NSWE Investment

[robbo1874]

I always think with the Witton Lane ,  could they make it more cantilevered not necessarily higher to gain more space over the road ?

Any increase in the height/ depth of the stand will inevitably impact the properties to the north in terms of daylight/ sunlight. Some impact might be considered acceptable, in which case a marginal increase in height/ depth might be possible - but probably wouldn’t justify the expense of rebuilding the stand.

the main problem we’d be trying to address by re-building the Witton Lane would be making the existing seating and concourse areas less cramped/shit. And if we can do that and also add a couple of thousand extra seats, it may make sense to do it if the money’s there.

[Neil Hawkes]

Wonder if it's feasible to sink the pitch a bit.

I always like grounds where you're effectively looking down at the action. Loads of Italian and Spanish stadia are like this and probably best example in England is Charlton's away end.

Would mean everyone in Holte and Trinity is looking down on the action and could possibly get a couple of extra thousand seats for the Witton although lots to do for a couple more thousand and as said you'd still need extra entrance and exit seats and can't see where they'd go.

The water table would scupper that idea, literally.

Isn't the pitch where the boating like was?

I think so, but although that was man-made so wouldn't be a problem, there's been trouble with the water levels since Ansell's closed.

Sinking the pitch would be expensive and complicated and what would it actually achieve? It's one of the craziest ideas I've heard on this subject.

Is it possible to move the pitch towards the North Stand, (when it goes and before the new one is built), to allow extensions of the Holte, Trinity & Witton at the other end?
NOTE: I am not a civil engineer!

[ChicagoLion]

Why don't we suspend a glass floor below a huge Zeppelin and float over the pitch during the game.
Then the Zepellin can float back to New Street Station, picking ip passengers on the way and thus solve the Transport problem

[darren woolley]

I don't want the corners filled in when they build the new North Stand.

[VILLA MOLE]

I always think with the Witton Lane ,  could they make it more cantilevered not necessarily higher to gain more space over the road ?

Any increase in the height/ depth of the stand will inevitably impact the properties to the north in terms of daylight/ sunlight. Some impact might be considered acceptable, in which case a marginal increase in height/ depth might be possible - but probably wouldn’t justify the expense of rebuilding the stand.

the main problem we’d be trying to address by re-building the Witton Lane would be making the existing seating and concourse areas less cramped/shit. And if we can do that and also add a couple of thousand extra seats, it may make sense to do it if the money’s there.

Could they concentrate the corporate in there ,  take seats out for more space  and make it just for well heeled brigade

Then make the North Stand the biggest end stand in the world  !

[ChicagoLion]

I always think with the Witton Lane ,  could they make it more cantilevered not necessarily higher to gain more space over the road ?

Any increase in the height/ depth of the stand will inevitably impact the properties to the north in terms of daylight/ sunlight. Some impact might be considered acceptable, in which case a marginal increase in height/ depth might be possible - but probably wouldn’t justify the expense of rebuilding the stand.

the main problem we’d be trying to address by re-building the Witton Lane would be making the existing seating and concourse areas less cramped/shit. And if we can do that and also add a couple of thousand extra seats, it may make sense to do it if the money’s there.

Could they concentrate the corporate in there ,  take seats out for more space  and make it just for well heeled brigade

Then make the North Stand the biggest end stand in the world  !

For corporate, you need space. The DE does not have it.
The reason why they could use the North is because you do not need pitch facing real estate to increase corporate capacity you just need nicer / bigger seats , as the private box offering is so limiting.

[LeeB]

I always think with the Witton Lane ,  could they make it more cantilevered not necessarily higher to gain more space over the road ?

Any increase in the height/ depth of the stand will inevitably impact the properties to the north in terms of daylight/ sunlight. Some impact might be considered acceptable, in which case a marginal increase in height/ depth might be possible - but probably wouldn’t justify the expense of rebuilding the stand.

the main problem we’d be trying to address by re-building the Witton Lane would be making the existing seating and concourse areas less cramped/shit. And if we can do that and also add a couple of thousand extra seats, it may make sense to do it if the money’s there.

Could they concentrate the corporate in there ,  take seats out for more space  and make it just for well heeled brigade

Then make the North Stand the biggest end stand in the world  !

