Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Match Threads & Player Ratings => Topic started by: Legion on October 06, 2012, 06:11:01 PM
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Available Sunday evening.
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So when is it time to worry?....
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So when is it time to worry?....
If we get less than 3 points from the next two games given who we are playing.
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We are shit and we are getting shitter
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Missed our chances when they came at 0-0 & paid the price.
Will be interested to see if Bent goes vocal again.
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We are shit and we are getting shitter
Yup.
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Hold of on the wrist-slitting. Games are turned on the slightest of things. Benteke scores and we're looking good for at least a point.
A bit more composure and luck at Fulham next time hopefully. We need a win or two from Fulham/Norwich/Sunderland though before our horrible run of games in November.
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We will be under genuine pressure within a fortnight unless we win a game. A win changes everything but we really need one.
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Can't see us not being involved in a relegations crap.
I think we probably will stay up this season and we have turned the corner but it will take time for the (self inflicted) damage of the past few years to wear off.
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Decent until the goal went in.
We should have scored, Benteke missed two good chances.
The subs from Lambert were terrible. Benteke should have gone off. We conceded the second and had no shape or balance at all.
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I'm not going to shit my pants over that, I expected them to beat us and up until they scored the fluke goal we were the better team, midfield is a bit of a worry though.
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Spurs just have better players than ours all over the park. We had chances, didn't take them, they had more chances and took some of them.
Both teams played at a 6/10 level but they have more quality and so rightly won. We need some points over the next couple of games badly.
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Score those 2 chances and we'd have been talking about a very good performance. We missed them, Spurs scored a lucky goal stright after and a soft one after that and because we were chasing the game we made them look much better than they actually are.
As for the game thread, there was a fair amount of arguing among fans today. I think people are getting worried we might be in the shit. I'm not particularly.
Cast your minds back about 12 months to that game last season. THAT was shit. What we just saw was another slightly naive, slightly toothless Villa side full of inexperience.
Bent did next to fuck all when he came on. Nothing. And that's the thing with him. He probably would've scored one of the chances Benteke fluffed (the second one in particular was really poor) but he adds next to nothing else. It's a real conundrum for the manager, especially when Bent is openly questioning him in the press.
Anyway, losing to them is about as welcome as gout, but let's not go overboard with the doom and gloom.
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Right well the decision not to pick Bent was a mistake, the chances missed by Benteke were absolute sitters. I'm not writing Benteke off, but Bent is a proven scorer and had scored in last two league games and should have played. I'm not panicking but one worry is that when we are behind the changes Lambert makes seem to empty the midfield completely and isolate the strikers and they haven't been remotely successful. We need to start getting some wins.
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We will be under genuine pressure within a fortnight unless we win a game. A win changes everything but we really need one.
I dont think we play for a fortnight, but I agree with your point. If we dont get anything at Fulham the table will not be pretty.
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Fulham away and Norwich at home, must take a minimum of 4 points otherwise we're deep in the shit.
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We will be under genuine pressure within a fortnight unless we win a game.
We have'nt got a game for a fortnight now unfortunately. Eeek.
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I thought we might get something from the game at half time, but honestly, it's an expected result.
Can you honestly say you'd take any of our players over theirs? They're a much better team, and the league will reflect that at the end of the season, we're years away from being anywhere near the top 6.
Hopefully we'll get something from Fulham.
We're good enough to hit 40-45 points this season, that's all I really expect for Lambert's first season.
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I think most of us would agree it was always going to be a season of ups and downs.
Maybe we are just getting most the downs out the way early on.
UTV
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Right well the decision not to pick Bent was a mistake, the chances missed by Benteke were absolute sitters. I'm not writing Benteke off, but Bent is a proven scorer and had scored in last two league games and should have played. I'm not panicking but one worry is that when we are behind the changes Lambert makes seem to empty the midfield completely and isolate the strikers and they haven't been remotely successful. We need to start getting some wins.
We were losing last week and Lambert's sub scored the goal.
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If I was asked to lay the blame on someone it would be benteke. Harsh as that sounds there were two glorious chances to put us ahead and force totenham to open up an he fluffed them both. U simply cannot do that at this level and we were duly punished. If we're gonna play him up top he needs to improve his finishing and fast. Bent and Weiman must be pissed watching him miss chances like that
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Haven't we got a game? Oh shite. I hate waiting for the next match when we're on a poor run.
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Time to get out the razor blades as we lose away to a side that has finished 4th, 5th, 4th the last 3 seasons. Reality is we missed a couple of great chances to take the lead, chances that every striker in the world misses at times and then they scored a flukey deflected goal. On such fine margins are we either heading for improvement or certs for relegation.
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There was absolutely nothing in it until we missed that chance. Not worried yet.
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I do hope Lambert isn't afraid to drop his own signings. Bent and Weimann are our best hopes for goals but aren't starting.
