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Author Topic: VAR  (Read 150631 times)

Offline exigo

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1650 on: December 01, 2020, 09:03:42 AM »
Just bin offside entirely. It can't be any worse than this current shitshow.

Offline Des Little

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1651 on: December 01, 2020, 09:18:35 AM »
The easiest and most logical solution is feet. If the playerís leading foot is level or behind the last defenderís trailing foot then heís on. Itís a whole lot easier to manage, and clear cut too.

Offline dicedlam

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1652 on: December 01, 2020, 09:23:48 AM »
Somebody on the post match thread said he was going crazy when we scored but his 10 year old sat there quietly in case VAR ruled it out. What a sad image.

This says it all for me and an image that is truly sad indeed.

I don't want to see games ruined by a shoulder being offside, or goals being disallowed because there was an incident in the build up play. Those are the things I want to discuss in the pub with my mates after the game.

Trying to sanitize the decision-making process is slowly strangling the life out of the game.

Offline Gareth

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1653 on: December 01, 2020, 09:37:37 AM »
What VAR really requires is fans to be unified against it - it doesnt help that grounds are empty because fans are denied a true voice!

Listening to a few minutes of talkSPORT this morning showed why fans wonít be unified unfortunately because every incident becomes tribal, West Ham fans feeling that they have to deflect or defend to justify the pen not being given.

It needs full stadiums all chanting in unison FCUK VAR or full stadiums all getting up and walking out at the same time in a game.

You look at PGMOL and the two top guys are Mike Riley & Neale Barry - two of the weakest most pedantic officials there were in 90ís / early 2000ís - would anyone seriously think they would administer any different to how they refereed games? Beyond that Elleray is knocking around in the game somewhere too.

Offline Lastfootstamper

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1654 on: December 01, 2020, 09:40:53 AM »
I'm going to be saying this forever now, because once I think of (more likely steal) a good point I hammer it home remorselessly so here goes:

When a decision is so millimetre-close how in the name of God can the exact split-second the ball is kicked possibly be judged?

It's a good point.  Another one is why they decided that any other decision such as penalties have to be "clear and obvious" to keep the flow and the intensity of the game going, but offsides have to be exact to the nearest millimetre which can take a few minutes to ascertain.  Why can't offsides have the clear and obvious rule as well?  If they have to use their lines, then it's not clear and obvious, and the goal stands.
They have to use the lines because of the camera angles. I must admit when I saw that first freeze frame flash up last night, my immediate thought was, "naaaahhh, he's off". So if I was in Stockley Park, you'd have had the same decision. Only quicker.

Offline Chris Smith

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1655 on: December 01, 2020, 09:48:34 AM »
I'm going to be saying this forever now, because once I think of (more likely steal) a good point I hammer it home remorselessly so here goes:

When a decision is so millimetre-close how in the name of God can the exact split-second the ball is kicked possibly be judged?

It's a good point.  Another one is why they decided that any other decision such as penalties have to be "clear and obvious" to keep the flow and the intensity of the game going, but offsides have to be exact to the nearest millimetre which can take a few minutes to ascertain.  Why can't offsides have the clear and obvious rule as well?  If they have to use their lines, then it's not clear and obvious, and the goal stands.

Iíve just made that exact point on the phone to my mate. If it takes numerous lines to be drawn and redrawn on a screen before a decision can be reached then that is totally against the spirit of the game. It is a technology brought in to supposedly reduce controversy around big decisions but it has delivered the complete opposite.
« Last Edit: December 01, 2020, 09:51:05 AM by Chris Smith »

Online Smithy

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1656 on: December 01, 2020, 09:54:44 AM »
I like the way the Dutch have done it (albeit against FIFA guidelines).  They still have VAR, they still have all the lines being drawn in the same way as we do, but the lines are 5cm wide, and if the lines are touching, then it stays with the original on-field decision.  The decision only gets reversed if there is clear daylight between the lines.

We'd still have debates over whether the lines were touching, or not, on close calls, but at least that would then be a decision over whether the player was 10 or 10.5cm offside.

Offline stevenavfc

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1657 on: December 01, 2020, 10:01:47 AM »
Exactly, the point the ball is kicked is still a guess. No technology can precisely determine this vital part of the criteria used to make an offside decision.
In Rugby and Cricket the advice is relayed live and the referee/umpire has the option to stick with the original decision or overturn it.
As it stands, VAR is subjective but binding. It can't and shouldn't be both.
« Last Edit: December 01, 2020, 10:03:51 AM by stevenavfc »

Offline luke95

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1658 on: December 01, 2020, 10:25:27 AM »
Discussing it now on skys Football show, Dermot  Gallagher  would make one hell of a Politician.

Offline olaftab

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1659 on: December 01, 2020, 12:56:41 PM »
I'm going to be saying this forever now, because once I think of (more likely steal) a good point I hammer it home remorselessly so here goes:

When a decision is so millimetre-close how in the name of God can the exact split-second the ball is kicked possibly be judged?
I bet if the the picture was frozen another 10th of a second later his arm would be back in and ball would be still in the process of being kicked.

Online Brend'Watkins

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1660 on: December 01, 2020, 01:11:17 PM »
I'm going to be saying this forever now, because once I think of (more likely steal) a good point I hammer it home remorselessly so here goes:

When a decision is so millimetre-close how in the name of God can the exact split-second the ball is kicked possibly be judged?
I bet if the the picture was frozen another 10th of a second later his arm would be back in and ball would be still in the process of being kicked.

This is what I've been saying.  The exact moment the boot touches the ball the kick is made.  Not when the ball has left the foot, or the moment the indent to the ball is made but the moment that force is applied. so they can fuck off with that backwards and forward slow mo graphic they show.  Once they've got that split moment they can start playing with their lines.

Offline Bobby Boy

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1661 on: December 01, 2020, 01:14:22 PM »
Surely, the whole point of the offside rule is to stop an attacker gaining an advantage over a defender. How can an upper arm being a millimetre ahead of the last defender provide an advantage?

We are seeing fantastic play being nullified by absurdly negative laws.

Just go to daylight between the players. If any part of an attackers body is in line with the last defender then it's onside. Is that too much to bear?

Online Brend'Watkins

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1662 on: December 01, 2020, 01:19:18 PM »
I'm all for accuracy but you can't have half accuracy as we have now.  The fancy lines of where the attackers arm is (which is another thing, which part of the arm and at what angle?) is all nonsense unless you bring everything to the equation.  If you can't do that you go back to what it was before.

Offline Tuscans

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1663 on: December 01, 2020, 01:21:59 PM »
If Watkins was wearing a long sleeve shirt would they then draw the line at his wrist or would they then draw a line at where a short sleeved shirt would end on his bicep at a guess!? Has this ever been thought about at IFAB at all?
« Last Edit: December 01, 2020, 01:23:37 PM by Tuscans »

Online brian green

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1664 on: December 01, 2020, 01:45:04 PM »
There has been photographic adjudication in horse racing for over 50 years.  The reason why photo finishes have never been controversial is because the camera serves the stewards.  The stewards make their decision based on the photographic evidence.  Where football has lost its way disastrously is that the authorities have allowed a panel of interpreters to come between the referee (steward) and the evidence.  I can live with, just about, one twat like Halsey getting a call wrong to our disadvantage.  What I cannot abide at any price is a room full of Halseys pontificating on microscopically minute calls.  They are the modern equivalent of bishops arguing about the number of angels dancing on a pinhead.
« Last Edit: December 01, 2020, 01:46:44 PM by brian green »

 


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