The International Cricket Thread

[taylorsworkrate]

Its all well and good going through the tail (which he's done in one test), but when you offer absolutely nothing against the top or middle order in terms of either control or wickets then its a bit too little too late to be honest.

Archer will doubtless come in for the 3rd test for Tongue. Another poor decision not to release Archer to get some more overs in his legs for Sussex this week. There's almost a blind arrogance in the setup at times. Bowling first again was purely to prove some sort of point with no logic behind it. Bashir is a vanity project who should be nowhere near the team. They should be embarrassed that Root took his wicket with a ball that spun big whilst Bashir failed to get a single ball off the straight in a day and a half

[Beard82]

They use Dukes in test matches in England.

Kookaburras are being used for a few games in the County Championship but not test matches.

I dread to think how bad this would be if they were using a kookaburra

I could've sworn one of the commentators in the first test said they were using kookaburras, might have only half heard and it was a conversation about a county match. Either way, really poor batting from our top 3 has given a false impression that this pitch is anything but a road.

There i a lot of discussion about it - as there using it to try and get players familar with it because its used abroad. 

Some people think its good - because players get used to it.  Others think its bad because the conditions are different so the ball is not suited to the UK.

More importantly - and in keeping with any UK governing body - they have managed to execute it badly.  So the players likely to play in the Ashes this winter (and would benefit from pratice with the Kookaburras) are all now either injuried or playing test cricket with a Dukes ball. 

[PaulWinch again]

Its all well and good going through the tail (which he's done in one test), but when you offer absolutely nothing against the top or middle order in terms of either control or wickets then its a bit too little too late to be honest.

Archer will doubtless come in for the 3rd test for Tongue. Another poor decision not to release Archer to get some more overs in his legs for Sussex this week. There's almost a blind arrogance in the setup at times. Bowling first again was purely to prove some sort of point with no logic behind it. Bashir is a vanity project who should be nowhere near the team. They should be embarrassed that Root took his wicket with a ball that spun big whilst Bashir failed to get a single ball off the straight in a day and a half

I just think you’re reacting to a rough innings. Tongue will get top order players out, he has the attributes that do that.

I agree they’re over dogmatic with Bashir, but equally he’s done pretty well for his age and there isn’t loads of spinners hammering the door down. I’d have Dawson in, but I think they believe Bashir that has a very high ceiling and with some of his wickets and deliveries you can see that.

[Villan For Life]

It was a good days cricket and Gill is in the form of his life.

I was left wondering why Stokes and Woakes didn’t bowl after lunch, I hope they’ve not picked up any injuries.

Brook is a terrible starter, he played and missed at several balls before he got his head down to see us through to the close. I thought India went a little defensive in the last 30 minutes, they’d got 587 runs and we were 3 down, they should have gone all out at us and try to get another couple before stumps.

I’m there again tomorrow, the weather forecast is good so it should be a fascinating days play.

[taylorsworkrate]

Its all well and good going through the tail (which he's done in one test), but when you offer absolutely nothing against the top or middle order in terms of either control or wickets then its a bit too little too late to be honest.

Archer will doubtless come in for the 3rd test for Tongue. Another poor decision not to release Archer to get some more overs in his legs for Sussex this week. There's almost a blind arrogance in the setup at times. Bowling first again was purely to prove some sort of point with no logic behind it. Bashir is a vanity project who should be nowhere near the team. They should be embarrassed that Root took his wicket with a ball that spun big whilst Bashir failed to get a single ball off the straight in a day and a half

I just think you’re reacting to a rough innings. Tongue will get top order players out, he has the attributes that do that.

I agree they’re over dogmatic with Bashir, but equally he’s done pretty well for his age and there isn’t loads of spinners hammering the door down. I’d have Dawson in, but I think they believe Bashir that has a very high ceiling and with some of his wickets and deliveries you can see that.

I think Tongue was poor in both innings at Headingley against the top and middle order. India had a long tail with 3 genuine no 11s and he took some wickets there. I also thought he looked pretty toothless against Zimbabwe.

Bashir is a vanity project that Stokes and McCullum decided to try after watching him on youtube. I don't think he's turned a single ball this series. I agree he has potential to be a reasonable bowler in a few years but he is so far off it at the moment.

[taylorsworkrate]

It was a good days cricket and Gill is in the form of his life.

I was left wondering why Stokes and Woakes didn’t bowl after lunch, I hope they’ve not picked up any injuries.

Brook is a terrible starter, he played and missed at several balls before he got his head down to see us through to the close. I thought India went a little defensive in the last 30 minutes, they’d got 587 runs and we were 3 down, they should have gone all out at us and try to get another couple before stumps.

I’m there again tomorrow, the weather forecast is good so it should be a fascinating days play.

It will be interesting to see if the mindset can change and we can embrace the potential of a draw as not the end of the world!!

