.
Post by: Chris Smith on May 14, 2021, 07:36:55 AM
Post by: Risso on May 14, 2021, 07:38:16 AM
His time with us is just a reflection of his career as a whole. Mostly average mixed with the odd very good game balanced by the odd completely useless game.
The completely useless games far outweigh the average and good ones.
Post by: caster troy on May 14, 2021, 08:04:51 AM
Post by: john e on May 14, 2021, 08:08:54 AM
Wouldn’t even take him on a free, he earns way too much given how little he contributes.
sounds ridiculous but nor would I
His wages would be massive, takes another spot up in the squad and it would be a backward step
I think it would be one of the most disappointing signings for me if we go that way as we need far better
Post by: Clampy on May 14, 2021, 08:23:47 AM
Post by: TelfordVilla on May 14, 2021, 08:26:50 AM
Post by: Rudy65 on May 14, 2021, 08:34:15 AM
There is talent there that's not in question. But Dean has been more than accomodating to him and has given him enough chances to make the move permanent. If it was a cut price fee then maybe but atm nowhere near the £30-40 million that shower of shite will be asking for him.
Talent? Not sure about that.
He looks so slow and one paced and regularly gets caught in possession. If you didn’t know how good he previously was at Everton you would think he was more suited to League 1. It could be confidence, attitude or something else but he looks finished at this level. If he is out of contract at Chelsea he may find it difficult to get another
Post by: brontebilly on May 14, 2021, 09:50:34 AM
I'm not sure what's going on with him. He looks like he cares, but something isn't right. Is his confidence just completely shot? Is there a physical issue which means he just can't cope in the majority of games? Is it depression or anxiety? Looking at him on the bench yesterday after being subbed he looked broken. I think it's best we take him out of the firing line now. Dean has an out, he can say he wants to look at Ramsey/Chuk in the remaining games in preparation for next season.
Physically, he is definitely carrying too much body mass. Whether that's muscle or fat I don't know but he simply is stuck to the ground. Needs to shift a stone at least if he wants to get back competing at this level. He said when he joined that he could also play as an 8, if he tried playing in McGinns role right now he would be embarrassed.
Mentally doesn't look in best place either. Confidence is shot and even his touch has deserted him. He needed that wake up call months back like when he was having his strop sitting in front of the Holte End.
Post by: Villan82 on May 14, 2021, 09:57:36 AM
I don't quite know what has gone wrong, and like others, the close up of him on the bench yesterday was the first occasion something struck me about his demeanor. I think I posted in the match thread that he looked broken. On a human level I hope is ok but if there are issues there I would question if we have handled it right.
Post by: West Derby Villan on May 14, 2021, 10:02:04 AM
I was never that much of a fan before he came but he loooked just what we needed in those first few games and on the very odd occasion, we did look a better side going forward with him in it but overall, it's not worked out for whatever reason.
Agree, whether COVID was part of it or not, he’s missed an opportunity to restart his career
Post by: Mister E on May 14, 2021, 10:19:30 AM
I wonder, as others have said, whether we are also seeing some other things going on for him behind the scenes. If that's the case I wish him well and hope that Chelsea look after him well (with Villa's support if that is appropriate).
Post by: Smithy on May 14, 2021, 11:53:03 AM
He's 28 this year, and I wonder if he's just one of those players who peaks early in their career and then fades? Michael Owen was completely shot at 28, and similarly, Ross was a premier league regular as a teenager and going to World Cups at 20.
It might be he can recover and perform once again at a level he was once capable of, but part of me wonders if that's just it for him now, and he's at a physical level other midfielders get to at around 32-33?
Post by: eamonn on May 14, 2021, 11:57:22 AM
Post by: LeeB on May 14, 2021, 12:03:13 PM
Post by: paul_e on May 14, 2021, 12:22:10 PM
The ability is there, but the problem is in his head and I'm doubtful it will ever be fully fixed judging on his career so far.
I agree. When he shows glimpses of his quality i get drawn back in to wanting to give him another chance but it's just not going to work, there are too many problems for a player of his age and standing to overcome now.
I also agree with:
He's playing as if he's pre-empting his hamstring going again. Tentative, few bursts of forward speed and half-hearted tracking-back.
I think him not trusting his ability to stay fit is at the heart of his problems.
I always thought he was over-rated at Everton and Chelsea because his reputation seemed to be based entirely on a handful of good performances and ignored the average/poor ones, I likened him to a slightly more capable version of Lansbury who did something good and then saw it as job done. Having watched him with us I don't think that comparison is correct, I'd go more towards Collymore now, talent and ability in bundles when he's 'on it' but too many games where everything is wrong.
Post by: chrisw1 on May 14, 2021, 12:44:06 PM
I agree with Paul, as with Collymore I now think it will always be 'what could have been.'
Post by: SoccerHQ on May 14, 2021, 12:56:26 PM
Wouldn’t even take him on a free, he earns way too much given how little he contributes.
sounds ridiculous but nor would I
His wages would be massive, takes another spot up in the squad and it would be a backward step
I think it would be one of the most disappointing signings for me if we go that way as we need far better
Is there even any indication we're interesting in a permanent other than the rumour Lange really likes him and wants him to be signed?
I think DS knows we've dodged a bullet here, would like to see Carney get some minutes before end of season although Ramsey obviously higher in the pecking order.
Last nighrt was his last start for us anyway.
Post by: Villa Lew on May 14, 2021, 01:20:21 PM
I understand he's got 2 years left of his contract with Chelsea, well clearly he's not going to get anywhere near their starting 11, probably even struggle to get on their bench. The only Premier League clubs, who may take him on, would be the 3, who are coming up and even that's doubtful.
Post by: Axl Rose on May 14, 2021, 01:22:15 PM
Post by: Pete3206 on May 14, 2021, 01:24:52 PM
Post by: Drummond on May 14, 2021, 01:28:24 PM
I disagree, I think he's a very good player. He's clearly struggling at the moment however and not really our problem after next Wednesday.
Yep, my thoughts too. I'd also add that I think he'd actually suit a season in the Championship to rebuild his confidence because the ability is there. Whether his fitness would last is another question.
He covered so much of the pitch in a match recently but never quite quickly enough or in the right places. A bit like Eric Morecombe on the piano.
Post by: Axl Rose on May 14, 2021, 02:11:30 PM
I disagree, I think he's a very good player. He's clearly struggling at the moment however and not really our problem after next Wednesday.
I should have been clearer, sorry. I don't think he's done much for us that shows he's a good player. A few games at the start? Nothing else.
I don't wish him ill, I just hope we shake his hand and send him on his way.
Post by: Andy_Lochhead_in_the_air on May 14, 2021, 05:36:15 PM
I disagree, I think he's a very good player. He's clearly struggling at the moment however and not really our problem after next Wednesday.
Yep, my thoughts too. I'd also add that I think he'd actually suit a season in the Championship to rebuild his confidence because the ability is there. Whether his fitness would last is another question.
He covered so much of the pitch in a match recently but never quite quickly enough or in the right places. A bit like Eric Morecombe on the piano.
Everything is in the right order, they're just not necessarily all the right letters.
Post by: Risso on May 14, 2021, 05:40:57 PM
I disagree, I think he's a very good player. He's clearly struggling at the moment however and not really our problem after next Wednesday.
Yep, my thoughts too. I'd also add that I think he'd actually suit a season in the Championship to rebuild his confidence because the ability is there. Whether his fitness would last is another question.
I think given his ridiculous antics when substituted for us, a spell in the Championship is the very last thing he'd ever agree to. He'd almost certainly see out his contract on the bench at Chelsea and then move to somewhere like the US or China than do that I reckon. I could see him going to a club like Palace for next season though.
Post by: N'ZMAV on May 14, 2021, 08:42:09 PM
It could have gone really well, it almost seemed like a great loan, we needed him and he needed us. Like Lingard at West Ham, a real chance to make a fresh start.
If Barkley is planning on playing Premier League football next season he’ll need to improve every area of his game, reduce his wage demands by probably over 50% and hope Chelsea let him leave for nothing. Pretty much a disaster.
Post by: London Villan on May 14, 2021, 09:32:55 PM
Post by: exigo on May 14, 2021, 09:45:11 PM
Someone will be desperate enough to sign him.
The biggest danger is that it's us.
Post by: VILLA MOLE on May 14, 2021, 09:45:22 PM
Someone will be desperate enough to sign him.
[/quote
someone like newcastle
Post by: Malandro on May 14, 2021, 09:46:01 PM
Someone will be desperate enough to sign him.
What’s the song.... pity the fool.
Post by: eamonn on May 15, 2021, 01:46:01 AM
Post by: Goldie.7 on May 15, 2021, 03:37:33 AM
Someone will be desperate enough to sign him.
Someone like Newcastle.
Reeks like a typical Palace signing to me.
Post by: Goldie.7 on May 15, 2021, 04:52:48 AM
If we write off the extra 4 points he got us against Leicester & Southampton we wouldn't even drop any places in the table. We'd be on 45 points, but with the better goal difference. He's been incredibly poor since the Arsenal match that he has actually become irrelevant for us.
When average players like Joe Willock have scored more goals in 5 weeks and have more assists throughout the season than Barkley you just have to laugh in embarrassment for him. If I'm not emphasizing enough how shit £100k-a-week Barkley has been for us even Ashley Westwood has more assists than him this season.
Post by: Sexual Ealing on May 15, 2021, 05:06:00 AM
Post by: Malandro on May 15, 2021, 05:40:58 AM
Someone Like You? Adele, I think.
I had you down as a Adele fan. All the heart break and crying in your bedroom.
Post by: Border villan on May 16, 2021, 01:09:42 PM
Post by: ChicagoLion on May 16, 2021, 08:44:37 PM
Post by: dcdavecollett on May 18, 2021, 12:34:14 AM
Post by: ChicagoLion on May 18, 2021, 06:08:23 AM
...which followed two better performances in the previous couple of games, including a good showing at Goodison.2 better performances, hardly difficult against the standard he set.
Post by: algy on May 18, 2021, 07:03:17 AM
We need a player like Ross when he's on one. Jack & him were irresistible against Liverpool. But whatever's wrong, it's not something we can fix (or have time to - we've very much an upwards trajectory right now). I imagine he'll be out on loan with an option to buy next season. Maybe somewhere like Celtic/Rangers? That might be his best bet.
Post by: dcdavecollett on May 19, 2021, 01:30:47 AM
There's no way we'll be trying to bring him in this summer. Be interesting to see where he ends up.
Post by: ChicagoLion on May 19, 2021, 07:25:37 AM
Integrity means acknowledging his good performances as well as the bad ones, whatever you think about him.he ain’t ever playing for Chelsea again, they have exhausted the mug punter option of someone paying his wages and a hired gun fee, so it will be either another loan with Chelsea paying most of his wages or they buy out his contract.
There's no way we'll be trying to bring him in this summer. Be interesting to see where he ends up.
He will probably get loaned to lower prem or championship club.
Fulham is a possibility.
Post by: ozzjim on May 19, 2021, 07:31:44 AM
Post by: Clampy on May 19, 2021, 07:33:10 AM
Integrity means acknowledging his good performances as well as the bad ones, whatever you think about him.
Agree. He did show glimpses of what he can bring to the team and when he did, we looked better for it but it was nowhere near often enough unfortunately.
Post by: TaxDodger on May 19, 2021, 03:33:09 PM
https://twitter.com/FootyHumour/status/1395005419114926084
Post by: chrisw1 on May 19, 2021, 03:49:27 PM
Post by: SoccerHQ on May 19, 2021, 08:16:50 PM
Post by: N'ZMAV on May 19, 2021, 08:19:03 PM
Post by: AGRIPPA on May 19, 2021, 09:19:20 PM
Post by: manic-road on May 19, 2021, 09:29:31 PM
Post by: Abbeyfealeavfc on May 19, 2021, 09:29:52 PM
Post by: LeeB on May 20, 2021, 10:48:00 AM
I know he's a footballer on a staggering wage and all, but to me he looks like he has a few demons in his head that are holding him back. I look at the 'petulance' we saw when he came off and see it as a player angry with himself, not the decision. I hope he gets himself right because when he has the ability.
Post by: ChicagoLion on May 20, 2021, 10:51:49 AM
I feel for him, the bleeding heart liberal that I am.I don't think his body can do what he needs it to do.
I know he's a footballer on a staggering wage and all, but to me he looks like he has a few demons in his head that are holding him back. I look at the 'petulance' we saw when he came off and see it as a player angry with himself, not the decision. I hope he gets himself right because when he has the ability.
Post by: LeeB on May 20, 2021, 10:52:38 AM
I feel for him, the bleeding heart liberal that I am.I don't think his body can do what he needs it to do.
I know he's a footballer on a staggering wage and all, but to me he looks like he has a few demons in his head that are holding him back. I look at the 'petulance' we saw when he came off and see it as a player angry with himself, not the decision. I hope he gets himself right because when he has the ability.
I think you may be right
Post by: Smithy on May 20, 2021, 10:58:09 AM
Tara Ross, expected more and only contributed slightly more than Drinkwater.
Only slightly more than Drinkwater? Either you never saw Drinkwater play for us, or you've never seen Barkley play for us. Barkley has overall been a bit of a disappointment, but to put him in the same bracket as Drinkwater is bonkers. Before Christmas he was good (and sometimes great), and he played a big part in some great victories (Liverpool, Leicester and Southampton in particular). Since Xmas, it's clearly not worked out and though I have no desire to see him sign permanently, he goes with my good wishes and I hope he gets a move in the summer to somewhere he can play regularly.
Drinkwater, on the other hand, was both crap on the rare occasions we saw him, and disruptive on the training field. Chalk and Cheese.
Post by: olaftab on May 20, 2021, 11:00:56 AM
I feel for him, the bleeding heart liberal that I am.Saint LeeB.
I know he's a footballer on a staggering wage and all, but to me he looks like he has a few demons in his head that are holding him back. I look at the 'petulance' we saw when he came off and see it as a player angry with himself, not the decision. I hope he gets himself right because when he has the ability.
Post by: Duncan Shaw on May 20, 2021, 11:01:21 AM
I feel for him, the bleeding heart liberal that I am.I don't think his body can do what he needs it to do.
I know he's a footballer on a staggering wage and all, but to me he looks like he has a few demons in his head that are holding him back. I look at the 'petulance' we saw when he came off and see it as a player angry with himself, not the decision. I hope he gets himself right because when he has the ability.
I think you may be right
It's funny, I was watching the AVFC Official Goal of the Season montage on Twitter the other day and his one at Leicester was rightly in it. In that clip when he scored and ran around celebrating it struck me he looked not only a totally different player to what we have seen of late, but almost a different person - sprightly, cheery call it what you will. I think something has happened with his injury/rehab that has affected him more than just physically and I wonder if he will ever recover from it now?
Post by: in exile on May 20, 2021, 11:16:13 AM
Post by: chrisw1 on May 20, 2021, 11:37:56 AM
Yep, he was mostly rubbish after his injury, but he wasn't the only one. He played his part this season and was well paid for it. Ultimately he was dissapointing but I'm not sure why there's so much hatred and glee about him moving on? It was a marriage of covenience and it just about served it's purpose.
Post by: Drummond on May 20, 2021, 12:33:56 PM
I feel for him, the bleeding heart liberal that I am.I don't think his body can do what he needs it to do.
I know he's a footballer on a staggering wage and all, but to me he looks like he has a few demons in his head that are holding him back. I look at the 'petulance' we saw when he came off and see it as a player angry with himself, not the decision. I hope he gets himself right because when he has the ability.
Haha, I'm the same.
Post by: PaulWinch again on May 20, 2021, 12:56:45 PM
I feel for him, the bleeding heart liberal that I am.
I know he's a footballer on a staggering wage and all, but to me he looks like he has a few demons in his head that are holding him back. I look at the 'petulance' we saw when he came off and see it as a player angry with himself, not the decision. I hope he gets himself right because when he has the ability.
Yup that’s where I am too.
Post by: Border villan on May 20, 2021, 04:01:33 PM
Both were far from the best who have appeared for the Villa, but importantly they gave their all in the claret and blue shirt and would have run through a brick wall for the team. A quality sadly lacking in Ross Barkley.
Post by: N'ZMAV on May 20, 2021, 04:06:07 PM
Only a few more days to wait to see if Deano managed to get Barkley into the Euro's squad.Not sure on this form he'd even get in the Scotland squad
Post by: Monty on May 20, 2021, 04:10:15 PM
Post by: Toronto Villa on May 20, 2021, 04:35:43 PM
Post by: VILLA MOLE on May 20, 2021, 04:39:27 PM
Post by: Pete3206 on May 20, 2021, 11:22:02 PM
Tara Ross, expected more and only contributed slightly more than Drinkwater.
Harsh. If fact, totally wrong.
Post by: tomd2103 on May 21, 2021, 12:01:20 AM
Ross played his part in a fantastic start to the season. Without him we may not have had the foundation that we needed to get through the poor run unscathed.
Yep, he was mostly rubbish after his injury, but he wasn't the only one. He played his part this season and was well paid for it. Ultimately he was dissapointing but I'm not sure why there's so much hatred and glee about him moving on? It was a marriage of covenience and it just about served it's purpose.
No hatred or glee from me Chris, just disappointment that it didn't work out the way it looked like it might earlier in the season. We paid a lot of money and in reality, he did well in a handful of games, so it has to go down as a failure really.
When we really needed him to step up in Jack Grealish's absence, he became worse if anything and contributed very little. He was, however, able to lift his performance and energy levels considerably on his return to Goodison Park, either trying to prove a point or catch the eye.
I wouldn't put him alongside some of the wasters we have seen over the past decade or so, more in the category of disappointing that it just didn't work out for one reason or another.
Post by: ROBBO on May 21, 2021, 12:11:02 AM
Post by: OzVilla on May 21, 2021, 03:00:34 AM
Up there with Didier Six, Sasa Curcic and Antonio Luna as players who had blinders in their first games and just seemed to regress game on game. A real shame and a missed opportunity for him.
Post by: paul_e on May 21, 2021, 08:10:53 AM
He looks about 10 years older and is scared to really open his stride so everything is at about 80%. Coupled with everything else I suspect the injury was worse than we thought and he's struggled to recover.
Post by: LeeB on May 21, 2021, 08:27:13 AM
Obviously doesn't matter now as he's played his last game for us but watching back some highlights yesterday I noticed something about his running. Watch the Liverpool game and pay attention to him then watch a game recently, even Everton where he played well.
He looks about 10 years older and is scared to really open his stride so everything is at about 80%. Coupled with everything else I suspect the injury was worse than we thought and he's struggled to recover.
Some of the cameos before that as well, I think it was the Newcastle game when the ball was close and a fit player would have got first to it, just needed a quick turn but he couldn't do it.
Post by: Pat Mustard on May 21, 2021, 08:43:55 AM
Obviously doesn't matter now as he's played his last game for us but watching back some highlights yesterday I noticed something about his running. Watch the Liverpool game and pay attention to him then watch a game recently, even Everton where he played well.
He looks about 10 years older and is scared to really open his stride so everything is at about 80%. Coupled with everything else I suspect the injury was worse than we thought and he's struggled to recover.
This is exactly right - something just looks wrong with him to me. Whether it’s still the injury, or it’s the psychological pressure of knowing something could go wrong again but he just wasn’t the same player after the injury.
If he could be fixed then to me there is still a very useful player there, but it doesn’t look like it will be with us. I hope he does manage to get it sorted though, because he doesn’t deserve to end up on the scrap heap.
Post by: Neil Hawkes on May 21, 2021, 09:05:20 AM
Post by: ChicagoLion on May 21, 2021, 09:20:55 AM
Same here, I do feel a bit sorry for him. I have always maintained that there is an underlying injury problem and it must be dismal to know you should be at your peak but can not get there.Ross played his part in a fantastic start to the season. Without him we may not have had the foundation that we needed to get through the poor run unscathed.
Yep, he was mostly rubbish after his injury, but he wasn't the only one. He played his part this season and was well paid for it. Ultimately he was dissapointing but I'm not sure why there's so much hatred and glee about him moving on? It was a marriage of covenience and it just about served it's purpose.
No hatred or glee from me Chris, just disappointment that it didn't work out the way it looked like it might earlier in the season. We paid a lot of money and in reality, he did well in a handful of games, so it has to go down as a failure really.
When we really needed him to step up in Jack Grealish's absence, he became worse if anything and contributed very little. He was, however, able to lift his performance and energy levels considerably on his return to Goodison Park, either trying to prove a point or catch the eye.
I wouldn't put him alongside some of the wasters we have seen over the past decade or so, more in the category of disappointing that it just didn't work out for one reason or another.
Any one that has played knows the sadness of discovering your body just cant do it any more but much worse if it happens prematurely.
Post by: sickbeggar on May 21, 2021, 09:37:08 AM
Post by: Allan C on May 21, 2021, 12:56:04 PM
Post by: Bryan on May 21, 2021, 02:17:48 PM
I really want someone creative in the middle to supplement Jack and Traore, but if that player can't press and leaves us under pressure when he'd not in possession, we'd be better playing another striker.
Post by: Small Rodent on May 21, 2021, 02:28:58 PM
Post by: Des Little on May 21, 2021, 09:57:17 PM
Post by: charleeco7 on May 22, 2021, 04:37:18 AM
Looks like he’s been celebrating the end of the season. For me he proves the point that you can have all the ability in the world but without the right attitude you’re destined to fail.
Post by: Percy McCarthy on May 22, 2021, 05:07:25 AM
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/sportsnews/article-9606567/England-star-Ross-Barkley-kicked-London-bar-following-drunken-row-diners-staff.html
Looks like he’s been celebrating the end of the season. For me he proves the point that you can have all the ability in the world but without the right attitude you’re destined to fail.
“...scoring once”. Harsh, got three that I can remember.
Post by: ChicagoLion on May 22, 2021, 06:02:33 AM
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/sportsnews/article-9606567/England-star-Ross-Barkley-kicked-London-bar-following-drunken-row-diners-staff.htmlThe MAYFAIR an interesting venue, lots of Russian ladies looking for company.
Looks like he’s been celebrating the end of the season. For me he proves the point that you can have all the ability in the world but without the right attitude you’re destined to fail.
Post by: Richard E on May 22, 2021, 06:58:33 AM
Post by: andyh on May 22, 2021, 07:59:01 AM
Who cares? To all intents and purposes he’s not our player anymore anyway.My thoughts entirely.
Post by: ChicagoLion on May 22, 2021, 08:43:26 AM
oh yeh, should be labelled ?% Villa because no one is interested ;DWho cares? To all intents and purposes he’s not our player anymore anyway.My thoughts entirely.
Post by: algy on May 22, 2021, 08:56:43 AM
We need a player like Ross against Liverpool though. It's all "if this" and "if that", but I think if he'd maintained his early season performance level, we'd be up chasing Europa League places. Don't think we're far off that already to be honest, maybe just a defensive midfielder to allow SJM & Dougie to push further up.
Post by: PhilVill on May 22, 2021, 10:52:26 AM
Post by: Damo70 on May 22, 2021, 11:15:55 AM
Post by: Risso on May 22, 2021, 12:12:51 PM
I reckon there’s a little depression going on with Ross (I drank myself daft when I had it as I didn’t have a clue what was going on with myself so sought refuge being totally out of it) I hope he gets the help he will need, gets himself through it, and gets himself back to the levels we all know he can. All the best to him and thanks for that LFC game!
I don't think we can be diagnosing depression and suggesting help is needed on the back of a footballer getting a bit pissed.
Post by: KevinGage on May 22, 2021, 12:34:18 PM
Pity for both us & him that it didn't work out, especially since we saw glimpses of what could've been. Don't think it was an abject failure of a loan I'm the sense that Drinkwater was, but it's not worked out.
We need a player like Ross against Liverpool though. It's all "if this" and "if that", but I think if he'd maintained his early season performance level, we'd be up chasing Europa League places. Don't think we're far off that already to be honest, maybe just a defensive midfielder to allow SJM & Dougie to push further up.
Indeed.
At the time West Ham signed Lingard, if you'd have asked who was more likely to tip the balance for his loan club pushing at the top of the table I don't think it would have been close.
Part of Barkley's effectiveness early on was his link up play with Jack. Plus, if sides were happy to assign 2-3 players to Jack as per usual, we suddenly had threats from different parts of the pitch with Ross, Watkins and even Cash all exploiting the space at various times. Unlike last season, where if sides could shut Jack down, they shut Villa down.
Some of our deficiencies in the middle of the park recently lead me to think we need a physical presence either alongside Luiz doing the spadework (or even deeper) with McGinn closer to the role he plays for Scotland; playing higher up, running with the ball and getting shots off. He has that bit of needle to his game where he's not afraid to tackle and defend from the front when required as well.
Barkley at his very best for us got shots away quicker and had slicker passing. Albeit he offered next to nothing in the tackle even during this period. But the way we overwhelmed sides earlier this year still has merit, if we could find a more consistent motivated version of Barkley. Let sides worry about us, as it were.
Post by: darren woolley on May 22, 2021, 12:41:51 PM
Post by: Brazilian Villain on May 22, 2021, 01:13:10 PM
The MAYFAIR an interesting venue, lots of Russian ladies looking for company.
Maybe on his way to Spartak Moscow and wants to speak the lingo?
Post by: clash city rocker on May 22, 2021, 03:31:46 PM
The MAYFAIR an interesting venue, lots of Russian ladies looking for company.
Maybe on his way to Spartak Moscow and wants to speak the lingo?
Personal experience Chicago ?
Post by: olaftab on May 22, 2021, 04:02:34 PM
He hasn't done himself any favours getting pissed up in a upper class establishment.No he should have chosen the The Sportsman in Nechells and no one would have known.
Post by: passport1 on May 22, 2021, 04:48:35 PM
Post by: Jane on May 22, 2021, 05:48:05 PM
I reckon there’s a little depression going on with Ross (I drank myself daft when I had it as I didn’t have a clue what was going on with myself so sought refuge being totally out of it) I hope he gets the help he will need, gets himself through it, and gets himself back to the levels we all know he can. All the best to him and thanks for that LFC game!
I don't think we can be diagnosing depression and suggesting help is needed on the back of a footballer getting a bit pissed.
Oh completely. He knows his season is over (he’s not allowed to play tomorrow, remember) & just went on a bender! It’s really not a story.
Post by: SamTheMouse on May 22, 2021, 07:55:43 PM
Anyway, he's not going to be part of our plans going forward, and that's for the best, but I wish him well.
Post by: Toronto Villa on May 22, 2021, 07:57:56 PM
Post by: Bad English on May 22, 2021, 08:18:52 PM
Quote from: The Daily Heil
There are also claims included in the report that his bright pink underwear were on display when he leaned over at a particular moment.Return to the dark ages.
Post by: SaddVillan on May 22, 2021, 08:26:03 PM
His next move will be crucial if he isn't to spiral down professionally and personally.
He clearly hasn't got a future at Chelsea.
Post by: RamboandBruno on May 22, 2021, 09:02:13 PM
It never worked out, good luck to him whatever happens next. And the villa move on.
Post by: steamer on May 23, 2021, 08:37:36 AM
Has a talent but.
He needs someone to give him some advice and guidance.
probable next gig at Southampton or somewhere similar can not see anyone in top 10 wanting him.
Post by: ChicagoLion on May 23, 2021, 08:41:49 AM
with these feet?The MAYFAIR an interesting venue, lots of Russian ladies looking for company.
Maybe on his way to Spartak Moscow and wants to speak the lingo?
Personal experience Chicago ?
Post by: PeterWithe on May 23, 2021, 08:47:30 AM
I dunno. There's something not right with him mentally. Obviously we don't know, but I wouldn't be at all surprised if it turned out that he is ill.
Anyway, he's not going to be part of our plans going forward, and that's for the best, but I wish him well.
He’s looked unhappy with his lot and discontent for some months, in his play and his body language. He looks like he knows he has blown a big chance.
Post by: tony scott on May 23, 2021, 09:59:52 AM
Post by: kipeye on May 23, 2021, 10:02:54 AM
If he had the conclusion would have been a lot quicker.He hasn't done himself any favours getting pissed up in a upper class establishment.No he should have chosen the The Sportsman in Nechells and no one would have known.
Post by: algy on May 23, 2021, 10:18:25 AM
A lot of unfulfilled potential made harder with a number of very disruptive injuries probably has left him incredibly frustrated about many things in his career and life, which then can manifest itself in unsavoury professional and personal incidents.He's got a bit pissed after (his) last game of the season. I just don't see why that's particularly unexpected or controversial. Other than that, the only other 'incident' was going down to a restaurant in London for his birthday meal, which to me - when you're dealing with high profile figures who'd likely have drawn a lot of attention in Brum - showed a (possibly unintentional) level of responsibility to me.
Much less controversial than, say, Jack Grealish who's been a bit of a prat over lockdown (tho again, I'm not inclined to be too critical of him either - driving offences aside it's a bit of a fuss over nothing)
Post by: saunders_heroes on May 23, 2021, 10:23:19 AM
A lot of unfulfilled potential made harder with a number of very disruptive injuries probably has left him incredibly frustrated about many things in his career and life, which then can manifest itself in unsavoury professional and personal incidents.He's got a bit pissed after (his) last game of the season. I just don't see why that's particularly unexpected or controversial. Other than that, the only other 'incident' was going down to a restaurant in London for his birthday meal, which to me - when you're dealing with high profile figures who'd likely have drawn a lot of attention in Brum - showed a (possibly unintentional) level of responsibility to me.
Much less controversial than, say, Jack Grealish who's been a bit of a prat over lockdown (tho again, I'm not inclined to be too critical of him either - driving offences aside it's a bit of a fuss over nothing)
Spot on.
Post by: KevinGage on May 23, 2021, 11:13:56 AM
Despite Lampard authorising the loan to us, he seemed to rate him enough to have him feature last season. And he was still making the bench for them in the early part of this season, even with their numbers in that area.
Him and Tammy would be fairly obvious moves to make.
Post by: Damo70 on May 23, 2021, 11:16:40 AM
Post by: sickbeggar on May 23, 2021, 11:19:55 AM
Post by: eamonn on May 23, 2021, 06:51:43 PM
Post by: kippaxvilla2 on February 04, 2024, 12:21:34 AM
Post by: brontebilly on February 04, 2024, 10:31:41 AM
Amazing performance today. I’m personally really pleased for him. So unlucky with injuries with us as he was great until that hamstring injury.
Appalling attitude too, let's be honest. I couldn't stand him in a Villa shirt.
Somehow the penny has finally dropped. I'd say Luton were the only PL club offering him a contract last summer, fair play to him for grabbing it with both hands. Looks way fitter, some thorough lifestyle changes over the summer I expect.
Post by: Steve67 on February 04, 2024, 10:34:10 AM
Post by: ChicagoLion on February 04, 2024, 10:34:36 AM
He definitely looks different physically, I think he had bulked up too much.Amazing performance today. I’m personally really pleased for him. So unlucky with injuries with us as he was great until that hamstring injury.
Appalling attitude too, let's be honest. I couldn't stand him in a Villa shirt.
Somehow the penny has finally dropped. I'd say Luton were the only PL club offering him a contract last summer, fair play to him for grabbing it with both hands. Looks way fitter, some thorough lifestyle changes over the summer I expect.
Maybe there have been lifestyle changes, well done to him.
Post by: Ian. on February 04, 2024, 11:35:02 AM
Post by: Risso on February 04, 2024, 11:36:10 AM
I had to laugh when that pillock Jenas was talking about Barclay for England. Then I see Southgate is still looking at Henderson at Ajax and I wouldn’t put it passed him to look at Ross!
Barkley's actually play well in a tough league though, a bit different to Henderson!
Post by: Ian. on February 04, 2024, 11:41:46 AM
I had to laugh when that pillock Jenas was talking about Barclay for England. Then I see Southgate is still looking at Henderson at Ajax and I wouldn’t put it passed him to look at Ross!
Barkley's actually play well in a tough league though, a bit different to Henderson!
He is playing well, I’d give him that, but good enough for England?
Anyway no ones getting ahead of Henderson, or Phillips either.
Post by: Hookeysmith on February 04, 2024, 11:41:52 AM
Post by: Risso on February 04, 2024, 11:43:54 AM
Even mouthgate could not keep justifying picking him whilst he was stealing a living in the desert.
He did keep picking him though.
Post by: AV82EC on February 04, 2024, 11:44:22 AM
I had to laugh when that pillock Jenas was talking about Barclay for England. Then I see Southgate is still looking at Henderson at Ajax and I wouldn’t put it passed him to look at Ross!
Barkley's actually play well in a tough league though, a bit different to Henderson!
Barkley has transformed himself, whether that’s down to himself realising he was pissing his talent away, or Edwards at Luton telling him a few home truths, Luton have a top quality player on board. I thought he was the pick of Luton’s players when we beat them and you could see the ability. He may have ultimately been a waste of space whilst at Villa but watching him, Grealish and McGinn destroy Liverpool in the 7-2 was superb.
Post by: TopDeck113 on February 04, 2024, 11:46:46 AM
Post by: eamonn on February 04, 2024, 12:13:17 PM
People deserve a second, third and fourth chance.
What if they've robbed, killed or raped?
Post by: Stinkin_Thinkin on February 04, 2024, 12:31:44 PM
Post by: robleflaneur on February 04, 2024, 12:38:14 PM
How come he was bombing forward ? How come he was able to do that ? Possibly,because it's near closing time in the Last Chance Saloon.He's got himself fitter and leaner.
The skill was never in doubt but attitude and fitness were.Much better than Chelski's Gallagher.
Post by: Steve67 on February 04, 2024, 04:30:42 PM
People deserve a second, third and fourth chance.
What if they've robbed, killed or raped?
Whoosh! Sarcasm never seems to work on the internet. Last chance saloon for Barkley.
Post by: Tokyo Sexwhale on February 04, 2024, 06:27:43 PM
Credit where it's due. Barkley - and also Andros Townsend - has woken up to the fact that it might be Luton but it is also last chance saloon as far as playing in the Premier League is concerned. That also takes good management, something that was conspicuous by its absence when you consider some of those buffoons with plenty of experience who were in and around the Villa squad that eventually went down.
Maybe Dele Alli should sign for Luton...
Post by: RamboandBruno on February 04, 2024, 08:04:04 PM
Post by: Toronto Villa on February 04, 2024, 09:51:45 PM
Barclay has been brilliant almost every time ive seen a Luton game on tv this year
You can bank on him having a good game vs us in a couple of weeks. I'd put money on it.
Post by: kippaxvilla2 on February 04, 2024, 10:06:21 PM
Post by: Drummond on February 04, 2024, 11:06:27 PM
Post by: Pat McMahon on February 04, 2024, 11:09:19 PM
Barkley was excellent for most of that game (as he is everytime I watch Luton) but he was sloppy for the 4th newcastle equaliser. Lost it in a dangerous position. If he's putting in man of the match performances every week he deserves to get called up. But we know it doesn't work like that with Southgate.
I only saw the highlights on MOTD, who didn’t focus on it, but I thought Barkley was fouled for Newcastle’s 4th.
Post by: LeeB on February 05, 2024, 07:50:07 AM
Barkley was excellent for most of that game (as he is everytime I watch Luton) but he was sloppy for the 4th newcastle equaliser. Lost it in a dangerous position. If he's putting in man of the match performances every week he deserves to get called up. But we know it doesn't work like that with Southgate.
I only saw the highlights on MOTD, who didn’t focus on it, but I thought Barkley was fouled for Newcastle’s 4th.
Me too, it was the kind of challenge Newcastle routinely get away with at home.
Post by: ChicagoLion on February 05, 2024, 09:56:46 AM
It was another dodgy decision, there are lots of them.Barkley was excellent for most of that game (as he is everytime I watch Luton) but he was sloppy for the 4th newcastle equaliser. Lost it in a dangerous position. If he's putting in man of the match performances every week he deserves to get called up. But we know it doesn't work like that with Southgate.
I only saw the highlights on MOTD, who didn’t focus on it, but I thought Barkley was fouled for Newcastle’s 4th.
Me too, it was the kind of challenge Newcastle routinely get away with at home.
Post by: LeeB on February 05, 2024, 11:15:56 AM
It was another dodgy decision, there are lots of them.Barkley was excellent for most of that game (as he is everytime I watch Luton) but he was sloppy for the 4th newcastle equaliser. Lost it in a dangerous position. If he's putting in man of the match performances every week he deserves to get called up. But we know it doesn't work like that with Southgate.
I only saw the highlights on MOTD, who didn’t focus on it, but I thought Barkley was fouled for Newcastle’s 4th.
Me too, it was the kind of challenge Newcastle routinely get away with at home.
It was the sort of thing Arteta or Klopp would whinge about then we'd have 20 minutes of discussion on MOTD and endless think pieces in the rags, but outside of that gets brushed away without any consideration.
Post by: Legion on May 23, 2024, 09:51:27 PM
Post by: Steve67 on May 23, 2024, 10:29:45 PM
Post by: Brazilian Villain on May 23, 2024, 10:34:30 PM
Post by: coreyfeldman on May 23, 2024, 10:39:34 PM
Really?People deserve a second, third and fourth chance.
What if they've robbed, killed or raped?
Post by: VillaTim on May 23, 2024, 10:39:36 PM
Post by: Villan82 on May 23, 2024, 10:44:42 PM
Post by: Astnor on May 23, 2024, 10:49:23 PM
Post by: Legion on May 23, 2024, 10:50:07 PM
Post by: pauliewalnuts on May 23, 2024, 10:52:02 PM
No thanks .
Behold, the ultimate stamp of approval for a signing!
Post by: AV84 on May 23, 2024, 10:56:25 PM
Let's hope this is one of those rare instances where the sequel is better than the original.
Like Sister Act 2 - Back in the Habit
Post by: VillaTim on May 23, 2024, 11:02:23 PM
Post by: Legion on May 23, 2024, 11:04:48 PM
Until Fabrizio has spoken it's just idle speculation anyway .
An official announcement from Pravda is better.
Post by: The Edge on May 23, 2024, 11:06:00 PM
Post by: AV84 on May 23, 2024, 11:06:20 PM
Post by: john e on May 23, 2024, 11:10:23 PM
Seems to have had a bit of a redemption at Luton, but in his recent years he’s been rubbish far more often than he’s been any good so I’m not sure his spots have changed for the longer term
I don’t think he’s worth the risk but hey ho seems the people in a better position than me think he is
Post by: Percy McCarthy on May 23, 2024, 11:10:56 PM
Until Fabrizio has spoken it's just idle speculation anyway .
He spoke the other night.
Post by: DrGonzo on May 23, 2024, 11:12:35 PM
Post by: Brazilian Villain on May 23, 2024, 11:14:54 PM
Until Fabrizio has spoken it's just idle speculation anyway .
Surprised you rate him, given many consider him to be a 'tap-in' merchant.
Post by: john e on May 23, 2024, 11:19:59 PM
We have been so short in this midfield area, SJM is not a holding player. Strikes me as a good coverage signing, certainly better than having to rely on Chambers to play that role.
If that’s the best argument comparing him to Chambers then it doesn’t fill me with any more confidence
Post by: VillaTim on May 23, 2024, 11:21:58 PM
Post by: Toronto Villa on May 23, 2024, 11:23:32 PM
Post by: john e on May 23, 2024, 11:29:04 PM
Intelligent signing to help our squad across a very taxing season. We ran out of experienced bodies. If Liverpool can sign Milner, Man U can sign a variety of experienced players, Arsenal signed Jorginho, we aren't above bringing in someone who can help us out. And he was superb for Luton last season.
Your really not helping
Milner is right up there as a role model perfect professional, Barkley isn’t
the fact your using Man Utd’s forage into the experienced players is unbelievable as they are mostly shit
we are bringing in someone where are very own experience with him was that he was a flop
Post by: ozzjim on May 23, 2024, 11:29:46 PM
I think there is a nodding acknowledgement from some fans of just how tight we might be to PSR breaches, followed by "why aren't we buying him over there for £45 million".
While I would love 3-4 brilliant signings and an Arsenal esque £200 million spend this summer, it ain't happening. Emery said we need to be intelligent. Make smart choices now so we can strengthen later.
Barkley for £2m when he has been in the top 5 Premier league centre mids this season on a lot of metrics, is clever. He's adapted to a deeper role, is comfortable in his own words of taking the ball anywhere and keeping it, chips in with a few goals and assists and seems to have grown up a lot. He's got champions league and playing abroad experience too. If he wasn't Barkley and was coming from Spain for that fee after the season he has had we'd be lauding it as a clever bit of squad building....which it is, especially when you see how shoddy we were when Luiz and McGinn were left on their own at any point last season.
Post by: AV84 on May 23, 2024, 11:38:48 PM
Post by: Dave P on May 23, 2024, 11:39:59 PM
Post by: VillaTim on May 23, 2024, 11:41:19 PM
Post by: Toronto Villa on May 23, 2024, 11:43:54 PM
It's going to be a very long summer at this rate .
agreed. You're unbearable with your constant misery.