For corporate, you need space. The DE does not have it.
The reason why they could use the North is because you do not need pitch facing real estate to increase corporate capacity you just need nicer / bigger seats , as the private box offering is so limiting.

I would have thought there's more demand for corporate facilities side on to the pitch though, rather than behind the goal?

Maybe just take some seats out of the Witton, build a new 'Sky Lounge' into the roof, and chuck all of the corporate in there, like a giant version of Luton's double glazed conservatory stand.

Then rebuild the other three stands into mahoosive stands instead, job done.

[robbo1874]

Me neither Darren. I’ve told the club so in the survey.

[chrisw1]

I don't want the corners filled in when they build the new North Stand.

A lot of peole agree with you Darren and I completely get that aethetics are a huge part of what Villa Park means to many of us.  But the reality is even with 50k seats we'll still only have the 9th largest stadium in the PL (5 of those 60k + once Anfield expansion is complete).  With all the revenue based FFP regs there's going to come a point that IF we can attract enough fans we're going to have to find a way to fit them in.  If that means filling in the corners at the North stand end I could live with it.  A horseshoe with the Holte as a centerpiece would still be a decent looking stadium. 

And let face it, the ground we all go gooyey eyed over doesn't exist any more.  Once the north has gone, all that remains are 3 cheaply built stands, the oldest built in 1993.  So yes, hopefully the new North will be a great design we can be proud of, but if the owners feel we need corners filled in to achieve what they want to, I hope there's not too much resistance from a fan base that will be quick to point out how we continue to underachieve against the 'Big 6,' who other than Chelsea (who timed their billionaire run perfectly), all have filled in corners.  What's more, we're in danger of getting left behind by the likes of West Ham who have an average attendance this season of 57k and the Geordies who have an av attendance of 51k and I presume whose new owners will be looking to increase their 52.5k capacity soon enough.

The North is our one chance to get the stadium right.  What they build will have to see us through for the next 20 years or so, so I truly hope they get it right.  If they can initially keep it as a stand alone then that's great, but surely they must build it with a view to easily and relatively cheaply being able to fill in the corners at a later date as and when we need to? 

[The Edge]

I always think with the Witton Lane ,  could they make it more cantilevered not necessarily higher to gain more space over the road ?

Any increase in the height/ depth of the stand will inevitably impact the properties to the north in terms of daylight/ sunlight. Some impact might be considered acceptable, in which case a marginal increase in height/ depth might be possible - but probably wouldn’t justify the expense of rebuilding the stand.

the main problem we’d be trying to address by re-building the Witton Lane would be making the existing seating and concourse areas less cramped/shit. And if we can do that and also add a couple of thousand extra seats, it may make sense to do it if the money’s there.

Could they concentrate the corporate in there ,  take seats out for more space  and make it just for well heeled brigade

Then make the North Stand the biggest end stand in the world  !

For corporate, you need space. The DE does not have it.
The reason why they could use the North is because you do not need pitch facing real estate to increase corporate capacity you just need nicer / bigger seats , as the private box offering is so limiting.

I would have thought there's more demand for corporate facilities side on to the pitch though, rather than behind the goal?

Maybe just take some seats out of the Witton, build a new 'Sky Lounge' into the roof, and chuck all of the corporate in there, like a giant version of Luton's double glazed conservatory stand.

Then rebuild the other three stands into mahoosive stands instead, job done.

That effort at Luton is an abomination and an affront to stadium design Making the Witton Lane into a larger version of that would be absolutely horrible. I don't think even old Herbert could have dreamed up something so ghastly. Your comment could be a tongue in cheek joke that's gone right over my head in which case I apologise in advance.

[Risso]

I don't want the corners filled in when they build the new North Stand.

A lot of peole agree with you Darren and I completely get that aethetics are a huge part of what Villa Park means to many of us.  But the reality is even with 50k seats we'll still only have the 9th largest stadium in the PL (5 of those 60k + once Anfield expansion is complete).  With all the revenue based FFP regs there's going to come a point that IF we can attract enough fans we're going to have to find a way to fit them in.  If that means filling in the corners at the North stand end I could live with it.  A horseshoe with the Holte as a centerpiece would still be a decent looking stadium. 

