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Author Topic: VAR  (Read 150549 times)

Offline kieron

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1155 on: January 02, 2020, 05:20:50 PM »
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/premier-league-clubs-anger-over-mike-rileys-handling-of-var-dxzf0v0bs?ni-statuscode=acsaz-307

Quote
Concerned club officials are to talk to Richard Masters, newly confirmed as the Premier League chief executive, about Mike Riley’s handling of VAR which has descended into a global embarrassment for the image-conscious league. Some want Riley dismissed, and a less pedagogical official appointed general manager of the Professional Game Match Officials Limited which oversees VAR at Stockley Park.

“He is actually a bit thick,” said one leading club official of Riley. “Like a bad schoolteacher. He is the root of the Premier League problem.’’

Clubs voted to bring in VAR but their discontent with Riley’s application of technology mounts through every round of games where goals are chalked off through fractional offsides, from heels to armpits. There are doubts in certain quarters over whether the technology, and line-drawing by a technician, can be totally accurate anyway. More profess frustration at delays in an English game that always prided itself on uninterrupted flow, and that attackers should be favoured anyway.

They point out that the Premier League’s attraction around the world, and allure to wealthy broadcasters, is based substantially on breath-taking attacking and spectacular goals, which many consider is being undermined by Riley’s hunt for fractional offsides. As one official confided, Riley is developing a reputation as “The Goal-Killer”, anathema for the Premier League’s desire to be the “Big Show”, the No 1 entertainment.

Wolves, Sheffield United and Norwich City have been particularly hard done with goals ruled out. Norwich fans now sell T-shirts decrying VAR. Molineux and Bramall Lane regularly ring out to “F*** VAR” and “it’s not football any more”. All clubs have a tale of woe or two. The Footballer of the Year, Raheem Sterling of Manchester City, tweets “happy to improve my VAR overruled goals record” when another of his efforts is ruled out. Even Liverpool, widely considered by opposing fans as beneficiaries of VAR, saw a Sadio Mané header against Watford ruled out for a stray armpit.

Aston Villa’s captain, Jack Grealish, had a magnificent header ruled out against Burnley for the trailing heel of Wesley, who was not involved in the move. The decision by PGMOL, especially when they revealed pictures of their drawn lines, triggered much derision. Players don’t know whether to celebrate or not. The atmosphere in grounds turns toxic, with groaning and goading following overturned decisions.

Riley, 55, who was appointed a Fifa official and worked at Euro 2004 during his years as a Premier League referee, has lost touch with what the game is about, about what players, managers, fans and owners want, and is causing excessive problems for his beleaguered men in the middle.

It’s gone from being a joke to doing damage to the credibility of the league. So certain clubs are turning to Masters to call Riley to account, to control the offside-hunters at Stockley Park and, if he won’t, then dismiss him. Along with addressing the rise of racism within grounds, making Riley see sense, or sacking him, will be the first big test of Masters’ reign.

Masters is respected by the clubs following his calm stewarding of the organisation during the troubled search for Richard Scudamore’s successor. Two candidates were appointed but never started, leaving Masters, the managing director, as interim chief executive, a role eventually made permanent last month.

It will be pointed out to Masters, not that he probably needs reminding, that the original intention of technology was helping overturn “clear and obvious” errors and that is being overlooked with almost a mission to seek out the fractional, mainly with offside. Everyone accepts the offside law needs overhauling. Ifab plans a confab. The Liverpool manager, Jürgen Klopp, talks of being encouraged to hear Uefa discussing widening the margin of error on offside, favouring the attacking side, as it should be. Riley has taken the pursuit too far, with more than 20 goals ruled out already. Alternative “without VAR” league tables abound.

The Premier League pointed out that, “A player is in an offside position if: any part of the head, body or feet is in the opponents’ half (excluding the halfway line) and any part of the head, body or feet is nearer to the opponents’ goal line than both the ball and the second-last opponent.’’ Its argument is that there is no room for subjectivity on offside and it can’t be subject to “clear and obvious” because it is a factual decision and that is what has been applied in the Premier League this season, and any change to that would have to come from Ifab. There is an acceptance within the organisation that the technology cannot be 100 per cent accurate because of camera frame rates. At the Premier League’s last shareholders’ meeting, Riley “accepted improvement is required”.

Riley has also come under fierce criticism for referees not consulting pitch-side monitors. England’s few elite referees are encouraged to use the monitors when overseeing Uefa matches. “I hope Fifa insist he [Riley] is binned for flagrantly ignoring directive on field-ref use of monitor,” added one club official.