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Bent should be playing though.
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With the November nightmare fixtures looming I'm starting to worry a little.
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That was shit.
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We need to hold our nerve now. Reading, Norwich, Fulham, Sunderland we will pick up 9 from this lot and some cushion for getting nothing from Arsensl, City United .
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We need wins in all the next 3 games to get us on a roll and get confidence back into the team.
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Bent should be playing though.
He should. A 20 goal a season striker not starting is very strange.
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At this rate we'll have 25 points at the end of the season. 5 points from the 21 we've played for just isn't good enough. I don't know what it is but we are a well below average team at the moment. And if I hear one more supporter blame it on luck I'm going to put a feckin bullet in my head. We make our on luck boys and we look garbage, plain and simple. I want to start winning again. Lambert hasn't instilled a winning mentality in the players at all up until this point. McLeish got more out of a much more limited squad.
Fuck.
WE NEED MORE.
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Two seasons ago we were in the relegation zone by New Year, but still managed to climb to ninth.
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It was a fairly even first half, really, but I think Hilts was right in that there was a sense that Spurs could play better than they were and we were just about as good as we can be.
We were second best in the second half, and in the end it was routine enough for Spurs, who look like a half-decent side.
To repeat my thoughts from the match thread, to lose at White Hart Lane isn't a disgrace in and of itself but it does put that extra pressure on us for the next game, which isn't an easy one. A draw, obviously I suppose, would have just kept us ticking over.
Anyway, five points from seven games is poor stuff, I'm afraid. I still think it'll get better, but I'm not so sure at the moment how much better.
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Nobody seriously expected us to get anything here did they? It was predictable codswallop from start to finish. We might get wins against Norwich, then Reading on the 27th of November. I can't see where else a win will come from between now and then.
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I still think we're in better shape than this time last season, without Ginger Bollocks in charge.
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Fair comments about Spurs being a top side but we were very poor today. And they missed as many sitters as we did, they're just a better team with much better players.
Feel El Ahmadi is way off the pace despite everyone banging on about his passing stats.
Midfield is responsible for a lot of our issues at the moment.
One positive, despite him being poor against the Boggies, I though Vlaar was excellent today, well done Skip.
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There was absolutely nothing in it until we missed that chance. Not worried yet.
Are you related to Neville Chamberlain Steve?
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The only thing that worried me was the substitutions. Emptying midfield wasn't going to help our cause any more than it did against Southampton. A second goal for them was all but inevitable.
It's still very different from the game last year. Progress is still progress. As no doubt everyone will point out, if Benteke had put away one of the good chances that came his way it could have been different.
I didn't see exactly what Bennett's injury was, but it didn't look good.
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I am afraid the last couple of seasons have affected my ability to think positively. I just don't expect us to win. It is a shite attitude but I can't shake it off.
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Not going to get too upset didn't expect to win, at least we didn't roll over.
Dont agree with Bent starting, away from home against a good team that have Just beat Man United away we needed an outlet and Bent doesn't work hard enough to be that man.
Who says Bent would have been where Benteke was for the chances?
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Expected to lose this one but if Benteke had taken one of those two chances things may have been different. Not too concerned about losing this - they're a better team than us. What really concerns me is losing to two of the promoted teams in the first 7 games of the season. We needed those points on the board and we didn't get them. Failure to pick up 4 points from the next 2 games and I think we're really in the shit - especially with both Mancs and Arsenal in November. I think it's going to be a long hard season and PL really needs to shore up our midfield pretty sharpish
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I wish I had never allowed the words Mentally Frail to come into my head. Now I cannot think anything else about performances like that one and Southampton and Wet Spam. Mentally frail.
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McLeish got more out of a much more limited squad.
Fuck.
WE NEED MORE.
Posting so soon after a defeat is probably not best for you mate, give it a few hours next time or you may come out with something as insane as this again.
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too lazy to look it up but what did we get points wise after the first 7 games last season?
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Right well the decision not to pick Bent was a mistake, the chances missed by Benteke were absolute sitters. I'm not writing Benteke off, but Bent is a proven scorer and had scored in last two league games and should have played. I'm not panicking but one worry is that when we are behind the changes Lambert makes seem to empty the midfield completely and isolate the strikers and they haven't been remotely successful. We need to start getting some wins.
We were losing last week and Lambert's sub scored the goal.
Agreed, but I'm thinking of Southampton and this game. Also he dropped the player who got that goal, which doesn't really send the right message.
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I will start to worry if we get to November on less than 9 points. Any less than that going into Nov fixtures and we better hope there are 3 or 4 teams worse than us!
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I am afraid the last couple of seasons have affected my ability to think positively. I just don't expect us to win. It is a shite attitude but I can't shake it off.
I'm the same and unfortunately it seems like a lot of the players share it.