Post by: pauliewalnuts on May 23, 2024, 11:46:38 PM
I don't like that option being Calum Chambers. I'd much rather it was Ross Barkley, at a pretty miniscule cost, he's a massive upgrade.
Post by: pauliewalnuts on May 23, 2024, 11:47:47 PM
It's going to be a very long summer at this rate .
Tell you what, it is for people who just do not listen when PSR is discussed.
As others have pointed out up this page, we CAN NOT go and spend what we want, we're in a tight spot already, and as the manager himself said last week, we need to be intelligent in what we do.
Anyone thinking we'll be dropping 50m on a player this summer - unless we make a big sale - is going to be really disappointed.
We can't do it.
Post by: tomd2103 on May 23, 2024, 11:52:09 PM
Let’s not wet the bed and think he’s going to replace Luiz or Tielemans. He’s more than likely going to upgrade Dendonker and that is a bone fide upgrade.
I just can't see him in that defensive midfield role for us I'm afraid. We need someone who is athletic, can cover the ground and really bring some energy in there like Kamara does.
Happy to be proved wrong, but I just don't see this being a shrewd signing.
Post by: john e on May 24, 2024, 12:01:54 AM
It's going to be a very long summer at this rate .
Tell you what, it is for people who just do not listen when PSR is discussed.
As others have pointed out up this page, we CAN NOT go and spend what we want, we're in a tight spot already, and as the manager himself said last week, we need to be intelligent in what we do.
Anyone thinking we'll be dropping 50m on a player this summer - unless we make a big sale - is going to be really disappointed.
We can't do it.
We’ve got Monchi and half the Spanish nation looking for value replacements but the best you think we can come up with is a flop we had first time round
you’ve got it wrong if you think I’m looking at 50 mill players, I was just hoping for a bit better than the risk we already know about
Post by: PeterWithesShin on May 24, 2024, 12:04:14 AM
Post by: Percy McCarthy on May 24, 2024, 12:05:38 AM
Ross Barkley isn't happening. Everyone get some sleep .
But your hero Romano has spoken, so I’m too excited.
(Plus I’m at work)
Post by: Monty on May 24, 2024, 12:11:28 AM
Come on back Ross, you'll find we're even bigger time now than the first time round. Hopefully it's to your liking!
Post by: Toronto Villa on May 24, 2024, 12:15:20 AM
Post by: ROBBO on May 24, 2024, 12:26:54 AM
Post by: brontebilly on May 24, 2024, 12:56:03 AM
Let’s not wet the bed and think he’s going to replace Luiz or Tielemans. He’s more than likely going to upgrade Dendonker and that is a bone fide upgrade.
He won't replace Kamara (or the Donk), that's not his game and that's where we are weakest. If he's a playmaker from deep these days then he's competing with Luiz and Tielemans for minutes. So he's not an upgrade on anyone. For football reasons only, it reminds me of the Zaniolo signing when we already had Diaby and Bailey, we don't need a player like Barkley.
If you can ignore, his career at the top level has been a joke for years bar last season, he already cost us a 12m loan fee + wages and bombed spectacularly.
Post by: Axl Rose on May 24, 2024, 01:30:46 AM
Anyway, if you come, good luck Ross.
Post by: Toronto Villa on May 24, 2024, 01:51:26 AM
Post by: ChicagoLion on May 24, 2024, 05:38:38 AM
It could be another indication that Luiz is on his way.
Post by: Goldenballs on May 24, 2024, 06:37:45 AM
Post by: FatSam on May 24, 2024, 06:54:49 AM
Decent bit of business, all things considered, although talk of a 'bumper 3 year contract' is a bit worrying. Hope he's still motivated.Yes, that’s the he only bit that I’m concerned about. I can’t help thinking that part of the reason for his success at Luton was the highly incentivised nature of a short term deal.
Post by: Mister E on May 24, 2024, 06:54:50 AM
Post by: RichardBatchelor on May 24, 2024, 06:59:47 AM
It's going to be a very long summer at this rate .
Tell you what, it is for people who just do not listen when PSR is discussed.
As others have pointed out up this page, we CAN NOT go and spend what we want, we're in a tight spot already, and as the manager himself said last week, we need to be intelligent in what we do.
Anyone thinking we'll be dropping 50m on a player this summer - unless we make a big sale - is going to be really disappointed.
We can't do it.
Which is great news for the Sky five, who no doubt can and will soend 50 million on a player (s)
Post by: chrisw1 on May 24, 2024, 07:14:57 AM
My concern is that he had a season at Luton where he played most of their games and was the central cog of their midfield. It will be different with us and I wonder whether bits of games here and there will suit him.
Yep, that’s a concern. But he’s a good player and is very good at looking after the ball under pressure, so if he does keep fit and motivated then I’m sure he’ll be useful
Post by: Nev on May 24, 2024, 07:20:04 AM
Post by: Clampy on May 24, 2024, 07:25:10 AM
Post by: RamboandBruno on May 24, 2024, 07:31:49 AM
He no doubt has loads of ability, but one of the issues for me is not so much what happened last time, its history, but how he’s going to cope with not being the big fish in the small pond he was last year. FA cup winning, euros, WC level Tielemans had to bide his time a lot for much of last season, can Barkleys mentality cope with that. Also there is no doubt combined with not being a regular, Unai will still be more demanding of him than Smith or maybe any other manager he’s had, has ever been.
If he can stay fit, stay mentally ok if not in the team all the time and cope with the demands of Emery, it could be a very good signing, but a lot of things have to work out.
Post by: ozzjim on May 24, 2024, 07:32:30 AM
Post by: algy on May 24, 2024, 07:34:02 AM
I suppose the thing is, if we had an extra body giving quality cover for central midfield last season, we get an extra 4 or 5 points in the run-in, CL football is wrapped up early, and we're all packing our bags for Athens right now.
Anyway, welcome back Ross.
Post by: LeonW on May 24, 2024, 08:35:34 AM
Whilst Barkley does not win many tackles he is very strong at carrying the ball under pressure from more physical opponents. And is a decent goal threat with his shooting.
This could be a very smart and reasonably cheap piece of business to give us an option when we play teams like Chelsea and other physical opponents that will press us high up the pitch. Sometimes players mature at different points. Perhaps Barkley has finally found a more consistent position for his skill set and fitness later on in his career at a last chance saloon in Luton. I think he’s worth a punt.
Post by: ChicagoLion on May 24, 2024, 08:41:24 AM
If he signs, he won’t be cover for anyone; more an option of a deep lying, physical ball carrying option which is not necessary a profile we have at the moment. Kamara and Dougie can carrying the ball but are susceptible to being disposed as neither are particularly physically imposing.I think there were some lifestyle changes.
Whilst Barkley does not win many tackles he is very strong at carrying the ball under pressure from more physical opponents. And is a decent goal threat with his shooting.
This could be a very smart and reasonably cheap piece of business to give us an option when we play teams like Chelsea and other physical opponents that will press us high up the pitch. Sometimes players mature at different points. Perhaps Barkley has finally found a more consistent position for his skill set and fitness later on in his career at a last chance saloon in Luton. I think he’s worth a punt.
Post by: darren woolley on May 24, 2024, 08:44:04 AM
Post by: LeonW on May 24, 2024, 08:45:35 AM
If he signs, he won’t be cover for anyone; more an option of a deep lying, physical ball carrying option which is not necessary a profile we have at the moment. Kamara and Dougie can carrying the ball but are susceptible to being disposed as neither are particularly physically imposing.I think there were some lifestyle changes.
Whilst Barkley does not win many tackles he is very strong at carrying the ball under pressure from more physical opponents. And is a decent goal threat with his shooting.
This could be a very smart and reasonably cheap piece of business to give us an option when we play teams like Chelsea and other physical opponents that will press us high up the pitch. Sometimes players mature at different points. Perhaps Barkley has finally found a more consistent position for his skill set and fitness later on in his career at a last chance saloon in Luton. I think he’s worth a punt.
Catching someone at the right moment is sometimes what it’s all about. I can see the logic in this one for sure. I’m sure Emery and Monchi will have done their homework on the person as much as the player.
Post by: dicedlam on May 24, 2024, 08:49:17 AM
I reckon this could be one of the bargain buys of the season.
Post by: chrisw1 on May 24, 2024, 08:56:56 AM
I think this is a smart move by us and he will fit right in how Unai will want to play. Quite a few games that I saw Barkley play in for Luton last season were very similar to how we invite the press in defense, then giving the ball to Barkley to turn and play through to the midfield or spraying the ball out wide. Physically imposing, good on the ball with a great range of passing.It could go either way, but I agree. Hopefully it's smart business.
I reckon this could be one of the bargain buys of the season.
Post by: john e on May 24, 2024, 09:10:52 AM
If he signs, he won’t be cover for anyone; more an option of a deep lying, physical ball carrying option which is not necessary a profile we have at the moment. Kamara and Dougie can carrying the ball but are susceptible to being disposed as neither are particularly physically imposing.I think there were some lifestyle changes.
Whilst Barkley does not win many tackles he is very strong at carrying the ball under pressure from more physical opponents. And is a decent goal threat with his shooting.
This could be a very smart and reasonably cheap piece of business to give us an option when we play teams like Chelsea and other physical opponents that will press us high up the pitch. Sometimes players mature at different points. Perhaps Barkley has finally found a more consistent position for his skill set and fitness later on in his career at a last chance saloon in Luton. I think he’s worth a punt.
Maybe the fact his mate Grealish isn’t here any more might help as well
Post by: john2710 on May 24, 2024, 09:21:43 AM
Post by: aj2k77 on May 24, 2024, 09:30:49 AM
Post by: VillaTim on May 24, 2024, 09:34:47 AM
When did he sign.
Anyway, welcome back Ross.
Post by: pablo_picasso on May 24, 2024, 09:43:39 AM
I don't trust him based on the previous decades worth of evidence not to rock up, have a few decent games & then settle into prime Barkley mode for the remainder of his contract.
I never wanted to ever see him in a Villa shirt again once he left & that hasn't changed.
Post by: Chris Smith on May 24, 2024, 09:54:59 AM
Disappointing signing if it happens.
I don't trust him based on the previous decades worth of evidence not to rock up, have a few decent games & then settle into prime Barkley mode for the remainder of his contract.
I never wanted to ever see him in a Villa shirt again once he left & that hasn't changed.
I cannot imagine Unai allowing that to happen. In any case he has apparently worked hard in a relegation fight all season which doesn’t strike me as the attitude of somebody settling.
Post by: Ads on May 24, 2024, 09:56:08 AM
Post by: VillaTim on May 24, 2024, 10:30:28 AM
Post by: itbrvilla on May 24, 2024, 10:34:58 AM
I think this is a smart move by us and he will fit right in how Unai will want to play. Quite a few games that I saw Barkley play in for Luton last season were very similar to how we invite the press in defense, then giving the ball to Barkley to turn and play through to the midfield or spraying the ball out wide. Physically imposing, good on the ball with a great range of passing.This is how I see it. He did very well last year and impressed me a lot. Some more physicality and strength in our midfield lightweight midfield will also be a bonus.
I reckon this could be one of the bargain buys of the season.
Post by: Brazilian Villain on May 24, 2024, 10:49:29 AM
I think it's all paper talk , can't see it happening. If it does it should be a 1 year deal or at least have a break clause.
If a man with your insight can't see it happening, then surely there's nothing to it.
Post by: Brend'Watkins on May 24, 2024, 10:56:56 AM
Post by: Baldy on May 24, 2024, 11:06:32 AM
This dude has had a two year trial already and failed.
Looked great at Luton last season but then again, so did Marvelous Nakamba before him.
We have a happy camp at the moment. Do we need someone sulking around in the background if they do not get the limelight!!
No from me, we can do better.
Post by: OCD on May 24, 2024, 11:12:15 AM
Post by: Ads on May 24, 2024, 11:20:13 AM
If you're not keen on clichés or zoo attractions, then you can watch football instead.
Post by: LeeB on May 24, 2024, 11:21:06 AM
Does a leopard change its spots!!
This dude has had a two year trial already and failed.
Looked great at Luton last season but then again, so did Marvelous Nakamba before him.
We have a happy camp at the moment. Do we need someone sulking around in the background if they do not get the limelight!!
No from me, we can do better.
Yeah, Marv was playing in the championship, Barkley was only here a year, and regarding his character do you not think the like McGinn, Mings, Cash, Emi, Luiz etc who all played here with him would have alerted the manager if there were issues?
Post by: Baldy on May 24, 2024, 11:22:47 AM
two year trial?
When he was on loan from Chelsea, might be less than 2 years.
He sulked a lot.
Post by: OCD on May 24, 2024, 11:31:07 AM
Post by: cdward on May 24, 2024, 11:33:15 AM
The form he showed for Luton this season sitting in deeper as a number 6, he would be a good replacement for Kamara.
We need to enlarge the squad for another season of European football, and he can play further forward/wider if needed.
He is an upgrade on Dendonker and will be relatively cheap.
If Unai and his backroom team want him, i'm happy to go with their judgement.
Post by: pablo_picasso on May 24, 2024, 11:37:55 AM
He was here for a year, and never looked right after his hamstring injury. After being released by Chelsea and having been without a club going into his peak career years, he seems to have had a realisation that time's running out and he has take things seriously now. I trust Emery and Monchi to know what they're doing.
I get that they have earned that trust, but it doesn't make them infallible.
Monchi once signed Olsen, for example...
For me personally, Barkley has done the opposite of earning my trust.
He has a decade of his career, wasting it. Including a year with us where I, & many others, never wanted to see him in a Villa shirt ever again. And I can say many others because I have both read & heard Villa fans say exactly that.
Granted, he had a good year at Luton on a short term contract, but it will take a lot from the player himself to prove to me that he has learned his lesson.
And I hope he does prove me wrong. I just don't expect it to happen.
Post by: Baldy on May 24, 2024, 11:43:07 AM
Yeah and the lad that just scored a hat-trick in the Europa League final was a berk with a dodgy panenka for Fulham. If you want leopards, Chester Zoo has a great exhibition. You can just about make the spots out on the black one.
If you're not keen on clichés or zoo attractions, then you can watch football instead.
Love cliches and zoo attractions. Like an elephant (bald with big ears) I never forget.
Once bitten twice shy.
No from me. But Unai and co will know better.
Post by: Ads on May 24, 2024, 11:48:10 AM
Post by: LeeB on May 24, 2024, 11:49:12 AM
He was here for a year, and never looked right after his hamstring injury. After being released by Chelsea and having been without a club going into his peak career years, he seems to have had a realisation that time's running out and he has take things seriously now. I trust Emery and Monchi to know what they're doing.
I get that they have earned that trust, but it doesn't make them infallible.
Monchi once signed Olsen, for example...
For me personally, Barkley has done the opposite of earning my trust.
He has a decade of his career, wasting it. Including a year with us where I, & many others, never wanted to see him in a Villa shirt ever again. And I can say many others because I have both read & heard Villa fans say exactly that.
Granted, he had a good year at Luton on a short term contract, but it will take a lot from the player himself to prove to me that he has learned his lesson.
And I hope he does prove me wrong. I just don't expect it to happen.
Nobody is infalliable, just that these guys are better than most.
And a couple of million plus wages to get in someone who undoubtedly has the ability to play in our team is an extremely low risk punt in terms of modern football transfers, especially given the potential rewards.
Post by: pablo_picasso on May 24, 2024, 11:52:34 AM
I really do...
Post by: LeeB on May 24, 2024, 11:54:06 AM
It's a gamble I hope comes off Lee.
I really do...
It will, don't worry.
Post by: Baldy on May 24, 2024, 11:56:43 AM
Yeah they will George.
George? Sorry, gone over my head.
Post by: VillaTim on May 24, 2024, 11:57:15 AM
Does a leopard change its spots!!x2.
This dude has had a two year trial already and failed.
Looked great at Luton last season but then again, so did Marvelous Nakamba before him.
We have a happy camp at the moment. Do we need someone sulking around in the background if they do not get the limelight!!
No from me, we can do better.
Post by: VillaTim on May 24, 2024, 11:58:40 AM
Post by: Toronto Villa on May 24, 2024, 11:58:45 AM
Post by: Toronto Villa on May 24, 2024, 11:59:22 AM
I cannot see anything concrete on this at all. I'd say it's all idle speculation and lazy journalism.
What a strange hill to want to die on.
Post by: Ads on May 24, 2024, 12:02:04 PM
Yeah they will George.
George? Sorry, gone over my head.
Just keep your distance and see if Barkley catches your eye.
Post by: PaulWinch again on May 24, 2024, 12:08:17 PM
It's a gamble I hope comes off Lee.
I really do...
It’s not really a gamble. It’s quite astute and risk based.
Post by: brontebilly on May 24, 2024, 12:08:48 PM
Surely anyone can make a signing that doesn’t pan out. I wouldn’t judge Monchi on his recruitment of Barkley because he once signed Olsen. He’s got more right than wrong. That would be like slating Alex Ferguson for signing Bebe, Eric Djemba Djemba, Kleberson and Taibi and ignoring the vast majority that worked out well. And frankly I have no reason to believe Barkley will be anything as bad as any of those. Especially as it’s likely a very small fee.
Micah Richards was "free"! I haven't been as against a potential signing as maybe Barkley the first time, Ings or Drinkwater. I wasn't sold on Martinez either 😀
Post by: pablo_picasso on May 24, 2024, 12:15:32 PM
Surely anyone can make a signing that doesn’t pan out. I wouldn’t judge Monchi on his recruitment of Barkley because he once signed Olsen. He’s got more right than wrong. That would be like slating Alex Ferguson for signing Bebe, Eric Djemba Djemba, Kleberson and Taibi and ignoring the vast majority that worked out well. And frankly I have no reason to believe Barkley will be anything as bad as any of those. Especially as it’s likely a very small fee.
Fair point.
My view on Barkley will only be changed by Barkley though.
Nothing stubborn or arrogant about that, not intentionally, as Id like to think I can change my mind given the right evidence, I just don't trust Barkley, until Barkley earns my trust.
No matter what the price.
But as Lee said, its a gamble that could pay off, so I wait with baited breath... 👍
Post by: OCD on May 24, 2024, 12:19:32 PM
Surely anyone can make a signing that doesn’t pan out. I wouldn’t judge Monchi on his recruitment of Barkley because he once signed Olsen. He’s got more right than wrong. That would be like slating Alex Ferguson for signing Bebe, Eric Djemba Djemba, Kleberson and Taibi and ignoring the vast majority that worked out well. And frankly I have no reason to believe Barkley will be anything as bad as any of those. Especially as it’s likely a very small fee.
I think there's the signings Monchi made without Emery as manager at Sevilla, and there's the signings Monchi made with Emery's input.
Post by: Drummond on May 24, 2024, 12:20:52 PM
Now, think of every player in our squad, and tell me any that have become worse under Emery, and then consider all of the players who have got better.
Then look at Barkley, who is English, cheap, and hungry to make up for lost time, in a stable team and club environment, where the team ethic thrives, the coaching is top drawer, and genuinely tell me there isn't a very high probability of him doing well for us.
Post by: pauliewalnuts on May 24, 2024, 12:21:32 PM
It's a gamble I hope comes off Lee.
I really do...
It’s not really a gamble. It’s quite astute and risk based.
Like all sensible gambles, it's a gamble we can afford to lose if it goes tits up*.
This message brought to you by GambleAware. When the fun stops, stop.
Post by: Olneythelonely on May 24, 2024, 12:33:36 PM
I cannot see anything concrete on this at all. I'd say it's all idle speculation and lazy journalism.
What are you going to do as a forfeit when you’re proven wrong? Change your username again?
Post by: Rudy Can't Fail on May 24, 2024, 12:36:05 PM
If he signs, he won’t be cover for anyone; more an option of a deep lying, physical ball carrying option which is not necessary a profile we have at the moment. Kamara and Dougie can carrying the ball but are susceptible to being disposed as neither are particularly physically imposing.
Whilst Barkley does not win many tackles he is very strong at carrying the ball under pressure from more physical opponents. And is a decent goal threat with his shooting.
This could be a very smart and reasonably cheap piece of business to give us an option when we play teams like Chelsea and other physical opponents that will press us high up the pitch. Sometimes players mature at different points. Perhaps Barkley has finally found a more consistent position for his skill set and fitness later on in his career at a last chance saloon in Luton. I think he’s worth a punt.
Good post and agree with all. The ball carrying part is something we've been lacking, it immediately puts teams on the back foot. Ramsey and Rogers can do it too but too often we refuse to take on a man in the middle of the park and instead pass it around looking for that key pass. Watching some highlights of his season at Luton Leon Bailey can expect to see the ball earlier and with space as Barkley can spray a pass across the field from left to right, very Pau Torres. I think he'll give us an extra threat in midfield playing from deep.
I see him more competing with Dougie and McGinn rather than Tielemanns. He's a 6 or 8 rather than a 10 now.
Post by: LeeB on May 24, 2024, 12:39:25 PM
If he signs, he won’t be cover for anyone; more an option of a deep lying, physical ball carrying option which is not necessary a profile we have at the moment. Kamara and Dougie can carrying the ball but are susceptible to being disposed as neither are particularly physically imposing.
Whilst Barkley does not win many tackles he is very strong at carrying the ball under pressure from more physical opponents. And is a decent goal threat with his shooting.
This could be a very smart and reasonably cheap piece of business to give us an option when we play teams like Chelsea and other physical opponents that will press us high up the pitch. Sometimes players mature at different points. Perhaps Barkley has finally found a more consistent position for his skill set and fitness later on in his career at a last chance saloon in Luton. I think he’s worth a punt.
Good post and agree with all. The ball carrying part is something we've been lacking, it immediately puts teams on the back foot. Ramsey and Rogers can do it too but too often we refuse to take on a man in the middle of the park and instead pass it around looking for that key pass. Watching some highlights of his season at Luton Leon Bailey can expect to see the ball earlier and with space as Barkley can spray a pass across the field from left to right, very Pau Torres. I think he'll give us an extra threat in midfield playing from deep.
I see him more competing with Dougie and McGinn rather than Tielemanns. He's a 6 or 8 rather than a 10 now.
He can also take those passes that Pau likes to hammer quickly into the middle of the pitch, something that bceame a struggle in the last few weeks.
Post by: dave shelley on May 24, 2024, 12:47:50 PM
Post by: john e on May 24, 2024, 01:00:17 PM
Post by: aldridgeboy on May 24, 2024, 01:00:51 PM
If he signs, he won’t be cover for anyone; more an option of a deep lying, physical ball carrying option which is not necessary a profile we have at the moment. Kamara and Dougie can carrying the ball but are susceptible to being disposed as neither are particularly physically imposing.
Whilst Barkley does not win many tackles he is very strong at carrying the ball under pressure from more physical opponents. And is a decent goal threat with his shooting.
This could be a very smart and reasonably cheap piece of business to give us an option when we play teams like Chelsea and other physical opponents that will press us high up the pitch. Sometimes players mature at different points. Perhaps Barkley has finally found a more consistent position for his skill set and fitness later on in his career at a last chance saloon in Luton. I think he’s worth a punt.
Good post and agree with all. The ball carrying part is something we've been lacking, it immediately puts teams on the back foot. Ramsey and Rogers can do it too but too often we refuse to take on a man in the middle of the park and instead pass it around looking for that key pass. Watching some highlights of his season at Luton Leon Bailey can expect to see the ball earlier and with space as Barkley can spray a pass across the field from left to right, very Pau Torres. I think he'll give us an extra threat in midfield playing from deep.
I see him more competing with Dougie and McGinn rather than Tielemanns. He's a 6 or 8 rather than a 10 now.
The Leon Bailey point is a great point. There were so many times last season where I though we just struggled to give it to what is pretty much our most dangerous player. Despite Baileys amazing season ( and stats ) I thought at long periods in games, he was isolated
Post by: villadelph on May 24, 2024, 01:23:37 PM
Post by: Russ aka Big Nose on May 24, 2024, 01:59:38 PM
I think he is too great a risk. He did well when first at Everton and then when the main man at Luton - everything went through him.
I can't see him being happy as a back-up option, biding his time for a chance to impress or the odd cameo appearances to save the legs of Luiz or Tielemans and it looks like he can be a disruptive influence.
I have to think there are better options that are lower risk. UTV
Post by: Jon Crofts on May 24, 2024, 02:02:58 PM
It's a gamble I hope comes off Lee.
I really do...
It’s not really a gamble. It’s quite astute and risk based.
More likely data led.
Post by: Sexual Ealing on May 24, 2024, 02:18:20 PM
Fair enough, on his form for Luton, he is an upgrade on Zaniolo, Chambers, and Dendoncker - though so are countless others.
I think he is too great a risk. He did well when first at Everton and then when the main man at Luton - everything went through him.
I can't see him being happy as a back-up option, biding his time for a chance to impress or the odd cameo appearances to save the legs of Luiz or Tielemans and it looks like he can be a disruptive influence.
I have to think there are better options that are lower risk. UTV
Tiny fee and (comparatively) low wages. Where's the risk?
Post by: Russ aka Big Nose on May 24, 2024, 02:35:00 PM
Potential disruption to a (seemingly) harmonious squad; a PL and CL squad place taken up by someone who might become a sulky passenger; a distraction for UE as he tries to get him firing; and blocking the progress of an Academy prospect.Fair enough, on his form for Luton, he is an upgrade on Zaniolo, Chambers, and Dendoncker - though so are countless others.
I think he is too great a risk. He did well when first at Everton and then when the main man at Luton - everything went through him.
I can't see him being happy as a back-up option, biding his time for a chance to impress or the odd cameo appearances to save the legs of Luiz or Tielemans and it looks like he can be a disruptive influence.
I have to think there are better options that are lower risk. UTV
Tiny fee and (comparatively) low wages. Where's the risk?
Plus, the obvious opportunity cost of not finding a better option ... or at the very least a similarly priced risk that might have some re-sale value, say someone younger from the Championship that is rated as (possibly) being able to step up. UTV
Post by: kippaxvilla2 on May 24, 2024, 02:38:13 PM
Post by: Drummond on May 24, 2024, 02:45:08 PM
Post by: VillaTim on May 24, 2024, 02:54:36 PM
Post by: Border villan on May 24, 2024, 03:07:50 PM
Odds 1/5 on SkyBet
Is Zani…interested at those odds.
Post by: AV84 on May 24, 2024, 03:09:28 PM
Hopefully the Everton links to him are true .
Everton can't afford tea bags never mind a player.
Post by: usav on May 24, 2024, 03:10:32 PM
He's certainly an upgrade on Zaniolo, Chambers and Donk.. though they might not do the same things, its still a net positive for us in the middle of the park. Especially considering most of our squad is going to be asked to play another 50+ matches next season.
I think this is the best way to look at it.
Post by: Clark W Griswold on May 24, 2024, 03:15:18 PM
Hopefully the Everton links to him are true .
Hopefully.
Failing that, if he is coming here hopefully he’ll decide to go and partake in a bit of Gloucester cheese rolling this weekend on the way to his medical.
Post by: KRS on May 24, 2024, 03:29:36 PM
This could turn out to be an astute signing but understandably there are question marks and concerns based on his previous form with us.
Post by: VillaTim on May 24, 2024, 03:35:44 PM
Post by: Bad English on May 24, 2024, 03:43:54 PM
Monchi: "Unai, I can get Barkley to sign for us."
Emery: "Monchi, I think we need to be a bit careful with the level of plaudits Luton are getting. They were largely crap and were rightly relegated despite Everton and Forest having points deduction issues and also being shite. Barkley ran around a lot and had his moments. That said, yes, let's sign him, we will be demanding in our way always looking to improve our levels, contributing to the team."
Post by: KRS on May 24, 2024, 03:44:45 PM
Post by: kippaxvilla2 on May 24, 2024, 03:45:05 PM
Post by: Olneythelonely on May 24, 2024, 03:58:17 PM
Hopefully the Everton links to him are true .
Hopefully? You were convinced it was bollocks a matter of hours ago
Post by: PaulWinch again on May 24, 2024, 03:58:51 PM
Post by: Drummond on May 24, 2024, 10:25:13 PM
Post by: AV84 on May 24, 2024, 10:28:01 PM
1/8 now
Is that more or less likely than 1/5?
Post by: Brazilian Villain on May 24, 2024, 10:31:43 PM
1/8 now
Is that more or less likely than 1/5?
More likely.
Mind you, we were 1/25 to get Champions League football and look what happened there.
Post by: VillaTim on May 24, 2024, 10:55:53 PM
1/8 nowBardell factor .
Post by: Brazilian Villain on May 24, 2024, 11:03:11 PM
1/8 now
Tim factor.
Post by: brontebilly on May 24, 2024, 11:14:33 PM
Barkley is a player of undoubted talent. We saw it when he played for us, albeit with some dip in form after his injury.
Now, think of every player in our squad, and tell me any that have become worse under Emery, and then consider all of the players who have got better.
Then look at Barkley, who is English, cheap, and hungry to make up for lost time, in a stable team and club environment, where the team ethic thrives, the coaching is top drawer, and genuinely tell me there isn't a very high probability of him doing well for us.
His talent has always been way over stated for one. He was never elite or even approaching elite even as a young player at Everton. Over playing the ball was his speciality with zero workrate off the ball and a very suspect attitude. Found out at Chelsea and the subsequent flops with us and then Nice. Only the favourites for the drop last season were interested in him, that's how far his star had fallen. Credit him for a career turnaround at Luton...but it's from an incredibly low base and a single season.
Ireland and Nzogbia had a handful of decent games for us, their worst performances were on a par with Roscos. "Some dip in form after injury", Barkley's performances and lack of effort were a disgrace for most of his time with us.
Post by: tomd2103 on May 24, 2024, 11:23:34 PM
Fair enough, on his form for Luton, he is an upgrade on Zaniolo, Chambers, and Dendoncker - though so are countless others.
I think he is too great a risk. He did well when first at Everton and then when the main man at Luton - everything went through him.
I can't see him being happy as a back-up option, biding his time for a chance to impress or the odd cameo appearances to save the legs of Luiz or Tielemans and it looks like he can be a disruptive influence.
I have to think there are better options that are lower risk. UTV
He's not really a like-for-like replacement for any of those though. As I see it, in the two formations we normally play, we play with a '6' and an '8' (in modern parlance!). Kamara is the '6' and Luiz the '8'.
We struggled without Kamara's athleticism and physicality in the deeper role and I can't see Barkley being able to do that job. I think we need to sign a similar player to Kamara for that role this season while he is out, as Dendoncker isn't the answer either. Barkley would be competing with Luiz and Tielemans for that '8' spot if he were to come.
I suppose my view of him is somewhat clouded by his first spell at the club. I might not be as sceptical if that hadn't have happened.
Post by: VillaTim on May 24, 2024, 11:36:39 PM
Glad i'm not the only one being drawn in by this questionable "Bedfordshire renaissance" mirage.Barkley is a player of undoubted talent. We saw it when he played for us, albeit with some dip in form after his injury.
Now, think of every player in our squad, and tell me any that have become worse under Emery, and then consider all of the players who have got better.
Then look at Barkley, who is English, cheap, and hungry to make up for lost time, in a stable team and club environment, where the team ethic thrives, the coaching is top drawer, and genuinely tell me there isn't a very high probability of him doing well for us.
His talent has always been way over stated for one. He was never elite or even approaching elite even as a young player at Everton. Over playing the ball was his speciality with zero workrate off the ball and a very suspect attitude. Found out at Chelsea and the subsequent flops with us and then Nice. Only the favourites for the drop last season were interested in him, that's how far his star had fallen. Credit him for a career turnaround at Luton...but it's from an incredibly low base and a single season.
Ireland and Nzogbia had a handful of decent games for us, their worst performances were on a par with Roscos. "Some dip in form after injury", Barkley's performances and lack of effort were a disgrace for most of his time with us.
Post by: Brazilian Villain on May 24, 2024, 11:47:41 PM
Glad i'm not the only one being drawn in by this questionable "Bedfordshire renaissance" mirage.
That's disappointing, you've always struck me as such a renaissance man.
Post by: Anthenagin on May 24, 2024, 11:50:38 PM
Fair enough, on his form for Luton, he is an upgrade on Zaniolo, Chambers, and Dendoncker - though so are countless others.
I think he is too great a risk. He did well when first at Everton and then when the main man at Luton - everything went through him.
I can't see him being happy as a back-up option, biding his time for a chance to impress or the odd cameo appearances to save the legs of Luiz or Tielemans and it looks like he can be a disruptive influence.
I have to think there are better options that are lower risk. UTV
He's not really a like-for-like replacement for any of those though. As I see it, in the two formations we normally play, we play with a '6' and an '8' (in modern parlance!). Kamara is the '6' and Luiz the '8'.
We struggled without Kamara's athleticism and physicality in the deeper role and I can't see Barkley being able to do that job. I think we need to sign a similar player to Kamara for that role this season while he is out, as Dendoncker isn't the answer either. Barkley would be competing with Luiz and Tielemans for that '8' spot if he were to come.
I suppose my view of him is somewhat clouded by his first spell at the club. I might not be as sceptical if that hadn't have happened.
This is exactly what I was saying earlier, Barkley is hopefully a back up 8 for Doug.
Our weakness this season has been lack of quality depth. Understandable considering we’ve come far in a short time.
The key thing is we need back up for Kamara for the deeper role. He’s injury and suspension this season exposed how much we need him. For me it’s the priority cover area.
Post by: LeonW on May 24, 2024, 11:53:20 PM
Glad i'm not the only one being drawn in by this questionable "Bedfordshire renaissance" mirage.Barkley is a player of undoubted talent. We saw it when he played for us, albeit with some dip in form after his injury.
Now, think of every player in our squad, and tell me any that have become worse under Emery, and then consider all of the players who have got better.
Then look at Barkley, who is English, cheap, and hungry to make up for lost time, in a stable team and club environment, where the team ethic thrives, the coaching is top drawer, and genuinely tell me there isn't a very high probability of him doing well for us.
His talent has always been way over stated for one. He was never elite or even approaching elite even as a young player at Everton. Over playing the ball was his speciality with zero workrate off the ball and a very suspect attitude. Found out at Chelsea and the subsequent flops with us and then Nice. Only the favourites for the drop last season were interested in him, that's how far his star had fallen. Credit him for a career turnaround at Luton...but it's from an incredibly low base and a single season.
Ireland and Nzogbia had a handful of decent games for us, their worst performances were on a par with Roscos. "Some dip in form after injury", Barkley's performances and lack of effort were a disgrace for most of his time with us.
I don’t think it’s as black and white as that. Players (like people) can change and we’re not recruiting him to play the same position as under Smith. If we were looking to bring him in as a 10 I would absolutely be against it. But Barkley (a bit like Pogba) has always struck me as someone who has struggled to understand what their position should be. He seems to have found that at Luton which works with his physicality and attributes. And as such, he’s performed well. Performing well in a struggling side should also have the positive viewpoint in that it can be very difficult to do so and suggests something about the person involved.
Post by: VillaTim on May 25, 2024, 12:04:36 AM
All fair enough, perspective needed though, there's a reason why he has ended up at Luton and people need to look wider than his 2 mins Bedfordshire YouTube Highlights reel. Luton were awful, relegated, he played his part all of which gets glossed over on YouTube .Glad i'm not the only one being drawn in by this questionable "Bedfordshire renaissance" mirage.Barkley is a player of undoubted talent. We saw it when he played for us, albeit with some dip in form after his injury.
Now, think of every player in our squad, and tell me any that have become worse under Emery, and then consider all of the players who have got better.
Then look at Barkley, who is English, cheap, and hungry to make up for lost time, in a stable team and club environment, where the team ethic thrives, the coaching is top drawer, and genuinely tell me there isn't a very high probability of him doing well for us.
His talent has always been way over stated for one. He was never elite or even approaching elite even as a young player at Everton. Over playing the ball was his speciality with zero workrate off the ball and a very suspect attitude. Found out at Chelsea and the subsequent flops with us and then Nice. Only the favourites for the drop last season were interested in him, that's how far his star had fallen. Credit him for a career turnaround at Luton...but it's from an incredibly low base and a single season.
Ireland and Nzogbia had a handful of decent games for us, their worst performances were on a par with Roscos. "Some dip in form after injury", Barkley's performances and lack of effort were a disgrace for most of his time with us.
I don’t think it’s as black and white as that. Players (like people) can change and we’re not recruiting him to play the same position as under Smith. If we were looking to bring him in as a 10 I would absolutely be against it. But Barkley (a bit like Pogba) has always struck me as someone who has struggled to understand what their position should be. He seems to have found that at Luton which works with his physicality and attributes. And as such, he’s performed well. Performing well in a struggling side should also have the positive viewpoint in that it can be very difficult to do so and suggests something about the person involved.
Post by: rooboy316 on May 25, 2024, 12:14:25 AM
Post by: LeonW on May 25, 2024, 12:49:49 AM
All fair enough, perspective needed though, there's a reason why he has ended up at Luton and people need to look wider than his 2 mins Bedfordshire YouTube Highlights reel. Luton were awful, relegated, he played his part all of which gets glossed over on YouTube .Glad i'm not the only one being drawn in by this questionable "Bedfordshire renaissance" mirage.Barkley is a player of undoubted talent. We saw it when he played for us, albeit with some dip in form after his injury.
Now, think of every player in our squad, and tell me any that have become worse under Emery, and then consider all of the players who have got better.
Then look at Barkley, who is English, cheap, and hungry to make up for lost time, in a stable team and club environment, where the team ethic thrives, the coaching is top drawer, and genuinely tell me there isn't a very high probability of him doing well for us.
His talent has always been way over stated for one. He was never elite or even approaching elite even as a young player at Everton. Over playing the ball was his speciality with zero workrate off the ball and a very suspect attitude. Found out at Chelsea and the subsequent flops with us and then Nice. Only the favourites for the drop last season were interested in him, that's how far his star had fallen. Credit him for a career turnaround at Luton...but it's from an incredibly low base and a single season.
Ireland and Nzogbia had a handful of decent games for us, their worst performances were on a par with Roscos. "Some dip in form after injury", Barkley's performances and lack of effort were a disgrace for most of his time with us.
I don’t think it’s as black and white as that. Players (like people) can change and we’re not recruiting him to play the same position as under Smith. If we were looking to bring him in as a 10 I would absolutely be against it. But Barkley (a bit like Pogba) has always struck me as someone who has struggled to understand what their position should be. He seems to have found that at Luton which works with his physicality and attributes. And as such, he’s performed well. Performing well in a struggling side should also have the positive viewpoint in that it can be very difficult to do so and suggests something about the person involved.
It’s the risk aggregate though. If he’s relatively cheap in fee and wages, it’s worth the punt because the benefits of it being a success…and I trust those making those decisions. On a personal level, I’m more for watching full games rather than highlights reels which I don’t think tell much.
Post by: olaftab on May 25, 2024, 01:09:36 AM
Whatever is the question, Barkley is not the answer.
Post by: olaftab on May 25, 2024, 01:12:18 AM
Disappointing from you BV when you should know that Tim is a gender neutral person.Glad i'm not the only one being drawn in by this questionable "Bedfordshire renaissance" mirage.
That's disappointing, you've always struck me as such a renaissance man.
Post by: Brazilian Villain on May 25, 2024, 01:23:32 AM
Glad i'm not the only one being drawn in by this questionable "Bedfordshire renaissance" mirage.
That's disappointing, you've always struck me as such a renaissance man.
Disappointing from you BV when you should know that Tim is a gender neutral person.
I recognised that their opinions were certainly fluid, I didn't realise it applied to their gender as well. :(
Post by: purpletrousers on May 25, 2024, 02:16:44 AM
I don’t think it’s as black and white as that. Players (like people) can change and we’re not recruiting him to play the same position as under Smith. If we were looking to bring him in as a 10 I would absolutely be against it. But Barkley (a bit like Pogba) has always struck me as someone who has struggled to understand what their position should be. He seems to have found that at Luton which works with his physicality and attributes. And as such, he’s performed well. Performing well in a struggling side should also have the positive viewpoint in that it can be very difficult to do so and suggests something about the person involved.
This.
The podcast link I just shared in the transfer thread had the Luton guy even musing maybe he’d finally found the position that truly suits his skill set.
I’d be impressed if we can add squad depth (and slight variety) at such good value elsewhere, including Premier League experience that doesn’t need to adapt.
I’ve seen so much pessimism about the guy, it’s pushed me into the optimist camp!
Post by: Goldie.7 on May 25, 2024, 04:46:06 AM
Post by: PhilVill on May 25, 2024, 06:41:07 AM
Post by: Des Little on May 25, 2024, 06:53:40 AM
Post by: Risso on May 25, 2024, 07:30:54 AM
Post by: Allan C on May 25, 2024, 07:41:45 AM
Way too much overthinking going on here. Unai wants him, we’ll have done our due diligence and we are happy with the package we are offering him. I’ll back their judgement all day long.All true, and as a few have mentioned we’re a different Villa now than the one when he was here last. I liked him up to his injury and like several others he definitely wasn’t the same after. Emery will improve him where Smith couldn’t
Post by: Drummond on May 25, 2024, 07:46:41 AM
I'm not sure it's *over* thinking, Des...
