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Author Topic: VAR  (Read 165491 times)

Offline Rudy65

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1665 on: December 01, 2020, 01:53:41 PM »
I'm going to be saying this forever now, because once I think of (more likely steal) a good point I hammer it home remorselessly so here goes:

When a decision is so millimetre-close how in the name of God can the exact split-second the ball is kicked possibly be judged?

It's a good point.  Another one is why they decided that any other decision such as penalties have to be "clear and obvious" to keep the flow and the intensity of the game going, but offsides have to be exact to the nearest millimetre which can take a few minutes to ascertain.  Why can't offsides have the clear and obvious rule as well?  If they have to use their lines, then it's not clear and obvious, and the goal stands.

Iíve just made that exact point on the phone to my mate. If it takes numerous lines to be drawn and redrawn on a screen before a decision can be reached then that is totally against the spirit of the game. It is a technology brought in to supposedly reduce controversy around big decisions but it has delivered the complete opposite.

....and chalked off some bloody good goals in the process

Online Brend'Watkins

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1666 on: December 01, 2020, 01:56:05 PM »
In fact, for VAR offside decisions you donít need referees, ex referees or anybody associated with football. You need People with O level maths who are proficient at operating and interpreting measuring equipment.

Offline Ad@m

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1667 on: December 01, 2020, 02:10:09 PM »
It's another example of what's wrong with football that technology is successfully used in other sports but the football powers that be think they can do it better and in the process fuck it up.

For offsides rugby is the best example - look at how they handle forward passes in the build up to a try. If there's a question mark over it, the video ref tells the on field ref to have another look. They stick it on the big screen for all to see, the mics pick up the refs thinking, no daft lines and unless it's an obvious forward pass the try stands.

It's that fucking simple!

Offline Risso

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1668 on: December 01, 2020, 02:50:27 PM »
It's another example of what's wrong with football that technology is successfully used in other sports but the football powers that be think they can do it better and in the process fuck it up.

For offsides rugby is the best example - look at how they handle forward passes in the build up to a try. If there's a question mark over it, the video ref tells the on field ref to have another look. They stick it on the big screen for all to see, the mics pick up the refs thinking, no daft lines and unless it's an obvious forward pass the try stands.

It's that fucking simple!

There are so many examples of that, but then they just seem absolutely determined to stick pig-headedly to their existing system.  It actually worked a bit like that for the overturned penalty last week.  In telling the ref to look at it again, they basically admitted it wasn't clear and obvious, thus going against their own rules.  Fine if that's what they want to do going forward, but they can't have it both ways.

Offline brian green

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1669 on: December 01, 2020, 02:59:33 PM »
Absolutely Martin.  It is the excruciating prevalence of "on the one hand this" "but on the other hand that" that is tearing the game apart.  Everybody has to put in their twopennyworth and all the views have their own debating credentials.

Offline chrisw1

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1670 on: December 01, 2020, 03:07:34 PM »
Rugby is the perfect example of how it should work.  The on field ref takes responsibility for all decisions, taking advice and even discussing with the video ref as needed asking for replays as needed, but ultimately the on-field ref makes the call.  The only real exception to this is where the video ref is asked to look to see if the ball has been grounded properly, but even then they make it clear what their onfield decision is.

For me I'm ok witth VAR dealing with offside just so long as the parameters are fixed - the boots for example or even the upper body.  I'd be comfortable with them using GPS in the back of the shirt.  The point is everybody knows the parameters - yes theres still interpretation on when the ball is kicked, but I can live with that.  Make the lines a bit wider to give some margin for error in favour of the attacking player if necessary.

But I want to see refs take responsibility for all other onfield decisions.  They should look at every penalty decision on the video screen unless they are 100% happy.  They should be able to ask the VAR to check quickly check any decision they want to and to show replays of any incident they want to.  The VAR should draw their attention to fouls they might not see, like on Watkins yesterday, but the ref should look at it and make the decison.  It doesn't take as long as people think and it would work. 

Offline SoccerHQ

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1671 on: December 01, 2020, 03:07:40 PM »
Refs should certainly go to the monitor for offsides like last night and hopefully some common sense would be used for the ridiculously tight ones.

More crucial than deciding a penalty given a goal has actually been scored.

Offline The Edge

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1672 on: December 01, 2020, 03:40:56 PM »
It would be interesting if they reset the poll at the top of this page. I'd be amazed if more that 5% are still in favour.

Online Chris Smith

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1673 on: December 01, 2020, 03:45:32 PM »
I get sent something on WhatsApp of how it is implemented in the Dutch league. Apparently they have introduced a margin of error by using lines 5cm wide. If the last man and attacker lines are touching VAR does not intervene. Iíd rather ditch it altogether but if they are determined to stick with it that seems a more pragmatic approach - which obviously makes it extremely unlikely theyíll adopt anything similar over here.

Offline olaftab

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1674 on: December 01, 2020, 04:52:28 PM »
In fact, for VAR offside decisions you donít need referees, ex referees or anybody associated with football. You need People with O level maths who are proficient at operating and interpreting measuring equipment.
And on field you don't need a qualified referee you just need an actor who can follow instructions and  is good at pointing and waving.

Offline brian green

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1675 on: December 01, 2020, 05:09:51 PM »
And completely devoid of respect for the followers of the game.

Offline Andy_Lochhead_in_the_air

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1676 on: December 01, 2020, 06:01:05 PM »
In fact, for VAR offside decisions you donít need referees, ex referees or anybody associated with football. You need People with O level maths who are proficient at operating and interpreting measuring equipment.
And on field you don't need a qualified referee you just need an actor who can follow instructions and  is good at pointing and waving.

May as well be a Villa fan then.




Online London Villan

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1677 on: December 01, 2020, 06:09:23 PM »
GPS in the little device they all wear on their backs would at least identify if the torso of the player is on/offside. What has the game come to that we are discussing that though.

Offline chrisw1

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1678 on: December 01, 2020, 06:49:02 PM »
GPS in the little device they all wear on their backs would at least identify if the torso of the player is on/offside. What has the game come to that we are discussing that though.
I actualy think that's a fine solution.  No lines drawn, no woories about toeso or heels, no interpretation.  If the technology works then either a player is offside or he isn't.  Pefrect.  What I'm not sure of is whether the technology is accurate enough though.  I also appreciate this can't be replicated at grass routes, but then neither can VAR.

Offline Alex77

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1679 on: December 01, 2020, 07:40:28 PM »
It would be interesting if they reset the poll at the top of this page. I'd be amazed if more that 5% are still in favour.

I didn't actually realise I was in the "for" camp. I'm still in favour of it in principle, I just despise how it's been implemented!

I think a reset of the poll would be useful but with an added option of "for but with changes".

 


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