NSWE Investment

[chrisw1]

For the City game, there's 2,000 left with 2 weeks to go for a midweek game against a team who are likely to smash us.

If I was picking and choosing games on an individual basis I wouldn't be rushing to buy a ticket for this one.  Even so, it still looks like we'll sell out.  There's nothing to see here Flin.  Well other than a bit of trolling.

There's 3,700 left for Leicester which doesn't go on general sale until Monday.  No doubt that will be a sell out too.

I'm not convinced we'd consistently sell out 50k just yet, but put us in the top 6 and I'm sure we would.

[sickbeggar]

They need to put 10k on the capacity anyway. Doesn't matter if you fill it every week. 10 games per season with 50k over 5 years  and it pays for itself,

[Mister E]

They need to put 10k on the capacity anyway. Doesn't matter if you fill it every week. 10 games per season with 50k over 5 years  and it pays for itself,

don't understand your maths, mate.
10,000 incremental seats @£30 per seat x 20 home games per season = £6m incremental funds per season. You could add more for extra catering and shop sales but it will take more than 5 years to repay the cost of rebuilding the North Stand, I'm guessing.

[paul_e]

They need to put 10k on the capacity anyway. Doesn't matter if you fill it every week. 10 games per season with 50k over 5 years  and it pays for itself,

don't understand your maths, mate.
10,000 incremental seats @£30 per seat x 20 home games per season = £6m incremental funds per season. You could add more for extra catering and shop sales but it will take more than 5 years to repay the cost of rebuilding the North Stand, I'm guessing.

It's a bit out of date and I can't find it now but I remember reading something from about 7-8 years ago where you can add about 50-60% to the ticket price as the average spend for a visit to the ground. so £9m would be closer to the real value.

However that's also largely missing the point. whether it takes 5 years or 50 years to pay for the initial investment is excluded from FFP but the extra profits are included so you're addig £9m a year to the transfer and wage budget and, in a case like ours, you're doing it without putting any debt on th eclub because the stadium is owned by the parent company not the club.

[sickbeggar]

They need to put 10k on the capacity anyway. Doesn't matter if you fill it every week. 10 games per season with 50k over 5 years  and it pays for itself,

don't understand your maths, mate.
10,000 incremental seats @£30 per seat x 20 home games per season = £6m incremental funds per season. You could add more for extra catering and shop sales but it will take more than 5 years to repay the cost of rebuilding the North Stand, I'm guessing.

The season ticket waiting list so that would be another minimum 300 per year for a % of those 10,000 as well as having the capacity to accommodate all the plastic reds etc for the top games. Plus you'd hope we'd get a few league Cup/FA Cup (yeah, yeah I know) games against big teams. European games as well which is what we're aiming for. We should be looking at getting a decent distance in the Europa cup if we qualify so big games against other "name" teams in the latter stages. All about being ready to capitalise on success rather than wait for it to appear.

[LeeB]

I would agree regarding building before the success, but our unprecedented situation is creating a demand (and waiting list) that wasn't there before, and changing supporter habits as a result, making it a necessity to get a season ticket and go every week if you want to go at all.

I read a Rangers fan regarding their situation with wildly fluctuating attendances in the late seventies/early eighties, where people used to pick and choose as there was always capacity, but when the ground was redeveloped and Souness came in it was suddenly harder to get tickets, and then suddenly there's 40,000 against Falkirk and St Johnstone and everyone's got season tickets.

A few years of keeping people wanting, coupled with relative success, might pay off more in the long run.

[chrisw1]

In the maths above you're all looking at turnover, not profit.  No idea what the margins are but I'd presume you're more than halfing catering income for example.

That's before we look at the average spend being 50-60% of ticket price.  For a £40 ticket are people really spending £20-£25 quid per ticket on a match day (on average)?  That sounds nuts to me.

Either way I agree with Mr E.  No way a stand pays for itself in 5 years.  The FFP point is a good one though.

[sickbeggar]

Maybe, I just think 50k+ is about the sweetspot for a team with pretentions to regularly compete in Europe and it wouldn't be too expensive to achieve it relatively short term. Certainly teams with the same objective like Spurs/Arsenal/Westham/Newcastle are all in that 50-60k area while Everton are looking at that with their new stadium.

[Zouch Villa]

They could do with showing they can service the 40k people that are already in the ground before thinking about increasing capacity.  I’ve given up trying to buy any food or drink in the concourse areas as the speed, choice and quality of service is atrocious.  I appreciate it will be argued that this infrastructure will be addressed as part of any redevelopment, but the issue isn’t just about space and facilities.  The co-ordination, training and delivery of these services is just woefully inadequate.

[algy]

I would agree regarding building before the success, but our unprecedented situation is creating a demand (and waiting list) that wasn't there before, and changing supporter habits as a result, making it a necessity to get a season ticket and go every week if you want to go at all.

I read a Rangers fan regarding their situation with wildly fluctuating attendances in the late seventies/early eighties, where people used to pick and choose as there was always capacity, but when the ground was redeveloped and Souness came in it was suddenly harder to get tickets, and then suddenly there's 40,000 against Falkirk and St Johnstone and everyone's got season tickets.

A few years of keeping people wanting, coupled with relative success, might pay off more in the long run.

I think that's a very good point.  From NSWE's point of view, if you expand the ground capacity by 10k, you're really going to want to be backing that up by selling another ~9k+ season tickets.

[chrisw1]

Maybe, I just think 50k+ is about the sweetspot for a team with pretentions to regularly compete in Europe and it wouldn't be too expensive to achieve it relatively short term. Certainly teams with the same objective like Spurs/Arsenal/Westham/Newcastle are all in that 50-60k area while Everton are looking at that with their new stadium.

Yep I agree with this.  We should be aiming for that for sure.

[chrisw1]

They could do with showing they can service the 40k people that are already in the ground before thinking about increasing capacity.  I’ve given up trying to buy any food or drink in the concourse areas as the speed, choice and quality of service is atrocious.  I appreciate it will be argued that this infrastructure will be addressed as part of any redevelopment, but the issue isn’t just about space and facilities.  The co-ordination, training and delivery of these services is just woefully inadequate.

These are two entirely different issues and absolutely not mutualy exclusive.  I must admit I never understand staffing levels at major events, the amount of extra you could sell just by doubling staff at £8,50 to £9.00 per hr must be a no brainer.

[pauliewalnuts]

That reminds me - I must remember to emigrate. Oh, I did. And yet...

That made me snort laughter. Snaughter.

[paul_e]

In the maths above you're all looking at turnover, not profit.  No idea what the margins are but I'd presume you're more than halfing catering income for example.

That's before we look at the average spend being 50-60% of ticket price.  For a £40 ticket are people really spending £20-£25 quid per ticket on a match day (on average)?  That sounds nuts to me.

Either way I agree with Mr E.  No way a stand pays for itself in 5 years.  The FFP point is a good one though.

As I said the figure is a bit out of date (I can't remember when it was from but it was at least 10 years ago I'd think) so might not be so high now, the point really, as you've said, was the FFP part.

[wince]

Fred is high on Cake.

Wait till he finds out Villa Park is actually paedophile disguised as a football stadium.

I’d just like to point out that other Freds are available.

But you don’t doom monger.......