🤣
Post by: Chris Smith on May 25, 2024, 07:50:36 AM
All fair enough, perspective needed though, there's a reason why he has ended up at Luton and people need to look wider than his 2 mins Bedfordshire YouTube Highlights reel. Luton were awful, relegated, he played his part all of which gets glossed over on YouTube .Glad i'm not the only one being drawn in by this questionable "Bedfordshire renaissance" mirage.Barkley is a player of undoubted talent. We saw it when he played for us, albeit with some dip in form after his injury.
Now, think of every player in our squad, and tell me any that have become worse under Emery, and then consider all of the players who have got better.
Then look at Barkley, who is English, cheap, and hungry to make up for lost time, in a stable team and club environment, where the team ethic thrives, the coaching is top drawer, and genuinely tell me there isn't a very high probability of him doing well for us.
His talent has always been way over stated for one. He was never elite or even approaching elite even as a young player at Everton. Over playing the ball was his speciality with zero workrate off the ball and a very suspect attitude. Found out at Chelsea and the subsequent flops with us and then Nice. Only the favourites for the drop last season were interested in him, that's how far his star had fallen. Credit him for a career turnaround at Luton...but it's from an incredibly low base and a single season.
Ireland and Nzogbia had a handful of decent games for us, their worst performances were on a par with Roscos. "Some dip in form after injury", Barkley's performances and lack of effort were a disgrace for most of his time with us.
I don’t think it’s as black and white as that. Players (like people) can change and we’re not recruiting him to play the same position as under Smith. If we were looking to bring him in as a 10 I would absolutely be against it. But Barkley (a bit like Pogba) has always struck me as someone who has struggled to understand what their position should be. He seems to have found that at Luton which works with his physicality and attributes. And as such, he’s performed well. Performing well in a struggling side should also have the positive viewpoint in that it can be very difficult to do so and suggests something about the person involved.
If we held relegation against a player we’d never have signed Tielemans.
Post by: Mister E on May 25, 2024, 08:42:17 AM
However, qué Sera Sera.
Post by: Olneythelonely on May 25, 2024, 08:43:53 AM
He shined in the pile of manure that was Luton. He was crap at Villa Park when we played them and reckon will be equally shite this time as he previously.
Whatever is the question, Barkley is not the answer.
But the question is, who does Unai want to sign as competition in the middle of the park? Barkley seems to be the answer to that.
Post by: Monty on May 25, 2024, 08:55:50 AM
He shined in the pile of manure that was Luton. He was crap at Villa Park when we played them and reckon will be equally shite this time as he previously.
Whatever is the question, Barkley is not the answer.
If Luton were so shite, doesn't that make playing well for them harder? I mean, they were playing against the same teams as everyone else...
Post by: chrisw1 on May 25, 2024, 09:04:19 AM
He shined in the pile of manure that was Luton. He was crap at Villa Park when we played them and reckon will be equally shite this time as he previously.What if the question is which relatively cheap versatile midfielder does our generational manager want to add to our really thin squad?
Whatever is the question, Barkley is not the answer.
Post by: pauliewalnuts on May 25, 2024, 09:06:15 AM
But the question is, who does Unai want to sign as competition in the middle of the park
….. for not very much money given the extreme conditions PSR is forcing us to work under.
Surprised how many people are overlooking this.
I think this is a good signing, but a large part of the reason I like it is precisely because it’s one that we can make with barely any PSR impact.
Post by: PaulWinch again on May 25, 2024, 09:12:57 AM
But the question is, who does Unai want to sign as competition in the middle of the park
….. for not very much money given the extreme conditions PSR is forcing us to work under.
Surprised how many people are overlooking this.
I think this is a good signing, but a large part of the reason I like it is precisely because it’s one that we can make with barely any PSR impact.
Yep it’s a very obvious attempt to strike the balance of improving the squad and not hindering PSR further.
Post by: ChicagoLion on May 25, 2024, 09:14:14 AM
I was very critical of him when he was with us because I don’t think he was ever fit.
He has had a lifestyle change and I hope if he does join, he can operate with the same impact he had at Luton.
Perhaps continuing to not take the call from Greasy.
Post by: TonyD on May 25, 2024, 09:55:45 AM
Post by: pauliewalnuts on May 25, 2024, 09:57:41 AM
(https://i.ibb.co/syXvbF5/Screenshot-2024-05-25-at-09-56-39.png)
Post by: Villafirst on May 25, 2024, 10:13:00 AM
Post by: Sexual Ealing on May 25, 2024, 10:35:08 AM
Critics of this transfer are essentially criticising Unai's judgement. I know who I'd trust with this decision. It's virtually a risk free move. I think Ross will thrive under UE's coaching. He was outstanding last season for Luton.
People are allowed to criticise Unai's judgement.
Post by: Malandro on May 25, 2024, 10:41:38 AM
Critics of this transfer are essentially criticising Unai's judgement. I know who I'd trust with this decision. It's virtually a risk free move. I think Ross will thrive under UE's coaching. He was outstanding last season for Luton.
People are allowed to criticise Unai's judgement.
But they will rightly be sent to the ‘unbeliever’ section.
Post by: Ian. on May 25, 2024, 10:56:54 AM
I must admit I was surprised with the plaudits Barkley received last season and especially when his name was mooted for an England call up. I questioned that then on here and quite a few told me he has been playing exceptionally well.
I haven’t seen many of his performances but I certainly do worry about his commitment. His ability was always there. I’m not so sure about this signing myself and I would hope to be proved wrong if he does sign.
Post by: Russ aka Big Nose on May 25, 2024, 11:03:05 AM
I cannot believe Barkley is being considered for that role.
So, if the merits of this potential deal is that he is a relatively cost effective squad filler then, again, I’m not convinced.
I don’t see him knuckling down and staying fit and motivated for 20 minute cameo appearances to save the legs of Dougie or Tielemans or when he is asked to start when a ‘first choice’ is suspended and being rested.
And it is far from risk free. As mentioned previously, potential risks include:
1. A disruptive influence in a seemingly harmonious squad
2. It is a distraction to UE and the coaches as they try to make it work
3. It takes up a PL and CL squad place with a player that doesn’t make much of a contribution
4. It blocks the progress of a younger player (that will have a resale value even if they don’t cement a place in the first team)
5. The opportunity cost of what might have been possible if we, for example, brought in a younger player from a Championship side that is rated as making the step up (like Rogers)
If the deal happens then I hope it works out brilliantly. Though I hope it is no more than speculation and we are working on other deals. UTV
Post by: AV84 on May 25, 2024, 11:23:09 AM
The players that any long term thought seems to have gone into, Moreno, Tielemans, Torres, Diaby, Rogers, have all been much more impressive signings. Even if Tielemans took a while, and Diaby hasn't risen to the levels his fee implied he would.
I wouldn't say he's completely beyond question, but so far, evidence suggests he knows what he's doing
.
Post by: Paul.S on May 25, 2024, 11:24:10 AM
With Ramsey back fit (hopefully) we’d have some choice in midfield. Add a defensive midfielder and with Mings and Buendia back we’d have a very decent squad.
I’m 100% sure Emery has done his homework many times over with Barkley and he’s a step up from what we’ve had sitting on the bench this season. If anyone can get a tune out of him he can, and then some.
Post by: PaulWinch again on May 25, 2024, 11:24:44 AM
Post by: Clampy on May 25, 2024, 11:40:39 AM
Post by: maidstonevillain on May 25, 2024, 11:44:31 AM
In regards to Emery's judgment, of all the players to come in since he's been here, Zaniolo and Lenglet are probably the "worst" signings, but they were both, I think, emergency last minute replacements because of injuries to Buendia and Mings.
The players that any long term thought seems to have gone into, Moreno, Tielemans, Torres, Diaby, Rogers, have all been much more impressive signings. Even if Tielemans took a while, and Diaby hasn't risen to the levels his fee implied he would.
I wouldn't say he's completely beyond question, but so far, evidence suggests he knows what he's doing
.
Yet the spine of the team, and the first names on the team sheet (if not injured) is the team Dean Smith put together (or kept in the case of McGinn).
Martinez
Konza/Mings
Luiz/McGinn
Watkins
Post by: VillaTim on May 25, 2024, 11:48:01 AM
Konsa at RB etcCritics of this transfer are essentially criticising Unai's judgement. I know who I'd trust with this decision. It's virtually a risk free move. I think Ross will thrive under UE's coaching. He was outstanding last season for Luton.
People are allowed to criticise Unai's judgement.
Post by: KRS on May 25, 2024, 11:51:11 AM
And it is far from risk free. As mentioned previously, potential risks include:Just to counter these potential issues:
1. A disruptive influence in a seemingly harmonious squad
2. It is a distraction to UE and the coaches as they try to make it work
3. It takes up a PL and CL squad place with a player that doesn’t make much of a contribution
4. It blocks the progress of a younger player (that will have a resale value even if they don’t cement a place in the first team)
5. The opportunity cost of what might have been possible if we, for example, brought in a younger player from a Championship side that is rated as making the step up (like Rogers)
1. He’s been here before so it would be well documented if he was a disruptive influence. There would also be noises from the Luton camp if that was the case.
2. There is no evidence to suggest that he’d be any more of a distraction than any other player. All players need coaching so I don’t see that as being any kind of distraction.
3. The same applies and can be said of any player not considered to be in the starting XI.
4. As far as I’m aware, we don’t have any younger players with sufficient game experience and ability that are ready and able to make the step up to the first team. It’s more of a case that our younger players aren’t good enough for where we are and need to be.
5. You aren’t getting a younger player of the calibre required for the money we’d be paying for Barkley. You also don’t know if they’d be ready to make that step up where as Barkley is a known PL standard player and has also played on the international stage.
Post by: VillaTim on May 25, 2024, 11:51:30 AM
In regards to Emery's judgment, of all the players to come in since he's been here, Zaniolo and Lenglet are probably the "worst" signings, but they were both, I think, emergency last minute replacements because of injuries to Buendia and Mings.Moreno worries me a bit . He's been poor this season though maybe not fully fit .
The players that any long term thought seems to have gone into, Moreno, Tielemans, Torres, Diaby, Rogers, have all been much more impressive signings. Even if Tielemans took a while, and Diaby hasn't risen to the levels his fee implied he would.
I wouldn't say he's completely beyond question, but so far, evidence suggests he knows what he's doing
.
Post by: Sexual Ealing on May 25, 2024, 12:00:18 PM
Post by: AV84 on May 25, 2024, 12:04:58 PM
In regards to Emery's judgment, of all the players to come in since he's been here, Zaniolo and Lenglet are probably the "worst" signings, but they were both, I think, emergency last minute replacements because of injuries to Buendia and Mings.
The players that any long term thought seems to have gone into, Moreno, Tielemans, Torres, Diaby, Rogers, have all been much more impressive signings. Even if Tielemans took a while, and Diaby hasn't risen to the levels his fee implied he would.
I wouldn't say he's completely beyond question, but so far, evidence suggests he knows what he's doing
.
Yet the spine of the team, and the first names on the team sheet (if not injured) is the team Dean Smith put together (or kept in the case of McGinn).
Martinez
Konza/Mings
Luiz/McGinn
Watkins
It's debatable whether Mings starts over Torres, I think. Both fully fit, it depends on the opposition, formation, tactics etc. Before his injury I think most of us assumed Torres was being brought in to replace Mings in the long term. The amount of game time Lenglet got in the second half of the season implies there's room for both.
Also, your point is kind of irrelevant. Emery inherited a decent team that should have been playing much better than Gerrard had them playing. We all know that. It doesn't change the fact that all of his signings have been good signings. And he hasn't unnecessarily been replacing the good spine that he inherited, just to stamp his authority on the team, which, I think, backs up the point that he's got pretty good judgment when it comes to these things.
Post by: Risso on May 25, 2024, 12:06:11 PM
In regards to Emery's judgment, of all the players to come in since he's been here, Zaniolo and Lenglet are probably the "worst" signings, but they were both, I think, emergency last minute replacements because of injuries to Buendia and Mings.
The players that any long term thought seems to have gone into, Moreno, Tielemans, Torres, Diaby, Rogers, have all been much more impressive signings. Even if Tielemans took a while, and Diaby hasn't risen to the levels his fee implied he would.
I wouldn't say he's completely beyond question, but so far, evidence suggests he knows what he's doing
.
Yet the spine of the team, and the first names on the team sheet (if not injured) is the team Dean Smith put together (or kept in the case of McGinn).
Martinez
Konza/Mings
Luiz/McGinn
Watkins
Kamara?
Post by: purpletrousers on May 25, 2024, 12:10:18 PM
Post by: Risso on May 25, 2024, 12:13:36 PM
Post by: Rudy Can't Fail on May 25, 2024, 12:13:45 PM
With Ramsey and Buendia returning from injury our priority for midfield has to be a DCM to start every game for the first few months at the start of the season and then provide cover and competition for Kamara.
I cannot believe Barkley is being considered for that role.
I agree, I also don't believe he is being considered for that role. All the evidence points to a Luiz/McGinn type role, something those boys haven't had the luxury of an alternative player last season. Both have played far too much football, McGinn has a few days off before joining up with Scotland for the Euros. Without an alternative he'll be dead on his feet by the end of September.
Luiz by his own standards had a at best decent second half to the season and his performance levels dropped before Kamara got injured. He played 7 massive PL games in December, my guess is after he was completely knackered. Imagine throwing in Barkley in a couple of those games (eg: Brentford, Sheff Utd and Burnley) or bringing him off the bench and we may have seen a different Luiz in 2024.
Post by: Percy McCarthy on May 25, 2024, 12:32:31 PM
In regards to Emery's judgment, of all the players to come in since he's been here, Zaniolo and Lenglet are probably the "worst" signings, but they were both, I think, emergency last minute replacements because of injuries to Buendia and Mings.
The players that any long term thought seems to have gone into, Moreno, Tielemans, Torres, Diaby, Rogers, have all been much more impressive signings. Even if Tielemans took a while, and Diaby hasn't risen to the levels his fee implied he would.
I wouldn't say he's completely beyond question, but so far, evidence suggests he knows what he's doing
.
Yet the spine of the team, and the first names on the team sheet (if not injured) is the team Dean Smith put together (or kept in the case of McGinn).
Martinez
Konza/Mings
Luiz/McGinn
Watkins
This is further evidence that he knows a good player when he sees one isn’t it?
Post by: Ads on May 25, 2024, 12:35:59 PM
Post by: WarszaVillan on May 25, 2024, 12:39:30 PM
In regards to Emery's judgment, of all the players to come in since he's been here, Zaniolo and Lenglet are probably the "worst" signings, but they were both, I think, emergency last minute replacements because of injuries to Buendia and Mings.
The players that any long term thought seems to have gone into, Moreno, Tielemans, Torres, Diaby, Rogers, have all been much more impressive signings. Even if Tielemans took a while, and Diaby hasn't risen to the levels his fee implied he would.
I wouldn't say he's completely beyond question, but so far, evidence suggests he knows what he's doing
.
Yet the spine of the team, and the first names on the team sheet (if not injured) is the team Dean Smith put together (or kept in the case of McGinn).
Martinez
Konza/Mings
Luiz/McGinn
Watkins
Kamara?
Signed by Gerrard. By far the best thing he did.
Post by: paul_e on May 25, 2024, 12:43:02 PM
Post by: Drummond on May 25, 2024, 12:48:09 PM
Post by: Rudy Can't Fail on May 25, 2024, 12:51:38 PM
I've always thought Barkley was overrated even at his best and bar 2-3 games he was really poor for us. That said last year was probably the best football he's ever played mostly because he actually seemed to add some work ethic to go with the little flashes of talent. The big question mark for me is whether he'll still have that if he's on the bench for 5-6 games in a row.
It's a good point though it's not next season that worries me, he'll get plenty of games, minutes, it's the season after and if he's still here, the season after that. Ideally it would be a loan deal but hopefully we can use him well next season and sell him on for a small profit this time next year when money won't be so tight.
Post by: AV84 on May 25, 2024, 01:03:45 PM
I've always thought Barkley was overrated even at his best and bar 2-3 games he was really poor for us. That said last year was probably the best football he's ever played mostly because he actually seemed to add some work ethic to go with the little flashes of talent. The big question mark for me is whether he'll still have that if he's on the bench for 5-6 games in a row.
He's said himself at some point that he wants to play in Europe again and hasn't given up on playing for England again(?) too. If he's got any sense, or sensible people advising him, he'd have to know that being a squad player at Villa next season is the best route for him to achieve that.
The 3 other CL teams aren't going to be interested in him. Don't think he's going to go back to Chelsea, so that leaves us and Spurs. I don't know if they have any interest in him, but it's clear as day who the better manager is, and Emery has shown that he will rotate players when he has them available to him. So being a squad player means you actually will get game time and a chance to stake your claim on a starting spot. (We all would have dropped Dougie towards the end of the season if we'd had someone else available)
Basically, I'd assume he'd know what he's signing up for if he was to come to us, so to be stropping in October because he hasn't started a game yet would be silly. (Although obviously not impossible). If he wants to be a guaranteed starter somewhere then he needs to lower his sights from European and International football.
Also, by the looks of the squad towards the end of the season, there seems to be a mostly really good atmosphere and even the injured players who didn't play at all feel a part of it all, so maybe it's just a really good environment to be in, which can in itself work wonders for players.
Post by: Somniloquism on May 25, 2024, 01:04:50 PM
Post by: Chris Smith on May 25, 2024, 01:17:41 PM
Post by: Russ aka Big Nose on May 25, 2024, 01:21:19 PM
To be honest Russ I think you’re pretty much articulating the worst case scenario, which I think is pretty unlikely. On the flipside, he’s a player with plenty of quality who has shown the ability (and maturity) to knuckle down and perform consistently. He definitely improves the depth in our squad (and adds some much needed height). He’s also cheap.If the deal happens, I hope you are right.
I just see the potential risks outweighing the potential rewards with a player that is now 30 and that has had one 'good' or 'decent' season (depending on your take of his time at Luton) in the last six years.
It feels like the kind of deal that we used to look at where there was more hope than expectation that it would work out.
Finding cover and competition for Kamara is arguably our most important transfer objective. If we are restricted by FFP, then I would - very reluctantly - rather we sell a real asset where we are well served or the deal makes financial sense, than 'hope' that giving a 3-year deal to Ross Barkley will work. UTV.
Post by: dorsetvillian on May 25, 2024, 01:23:07 PM
Post by: PeterWithesShin on May 25, 2024, 01:27:41 PM
If Uni wants Ross Barkley that's good enough for me..
What's he studying?
Post by: kippaxvilla2 on May 25, 2024, 01:28:54 PM
Post by: Russ aka Big Nose on May 25, 2024, 01:33:22 PM
Maybe. I see his mindset and outlook being key - probably more so than with other players.And it is far from risk free. As mentioned previously, potential risks include:Just to counter these potential issues:
1. A disruptive influence in a seemingly harmonious squad
2. It is a distraction to UE and the coaches as they try to make it work
3. It takes up a PL and CL squad place with a player that doesn’t make much of a contribution
4. It blocks the progress of a younger player (that will have a resale value even if they don’t cement a place in the first team)
5. The opportunity cost of what might have been possible if we, for example, brought in a younger player from a Championship side that is rated as making the step up (like Rogers)
1. He’s been here before so it would be well documented if he was a disruptive influence. There would also be noises from the Luton camp if that was the case.
2. There is no evidence to suggest that he’d be any more of a distraction than any other player. All players need coaching so I don’t see that as being any kind of distraction.
3. The same applies and can be said of any player not considered to be in the starting XI.
4. As far as I’m aware, we don’t have any younger players with sufficient game experience and ability that are ready and able to make the step up to the first team. It’s more of a case that our younger players aren’t good enough for where we are and need to be.
5. You aren’t getting a younger player of the calibre required for the money we’d be paying for Barkley. You also don’t know if they’d be ready to make that step up where as Barkley is a known PL standard player and has also played on the international stage.
Last season at Luton he was the main man, winning plaudits, and it looked like a challenge he embraced.
If he were to get a better and longer deal at Villa, does he work hard, fight for his place and really make a difference OR does he settle for taking very good money, given where his career was, and coast at our expense for a few years?
I'm not a betting man, though my quid is on the latter rather than the former and as I said, I hope we have moved past the kind of details that are predicated more on hope than expectation.
I know all deals have a degree of uncertainty, so don't (anyone) point that out to me unless it is really important to you. ;)
Post by: edgysatsuma89 on May 25, 2024, 01:50:24 PM
Post by: Des Little on May 25, 2024, 02:02:57 PM
Post by: Monty on May 25, 2024, 02:07:59 PM
I completely trust Unai, but you would hardly be able to debate anything on here if everyone just said that. However much the naysayers may annoy you on here, you'd miss them if it was one big circle jerk.
Obviously this is true. It's more that some people criticise Emery as if he were just some other goober we'd got in, like he didn't have all the credit in the bank that he does.
And of course others are only happy when they're moaning. Which is a strange way to live your life, but each to their own.
Post by: chrisw1 on May 25, 2024, 02:28:44 PM
To be honest, if Emery wanted to sign Fred West I’d back him.Hmm, I’d bury that idea
Post by: dave.woodhall on May 25, 2024, 02:38:47 PM
Post by: PeterWithesShin on May 25, 2024, 02:43:11 PM
On the flipside, when we signed Micah there were people on here saying it was a smart and low risk deal that we couldn't really lose on. So I can understand some caution.
Post by: Villa in Denmark on May 25, 2024, 02:43:57 PM
Unless he's the only signing of the summer and half the midfield are off it's not like he's going to be asked to play as much as the two aforementioned have this season.
Post by: Mister E on May 25, 2024, 02:52:23 PM
Finding cover and competition for Kamara is arguably our most important transfer objective. If we are restricted by FFP, then I would - very reluctantly - rather we sell a real asset where we are well served or the deal makes financial sense, than 'hope' that giving a 3-year deal to Ross Barkley will work. UTV.I don't think anyone here or on Unai's staff is expecting Barkley to play Kamara's role in next season's team.
Post by: pauliewalnuts on May 25, 2024, 04:03:37 PM
If Uni wants Ross Barkley that's good enough for me..
So long as he’s revised enough and gets the A levels he needs.
Post by: olaftab on May 25, 2024, 04:15:47 PM
If he was our big signing of the summer I'd be concerned. If he's a cheap squadfiller I don't see the harm.Or an unnecessary liability on the wage bill.
Post by: PaulWinch again on May 25, 2024, 04:18:27 PM
Post by: olaftab on May 25, 2024, 04:32:59 PM
He’s entirely necessary- see our midfield depth at the end of last season.It doesn't work like that though does it? We need players of equal superb ability so that we can interchange game by game not just have someone who is likely to only sit on the bench and be very rusty when required.
Post by: PeterWithesShin on May 25, 2024, 04:34:38 PM
Post by: chrisw1 on May 25, 2024, 04:42:19 PM
I’d say he’s pretty interchangeable with Tielemans and Luiz. He’ll also give us options to support Rogers and Ramsey if needed. He’ll have a good environment around him a hopefully he’ll thrive.He’s entirely necessary- see our midfield depth at the end of last season.It doesn't work like that though does it? We need players of equal superb ability so that we can interchange game by game not just have someone who is likely to only sit on the bench and be very rusty when required.
Of course there’s a scenario where it doesn’t work out and he becames a bit of a drain, but right now I’m quite hopeful.
Post by: VillaTim on May 25, 2024, 05:18:04 PM
Post by: PeterWithesShin on May 25, 2024, 05:20:29 PM
Each day he doesn't sign suggests more and more to me there's nothing in this .
The fact the transfer window isn't open might play a part.
Post by: enigma on May 25, 2024, 05:43:48 PM
He’s entirely necessary- see our midfield depth at the end of last season.We need more bodies in the squad but why is it entirely necessary that it's him?
Post by: VillaTim on May 25, 2024, 05:49:15 PM
Thought Free's could move before .Each day he doesn't sign suggests more and more to me there's nothing in this .
The fact the transfer window isn't open might play a part.
Post by: pauliewalnuts on May 25, 2024, 05:50:43 PM
Thought Free's could move before .Each day he doesn't sign suggests more and more to me there's nothing in this .
The fact the transfer window isn't open might play a part.
He's not a free, there's a (small) fee involved, contract runs into next season.
Post by: Rigadon on May 25, 2024, 05:53:47 PM
Each day he doesn't sign suggests more and more to me there's nothing in this .
The fact the transfer window isn't open might play a part.
Oh, here he is with his ‘facts’.
Post by: PaulWinch again on May 25, 2024, 05:54:59 PM
Each day he doesn't sign suggests more and more to me there's nothing in this .
I visualise you, in a “I 8 Diaby” Villa Shirt, rocking back and forth each time you make posts akin to this.
Post by: VillaTim on May 25, 2024, 06:01:45 PM
Ok my bad, i thought he was a free agent.Thought Free's could move before .Each day he doesn't sign suggests more and more to me there's nothing in this .
The fact the transfer window isn't open might play a part.
He's not a free, there's a (small) fee involved, contract runs into next season.
Post by: RamboandBruno on May 25, 2024, 06:18:58 PM
Because the manager wants himHe’s entirely necessary- see our midfield depth at the end of last season.We need more bodies in the squad but why is it entirely necessary that it's him?
Post by: PaulWinch again on May 25, 2024, 06:20:42 PM
Post by: eye digress on May 25, 2024, 06:21:08 PM
Post by: Tokyo Sexwhale on May 25, 2024, 06:26:07 PM
He's a high-skilled player coming in as cover/depth/rotation. If somehow he does play himself into the starting XI, it's because he will have earned it.
We've already seen what happens when we get an injury or a suspension to one of Luiz, Tielemans or McGinn - we turn to shit. If two of them are out at the same time, or they're running on fumes next May, then we'll be screwed just like this season.
If we want to compete on multiple fronts, with FFP constraints, then adding players with definite physical and technical qualities like Barkley is a good risk to take.
Post by: enigma on May 25, 2024, 06:48:09 PM
Yeah, great answerBecause the manager wants himHe’s entirely necessary- see our midfield depth at the end of last season.We need more bodies in the squad but why is it entirely necessary that it's him?
Post by: eamonn on May 25, 2024, 06:53:38 PM
Post by: pauliewalnuts on May 25, 2024, 07:15:33 PM
Yeah, great answerBecause the manager wants himHe’s entirely necessary- see our midfield depth at the end of last season.We need more bodies in the squad but why is it entirely necessary that it's him?
He's right though, isn't he? Ultimately that's what it boils down to.
Monchi isn't just here to spend 50m on top players, he's here to manage our growth as a squad, which is going to mean adding players of all profiles, and all price points. He and Emery and Vidagamy have to manage a budget which is hugely hamstrung by PSR.
They've obviously decided he's the man, which is fair enough. They've done nothing thus far to suggest they're not to be trusted - far from it - and Barkley is obviously the one they want.
That's why it's necessarily him. Otherwise you go to the triumvirate and say no, you can't have him. Which is clearly never going to happen.
Post by: VillaTim on May 25, 2024, 08:43:45 PM
Maybe he does, maybe he doesn't, i've not heard a thing from Emery on this .Because the manager wants himHe’s entirely necessary- see our midfield depth at the end of last season.We need more bodies in the squad but why is it entirely necessary that it's him?
Post by: Villa in Denmark on May 25, 2024, 08:43:47 PM
And presumably tell them to find someone else for the same fee or less.Yeah, great answerBecause the manager wants himHe’s entirely necessary- see our midfield depth at the end of last season.We need more bodies in the squad but why is it entirely necessary that it's him?
He's right though, isn't he? Ultimately that's what it boils down to.
Monchi isn't just here to spend 50m on top players, he's here to manage our growth as a squad, which is going to mean adding players of all profiles, and all price points. He and Emery and Vidagamy have to manage a budget which is hugely hamstrung by PSR.
They've obviously decided he's the man, which is fair enough. They've done nothing thus far to suggest they're not to be trusted - far from it - and Barkley is obviously the one they want.
That's why it's necessarily him. Otherwise you go to the triumvirate and say no, you can't have him. Which is clearly never going to happen.
Post by: ldavfc4eva on May 25, 2024, 09:35:15 PM
Had a good season last year and as others have said, he has been an excellent player more than not, with a couple of dodgy seasons.
Worth a punt if Unai fancies him
Post by: Olneythelonely on May 25, 2024, 09:37:34 PM
Maybe he does, maybe he doesn't, i've not heard a thing from Emery on this .Because the manager wants himHe’s entirely necessary- see our midfield depth at the end of last season.We need more bodies in the squad but why is it entirely necessary that it's him?
I have. He text me.
Post by: AV84 on May 25, 2024, 11:32:46 PM
Maybe he does, maybe he doesn't, i've not heard a thing from Emery on this .Because the manager wants himHe’s entirely necessary- see our midfield depth at the end of last season.We need more bodies in the squad but why is it entirely necessary that it's him?
Fabrizio said Emery wants him.
Post by: tomd2103 on May 25, 2024, 11:38:38 PM
Had a good season last year and as others have said, he has been an excellent player more than not, with a couple of dodgy seasons.
Sorry, but that bit about being more excellent than not and only having a couple of dodgy seasons isn't right is it?
Post by: Mister E on May 26, 2024, 07:57:58 AM
Definitely not.Had a good season last year and as others have said, he has been an excellent player more than not, with a couple of dodgy seasons.Sorry, but that bit about being more excellent than not and only having a couple of dodgy seasons isn't right is it?
Post by: Randy Gurner on May 26, 2024, 10:12:07 AM
Post by: KevinGage on May 26, 2024, 10:18:42 AM
I can't see Barkley doing that.
Post by: pauliewalnuts on May 26, 2024, 10:21:03 AM
Maybe he does, maybe he doesn't, i've not heard a thing from Emery on this .Because the manager wants himHe’s entirely necessary- see our midfield depth at the end of last season.We need more bodies in the squad but why is it entirely necessary that it's him?
You reckon Emery doesn’t want him but Monchi is forcing him on him?
Jesus, Tim. That’s a whopper.
Post by: Ian. on May 26, 2024, 10:22:38 AM
I wonder if Emery see's Barkley as the Kamara replacement for a few months. It's not like Kamara is your typical bulldozer DMC.
That’s a good point. Kamara isn’t that sort of DMC for us and Barkley has got the technical ability to be that link from deep. Whether he’s got the discipline to hold that position is another matter. It may actually really suit him at this point in his career?
Post by: VillaTim on May 26, 2024, 11:50:00 AM
Happy for him to come in. Just never again want to see his red, sweaty pissed-off face when he's subbed and sulks back to the bench. Fucking child.What was the game when he got subbed off quite early, went off the pitch the other side to the dugouts took his boots off then sulked as he walked all round the pitch even taking time to sit on the advertising hoardings and sulk some more . Childish antics.
Post by: JUAN PABLO on May 26, 2024, 12:02:58 PM
If Unai wants him , replaces Iroegbunam maybe , get Donks massive wages off and wouldnt be on half of them , I can see the signing.
Post by: VillaTim on May 26, 2024, 12:07:43 PM
Could be worse could be Grant Holt.Agree on this. It's the unknown element .
If Unai wants him , replaces Iroegbunam maybe , get Donks massive wages off and wouldnt be on half of them , I can see the signing.
Post by: Flamingo Lane on May 26, 2024, 12:41:36 PM
Post by: ChicagoLion on May 26, 2024, 12:48:03 PM
You'd think that there would be several senior players at the club who would be able to offer their views, as regards Barkley's abilities and aptitude to be part of a squad etc, and whose opinions would carry some weight. Or maybe I'm being naive as to how these things work.I would have thought that’s exactly how it would work.
Post by: kippaxvilla2 on May 26, 2024, 01:54:57 PM
Post by: Keeno on May 26, 2024, 02:28:59 PM
Two year deal with a one year extension. No fee as he was allowed to leave if Luton got relegated. Sound business.
Low risk, incentives to perform.
Good signing this.
Post by: Brazilian Villain on May 26, 2024, 02:47:42 PM
Could be worse could be Grant Holt.
If Unai wants him , replaces Iroegbunam maybe , get Donks massive wages off and wouldnt be on half of them , I can see the signing.
Agree on this. It's the unknown element .
Thought that was Moscovium (115 Mc).
Post by: Ads on May 26, 2024, 03:17:23 PM
Post by: PaulWinch again on May 26, 2024, 03:18:10 PM
Two year deal with a one year extension. No fee as he was allowed to leave if Luton got relegated. Sound business.
Where’s this from?
Post by: Steve67 on May 26, 2024, 03:34:53 PM
Two year deal with a one year extension. No fee as he was allowed to leave if Luton got relegated. Sound business.
Where’s this from?
The dirge that is Football Insider.
Post by: kippaxvilla2 on May 26, 2024, 03:44:11 PM
Post by: not3bad on May 27, 2024, 11:37:11 AM
He's a big lad too at 6'1", might make defending set pieces a bit easier.
Handy for the attacking ones too.
Post by: Toronto Villa on June 03, 2024, 03:10:23 PM
https://x.com/FabrizioRomano/status/1797611208218173711
Post by: kippaxvilla2 on June 03, 2024, 03:39:10 PM
Post by: Bad English on June 03, 2024, 03:40:50 PM
Post by: VILLA MOLE on June 03, 2024, 03:45:00 PM
On Pravda stretching a shirt or not happening.
a new shirt also please 😃
Post by: JUAN PABLO on June 03, 2024, 03:50:39 PM
£5m tish.
More than I thought
Gone from free to 2 million to 5 million now ..
Post by: PaulWinch again on June 03, 2024, 03:52:19 PM
Post by: VillaTim on June 03, 2024, 03:59:28 PM
A 3 year deal for this player won't end well.
Post by: Toronto Villa on June 03, 2024, 04:00:54 PM
Pray he's on a short deal (1 year) or some sort of pay as you go deal.
A 3 year deal for this player won't end well.
oh do stop
Post by: Percy McCarthy on June 03, 2024, 04:00:55 PM
Post by: Percy McCarthy on June 03, 2024, 04:02:03 PM
Pray he's on a short deal (1 year) or some sort of pay as you go deal.
A 3 year deal for this player won't end well.
Excellent. Tim thinks he’s going to be crap. That’s an almost copper-bottomed guarantee that he won’t be.
Post by: Louzie0 on June 03, 2024, 04:05:53 PM
Post by: Olneythelonely on June 03, 2024, 04:17:18 PM
Pray he's on a short deal (1 year) or some sort of pay as you go deal.
A 3 year deal for this player won't end well.
Excellent. Tim thinks he’s going to be crap. That’s an almost copper-bottomed guarantee that he won’t be.
*cooper-bottomed
Post by: chrisw1 on June 03, 2024, 04:22:16 PM
Could go either way, but I lean towards him being a very useful signing.
Post by: AV84 on June 03, 2024, 04:22:31 PM
Post by: Olneythelonely on June 03, 2024, 04:24:48 PM
Why is the players agreement expected in July? Is it just because he's on holidays?
His current contract runs out then?
I think Luton have the option to extend but we’re paying them not to.
Post by: AV84 on June 03, 2024, 04:27:00 PM
Why is the players agreement expected in July? Is it just because he's on holidays?
His current contract runs out then?
I think Luton have the option to extend but we’re paying them not to.
Oh, so officially he can't sign until then but everything is actually agreed before that. So no shirt stretching for at least 4 weeks then.
Post by: Olneythelonely on June 03, 2024, 04:28:03 PM
Why is the players agreement expected in July? Is it just because he's on holidays?
His current contract runs out then?
I think Luton have the option to extend but we’re paying them not to.
Oh, so officially he can't sign until then but everything is actually agreed before that. So no shirt stretching for at least 4 weeks then.
I think so. Read it somewhere. Might even have been on here.
Post by: eamonn on June 03, 2024, 04:43:08 PM
If it’s in the region £5m it’s still a very nominal fee in the context of the premier league.
Luton held an option to renew his deal. In that context I think £5m is very generous.
Post by: eamonn on June 03, 2024, 04:44:21 PM
A Luton podcaster I listened to on one of the Villa pods said £5-7m a couple of weeks ago.
Well, they would. "Yeah we've got relegated but you're paying for a chunk of our new stadium".
Post by: eamonn on June 03, 2024, 04:58:49 PM
My Luton supporter friend says we are getting an absolute gem, so that’s nice to hear!
He was the main dawg there and loved accordingly. He won't be, here so it'll be interesting to see his attitude when he doesn't start/is subbed cos last time it stunk.
Post by: Risso on June 03, 2024, 05:02:12 PM
My Luton supporter friend says we are getting an absolute gem, so that’s nice to hear!
He was the main dawg there and loved accordingly. He won't be, here so it'll be interesting to see his attitude when he doesn't start/is subbed cos last time it stunk.
You'd have to assume he'd at least talk to Emery before signing to get an idea of what Unai has in store for him! Which I'm sure won't be "you'll be starting every game Ross, and if I have to fuck off McGinn to do it, so be it."
Post by: AV84 on June 03, 2024, 05:03:04 PM
My Luton supporter friend says we are getting an absolute gem, so that’s nice to hear!
He was the main dawg there and loved accordingly. He won't be, here so it'll be interesting to see his attitude when he doesn't start/is subbed cos last time it stunk.
That interview he did recently makes it sound like he spent the season in France getting his head clear and saw Luton as an opportunity to get his career back on track, and he's taken that opportunity. If he really does have his head on straight there's no reason to think he doesn't know what he's signing up for with us now. He's 30 now, so it's his last chance to establish any kind of high level career for himself.
Post by: Pete3206 on June 03, 2024, 05:04:31 PM
Post by: Sexual Ealing on June 03, 2024, 05:14:34 PM
Post by: Louzie0 on June 03, 2024, 05:17:01 PM
This is a very interesting summer and I’m looking forward to our next signing.
Post by: Brazilian Villain on June 03, 2024, 05:38:30 PM
Pray he's on a short deal (1 year) or some sort of pay as you go deal.
A 3 year deal for this player won't end well.
Excellent. Tim thinks he’s going to be crap. That’s an almost copper-bottomed guarantee that he won’t be.
*cooper-bottomed
*Because he's a barrel of laughs?
Post by: Smithy on June 03, 2024, 07:41:34 PM
I know they're different characters, but it has the feeling of a Paul Merson situation. That worked out pretty well, and if Barkley doesn't, it's not a lot of money.
His wages will be quite big, I'd imagine? That said, I'm firmly in the "if anyone can get a tune out of him, Unai can" camp.
Post by: VillaTim on June 03, 2024, 07:45:10 PM
If Unai can squeeze 8/9 out of 10 performances out of him then it will be a good move. Back up for Luiz / McGinn ?I know they're different characters, but it has the feeling of a Paul Merson situation. That worked out pretty well, and if Barkley doesn't, it's not a lot of money.
His wages will be quite big, I'd imagine? That said, I'm firmly in the "if anyone can get a tune out of him, Unai can" camp.
Post by: Dave on June 03, 2024, 07:45:20 PM
I know they're different characters, but it has the feeling of a Paul Merson situation. That worked out pretty well, and if Barkley doesn't, it's not a lot of money.
His wages will be quite big, I'd imagine? That said, I'm firmly in the "if anyone can get a tune out of him, Unai can" camp.
Nice were only paying him £25k per week, and I'd be surprised if Luton were paying him much more than that.
Post by: VillaTim on June 03, 2024, 08:21:34 PM
Blimey. We should set up a JustGiving website for the poor bloke .I know they're different characters, but it has the feeling of a Paul Merson situation. That worked out pretty well, and if Barkley doesn't, it's not a lot of money.
His wages will be quite big, I'd imagine? That said, I'm firmly in the "if anyone can get a tune out of him, Unai can" camp.
Nice were only paying him £25k per week, and I'd be surprised if Luton were paying him much more than that.
Post by: Drummond on June 03, 2024, 08:27:53 PM
If Unai can squeeze 8/9 out of 10 performances out of him then it will be a good move. Back up for Luiz / McGinn ?I know they're different characters, but it has the feeling of a Paul Merson situation. That worked out pretty well, and if Barkley doesn't, it's not a lot of money.
His wages will be quite big, I'd imagine? That said, I'm firmly in the "if anyone can get a tune out of him, Unai can" camp.
No, because someone, can't remember who, said it's not happening.
Post by: PaulWinch again on June 03, 2024, 08:32:17 PM
Blimey. We should set up a JustGiving website for the poor bloke .I know they're different characters, but it has the feeling of a Paul Merson situation. That worked out pretty well, and if Barkley doesn't, it's not a lot of money.
