Villa Park Redevelopment

[chrisw1]

The thing is, I don't see any significant help coming from the Council any time soon so a relocation is probably off the table too.

I think we just need to crack on with it and go down the coaches' route and maybe find some more car parking partners and hope the train station catches up in due course

I'm only guessing, but similar to my comment above, this would probably require another revision of planning, and my guess is it would be turned down. They have to say how the plans would affect existing traffic flows and the overall effect on the local area, and so getting 50K+ fans in and out quickly is a huge part of that.

We're talking an extra 8k max match going fans, a fair proportion of which - probably half - will be corporate (either directly in the North stand or indirectly by increased corporate in the Trinity)

Couldn't a case be made that corporate fans are more likely to leave at staggered times and the remaining 4k ish will be 50/50 car and public transport, which we can try to cover with coaches and parking?

I'm stretching here, but BCC are culpable with their inaction, can't we find a way around it in the interim?

[Sdwbvf]

Transport is nothing to do with BCC, fortunately. Unfortunately it is generally reliant on government funding. Having said that, someone needs to ask Devon how they do it - four new stations in 6 years.

Proof house isn't the problem per se. New Street has been a platform short for several years. Which does help when you try to shoehorn in extra trains. Running 6 coaches on the shuttles would help with the crowds.

[Risso]

If I was either of the owners, I’d be looking for building land. The amount of money that needs spending on Villa Park, the transportation issues and the site limitations - there is certainly a case for a new stadium elsewhere.

I’m not quite sure how I feel about that as a fan. But there is a case for it.

Yep, I've said the same thing lots of times. Everton managed it and they've got the sea on one side!

yep, that's been my thinking as well. Villa Park is great and it would be a massive shame to move but staying there comes with its problems. I'd want something closer to the city centre though, not out of town somewhere.

Is there any point in asking where?

That bit of Digbeth west of Moor Street, south of the HS2 area is almost begging to be demolished and a lovely new 60,000 stadium constructed. Bordesley Street, around there. All of the trendy stuff is south of there, most of the area I've mentioned is delapidated warehouses and the like.

[Ads]

We break ground after the Foo Fighters concert, upgrade or not.

I would assume the upgraded transport is a condition of the planning permission, so if firm plans for the station aren't in place, they won't be allowed to do that. They can probably crack on with tarting up the Villa Live or whatever the new version is called, but nothing else.

The restriction on planning requires the submission of a detailed plan in accordance with WSP objectives to reduce dependency on private car travel. There is no condition to build a new Witton Station before or in concert with the New North development associated with the previous planning application. The new submission will have fewer conditions under TCPA as we're doing less with Villa Live.

The plan is indexed to suggested measures and rail is indexed as special long term measure. Approval was granted on that commitment basis.

As soon as Dave Grohl has waved goodbye, work starts.

[DeKuip]

If I was either of the owners, I’d be looking for building land. The amount of money that needs spending on Villa Park, the transportation issues and the site limitations - there is certainly a case for a new stadium elsewhere.

I’m not quite sure how I feel about that as a fan. But there is a case for it.

Yep, I've said the same thing lots of times. Everton managed it and they've got the sea on one side!

yep, that's been my thinking as well. Villa Park is great and it would be a massive shame to move but staying there comes with its problems. I'd want something closer to the city centre though, not out of town somewhere.

Is there any point in asking where?

That bit of Digbeth west of Moor Street, south of the HS2 area is almost begging to be demolished and a lovely new 60,000 stadium constructed. Bordesley Street, around there. All of the trendy stuff is south of there, most of the area I've mentioned is delapidated warehouses and the like.

We have a perfectly good enough ground as it is and so long as we keep pricing people of going there the transport problems will eventually ease.

[hipkiss92]

We break ground after the Foo Fighters concert, upgrade or not.

I would assume the upgraded transport is a condition of the planning permission, so if firm plans for the station aren't in place, they won't be allowed to do that. They can probably crack on with tarting up the Villa Live or whatever the new version is called, but nothing else.

There isn't a condition requiring them to do so in the planning permission (not in their control to do so either, so would be a poor planning consultant who signed them up to that), or any commitment for the station upgrade to form part of the transport measures for the re-development, other than a commitment to work with TfWM and others to explore rail improvements.