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Was anyone else halfway off their seat as Benteke met that cross? Ho hum.
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Fulham away and Norwich at home, must take a minimum of 4 points otherwise we're deep in the shit.
What I am thinking.
Starting to think the "must win this" thoughts when looking at playing shit teams at home...
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And if I hear one more supporter blame it on luck I'm going to put a feckin bullet in my head.
I haven't heard anybody saying we have been unlucky.
As far as I can tell the arguments have all revolved around whether at this point in time we are seriously shit or moderately shit, becoming more shittier or less shittier, where the blame lies for us getting into this shit in the first place, and what methods needs to be used to extract us from the aforementioned shit.
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McLeish got more out of a much more limited squad.
Fuck.
WE NEED MORE.
Posting so soon after a defeat is probably not best for you mate, give it a few hours next time or you may come out with something as insane as this again.
Insane?!
Buddy, we lost to West ham and got walloped by Southampton.. where do you expect to get wins?
Results, and only results, matter.
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You just know after the break we be piss poor again, happens after every international also Norwich need points and their playing us so it's almost a guarantee they'll win.
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Was anyone else halfway off their seat as Benteke met that cross? Ho hum.
Like last week when he robbed the ball and advanced on goal before not scoring?
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thought we would get totally creamed today, so not all bad.
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Some of your expectations are far too low.
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I am afraid the last couple of seasons have affected my ability to think positively. I just don't expect us to win. It is a shite attitude but I can't shake it off.
I'm the same and unfortunately it seems like a lot of the players share it.
Me too, perhaps thats why i'm so relaxed over this defeat, were just to familiar with it.
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We are in dire need of a DM, who wins the ball for us in midfield ? I was 10% optimistic we could win here but the other 90% was proved right.Patience and the holding of nerves are going to prove a real test for us fans, but what choice have we got ? Any one else think Chris Herd could have played today ?
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At half time at 0-0 I was pleased with how we had kept it at 0-0 and asked for us to be a little more patient in the last third and retain the ball better.
The problem we had was that we were playing as well as we could and our substitutions made us worse - their substitutions improved them. Darren Bent is just the type of striker we needed when we purchased Heskey, as a struggling side he offers the square root of fuck all unless he is 6 yards from goal. Sadly a pitch is 110 yards. The fact of the matter is we're not good enough. Delph, Bannan and Albrighton have all started games this season and they're clearly not good enough. El Ahmadi doesn't instill me in confidence when we play 4-4-2. Holman, you can't fault his effort or work rate but the quality is championshipesque. As for the youngsters like Bennett, Lowton and Benteke, they need to be given time, but it would help their development if they were playing with experienced premiership players and not the likes Delph, Bannan and Albrighton.
Spurs are a million miles ahead of us, the diffference being they have an astute business man who knows his football in Daniel Levy, we have Lerner who doesn't give a fuck.
Even West fucking Brom are better than us and it fucking hurts like hell.
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too lazy to look it up but what did we get points wise after the first 7 games last season?
I hate to worry you but it was 11 and we were unbeaten
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I think the post-2nd goal wrist slashing has clouded the performance overall up to their first. I thought we were equal if not slightly better, given Benteke should have given us the lead. But AVB really has them set up as a counterattacking team and the lucky goal played exactly into their hands.
The problem is, though, teams just know that even if they're in the lowest gear, just keep plugging away and Villa will gift you a goal.
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Was anyone else halfway off their seat as Benteke met that cross? Ho hum.
Like last week when he robbed the ball and advanced on goal before not scoring?
Benteke and Gabby were both poor today. I don't see that pairing delivering many goals.
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Some of your expectations are far too low.
most people seem spot on with their predictions
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McLeish got more out of a much more limited squad.
Fuck.
WE NEED MORE.
Posting so soon after a defeat is probably not best for you mate, give it a few hours next time or you may come out with something as insane as this again.
Insane?!
Buddy, we lost to West ham and got walloped by Southampton.. where do you expect to get wins?
Results, and only results, matter.
I can't believe were even having this conversation tbh, McCleish got absolutely nothing out of his team. Look at the same fixtures post match thread from last season.
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We weren't that bad at the start of the second half, but you cannot miss the chances that we missed against a good side.
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McLeish got more out of a much more limited squad.
Fuck.
WE NEED MORE.
Posting so soon after a defeat is probably not best for you mate, give it a few hours next time or you may come out with something as insane as this again.
Insane?!
Buddy, we lost to West ham and got walloped by Southampton.. where do you expect to get wins?
Results, and only results, matter.
Yet we drew against Newcastle beat swansea and Man city and drew against Albion something that would not have happened last season! It was never going to be instant fix after the the tosh of last season. weve got the right Manager weve just got to take any small positive at this point and for me its were trying to play football again
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McLeish got more out of a much more limited squad.
Fuck.
WE NEED MORE.