His wages will be quite big, I'd imagine? That said, I'm firmly in the "if anyone can get a tune out of him, Unai can" camp.
Nice were only paying him £25k per week, and I'd be surprised if Luton were paying him much more than that.
As you’re well aware, the point is that is very low for a PL player in a first team squad.
Post by: Toronto Villa on June 03, 2024, 08:33:45 PM
Blimey. We should set up a JustGiving website for the poor bloke .I know they're different characters, but it has the feeling of a Paul Merson situation. That worked out pretty well, and if Barkley doesn't, it's not a lot of money.
His wages will be quite big, I'd imagine? That said, I'm firmly in the "if anyone can get a tune out of him, Unai can" camp.
Nice were only paying him £25k per week, and I'd be surprised if Luton were paying him much more than that.
As you’re well aware, the point is that is very low for a PL player in a first team squad.
don't. It's pointless.
Post by: Smithy on June 03, 2024, 08:51:06 PM
I know they're different characters, but it has the feeling of a Paul Merson situation. That worked out pretty well, and if Barkley doesn't, it's not a lot of money.
His wages will be quite big, I'd imagine? That said, I'm firmly in the "if anyone can get a tune out of him, Unai can" camp.
Nice were only paying him £25k per week, and I'd be surprised if Luton were paying him much more than that.
I suspect because he was something of a risk at the time, but having proven he can perform at premier league level, I suspect any contract we give him will be for a lot more. Not 'top earner at the club' level, but I'd be very surprised if it was much less than £75-100k.
Post by: Russ aka Big Nose on June 03, 2024, 08:51:18 PM
Not if that is it over 2 seasons ... with 3 times that number of 3 or 4 out of 10 performances.If Unai can squeeze 8/9 out of 10 performances out of him then it will be a good move. Back up for Luiz / McGinn ?I know they're different characters, but it has the feeling of a Paul Merson situation. That worked out pretty well, and if Barkley doesn't, it's not a lot of money.His wages will be quite big, I'd imagine? That said, I'm firmly in the "if anyone can get a tune out of him, Unai can" camp.
Post by: brontebilly on June 03, 2024, 08:52:08 PM
My Luton supporter friend says we are getting an absolute gem, so that’s nice to hear!
He was the main dawg there and loved accordingly. He won't be, here so it'll be interesting to see his attitude when he doesn't start/is subbed cos last time it stunk.
Very interesting, I think Barkley would have been best returning to Everton or some other club where he would have started most weeks. Competing with likes of Luiz, McGinn, Tielemans and Ramsey...don't see him being a regular and it wasn't a position we need to strengthen in any case.
I'm 💯 against this signing, was totally against him the first time and he was a 12m disaster, smaller fee this time but spots and leopards come to mind. In saying all that, all the best Rosco!
Post by: Dante Lavelli on June 03, 2024, 09:36:24 PM
It’s a massive shame but balances the books, keeps the nucleus of last year’s team together and the DCM strengthens the squad.
Post by: VillaTim on June 03, 2024, 09:37:49 PM
Yup that's the red flag.Not if that is it over 2 seasons ... with 3 times that number of 3 or 4 out of 10 performances.If Unai can squeeze 8/9 out of 10 performances out of him then it will be a good move. Back up for Luiz / McGinn ?I know they're different characters, but it has the feeling of a Paul Merson situation. That worked out pretty well, and if Barkley doesn't, it's not a lot of money.His wages will be quite big, I'd imagine? That said, I'm firmly in the "if anyone can get a tune out of him, Unai can" camp.
A leopard doesn't change its spots . As you were.
Post by: Dave on June 03, 2024, 09:38:05 PM
Post by: Dante Lavelli on June 03, 2024, 09:40:28 PM
Who is buying an injured Ramsey for £40m?
Liverpool were linked at £50m a week or so back.
Post by: brontebilly on June 03, 2024, 09:41:35 PM
Who is buying an injured Ramsey for £40m?
It's a fair old punt. Ferguson bought RvN after an ACL didn't he? Ramsey is a quality player but he has missed a full season. If we have to sell it will be one of Watkins or Luiz surely.
Post by: VillaTim on June 03, 2024, 09:48:16 PM
Post by: Dante Lavelli on June 03, 2024, 10:09:19 PM
So £40m is market driven figure rather than a reflection on Ramsey’s worth.
Post by: Beard82 on June 03, 2024, 10:13:15 PM
If we were to cash in on core player, it must be luiz. He's got to be worth 60m+, has had a good season which only increases the value. And I think he is more replaceable. Ramsey would be selling him on the "cheap" due to the risk factor of him having a reoccurring injury.Who is buying an injured Ramsey for £40m?
It's a fair old punt. Ferguson bought RvN after an ACL didn't he? Ramsey is a quality player but he has missed a full season. If we have to sell it will be one of Watkins or Luiz surely.
Watkins and Emi are too difficult to replace. Other players like Carlos, Cash and Digne could also be sold but I wouldn't say they were key. (as good as they have been, particularly Digne last season).
Post by: ChicagoLion on June 03, 2024, 10:24:28 PM
Ramsey is worth a lot more than £40mYes but a crocked Ramsey?
1. Doubtfull any one is buying until his fitness is proven.
2. We would get a lot more money for a fit and able Ramsey.
Post by: Des Little on June 03, 2024, 10:29:00 PM
Pray he's on a short deal (1 year) or some sort of pay as you go deal.
A 3 year deal for this player won't end well.
Lighten up Tim, it may even work out well? Come on man
Post by: Somniloquism on June 03, 2024, 10:39:23 PM
Ramsey is worth a lot more than £40mYes but a crocked Ramsey?
1. Doubtfull any one is buying until his fitness is proven.
2. We would get a lot more money for a fit and able Ramsey.
Most medics would be able to tell if a foot bone is fully healed or not now he has been given 3 months to heal rather then 6 weeks.
Post by: Percy McCarthy on June 03, 2024, 10:57:54 PM
I still suspect we will sell Ramsey for £40m and use the money to buy a genuine DCM.
It’s a massive shame but balances the books, keeps the nucleus of last year’s team together and the DCM strengthens the squad.
I’m pretty sure we can afford a good DCM without having to sell anybody we don’t want to.
Post by: robleflaneur on June 03, 2024, 11:14:35 PM
He will be playing in front of a full VP instead of a pandemic empty one.He will be playing in s team geared to possession with other ball playing midfielders and coached by Unai.Any talented player would relish that and Champions League as an added bonus.
Post by: pauliewalnuts on June 03, 2024, 11:15:53 PM
Post by: Percy McCarthy on June 03, 2024, 11:26:49 PM
Trying to sell JJ while he's got a broken foot would be nuts.
Especially when that negative ninny Kieran Maguire is saying we’re fine FFP-wise.
Post by: eamonn on June 03, 2024, 11:54:46 PM
Post by: Somniloquism on June 04, 2024, 08:56:45 AM
Trying to sell JJ while he's got a broken foot would be nuts.
I'm not saying we should. Just stating a broken foot is not an ACL injury and as long as they have allowed it to fully heal (and a medical should be able to show that), it shouldn't be a case of seeing if the player is affected.
Post by: stevo_st on June 04, 2024, 09:27:54 AM
Post by: robleflaneur on June 04, 2024, 09:48:48 AM
Xavi passed comment on Barkley?The wonders of Wikipedia.November 2014 Xavi said he was good enough to play for Barcelona.
Post by: chrisw1 on June 04, 2024, 10:55:30 AM
Trying to sell JJ while he's got a broken foot would be nuts.Agreed. Particularly after a failed come back.
Post by: brontebilly on June 04, 2024, 11:03:58 AM
With that logic he shouldn’t have been out for the best part of a season. Clearly there’s some complexity to it which hopefully will have all been sorted by pre-season. Fully fit JJ in the champions league could see the £40m figure doubling!
Let's hope so, we struggled on that left side all season really in Ramsey's absence. I don't see Barkley as an option in that role at all. A fitter Rogers possibly though I think he's better further up the pitch. Buendia played there a bit but again would be better further forward too.
Post by: Astnor on June 09, 2024, 03:53:39 PM
Players that have left us and done a good comeback? From my memory Gordon Cowans and Ashley Young.
Post by: Monty on June 09, 2024, 03:55:23 PM
Players that have left us and done a good comeback? From my memory Gordon Cowans and Ashley Young.
Milner, if he counts.
Post by: Brazilian Villain on June 09, 2024, 03:58:01 PM
Players that have left us and done a good comeback? From my memory Gordon Cowans and Ashley Young.
Milner, if he counts.
Steve Staunton.
Post by: The Edge on June 09, 2024, 08:21:38 PM
I'm backing Diaby to do a Bailey and have a storming second season. He'll need better behind him than Moreno or Digne in my opinion.With that logic he shouldn’t have been out for the best part of a season. Clearly there’s some complexity to it which hopefully will have all been sorted by pre-season. Fully fit JJ in the champions league could see the £40m figure doubling!
Let's hope so, we struggled on that left side all season really in Ramsey's absence. I don't see Barkley as an option in that role at all. A fitter Rogers possibly though I think he's better further up the pitch. Buendia played there a bit but again would be better further forward too.
Post by: Richard on June 09, 2024, 10:26:32 PM
I'm backing Diaby to do a Bailey and have a storming second season. He'll need better behind him than Moreno or Digne in my opinion.With that logic he shouldn’t have been out for the best part of a season. Clearly there’s some complexity to it which hopefully will have all been sorted by pre-season. Fully fit JJ in the champions league could see the £40m figure doubling!
Let's hope so, we struggled on that left side all season really in Ramsey's absence. I don't see Barkley as an option in that role at all. A fitter Rogers possibly though I think he's better further up the pitch. Buendia played there a bit but again would be better further forward too.
I don't recall Diaby playing much in front of either?
Post by: john e on June 09, 2024, 10:30:29 PM
But that turn and run to create the equaliser against Liverpool was a thing of wonder, more of that please
Post by: RamboandBruno on June 09, 2024, 11:38:58 PM
I think Digne had a great season and Moreno was brilliant the season before, before a horrible injuryI'm backing Diaby to do a Bailey and have a storming second season. He'll need better behind him than Moreno or Digne in my opinion.With that logic he shouldn’t have been out for the best part of a season. Clearly there’s some complexity to it which hopefully will have all been sorted by pre-season. Fully fit JJ in the champions league could see the £40m figure doubling!
Let's hope so, we struggled on that left side all season really in Ramsey's absence. I don't see Barkley as an option in that role at all. A fitter Rogers possibly though I think he's better further up the pitch. Buendia played there a bit but again would be better further forward too.
Post by: eye digress on June 10, 2024, 06:10:42 AM
I thought some of Diaby’s performances this year have been truly piss poorBit harsh - think it would be better to say he was below his potential.
But that turn and run to create the equaliser against Liverpool was a thing of wonder, more of that please
As for shiny moments, you could add the offside goal versus Palace at home, picking the ball out of the air with sublime skill.
Post by: coreyfeldman on June 10, 2024, 09:03:50 AM
Post by: Monty on June 10, 2024, 09:22:17 AM
I thought some of Diaby’s performances this year have been truly piss poorBit harsh - think it would be better to say he was below his potential.
But that turn and run to create the equaliser against Liverpool was a thing of wonder, more of that please
As for shiny moments, you could add the offside goal versus Palace at home, picking thr ball out of the air with sublime skill.
I think there were too many games where he looked genuinely lost. Not without the ball - he did his job positionally as he should - but when he'd get the thing he'd sometimes look really indecisive, like he was surprised to be there.
Plenty of moments to build on though. Clearly a tremendous talent.
Post by: Smithy on June 10, 2024, 09:31:45 AM
I think Moussa will be even better next season, and being into double figures for goals and assists should become the norm for him if he stays fit. He's had his acclimatisation season, which we're often told some players need. So let's see what he can do in year two...
Post by: eamonn on June 10, 2024, 10:33:04 AM
He needs to be sharper in his play and cleverer to evade challenges from bigger players, hopefully he shows that next season.
Post by: eye digress on June 10, 2024, 11:02:13 AM
There were some poor and frustrating performances too. Just think it needs to be kept in perspective.
Post by: Rudy Can't Fail on June 10, 2024, 09:53:24 PM
There was definitely a loss of confidence at one stage – the directness that his goals vs the Jaudis and Burnley (plus the disallowed Palace one) seemed to promise faded away.
There were some poor and frustrating performances too. Just think it needs to be kept in perspective.
Perspective? Despite his numbers it feels like we've been playing with 10 players most of the time he's in the team. It's not like Unai hasn't given him the opportunities.
'Look at Bailey, he needed time,' sure but both have been working under Unai, only one was his signing. Sometimes even the best get it wrong. Not righting him off, I suspect he's one of many that played under injury problems.
If we get him fully fit, (the only time last season I was amazed at his speed was to celebrate a goal) he may turn out to be a good investment but right now, I have serious doubts.
For reference, I also thought we'd be lucky to get £40m for clown feet, Ollie Watkins 12 months ago.
Post by: Dante Lavelli on June 11, 2024, 04:43:43 PM
Luton supporting mate loves him and says he’s brilliant as the more creative one next to a DCM. Ridiculously comfortable taking the ball off the centre backs and on the half-turn so aligns with Emery’s tactics perfectly.
Post by: AV84 on June 11, 2024, 05:28:19 PM
I can see him starting if Doug goes.
Luton supporting mate loves him and says he’s brilliant as the more creative one next to a DCM. Ridiculously comfortable taking the ball off the centre backs and on the half-turn so aligns with Emery’s tactics perfectly.
I wonder how did teams set up against Luton? Did he get more time on the ball when taking it from the CBs than he might playing for us, or would it be a directly transferable skill?
Post by: Dante Lavelli on June 11, 2024, 06:17:56 PM
No idea how to post videos either but this had him salivating (fingers crossed):
https://youtu.be/iIvm3TZ5zVA?si=o-MteE_qkQR3UW5_
Post by: Toronto Villa on June 11, 2024, 06:23:37 PM
That I couldn’t tell you.
No idea how to post videos either but this had him salivating (fingers crossed):
Post by: Dante Lavelli on June 11, 2024, 06:25:37 PM
Post by: Percy McCarthy on June 13, 2024, 01:37:24 AM
That I couldn’t tell you.
No idea how to post videos either but this had him salivating (fingers crossed):
Most of those clips against good teams.
Post by: chrisw1 on June 13, 2024, 01:05:36 PM
From what I've seen McKennie doesn't have the quality on the ball to do that, nor does he want to DM so my guess is he's mainly going to be used in the wide-right McGinn role.
That leaves us Ramsey and Rogers for the left (supported by Tielemans / McGinn / Barkley / Iling if necessary)
McGinn can be an emergency DM (possibly McKennie if we can improve his attitude). Still leaves a big gap until Kamara is fit.
Post by: Dante Lavelli on June 13, 2024, 01:08:57 PM
Also add buendia and possibly Kellyman although I’d guess a loan might suit him better.
Post by: brontebilly on June 13, 2024, 09:21:50 PM
Players that have left us and done a good comeback? From my memory Gordon Cowans and Ashley Young.
Those players performed for us! Barkley was an embarrassing flop that has already cost us a 12m loan fee.
Is there any precedent of a player bombing in his first chance with a club and they sign him again and he does well? Suspect this second punt on Barkley is unprecedented.
Post by: Monty on June 13, 2024, 09:38:10 PM
Players that have left us and done a good comeback? From my memory Gordon Cowans and Ashley Young.
Those players performed for us! Barkley was an embarrassing flop that has already cost us a 12m loan fee.
Is there any precedent of a player bombing in his first chance with a club and they sign him again and he does well? Suspect this second punt on Barkley is unprecedented.
I wonder if Unai knows this.
Post by: Astnor on June 13, 2024, 09:51:44 PM
Looks a stronger variant of Luiz on those clips.That I couldn’t tell you.
No idea how to post videos either but this had him salivating (fingers crossed):
Most of those clips against good teams.
Post by: brontebilly on June 14, 2024, 12:10:46 PM
Players that have left us and done a good comeback? From my memory Gordon Cowans and Ashley Young.
Those players performed for us! Barkley was an embarrassing flop that has already cost us a 12m loan fee.
Is there any precedent of a player bombing in his first chance with a club and they sign him again and he does well? Suspect this second punt on Barkley is unprecedented.
I wonder if Unai knows this.
Im not really sure forums work if everyone blindly accepts the decisions the manager or even the club make.
Post by: AV82EC on June 14, 2024, 12:17:33 PM
Post by: Monty on June 14, 2024, 12:23:52 PM
Players that have left us and done a good comeback? From my memory Gordon Cowans and Ashley Young.
Those players performed for us! Barkley was an embarrassing flop that has already cost us a 12m loan fee.
Is there any precedent of a player bombing in his first chance with a club and they sign him again and he does well? Suspect this second punt on Barkley is unprecedented.
I wonder if Unai knows this.
Im not really sure forums work if everyone blindly accepts the decisions the manager or even the club make.
No, but I'm pretty sure who's watched more football other than the Villa.
Post by: Ads on June 14, 2024, 12:29:49 PM
Still on favour of this. Good physical presence too, which seems to be the profile; height/aerial ability, pace, power. Would have slotted in on plenty of ocassions to cover Doug or Yuri.
Post by: LeeB on June 14, 2024, 12:47:34 PM
Criticism narrows when there's probably 1 manager better than him in Europe.
Still on favour of this. Good physical presence too, which seems to be the profile; height/aerial ability, pace, power. Would have slotted in on plenty of ocassions to cover Doug or Yuri.
Certainly seems to be a push towards this, which given the problems say Newcastle caused us I can understand.
Imagine a bunch of angry giants playing the kind of football we did last season, God help everyone else.
Post by: Ads on June 14, 2024, 12:50:29 PM
Criticism narrows when there's probably 1 manager better than him in Europe.
Still on favour of this. Good physical presence too, which seems to be the profile; height/aerial ability, pace, power. Would have slotted in on plenty of ocassions to cover Doug or Yuri.
Certainly seems to be a push towards this, which given the problems say Newcastle caused us I can understand.
Imagine a bunch of angry giants playing the kind of football we did last season, God help everyone else.
How do you defend against a JJ in full gallop, being overlapped by The Flash if The Flash was stacked and you've got a man whose 6'4" in your eye line that appears impossible to knock off the ball.
Post by: LeeB on June 14, 2024, 12:53:37 PM
Criticism narrows when there's probably 1 manager better than him in Europe.
Still on favour of this. Good physical presence too, which seems to be the profile; height/aerial ability, pace, power. Would have slotted in on plenty of ocassions to cover Doug or Yuri.
Certainly seems to be a push towards this, which given the problems say Newcastle caused us I can understand.
Imagine a bunch of angry giants playing the kind of football we did last season, God help everyone else.
How do you defend against a JJ in full gallop, being overlapped by The Flash if The Flash was stacked and you've got a man whose 6'4" in your eye line that appears impossible to knock off the ball.
You spend all game getting the shit knocked out of you by angry Mings and co, then get beaten in the air at the near post from a corner by Buendia.
Post by: eamonn on June 14, 2024, 01:17:36 PM
Post by: paul_e on June 14, 2024, 01:39:17 PM
Aside but God I hope Ramsey comes back fit and as good as he was in 22/23. A joy to watch when he drives forward. More than Grealish in a way. With Jack, I always felt like he'd end any dribbling by winning a foul. JJ is stronger, when he drives, you're more confident that there will be end-product.
With JJ, Rogers and Bailey we have a lot of strong ball carriers in squad if we can get them all fit. Add Iling-Junior as well and we look very dangerous.
Post by: Ian. on June 14, 2024, 01:46:02 PM
They all know where the net is too, I'd say if Jack had a weakness for us, it was the final shot or knowing when to shoot.Aside but God I hope Ramsey comes back fit and as good as he was in 22/23. A joy to watch when he drives forward. More than Grealish in a way. With Jack, I always felt like he'd end any dribbling by winning a foul. JJ is stronger, when he drives, you're more confident that there will be end-product.
With JJ, Rogers and Bailey we have a lot of strong ball carriers in squad if we can get them all fit. Add Iling-Junior as well and we look very dangerous.
Post by: Smithy on June 14, 2024, 09:55:25 PM
he's clearly a different player to the one we had in 20/21. Whether something has 'clicked' having left Chelsea without a Premier League suitor, or having to kick on over in France, but it's obviously to everyone that the player who spent last season at Luton is head and shoulders above the one who spent time in our midfield three seasons ago.Looks a stronger variant of Luiz on those clips.That I couldn’t tell you.
No idea how to post videos either but this had him salivating (fingers crossed):
Most of those clips against good teams.
The only real question is 'has he changed permanently'? And the only people who can answer that are the club, and those who get to talk to him and look in his eyes. If he can play at the level he did for Luton, then he will be an asset, undoubtedly. If he feels he's back in the big time and takes his foot of the pedal, then it could be a mistake. But that's about mentality rather than ability, because he clearly has the latter.
Post by: KevinGage on June 14, 2024, 10:01:29 PM
In that period, he was capable of being explosive over short distances and opening the game up with a quick pass. Or having a pop from distance.
For his height and build he was always punching below his weight when it came to the other stuff.
Post by: ChicagoLion on June 14, 2024, 10:14:02 PM
Don't recall much of a physical presence from him in his first spell with us - even during his initial good phase.He looks different physically since he was with us.
In that period, he was capable of being explosive over short distances and opening the game up with a quick pass. Or having a pop from distance.
For his height and build he was always punching below his weight when it came to the other stuff.
Post by: Toronto Villa on June 14, 2024, 10:17:18 PM
Post by: Mister E on June 15, 2024, 07:23:25 AM
He looks different physically since he was with us.Yeah, not quite as Trump-orange (unless it's an optical illusion resulting from him wearing an orange shirt).
Post by: Dante Lavelli on June 15, 2024, 08:21:04 AM
Post by: AV84 on June 15, 2024, 09:20:07 AM
He looks different physically since he was with us.Yeah, not quite as Trump-orange (unless it's an optical illusion resulting from him wearing an orange shirt).
Isn't he mixed race?
Post by: pablo_picasso on June 15, 2024, 09:36:06 AM
He looks different physically since he was with us.Yeah, not quite as Trump-orange (unless it's an optical illusion resulting from him wearing an orange shirt).
Isn't he mixed race?
Yes.
Both his father & grandfather are from Nigeria.
He took his mothers maiden name instead of his fathers name (Effanga) because he has a strained relationship with him.
Post by: Villa Lew on June 20, 2024, 11:55:50 AM
Post by: ASHTONVILLA on June 20, 2024, 11:57:31 AM
Post by: Percy McCarthy on June 20, 2024, 11:58:50 AM
Don't understand, why the deal hasn't been confrmed, the verbal agreement with Luton was a few weeks ago, what is causing the hold up?
We’re waiting for the new financial year to begin on July 1st. They agreed everything a few weeks ago as you say, but even then they said it would be made official in ‘early July’.
Post by: Villa Lew on June 20, 2024, 01:01:06 PM
Don't understand, why the deal hasn't been confrmed, the verbal agreement with Luton was a few weeks ago, what is causing the hold up?
We’re waiting for the new financial year to begin on July 1st. They agreed everything a few weeks ago as you say, but even then they said it would be made official in ‘early July’.
Ok thanks
Post by: PeterWithe on June 20, 2024, 01:04:42 PM
Post by: Risso on June 20, 2024, 01:08:11 PM
Post by: LeeB on June 20, 2024, 01:14:30 PM
They can announce that an agreement has been reached before the contract officially begins. As somebody said earlier, I think the most likely explanation is to do with kits, they'll want all of the new players stretching the new Adidas kit, which they can't do until it's officially launched.
Typical Villa, now I'm wishing away an international tournament so I can see the new kit and some gurning bloke pulling it.
Post by: eamonn on June 20, 2024, 01:35:42 PM
And his Luton contract will expire at the end of the month, I think we are paying them to not take up their optional extra year.
Could Barkley have a say in the option not being taken-up, therefore we sign him for free and he gets a nice signing-on fee?
Post by: Risso on June 20, 2024, 01:47:13 PM
And his Luton contract will expire at the end of the month, I think we are paying them to not take up their optional extra year.
Could Barkley have a say in the option not being taken-up, therefore we sign him for free and he gets a nice signing-on fee?
If it's an option that Luton can automatically enforce, then no. The way it's been described so far, that would appear to be the case.
Post by: VillaTim on June 20, 2024, 01:51:42 PM
Don't understand, why the deal hasn't been confrmed, the verbal agreement with Luton was a few weeks ago, what is causing the hold up?He's in Marbs on holiday.
Post by: Tuscans on June 23, 2024, 11:05:07 AM
⤵️🟣🔵 #AVFC
🟣🔵🤝🏻 Aston Villa are prepared to enter into formal stages of Ross Barkley deal after agreement with Luton Town.
Fee around £5m, contract details already agreed and now waiting on medical.
Here we go, soon 🏴
Post by: Ian. on June 23, 2024, 11:13:04 AM
Post by: edgysatsuma89 on June 23, 2024, 12:52:52 PM
Post by: jwarry on June 23, 2024, 02:19:05 PM
He won't be the Kamara replacement, I imagine. He played alongside a more defensive player at Luton.
Definitely a Doug replacement
Post by: Percy McCarthy on June 23, 2024, 02:21:43 PM
He won't be the Kamara replacement, I imagine. He played alongside a more defensive player at Luton.
Definitely a Doug replacement
I think Tielemans is the Dougie replacement, and Ross his understudy/rotation.
Emery said last season that Dougie & Youri are basically the same player.
Unless Enzo is more ready than we think, we need a Kamara replacement for the first half of the season. Fofana, come on down!
Post by: AV84 on June 23, 2024, 02:29:59 PM
We hopefully won't be selling a Dougie every summer, but if someone is willing to commit to a season of being in and out of the squad, the chances will come. (Or at worst they'll get a nice move to another club in a mutually beneficial trade)
Post by: OCD on June 23, 2024, 02:39:25 PM
Post by: Dante Lavelli on June 23, 2024, 02:57:25 PM
I wonder whether one of the thoughts when we signed Tielemans last summer was to give him a season to get used to the system and then we would move Doug on this summer. Sure, we needed someone else because we couldn't rely so much on one player, but I do wonder whether this was the plan all along. It wouldn't surprise me with Emery tbh.
I’m convinced that he was signed in anticipation of Doug leaving. Part of monchi’s success at Seville was selling players for big bucks and already having their replacement in the squad.
Post by: AV84 on June 23, 2024, 03:02:37 PM
We saw several times this season how injury to a key player could really derail out entire system. I'd assume the long term goal would be to have minimal drop off in quality for all positions.
Post by: Monty on June 23, 2024, 03:23:28 PM
Post by: Dante Lavelli on June 23, 2024, 04:56:14 PM
It's a good way to do things, especially if players are on board. We're bringing in 2 young midfielders from Juve who should have plenty of time to adapt and bed in, peessure off, and by next summer we may sell a Bailey, or a Diaby, (I know they're not like for like) and have a replacement all ready to go.
We saw several times this season how injury to a key player could really derail out entire system. I'd assume the long term goal would be to have minimal drop off in quality for all positions.
Hypothetically we might need to sacrifice Ramsey next summer in order to comply with FFP\PSR but there’s a good chance Rogers and Illing will be established PL/CL players by that point.
Post by: Brazilian Villain on June 23, 2024, 05:48:20 PM
Hypothetically we might need to sacrifice Ramsey next summer in order to comply with FFP\PSR but there’s a good chance Rogers and Illing will be established PL/CL players by that point.
I doubt that will be the case, I'm more concerned about JJ coming back 100% at the start of the season.
Post by: AV84 on June 23, 2024, 06:40:39 PM
Post by: VillaTim on June 23, 2024, 07:28:07 PM
Post by: jwarry on June 24, 2024, 06:53:03 AM
Hypothetically we might need to sacrifice Ramsey next summer in order to comply with FFP\PSR but there’s a good chance Rogers and Illing will be established PL/CL players by that point.
I doubt that will be the case, I'm more concerned about JJ coming back 100% at the start of the season.
A 100% JJ would be like a new signing
Post by: OCD on June 24, 2024, 11:36:22 AM
If we sign Barkley, he has a massive opportunity to achieve what he couldn't at Chelsea. He's a very good player, all down to mindset and application now plus working with the best coach of his career now.
That's quite a turnaround from someone who was adamant that Barkley was just paper talk and who didn't want us to sign him.
Post by: Percy McCarthy on June 24, 2024, 11:38:09 AM
If we sign Barkley, he has a massive opportunity to achieve what he couldn't at Chelsea. He's a very good player, all down to mindset and application now plus working with the best coach of his career now.
That's quite a turnaround from someone who was adamant that Barkley was just paper talk and who didn't want us to sign him.
We’re all allowed to change our minds right?
Post by: Ads on June 24, 2024, 11:43:02 AM
Post by: VILLA MOLE on June 24, 2024, 11:44:13 AM
If we sign Barkley, he has a massive opportunity to achieve what he couldn't at Chelsea. He's a very good player, all down to mindset and application now plus working with the best coach of his career now.
That's quite a turnaround from someone who was adamant that Barkley was just paper talk and who didn't want us to sign him.
We’re all allowed to change our minds right?
no we are not
Post by: VILLA MOLE on June 24, 2024, 11:44:47 AM
If we sign Barkley, he has a massive opportunity to achieve what he couldn't at Chelsea. He's a very good player, all down to mindset and application now plus working with the best coach of his career now.
That's quite a turnaround from someone who was adamant that Barkley was just paper talk and who didn't want us to sign him.
We’re all allowed to change our minds right?
no we are not
yeh actually we can :D
Post by: VillaTim on June 24, 2024, 11:49:34 AM
"IF" .If we sign Barkley, he has a massive opportunity to achieve what he couldn't at Chelsea. He's a very good player, all down to mindset and application now plus working with the best coach of his career now.
That's quite a turnaround from someone who was adamant that Barkley was just paper talk and who didn't want us to sign him.
Last time i checked he hadn't signed.
Post by: Chris Smith on June 24, 2024, 11:49:36 AM
If we sign Barkley, he has a massive opportunity to achieve what he couldn't at Chelsea. He's a very good player, all down to mindset and application now plus working with the best coach of his career now.
That's quite a turnaround from someone who was adamant that Barkley was just paper talk and who didn't want us to sign him.
We’re all allowed to change our minds right?
no we are not
yeh actually we can :D
You used to be indecisive, now you’re not so sure.
Post by: Drummond on June 24, 2024, 01:27:25 PM
Post by: Hookeysmith on June 24, 2024, 02:04:39 PM
Really looking forward to seeing him again.
Post by: Smithy on June 24, 2024, 02:07:46 PM
Barkley's clear skill and experience matched with SUE's coaching and tactics could just be the signing of the season. He was really lauded for his efforts at Luton
Really looking forward to seeing him again.
Me too. I also think that's because over time, the memories of his meandering midfield performances for us have faded, while the memories of his positive contributions, such as in Liverpool's hammering, and his last-minute winner away at Leicester, still burn pretty bright.
He's obviously not a long-term signing, but if he can play even a medium-sized part in helping us consolidate as a top-four side in the next two years, then he'll be worth every penny.
Post by: Risso on June 24, 2024, 02:09:12 PM
Post by: LeeB on June 24, 2024, 02:09:24 PM
Barkley's clear skill and experience matched with SUE's coaching and tactics could just be the signing of the season. He was really lauded for his efforts at Luton
Really looking forward to seeing him again.
Me too. I also think that's because over time, the memories of his meandering midfield performances for us have faded, while the memories of his positive contributions, such as in Liverpool's hammering, and his last-minute winner away at Leicester, still burn pretty bright.
He's obviously not a long-term signing, but if he can play even a medium-sized part in helping us consolidate as a top-four side in the next two years, then he'll be worth every penny.
The volleyed cross onto Watkins nut at the Emirates remains probably the best cross I've ever seen.
Post by: eamonn on June 24, 2024, 03:05:19 PM
As long as he doesn't get the arse again if he's subbed/not first choice. He's going to find Champions League Aston Villa are an extremely different proposition to relegated Luton.
He will, you just know it.
Post by: john e on June 24, 2024, 03:41:32 PM
Post by: Smithy on June 24, 2024, 03:48:38 PM
As long as he doesn't get the arse again if he's subbed/not first choice. He's going to find Champions League Aston Villa are an extremely different proposition to relegated Luton.
I think he's going to find Champions League Aston Villa are a very different proposition to 2020/21 Aston Villa...
Post by: Drummond on June 24, 2024, 03:55:15 PM
Post by: Clark W Griswold on June 24, 2024, 03:56:28 PM
As long as he doesn't get the arse again if he's subbed/not first choice. He's going to find Champions League Aston Villa are an extremely different proposition to relegated Luton.
He will, you just know it.
We do.
You would think that he would have thought about this himself and given that he clearly doesn't like being rotated / not playing much he would go and sign for someone else where he will be first choice, doesn't necessarily have to be another relegation team. Yes, we're in the Champions League but will he play all that much? I don't altogether get his motivation for coming, considering he seems to be better as a big fish in a small pond. We're a much bigger pond now and he struggled the hold down a place last time second half of the season. It's the one deal mentioned so far this summer that i'm not happy about at all.
Post by: LeeB on June 24, 2024, 04:05:28 PM
As long as he doesn't get the arse again if he's subbed/not first choice. He's going to find Champions League Aston Villa are an extremely different proposition to relegated Luton.
He will, you just know it.
We do.
You would think that he would have thought about this himself and given that he clearly doesn't like being rotated / not playing much he would go and sign for someone else where he will be first choice, doesn't necessarily have to be another relegation team. Yes, we're in the Champions League but will he play all that much? I don't altogether get his motivation for coming, considering he seems to be better as a big fish in a small pond. We're a much bigger pond now and he struggled the hold down a place last time second half of the season. It's the one deal mentioned so far this summer that i'm not happy about at all.
He's joining us in a completely different position to when he did last time. I'm sure he's fully aware of that. I reckon he's had some off-field issues in the past which he's overcome, he's spent the last couple of seasons getting himself properly fit and proving himself again and it's led to an opportunity that he may have felt wouldn't come again.
I reckon he'll be absolutely chomping at the bit to prove himself again at the top level and we will see the benefit of a player that will realise the potential he's always had.
Post by: OCD on June 24, 2024, 04:26:11 PM
Post by: PaulWinch again on June 24, 2024, 04:38:18 PM
He still harbours ambitions of getting back into the England team so he definitely wants to prove himself at the top level again.
Well his position is a very obvious weakness in the England team, so if he performs he’s got a shot.
Post by: VillaTim on June 24, 2024, 10:52:26 PM
whilst i'm happy with our transfer dealings so far i still think Barkley is a mistake but not a big one so i'm not overly concernedStill not convinced it's happening anyway. Doesn't strike me as an Emery type .
Post by: Toronto Villa on June 24, 2024, 11:06:46 PM
Post by: brontebilly on June 24, 2024, 11:18:24 PM
He still harbours ambitions of getting back into the England team so he definitely wants to prove himself at the top level again.
Well his position is a very obvious weakness in the England team, so if he performs he’s got a shot.
Dean Smith said the same a few years back...look at how that ended up....right back to where we started.
Post by: pablo_picasso on June 25, 2024, 11:59:20 AM
whilst i'm happy with our transfer dealings so far i still think Barkley is a mistake but not a big one so i'm not overly concernedStill not convinced it's happening anyway. Doesn't strike me as an Emery type .
You were praising it a couple days ago until someone reminded you that you said it wouldn't happen...
Post by: VillaTim on June 25, 2024, 12:49:42 PM
I hope it doesn't happen, I think he's far too big a gamble. He's a good player (when he wants to be) but we need far better. I don't remember him doing much in either game agaonst us last season which are the only 2 full Luton games i watched.whilst i'm happy with our transfer dealings so far i still think Barkley is a mistake but not a big one so i'm not overly concernedStill not convinced it's happening anyway. Doesn't strike me as an Emery type .
You were praising it a couple days ago until someone reminded you that you said it wouldn't happen...
Post by: Paul.S on June 25, 2024, 03:50:37 PM
I hope it doesn't happen, I think he's far too big a gamble. He's a good player (when he wants to be) but we need far better. I don't remember him doing much in either game agaonst us last season which are the only 2 full Luton games i watched.whilst i'm happy with our transfer dealings so far i still think Barkley is a mistake but not a big one so i'm not overly concernedStill not convinced it's happening anyway. Doesn't strike me as an Emery type .
You were praising it a couple days ago until someone reminded you that you said it wouldn't happen...
He’s definitely not a gamble at £5m. We need a better quality squad and he’ll start on the bench and will have to earn his place.
Post by: Brazilian Villain on June 25, 2024, 04:46:06 PM
whilst i'm happy with our transfer dealings so far i still think Barkley is a mistake but not a big one so i'm not overly concerned
Still not convinced it's happening anyway. Doesn't strike me as an Emery type .
*checks odds available on Barkley's next club*
Post by: OCD on June 26, 2024, 02:00:19 PM
It's crucial Villa add more options for Emery, but while Profit and Sustainability Rules have dictated the club's early summer business a move for Barkley makes great sense for a variety of reasons. Preparations for Douglas Luiz's exit began 18 months ago and following the free transfer of Youri Tielemans last summer, Villa believe Barkley - who Emery personally met to discuss a move - will also be a shrewd capture.
Barkley's career had been in decline since his departure from Everton in 2018 as he struggled to make a real impact at Chelsea. He returned to Stamford Bridge for one more season following a loan spell at Villa Park where he excelled in his first six league games before a hamstring injury appeared to affect the rest of his campaign.
Barkley left Chelsea in the summer of 2022 and joined Ligue 1 side Nice in what was a surprise move for the midfielder. He only made nine starts in 27 Ligue 1 appearances, but the move abroad allowed him to reset before returning to England with Luton after their promotion to the Premier League.
Barkley didn't take long to accept Luton's offer after a brief chat with Rob Edwards, who explained how he wanted to get the former Everton star back to the same level he showed at Goodison Park earlier in his career.
The 30-year-old believes he will still be in his prime for another three years and only a few months ago said: "I want to play in the Premier League. I want to play in Europe again."
Barkley's rise at Everton came when he was playing in an advanced midfield role, operating around a number nine, often Romelu Lukaku. But at Luton, he demonstrated how he can play in a deeper position and influence the game in front of the defence.
Due to Luton's lack of ability to control matches - which meant Barkley couldn't get on the ball in the final third too often - he was deployed in a deeper role and flourished. As Barkley was getting on the ball more, it allowed his team to sustain pressure, otherwise it would have been a challenge to generate any meaningful build-up.
Barkley often played the regista role, which is a position just in front of the backline. He was therefore entrusted with playmaking, directing the tempo of the game, and moving the ball under pressure from the opponent.
His positional awareness allows him to take responsibility in the first phase of possession, whether that's finding passes or driving past opponents in tight spaces; something which Youri Tielemans does very well in a deep-lying position.
"I knew I could play in that position, but sometimes all it takes is a manager to trust you in a certain role," Barkley told the BBC. "When I was younger, I was more of a holding midfielder, making tackles and similar to how I'm playing now but still taking some risks.
"Then once I broke my leg and came back, I had no confidence in tackling or leaving my leg in for challenges. It took me a couple of years because every time I saw someone go in for a 50-50, I thought someone could have broken their leg.
"Of course it affected me mentally, so I got moved further forward into more attacking positions because my decision-making when I was younger wasn't as good as it is now. That comes with experience."
Rob Edwards often deployed either a 5-4-1 or 3-4-3 formation, also a 4-4-2 at times. Despite a few structural changes, Luton's two-man midfield was ever-present. Barkley usually operated on the left side of the central two, forming partnerships with the likes of Pelly Mpanzu and Albert Sambi Lokonga.
While Barkley was consistently brilliant across the Premier League season, he was particularly impressive in Luton's draw against Liverpool, the close defeats to Manchester City and Arsenal, as well as the win over Newcastle.
Barkley completed 163 progressive passes last term at a rate of 5.6 per 90. Compared to Villa's three most comparable midfielders last season Luiz, John McGinn and Youri Tielemans, he ranks second behind Tielemans at 7.1 progressive passes per 90. Barkley's pass completion was 82.6 per cent last term, slightly lower than Luiz (85.7 per cent) and Tielemans' (83.1 per cent) scores.
The Luton man played 138 passes into the final third last season, which was more those three Villa midfielders. He also recorded 24 switches across the pitch, which was the fifth most in the Premier League and 11 more than Luiz in second, in front of Tielemans and McGinn's totals.
Barkley's ability to carry the ball and progress up the pitch in possession is arguably his biggest strength. He completed 104 take-ons in the league season and completed 66, which was the sixth most in the division.
Villa captain McGinn attempted 96 take-ons, while Barkley's higher total was more than Luiz and Tielemans' total combined. Barkley also carried the ball into the final third 49 times last season which was more than the three Villa men.
