International Rugby

[paul_e]

Ireland try shouldn't have stood, the scrum should never have stood given Hansen made a seatbelt tackle on Watson with no attempt at a legal tackle. Again doesn't get mentioned because those are the sort of decisions that never get given against Ireland in Dublin.

[Abbeyfealeavfc]

Villa winning 3-0 and moving into the top 10.
Ireland winning the 6 Nations.
It's good to go out on a winning note!

[Rory]

My uncle, big Ireland supporter, passed away over Christmas. He'll be happy, wherever he is.

RIP
COYBIG

[PaulWinch again]

Fair play to Ireland. England were much better today, but they need to build from this.

[Steve67]

Another four tries conceded for England?  Are we just not tough enough?

[PaulWinch again]

Well to be fair 2 of those were against 14 men and 1 was against 13 men. Ill discipline is more the issue - toughness and desire was there today.

[paul_e]

Another four tries conceded for England?  Are we just not tough enough?

the last try came against 13men, you can't really read anything into it. The 2nd? Should never have counted, coming directly from a scrum that should've been a penalty to England for an obvious seatbelt tackle on Watson as he fielded the kick.

Ireland were the better team, that's undeniable, but the ref was fucking awful, starting with one of the worst red card decisions I've ever seen. What pissed me off more was all the pundits tying themselves up in knots to justify it. The reaction from current and former players on twitter is a far more honest reaction. Some of it is covered on the BBC article - https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/65002154 - but that's the tip of the iceberg, I've seen very few people say it was correct, at best the defense offered is along the lines of once they decided it was foul play then the rules force them into a red card.

I'm normally of the view that rugby officials are far better than football but today was a very clear example of a lack of common sense. I'll be amazed if the red isn't rescinded in the week and it gets quietly brushed under the carpet.

[Jon Crofts]

Peyper couldn’t wait to make that decision, ruined the game for everyone the absolute Twat.

[paul_e]

It feels sad to admit it but I'm still pissed off over the decision over 3 hours later, I just can't get it out my head. What's really stuck with me is that I keep going over all the potential accidental collisions that happen during play and how this decision would play out for each. I just can't get away from the idea that this could lead to games finishing with 25 players on the pitch. Just a week ago the Yellow for Bruno felt like a step in the right direction of officials understanding that cheap red cards are bad for the game and shifting the bar a little higher so to have it set so low today worries me.

[paul_e]

Stuff like this - https://twitter.com/theofficialcox/status/1637158650451050497 - are why I'm so annoyed by the red card. How is this not far more dangerous and, importantly, intended?

In the 2nd half I counted 6 times (not including that one) that a player got caught in the head or face under what I'd consider accidental circumstances and none of them resulted in any review so I'd love to know why not. I mentioned Aki landing his hand in ribbans head, there was also a Sexton shoulder to Ben Curry, one where Ribbans got a stud across his cheek because as he was moving away from a tackle an Irish defender went off his feet, one where an England player (can't remember who) got shoved out of a ruck and his hip/arse landed on an Irish head and a couple of more minor ones where players took forearms to the face during a ruck and a maul respectively.

The argument will be that the outcome (i.e. Keenan failing his HIA) justifies the difference but ruling around outcome when it's an unavoidable accident is stupid and risks people being penalised for ridiculous reasons.

I'll leave it there though, I'm genuinely not angry about England losing, I expected that and thought the game went better than it could've, I'm angry about the implications for the sport if something like that becomes established as a red card.

[PaulWinch again]

Thing is in a sport that is inherently based on collision you can’t be red carding unless there’s either intent, recklessness, or negligence. I don’t think any of those things were present.

In any case we’ve got to stop giving away so many penalties.

[Risso]

It looked a terrible decision, the Irish lad just collided with Stewart who was trying to avoid making a tackle. Absolutely no intent whatsoever other than to get out of the way. Reminded me of the Villa game against Man U in the FA Cup when our goal was chalked off for their player running into ours.

[Villa Lew]

Sarah Hunter, the world's most capped women's player with 140 caps, is retiring after the Scotland match on Saturday.

[PaulWinch again]

It looked a terrible decision, the Irish lad just collided with Stewart who was trying to avoid making a tackle. Absolutely no intent whatsoever other than to get out of the way. Reminded me of the Villa game against Man U in the FA Cup when our goal was chalked off for their player running into ours.

I do think there are two clear tests - intent or negligence/recklessness - if it’s neither of those things then it’s just an unfortunate incident.

[Risso]

It looked a terrible decision, the Irish lad just collided with Stewart who was trying to avoid making a tackle. Absolutely no intent whatsoever other than to get out of the way. Reminded me of the Villa game against Man U in the FA Cup when our goal was chalked off for their player running into ours.

I do think there are two clear tests - intent or negligence/recklessness - if it’s neither of those things then it’s just an unfortunate incident.

I'm as far from being a rugby expert as it's possible to be, but it looks like it's getting to the point where a player who mashes his head into another player stands a fairly good chance of getting the other player sent off. Surely negligence has to be more than just failing to get out of the way?