Posting so soon after a defeat is probably not best for you mate, give it a few hours next time or you may come out with something as insane as this again.
Insane?!
Buddy, we lost to West ham and got walloped by Southampton.. where do you expect to get wins?
Results, and only results, matter.
Last season we lost 2-0 at Spurs without even trying to get a result. We also lost at home to Swansea and Albion and at Newcastle.
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For all of us that thought it couldn`t be any worse than the "Scottish Manager"- Is Lambert any better? He seems just as tactically inept as McLeish and with a similar stubborn streak. Fitness wise we seem to run out of steam in every game.
I have a feeling that Bent will be replaced by Holt in January - Its all very well saying its early days and all that shit but we really do look poor and I faill to see where the improvement is gonna come from in this squad of players.
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We are in dire need of a DM, who wins the ball for us in midfield ? I was 10% optimistic we could win here but the other 90% was proved right.Patience and the holding of nerves are going to prove a real test for us fans, but what choice have we got ? Any one else think Chris Herd could have played today ?
Been saying that since before the season started. El Ahamdi is not that player and Herd isn't good enough either. We are poor through the middle.
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For all of us that thought it couldn`t be any worse than the "Scottish Manager"- Is Lambert any better? He seems just as tactically inept as McLeish and with a similar stubborn streak. Fitness wise we seem to run out of steam in every game.
I have a feeling that Bent will be replaced by Holt in January - Its all very well saying its early days and all that shit but we really do look poor and I faill to see where the improvement is gonna come from in this squad of players.
I think that's a bit dramatic, there is a tactical plan but we have a lot of inexperienced players and are struggling. The idea of not selecting Bent is crazy though.
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I think the post-2nd goal wrist slashing has clouded the performance overall up to their first. I thought we were equal if not slightly better, given Benteke should have given us the lead. But AVB really has them set up as a counterattacking team and the lucky goal played exactly into their hands.
Absolutely, we were very comfortable up until that fluke of a goal, then it was only after that they looked better than us.
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In a very James May voice .... cock!
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I think we are far from shit but unless we convert our good play into goals and points we will be right in the shit. We looked good for a draw until they got the spawniest goal you will ever see, and the second was a bit unlucky too, going through Bennett's legs.
However the substitutions left us a shapeless mess with a huge gap between attack and defence. I think it was over then, even before we went down to 10 men, and it shows Lambert may not be as brilliant tactically as we sometimes give him credit for.
I think Benteke needs to be eased in with a few sub appearances - he doesn't look entirely ready to me and has missed sitters in 2 or 3 games now. I don't care that he gets more involved than Bent, Bent puts the ball in the net and should start.
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I only saw the last 15 minutes, from when Bennet was injured, so I haven't got much to judge it on today but I've seen most games this season.
Today was always going to be difficult, they have better players in every position in the team and that's true of Man Utd/City, Arsenal, Chelsea, Arsenal, Everton. 6 teams who i'd be shocked if we got anything from.
Theres another bracket of teams with, Newcastle, Sunderland, Liverpool, Stoke, where some of our individual players might be on a par but overall their squads look stronger. These are games where realistically you'd be happy with a point from.
Then there are the group I feel we are amongst, West Brom, Fulham, Swansea, West Ham, QPR, Ideally you want to be winning these games but again realistically they would think the same about us. Our games against West Brom, Swansea, West Ham suggest our results will be a mixed bag.
Below us there's a slightly weaker group of squads, Norwich, Southampton, Reading, Wigan who you would expect to battle relegation. I make this only four teams where I would actually expect us on the balance of probability to win these games. As the Southampton result indicates, even these aren't bankers because there isn't enough of a difference in quality between us and them.
I think this is a fair enough assessment of our relative strength compared with the other teams in our league and it isn't too reassuring. I think we have got a great manager and I think ultimately his method of strengthening the squad looks like the way forward, signing players with potential and developing the young players who we already have. But it does look a squad that's desperately short on quality. I'm not surprised or too disappointed with todays result because it just seems a true reflection on where we are, but I feel we will need to start picking up some wins from the teams in our group VERY soon if the pressure isn't going to build on us again. Due to the make up of our team, which is built for long term development, and financial prudence, we are made up of young players and players without much premier league experience and I think it makes us particularly vulnerable to suffering under the pressure in the immediate short term.
I'm not panicking, but I think LAmbert has a massive job on his hands, bigger than I initially thought.
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For all of us that thought it couldn`t be any worse than the "Scottish Manager"- Is Lambert any better? He seems just as tactically inept as McLeish and with a similar stubborn streak. Fitness wise we seem to run out of steam in every game.
I have a feeling that Bent will be replaced by Holt in January - Its all very well saying its early days and all that shit but we really do look poor and I faill to see where the improvement is gonna come from in this squad of players.