For all of Barkley's qualities in possession, he couldn't have played in a two-man midfield without being defensively secure alongside his teammate. He showed strong positional discipline for Luton last season, recording more interceptions (25) than Luiz, McGinn and Tielemans. He also won more aerial duels (42) than the three Villa players combined and committed fewer fouls (25) than Luiz (51) and McGinn (39).
Barkley is also capable of winning the ball back higher up the pitch as he has the power to burst into high intensity sprints to close down an opponent in a bid to retrieve possession. It was at Nice where he learned the importance of pressing and counter-pressing.
"I learned quite a lot [at Nice] to be honest, even though I felt like I should have played a lot more than I did there," he told the BBC. "I learned a lot off the ball. In France, they work hard on the defensive side of the game, really aggressive pressing.
"Some tackles I saw in training were dangerous, even some of the youngsters go right through the older players and didn't even pick them up.
"I just felt like I had a lot to prove [before signing for Luton] and I missed my football and playing games. I feel like I've gone back in time now. I've not really played [as] much in the past three or four years as I feel like I deserved.
"The manager has helped me a lot since he came in, with his trust and communication. He's got great man-management skills, great togetherness and he's a great man as well."
Source: https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/aston-villa-transfer-ross-barkley-29243440
Post by: Toronto Villa on June 26, 2024, 02:02:24 PM
Clearly not happening
Post by: paul_e on June 26, 2024, 02:13:10 PM
I feel like I've gone back in time now. I've not really played [as] much in the past three or four years as I feel like I deserved.
"The manager has helped me a lot since he came in, with his trust and communication. He's got great man-management skills, great togetherness and he's a great man as well."
Source: https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/aston-villa-transfer-ross-barkley-29243440
I won't quote everything but those 2 lines are why I'm not sure about this one, I'm just not sure he's capable of being out of the team and keeping his head right. Last time he was with us he was fine until he got injured against Brighton and missed about 5-6 weeks. After that he strugglde to play out 90minutes and as he was being taken off in most games he got more petulant and lazier.
Post by: eamonn on June 26, 2024, 02:32:50 PM
Interesting quotes on Barkely being scared of tackling after his major injury. Looks like France and Luton has been good for him as it would be for all of us.
Post by: pablo_picasso on June 26, 2024, 02:36:55 PM
https://www.sofascore.com/player/ross-barkley/98435 (https://www.sofascore.com/player/ross-barkley/98435)
He is everywhere...
Post by: VillaTim on June 26, 2024, 02:39:37 PM
I'd be reluctant to offer any longer than a 1 year deal on this basis.I feel like I've gone back in time now. I've not really played [as] much in the past three or four years as I feel like I deserved.
"The manager has helped me a lot since he came in, with his trust and communication. He's got great man-management skills, great togetherness and he's a great man as well."
Source: https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/aston-villa-transfer-ross-barkley-29243440
I won't quote everything but those 2 lines are why I'm not sure about this one, I'm just not sure he's capable of being out of the team and keeping his head right. Last time he was with us he was fine until he got injured against Brighton and missed about 5-6 weeks. After that he strugglde to play out 90minutes and as he was being taken off in most games he got more petulant and lazier.
Post by: OCD on June 26, 2024, 02:49:01 PM
His heatmap in the Prem last year is fascinating.
https://www.sofascore.com/player/ross-barkley/98435 (https://www.sofascore.com/player/ross-barkley/98435)
He is everywhere...
More of a focus to the left side of central midfield though.
Post by: Clark W Griswold on June 26, 2024, 02:52:45 PM
"I learned quite a lot [at Nice] to be honest, even though I felt like I should have played a lot more than I did there,"
"I've not really played [as] much in the past three or four years as I feel like I deserved."
No. Just fucking no.
Post by: cdbearsfan on June 26, 2024, 02:52:53 PM
https://x.com/johntownley11/status/1805942628443152628?s=46
Clearly not happening
Don't get my hopes up, please.
Post by: chrisw1 on June 26, 2024, 02:53:25 PM
I'm pretty confident he'll do ok, but yes, not getting regular game time may be a worry.
Post by: Drummond on June 26, 2024, 03:08:29 PM
Post by: Somniloquism on June 26, 2024, 03:14:20 PM
I love Youri's progressive passes. Even for Belgium the other day, they look a lot better with him in the team.
I noticed afterwards it was "De Bruyne runs the show in Belgium win". Hmmm, did Tielemans not start and end that breakthrough goal and cause other problems, something De Bruyne wasn't doing in that first match.
Post by: AV84 on June 26, 2024, 03:39:44 PM
Post by: Smithy on June 26, 2024, 03:49:58 PM
That tweet says Uni met with him personally to talk to him about coming back to Villa. I find it hard to believe he wouldn't have laid out his exact plans for Barkley and for the team as a whole. If he comes here expecting anything else then he can't complain.
I suspect it will be a bit like Tielemens last season. He'll probably spend a prolonged period on the bench, maybe even to the point of public frustration, and then he'll get his chance when circumstance dictate. Whether he takes it, or not, is up to him. The one thing in his favour is we're losing Dougie, who was a guaranteed starter when fit, so there is definitely an opportunity for him to fight for a place in the 11 early on if he gets a chance.
If Enzo is to be the Kamara cover until his return, then I suspect Ross would next in line behind Youri and SJM for a midfield spot. Unless Unai thinks he's capable of playing in the Kamara role, which would be surprising to say the least...
Post by: Drummond on June 26, 2024, 05:24:16 PM
McGinn, Tielemans, Barkley, Barrenechea, Ramsey... With Kamara due back at the end of the year.
It wouldn't surprise me if we got another central midfielder in.
Post by: pablo_picasso on June 26, 2024, 07:08:18 PM
His heatmap in the Prem last year is fascinating.
https://www.sofascore.com/player/ross-barkley/98435 (https://www.sofascore.com/player/ross-barkley/98435)
He is everywhere...
More of a focus to the left side of central midfield though.
Tbf, you see the same with Douglas Luiz because he was on the left side of the central midfield pairing. Its actually more focused on the left for Luiz.
https://www.sofascore.com/player/douglas-luiz/867887 (https://www.sofascore.com/player/douglas-luiz/867887)
Kamara is the same, only he is on the right side...
https://www.sofascore.com/player/douglas-luiz/867887 (https://www.sofascore.com/player/douglas-luiz/867887)
Don't get me wrong, Im not a huge fan of Barkley or this transfer, I just thought he looked 'busy' from his heat-map, which is a positive element to the transfer.
Post by: VillaTim on June 26, 2024, 07:56:12 PM
I think we could be seeing all sorts of permutations...Adapting a new middle of the team without Kamara/Luiz is vital. Tielemans is the Luiz upgrade but we need a quality DM now
McGinn, Tielemans, Barkley, Barrenechea, Ramsey... With Kamara due back at the end of the year.
It wouldn't surprise me if we got another central midfielder in.
Post by: Ads on June 26, 2024, 08:13:43 PM
Enzo, Barkley etc are there to bulk the squad up given we'll have to go full tilt in Europe everytime.
Post by: AV84 on June 26, 2024, 08:23:46 PM
Post by: VillaTim on June 26, 2024, 08:27:39 PM
Depends on who else we sign, but with Kamara out and Luiz gone, Tielemans and McGinn probably having a slightly longer break, Ramsey and Buendia's return from injury status unknown, there should be a fairly big opportunity for Barkley to make his mark early on. Obviously he'll need time to settle and adapt, but potentially a couple of weeks of pre season where it's just him and a bunch of kids in midfield.If we've come all this way to pin our hopes on Ross Barkley in the middle it's a huge gamble.
Post by: PaulWinch again on June 26, 2024, 08:32:16 PM
Post by: Brazilian Villain on June 26, 2024, 08:37:16 PM
We won’t be “pinning our hopes” on him. He’s one addition to the midfield, and a good one at that.
Yeah, the only player we're 'pinning our hopes on' is JJ.
Post by: AV84 on June 26, 2024, 08:45:37 PM
Depends on who else we sign, but with Kamara out and Luiz gone, Tielemans and McGinn probably having a slightly longer break, Ramsey and Buendia's return from injury status unknown, there should be a fairly big opportunity for Barkley to make his mark early on. Obviously he'll need time to settle and adapt, but potentially a couple of weeks of pre season where it's just him and a bunch of kids in midfield.If we've come all this way to pin our hopes on Ross Barkley in the middle it's a huge gamble.
If you took that from what I said, I don't know what to tell you.
Post by: RamboandBruno on June 26, 2024, 08:51:11 PM
I really like Tielemans, but saying he’s a Luiz upgrade is just you trying to continue your point in the Luiz thread that you don’t think Luiz is that good.I think we could be seeing all sorts of permutations...Adapting a new middle of the team without Kamara/Luiz is vital. Tielemans is the Luiz upgrade but we need a quality DM now
McGinn, Tielemans, Barkley, Barrenechea, Ramsey... With Kamara due back at the end of the year.
It wouldn't surprise me if we got another central midfielder in.
Post by: PaulWinch again on June 26, 2024, 08:52:21 PM
Post by: VillaTim on June 26, 2024, 08:59:51 PM
Not really. Luiz is good, Tielemans is better and an upgrade.I really like Tielemans, but saying he’s a Luiz upgrade is just you trying to continue your point in the Luiz thread that you don’t think Luiz is that good.I think we could be seeing all sorts of permutations...Adapting a new middle of the team without Kamara/Luiz is vital. Tielemans is the Luiz upgrade but we need a quality DM now
McGinn, Tielemans, Barkley, Barrenechea, Ramsey... With Kamara due back at the end of the year.
It wouldn't surprise me if we got another central midfielder in.
Post by: PaulWinch again on June 26, 2024, 09:00:40 PM
Post by: tomd2103 on June 27, 2024, 01:05:36 AM
I would imagine July/August will bring the Luiz replacement.
Enzo, Barkley etc are there to bulk the squad up given we'll have to go full tilt in Europe everytime.
If the formation doesn't change too drastically next season, then Tielemans, McGinn or Barkley will likely play where Luiz did. None or probably better, but I don't think there is much in it if they perform.
Not bringing in an adequate replacement for Kamara while he is out will be a much bigger than losing Luiz I think.
Post by: Smithy on June 27, 2024, 10:08:09 AM
Not really. Luiz is good, Tielemans is better and an upgrade.I really like Tielemans, but saying he’s a Luiz upgrade is just you trying to continue your point in the Luiz thread that you don’t think Luiz is that good.I think we could be seeing all sorts of permutations...Adapting a new middle of the team without Kamara/Luiz is vital. Tielemans is the Luiz upgrade but we need a quality DM now
McGinn, Tielemans, Barkley, Barrenechea, Ramsey... With Kamara due back at the end of the year.
It wouldn't surprise me if we got another central midfielder in.
There is a reason Luiz has been chased by Juventus for circa £60m and linked with various other champions league clubs like Arsenal, and Tielemans hasn't. And it's not because Tielemens is a "better player".
Youri did MUCH better for us in the second half of last season, but re-writing history just because Dougie is leaving just makes you look a bit silly. Now, can Youri step up and fill Dougie's boots this coming season? Quite possibly, and I certainly HOPE he can - but he's not a "better" player today.
Post by: LeeB on June 27, 2024, 10:12:41 AM
Post by: Risso on June 27, 2024, 10:17:58 AM
There is a reason Luiz has been chased by Juventus for circa £60m and linked with various other champions league clubs like Arsenal, and Tielemans hasn't. And it's not because Tielemens is a "better player".
Youri did MUCH better for us in the second half of last season, but re-writing history just because Dougie is leaving just makes you look a bit silly. Now, can Youri step up and fill Dougie's boots this coming season? Quite possibly, and I certainly HOPE he can - but he's not a "better" player today.
Tielemans cost Leicester £40m when he signed 5 years ago, and at times 2 or 3 years ago he was being linked with some big moves like Barcelona and Arsenal. Just because he hasn't been linked with a move this summer, doesn't mean he isn't a top notch player. I haven't seen much in the way of speculation for Martinez or Watkins either.
The only reason Luiz was linked with Juventus pretty much straight away is that we must have made it clear we were were willing to listen to offers. It's telling we were prepared to do that with Luiz and nobody else. Maybe his second half of the season performances convinced Emery we could manage without him?
Post by: Smithy on June 27, 2024, 12:58:45 PM
There is a reason Luiz has been chased by Juventus for circa £60m and linked with various other champions league clubs like Arsenal, and Tielemans hasn't. And it's not because Tielemens is a "better player".
Youri did MUCH better for us in the second half of last season, but re-writing history just because Dougie is leaving just makes you look a bit silly. Now, can Youri step up and fill Dougie's boots this coming season? Quite possibly, and I certainly HOPE he can - but he's not a "better" player today.
Tielemans cost Leicester £40m when he signed 5 years ago, and at times 2 or 3 years ago he was being linked with some big moves like Barcelona and Arsenal. Just because he hasn't been linked with a move this summer, doesn't mean he isn't a top notch player. I haven't seen much in the way of speculation for Martinez or Watkins either.
The only reason Luiz was linked with Juventus pretty much straight away is that we must have made it clear we were were willing to listen to offers. It's telling we were prepared to do that with Luiz and nobody else. Maybe his second half of the season performances convinced Emery we could manage without him?
Youri was available for free last summer, and I'm delighted we got him, but it's not like we were fighting off Champions League sides to get his signature. There is a reason for that.
I'm not saying Youri is a bad player, far from it. I think he's really good, and a valuable part of our side. I just think it's revisionism to pretend that he's better than Dougie - who has at times in the last couple of years has been a truly stand-out player - just because Dougie is going.
I'm also acutely aware that one of our best results last year, in beating Arsenal at the Emirates, was achieved with Youri playing the Dougie role. So I know he's capable of it, but Dougie has done it for a prolonged period of time for us. I'm hoping Youri can, too. I'm also hoping Dougie leaving will eventually be seen as the shrewdest transfer move of the entire summer, but the jury will be out on that for a while.
Post by: chrisw1 on June 27, 2024, 01:08:18 PM
Post by: Clark W Griswold on June 27, 2024, 01:12:07 PM
On the flipside though, because we have Tielemans to come in, selling Doug to sort the FFP/PSR shite out seems like the most obvious one.
Post by: Risso on June 27, 2024, 01:13:32 PM
Post by: Clark W Griswold on June 27, 2024, 01:16:12 PM
Post by: Monty on June 27, 2024, 01:20:13 PM
Post by: Hookeysmith on June 27, 2024, 01:21:04 PM
Maybe he knew he was off, which does make him seem pretty unprofessional if so, but if he'd fancied the move to Italy for a while he might not have wanted to fuck it up with an injury. That is me doing a bit of a Footy impersonation but you never know!
I think also this is quite close to being on the mark. His performances certainly dropped off since Sheff united away and at times his slow play hindered our transition
Post by: Clark W Griswold on June 27, 2024, 01:23:18 PM
Post by: LeeB on June 27, 2024, 01:26:38 PM
Post by: chrisw1 on June 27, 2024, 01:28:24 PM
I think Tielemans has a higher ceiling than Luiz. I was extremely disappointed with Doug for most of the season after Christmas, his form seemed to vary between average and terrible.You've never really fancied Luiz though Risso, so I suspect you're quicker to see his flaws. For me, I thought Luiz was exceptional for the first half of the season and a little bit off it after the Kamara injury, whilst still being one of our most important players.
Post by: Dave on June 27, 2024, 01:45:56 PM
I wonder if he looks at our current options and thinks that while our passing options in midfield are pretty well set, he wants something bigger and nastier in DL's position and we're happy to sacrifice his playmaking for more strength and solidity.
Post by: Mister E on June 27, 2024, 02:32:43 PM
One thing if you look back at the teams that Emery has built rather than inherited is that he does seem to like at least one big, tough midfielder to break up play in the way that none of our current midfielders really do. His Sevilla midfield was three 6ft+ brutes and anything creative that they did was of secondary importance.... and Tielemans is not a nasty brute ...
I wonder if he looks at our current options and thinks that while our passing options in midfield are pretty well set, he wants something bigger and nastier in DL's position and we're happy to sacrifice his playmaking for more strength and solidity.
Post by: Clark W Griswold on June 27, 2024, 02:35:13 PM
Post by: Brazilian Villain on June 27, 2024, 02:39:26 PM
Post by: Clark W Griswold on June 27, 2024, 02:40:59 PM
Post by: Villatillidie25 on June 27, 2024, 02:42:55 PM
Post by: PeterWithesShin on June 27, 2024, 03:06:45 PM
Post by: pablo_picasso on June 27, 2024, 03:37:42 PM
One thing if you look back at the teams that Emery has built rather than inherited is that he does seem to like at least one big, tough midfielder to break up play in the way that none of our current midfielders really do. His Sevilla midfield was three 6ft+ brutes and anything creative that they did was of secondary importance.
I wonder if he looks at our current options and thinks that while our passing options in midfield are pretty well set, he wants something bigger and nastier in DL's position and we're happy to sacrifice his playmaking for more strength and solidity.
Guendouzi could be a decent option.
A bit of an all round player, like Douglas Luiz, but bigger, stronger & quicker.
With Emerys guidance, he could become a perfect replacement, in my humble opinion...
He is also Argentinian so is probably hard wired to stick the boot in where necessary.
After watching a few videos of his, I reckon he will earn quite a few yellows for his "committed" tackling, lol...
Post by: Brazilian Villain on June 27, 2024, 03:42:25 PM
He is also Argentinian so is probably hard wired to stick the boot in where necessary.
After watching a few videos of his, I reckon he will earn quite a few yellows for his "committed" tackling, lol...
I'd prefer if it were for that, rather than kicking the ball away or dissent.
Post by: pablo_picasso on June 27, 2024, 03:55:58 PM
I think it was Romania (?) whose coach was recently complaining about a lack of yellow cards for his players because he saw it as a sign that they were not being aggressive/committed enough.
Post by: Risso on June 27, 2024, 05:18:50 PM
I think Tielemans has a higher ceiling than Luiz. I was extremely disappointed with Doug for most of the season after Christmas, his form seemed to vary between average and terrible.You've never really fancied Luiz though Risso, so I suspect you're quicker to see his flaws. For me, I thought Luiz was exceptional for the first half of the season and a little bit off it after the Kamara injury, whilst still being one of our most important players.
Eh? That's not remotely true, I think he's mostly been a superb player for us. First half of this season he was brilliant and a main factor in us pushing for top spot while we were.
There are times when he goes missing though, and for somebody who started out as a defensive midfielder, he's got absolutely no defensive side to his game, as was shown post injury to Kamara. As I've said numerous times though, I wish we were keeping him, but also understand that if we have to sell a player to balance the books, he's the one to go.
Post by: Ian. on June 27, 2024, 05:47:05 PM
I’m going to miss him and I’m sure everyone involved will.
Post by: VillaTim on June 27, 2024, 07:18:42 PM
I think Tielemans has a higher ceiling than Luiz. I was extremely disappointed with Doug for most of the season after Christmas, his form seemed to vary between average and terrible.I don't think there are any doubts about this. In terms of pedigree, Tielemans is on another level to Luiz.
Post by: PaulWinch again on June 27, 2024, 07:52:12 PM
Post by: Mister E on June 27, 2024, 07:54:10 PM
Post by: john e on June 27, 2024, 08:40:20 PM
I think Tielemans has a higher ceiling than Luiz. I was extremely disappointed with Doug for most of the season after Christmas, his form seemed to vary between average and terrible.I don't think there are any doubts about this. In terms of pedigree, Tielemans is on another level to Luiz.
Yep a lower level
Post by: LeeB on June 27, 2024, 08:40:32 PM
I think Tielemans has a higher ceiling than Luiz. I was extremely disappointed with Doug for most of the season after Christmas, his form seemed to vary between average and terrible.I don't think there are any doubts about this. In terms of pedigree, Tielemans is on another level to Luiz.
I tend to think so but it's very close and completely subjective, so stop going on like it's the most obvious of things you tedious twat.
Post by: pauliewalnuts on June 27, 2024, 08:41:48 PM
I am sure Kamara not being next to him limited him a bit, but his form tailed off markedly the second half of last season.
I would prefer to keep him, but we've been told for a while we'd need to sell a top quality player this summer for PSR, and if that's why he's being sold, they have chosen the right one.
Post by: VillaTim on June 27, 2024, 09:09:25 PM
Thanks for the feedback you odious bellend .I think Tielemans has a higher ceiling than Luiz. I was extremely disappointed with Doug for most of the season after Christmas, his form seemed to vary between average and terrible.I don't think there are any doubts about this. In terms of pedigree, Tielemans is on another level to Luiz.
I tend to think so but it's very close and completely subjective, so stop going on like it's the most obvious of things you tedious twat.
Post by: VillaTim on June 27, 2024, 09:10:51 PM
Post by: Rory on June 27, 2024, 09:13:36 PM
Thanks for the feedback you odious bellend .I think Tielemans has a higher ceiling than Luiz. I was extremely disappointed with Doug for most of the season after Christmas, his form seemed to vary between average and terrible.I don't think there are any doubts about this. In terms of pedigree, Tielemans is on another level to Luiz.
I tend to think so but it's very close and completely subjective, so stop going on like it's the most obvious of things you tedious twat.
I wouldn't talk to LeeB like that if I were you. He has caravans...
(https://i.ibb.co/Tvk9KS6/brad-pitt-leather-hat-snatch-2.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Tvk9KS6)
Post by: N'ZMAV on June 27, 2024, 09:14:25 PM
calm down children :)Thanks for the feedback you odious bellend .I think Tielemans has a higher ceiling than Luiz. I was extremely disappointed with Doug for most of the season after Christmas, his form seemed to vary between average and terrible.I don't think there are any doubts about this. In terms of pedigree, Tielemans is on another level to Luiz.
I tend to think so but it's very close and completely subjective, so stop going on like it's the most obvious of things you tedious twat.
Post by: VillaTim on June 27, 2024, 09:14:54 PM
[ Invalid YouTube link ]Thanks for the feedback you odious bellend .I think Tielemans has a higher ceiling than Luiz. I was extremely disappointed with Doug for most of the season after Christmas, his form seemed to vary between average and terrible.I don't think there are any doubts about this. In terms of pedigree, Tielemans is on another level to Luiz.
I tend to think so but it's very close and completely subjective, so stop going on like it's the most obvious of things you tedious twat.
I wouldn't talk to LeeB like that if I were you. He has caravans...
(https://i.ibb.co/Tvk9KS6/brad-pitt-leather-hat-snatch-2.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Tvk9KS6)
:D ;D
Post by: paul_e on June 27, 2024, 09:25:08 PM
Luiz leaves with our thanks but never reached legend status like Petrov for instance. Another player who was in a different higher pedigree to Luiz.
You've been ridiculous ever since you arrived on the site but this might be the worst thing you've ever posted. If this is your honest opinion and not just another bad attempt at trolling it explains a hell of a lot about why you post the amount of nonsense you do.
Petrov was a good player who did well for us and is a club legend because of a number of things but he's nowhere near the same standard that Luiz has been for us under Emery.
Post by: Brazilian Villain on June 27, 2024, 09:34:12 PM
I wouldn't talk to LeeB like that if I were you. He has caravans...
H&V's own Leo DiCaprio reckons LeeB looks like Brad Pitt. What a pair of lucky bastards!
Post by: VillaTim on June 27, 2024, 09:36:40 PM
In your opinion which isn't relevant to me. I watched Petrov for seasons play superbly not just a 12 month renaissance under a new manager. Luiz is a good player but there is a reason why Emery has sacrificed him. I understand Emery's decision and back it.Luiz leaves with our thanks but never reached legend status like Petrov for instance. Another player who was in a different higher pedigree to Luiz.
You've been ridiculous ever since you arrived on the site but this might be the worst thing you've ever posted. If this is your honest opinion and not just another bad attempt at trolling it explains a hell of a lot about why you post the amount of nonsense you do.
Petrov was a good player who did well for us and is a club legend because of a number of things but he's nowhere near the same standard that Luiz has been for us under Emery.
Post by: Dave on June 27, 2024, 09:38:04 PM
Thanks for the feedback you odious bellend .I think Tielemans has a higher ceiling than Luiz. I was extremely disappointed with Doug for most of the season after Christmas, his form seemed to vary between average and terrible.I don't think there are any doubts about this. In terms of pedigree, Tielemans is on another level to Luiz.
I tend to think so but it's very close and completely subjective, so stop going on like it's the most obvious of things you tedious twat.
Can both of you stop that please.
Post by: Paul.S on June 27, 2024, 09:40:27 PM
We’ll definitely miss him but players come and go and I wish him all the best and thank him for some great memories.
Post by: VillaTim on June 27, 2024, 09:45:32 PM
Post by: paul_e on June 27, 2024, 09:48:52 PM
In your opinion which isn't relevant to me. I watched Petrov for seasons play superbly not just a 12 month renaissance under a new manager. Luiz is a good player but there is a reason why Emery has sacrificed him. I understand Emery's decision and back it.Luiz leaves with our thanks but never reached legend status like Petrov for instance. Another player who was in a different higher pedigree to Luiz.
You've been ridiculous ever since you arrived on the site but this might be the worst thing you've ever posted. If this is your honest opinion and not just another bad attempt at trolling it explains a hell of a lot about why you post the amount of nonsense you do.
Petrov was a good player who did well for us and is a club legend because of a number of things but he's nowhere near the same standard that Luiz has been for us under Emery.
As I said, this sums up why I disagree with almost everything you post, you're clearly looking for something completely different in players.
Post by: VillaTim on June 27, 2024, 09:54:58 PM
As a playmaker the player has to set the tempo, keep the ball moving , have limited errors in dangerous areas, give minimal fouls away in dangerous areas. I've seen the best and worst of Luiz , he's a good player with flaws (too slow at times , gets caught, gives away silly fouls) We played some of our best team football last season when he wasn't playing. Ask yourself why Emery has allowed him to leave .In your opinion which isn't relevant to me. I watched Petrov for seasons play superbly not just a 12 month renaissance under a new manager. Luiz is a good player but there is a reason why Emery has sacrificed him. I understand Emery's decision and back it.Luiz leaves with our thanks but never reached legend status like Petrov for instance. Another player who was in a different higher pedigree to Luiz.
You've been ridiculous ever since you arrived on the site but this might be the worst thing you've ever posted. If this is your honest opinion and not just another bad attempt at trolling it explains a hell of a lot about why you post the amount of nonsense you do.
Petrov was a good player who did well for us and is a club legend because of a number of things but he's nowhere near the same standard that Luiz has been for us under Emery.
As I said, this sums up why I disagree with almost everything you post, you're clearly looking for something completely different in players.
Post by: PaulWinch again on June 27, 2024, 09:58:57 PM
Post by: paul_e on June 27, 2024, 10:11:06 PM
Did we? I can think of one game in the second half of the season that could compete for our “best football” and that’s Arsenal away. All of the other games I can think of came in the first half of the season with Doug playing.
Exactly. Luiz was one of the top 2-3 central midfielders in the league in 2023 and I don't understand why anyone would be so determined to argue against that.
In his best season for us Petrov got 4 goals and 2 assists (I know there's more to the role than that but this is a simple comparison). Luiz had more than that before the end of November and even in his 'bad' half of the season he got 4 goals and 3 assists (one of which was THAT pass against Sheff Utd which is one of the most perfect through balls I've ever seen).
The Tielemans comparison I'm okay with, personally I think Luiz is the more complete player of the 2 but I can see the arguments for both sides.
Post by: pauliewalnuts on June 27, 2024, 10:13:53 PM
Did we? I can think of one game in the second half of the season that could compete for our “best football” and that’s Arsenal away. All of the other games I can think of came in the first half of the season with Doug playing.
Correct.
Post by: PaulWinch again on June 27, 2024, 10:17:21 PM
Post by: john e on June 27, 2024, 10:32:48 PM
It’s to close to call for me
Post by: VillaTim on June 27, 2024, 10:36:35 PM
Post by: Dante Lavelli on June 27, 2024, 10:38:36 PM
The crucial bit to actually improve the team is to buy a Kamara replacement.
Post by: Dante Lavelli on June 27, 2024, 10:38:55 PM
Petrov in his prime is one of the best I've seen , unbelievable player, then Barry came very very close. Tielemans will potentially go into the same bracket.
Please stop.
Post by: Ads on June 27, 2024, 10:40:05 PM
Post by: brontebilly on June 27, 2024, 11:02:15 PM
Petrov had one good game in the position we signed him for, his debut at West Ham, then reinvented himself 12 months later as a deep lying midfielder. Good player, not as good as Barry or Luiz. Missed him hugely after he became ill.
I guess he's comparable to Luiz in that in took them both a good bit of time to settle in. Seem to recall Petrov taking a bit of grief from the crowd for a while. Petrov was a fine player, from memory better in a midfield three with the likes of Barry. Good presence about him. But I think we are forgetting how good of a midfielder Luiz was for us, his playmaking ability was/is elite.
Post by: john e on June 27, 2024, 11:15:47 PM
Post by: LeeB on June 27, 2024, 11:36:24 PM
Barry was the best of the three for me
From the minute he walked into the team at 17. Could play anywhere and was still brilliant when he rest of the team were shite.
Twat in the end though.
Post by: john e on June 27, 2024, 11:51:58 PM
Barry was the best of the three for me
From the minute he walked into the team at 17. Could play anywhere and was still brilliant when he rest of the team were shite.
Twat in the end though.
He’s not the only great player who ended up being a twat in the end
Post by: Rory on June 28, 2024, 12:00:54 AM
Barry was the best of the three for me
Agreed.
Post by: The Edge on June 28, 2024, 12:08:00 AM
Bout rightBarry was the best of the three for me
From the minute he walked into the team at 17. Could play anywhere and was still brilliant when he rest of the team were shite.
Twat in the end though.
Post by: Rory on June 28, 2024, 01:34:27 AM
Post by: Rory on June 28, 2024, 01:35:03 AM
I wouldn't talk to LeeB like that if I were you. He has caravans...
H&V's own Leo DiCaprio reckons LeeB looks like Brad Pitt. What a pair of lucky bastards!
😆
Post by: AV82EC on June 28, 2024, 10:05:59 AM
Barry was the best of the three for me
From the minute he walked into the team at 17. Could play anywhere and was still brilliant when he rest of the team were shite.
Twat in the end though.
Tbf to him judging by what he was witnessing with O’Neills archaic management and coaching and teammates who were happy to do enough for 6th but no more I can’t say I blame him for wanting out.
Post by: LeeB on June 28, 2024, 10:06:29 AM
Barry was the best of the three for me
From the minute he walked into the team at 17. Could play anywhere and was still brilliant when he rest of the team were shite.
Twat in the end though.
Tbf to him judging by what he was witnessing with O’Neills archaic management and coaching and teammates who were happy to do enough for 6th but no more I can’t say I blame him for wanting out.
Yes that's a fair point.
Post by: rob_bridge on June 28, 2024, 10:36:36 AM
Petrov had one good game in the position we signed him for, his debut at West Ham, then reinvented himself 12 months later as a deep lying midfielder. Good player, not as good as Barry or Luiz. Missed him hugely after he became ill.
Agree Petrov was decent but he did play next to Barry and then Milner who both excellent in those seasons.
Post by: chrisw1 on June 28, 2024, 10:42:09 AM
Petrov in his prime is one of the best I've seen , unbelievable player, then Barry came very very close. Tielemans will potentially go into the same bracket.Petrov was decent, no more. I liked the guy a lot, but the truth is his contribution and abilities got massively revised after he became ill.
I'm not sure why I'm engaging, your opinions on players seem so at odds with my own (and clearly a few others), if I didn't know better I'd say it almost feels like you are posting them for effect.
Post by: brontebilly on June 28, 2024, 10:45:34 AM
Prime Luiz or Prime Petrov is a good one
It’s to close to call for me
They are comparable as they had very slow starts to the Villa careers. Didn't Petrov take a fair bit of grief from the fans in his first season? Petrov was very good in a three with likes of Barry but struggled in a two from memory. Solid passer and good presence about him. Not much recovery pace.
I think Luiz was different class really in terms of his playmaking ability, getting the ball off the back and getting us playing up the pitch. Able to score and create goals. He's ahead of Petrov for me.
I think SJM might well have surpassed Gareth Barry last season in that best Villa team of last 25-30 years debate. Two lads well able to use their ass to shield the ball! It's a close call but SJM showed great versatility and quality last season to get us into the CL.
Post by: john e on June 28, 2024, 09:45:21 PM
I was always a massive fan of Gary Parker who I felt was a bit before his time when Mids also had to be physical and imposing, Gary was an artist but was viewed as luxury player back then and probably didn’t work hard enough
But has always been one of my favourites
He’d be running the show for in a Pep team today
Post by: olaftab on June 28, 2024, 09:56:24 PM
Post by: VillaTim on June 28, 2024, 10:27:59 PM
Petrov and Barry played some great football , controlled games set the tempo , scored great goals and also captained and lead the team (Luiz is no captain).
I've enjoyed parts of the Luiz era but i lose no sleep with him going.
Also quite telling that no top Prem teams came in for Luiz .
Post by: PaulWinch again on June 28, 2024, 10:37:47 PM
Post by: VillaTim on June 28, 2024, 10:43:44 PM
Some of the errors of your analysis of Luiz have been pointed out previously Tim, but blimey.Opinions aren't errors Paul . I've watched enough villa games to be comfortable with my opinion and we are selling Luiz and he's off to juventus rather than a top club , why is that ?
Fact also his sale price isn't as astronomical as some were saying . So I'd say all facts considered he is highly overrated by some villa fans , plenty I know aren't in the same camp . Good player yes but let's see what Emery / Monchi have in store now.
Post by: PaulWinch again on June 28, 2024, 10:53:55 PM
My personal opinion is that the level Doug hit in the first 6 months of last season was probably higher than what Barry or Petrov delivered. But I appreciate that’s subjective.
The argument around Unai being willing to let him go though I suspect is heavily influenced by what the player wants to do. Also I don’t know who else was interested, although Arsenal clearly held/hold an interest, but I suspect we’re much keener to sell abroad.
Post by: Ian. on June 28, 2024, 11:23:33 PM
Post by: edgysatsuma89 on June 29, 2024, 01:22:59 AM
Post by: cdbearsfan on June 29, 2024, 01:27:27 AM
Post by: Rory on June 29, 2024, 01:30:51 AM
Does anyone know any famous Tim's they like? I immediately think of Lovejoy, who I believe may be the most deplorable person in the world. Westwood? Prick. Allen? Not a fan. I guess there's Robbins, Roth and Curry, but I don't know much about them.
I thought I agreed with you, but then I looked up 'famous Timothys' and can add McInnerny, Dalton, Spall, and Pigott-Smith. Added to Robbins, Roth and Curry, that's a decent number.
Post by: eamonn on June 29, 2024, 01:49:25 AM
Post by: edgysatsuma89 on June 29, 2024, 02:07:01 AM
Does anyone know any famous Tim's they like? I immediately think of Lovejoy, who I believe may be the most deplorable person in the world. Westwood? Prick. Allen? Not a fan. I guess there's Robbins, Roth and Curry, but I don't know much about them.
I thought I agreed with you, but then I looked up 'famous Timothys' and can add McInnerny, Dalton, Spall, and Pigott-Smith. Added to Robbins, Roth and Curry, that's a decent number.
I'm pretty ashamed at myself for forgetting about Spall and McInnerny in particular. It's actually pretty healthy. I still think they should all be sacrificed if it means Lovejoy gets immediately sent to hell for eternity.
Post by: Rory on June 29, 2024, 02:17:07 AM
Does anyone know any famous Tim's they like? I immediately think of Lovejoy, who I believe may be the most deplorable person in the world. Westwood? Prick. Allen? Not a fan. I guess there's Robbins, Roth and Curry, but I don't know much about them.
I thought I agreed with you, but then I looked up 'famous Timothys' and can add McInnerny, Dalton, Spall, and Pigott-Smith. Added to Robbins, Roth and Curry, that's a decent number.
I'm pretty ashamed at myself for forgetting about Spall and McInnerny in particular. It's actually pretty healthy. I still think they should all be sacrificed if it means Lovejoy gets immediately sent to hell for eternity.
I don't necessarily disagree.
Post by: Martin Carruthers on June 29, 2024, 07:39:16 AM
Post by: AV84 on June 29, 2024, 08:10:20 AM
Post by: Dave on June 29, 2024, 08:10:54 AM
Post by: dave shelley on June 29, 2024, 08:45:58 AM
Post by: Drummond on June 29, 2024, 08:53:11 AM
Post by: Percy McCarthy on June 29, 2024, 09:02:48 AM
Post by: Martin Carruthers on June 29, 2024, 09:06:10 AM
Post by: Smithy on June 29, 2024, 09:37:11 AM
Some of the errors of your analysis of Luiz have been pointed out previously Tim, but blimey.Opinions aren't errors Paul . I've watched enough villa games to be comfortable with my opinion and we are selling Luiz and he's off to juventus rather than a top club , why is that ?
Fact also his sale price isn't as astronomical as some were saying . So I'd say all facts considered he is highly overrated by some villa fans , plenty I know aren't in the same camp . Good player yes but let's see what Emery / Monchi have in store now.
Juventus aren't a "top club"? Just to be clear, you know he's going to the Italian Juventus, not the second division Brazlian club, right? The Italian one that's won 7 league titles, 11 domestic cup competitions, and been in two Champions League finals in the last 10 years ALONE?
THAT Juventus?
No club on the planet will ever be a 'step up' from Aston Villa, but to consider Juventus as anything other than a 'top club' is utterly bizarre.
Post by: LeeB on June 29, 2024, 09:45:46 AM
Some of the errors of your analysis of Luiz have been pointed out previously Tim, but blimey.Opinions aren't errors Paul . I've watched enough villa games to be comfortable with my opinion and we are selling Luiz and he's off to juventus rather than a top club , why is that ?
Fact also his sale price isn't as astronomical as some were saying . So I'd say all facts considered he is highly overrated by some villa fans , plenty I know aren't in the same camp . Good player yes but let's see what Emery / Monchi have in store now.
Juventus aren't a "top club"? Just to be clear, you know he's going to the Italian Juventus, not the second division Brazlian club, right? The Italian one that's won 7 league titles, 11 domestic cup competitions, and been in two Champions League finals in the last 10 years ALONE?
THAT Juventus?
No club on the planet will ever be a 'step up' from Aston Villa, but to consider Juventus as anything other than a 'top club' is utterly bizarre.
It's called posting for effect, I believe.
Post by: Dave on June 29, 2024, 10:41:35 AM
Rice?
Didn't he turn out to be a massive Brexit whopper?
Post by: Smithy on June 29, 2024, 10:43:46 AM
Some of the errors of your analysis of Luiz have been pointed out previously Tim, but blimey.Opinions aren't errors Paul . I've watched enough villa games to be comfortable with my opinion and we are selling Luiz and he's off to juventus rather than a top club , why is that ?
Fact also his sale price isn't as astronomical as some were saying . So I'd say all facts considered he is highly overrated by some villa fans , plenty I know aren't in the same camp . Good player yes but let's see what Emery / Monchi have in store now.
Juventus aren't a "top club"? Just to be clear, you know he's going to the Italian Juventus, not the second division Brazlian club, right? The Italian one that's won 7 league titles, 11 domestic cup competitions, and been in two Champions League finals in the last 10 years ALONE?
THAT Juventus?
No club on the planet will ever be a 'step up' from Aston Villa, but to consider Juventus as anything other than a 'top club' is utterly bizarre.
It's called posting for effect, I believe.
Oh. He's one of those. I hadn't realised. Apologies.
Post by: Ian. on June 29, 2024, 10:49:46 AM
Post by: Tony Daleys Shorts on June 29, 2024, 11:44:47 AM
Post by: Drummond on June 29, 2024, 11:45:37 AM
Post by: The Edge on June 29, 2024, 11:48:30 AM
Tim Munton - my favourite Timothy.Tim Minchin is mine.
Post by: Drummond on June 29, 2024, 11:53:01 AM
Post by: Brazilian Villain on June 29, 2024, 12:21:49 PM
Does anyone know any famous Tim's they like? I immediately think of Lovejoy, who I believe may be the most deplorable person in the world. Westwood? Prick. Allen? Not a fan. I guess there's Robbins, Roth and Curry, but I don't know much about them.
How could you forget Berners-Lee, without whom you'd never have encountered Tim's pearls of wisdom?
Post by: eamonn on June 29, 2024, 12:40:39 PM
Post by: edgysatsuma89 on June 29, 2024, 03:20:52 PM
Tim Munton - my favourite Timothy.Tim Minchin is mine.
How did I miss Minchin! "Inflatable, insatiable yooou.."
Post by: Steve67 on June 29, 2024, 04:17:28 PM
Post by: AV84 on June 29, 2024, 04:56:55 PM
Post by: Dogtanian on June 29, 2024, 05:02:29 PM
Post by: Brazilian Villain on June 29, 2024, 05:14:14 PM
Language Timothy?