And let face it, the ground we all go gooyey eyed over doesn't exist any more.  Once the north has gone, all that remains are 3 cheaply built stands, the oldest built in 1993.  So yes, hopefully the new North will be a great design we can be proud of, but if the owners feel we need corners filled in to achieve what they want to, I hope there's not too much resistance from a fan base that will be quick to point out how we continue to underachieve against the 'Big 6,' who other than Chelsea (who timed their billionaire run perfectly), all have filled in corners.  What's more, we're in danger of getting left behind by the likes of West Ham who have an average attendance this season of 57k and the Geordies who have an av attendance of 51k and I presume whose new owners will be looking to increase their 52.5k capacity soon enough.

The North is our one chance to get the stadium right.  What they build will have to see us through for the next 20 years or so, so I truly hope they get it right.  If they can initially keep it as a stand alone then that's great, but surely they must build it with a view to easily and relatively cheaply being able to fill in the corners at a later date as and when we need to? 

If we've still got a waiting list of thousands, then I'd guess the people who want a ticket but can't get one would agree that sitting in filled in corners would be better than maintaining four separate stands and watching the match on the TV.

[Brazilian Villain]

Why don't we suspend a glass floor below a huge Zeppelin and float over the pitch during the game.
Then the Zepellin can float back to New Street Station, picking ip passengers on the way and thus solve the Transport problem

Like it, then we could sign that Argie from PSG and call it the 'Messinine Level'. Fancy setting up a Sports Stadium Design/Marketing partnership?

[The Edge]

Wonder if it's feasible to sink the pitch a bit.

I always like grounds where you're effectively looking down at the action. Loads of Italian and Spanish stadia are like this and probably best example in England is Charlton's away end.

Would mean everyone in Holte and Trinity is looking down on the action and could possibly get a couple of extra thousand seats for the Witton although lots to do for a couple more thousand and as said you'd still need extra entrance and exit seats and can't see where they'd go.

The water table would scupper that idea, literally.

Isn't the pitch where the boating like was?

I think so, but although that was man-made so wouldn't be a problem, there's been trouble with the water levels since Ansell's closed.

Sinking the pitch would be expensive and complicated and what would it actually achieve? It's one of the craziest ideas I've heard on this subject.

Is it possible to move the pitch towards the North Stand, (when it goes and before the new one is built), to allow extensions of the Holte, Trinity & Witton at the other end?
NOTE: I am not a civil engineer!

I suppose moving the ground to the north would allow an extension for the Trinity and the Witton (there's already room to extend the Trinity) but at what cost? That would mean that the Holte End would be a long way from the pitch? No way any of that is happening unless of course you knock it down and move it closer to the pitch like Wolves did with the John Ireland stand. There's zero chance of that happening.

[chrisw1]

If we've still got a waiting list of thousands, then I'd guess the people who want a ticket but can't get one would agree that sitting in filled in corners would be better than maintaining four separate stands and watching the match on the TV.

Agreed.  IF we can fill it we must build it to keep up.  Although playing Devils advocate, I do wonder if the waiting list is partly fuelled by FOMO.  If we have 55k seats and it's easy enough to get a ticket game by game I do wonder if ST demand could actually drop?

[algy]

I always think with the Witton Lane ,  could they make it more cantilevered not necessarily higher to gain more space over the road ?

Any increase in the height/ depth of the stand will inevitably impact the properties to the north in terms of daylight/ sunlight. Some impact might be considered acceptable, in which case a marginal increase in height/ depth might be possible - but probably wouldn’t justify the expense of rebuilding the stand.

the main problem we’d be trying to address by re-building the Witton Lane would be making the existing seating and concourse areas less cramped/shit. And if we can do that and also add a couple of thousand extra seats, it may make sense to do it if the money’s there.

Could they concentrate the corporate in there ,  take seats out for more space  and make it just for well heeled brigade

Then make the North Stand the biggest end stand in the world  !

Why not go the other way?

Make the North Stand 3 tier. Link the bottom & middle tiers of the stands in the North Stand/Trinity Road corner - so both have an extra tier to keep them distinct. Use the 2 biggest stands for corporate stuff. The North Stand will be the main corporate entrance, so make it *grand*. I'm talking putting the Holte & old Trinity Road stand to shame level of grandeur.

Convert the lower Holte to safe standing. Knock the Witton Lane stand down, rebuild it as a single tier, safe standing stand. The Holte & Witton Lane become where the cool kids go, providing a vibrant atmosphere for the corporate types and folk who like a nice sit down.