Did we run out of steam at home to Albion and Swansea or at Man City? How about comparing what we just saw to what was served up in the same fixture last season. Or are some people conveniently forgetting Hutton and Heskey in midfield?
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after today we have managed 8 wins in 45 Premier league games, is it any wonder we are so negative and any confidence we get from a win quickly evaporates like today ? Lambert understood this culture of doom ,alluding to something similar when he took over at Norwich.The problem is in this league there isn't the time to turn it around as the next team you play will have as much or more quality/experience.
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We have four or five players adjusting to playing in the Premier League, the "old boys" are coming to terms with a new style of football and people still expect us to win every game.
Patience is a virtue (to coin a phrase) and just as long as we the fans and the board show a bit of patience I feel certain that PlL's vision will pay off. It's going to take years rather than months.
Some of our current squad won't cut the mustard and it's up to PL to weed them out and bring in players that will improve the squad, but that will take at least two or three transfer windows to show whether or not he's the man for the job.
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For all of us that thought it couldn`t be any worse than the "Scottish Manager"- Is Lambert any better? He seems just as tactically inept as McLeish and with a similar stubborn streak. Fitness wise we seem to run out of steam in every game.
I have a feeling that Bent will be replaced by Holt in January - Its all very well saying its early days and all that shit but we really do look poor and I faill to see where the improvement is gonna come from in this squad of players.
The one consolation I take from today's result is that even though the subs didn't work, TSM would have taken off Gabby and Benteke and brought extra defenders on to try to cling on to the 1-0 loss.
It won't always work, but Lambert wants to play attacking football. He has made a huge number of changes, no doubt it's going to take time for things to click. After the last couple of seasons I feel like we've been conditioned to expect the worst, but hopefully we'll all be pleasantly surprised by May.
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I think the post-2nd goal wrist slashing has clouded the performance overall up to their first. I thought we were equal if not slightly better, given Benteke should have given us the lead. But AVB really has them set up as a counterattacking team and the lucky goal played exactly into their hands.
Absolutely, we were very comfortable up until that fluke of a goal, then it was only after that they looked better than us.
However, the table doesn't lie and after 7 games we have the not so grand total of 5 points. We needed to buy some quality in the summer but we bought a load of kids instead. That's a noble ambition if you've just had a comfortable season before, but we didn't, and we can't afford the luxury of letting so many players come to terms with Premier League football all at once. It's a recipe for disaster.
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The result was no surprise, Spurs are a much better team and we're pretty shit with a sub-standard midfield.
Need to get some battlers in January for the relegation dogfight.
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For all of us that thought it couldn`t be any worse than the "Scottish Manager"- Is Lambert any better? He seems just as tactically inept as McLeish and with a similar stubborn streak. Fitness wise we seem to run out of steam in every game.
I have a feeling that Bent will be replaced by Holt in January - Its all very well saying its early days and all that shit but we really do look poor and I faill to see where the improvement is gonna come from in this squad of players.
Im not even going to answer this.. ...seriously?
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I think the post-2nd goal wrist slashing has clouded the performance overall up to their first. I thought we were equal if not slightly better, given Benteke should have given us the lead. But AVB really has them set up as a counterattacking team and the lucky goal played exactly into their hands.
Absolutely, we were very comfortable up until that fluke of a goal, then it was only after that they looked better than us.
However, the table doesn't lie and after 7 games we have the not so grand total of 5 points. We needed to buy some quality in the summer but we bought a load of kids instead. That's a noble ambition if you've just had a comfortable season before, but we didn't, and we can't afford the luxury of letting so many players come to terms with Premier League football all at once. It's a recipe for disaster.
It's a policy in keeping with the fuckwits who run the club, i'm afraid.
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I'm really pissed at how we haven't learnt from not taking our chances. Can't keep happening. When will we learn ffs.
I'm not panicing like others on here, but 1 win in 7 is poor. Need to change the habit of not winning which has torn deeply from when McLeish was manager.
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Calm down. We did ok. Focus on winning the winnable games eg Norwich and Fulham
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Calm down. We did ok. Focus on winning the winnable games eg Norwich and Fulham
Norwich is winnable, not so sure about Fulham.
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I think we'll be fine as I've seen enough from some of the players to suggest they'll be good. However we need to play our best players like Bent and bed the likes of Benteke in gradually. Learn from your mistakes Mr Lambert.
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For all of us that thought it couldn`t be any worse than the "Scottish Manager"- Is Lambert any better? He seems just as tactically inept as McLeish and with a similar stubborn streak. Fitness wise we seem to run out of steam in every game.
I have a feeling that Bent will be replaced by Holt in January - Its all very well saying its early days and all that shit but we really do look poor and I faill to see where the improvement is gonna come from in this squad of players.
Im not even going to answer this.. ...seriously?
I was annoyed by that post too. But as you say, just not worth getting drawn into the debate!