Mostly English, but it can hard to tell at times.
Post by: Louzie0 on June 29, 2024, 05:24:34 PM
Post by: charlatan on June 29, 2024, 05:36:34 PM
Rice?
Didn't he turn out to be a massive Brexit whopper?
My sixth form economics teacher was called Tim and Twitter suggests he isn't over it yet either
Post by: Dogtanian on June 29, 2024, 05:39:11 PM
Post by: Brazilian Villain on June 29, 2024, 06:12:33 PM
My sixth form economics teacher was called Tim and Twitter suggests he isn't over it yet either
Being called Tim, or teaching you? ;)
Post by: Brazilian Villain on June 30, 2024, 12:18:40 AM
I think SJM might well have surpassed Gareth Barry last season in that best Villa team of last 25-30 years debate. Two lads well able to use their ass to shield the ball! It's a close call but SJM showed great versatility and quality last season to get us into the CL.
Interesting to hear Richards talk about Barry on the MOTD Golden Boot episode. Reckoned Barry liked the bevvy and was last to leave the bar,, but first into training without it affecting him.
Post by: Pat McMahon on June 30, 2024, 12:37:02 AM
I think SJM might well have surpassed Gareth Barry last season in that best Villa team of last 25-30 years debate. Two lads well able to use their ass to shield the ball! It's a close call but SJM showed great versatility and quality last season to get us into the CL.
Interesting to hear Richards talk about Barry on the MOTD Golden Boot episode. Reckoned Barry liked the bevvy and was last to leave the bar,, but first into training without it affecting him.
Apparently that was a factor in Fergie keeping Robson of the three boozers, alongside McGrath and Whiteside. His ability to sink prodigious amounts of beer and still be at the front in all training exercises the following day was legendary - amongst those that give a shit about Manyoo.
Robson used to run a pub team in West Bromwich, the Four in Hand IIRC, and was well known for his drinking ability in there.
Post by: Rory on June 30, 2024, 12:54:43 AM
I think SJM might well have surpassed Gareth Barry last season in that best Villa team of last 25-30 years debate. Two lads well able to use their ass to shield the ball! It's a close call but SJM showed great versatility and quality last season to get us into the CL.
Interesting to hear Richards talk about Barry on the MOTD Golden Boot episode. Reckoned Barry liked the bevvy and was last to leave the bar,, but first into training without it affecting him.
I've known a few women who claim to have been acquainted with Barry on nights out. They have all said that he did indeed drink a lot but was a gentleman with it; never got loutish or out of control, and was always respectful towards female company.
Post by: aldridgeboy on June 30, 2024, 12:58:22 AM
Post by: AGRIPPA on June 30, 2024, 11:21:10 PM
I think SJM might well have surpassed Gareth Barry last season in that best Villa team of last 25-30 years debate. Two lads well able to use their ass to shield the ball! It's a close call but SJM showed great versatility and quality last season to get us into the CL.
Interesting to hear Richards talk about Barry on the MOTD Golden Boot episode. Reckoned Barry liked the bevvy and was last to leave the bar,, but first into training without it affecting him.
Apparently that was a factor in Fergie keeping Robson of the three boozers, alongside McGrath and Whiteside. His ability to sink prodigious amounts of beer and still be at the front in all training exercises the following day was legendary - amongst those that give a shit about Manyoo.
Robson used to run a pub team in West Bromwich, the Four in Hand IIRC, and was well known for his drinking ability in there.
Met a former Albion player who played under him and said that no one would ever touch him for drinking capacity…but what really got me was…with every take he told he said…” with no drugs”…..leaving me to think that they must have been pretty rife….
Post by: eamonn on July 01, 2024, 12:52:35 AM
Both Barry and Grealish are amongst the highest spenders at Bushwackers Birmingham after party on a Saturday night.
What about our Lee ?
Post by: Villafirst on July 01, 2024, 06:09:34 AM
Post by: Dogtanian on July 01, 2024, 06:56:46 AM
Will Barkley finally be announced today ? Seems ages since this story first surfaced......
Twas the same with Tielemans last year.
Post by: OCD on July 01, 2024, 10:40:52 AM
Post by: Brazilian Villain on July 01, 2024, 12:28:38 PM
Will Barkley finally be announced today ? Seems ages since this story first surfaced......
Over the weekend, I heard rumours of a triple unveiling today. Two announced this morning, so we'll have to wait and see.
Post by: Percy McCarthy on July 01, 2024, 12:36:46 PM
Tielemans was announced on the 10th of June.
You sure?
https://x.com/villatil1die/status/1807662923382218865?s=46&t=GdM6cpVxe5IloByNCRheWA
Post by: LeeB on July 01, 2024, 12:40:44 PM
Tielemans was announced on the 10th of June.
You sure?
https://x.com/villatil1die/status/1807662923382218865?s=46&t=GdM6cpVxe5IloByNCRheWA
I was in the 'Dam when I got that news which was when OCD says.
Post by: Dave on July 01, 2024, 12:40:44 PM
Tielemans was announced on the 10th of June.
You sure?
https://x.com/villatil1die/status/1807662923382218865?s=46&t=GdM6cpVxe5IloByNCRheWA
Quote
Youri Tielemans: Aston Villa agree deal to sign Leicester City midfielder
10 June 2023
Aston Villa have agreed a deal to sign Leicester midfielder Youri Tielemans.
The Belgium international, 26, will join the club on 1 July, after his Leicester contract expires.
BBC (https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/65868644)
Post by: Percy McCarthy on July 01, 2024, 12:49:33 PM
Tielemans was announced on the 10th of June.
You sure?
https://x.com/villatil1die/status/1807662923382218865?s=46&t=GdM6cpVxe5IloByNCRheWAQuoteYouri Tielemans: Aston Villa agree deal to sign Leicester City midfielder
10 June 2023
Aston Villa have agreed a deal to sign Leicester midfielder Youri Tielemans.
The Belgium international, 26, will join the club on 1 July, after his Leicester contract expires.
BBC (https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/65868644)
Ah okay, so he signed on July 1st then. Glad that’s been cleared up.
Post by: Dave on July 01, 2024, 12:50:54 PM
Tielemans was announced on the 10th of June.
You sure?
https://x.com/villatil1die/status/1807662923382218865?s=46&t=GdM6cpVxe5IloByNCRheWAQuoteYouri Tielemans: Aston Villa agree deal to sign Leicester City midfielder
10 June 2023
Aston Villa have agreed a deal to sign Leicester midfielder Youri Tielemans.
The Belgium international, 26, will join the club on 1 July, after his Leicester contract expires.
BBC (https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/65868644)
Ah okay, so he signed on July 1st then. Glad that’s been cleared up.
Yes, so not the same as Barkley - as we've not had anything like the "10th June for Tielemans" thing for Barkley.
Post by: OCD on July 01, 2024, 12:55:22 PM
Post by: VillaTim on July 01, 2024, 01:03:04 PM
Tielemans contract ran until 30th June 2023 whereas Barkley's contract didn't expire yesterday.Hmmm. The plot thickens.
Post by: Risso on July 01, 2024, 01:04:18 PM
Post by: Olneythelonely on July 01, 2024, 01:35:21 PM
Hmmm. The plot thickens.
*Matt Le Tissier - “Makes you think” picture*
Post by: john e on July 01, 2024, 03:58:43 PM
Villatimbo will be in proper Nigel Farage ‘your not laughing now’ mode
Post by: Toronto Villa on July 01, 2024, 04:02:55 PM
https://x.com/avfcofficial/status/1807791406624170151?s=46
Post by: jwarry on July 01, 2024, 04:03:16 PM
Post by: Toronto Villa on July 01, 2024, 04:03:45 PM
Tielemans contract ran until 30th June 2023 whereas Barkley's contract didn't expire yesterday.Hmmm. The plot thickens.
How’s it going on that hill you decided to die on?
Post by: Tuscans on July 01, 2024, 04:06:17 PM
Didn't fancy the training gear so went Fruit of the Loom.
Post by: PeterWithesShin on July 01, 2024, 04:06:49 PM
Post by: Monty on July 01, 2024, 04:07:19 PM
Welcome back Ross, be the good bits of last time, don't be the bad bits, that's my advice.
Post by: London Villan on July 01, 2024, 04:08:17 PM
Post by: algy on July 01, 2024, 04:10:17 PM
Welcome back Ross, hopefully you replicate your form for Everton last season.I'd rather he replicate his Luton form tbh
Post by: Toronto Villa on July 01, 2024, 04:11:08 PM
Welcome back Ross, hopefully you replicate your form for Everton last season.I'd rather he replicate his Luton form tbh
Oh dear…
Post by: LeeB on July 01, 2024, 04:11:33 PM
Busy day in HR today - lots of induction videos showing how not to lift boxes in warehouses...
Just picturing Ross sat bored in the security portacabin because nobody had told him he needed PPE.
Post by: cdbearsfan on July 01, 2024, 04:11:40 PM
Welcome back Ross (don't bother reading the previous paragraph).
Post by: VillaTim on July 01, 2024, 04:15:03 PM
How long is the contract .
Either way, Good Luck Ross. Prove the critics wrong.
Post by: edgysatsuma89 on July 01, 2024, 04:15:25 PM
Post by: London Villan on July 01, 2024, 04:16:50 PM
Post by: Brazilian Villain on July 01, 2024, 04:18:14 PM
Welcome back Ross, hopefully you replicate your form for Everton last season.
I'd rather he replicate his Luton form tbh
Oh dear…
Yeah, I'm afraid the normally astute algy has dropped a ricket there.
Post by: paul_e on July 01, 2024, 04:20:16 PM
Post by: not3bad on July 01, 2024, 04:20:39 PM
As long as he doesn't get the arse again if he's subbed/not first choice. He's going to find Champions League Aston Villa are an extremely different proposition to relegated Luton.
Absolutely his attitude will be critical here. All the best and welcome back Ross.
Post by: Tuscans on July 01, 2024, 04:20:55 PM
Lucky boy must be pinching himself.3
How long is the contract .
Either way, Good Luck Ross. Prove the critics wrong.
Post by: OCD on July 01, 2024, 04:21:08 PM
Post by: DB on July 01, 2024, 04:21:31 PM
Lucky boy must be pinching himself.
How long is the contract .
Either way, Good Luck Ross. Prove the critics wrong.
What critics?
Post by: LeeB on July 01, 2024, 04:22:01 PM
Lucky boy must be pinching himself.
How long is the contract .
Either way, Good Luck Ross. Prove the critics wrong.
What critics?
Basically him.
Post by: Toronto Villa on July 01, 2024, 04:22:32 PM
No doubt he'll rotate with Teilemans and will start 20 or so games
You’ve had a spelling nightmare there LV
Post by: DB on July 01, 2024, 04:22:55 PM
Lucky boy must be pinching himself.
How long is the contract .
Either way, Good Luck Ross. Prove the critics wrong.
What critics?
Basically him.
Yep.
Post by: algy on July 01, 2024, 04:23:13 PM
Welcome back Ross, hopefully you replicate your form for Everton last season.
I'd rather he replicate his Luton form tbh
Oh dear…
Yeah, I'm afraid the normally astute algy has dropped a ricket there.
So long as he realises he's not going to be an automatic starter and he buckles down instead of sulking he'll be fine, it's really up to him.
I'll try not to sulk, and accept that I might need a period in the H&V stiffs to get back up to speed.
Post by: DrGonzo on July 01, 2024, 04:23:37 PM
Welcome back Ross.
Post by: Drummond on July 01, 2024, 04:24:10 PM
So long as he realises he's not going to be an automatic starter and he buckles down instead of sulking he'll be fine, it's really up to him.
But harsh on algy that.
*ah balls, he beat me to it. Looks like I may be on the bench
Post by: LeeB on July 01, 2024, 04:25:29 PM
So long as he realises he's not going to be an automatic starter and he buckles down instead of sulking he'll be fine, it's really up to him.
But harsh on algy that.
Look, he's always had the talent, we know that, but does he have the discipline?
Barkley on the other hand looks a good deal.
Post by: Brazilian Villain on July 01, 2024, 04:28:43 PM
So long as he realises he's not going to be an automatic starter and he buckles down instead of sulking he'll be fine, it's really up to him.
But harsh on algy that.
Look, he's always had the talent, we know that, but does he have the discipline?
A season long loan to the Wrexham forum is probably the best for all concerned.
Post by: Tuscans on July 01, 2024, 04:31:01 PM
New training gear
Post by: Toronto Villa on July 01, 2024, 04:47:09 PM
Post by: pablo_picasso on July 01, 2024, 04:52:52 PM
I just hope that he realises what a fucking privilege it is to play football for a living & I hope that he carries his Luton form over to Villa next season.
I also hope that he proves me wrong & earns my trust over the course of the season.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GRaXR4aaYAAtqNp?format=jpg&name=900x900)
New training gear
I like that..
Post by: Ian. on July 01, 2024, 04:57:11 PM
Well, a few weeks ago I hadn't. Welcome again Ross.
Post by: PaulWinch again on July 01, 2024, 05:09:52 PM
Post by: Tony Daleys Shorts on July 01, 2024, 05:10:59 PM
Post by: VillaTim on July 01, 2024, 05:12:10 PM
Axel Tuanzebe
Andy Gray
James Milner
Post by: PeterWithe on July 01, 2024, 05:20:34 PM
Did we buy Milner twice, didn't we turn his loan into a permanent deal?
Post by: AV84 on July 01, 2024, 05:24:36 PM
Post by: Tony Daleys Shorts on July 01, 2024, 05:29:23 PM
Post by: PeterWithesShin on July 01, 2024, 05:29:57 PM
Post by: cdbearsfan on July 01, 2024, 05:37:09 PM
Sid Cowans.
Did we buy Milner twice, didn't we turn his loan into a permanent deal?
Two separate spells. Loan under DOL, signed two years later under MON.
Post by: cdbearsfan on July 01, 2024, 05:40:02 PM
Post by: olaftab on July 01, 2024, 05:40:15 PM
I think this is a tremendous deal personally. He was superb for Luton last season.Yes....for Luton where it's not that difficult to shine in their very basic midfield.
Post by: WarszaVillan on July 01, 2024, 05:42:34 PM
Sid Cowans.
Did we buy Milner twice, didn't we turn his loan into a permanent deal?
Sid had three spells with us.
Steve Hunt and Andy Blair - we signed them the second time around at the same time as I remember.
Post by: Clark W Griswold on July 01, 2024, 06:29:44 PM
I’m judging by that fucking grin it’s quite long.
Post by: DrGonzo on July 01, 2024, 06:33:41 PM
Post by: Villafirst on July 01, 2024, 06:52:30 PM
Post by: coreyfeldman on July 01, 2024, 07:18:22 PM
How long is the contract?
I’m judging by that fucking grin it’s quite long.
3 I believe
Post by: PaulWinch again on July 01, 2024, 07:19:40 PM
How long is the contract?
I’m judging by that fucking grin it’s quite long.
Going into this with a positive attitude?
Post by: pauliewalnuts on July 01, 2024, 07:20:46 PM
How long is the contract?
I’m judging by that fucking grin it’s quite long.
Going into this with a positive attitude?
Trying always to raise his levels.
Post by: VillaTim on July 01, 2024, 07:27:53 PM
How long is the contract?Hopefully it's an incentive based deal.
I’m judging by that fucking grin it’s quite long.
Post by: Smithy on July 01, 2024, 07:31:07 PM
I think this is a tremendous deal personally. He was superb for Luton last season.Yes....for Luton where it's not that difficult to shine in their very basic midfield.
It's actually pretty difficult to shine in a premier league midfield when you're surrounded by sub-standard players, and regularly playing against top teams full of internationals. You're starved of possession, and when you get it, your options are always limited. Not easy, at all. And he still looked pretty good for most of the season.
There is no doubting his natural ability, we saw it in spurts three years ago. If he's got his head right, and is 100% committed to being the best footballer he can be for the remaining few years he has at the top of the game, then we've got ourselves a great player.
Post by: Mellin on July 01, 2024, 07:32:48 PM
I think we technically had Peter Withe on our books as a player twice.
Did we? I don't know about that. Before or after he made us CHAMPIONS OF EUROPE?
Post by: pauliewalnuts on July 01, 2024, 07:36:26 PM
Adds tons to the squad, a different sort of option, in a season in which we will be playing a huge amount of football. At least 8 CL matches, 38 league games, a couple of LC matches plus however many matches you have to play to WIN THE FA CUP.
Post by: cdbearsfan on July 01, 2024, 07:38:08 PM
Post by: Clark W Griswold on July 01, 2024, 07:39:34 PM
How long is the contract?
I’m judging by that fucking grin it’s quite long.
Going into this with a positive attitude?
Sure
I’m genuinely ecstatic….
Post by: LeeB on July 01, 2024, 07:45:45 PM
How long is the contract?
I’m judging by that fucking grin it’s quite long.
Going into this with a positive attitude?
Sure
I’m genuinely ecstatic….
Mate, you're going to have so much fun you'll be whistling Zippedy Do Dah out of your arsehole.
Post by: Mellin on July 01, 2024, 07:46:58 PM
Way after, was when Venglos was in charge. Withe was a coach but signed as a player just in case. Made one appearance for the reserves (thanks Wikipedia).
Of course. Could've made an educated guess there (or googled it)! Cheers.
Post by: Villa Lew on July 01, 2024, 07:51:35 PM
Post by: Olneythelonely on July 01, 2024, 07:52:25 PM
Nick Owen has said he's gutted he's leaving, but did wish him all the best and said it was a great move for him, thank you Nick.
Said he was the best player he’d seen play for Luton too. That might not be saying much.
Post by: LeeB on July 01, 2024, 07:53:36 PM
Post by: Villa in Denmark on July 01, 2024, 07:55:23 PM
Ricky Hill, Mark Stein, Mick Harford, your boys took one hell of a put down.Nick Owen has said he's gutted he's leaving, but did wish him all the best and said it was a great move for him, thank you Nick.
Said he was the best player he’d seen play for Luton too. That might not be saying much.
Post by: Brazilian Villain on July 01, 2024, 07:56:18 PM
To be fair, Nick Owen was a Luton fan when they were a decent side with some very good players.
Yeah, he'd definitely be old enough to remember Mick Harford.
Post by: Clark W Griswold on July 01, 2024, 07:58:05 PM
How long is the contract?
I’m judging by that fucking grin it’s quite long.
Going into this with a positive attitude?
Sure
I’m genuinely ecstatic….
Mate, you're going to have so much fun you'll be whistling Zippedy Do Dah out of your arsehole.
:-)
It feels like we should be getting the Antarctic blue super sports wagon with the optional rally fun pack and have ended up with the Wagon Queen Family truckster!
Post by: PeterWithesShin on July 01, 2024, 07:58:10 PM
Post by: Clark W Griswold on July 01, 2024, 08:01:06 PM
Post by: Pete3206 on July 01, 2024, 08:03:22 PM
Post by: VillaTim on July 01, 2024, 08:05:49 PM
To be fair, Nick Owen was a Luton fan when they were a decent side with some very good players.Shame about the manager and his extra curricular shenanigans
Post by: Tony Daleys Shorts on July 01, 2024, 08:16:58 PM
I think this is a tremendous deal personally. He was superb for Luton last season.Yes....for Luton where it's not that difficult to shine in their very basic midfield.
It's actually pretty difficult to shine in a premier league midfield when you're surrounded by sub-standard players, and regularly playing against top teams full of internationals. You're starved of possession, and when you get it, your options are always limited. Not easy, at all. And he still looked pretty good for most of the season.
There is no doubting his natural ability, we saw it in spurts three years ago. If he's got his head right, and is 100% committed to being the best footballer he can be for the remaining few years he has at the top of the game, then we've got ourselves a great player.
Precisely, I don’t recall any other midfielder player in the lower reaches of the league showing anything like the class he did.
Post by: jwarry on July 01, 2024, 09:53:56 PM
Watching this it seems pretty obvious what has held him back from being the superstar that his ability deserves ……
Post by: Goldenballs on July 01, 2024, 10:01:31 PM
That aside, welcome back. Please try.
Post by: VillaTim on July 01, 2024, 10:08:23 PM
If he gets his head in place and stays injury free we are quids in. It's 2 big ifs though. Fingers crossed.
Post by: kippaxvilla2 on July 01, 2024, 10:12:55 PM
Way after, was when Venglos was in charge. Withe was a coach but signed as a player just in case. Made one appearance for the reserves (thanks Wikipedia).
And was famously appointed when Dr Jo read about him in a book.
Post by: Small Rodent on July 01, 2024, 11:41:28 PM
Post by: Randy Gurner on July 01, 2024, 11:54:58 PM
Post by: Dogtanian on July 02, 2024, 10:39:58 AM
https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/5539127/2024/07/02/aston-villa-are-getting-ross-barkley-2-0-and-it-looks-like-smart-business/ (https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/5539127/2024/07/02/aston-villa-are-getting-ross-barkley-2-0-and-it-looks-like-smart-business/)
"...when Emery wants someone, Villa’s footballing department does whatever it can to comply with his wishes."
Post by: Risso on July 02, 2024, 11:01:36 AM
Post by: PeterWithesShin on July 02, 2024, 11:08:48 AM
Post by: Border villan on July 02, 2024, 11:28:36 AM
Piece in the Athletic about our signing Barkley;
https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/5539127/2024/07/02/aston-villa-are-getting-ross-barkley-2-0-and-it-looks-like-smart-business/ (https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/5539127/2024/07/02/aston-villa-are-getting-ross-barkley-2-0-and-it-looks-like-smart-business/)
"...when Emery wants someone, Villa’s footballing department does whatever it can to comply with his wishes."
Behind a pay wall, can anyone oblige?
Post by: Toronto Villa on July 02, 2024, 11:42:55 AM
Jacob Tanswell
Last October, Matty Cash was standing outside the home changing rooms at Villa Park, just after visitors Luton Town had been beaten 3-1, when he shared an anecdote which – in hindsight – seems more significant now.
“Ross Barkley said to me, ‘How many set pieces have you always got?!’” Cash said.
Luton midfielder Barkley was impressed and surprised by Aston Villa’s attention to detail. Things had changed since he had played for the club on loan from Chelsea three seasons earlier, when they were an improving, albeit mid-table, Premier League side. To accentuate the contrast, Barkley’s year in claret and blue was played in front of empty stands due to rules against crowds gathering related to the Covid-19 pandemic.
That post-game conversation with Cash spoke of how the now 30-year-old had maintained close bonds with former team-mates. He became good friends with many in that Villa squad, including Jack Grealish.
Now, Barkley is returning permanently.
He joins after a season with Luton, where the manager, Rob Edwards, had reinvigorated his career to the point that Villa counterpart Unai Emery became a major admirer. And when Emery wants someone, Villa’s footballing department does whatever it can to comply with his wishes. His belief in Barkley, and the fact central midfield was a priority position this summer, meant Villa had little doubt in exercising the £5million ($6.4m) buy-out clause in the former England international’s contract.
Unlike in that first stint, Barkley is now a player going back up the football mountain. He had been on a gradual downward slide during that loan spell, with Chelsea only too willing to get him off their books for 12 months.
A promising start soon faded in a forgettable season, which included the third notable hamstring injury of his career and an inability to bear the weight of creative responsibility for the team he was asked to shoulder at the end of that season after Grealish was ruled out with his own fitness issues.
Any hopes of a permanent move were scuppered when Barkley only scored once after returning from that hamstring problem in the January and failed to register an assist in his final 14 appearances for Villa. Dean Smith, the manager at the time, left him on the bench for two of the last three games, while the other was against his parent club so he was not allowed to play.
Crucially, all parties feel Barkley is a different player, and person, now.
This is a player in the second iteration of his career and given his vast experience — he played in all three of England’s games at the World Cup in Brazil a decade ago — believe he is at his most assured and settled.
Barkley’s trajectory has been rocky. His emergence as a teenager at Everton saw him compared to fellow Goodison prodigy Wayne Rooney — perhaps inevitably given his physique, local roots and prodigious reputation — but he struggled with fitness and consistency. A move to Chelsea in January 2018 was misplaced and while every incoming coach at Stamford Bridge injected fleeting confidence in Barkley, it soon evaporated.
He appeared a player, going into his mid-to-late twenties, toiling to get back to where he once was and coaches were unsure of his best position. Regular managerial changes brought different systems and instructions and meant constant resetting.
In his loan spell at Villa, Barkley predominantly played in the left half-pocket. He had played to the left of a midfield trio in a 4-3-3 under Maurizio Sarri at Chelsea and, considering Grealish played slightly wider, Smith had confidence a partnership could be forged there.
Barkley flew through England’s various youth levels and made his senior debut at 19. He has won another 32 caps since, but his most recent one came over four years ago.
His renaissance at Luton last season, however, saw him re-enter the conversation around the national team, even if he fell short of a place in the provisional squad for Euro 2024.
He found a home, and a manager in Edwards who installed confidence and clarity, rediscovering his distinctive skill set. His year at Luton proved, personally, an unmitigated success — even if it was ultimately tinged with the regret of their relegation after a first season among the domestic elite since the early 1990s.
A more mature Barkley learned to enjoy football again, after four and a half unfulfilling years at Chelsea and a lukewarm 2022-23 season with Nice in France’s top flight.
Just 10 months ago, and with the start of a new Premier League season just two days away, Barkley remained a free agent. It showed how far his stock had fallen. But he ended up elevating Luton, and they him.
His lack of a proper pre-season meant Barkley had to build up his fitness as he went, but he managed 37 appearances across all competitions, starting in all but three of them, and the third-most league minutes of any Luton outfield player (2,618). In doing so, he demonstrated a durability that was felt to have been missing throughout his career — largely through no fault of his own.
Contrary to perception, however, Barkley has shown a good availability rate.
Despite being limited to 14 Chelsea appearances in 2021-22, he has played an average of 30 games across the past six seasons and has not suffered a serious injury since leaving Villa. This is significant, given he sustained those three separate hamstring injuries in as many years between 2018 and 2021, ruling him out for 249 days in total.
Barkley owes the start of his second career phase to Edwards, transitioning from a drifting No 10 into a more measured and deeper midfield presence. A player who turned 30 in December operated in a withdrawn double-pivot for Luton, inheriting greater responsibility and requiring him to start attacks and be combative out of possession.
He fits Villa’s criteria by playing in a midfield pair, which has a similar remit to that demanded by Emery.
Barkley contributed five goals and four assists in the league last season, and led Luton in several in-possession metrics, including passes completed, carries and passes received. Even in a side who averaged just 41.6 per cent possession, he was Luton’s metronome and line-breaker.
His verticality with the ball chimed with Edwards’ desire to apply direct pressure to the opposition back line. Across Europe’s top five domestic leagues, Barkley ranked in the 69th percentile (only 31 per cent were better) of midfielders for carries into the final third at 1.68 per 90 minutes.
Within Luton’s 3-5-2 shape, which principally attacked through high wing-backs, Barkley’s passing range was used expertly.
A common pattern of play was a switch to the opposite flank, with Barkley striking an effective understanding with left wing-back Alfie Doughty. Barkley ranked in the 93rd percentile of midfielders from Europe’s top five leagues for switches of play per 90 (0.83).
Barkley will offer Villa a more expansive and varied passing range than his midfield peers — particularly with Douglas Luiz departing for Juventus — and augment Emery’s desire to transition quickly from deep areas.
Sharing the set-piece duties, Barkley (11) and Doughty (16) created Luton’s most goal-creating actions last season. Barkley ranked in the top 21 per cent of midfielders in Europe’s biggest five domestic leagues for key passes per 90 (1.51) and top 16 per cent for shot-creating actions (3.58 per 90).
Edwards aimed to push teams back through Barkley’s switches of play and Doughty’s crossing, in turn creating space on the edge of the opposition box for Luton shots. Last season, only three per cent of midfielders in the big five leagues took more shots than Barkley (2.27 per 90) with just seven per cent putting more on target (0.65 per 90).
A drawback to Barkley’s risk-taking licence was his profligacy in possession, standing in the bottom three per cent of midfielders dispossessed across those same five divisions. Relatively speaking though, his role drew parallels with the balancing act Bruno Fernandes performs for Manchester United. Given they are their team’s creative hub, losing the ball is generally accepted.
Barkley’s athleticism means he can cover the width of the pitch in a midfield pairing, able to defend spaces on transition — he made an average of 6.91 ball recoveries per game last season (88th percentile) — and can support his closest full-back when offering defensive cover.
Versatility will be an important factor at Villa next season, with Barkley still capable of playing in more advanced areas against certain stylistic match-ups.
Against high-pressing teams who leave space on transition, he could be deployed further forward, leaning on his ball-carrying and take-on ability. Remarkably, he ranked in the top one per cent of midfielders in Europe’s big five leagues for dribbling past defenders.
Without the ball, Barkley is an anomaly; one that can be explained by Luton’s deep defensive set-up. This contributed to his low numbers for tackles made (0.65 per 90; fifth percentile). Regardless, he still had the fifth-most tackles (47) and joint-fourth most interceptions (25) in Edwards’ squad.
Curiously, despite being in or just above the bottom quarter among midfielders in Europe’s biggest five leagues for tackles in the defensive and middle thirds, when Luton did press high with midfielders locking onto opponents in advanced areas, Barkley was among the top 22 per cent for them in the final third.
Now more measured and mature than he was during that loan spell, Barkley returns to Villa as a different player and a cost-effective, all-round midfielder who adds to Emery’s options.
This deal feels like smart business.
Post by: Bad English on July 02, 2024, 12:41:53 PM
Post by: eamonn on July 02, 2024, 01:14:31 PM
Post by: Hookeysmith on July 02, 2024, 01:31:43 PM
Post by: Drummond on July 02, 2024, 02:05:34 PM
the above article
8)
Post by: OCD on July 02, 2024, 02:43:34 PM
Aston Villa are getting Ross Barkley 2.0 - and it looks like smart business
Jacob Tanswell
Last October, Matty Cash was standing outside the home changing rooms at Villa Park, just after visitors Luton Town had been beaten 3-1, when he shared an anecdote which – in hindsight – seems more significant now.
“Ross Barkley said to me, ‘How many set pieces have you always got?!’” Cash said.
Luton midfielder Barkley was impressed and surprised by Aston Villa’s attention to detail. Things had changed since he had played for the club on loan from Chelsea three seasons earlier, when they were an improving, albeit mid-table, Premier League side. To accentuate the contrast, Barkley’s year in claret and blue was played in front of empty stands due to rules against crowds gathering related to the Covid-19 pandemic.
That post-game conversation with Cash spoke of how the now 30-year-old had maintained close bonds with former team-mates. He became good friends with many in that Villa squad, including Jack Grealish.
Now, Barkley is returning permanently.
He joins after a season with Luton, where the manager, Rob Edwards, had reinvigorated his career to the point that Villa counterpart Unai Emery became a major admirer. And when Emery wants someone, Villa’s footballing department does whatever it can to comply with his wishes. His belief in Barkley, and the fact central midfield was a priority position this summer, meant Villa had little doubt in exercising the £5million ($6.4m) buy-out clause in the former England international’s contract.
Just to make it look like the whole article was quoted when BE scrolls down.
Post by: Bad English on July 02, 2024, 05:58:32 PM
Post by: OCD on July 02, 2024, 08:41:46 PM
It worked; I'd already shouted WANKER! before I'd finished scrolling. :-)
😂
I wouldn't do that.
Post by: Dick Edwards on July 03, 2024, 10:11:28 AM
Post by: eamonn on July 03, 2024, 10:13:14 AM
Post by: john e on July 03, 2024, 03:27:13 PM
From the moment i heard we were interested i thought this could be a masterstroke - i think he will be brilliant for us
That word masterstroke has been used many times down the years for players we’ve taken a risky punt on, and mostly they’ve turned out to be duds
Post by: Hookeysmith on July 03, 2024, 06:04:13 PM
From the moment i heard we were interested i thought this could be a masterstroke - i think he will be brilliant for us
That word masterstroke has been used many times down the years for players we’ve taken a risky punt on, and mostly they’ve turned out to be duds
One factor you miss...SUE targeted him very early. Once he is used to a coach like him, then I think he will go up another level and play more times than people envisage atm
Post by: jwarry on July 17, 2024, 06:18:10 PM
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13643809/Ross-Barkley-speeding-offence-Audi-London.html
Post by: Footy-Vill on July 26, 2024, 04:31:57 PM
Now who said he’s was too slow?
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13643809/Ross-Barkley-speeding-offence-Audi-London.html
That's poor
I rather thought it was a strange move considering his complete deterioration in form when last here and it still seems there are off field issues.
He has experience and supposedly matured!
I want to see what sort of attitude he shows when he's either taken off or not starting matches.
Barkley has been awarded the number 6 shirt so he seems to be the player that has replaced Douglas Luiz.
I guess I'm expecting a bigger signing after champions league but have a relegated player.
Hopefully he will be positive signing but I not convinced just yet.
Post by: Footy-Vill on August 14, 2024, 09:12:57 PM
Sky Sports article suggests attacking role for Barkley ?
Attack-minded Barkley
'A Barkley-Barrenechea pairing was one of the first experiments trialled by the Villa boss - which was quickly reassessed following a 4-1 defeat to 2023 MLS champions Columbus Crew.
It was a combination most fans can probably predict won't feature in the opening game of the season against West Ham.
Barkley, despite all his experience, is not a genuine all-round central midfielder. His talents lay within the final third, rather than supporting the defence
Within a double pivot, Villa need a more robust option ahead of Pau Torres and Ezri Konsa.
Given no player was dispossessed more times than Barkley for the Hatters last season - as well as having the second-worst tackling success rate in the team according to Opta - the former Everton man likely won't offer this.
A role playing off the striker, which Emery often deploys, might be better suited. '
Post by: VillaTim on August 14, 2024, 09:19:37 PM
Post by: Footy-Vill on August 14, 2024, 09:43:22 PM
Said at the time i wasn't convinced re-signing Barkley is a good move .
I think you have a point.
I mean he's not going to be first choice.
And he needs to be ok with that.
Barkley may have come to play Champions League but he's not going to be playing off Watkins away at Real Madrid is he? Or is he?
And is he to be trusted in the pivot given the damning stats.
It's those league games in between champions league where he may be if some squad use but it does remain to be seen
Dean Smith didn't see fit to play him so really have to wondr why bring him back when have improved as a team.
Post by: PaulWinch again on August 14, 2024, 09:54:10 PM
Post by: VillaTim on August 14, 2024, 09:55:05 PM
Post by: Footy-Vill on August 14, 2024, 09:56:51 PM
It's a strange signing. The only thing that makes sense is the cheap price . But, we shouldn't be shopping at this level, oh but FFP .PSR
Post by: Dave on August 14, 2024, 09:58:31 PM
It's a strange signing. The only thing that makes sense is the cheap price . But, we shouldn't be shopping at this level, oh but FFP .
He was one of the best players in the league in his position last season, in an area of the squad where we have the least depth, where injuries and suspensions nearly lost us our Champions League place last season, and he cost us the modern-day transfer fee equivalent of coins we found down the back of the sofa.
It's fine.
Post by: VillaTim on August 14, 2024, 09:59:53 PM
He really wasn't. He was one of the best players at Luton yes. But that's miles apart .It's a strange signing. The only thing that makes sense is the cheap price . But, we shouldn't be shopping at this level, oh but FFP .
He was one of the best players in the league in his position last season, in an area of the squad where we have the least depth, where injuries and suspensions nearly lost us our Champions League place last season, and he cost us the modern-day transfer fee equivalent of coins we found down the back of the sofa.
It's fine.
Post by: ozzjim on August 14, 2024, 10:03:53 PM
Post by: eye digress on August 14, 2024, 10:36:14 PM
Post by: pauliewalnuts on August 14, 2024, 10:37:44 PM
He really wasn't. He was one of the best players at Luton yes. But that's miles apart .It's a strange signing. The only thing that makes sense is the cheap price . But, we shouldn't be shopping at this level, oh but FFP .
He was one of the best players in the league in his position last season, in an area of the squad where we have the least depth, where injuries and suspensions nearly lost us our Champions League place last season, and he cost us the modern-day transfer fee equivalent of coins we found down the back of the sofa.
It's fine.
He was statistically one of the best players in his position in the league - while playing for Luton Town.
Honest, Tim, do you ever read the stuff you're replying to?
Post by: VillaTim on August 14, 2024, 11:46:10 PM
Outstanding in every game I saw him play last season, including against some of the bigger teams and even when they were losing.Outstanding ?! Did he play in both games vs Us ? Didn't even notice him. He was ok in a piss poor luton team no wonder he stood out . I hope he does well for us but I have concerns about this signing and backwards steps .
Post by: Drummond on August 15, 2024, 06:35:12 AM
It's a strange signing. The only thing that makes sense is the cheap price . But, we shouldn't be shopping at this level, oh but FFP .PSR
He say FFP you say PSR, let's call the whole thing off.
Post by: Chap on August 15, 2024, 07:11:37 AM
Some may not be old enough to know what you’re referring too.😜It's a strange signing. The only thing that makes sense is the cheap price . But, we shouldn't be shopping at this level, oh but FFP .PSR
He say FFP you say PSR, let's call the whole thing off.
Post by: jwarry on August 15, 2024, 07:15:10 AM
Outstanding in every game I saw him play last season, including against some of the bigger teams and even when they were losing.Outstanding ?! Did he play in both games vs Us ? Didn't even notice him. He was ok in a piss poor luton team no wonder he stood out . I hope he does well for us but I have concerns about this signing and backwards steps .
Thing is he is yet to play for an elite coach so I suspect we will see a very different Barkley to the one we had a few years ago
Post by: Drummond on August 15, 2024, 07:16:09 AM
Some may not be old enough to know what you’re referring too.😜It's a strange signing. The only thing that makes sense is the cheap price . But, we shouldn't be shopping at this level, oh but FFP .PSR
He say FFP you say PSR, let's call the whole thing off.
I think you may be correct!
Post by: Demitri_C on August 15, 2024, 08:12:12 AM
However he hasnt worked under someone like unai before so we could see a real improved barkley
Post by: Olneythelonely on August 15, 2024, 08:20:02 AM
It was a nominal fee. It’s fine. Nothing to get worried about really.
Post by: Demitri_C on August 15, 2024, 08:30:03 AM
I think the very last thing it is is “concerning”. He might not be good enough, he might be exactly what we need, he might be brilliant.
It was a nominal fee. It’s fine. Nothing to get worried about really.
Ita not the money thats the problem its how he performs in a team that wants to be as successful as last year.
I have reservations he is good enough but as i said maybe under unai we could see a completely different player
Post by: Risso on August 15, 2024, 08:59:52 AM
Post by: DB on August 15, 2024, 09:21:11 AM
Post by: jwarry on August 15, 2024, 09:27:23 AM
I don't think he was signed as an intended first team player. He cost almost bugger all, and can play in a number of positions. So given the number of games we've got coming up, he'll either be a handy sub or starter in cup games, covering various roles; or if he is a starter it's because he's playing so well that Emery can't leave him out. Doesn't strike me as a bad situation, really.
I suspect he will be playing more than this, especially as we will have a two games a week for most of the season
Post by: Risso on August 15, 2024, 09:43:08 AM
I don't think he was signed as an intended first team player. He cost almost bugger all, and can play in a number of positions. So given the number of games we've got coming up, he'll either be a handy sub or starter in cup games, covering various roles; or if he is a starter it's because he's playing so well that Emery can't leave him out. Doesn't strike me as a bad situation, really.
I suspect he will be playing more than this, especially as we will have a two games a week for most of the season
Possibly. The point is though, that he hasn't been signed as a direct replacement for Luiz or anything like that. He's a good footballer who can play in a number of positions, and he cost bugger all. We suffered at the end of last season from lack of squad depth, and Ross was a signing to help rectify that. Our central midfield options are now Onana, Tielemans, Barkley, McGinn, the Baron and Kamara when he comes back. That's as good as you'll find anywhere.
Post by: VillaTim on August 15, 2024, 01:00:38 PM
That's my biggest concern .I don't think he was signed as an intended first team player. He cost almost bugger all, and can play in a number of positions. So given the number of games we've got coming up, he'll either be a handy sub or starter in cup games, covering various roles; or if he is a starter it's because he's playing so well that Emery can't leave him out. Doesn't strike me as a bad situation, really.
I suspect he will be playing more than this, especially as we will have a two games a week for most of the season
Post by: eye digress on August 16, 2024, 10:37:36 AM
The claret and blue goggles would have prevented me from noticing him when he played against us, so that's a fair point!Outstanding in every game I saw him play last season, including against some of the bigger teams and even when they were losing.Outstanding ?! Did he play in both games vs Us ? Didn't even notice him. He was ok in a piss poor luton team no wonder he stood out . I hope he does well for us but I have concerns about this signing and backwards steps .