The concerned club officials want to wrest control of games back from Stockley Park, restoring the authority of the actual match official who is at risk of simply becoming a messenger boy for PGMOL. These club officials are fed up at seeing their league, so successful in many years, certainly the most popular worldwide, being laughed at by so many.

The frustration is that all the focus and fury around VAR is taking away from the sight of one of the great sides of the modern era, the European and world champions Liverpool, playing such unbelievable football. The Premier League is now associated with being killjoys, a forensic mission to rule out goals led by Mike Riley. Masters has a big call to make.

Offline PeterWithesShin

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1156 on: January 02, 2020, 05:30:47 PM »
When you have Burnley fans joining in with "it's not football any more" after a decision has gone their way then you know something is seriously wrong. I posted the Villa on Tour video from yesterday and there was virtually no celebration when Wes scored, you're seeing more and more goals scored where players and fans don't celebrate. There is no point to the game if the most important part of a game is being killed. I was in favour of VAR but the version we have is is fucking shit.

Offline Des Little

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1157 on: January 02, 2020, 05:38:21 PM »
It’s not a big call at all, it’s piss easy. Do it and save the game from this utter chaos

Offline GXVilla

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1158 on: January 02, 2020, 05:41:55 PM »
Being as Richard Masters is a Villa fan, I hope he shares our frustrations. Not sure he's going to sack Riley so early into his role though.

Offline phantom limb

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1159 on: January 02, 2020, 05:42:01 PM »
In the ground you normally don’t have any idea what’s going on, you need to find out afterwards what the decision was and why. All it’s doing is making people angry.

Offline danno

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1160 on: January 02, 2020, 05:50:06 PM »
There's a big difference in looking for reasons to disallow a goal and seeing an obvious foul handball etc that needs to be overturned.

With the offsides, as soon as your zooming in and drawing lines everywhere like it's a photo finish of the 100 metre final you're beyond parody.

I think the Russians at the World Cup had the least crap version (which wasn't great) our lot have somehow made it even worse.




Offline PeterWithesShin

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1161 on: January 02, 2020, 06:50:35 PM »

Offline gpbarr

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1162 on: January 02, 2020, 07:18:19 PM »
Ruining the game we love - not because its either right or wrong, but because it has become such a distraction that fans cant celebrate goals for 1-2 mins in many cases and, I would argue its often being over-used for the most ridiculous "fractional" decisions.

And it's so easy to fix - look at Rugby Union which, is also a fast moving contact sport.  The PL management is an abominable disgrace to the game

Offline devilla

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1163 on: January 03, 2020, 08:02:55 AM »
How easy it should be

https://twitter.com/GMS__Football/status/1211676152739385350

Absolutely. I don't think there has been one example in those whole sorry mess of a referee going to look at a pitchside monitor to review a decision.Fair play to the ref in that video - if only ours had done that for the foul on Wesley.

Offline CT

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1164 on: January 03, 2020, 08:13:57 AM »
When you have Burnley fans joining in with "it's not football any more" after a decision has gone their way then you know something is seriously wrong. I posted the Villa on Tour video from yesterday and there was virtually no celebration when Wes scored, you're seeing more and more goals scored where players and fans don't celebrate. There is no point to the game if the most important part of a game is being killed. I was in favour of VAR but the version we have is is fucking shit.

It was the same at OT after Tyrone's goal. Very half hearted, everyone just assumed VAR would chalk it off for offside, even though the linesman had got it right. The goal celebrations started at the kick off.

People said this wouldn't happen, well, it is.

Offline Mister E

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1165 on: January 03, 2020, 08:18:06 AM »
How easy it should be

https://twitter.com/GMS__Football/status/1211676152739385350
I still haven't seen the rationale for the instruction that our refs should not use the screen. What is it?

Offline KRS

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1166 on: January 03, 2020, 09:31:32 AM »
Think they said it was due to time...which is clearly bolx. At Burnley it took so long that it genuinely felt like they were trying to find reasons to disallow the goal and making it up as they go along.

Offline dave shelley

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1167 on: January 03, 2020, 09:35:44 AM »
I personally think they were instructed not to use it so that some of them weren't made to look bigger c***s than they already are.  ie, Kevin Friend!

Offline PeterWithe

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1168 on: January 03, 2020, 09:45:38 AM »
I've still not seen a photo showing Wesley's heel offside.

Online cdbullyweefan

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Re: VAR
« Reply #1169 on: January 03, 2020, 11:02:39 AM »
I think his heel probably was offside, but it wasn't "clear and obvious" so they shouldn't have overturned the on pitch decision. Plus, the goal was scored a different phase of playing, so there was no need to even look at whether Wesley was offside in the first place.

 


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