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I think we'll be fine as I've seen enough from some of the players to suggest they'll be good. However we need to play our best players like Bent and bed the likes of Benteke in gradually. Learn from your mistakes Mr Lambert.
Lambert acting the hard man today?
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For all of us that thought it couldn`t be any worse than the "Scottish Manager"- Is Lambert any better? He seems just as tactically inept as McLeish and with a similar stubborn streak. Fitness wise we seem to run out of steam in every game.
I have a feeling that Bent will be replaced by Holt in January - Its all very well saying its early days and all that shit but we really do look poor and I faill to see where the improvement is gonna come from in this squad of players.
Did we run out of steam at home to Albion and Swansea or at Man City? How about comparing what we just saw to what was served up in the same fixture last season. Or are some people conveniently forgetting Hutton and Heskey in midfield?
Today we had 8 shots, 5 on target, and played some football, gave it a go and were a bit unlucky. Last season we barely got out of our own half, and to be honest, didn't look interested in trying. Just go away and watch a re-run of last season's game and then maybe you see how bad it really was. Yes Lambert looks stubborn and may be has too much faith in inexperienced players, but at least there are some positives. I don't think anything could be as bad as watching that TSM team last season.
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We didn't have a single corner..
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I think the post-2nd goal wrist slashing has clouded the performance overall up to their first. I thought we were equal if not slightly better, given Benteke should have given us the lead. But AVB really has them set up as a counterattacking team and the lucky goal played exactly into their hands.
Absolutely, we were very comfortable up until that fluke of a goal, then it was only after that they looked better than us.
However, the table doesn't lie and after 7 games we have the not so grand total of 5 points. We needed to buy some quality in the summer but we bought a load of kids instead. That's a noble ambition if you've just had a comfortable season before, but we didn't, and we can't afford the luxury of letting so many players come to terms with Premier League football all at once. It's a recipe for disaster.
Aston Villa is not a child sex trafficking buisness ;)
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We have four or five players adjusting to playing in the Premier League, the "old boys" are coming to terms with a new style of football and people still expect us to win every game.
Patience is a virtue (to coin a phrase) and just as long as we the fans and the board show a bit of patience I feel certain that PlL's vision will pay off. It's going to take years rather than months.
Some of our current squad won't cut the mustard and it's up to PL to weed them out and bring in players that will improve the squad, but that will take at least two or three transfer windows to show whether or not he's the man for the job.
By which time we will be in the Championship and it will be too fecking late - patience may well be a virtue however in the modern game results matter more than anything else. Personally I have seen nothing in this manager that suggests we will be anything other than strugglers. Maybe, just maybe we will take that step down and come back stronger but its far too much of a gamble to take.
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And if I hear one more supporter blame it on luck I'm going to put a feckin bullet in my head.
I think we were unlucky. Nice knowing you.
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I think we'll be fine as I've seen enough from some of the players to suggest they'll be good. However we need to play our best players like Bent and bed the likes of Benteke in gradually. Learn from your mistakes Mr Lambert.
Lambert acting the hard man today?
Well precisely that sort of pettiness can not be afforded. Bent had scored his last two games and should have been playing.
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Calm down. We did ok. Focus on winning the winnable games eg Norwich and Fulham
Any game is winnable.
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For all of us that thought it couldn`t be any worse than the "Scottish Manager"- Is Lambert any better? He seems just as tactically inept as McLeish and with a similar stubborn streak. Fitness wise we seem to run out of steam in every game.
I have a feeling that Bent will be replaced by Holt in January - Its all very well saying its early days and all that shit but we really do look poor and I faill to see where the improvement is gonna come from in this squad of players.
Dude chill out. You're overreacting. Get some fresh air.
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Calm down. We did ok. Focus on winning the winnable games eg Norwich and Fulham
This
We'll be fine
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Apparently results and the table don't lie as it shows us near the bottom. So it won't lie that 3 of our 4 defeats came against sides in the top 8. And that we've only played 2 of the rest of the current bottom half. Disgraceful, sack everyone associated with the club.
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I think the post-2nd goal wrist slashing has clouded the performance overall up to their first. I thought we were equal if not slightly better, given Benteke should have given us the lead. But AVB really has them set up as a counterattacking team and the lucky goal played exactly into their hands.
Absolutely, we were very comfortable up until that fluke of a goal, then it was only after that they looked better than us.
However, the table doesn't lie and after 7 games we have the not so grand total of 5 points. We needed to buy some quality in the summer but we bought a load of kids instead. That's a noble ambition if you've just had a comfortable season before, but we didn't, and we can't afford the luxury of letting so many players come to terms with Premier League football all at once. It's a recipe for disaster.
Aston Villa is not a child sex trafficking buisness ;)
Would have made an interesting poll question not much over a year ago though.
Who would you prefer as Villa manager ? Alex Mcleish or Jimmy Saville ?