Post by: rob_bridge on August 16, 2024, 10:53:50 AM
I don't think he was signed as an intended first team player. He cost almost bugger all, and can play in a number of positions. So given the number of games we've got coming up, he'll either be a handy sub or starter in cup games, covering various roles; or if he is a starter it's because he's playing so well that Emery can't leave him out. Doesn't strike me as a bad situation, really.
If he doesn't cut it someone like Leeds or Norwich will take a punt on him as a loanee in January
Post by: Footy-Vill on August 21, 2024, 04:02:36 PM
I feel I’ve changed my tune after reading encouraging words that Unai specifally wanted Barkley so that will do me!
Post by: Monty on August 21, 2024, 05:20:50 PM
Post by: jwarry on August 21, 2024, 06:12:38 PM
Post by: VillaTim on August 21, 2024, 07:24:44 PM
Post by: jwarry on August 21, 2024, 07:58:07 PM
He's here for cameos , carabao and emergency deployment
I don’t think he is. It’s like Youri early last season, he will have a massive part to play
Post by: ozzjim on August 21, 2024, 09:10:43 PM
He's here for cameos , carabao and emergency deployment
I don’t think he is. It’s like Youri early last season, he will have a massive part to play
Agreed. He's an excellent player, Unai will use him when he's ready to.
Post by: PaulWinch again on August 21, 2024, 09:12:52 PM
Post by: Smithy on August 22, 2024, 06:41:45 PM
I'm hoping our strength in depth means we'll rotate a bit more this season, and in turn this will mean a decent number of starts for most of our midfielders.
Post by: Gerrin on September 01, 2024, 08:18:53 AM
Post by: Dante Lavelli on September 01, 2024, 09:38:11 AM
He was often a passenger playing ten as he didn’t get back and was reliant on being given the ball. Now the traffic is in front of him so he’s more involved. Plus he can use his physicality to block the channels if not actually make tackles.
The touch and quality has never been in doubt.
Post by: Dogtanian on September 01, 2024, 11:37:25 AM
Post by: Dante Lavelli on September 01, 2024, 11:43:23 AM
Tielemans and Barkley makes me shudder.
Post by: Steve67 on September 01, 2024, 01:28:26 PM
Big call but I think he might eventually be better than Tielemans in that double pivot role as long as it’s onana or Kamara alongside him.
Tielemans and Barkley makes me shudder.
They are both quality players, good passers of the ball. Not sure why they make you shudder.
Post by: OCD on September 01, 2024, 02:16:23 PM
I'm sure Barkley will become more involved as the season goes on, like Tielemans did last season, as he adjusts to what Emery wants.
We struggled to keep hold of the ball in the second half and then we settled down for a while when the changes were made.
Post by: Risso on September 01, 2024, 05:42:32 PM
Post by: eye digress on September 01, 2024, 07:37:15 PM
But I’d put that down to his adaptation to our methods and think he will prove a bargain once his software has been fully upgraded.
Post by: PaulWinch again on September 01, 2024, 07:41:38 PM
Post by: eye digress on September 01, 2024, 07:43:29 PM
Post by: tony scott on September 01, 2024, 09:21:55 PM
Post by: rooboy316 on September 02, 2024, 04:51:51 AM
Post by: Mister E on September 02, 2024, 07:56:47 AM
A lot of simple short passes, he seems to be easing himself into the system.Agreed; recycled the ball well; not ponderous. ;D
Post by: Dante Lavelli on September 02, 2024, 08:26:53 AM
Big call but I think he might eventually be better than Tielemans in that double pivot role as long as it’s onana or Kamara alongside him.
Tielemans and Barkley makes me shudder.
They are both quality players, good passers of the ball. Not sure why they make you shudder.
I agree they are great passers of the ball but both need the other to be the “water carrier” so they can be at their best playing front foot football. My fear is that it would be similar to the end of last season where Luiz and Tielemas/Mcginn were being over-run.
Post by: chrisw1 on September 02, 2024, 11:03:51 AM
Post by: eamonn on September 02, 2024, 12:05:01 PM
Post by: Toronto Villa on September 14, 2024, 07:50:57 PM
Post by: Risso on September 14, 2024, 07:52:45 PM
Post by: Ian. on September 14, 2024, 07:53:52 PM
Post by: Ian. on September 14, 2024, 07:55:06 PM
Onana had a bit of a stinker first half, but easy to forget he’s still young. Barkley came on and was very assured.
Typical for him to have that against these, I guess their players knew how to rattle him.
Post by: Steve67 on September 14, 2024, 07:59:24 PM
Post by: Garyth on September 14, 2024, 08:04:40 PM
It has got to a point with Villa where I am happy with whoever comes on and Barkley is definitely in this club.
Indeed. I was looking at the bench at half time today, and thinking that I would genuinely be interested if any of them were to come on (barring Gauchi, i guess).
Post by: Risso on September 14, 2024, 08:04:55 PM
He’s a very different Barkley to the one that last played here. He’s matured into a fine player. He had moments in his last stint, but he’s far more comfortable and composed. He’s a really good fit for our style too.
Plus he knows now he can’t get away with acting the twat.
Post by: Ian. on September 14, 2024, 08:08:33 PM
Yep, that’s true. I’d also add, it seems he’s grown up a lot since we’ve last seen him.He’s a very different Barkley to the one that last played here. He’s matured into a fine player. He had moments in his last stint, but he’s far more comfortable and composed. He’s a really good fit for our style too.
Plus he knows now he can’t get away with acting the twat.
Post by: PeterWithesShin on September 14, 2024, 08:10:16 PM
Post by: cdbearsfan on September 14, 2024, 08:11:03 PM
Post by: Rudy Can't Fail on September 14, 2024, 08:23:42 PM
Post by: Richard E on September 14, 2024, 08:30:17 PM
Post by: PaulWinch again on September 14, 2024, 09:54:37 PM
Post by: usav on September 14, 2024, 10:01:19 PM
Post by: pauliewalnuts on September 14, 2024, 10:03:02 PM
Really important in the turnaround. Excellent player to have in the squad.
Exactly this, and it's one of many examples of how DimVillaTim doesn't get it.
Post by: j66acd on September 14, 2024, 10:16:20 PM
He did well today. However, Emery had an absolute melt down at him for about 1 minute......not sure why.
Did Emery get booked for that? 😂😂 he was so pissed off
Post by: Somniloquism on September 14, 2024, 10:22:23 PM
Barkley was excellent today, will be interesting to see his passing stats. Dictated the pace of the game and was excellent alongside Tielemans. It has got to a point with Villa where I am happy with whoever comes on and Barkley is definitely in this club.
Well he got an assist, although probably wasn't expecting to with his pass.
Post by: Footy-Vill on September 14, 2024, 10:45:56 PM
Post by: darren woolley on September 15, 2024, 06:09:12 PM
Post by: Dogtanian on September 15, 2024, 06:11:45 PM
He did well today. However, Emery had an absolute melt down at him for about 1 minute......not sure why.
I saw that but couldn’t see who it was at. A lad near me said it was Tielemans.
Post by: Olneythelonely on September 16, 2024, 08:10:29 AM
I think he’ll prove to be a master stroke.
Post by: chrisw1 on September 16, 2024, 09:00:34 AM
I think Jacob Tanswell mentioned this and it was because he was pushing up too far and leaving us exposed.He did well today. However, Emery had an absolute melt down at him for about 1 minute......not sure why.
I saw that but couldn’t see who it was at. A lad near me said it was Tielemans.
Either way, I thought he looked really good when he came on. My only real concern with him carrying over last season's form was how he would react to not being the main man and starting on the bench. Hopefully we have our answer - an excellent addition to the squad.
Post by: Smithy on September 16, 2024, 09:09:05 AM
I think Jacob Tanswell mentioned this and it was because he was pushing up too far and leaving us exposed.He did well today. However, Emery had an absolute melt down at him for about 1 minute......not sure why.
I saw that but couldn’t see who it was at. A lad near me said it was Tielemans.
Either way, I thought he looked really good when he came on. My only real concern with him carrying over last season's form was how he would react to not being the main man and starting on the bench. Hopefully we have our answer - an excellent addition to the squad.
Yep, there are also some players who need games for match sharpness, and who struggle to maintain a level if they're not starting week-in week-out (I think SJM might be one of those types), and though I thought Ross would be one of those, it certainly seems like the version we've bought is much better than the version we loaned.
Post by: Somniloquism on September 16, 2024, 09:09:16 AM
Post by: Somniloquism on September 16, 2024, 09:10:33 AM
Yep, there are also some players who need games for match sharpness, and who struggle to maintain a level if they're not starting week-in week-out (I think SJM might be one of those types), and though I thought Ross would be one of those, it certainly seems like the version we've bought is much better than the version we loaned.
Didn't we try playing Barkley in a 10 role when we first had him. I seem to remember he was close to forwards at the time.
Post by: Risso on September 16, 2024, 09:15:41 AM
Yep, there are also some players who need games for match sharpness, and who struggle to maintain a level if they're not starting week-in week-out (I think SJM might be one of those types), and though I thought Ross would be one of those, it certainly seems like the version we've bought is much better than the version we loaned.
Didn't we try playing Barkley in a 10 role when we first had him. I seem to remember he was close to forwards at the time.
Yes we did. He's probably still quite capable of doing it as well. Tielemans did for a few games last season.
Post by: Somniloquism on September 16, 2024, 09:19:21 AM
Post by: Dave on September 16, 2024, 09:24:51 AM
Yep, there are also some players who need games for match sharpness, and who struggle to maintain a level if they're not starting week-in week-out (I think SJM might be one of those types), and though I thought Ross would be one of those, it certainly seems like the version we've bought is much better than the version we loaned.
Didn't we try playing Barkley in a 10 role when we first had him. I seem to remember he was close to forwards at the time.
That's where he'd spent pretty much his whole career, so it would have been strange if we'd tried him anywhere else. It's only when he went to Luton that they thought he might be a bit better pretending to be Toni Kroos instead of pretending to be Phil Foden.
Post by: rob_bridge on September 16, 2024, 09:54:11 AM
Post by: Drummond on September 16, 2024, 09:55:03 AM
Emery is very demanding of his midfielders, he would react similarly with Luiz too.
Post by: Mister E on September 16, 2024, 10:01:47 AM
He’s going to be really helpful when we’re trying to break down teams playing deep. We struggled with that at times last season and the speed of his passing should make a huge difference.I think you're right: he and Tielemans on Saturday really seemed to put their boot on Everton's throat and slowly squeeze their resistance out. Add a right-winger as an out-ball and we have some great options across the middle of the park.
Post by: Hookeysmith on September 16, 2024, 01:00:05 PM
Post by: Smithy on September 16, 2024, 02:00:40 PM
Post by: john e on September 16, 2024, 05:52:30 PM
if he continues like that I will have no problem in been proved wrong
In fact the two players that I thought would be weak links this year were Barkley and Tielemans with the loss of Dougie
Both are making me look a bit of a numpty at the moment which isn’t hard to be fair
Post by: Risso on September 16, 2024, 06:08:14 PM
I thought it was a mistake bringing Barkley back but he did very well when he came on showed his composure and experience and made a difference in the second half
if he continues like that I will have no problem in been proved wrong
In fact the two players that I thought would be weak links this year were Barkley and Tielemans with the loss of Dougie
Both are making me look a bit of a numpty at the moment which isn’t hard to be fair
That ship sailed a long, long time ago John!
Post by: john e on September 16, 2024, 06:23:53 PM
I thought it was a mistake bringing Barkley back but he did very well when he came on showed his composure and experience and made a difference in the second half
if he continues like that I will have no problem in been proved wrong
In fact the two players that I thought would be weak links this year were Barkley and Tielemans with the loss of Dougie
Both are making me look a bit of a numpty at the moment which isn’t hard to be fair
That ship sailed a long, long time ago John!
Ha ha, I know
Post by: supertom on September 21, 2024, 05:34:47 PM
Post by: Risso on September 21, 2024, 05:35:32 PM
Post by: Matt C on September 21, 2024, 05:58:15 PM
Post by: robleflaneur on September 21, 2024, 08:28:41 PM
Post by: AV82EC on September 21, 2024, 08:32:13 PM
Post by: Dogtanian on September 21, 2024, 08:34:12 PM
Fantastic that we have these options as required.
Post by: N'ZMAV on September 21, 2024, 08:39:21 PM
Post by: PaulWinch again on September 21, 2024, 08:48:54 PM
Post by: frankmosswasmyuncle on September 21, 2024, 08:53:05 PM
Ross Barkley 2.0 is very good. I've been really impressed so far. He's just quietly gone about his business when he's come on and he's looked very composed. Rarely wastes the ball.This.
Post by: Chap on September 21, 2024, 09:17:44 PM
Post by: colin69 on September 21, 2024, 09:20:54 PM
Post by: Brazilian Villain on September 21, 2024, 09:21:05 PM
Ross Barkley 2.0 is very good.
It's not often that the sequel is better.
Post by: rob_bridge on September 21, 2024, 09:21:54 PM
Cissokho, Joe Cole, Andy Gray II, McAvennie, Adrian Heath - the list is endless of has-beens who added nothing.
Unai - no problem. Going to reinvent him.
Post by: olaftab on September 21, 2024, 09:53:59 PM
Post by: ChicagoLion on September 21, 2024, 09:56:42 PM
Great variation to our midfield options.
Post by: garyellis on September 21, 2024, 10:18:50 PM
Terminator 2?Ross Barkley 2.0 is very good.
It's not often that the sequel is better.
Post by: Brazilian Villain on September 21, 2024, 10:24:05 PM
Ross Barkley 2.0 is very good.
It's not often that the sequel is better.
Terminator 2?
Green Lantern 2.
Post by: AV84 on September 21, 2024, 10:27:19 PM
Terminator 2?Ross Barkley 2.0 is very good.
It's not often that the sequel is better.
Sister Act 2
Post by: Sexual Ealing on September 21, 2024, 10:56:01 PM
Post by: Dave P on September 21, 2024, 11:06:11 PM
Post by: VillaTim on September 21, 2024, 11:13:00 PM
Post by: Astral Weeks on September 22, 2024, 08:13:41 AM
Post by: Nelly on September 22, 2024, 08:27:02 AM
Post by: Toronto Villa on September 23, 2024, 12:10:02 PM
Post by: VILLA MOLE on September 23, 2024, 12:34:04 PM
The Empire Strikes Back
yes but that incestuous kiss between Luke and leia, SOOOO WRONG
Post by: Clark W Griswold on September 23, 2024, 12:43:52 PM
Yes, Barkley so far so good i have to say. Didn't want him to come back but if he carries on all season the way he's started with good performances when call on and no drama then i'm all for it.
Post by: cdbearsfan on September 23, 2024, 12:45:45 PM
Back to the Future Part II
The Dark Knight
Batman Returns
Superman II
Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan
Bill and Ted's Bogus Journey
Addams Family Values
Daleks: Invasion Earth 2150
Green Lantern 2 (don't think this has been made but that's preferable to the first one)
Post by: SoccerHQ on September 23, 2024, 12:46:02 PM
Not sure he'd make the same impact starting games but him and Tielemans are excellent at recycling the ball and playing risky passes so that's a really good combination when chasing a game to have centrally.
Post by: Gerrin on September 23, 2024, 12:46:22 PM
Post by: Monty on September 23, 2024, 12:48:16 PM
Post by: SoccerHQ on September 23, 2024, 12:48:29 PM
Now that Mcginn is injured how does the midfield shape look assuming Barkley replaces him, or doesn't he?
Ross could start but think we'll just see Bailey come in from the start v Ipswich.
They play with wing backs so they'll be plenty of space for Leon to exploit there.
Post by: Dante Lavelli on September 23, 2024, 12:48:44 PM
Now that Mcginn is injured how does the midfield shape look assuming Barkley replaces him, or doesn't he?
Doubt it, I’d expect Bailey to come in for mcginn.
Post by: Clark W Griswold on September 23, 2024, 12:51:00 PM
Evil Dead II don't know
Back to the Future Part II not as good as the first
The Dark Knight not as good as the first
Batman Returns not as good as the first by some distance
Superman II - equal to the first
Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan don't know
Bill and Ted's Bogus Journey - no where near as good as the first
Addams Family Values - didn't like either
Daleks: Invasion Earth 2150 - don't know
Green Lantern 2 (don't think this has been made but that's preferable to the first one) don't know
Marked your work as above :-)
Post by: Brazilian Villain on September 23, 2024, 12:53:10 PM
Post by: Clark W Griswold on September 23, 2024, 12:54:06 PM
Post by: Clark W Griswold on September 23, 2024, 12:54:48 PM
The Chronicles of Riddick (Clark and/or others may not agree).
Not seen to comment :-)
Post by: Dave on September 23, 2024, 01:41:54 PM
Quote
Ross Barkley
There was no incredible assist to match the generational three-yard lay-off which preceded Jhon Duran’s 30-yard tap-in against Everton, but Barkley again proved himself a contender for best bargain signing for the second straight season.
Luton used their free agent as often as possible; Aston Villa are yet to give their £5m summer purchase a start outside the Bristol Street Motors Trophy. But Barkley’s influence from the bench has been clear and crucial.
After misplacing one pass at Everton, Barkley maintained a 100% accuracy against Wolves. Villa were losing both games when he came on to help establish control, command the tempo and free up his teammates. As a reliable, game-changing squad option, he was a phenomenal addition.
Post by: Percy McCarthy on September 24, 2024, 02:55:00 AM
From F365's Winners & Losers section:QuoteRoss Barkley
There was no incredible assist to match the generational three-yard lay-off which preceded Jhon Duran’s 30-yard tap-in against Everton, but Barkley again proved himself a contender for best bargain signing for the second straight season.
Luton used their free agent as often as possible; Aston Villa are yet to give their £5m summer purchase a start outside the Bristol Street Motors Trophy. But Barkley’s influence from the bench has been clear and crucial.
After misplacing one pass at Everton, Barkley maintained a 100% accuracy against Wolves. Villa were losing both games when he came on to help establish control, command the tempo and free up his teammates. As a reliable, game-changing squad option, he was a phenomenal addition.
Came straight to the latest posts on the thread so not sure if it’s been mentioned, but he’s only misplaced one pass in his three appearances so far. 100% successful passes against Leicester as well as the games mentioned above.
Post by: algy on September 24, 2024, 08:08:27 AM
The only real difference between Evil Dead I and II is the budget - the plot is near identical, and both have the wonderful Bruce Campbell as the lead actor.Evil Dead II don't know
Marked your work as above :-)
Personally I prefer I, but if you’re looking for a pure horror film then II is a better version.
But Evil Dead 3: Army of Darkness wipes the floor with both. That film absolutely nails what it’s trying to do (comedy-horror, packed with 1 liners … groovy)
Post by: Risso on September 24, 2024, 10:34:11 AM
Came straight to the latest posts on the thread so not sure if it’s been mentioned, but he’s only misplaced one pass in his three appearances so far. 100% successful passes against Leicester as well as the games mentioned above.
That's an insane stat, good on him. It's not like he's come on when we're 1-0 up and hanging on either, he's actually been part of the catalyst for wins.
Post by: Smithy on September 24, 2024, 11:23:00 AM
Came straight to the latest posts on the thread so not sure if it’s been mentioned, but he’s only misplaced one pass in his three appearances so far. 100% successful passes against Leicester as well as the games mentioned above.
That's an insane stat, good on him. It's not like he's come on when we're 1-0 up and hanging on either, he's actually been part of the catalyst for wins.
Yep, it's easy to get 100% passing accuracy when you're knocking it around at the back, protecting a lead and not taking any risks at all. It's VERY different when you're chasing a game and need a goal. He's been excellent so far, and long may it continue!
Post by: Demitri_C on September 24, 2024, 11:24:49 AM
Post by: Risso on September 24, 2024, 11:37:38 AM
Barkley has to start tonight. Probably will start on weekend too with mcginns injury
He may start against Ipswich in place of Onana, but I don't think McGinn's injury has anything to do with it. Bailey will probably start on the right instead of McGinn I'd have thought.
Post by: Hookeysmith on September 24, 2024, 03:44:16 PM
Post by: Footy-Vill on September 24, 2024, 05:29:18 PM
Barkley has to start tonight. Probably will start on weekend too with mcginns injury
He may start against Ipswich in place of Onana, but I don't think McGinn's injury has anything to do with it. Bailey will probably start on the right instead of McGinn I'd have thought.
How about Duran for McGinn on Sunday!
I'm awaiting the starting double act of Watkins and he!
Post by: Somniloquism on September 24, 2024, 07:59:50 PM
How about Duran for McGinn on Sunday!
I'm awaiting the starting double act of Watkins and he!
Don't we have a thread to discuss if we are starting one, the other, or both?
Post by: Footy-Vill on September 24, 2024, 10:16:22 PM
Post by: Demitri_C on September 25, 2024, 09:52:01 AM
Post by: coreyfeldman on September 25, 2024, 09:57:02 AM
Looked rather meh to me. Didnt take the chance given to him in my opinion. But will likley start vs Ipswich with mcginn injury
Bailey will start on the right, there's no way he's playing onana/tielemans/barkley
Post by: ChicagoLion on September 25, 2024, 10:00:27 AM
Looked rather meh to me. Didnt take the chance given to him in my opinion. But will likley start vs Ipswich with mcginn injuryBailey more likely to replace SJM.
Post by: OCD on September 25, 2024, 05:27:01 PM
Past the quarter-of-an-hour mark away to Wycombe Wanderers, young defender Sil Swinkels stood still on the ball.
The 20-year-old hoped to bait Wycombe’s narrow shape into pressing him, in turn freeing up space in the central areas further forward. In that time, only a matter of seconds, Ross Barkley looked over his shoulder to scan his surroundings four times.
Barkley was making his first competitive start since rejoining Aston Villa, a feat notable in itself given how accomplished the early impressions have been. When he plays — albeit across a small sample size — this version of Barkley tends to be Villa’s chief ball-progressor. On Tuesday night at Wycombe, he was also the oldest player in a squad that included nine academy graduates.
Youngsters such as Swinkels would invariably gravitate towards Barkley, capped 33 times by England and an FA Cup and Europa League winner. Earlier on, Barkley gestured for Swinkels to stay relaxed in possession, knowing extra touches would settle a young team and aid control in the opening stages.
A minute later, under near-identical circumstances, Swinkels played straight into Barkley’s feet, despite him being sandwiched between two Wycombe shirts. Barkley simply flicked a sharp first-time pass around the corner, wriggling Villa out of a tight situation. He made 76 passes in total, more than eight of Wycombe’s starters combined — showing his metronomic qualities.
Even while they were on holiday in the summer, Villa’s triangle of power – manager Unai Emery, president of football operations Monchi and Damian Vidagany, director of football – spent hours every day deciding on the squad’s balance and addressing profit and sustainability fears. Yet the most straightforward outlay was Barkley.
The midfielder was Villa’s first signing this summer. The former England international represented a low-cost market opportunity — Villa had little doubt in activating the £5million ($6.4m) buy-out clause in his contract at Luton Town — but, more importantly, he was the profile of central player Emery loves; confident enough to stay in possession and play forward at the right time.
For example, it is now a common sight to see Barkley with his studs on the ball and rolling it backwards, daring an opponent into tackling him. By wanting Villa to become more refined and patient in possession, Barkley, the second iteration, felt stylistically perfect to Emery.
It was the Villa manager who told Monchi and Vidagany to buy Barkley. The 30-year-old wished to return to Villa after spending the 2020-21 Covid-19-impacted campaign on loan and hearing from former team-mates about the depth of detail Emery instils into them.
Barkley’s reputation had been rejuvenated over the previous 12 months, repaying Luton Town’s short-term gamble in signing him as a free agent. From a broader perspective, Barkley became the deep-lying creator, using his ball progression and improved temperament to change the trajectory of his career.
Emery often berates his players for attacking too quickly. It might seem counter-intuitive, yet going forward at pace can be directionless and cause the match to become very transitional and chaotic. Because of fatigue, substitutions and the general game state, this tends to materialise in the second half.
It is why Barkley has been tasked with coming on in four of the first five Premier League matches. In each of them, he has replaced Amadou Onana, an all-round, athletic midfielder who still requires improvement in being more press-resistant and regulating the tempo.
Barkley, now a matured No 6 with his head on a constant swivel, has worked increasingly well when coming on alongside Youri Tielemans, a player of comparable profile. The pair have formed a partnership in the second half of matches against Leicester City, Everton and Wolves — at a time when each contest was in the balance — managing to bring authority and a stranglehold on Villa’s ability to sustain attacks.
The case in point was the comeback victory against Everton when Barkley replaced Onana at half-time. Villa became more attentive in possession, reducing counter-attacking opportunities and enabling the wide players to stay higher and wider for longer. As a consequence, Villa were successful in pinning Everton’s 4-2-3-1 shape into a back five.
“We have to be intelligent, using each match with the characteristics we need on the pitch,” said Emery in his post-match press conference. “Barkley and Youri Tielemans are similar. They can even play together or with one other midfielder — Onana or (Boubacar) Kamara — but what we needed in the second half was to take time in our build-up.”
Barkley then helped to shift the momentum the following week against Wolves. Jhon Duran has earned the game-changer tag, but Barkley’s presence is arguably as effective. After the hour mark of that match, Villa added precision to their play and were less wasteful and far more deft, resulting, ultimately, in coming back once more to win.
In light of Villa’s typical malaise in domestic cup competitions, the 2-1 victory at Wycombe followed a similar trend. It was a stodgy affair but perhaps understandably so, with Emery putting together a young, hodge-podge line-up. Gradually, as more of the seven debutants were introduced, the onus on Barkley to hold Villa’s shape together grew.
When Onana was replaced by 17-year-old Aidan Borland, set-piece coach Austin MacPhee called over Barkley to stress why he needed to be even more defensively mindful.
Barkley is no longer the young Evertonian who played with no handbrake and had a licence to roam. This is the second part of his career: more disciplined, tactically astute and suited to Emery’s ideals.
Source - Jacob Tanswell, The Athletic
Post by: jon collett on September 25, 2024, 05:31:22 PM
Post by: OCD on September 25, 2024, 05:34:30 PM
Post by: jon collett on September 25, 2024, 05:36:16 PM
Onana fits very well in our away games.
Possibly but we’ve only had two in the League and other than his goal he was poor at Leicester and hooked!
Post by: purpletrousers on September 25, 2024, 06:45:48 PM
As far as our Ross, delighted he's putting the doubters in their place. Unai and the boys in charge do seem to know what they are doing...
Post by: RichardBatchelor on September 25, 2024, 07:02:39 PM
Evil Dead II don't know
Back to the Future Part II not as good as the first
The Dark Knight not as good as the first
Batman Returns not as good as the first by some distance
Superman II - equal to the first
Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan don't know
Bill and Ted's Bogus Journey - no where near as good as the first
Addams Family Values - didn't like either
Daleks: Invasion Earth 2150 - don't know
Green Lantern 2 (don't think this has been made but that's preferable to the first one) don't know
Marked your work as above :-)
Evil Dead II - equal
Jurassic Park II - thought it was better because I was hammered, but wasn’t on second viewing, though exciting moments.
Back to the Future II - equal
The Dark Knight not as good as the first
Batman Returns not as good as the first by some distance
Superman II - better. Zod was terrifying
Star Trek II - a million times better, the first film was quite dull.
Bogus Journey - only slightly inferior in my view “That’s the Devil, dude.”
Addams Family Values - didn't like either much
Daleks: Invasion Earth 2150 - not as good
Post by: Brazilian Villain on September 25, 2024, 07:44:51 PM
Ross Barkley 2.0 is exactly the type of player Unai Emery loves at Aston Villa
Interesting stuff, thanks for posting.
Post by: frankmosswasmyuncle on September 25, 2024, 07:53:52 PM
Post by: john e on September 25, 2024, 10:43:33 PM
I thought he was a bit crap last night.
He was back to the Barkley we had first time round last night
But in fairness he’s been quality when he’s come on in the prem league games so far
Post by: coreyfeldman on September 25, 2024, 11:11:21 PM
I prefer us with him in the team to Onana who I don’t think fits with our style of play!
Is this a joke that I'm missing?
Post by: edgysatsuma89 on September 26, 2024, 01:35:27 AM
Post by: coreyfeldman on September 26, 2024, 08:56:35 AM
Post by: ChicagoLion on September 26, 2024, 09:03:47 AM
To say Onana doesn't suit our style of play is one of the most stupid things I've read on here for a while.Although I do think that the opposition and the way we set up will impact his contribution.
Post by: jon collett on September 26, 2024, 09:55:09 AM
To say Onana doesn't suit our style of play is one of the most stupid things I've read on here for a while.
Responses like this remind me of that Ricky Gervais sketch about guitar lessons and Twitter. ::)
Post by: olaftab on September 26, 2024, 10:04:39 AM
I think Jon just prefers Barkley's calm control of a game over Onana's athleticism. I think there is a place for both but I don't think it's a completely outlandish preference.Horses for courses. Barkley works well when we are playing teams inferior than us, that's most teams and trying to force the play, Onana works well when we are up against high quality teams such as Arsenal, Bayern, 115C, Liverpool etc. Both are key to our fortune this season.
Post by: paul_e on September 26, 2024, 10:30:42 AM
I think Jon just prefers Barkley's calm control of a game over Onana's athleticism. I think there is a place for both but I don't think it's a completely outlandish preference.Horses for courses. Barkley works well when we are playing teams inferior than us, that's most teams and trying to force the play, Onana works well when we are up against high quality teams such as Arsenal, Bayern, 115C, Liverpool etc. Both are key to our fortune this season.
and even against the poorer teams Onana has a big part to play because of his height and strength at set pieces (at both ends).
Post by: Footy-Vill on October 06, 2024, 01:18:45 PM
He was decent enough against Bayern though a few times caught in possession.
Think he should do ok today but wonder if he lasts the whole game?
Post by: AV84 on October 06, 2024, 01:48:05 PM
Post by: Demitri_C on October 06, 2024, 05:32:50 PM
Post by: Clampy on October 06, 2024, 05:45:13 PM
Post by: VillaTim on October 06, 2024, 05:54:05 PM
Post by: Chap on October 06, 2024, 05:54:55 PM
Post by: Deano's Mullet on October 06, 2024, 06:00:49 PM
Post by: Richard E on October 06, 2024, 06:05:54 PM
He was brilliant today.
He was. So comfortable in possession.
Post by: Tony Daleys Shorts on October 06, 2024, 06:06:05 PM
Post by: PaulWinch again on October 06, 2024, 08:08:45 PM
Post by: VillaTim on October 06, 2024, 08:11:41 PM
Post by: Drummond on October 06, 2024, 08:15:34 PM
Post by: Dante Lavelli on October 06, 2024, 08:51:07 PM
Post by: tony scott on October 06, 2024, 10:27:58 PM
Post by: eye digress on October 06, 2024, 10:48:36 PM
The shape or balance didn’t seem quite right with Tielemans in the middle, as we failed to get hold of the ball and dominate the game, I felt.
Post by: Monty on October 06, 2024, 10:52:39 PM
Post by: Somniloquism on October 07, 2024, 08:32:44 AM
I was a bit sceptical of his signing, but he looks like he's hear to play and not just top up his pension fund. I've been impressed with his cameos and today he was very good, composed and got stuck in when required.
I think that part of the phrase is doing some really heavy lifting.
Post by: Mortimer's Bear on October 09, 2024, 11:53:07 AM
Post by: Somniloquism on October 09, 2024, 12:15:15 PM
Post by: Brazilian Villain on October 09, 2024, 09:52:54 PM
Saw him in the co-op yesterday.
He was sorting out travel insurance, he's going diving in the Bermuda Triangle even though he has asthma.
Post by: Clampy on October 09, 2024, 09:55:26 PM
Post by: VillaTim on October 09, 2024, 10:03:39 PM
Post by: pauliewalnuts on October 09, 2024, 10:32:33 PM
Post by: Lsvilla on October 09, 2024, 10:35:58 PM
He might have been buying a pack of Co-ops own sausages.Lashfords aren't they ? The best.
Post by: coreyfeldman on October 09, 2024, 10:51:37 PM
Post by: Percy McCarthy on October 09, 2024, 11:54:32 PM
Evil Dead II don't know
Back to the Future Part II not as good as the first
The Dark Knight not as good as the first
Batman Returns not as good as the first by some distance
Superman II - equal to the first
Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan don't know
Bill and Ted's Bogus Journey - no where near as good as the first
Addams Family Values - didn't like either
Daleks: Invasion Earth 2150 - don't know
Green Lantern 2 (don't think this has been made but that's preferable to the first one) don't know
Marked your work as above :-)
Evil Dead II - equal
Jurassic Park II - thought it was better because I was hammered, but wasn’t on second viewing, though exciting moments.
Back to the Future II - equal
The Dark Knight not as good as the first
Batman Returns not as good as the first by some distance
Superman II - better. Zod was terrifying
Star Trek II - a million times better, the first film was quite dull.
Bogus Journey - only slightly inferior in my view “That’s the Devil, dude.”
Addams Family Values - didn't like either much
Daleks: Invasion Earth 2150 - not as good
Godfather verdict please.
I prefer II. III was nowhere near the first two, but might have been okay if it wasn’t following probably the greatest two films of all time.
Post by: Footy-Vill on October 09, 2024, 11:55:06 PM
Saw him in the co-op yesterday.
All Co-ops have incidents of shop lifting and anti social behaviour.
Ross often dines in Mayfair and has place in London
Are you sure it was him??
Post by: cdbearsfan on October 09, 2024, 11:57:11 PM
Post by: Footy-Vill on October 10, 2024, 12:03:25 AM
Post by: coreyfeldman on October 10, 2024, 12:04:03 AM
Saw him in the co-op yesterday.
All Co-ops have incidents of shop lifting and anti social behaviour.
Ross often dines in Mayfair and has place in London
Are you sure it was him??
Christ even the co-ops are dens of iniquity now according to FV. Is nowhere sacred on this earth?
My mate has also seen him around a few times as well so he's probably got a couple of gaffs hasn't he
Post by: Percy McCarthy on October 10, 2024, 12:04:07 AM
I love I and II. I did prefer II but think I is now just ahead on the basis that the Vito scenes from II are now just too prominent in my memory having seen both films at least twenty times. Agree with your opinion on III. It's not a bad film, but it's not a film that needed to be made as the first two told the complete story.
Cheers cd. I also loved the book. I want to read it again but I’m scared to, as since becoming a mobologist little inaccuracies about the subject annoy me more than they should.
There’s a glaring one in the film that my missus has made me promise not to point out lest it spoils it for her.
Post by: Louzie0 on October 10, 2024, 12:19:27 AM
I imagine the ‘glaring inaccuracy’ in GF isn’t Apollonia getting the days of the week in the wrong order. 😊
Post by: cdbearsfan on October 10, 2024, 12:21:33 AM
Here if that's your bag:
Part 1: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=A2Zg9HrYS78&list=PLxiqgnPij7iLHFWqmrgYQQofCTaKMTDIE&index=1&pp=iAQB
Part 2: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=mzIw9gMMOyY&list=PLxiqgnPij7iLHFWqmrgYQQofCTaKMTDIE&index=2&pp=iAQB
Post by: Percy McCarthy on October 10, 2024, 01:42:47 AM
Ha! I'll let you point out the error in spoiler tabs to be on the safe side! I loved the book, too. I listened to it all recently while "working". It's still excellent, not as good as the film but that's only like saying Pau Torres isn't as good as Paul McGrath. It's hardly an insult.
Here if that's your bag:
Part 1: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=A2Zg9HrYS78&list=PLxiqgnPij7iLHFWqmrgYQQofCTaKMTDIE&index=1&pp=iAQB
Part 2: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=mzIw9gMMOyY&list=PLxiqgnPij7iLHFWqmrgYQQofCTaKMTDIE&index=2&pp=iAQB
Nice one cd, appreciate it. I don’t think we need spoilers, it won’t bother anyone here like it bothers me.
Post by: Percy McCarthy on October 10, 2024, 01:47:52 AM
I rate GF2 just ahead of GF1, mainly because of the story of Vito (and Clemenza).
I imagine the ‘glaring inaccuracy’ in GF isn’t Apollonia getting the days of the week in the wrong order. 😊
Haha, no. It’s more to do with Cosa Nostra structure. It would only bother a few sad pedants, myself included.
For a start, there’s no way a non-Italian could ever be consigliere, but the main thing is that the Corleone family isn’t one of the five families. That’s just ridiculous.
See, I told you it wouldn’t bother you.
Post by: cdbearsfan on October 10, 2024, 02:03:31 AM
Post by: Percy McCarthy on October 10, 2024, 02:42:23 AM
I'd thought that before about Tom, tbf. Goodfellas is quite specific about the racial requirements. I never worried about the Corleones not being one of the Five Families as they're clearly just a fictionalised version thereof, same as the Lupertazzis in The Sopranos.
Ah, but Vito goes to a meeting with the five families, The Commission as it were, of which his family is not a part, making the Corleones some kind of sixth New York family. The Lupertazzis is one of the five, while The Sopranos is the New Jersey family (Decalvacante in real life).
Post by: cdbearsfan on October 10, 2024, 02:45:24 AM
Post by: Percy McCarthy on October 10, 2024, 02:46:45 AM
Ah, if I knew they were a sixth family, I'd forgotten it. I remember Hagen warning Sonny that "all the other families will come after us" [if they kill Solazzo] but couldn't remember how many there were.
Yeah, Don Vito mentions five at some point.
Still, Ross Barkley’s doing well innit.
Post by: Villan For Life on October 10, 2024, 06:03:45 AM
Post by: Mister E on October 10, 2024, 08:32:54 AM
Has Ross Barkley read the Godfather I wonder?Has Ross B ever woken up alongside a horse's head, I wonder?
Post by: Percy McCarthy on October 10, 2024, 08:52:20 AM
Post by: Villatillidie25 on October 10, 2024, 01:10:07 PM
Post by: Clark W Griswold on October 10, 2024, 01:20:23 PM
]I love I and II. I did prefer II but think I is now just ahead on the basis that the Vito scenes from II are now just too prominent in my memory having seen both films at least twenty times. Agree with your opinion on III. It's not a bad film, but it's not a film that needed to be made as the first two told the complete story.
Cheers cd. I also loved the book. I want to read it again but I’m scared to, as since becoming a mobologist little inaccuracies about the subject annoy me more than they should.
There’s a glaring one in the film that my missus has made me promise not to point out lest it spoils it for her.
The book is superb, movies 1 and 2 based on it. It has quite a lot extra to the movies of course, if they'd tried to fit everything in they would have ended up twice as long.
1 and 2 about equal for me, but i much prefer the De Niro back story parts in part 2 to the continuation of the original film. The bit where he climbs above the houses and ends up taking out the don in the apartment building is particularly great. Also the restaurant scene in 1.
I watched 3 at the cinema a a mid teen having not seen the first 2 and hadn't got a frigging clue what was going on. Don't ask me why. Watching it years later and i'd say it's still a very good film in it's own right but not up to the first 2.
Post by: Brazilian Villain on October 10, 2024, 01:25:56 PM
He might have been buying a pack of Co-ops own sausages.
Lashfords aren't they ? The best.
"Put a Lashy on the pan for me", as Footy is wont to say.
Post by: Brazilian Villain on October 10, 2024, 01:33:37 PM
I love I and II. I did prefer II but think I is now just ahead on the basis that the Vito scenes from II are now just too prominent in my memory having seen both films at least twenty times. Agree with your opinion on III. It's not a bad film, but it's not a film that needed to be made as the first two told the complete story.
I'd say that's where I'm at too. I seem to recall the BBC showing the two films in 6 or 7 one hour (ish) episodes. It was many moons ago ago, so I don't know if it they were the films as we know them, or The Godfather Saga serialised.
Of course the burning question now is, does Percy prefer The Godfather to the Modfather?
Post by: Villan For Life on October 10, 2024, 01:37:59 PM
I love I and II. I did prefer II but think I is now just ahead on the basis that the Vito scenes from II are now just too prominent in my memory having seen both films at least twenty times. Agree with your opinion on III. It's not a bad film, but it's not a film that needed to be made as the first two told the complete story.
I'd say that's where I'm at too. I seem to recall the BBC showing the two films in 6 or 7 one hour (ish) episodes. It was many moons ago ago, so I don't know if it they were the films as we know them, or The Godfather Saga serialised.
Of course the burning question now is, does Percy prefer The Godfather to the Modfather?
Yes I remember the Beeb showing the Godfather in episodes, I reckon it was the first time that I had seen it and was hooked. It must have been in the early 1980’s and have seen the films and read the book many times since.
Post by: Ads on October 10, 2024, 01:57:13 PM
Post by: Percy McCarthy on October 10, 2024, 06:45:08 PM
I always assumed the Lupertazzis were the Genovese because they've got or had a crew in Jersey, so it would make sense for them to be entwined with the Sopranos. Also Meadow names all the others bar them.