[cdbearsfan]

Just chase down 900 in three sessions, no bother.

[olaftab]

I don’t know about Tongue there’s definitely something there.

Half volleys or half trackers mostly

You’re starting to sound like “Coopers Injury”  does on football matters. I agree that Tongue, Carse and Bashir are not the best in the world but they are best in England ATM unless you have alternative suggestions?

[PaulWinch again]

Tongue has plenty of talent, so does Carse, and Bashir is very young.

If fully fit, Wood, Archer, and Atkinson would be involved.

The pitches are flat, they didn’t bowl their best but they’ve each shown plenty.

[Meanwood Villa]

We need to bat all day today. I'm choosing to be optimistic and hopefully at least a couple of players step up and get big scores.

[taylorsworkrate]

I don’t know about Tongue there’s definitely something there.

Half volleys or half trackers mostly

You’re starting to sound like “Coopers Injury”  does on football matters. I agree that Tongue, Carse and Bashir are not the best in the world but they are best in England ATM unless you have alternative suggestions?

Carse is ok. Probably better suited to away conditions with his back of a length bowling.

Dawson and Leach would both be an instant upgrade on Bashir as a spinner. Bashir could be good in a few years time but at present is merely a Stokes and McCullum vanity project.

Tongue is in the team because of a massive injury backlog in fairness. He won't be in the team in the next game which I'd think both Atkinson and Archer will come into. The daft thing is that England have moved on from Jimmy Anderson who would absolutely still love to play and is absolutely still good enough to get into the team.

Crawley
Duckett
Pope
Root
Brookes
Stokes
Smith
Dawson
Atkinson
Archer
Anderson

That would be my team for the next game (Woakes and Carse have some fitness concerns). Think that would be a big upgrade in the spin department with added runs from Dawson. Atkinson, Archer and Anderson would all be upgrades on the current seam attack too. It won't happen clearly as Anderson won't be considered.

[PaulWinch again]

Jimmy would be doing nothing on this pitch. Towards the end of his time he was economical, but he’d lost at lot of his wicket taking ability.

[taylorsworkrate]

Jimmy would be doing nothing on this pitch. Towards the end of his time he was economical, but he’d lost at lot of his wicket taking ability.

Purely by being economical, he'd be a massive upgrade on Tongue who has offered neither economy or wicket taking against non tailenders.

[paul_e]

Your dislike of Bashir is a bit weird.

He has 4 5fers in 29 innings (1 less than leach has managed in more that double that), that doesn't sound like a vanity project, it sounds like someone with a huge amount of potential who just needs experience.

England is a tough place to learn to be a spinner, the conditions normally favour medium pace swing bowling and there's plenty of those around so it's not unusual for a spinner to only get a handful of overs in a match. What England have decided to do is to pick someone early in his career and let him learn on the job, and I think that's a decent call. As I've said before I'd like to see Bethell in there as well to give a 2nd spin option before we turn to Root because that gives Bashir room to breath.

As for bringing back Anderson, I think that's a terrible idea. I love the guy, he's one of the best players we've ever produced but he's 42 and has played 3 matches all summer, he's practically retired and almost certainly will be before long, let him go.

[taylorsworkrate]

Your dislike of Bashir is a bit weird.

He has 4 5fers in 29 innings (1 less than leach has managed in more that double that), that doesn't sound like a vanity project, it sounds like someone with a huge amount of potential who just needs experience.

England is a tough place to learn to be a spinner, the conditions normally favour medium pace swing bowling and there's plenty of those around so it's not unusual for a spinner to only get a handful of overs in a match. What England have decided to do is to pick someone early in his career and let him learn on the job, and I think that's a decent call. As I've said before I'd like to see Bethell in there as well to give a 2nd spin option before we turn to Root because that gives Bashir room to breath.

As for bringing back Anderson, I think that's a terrible idea. I love the guy, he's one of the best players we've ever produced but he's 42 and has played 3 matches all summer, he's practically retired and almost certainly will be before long, let him go.

I've said plenty of times that Bashir could be good in a few years. At present he isn't good enough to be an international bowler. Maybe if he offered something with the bat or in the field then the case for him "learning on the job" would be stronger. Get him back to county cricket, get him spending winters playing grade cricket in Australia, and other 1st class stuff around the world. Put a proper investment in him. The current series against India and then the Ashes are absolutely massive. They are not the series to have someone learn how to bowl spin. For all his detractors, Somerset wouldn't dream of playing Bashir over Leach. Surely that says something? Dawson would be a better spin option immediately than Bashir and offers a lot more with the bat and in the field.

As for Anderson, he never wanted to stop playing international cricket. Would he get in if all of Archer, Wood, Atkinson and even Ollie Stone were fit? No. With those injuries, would Anderson be an upgrade on Tongue or even Carse (in English conditions)? Yes. Absolutely.