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Apparently results and the table don't lie as it shows us near the bottom. So it won't lie that 3 of our 4 defeats came against sides in the top 8. And that we've only played 2 of the rest of the current bottom half. Disgraceful, sack everyone associated with the club.
And if it doesn't lie, Liverpool are also for the drop along with us I assume?
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Nice to see the Negative Nancy's are back this week.
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Boo fucking hoo.
Had chances, wasted them. Punished by the better side. Fulham next, move on.
I wasn't aware that you had to throw the towel in after 7 games.
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Think lambert cut off his nose to spite his face with leaving bent out- albrighton is not good enough at this level and Delph looks poor - decent enough 1st half but wrong team selections have helped towards this defeat- bent had scored in his last 2 games and should have started.
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Darren Bent needs to start against Fulham.
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I'm just fed up of expecting to lose. Our results in 2012 must be among the worst in the club's entire history. Lambert has an enormouse job to change my mindset.
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For all of us that thought it couldn`t be any worse than the "Scottish Manager"- Is Lambert any better? He seems just as tactically inept as McLeish and with a similar stubborn streak. Fitness wise we seem to run out of steam in every game.
I have a feeling that Bent will be replaced by Holt in January - Its all very well saying its early days and all that shit but we really do look poor and I faill to see where the improvement is gonna come from in this squad of players.
Dude chill out. You're overreacting. Get some fresh air.
Yeah youre right ... we battered Swansea and won two League cup ties ... lets forget Everton, Southampton, West Ham and the Baggies.
performances. Its all about opinions isn`t it? I hope I am proved wrong however I have seen little signs of the green shoots of recovery and to be frank, the signings other than perhaps Vlaar and El Hamadi have been totally underwhelming.
I have witnessed some poor Villa teams over the years and I get the "whiff" of relegation when the squad or team is of such poor quality ....right now the signs are edging that way - early days yes, but this is a results business and you get feck all for being unlucky or being in a period or transition. I am very frustrated like all of us I guess - but as much as I want this guy to be better than TSM I havn`t seen enough to give me that confidence...... just call me a twat when we finish 6th at the end of the season! :)
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I'm just fed up of expecting to lose. Our results in 2012 must be among the worst in the club's entire history. Lambert has an enormouse job to change my mindset.
I think we discussed this last season during the nadir of TSM. The worst in history was a particularly bad losing run in the early 1960s when Joe Mercer fell ill.
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I'm just fed up of expecting to lose. Our results in 2012 must be among the worst in the club's entire history. Lambert has an enormouse job to change my mindset.
How many games have we actually won this calendar year? 4? 5 tops? I remain confident we will improve in the new year but the new few results will be crucial. If we are struggling come December pockets of fans will start to get very edgy and that could erode some of the good will afforded to Lambert and team so far. I hope that isn't the case.
Spurs didn't really get out of 2nd gear but we were comfortable ourselves until they scored. Benteke has to score as we know but there were some strangely flat performances from players too, most notably Holman. Vlaar was excellent though and I really like the look of Bennett. The substitutions were baffling, Gabby didn't know where he was playing and El Ahmadi became a one man midfield. They then just walked through the gargantuan gap to score the 2nd goal.
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My instinct is to disagree with villadelph but we are not going to get better unless we are intolerant of our own failures. I hope the players hate losing as much as I do.
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In all fairness, if a Woman does object to being groped, she probably IS a lesbian.
SHIT
Thought I was on off topic.
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I'm really pissed at how we haven't learnt from not taking our chances. Can't keep happening. When will we learn ffs.
I'm not panicing like others on here, but 1 win in 7 is poor. Need to change the habit of not winning which has torn deeply from when McLeish was manager.
I'm not sure it's a case of not learning! Will benteke 'remember' to score next time?
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An hour on and only 8 pages of posts. I get the feeling that apathy is setting in. Better than caring I suppose.
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Is anyone seriously suggesting today wasn't a load better than the same matchast season? We actually passed the ball and attacked today
We're in for a tricky season I'm sure and lambert has a massive job on his hands. I still think he'll turn it around and to call him tactically ignorant is just wrong
I did think he got it wrong today in not selecting bent. But then you could argue the 4231 worked pretty well, and I think bent has frequently shown he can't play in that system, so perhaps not
But for fulham, I'd bring in lichaj for Bennett, Ireland for alby, bent for gabby. And possibly bannan for delph.
I think lambert's judgement on signings has looked very good so far. It's just a shame that we're relying on them fitting straight in
Also, I know it sounds odd, but if we did go down, I'd currently want to keep lambert as the man to build a new side to take us back up again.
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How games have we actually won this calendar year? 4? 5 tops?
6 of the last 38.
Home - Swansea, Fulham, Norwich.
Away - Wolves, Bolton, Chelsea.