Interesting, never clocked that. I thought maybe the Luccheses, just because of the Lu bit, and someone mentioning100 button men, which suggests one of the smaller three (Gambinos & Genovese are more like 200/250 each).
They also have a Jersey crew, as do the Gambinos and as you say the Genovese.
And talking of Lucchese/Sopranos connections, probable future boss Georgie ‘Neck’ Zappola was once frustrated in an attempt to smuggle his erm… essence out of prison for family planning purposes.
Post by: Louzie0 on October 11, 2024, 07:58:04 PM
I rate GF2 just ahead of GF1, mainly because of the story of Vito (and Clemenza).
I imagine the ‘glaring inaccuracy’ in GF isn’t Apollonia getting the days of the week in the wrong order. 😊
Haha, no. It’s more to do with Cosa Nostra structure. It would only bother a few sad pedants, myself included.
For a start, there’s no way a non-Italian could ever be consigliere, but the main thing is that the Corleone family isn’t one of the five families. That’s just ridiculous.
See, I told you it wouldn’t bother you.
I’ve read before ( I think comments on IMDb) about the unlikely appointment of Tom Hagen as consigliere.
Perhaps Mario Puzo may have known someone irl who filled this role for a Don, for a time. Ultimately, it’s a book and a film!
I’m left unbothered about the Five Families stunna as you predicted 👍
Post by: Olneythelonely on October 11, 2024, 08:20:46 PM
Post by: Percy McCarthy on October 11, 2024, 10:36:09 PM
I rate GF2 just ahead of GF1, mainly because of the story of Vito (and Clemenza).
I imagine the ‘glaring inaccuracy’ in GF isn’t Apollonia getting the days of the week in the wrong order. 😊
Haha, no. It’s more to do with Cosa Nostra structure. It would only bother a few sad pedants, myself included.
For a start, there’s no way a non-Italian could ever be consigliere, but the main thing is that the Corleone family isn’t one of the five families. That’s just ridiculous.
See, I told you it wouldn’t bother you.
I’ve read before ( I think comments on IMDb) about the unlikely appointment of Tom Hagen as consigliere.
Perhaps Mario Puzo may have known someone irl who filled this role for a Don, for a time.
No chance.
Post by: Footy-Vill on October 11, 2024, 10:58:28 PM
With the utmost respect for the discussion taking place currently it's not what everyone is expecting to read on this thread.
There's no harm to carry this on here but elsewhere is much more suitable and maybe start it's own thread discussion on the Corleone family both book and movie thread combined perhaps?
Post by: Drummond on October 11, 2024, 11:06:48 PM
Post by: Brazilian Villain on October 11, 2024, 11:27:11 PM
Could we move this non-Ross Barkley discussion from the main service board to the relevant place in other? With all due respect, this is unrelated and is entirely about films or books without mentioning Ross.
Al Pacino starred in all 3 Godfather films, as well as Glengarry Glen Ross.
Post by: Louzie0 on October 11, 2024, 11:30:14 PM
Bit wild as a suggestion, I admit.I rate GF2 just ahead of GF1, mainly because of the story of Vito (and Clemenza).
I imagine the ‘glaring inaccuracy’ in GF isn’t Apollonia getting the days of the week in the wrong order. 😊
Haha, no. It’s more to do with Cosa Nostra structure. It would only bother a few sad pedants, myself included.
For a start, there’s no way a non-Italian could ever be consigliere, but the main thing is that the Corleone family isn’t one of the five families. That’s just ridiculous.
See, I told you it wouldn’t bother you.
I’ve read before ( I think comments on IMDb) about the unlikely appointment of Tom Hagen as consigliere.
Perhaps Mario Puzo may have known someone irl who filled this role for a Don, for a time.
No chance.
Anyway, Goodfellas….
Post by: Percy McCarthy on October 12, 2024, 12:14:04 AM
Bit wild as a suggestion, I admit.I rate GF2 just ahead of GF1, mainly because of the story of Vito (and Clemenza).
I imagine the ‘glaring inaccuracy’ in GF isn’t Apollonia getting the days of the week in the wrong order. 😊
Haha, no. It’s more to do with Cosa Nostra structure. It would only bother a few sad pedants, myself included.
For a start, there’s no way a non-Italian could ever be consigliere, but the main thing is that the Corleone family isn’t one of the five families. That’s just ridiculous.
See, I told you it wouldn’t bother you.
I’ve read before ( I think comments on IMDb) about the unlikely appointment of Tom Hagen as consigliere.
Perhaps Mario Puzo may have known someone irl who filled this role for a Don, for a time.
No chance.
Anyway, Goodfellas….
The true story of the Lufthansa heist and the huge Vario crew, part of the Lucchese crime family, which is still active, as is that particular crew. The story is told through the lives of Jimmy ‘The Gent’ Burke (incredibly traumatic childhood) Tommy Di Simone, and Karen and Henry Hill etc. The Lufthansa heist was probably the biggest robbery in US history, the last of the money only recently partly gambled away and partly invested in a failed animation film, by the current consigliere of the Bonnano crime family, Angelo ‘Bruno’ Indelacotta, husband to one of Jimmy The Gent’s two daughters, who inherited the spoils. Bruno was meant to be killed in the legendary ‘three capos hit’ featured in Donnie Brasco, and was part of the crew that assassinated then-Bonnano boss Carmine Galante - you may have seen a fairly famous photograph of Galante dead in a pool of blood with his cigar still in his clenched teeth.
There were 12 murders in the aftermath of the robbery as Jimmy and his friends tried to silence anybody who might harm their chances of getting away with it.
Great film, incredible story, and there’s lots more to it that’s not depicted in the film.
Post by: Louzie0 on October 12, 2024, 01:19:01 AM
Bit wild as a suggestion, I admit.I rate GF2 just ahead of GF1, mainly because of the story of Vito (and Clemenza).
I imagine the ‘glaring inaccuracy’ in GF isn’t Apollonia getting the days of the week in the wrong order. 😊
Haha, no. It’s more to do with Cosa Nostra structure. It would only bother a few sad pedants, myself included.
For a start, there’s no way a non-Italian could ever be consigliere, but the main thing is that the Corleone family isn’t one of the five families. That’s just ridiculous.
See, I told you it wouldn’t bother you.
I’ve read before ( I think comments on IMDb) about the unlikely appointment of Tom Hagen as consigliere.
Perhaps Mario Puzo may have known someone irl who filled this role for a Don, for a time.
No chance.
Anyway, Goodfellas….
The true story of the Lufthansa heist and the huge Vario crew, part of the Lucchese crime family, which is still active, as is that particular crew. The story is told through the lives of Jimmy ‘The Gent’ Burke (incredibly traumatic childhood) Tommy Di Simone, and Karen and Henry Hill etc. The Lufthansa heist was probably the biggest robbery in US history, the last of the money only recently partly gambled away and partly invested in a failed animation film, by the current consigliere of the Bonnano crime family, Angelo ‘Bruno’ Indelacotta, husband to one of Jimmy The Gent’s two daughters, who inherited the spoils. Bruno was meant to be killed in the legendary ‘three capos hit’ featured in Donnie Brasco, and was part of the crew that assassinated then-Bonnano boss Carmine Galante - you may have seen a fairly famous photograph of Galante dead in a pool of blood with his cigar still in his clenched teeth.
There were 12 murders in the aftermath of the robbery as Jimmy and his friends tried to silence anybody who might harm their chances of getting away with it.
Great film, incredible story, and there’s lots more to it that’s not depicted in the film.
I had no idea it was based on a true story. Apologies if it starts with those words, I completely forgot them during the film, and since!
Looking at the cast, though, I’m reminded there was some stunning talent involved.
Post by: eamonn on October 12, 2024, 02:07:30 AM
Post by: Percy McCarthy on October 12, 2024, 02:13:03 AM
Bit wild as a suggestion, I admit.I rate GF2 just ahead of GF1, mainly because of the story of Vito (and Clemenza).
I imagine the ‘glaring inaccuracy’ in GF isn’t Apollonia getting the days of the week in the wrong order. 😊
Haha, no. It’s more to do with Cosa Nostra structure. It would only bother a few sad pedants, myself included.
For a start, there’s no way a non-Italian could ever be consigliere, but the main thing is that the Corleone family isn’t one of the five families. That’s just ridiculous.
See, I told you it wouldn’t bother you.
I’ve read before ( I think comments on IMDb) about the unlikely appointment of Tom Hagen as consigliere.
Perhaps Mario Puzo may have known someone irl who filled this role for a Don, for a time.
No chance.
Anyway, Goodfellas….
The true story of the Lufthansa heist and the huge Vario crew, part of the Lucchese crime family, which is still active, as is that particular crew. The story is told through the lives of Jimmy ‘The Gent’ Burke (incredibly traumatic childhood) Tommy Di Simone, and Karen and Henry Hill etc. The Lufthansa heist was probably the biggest robbery in US history, the last of the money only recently partly gambled away and partly invested in a failed animation film, by the current consigliere of the Bonnano crime family, Angelo ‘Bruno’ Indelacotta, husband to one of Jimmy The Gent’s two daughters, who inherited the spoils. Bruno was meant to be killed in the legendary ‘three capos hit’ featured in Donnie Brasco, and was part of the crew that assassinated then-Bonnano boss Carmine Galante - you may have seen a fairly famous photograph of Galante dead in a pool of blood with his cigar still in his clenched teeth.
There were 12 murders in the aftermath of the robbery as Jimmy and his friends tried to silence anybody who might harm their chances of getting away with it.
Great film, incredible story, and there’s lots more to it that’s not depicted in the film.
I had no idea it was based on a true story. Apologies if it starts with those words, I completely forgot them during the film, and since!
Looking at the cast, though, I’m reminded there was some stunning talent involved.
No need to apologise Lou. Very accurate film, apart from Billy Bats wasn’t made, and Karen was having an affair with Paul Vario (Paulie Cicero in the film), and was sexually assaulted by Tommy Di Simone (Tommy De Vito in the film - Joe Pesci’s character) which they left out, probably because it was all based on her husband’s version of the story.
Other true stories of the mob:
Donnie Brasco
Casino
Gotti* (HBO 1996 version - avoid the Travolta one at all costs)
The Youngest Godfather*
Witness to the Mob*
Boss of Bosses*
Rob The Mob
Kill The Irishman
Black Mass
Bugsy
Honor Thy Father*
*Available on YouTube
The Irishman purports to be true but it’s so inaccurate I can’t add it to the list.
Anyway, Ross is the Boss. Ok footie?
Post by: Percy McCarthy on October 12, 2024, 02:14:23 AM
No more quotathons please!
Sorry!
Post by: Chap on October 12, 2024, 03:45:55 AM
Don’t be sorry, Percy. Your expertise in this area is fascinating.No more quotathons please!
Sorry!
Signed - Ross Barkley🤣🤣
Post by: Percy McCarthy on October 12, 2024, 03:51:50 AM
Don’t be sorry, Percy. Your expertise in this area is fascinating.No more quotathons please!
Sorry!
Signed - Ross Barkley🤣🤣
Ah, thanks Chap. I really appreciate those kind words about me and my hobby.
Post by: Chap on October 12, 2024, 03:54:42 AM
Post by: adrenachrome on October 12, 2024, 04:02:50 AM
Could we move this non-Ross Barkley discussion from the main service board to the relevant place in other? With all due respect, this is unrelated and is entirely about films or books without mentioning Ross.
Al Pacino starred in all 3 Godfather films, as well as Glengarry Glen Ross.
Coffee is for closers. I always thought this was quite sinister.
Dennis Amiss and Bill Edrich would have never got a good cup of Joe on that basis.
Post by: Percy McCarthy on October 12, 2024, 06:44:34 AM
My favourite bit is when someone who was beaten up by Gotti appears in court. By this time however, he has discovered who the accused truly is, and pretends he’s never seen him before, except on the news or in the papers.
The headline in one of the New York papers the next day?
“I FORGOTTI”.
Post by: Ads on October 12, 2024, 09:12:43 AM
Post by: dave shelley on October 12, 2024, 09:29:44 AM
Post by: Clampy on October 12, 2024, 09:32:21 AM
Some of the interviews with the real Henry Hill on you tube are quite interesting.
Post by: Brazilian Villain on October 12, 2024, 09:50:17 AM
Post by: Olneythelonely on October 12, 2024, 11:31:15 AM
Goodfellas is an absolute masterpiece.
Some of the interviews with the real Henry Hill on you tube are quite interesting.
He was on Howard Stern once and someone calls in calling him a “rat”. It’s great.
Post by: Risso on October 12, 2024, 11:39:18 AM
as well as Glengarry Glen Ross.
Superb film, where every line is brilliantly delivered.
"As you all know, first prize is a Cadillac Eldorado. Anyone want to see second prize? Second prize's a set of steak knives. Third prize is, you're fired."
Post by: Footy-Vill on October 12, 2024, 11:39:30 AM
And if Footy has his way I would miss them as I rarely venture to the Off topic page. This is what makes this site so much fun.The non Barkley content is of interest to people clearly. And while I appreciate that you enjoy to read on Ross Barkley thread , I find such deviations perplexing and detracting from specific Ross Barkley discussions. I do realise and respect that you would miss out on the information because you, like me, don't much go in for the off topic and like the main service user board.
I'm just concerned that specific player thread topics will deviate to such an extent that the title thread becomes an irrelevance and that would not only lead to chaos but hard to follow communications , debate and discussion on Ross Barkley in this instance or whichever player thread the off topic discussion occurs.
Post by: Footy-Vill on October 12, 2024, 11:40:53 AM
Seemingly for some it's clearly not an issue as it is for me and perhaps others in trying to read and understand if there is or isn't connection t the specific thread, and I do not mean to be disparaging on the non Barkley chat in any way. I hope that all makes sense.
My final point and a concern is that this may be a precedent now where other films and books are discussed in other players' threads with no connection to the specific player. I do hope that doesn't occur and at the moment, I've concluded that it's the international break, which makes non-football chat more prevalence on main discussion board topic threads leading to such content being placed on player threads with no connection to the player.
Post by: Chris Smith on October 12, 2024, 11:45:03 AM
And if Footy has his way I would miss them as I rarely venture to the Off topic page. This is what makes this site so much fun.The non Barkley content is of interest to people clearly. And while I appreciate that you enjoy to read on Ross Barkley thread , I find such deviations perplexing and detracting from specific Ross Barkley discussions. I do realise and respect that you would miss out on the information because you, like me, don't much go in for the off topic and like the main service user board.
I'm just concerned that specific player thread topics will deviate to such an extent that the title thread becomes an irrelevance and that would not only lead to chaos but hard to follow communications , debate and discussion on Ross Barkley in this instance or whichever player thread the off topic discussion occurs.
You’re in a minority though so you just have to accept that it is the way things go with this thing of ours.
Post by: Risso on October 12, 2024, 11:49:54 AM
However, I can see that people are enjoying the non-Ross Barkley discussion on the Ross Barkley thread, All I can do is avoid during the international break and until Ross becomes newsworthy again. Of course, seeing new posts causes me to think there some Ross Barkley conversation, so you can perhaps see the confusion I'm experiencing.
Seemingly for some it's clearly not an issue as it is for me and perhaps others in trying to read and understand if there is or isn't connection t the specific thread, and I do not mean to be disparaging on the non Barkley chat in any way. I hope that all makes sense.
My final point and a concern is that this may be a precedent now where other films and books are discussed in other players' threads with no connection to the specific player. I do hope that doesn't occur and at the moment, I've concluded that it's the international break, which makes non-football chat more prevalence on main discussion board topic threads leading to such content being placed on player threads with no connection to the player.
Honestly, you'd be a lot happier posting on Villatalk. They don't allow any deviation from the subject of the topic at all over there, you'd be right at home.
Post by: Footy-Vill on October 12, 2024, 12:04:36 PM
Post by: Brazilian Villain on October 12, 2024, 12:06:47 PM
My donations sponsorship expires in November, but I don't want to leave. I guess I can look into Villa Talk to see the format, but I don't really want to change or move to something unfamiliar. Despite the occasional rudeness and maltreatment, I believe this is a decent service board with a lot of knowledge and has great tradition! Good day, sir!
Post by: FrankyH on October 12, 2024, 12:30:54 PM
Anyway back on topic, let's hope Barkley proves to be a bigger steal than the Lufthansa job.
Post by: Chap on October 12, 2024, 04:20:03 PM
My donations sponsorship expires in November, but I don't want to leave. I guess I can look into Villa Talk to see the format, but I don't really want to change or move to something unfamiliar. Despite the occasional rudeness and maltreatment, I believe this is a decent service board with a lot of knowledge and has great tradition! Good day, sir!There’s no need to leave, you just need to be a bit more accepting that this is the way it is and always has been on here.
Post by: KevinGage on October 12, 2024, 07:54:08 PM
But what would you do with unlimited power?
Wix have some pretty sweet deals going on at the minute, if you want to get started.
Post by: RamboandBruno on October 12, 2024, 09:16:02 PM
Came out in 1990 I think, just as i was about to start A-Level media studies, followed later by a degree in film and tv studies. Goodfellas was my absolute favourite film of that time. Pesci & Liotta have never been better and De Niro was in his pomp. Lorraine Bracco was brilliant as well. So many memorable lines, even some of the more throwaway ones.. was it Jimmy Two Times, as he said everything twice, like ‘I’m just gonna get the papers, get the papers’!! And obviously ‘the way I saw it, everyone takes a beating sometime’!Bit wild as a suggestion, I admit.I rate GF2 just ahead of GF1, mainly because of the story of Vito (and Clemenza).
I imagine the ‘glaring inaccuracy’ in GF isn’t Apollonia getting the days of the week in the wrong order. 😊
Haha, no. It’s more to do with Cosa Nostra structure. It would only bother a few sad pedants, myself included.
For a start, there’s no way a non-Italian could ever be consigliere, but the main thing is that the Corleone family isn’t one of the five families. That’s just ridiculous.
See, I told you it wouldn’t bother you.
I’ve read before ( I think comments on IMDb) about the unlikely appointment of Tom Hagen as consigliere.
Perhaps Mario Puzo may have known someone irl who filled this role for a Don, for a time.
No chance.
Anyway, Goodfellas….
The true story of the Lufthansa heist and the huge Vario crew, part of the Lucchese crime family, which is still active, as is that particular crew. The story is told through the lives of Jimmy ‘The Gent’ Burke (incredibly traumatic childhood) Tommy Di Simone, and Karen and Henry Hill etc. The Lufthansa heist was probably the biggest robbery in US history, the last of the money only recently partly gambled away and partly invested in a failed animation film, by the current consigliere of the Bonnano crime family, Angelo ‘Bruno’ Indelacotta, husband to one of Jimmy The Gent’s two daughters, who inherited the spoils. Bruno was meant to be killed in the legendary ‘three capos hit’ featured in Donnie Brasco, and was part of the crew that assassinated then-Bonnano boss Carmine Galante - you may have seen a fairly famous photograph of Galante dead in a pool of blood with his cigar still in his clenched teeth.
There were 12 murders in the aftermath of the robbery as Jimmy and his friends tried to silence anybody who might harm their chances of getting away with it.
Great film, incredible story, and there’s lots more to it that’s not depicted in the film.
The opening pre opening credits scene with Bats in the boot of the car, punches you in the face, and the pace never ever drops. Could easily watch that again tonight.
Post by: Percy McCarthy on October 12, 2024, 09:37:45 PM
Came out in 1990 I think, just as i was about to start A-Level media studies, followed later by a degree in film and tv studies. Goodfellas was my absolute favourite film of that time. Pesci & Liotta have never been better and De Niro was in his pomp. Lorraine Bracco was brilliant as well. So many memorable lines, even some of the more throwaway ones.. was it Jimmy Two Times, as he said everything twice, like ‘I’m just gonna get the papers, get the papers’!! And obviously ‘the way I saw it, everyone takes a beating sometime’!Bit wild as a suggestion, I admit.I rate GF2 just ahead of GF1, mainly because of the story of Vito (and Clemenza).
I imagine the ‘glaring inaccuracy’ in GF isn’t Apollonia getting the days of the week in the wrong order. 😊
Haha, no. It’s more to do with Cosa Nostra structure. It would only bother a few sad pedants, myself included.
For a start, there’s no way a non-Italian could ever be consigliere, but the main thing is that the Corleone family isn’t one of the five families. That’s just ridiculous.
See, I told you it wouldn’t bother you.
I’ve read before ( I think comments on IMDb) about the unlikely appointment of Tom Hagen as consigliere.
Perhaps Mario Puzo may have known someone irl who filled this role for a Don, for a time.
No chance.
Anyway, Goodfellas….
The true story of the Lufthansa heist and the huge Vario crew, part of the Lucchese crime family, which is still active, as is that particular crew. The story is told through the lives of Jimmy ‘The Gent’ Burke (incredibly traumatic childhood) Tommy Di Simone, and Karen and Henry Hill etc. The Lufthansa heist was probably the biggest robbery in US history, the last of the money only recently partly gambled away and partly invested in a failed animation film, by the current consigliere of the Bonnano crime family, Angelo ‘Bruno’ Indelacotta, husband to one of Jimmy The Gent’s two daughters, who inherited the spoils. Bruno was meant to be killed in the legendary ‘three capos hit’ featured in Donnie Brasco, and was part of the crew that assassinated then-Bonnano boss Carmine Galante - you may have seen a fairly famous photograph of Galante dead in a pool of blood with his cigar still in his clenched teeth.
There were 12 murders in the aftermath of the robbery as Jimmy and his friends tried to silence anybody who might harm their chances of getting away with it.
Great film, incredible story, and there’s lots more to it that’s not depicted in the film.
The opening pre opening credits scene with Bats in the boot of the car, punches you in the face, and the pace never ever drops. Could easily watch that again tonight.
Like everybody else in the film, Jimmy Two Times was based on a real person. His was actually known as Johnny Echoes.
Post by: DrGonzo on October 12, 2024, 09:47:00 PM
I think Barkley, like James Caan, is a decent number two for our midfield cover. Let's just not get him shot up at a toll booth, huh?
Post by: Percy McCarthy on October 12, 2024, 09:58:41 PM
Post by: purpletrousers on October 13, 2024, 04:49:36 AM
Probably also realising Footy, the more you try to enforce an imagined rule that isn’t there, like not swearing of staying on topic, the more people enjoy doing the opposite. I think you’ve requested people best say nothing in the past, it’s likely your most effective strategy..,And if Footy has his way I would miss them as I rarely venture to the Off topic page. This is what makes this site so much fun.The non Barkley content is of interest to people clearly. And while I appreciate that you enjoy to read on Ross Barkley thread , I find such deviations perplexing and detracting from specific Ross Barkley discussions. I do realise and respect that you would miss out on the information because you, like me, don't much go in for the off topic and like the main service user board.
I'm just concerned that specific player thread topics will deviate to such an extent that the title thread becomes an irrelevance and that would not only lead to chaos but hard to follow communications , debate and discussion on Ross Barkley in this instance or whichever player thread the off topic discussion occurs.
You’re in a minority though so you just have to accept that it is the way things go with this thing of ours.
Post by: eamonn on October 13, 2024, 10:22:31 AM
He looks a bit....culturally redundant. No offence, like.
Post by: Brazilian Villain on October 13, 2024, 10:30:19 AM
I do wonder if Barkley is up on his mob movies.
He looks a bit....culturally redundant. No offence, like.
Not sure about his taste in films but I've heard his favourite bands are U2 and Suede.
Post by: OCD on October 13, 2024, 12:04:16 PM
I do wonder if Barkley is up on his mob movies.
He looks a bit....culturally redundant. No offence, like.
Not sure about his taste in films but I've heard his favourite bands are U2 and Suede.
This should have shown up in Emery's research you would have thought.
Post by: Footy-Vill on October 20, 2024, 10:20:19 AM
Post by: Olneythelonely on October 20, 2024, 10:31:47 AM
How was Barkley when be came on Vs Fulham? I would not be averse to starting him Vs Bologna.
Presumably the second part of your post, depends on the first part?
What if I told you he just ran around doing breakdance moves, whilst Unai screamed at him to “be more demanding” and to “get back into position, you fuck”?
Because that’s what happened.
Post by: Louzie0 on October 20, 2024, 05:09:29 PM
Post by: Somniloquism on October 20, 2024, 05:29:11 PM
How was Barkley when be came on Vs Fulham? I would not be averse to starting him Vs Bologna.
Presumably the second part of your post, depends on the first part?
I was always sceptical on more people being behind the account. But as FV was watching the game and pasting in players threads about items happening on the pitch live, he suddenly doesn't know how players played during the match.
Post by: cdbearsfan on October 20, 2024, 05:38:21 PM
Post by: Sexual Ealing on October 20, 2024, 05:48:00 PM
FV, you could give Goodfellas a go, it's really very good indeed. Then you could join in and make a friend for life out of Percy?
As far back as I can remember, I always wanted to be a lifelong friend of Percy.
Post by: cdbearsfan on October 20, 2024, 05:54:22 PM
Post by: Villan For Life on October 20, 2024, 05:58:20 PM
FV, you could give Goodfellas a go, it's really very good indeed. Then you could join in and make a friend for life out of Percy?
He’s always struck me as a supermarket own brand value range pizza. Perhaps he should leave the cannoli
Post by: Sexual Ealing on October 20, 2024, 05:59:27 PM
Footy how? Like a clown?
The good half.
Post by: RamboandBruno on October 20, 2024, 06:42:44 PM
Footy-here to fucking amuse youFooty how? Like a clown?
The good half.
Post by: Footy-Vill on October 20, 2024, 06:50:11 PM
I despair sometimes I really do.
If I was aware of how he played yesterday I would not have asked .
I had hoped some one may have been helpful in sharing observations of his play yesterday!
Post by: Olneythelonely on October 20, 2024, 07:03:42 PM
I ask a valid question about Barkley and get a series of questionable responses.
I despair sometimes I really do.
If I was aware of how he played yesterday I would not have asked .
I had hoped some one may have been helpful in sharing observations of his play yesterday!
Did you not watch the match?
Post by: Olneythelonely on October 20, 2024, 07:07:00 PM
How good is this guy?
Fulham haven't got a comparable midfielder in the slightest.
Brilliant player.
I only ask because you said this about Tielemans yesterday, on about the 80th minute mark. 5 minutes after Barkley came on.
Post by: cdbearsfan on October 20, 2024, 07:09:21 PM
Thread's gone.
Post by: Chap on October 20, 2024, 07:11:53 PM
Will people stop bringing football into it, please.Mash potatoes on a Sunday lunch, right or wrong?
Thread's gone.
Post by: Olneythelonely on October 20, 2024, 07:12:03 PM
Will people stop bringing football into it, please.
Thread's gone.
Sorry.
Why don’t you go fuck yourself, CD?
Post by: VILLA MOLE on October 20, 2024, 07:12:56 PM
Will people stop bringing football into it, please.Mash potatoes on a Sunday lunch, right or wrong?
Thread's gone.
nope
Post by: Risso on October 20, 2024, 07:14:57 PM
I ask a valid question about Barkley and get a series of questionable responses.
I despair sometimes I really do.
If I was aware of how he played yesterday I would not have asked .
I had hoped some one may have been helpful in sharing observations of his play yesterday!
How is that you saw some players play in the game, but still don't know how Onana and Barkley got on?
Post by: VillaTim on October 20, 2024, 07:16:13 PM
AffirmativeWill people stop bringing football into it, please.Mash potatoes on a Sunday lunch, right or wrong?
Thread's gone.
Post by: Footy-Vill on October 20, 2024, 07:18:46 PM
I ask a valid question about Barkley and get a series of questionable responses.
I despair sometimes I really do.
If I was aware of how he played yesterday I would not have asked .
I had hoped some one may have been helpful in sharing observations of his play yesterday!
How is that you saw some players play in the game, but still don't know how Onana and Barkley got on?
Have you considered I ended up having to listen to some of the match thus meaning these two players weren't really mentioning in commentary.
I shouldn't have to explain all this I was just hoping for some friendly observations about both players!!
Post by: VillaTim on October 20, 2024, 07:20:23 PM
Post by: pauliewalnuts on October 20, 2024, 08:02:32 PM
I ask a valid question about Barkley and get a series of questionable responses.
I despair sometimes I really do.
If I was aware of how he played yesterday I would not have asked .
I had hoped some one may have been helpful in sharing observations of his play yesterday!
How is that you saw some players play in the game, but still don't know how Onana and Barkley got on?
Badly timed shift switchover.
Post by: cdbearsfan on October 20, 2024, 08:03:35 PM
Will people stop bringing football into it, please.
Thread's gone.
Sorry.
Why don’t you go fuck yourself, CD?
That's more like it. Back on track.
Post by: Percy McCarthy on October 21, 2024, 03:32:52 AM
Footy-here to fucking amuse youFooty how? Like a clown?
The good half.
He was watching the game, then someone told him to go and fuck his mother.
Post by: Louzie0 on October 21, 2024, 03:44:19 AM
Post by: Percy McCarthy on October 21, 2024, 04:48:38 AM
This has gone rather dark, all of a sudden.
Apologies Lou. It’s a line out of the particular scene in Goodfellas from which people are quoting.
Post by: Louzie0 on October 21, 2024, 01:07:45 PM
It’s some time since I last saw Goodfellas, so I didn’t recall the line - it shows how menacing the mob were in the film, if a random line from it can change a quite lighthearted exchange on here into a threat!
Anyway, Ross Barkley. I thought he played well. 👍
Post by: Dogtanian on October 21, 2024, 01:16:13 PM
But, I have seen the episode of Quantum Leap where Sam leaps into a mobster and there is something to do with a marriage, so I'm assuming that's exactly the same.
And of course Sam would never sully our living rooms with foul-mouthed threats. Not until he met the Suliban, anyway.
Post by: cdbearsfan on October 21, 2024, 02:09:50 PM
Post by: Sexual Ealing on October 21, 2024, 02:27:32 PM
Post by: Somniloquism on October 21, 2024, 02:32:17 PM
Post by: Dogtanian on October 21, 2024, 03:00:57 PM
I shall engage in negotiations this evening.
Post by: Brazilian Villain on October 21, 2024, 05:26:15 PM
Stop posting on here and watch Goodfellas immediately. 😡
Good advice and if you like that, also watch Casino.
Post by: cdbearsfan on October 21, 2024, 05:39:13 PM
Post by: Dave on December 11, 2024, 08:49:22 AM
And the prize money difference from a draw to a win covers about half his transfer fee, not withstanding how the two extra points might be the difference between top eight and top twenty four.
Just an excellent player to have in the squad.
Post by: Risso on December 11, 2024, 09:14:21 AM
Now equalled his goals total from 20-21 (all scored since the last post on this thread).
And the prize money difference from a draw to a win covers about half his transfer fee, not withstanding how the two extra points might be the difference between top eight and top twenty four.
Just an excellent player to have in the squad.
On the negative side, Heck's now missed out on the income from two extra games. Barkley out!
Post by: Demitri_C on December 11, 2024, 09:44:37 AM
Post by: itbrvilla on December 11, 2024, 09:47:14 AM
The prize money for finishing top 8 makes up for that.Now equalled his goals total from 20-21 (all scored since the last post on this thread).
And the prize money difference from a draw to a win covers about half his transfer fee, not withstanding how the two extra points might be the difference between top eight and top twenty four.
Just an excellent player to have in the squad.
On the negative side, Heck's now missed out on the income from two extra games. Barkley out!
Post by: Drummond on December 11, 2024, 09:48:56 AM
Now equalled his goals total from 20-21 (all scored since the last post on this thread).
And the prize money difference from a draw to a win covers about half his transfer fee, not withstanding how the two extra points might be the difference between top eight and top twenty four.
Just an excellent player to have in the squad.
On the negative side, Heck's now missed out on the income from two extra games. Barkley out!
Haha, I did wonder about that, but the prize money for Top 8 is more than the revenue would be for the play-offs isn't it? Unless Heck decided to make every seat GA++ for those games...
Post by: Dave on December 11, 2024, 09:52:33 AM
The prize money for finishing top 8 makes up for that.Now equalled his goals total from 20-21 (all scored since the last post on this thread).
And the prize money difference from a draw to a win covers about half his transfer fee, not withstanding how the two extra points might be the difference between top eight and top twenty four.
Just an excellent player to have in the squad.
On the negative side, Heck's now missed out on the income from two extra games. Barkley out!
I think he was joking, but yes - you get an extra €275,000 for every place higher up the league, and there's a €10m jump in prize money from first knockout to round of 16.
So I think (depending on how much Heck were to fleece out of people) that if you finished ninth and THEN qualified through the first knock-out stage (thus still getting the extra prize money) it could theoretically work out financially better to have the two extra games.
But I'm guessing they'd just prefer the extra €10m guaranteed.
Post by: Somniloquism on December 11, 2024, 12:57:04 PM
I think he was joking, but yes - you get an extra €275,000 for every place higher up the league, and there's a €10m jump in prize money from first knockout to round of 16.
So I think (depending on how much Heck were to fleece out of people) that if you finished ninth and THEN qualified through the first knock-out stage (thus still getting the extra prize money) it could theoretically work out financially better to have the two extra games.
But I'm guessing they'd just prefer the extra €10m guaranteed.
It wouldn't be close. (all prices Euros) 2.1m per win against 700k for a draw (and nothing for a loss) means to not qualify in the top 8 would lose us between 2-4 mil for not getting the wins needed to qualify. Getting into the knockout round is 1m so it adds some back, but you get no extra prize money unless you win the knockout, in which case you get the 11mil you mentioned. And Heck can only squeeze money on one of the games anyway as the other would be elsewhere.
(and that is not including the league position money you mentioned)
Post by: Risso on December 11, 2024, 12:58:47 PM
Post by: PaulWinch again on December 11, 2024, 01:09:08 PM
Post by: eamonn on December 11, 2024, 01:23:10 PM
Post by: Hookeysmith on December 11, 2024, 02:15:48 PM
It was never going in but we deserved a bit of luck last night.
Agreed - during our dodgy run every loose ball, every iffy bounce seemed to go to the opposition
Post by: dcdavecollett on December 12, 2024, 01:02:47 AM
Post by: Percy McCarthy on December 12, 2024, 01:35:35 AM
I thought the line of Ross's original shot was heading just inside the other post, but now we'll never know...
Yes, it was, but the keeper looked like he would have saved that one.
Post by: adrenachrome on December 12, 2024, 02:36:33 AM
I thought the line of Ross's original shot was heading just inside the other post, but now we'll never know...
Yes, it was, but the keeper looked like he would have saved that one.
There was also the fact that Ross slipped just about when he took the shot.
The point is that if a player has space to have a go, then he should take it, unless a pass would be a better option.
Post by: AV84 on December 12, 2024, 08:42:38 PM
Post by: usav on December 12, 2024, 08:46:55 PM
He slipped and I think it hit both defenders on the way in. Bounced off one's foot into the other's stomach. Definitely the luckiest goal I've seen for a while.
Since Rogers at Fulham?
Post by: AV84 on December 12, 2024, 08:49:50 PM
He slipped and I think it hit both defenders on the way in. Bounced off one's foot into the other's stomach. Definitely the luckiest goal I've seen for a while.
Since Rogers at Fulham?
He didn't slip though. Just the deflection.
Post by: VillaTim on December 12, 2024, 09:01:38 PM
Post by: Richard E on December 12, 2024, 09:04:40 PM
If you don't buy a ticket you can't win the lottery
Well, you say that but:-
you could steal a ticket
you could forge a ticket
Someone could give you a ticket as a present
You could hack the lottery computer
Post by: Somniloquism on December 13, 2024, 12:25:30 AM
Post by: Gerrin on January 04, 2025, 05:28:19 PM
Post by: PaulWinch again on January 04, 2025, 05:33:38 PM
Post by: Gerrin on January 04, 2025, 05:43:40 PM
Post by: Smirker on January 04, 2025, 06:33:49 PM
Big, powerful player. Lots of skill and intelligence. Go on Ross.
Post by: RamboandBruno on January 04, 2025, 06:36:10 PM
Post by: Dave on January 04, 2025, 07:14:51 PM
For the first sixty minutes he seemed to be where our (very limited) attacking momentum went to die.
Post by: brontebilly on January 04, 2025, 07:25:19 PM
Don't think we will get away with both him and Tielemans against better teams though. Tielemans was average at best today.
Post by: Monty on January 04, 2025, 07:27:21 PM
Agree that he improved a lot second half though, thought he showed strong personality and will to help keep us on the front foot and force the opening goal, which he obviously took superbly.
Post by: darren woolley on January 05, 2025, 02:37:27 PM
Post by: DB on January 05, 2025, 02:50:20 PM
Post by: john e on January 05, 2025, 03:00:05 PM
Fantastic finish
I thought he’d flopp this season but he’s definitely had some good moments
Post by: AV84 on January 05, 2025, 03:02:14 PM
Post by: Ian. on January 05, 2025, 03:05:37 PM
Post by: London Villan on January 05, 2025, 03:09:15 PM
Post by: Paul.S on January 05, 2025, 03:33:28 PM
Post by: usav on January 05, 2025, 03:58:49 PM
I thought he’d flopp this season but he’s definitely had some good moments
Strange comment after the season he had last year. He was never going to be a starter here with a full squad, but definitely a contributor - and he's doing just that.
Post by: DB on January 05, 2025, 06:00:40 PM
And Matty Cash and Watkins.
…and Buendia.
Post by: PaulWinch again on January 05, 2025, 07:38:35 PM
I thought he’d flopp this season but he’s definitely had some good moments
Strange comment after the season he had last year. He was never going to be a starter here with a full squad, but definitely a contributor - and he's doing just that.
Indeed he is the absolute epitome of a quality player to add squad depth.
Post by: VillaTim on January 05, 2025, 09:19:05 PM
Post by: rob_bridge on January 06, 2025, 11:38:11 AM
Barkley is exactly the type of player we need to plugs gaps in midfield especially with McGinn, Youri and Rogers being able to play more advanced
Post by: SaddVillan on January 10, 2025, 11:31:05 PM
Meatball- hammy.
And now Barkley.
ai Emery says Ross Barkley could be out for up to three weeks after the Aston Villa midfielder picked up a calf injury in Friday’s FA Cup victory over West Ham United.
Post by: Somniloquism on January 10, 2025, 11:32:06 PM
Post by: London Villan on January 11, 2025, 12:00:27 AM
Post by: LeeB on January 11, 2025, 12:02:53 AM
Calling Turin.
"Look, you're not using him, come on. Promise we'll sort you out later, you can have first dibs on Ollie in the summer"
Post by: Brazilian Villain on January 11, 2025, 12:23:50 AM
Calling Turin.
Royaume-Uni...douze points!
Post by: Gerrin on January 11, 2025, 09:17:33 AM
We just can't get a break.
Meatball- hammy.
And now Barkley.
ai Emery says Ross Barkley could be out for up to three weeks after the Aston Villa midfielder picked up a calf injury in Friday’s FA Cup victory over West Ham United.
Gutted for the lad, just seemed to be getting going. And he looked gutted when he had to go off.
Post by: Villafirst on January 31, 2025, 03:32:10 PM
Post by: RamboandBruno on January 31, 2025, 05:24:45 PM
UE said Barkley is still about a week away from returning to training.Be good to get him back, he’d been impressive this season
Post by: rougegorge on February 11, 2025, 12:26:23 PM
Post by: kippaxvilla2 on February 11, 2025, 01:24:24 PM
Post by: Tuscans on February 24, 2025, 03:39:49 PM
"MCL tear*. Calf happened trying to play on with the knee issue. Not far off 👍🏻"
Post by: enigma on February 24, 2025, 03:53:28 PM
Post by: Somniloquism on February 24, 2025, 03:56:12 PM
Post by: enigma on February 24, 2025, 04:03:41 PM
Lierally no truth to that at all then.
Post by: Somniloquism on February 24, 2025, 04:07:45 PM
Post by: enigma on February 24, 2025, 04:10:26 PM
Post by: Somniloquism on February 24, 2025, 04:15:03 PM
Post by: tomd2103 on February 24, 2025, 09:08:09 PM
Medial Cruciate Ligament. One of the side ligaments for the knee.
Would guess it is what Mings has done as well.
Post by: AV84 on February 24, 2025, 09:51:31 PM
Post by: ChicagoLion on February 24, 2025, 09:52:28 PM
Is he saying he's not far off being back? Or is he responding to someone guessing what's wrong with him, and he's saying they're not far off?The former surely.
Post by: Toronto Villa on March 28, 2025, 02:19:57 PM
Post by: AV82EC on March 28, 2025, 02:27:36 PM
Post by: Hillbilly on March 28, 2025, 10:21:04 PM
Good news, another body for the run in.
I heard that in a General Melchett voice.
Post by: AV84 on March 29, 2025, 08:23:59 AM
Post by: Rigadon on March 29, 2025, 08:25:49 AM
Post by: Mellin on March 29, 2025, 10:44:02 AM