There are firmer commitments to do other transport related things - bus shuttles to town, closing Witton Road post-match, finding more off-site parking, controlled parking on local roads, park and ride, taxi rank in front of the church - that the club can fund directly.

[Ads]

Planning was granted in December 22 on the basis of the WSP report on travel, which said this on trains (ball ache as I can't copy it)

AVFC will work with WMT and TfWM to further improve the efficiency of rail in the longer term amongst fans, for example by encouraging fans to travel on the quickest train for their journey and by sharing real-time travel information on the clubs channels.

WITTON STATION AND WIDER AREA MASTERPLAN

Witton Station is part of a wider area masterplan which would also include the reopening of the subway beneath the tracks.

AVFC will commit the availability of a team to the masterplan as it develops.

That commitment requires a detailed plan for compliance our end. That's it. Not we will lay track or extend by x inches the platform. Just plan, in detail.

Interestingly there will be more busses, Villa marked busses and a taxi rank.

[eamonn]

We break ground after the Foo Fighters concert, upgrade or not.

I would assume the upgraded transport is a condition of the planning permission, so if firm plans for the station aren't in place, they won't be allowed to do that. They can probably crack on with tarting up the Villa Live or whatever the new version is called, but nothing else.

The restriction on planning requires the submission of a detailed plan in accordance with WSP objectives to reduce dependency on private car travel. There is no condition to build a new Witton Station before or in concert with the New North development associated with the previous planning application. The new submission will have fewer conditions under TCPA as we're doing less with Villa Live.

The plan is indexed to suggested measures and rail is indexed as special long term measure. Approval was granted on that commitment basis.

As soon as Dave Grohl has waved goodbye, work starts.

Can't we tell him to fuck off and not bother coming so we can crack-on with this?

[Ads]

If the tickets are anything like Pink we'll be making some good dollar off it.

[dave.woodhall]

If I was either of the owners, I’d be looking for building land. The amount of money that needs spending on Villa Park, the transportation issues and the site limitations - there is certainly a case for a new stadium elsewhere.

I’m not quite sure how I feel about that as a fan. But there is a case for it.

Yep, I've said the same thing lots of times. Everton managed it and they've got the sea on one side!

yep, that's been my thinking as well. Villa Park is great and it would be a massive shame to move but staying there comes with its problems. I'd want something closer to the city centre though, not out of town somewhere.

Is there any point in asking where?

That bit of Digbeth west of Moor Street, south of the HS2 area is almost begging to be demolished and a lovely new 60,000 stadium constructed. Bordesley Street, around there. All of the trendy stuff is south of there, most of the area I've mentioned is delapidated warehouses and the like.

Do you mean east of Moor Street? If so it would be a logistical nightmare for traffic and I doubt if anyone is going to sell land so close to HS2.

[Risso]

Yes, east sorry.

[pauliewalnuts]

We have a perfectly good enough ground as it is and so long as we keep pricing people of going there the transport problems will eventually ease.

Do we though?

We have a historic (despite being less than 50 years old in its oldest part) ground which can be very atmospheric, but the facilities for fans are abysmal in two of the stands and highly questionable at best in the other two.

We also know that as soon as we've finished the North Stand, we'll still have a further problem in the Witton, which has the worst facilities in the ground and really isn't fit for anything you'd charge people almost 70 quid a pop for.

I just wonder if we reach the point where they think fuck this for a game of soldiers, either let's build anew somewhere else, or we demolish the whole lot currently there and build on the same plot.

[pauliewalnuts]

Do you mean east of Moor Street? If so it would be a logistical nightmare for traffic and I doubt if anyone is going to sell land so close to HS2.

Surely though anywhere so near to the city centre will be difficult for traffic (as the city centre itself already is) but the point would be few people would drive.

I'd never drive if our ground was nearer the centre. I almost always drive now because the public transport is so piss poor.

[Lastfootstamper]

Mebbe, but once that tram reaches the airport, everything will be rosy. And if that's not convenient for you, just jump on a train from Pineapple. Live Street's dream. Functional buses and the such are for wankers.

[Toronto Villa]

The new Betis stadium design is rather nice

https://x.com/espnfc/status/1701968020451598647?s=46