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Nice to see the Negative Nancy's are back this week.
I hear ya brother! Us positive Pamela's have to stick together.
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An hour on and only 8 pages of posts. I get the feeling that apathy is setting in. Better than caring I suppose.
My optimism over the Lambert appointment lead me to renew my season ticket whilst I was in a hospital bed recovering from an operation- a few months down the line and I am somewhat less optimistic about our future, primarily because of the lack of quality recruited during the transfer window. Perhaps its no coincidence that one of Lambert`s fellow "bright young mangers" Rodgers is also struggling over at Anfield.
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Is anyone seriously suggesting today wasn't a load better than the same matchast season? We actually passed the ball and attacked today
Thank you someone with some common sense
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Have to say a lot of over reacting on here today.2-0 flattered Spuds, a team that will probably finish in the top 4.
Positives for me were numerous.Bennett and RB played well against probably the best two wide players in the league, Vlaar and Clark played well, as did KEA and Delph for 60 mins.
Gabby remains an enigma, Benteke needs experience, and Albrighton, although better than last week is too lightweight.
Overall a better performance than i expected, we won't lose to Fulham, and beat Norwich, don't worry.
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For all of us that thought it couldn`t be any worse than the "Scottish Manager"- Is Lambert any better? He seems just as tactically inept as McLeish and with a similar stubborn streak. Fitness wise we seem to run out of steam in every game.
I have a feeling that Bent will be replaced by Holt in January - Its all very well saying its early days and all that shit but we really do look poor and I faill to see where the improvement is gonna come from in this squad of players.
Dude chill out. You're overreacting. Get some fresh air.
Yeah youre right ... we battered Swansea and won two League cup ties ... lets forget Everton, Southampton, West Ham and the Baggies.
performances. Its all about opinions isn`t it? I hope I am proved wrong however I have seen little signs of the green shoots of recovery and to be frank, the signings other than perhaps Vlaar and El Hamadi have been totally underwhelming.
I have witnessed some poor Villa teams over the years and I get the "whiff" of relegation when the squad or team is of such poor quality ....right now the signs are edging that way - early days yes, but this is a results business and you get feck all for being unlucky or being in a period or transition. I am very frustrated like all of us I guess - but as much as I want this guy to be better than TSM I havn`t seen enough to give me that confidence...... just call me a twat when we finish 6th at the end of the season! :)
theres nothing wrong in calling it early VCTM, if thats how you feel then thats what you say,
its the same as saying a player isnt doing it and someone comes on and says 'give him a chance' well when he's had a full season and he's still crap its easy to call it then.
i actually disagree with you though, i think we are in far better hands this season, and i do think it will take some time to turn round with small improvements as we go along, i'm quite happy with Lambert and the way we are at least trying to play, obviously we do need some good results soon or the pressure will build and things can turn sour. i do think we have improved from last year, but i accept that for others its difficult to see
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How games have we actually won this calendar year? 4? 5 tops?
6 of the last 38.
Home - Swansea, Fulham, Norwich.
Away - Wolves, Bolton, Chelsea.
That truly is an awful statistic - Chelsea result aside - We are officially shit then?
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We have to stick together, players and fans.....let's not kid ourselves it may well be touch and go this year but we will come through it better, stronger and with a team of hungry young players with some PL experience. We can't do it any other way because we haven't got a rich Arab bank-rolling us.
So keep the faith, support the gaffer and get behind the boys.
Ive been to most games this season home and away and with the exception of one or two players I have been really proud and pleased about the effort and commitment......how many times did I think that last year ??....very few !!
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I only saw the last 15 minutes, from when Bennet was injured, so I haven't got much to judge it on today but I've seen most games this season.
Today was always going to be difficult, they have better players in every position in the team and that's true of Man Utd/City, Arsenal, Chelsea, Arsenal, Everton. 6 teams who i'd be shocked if we got anything from.
Theres another bracket of teams with, Newcastle, Sunderland, Liverpool, Stoke, where some of our individual players might be on a par but overall their squads look stronger. These are games where realistically you'd be happy with a point from.
Then there are the group I feel we are amongst, West Brom, Fulham, Swansea, West Ham, QPR, Ideally you want to be winning these games but again realistically they would think the same about us. Our games against West Brom, Swansea, West Ham suggest our results will be a mixed bag.
Below us there's a slightly weaker group of squads, Norwich, Southampton, Reading, Wigan who you would expect to battle relegation. I make this only four teams where I would actually expect us on the balance of probability to win these games. As the Southampton result indicates, even these aren't bankers because there isn't enough of a difference in quality between us and them.
I think this is a fair enough assessment of our relative strength compared with the other teams in our league and it isn't too reassuring. I think we have got a great manager and I think ultimately his method of strengthening the squad looks like the way forward, signing players with potential and developing the young players who we already have. But it does look a squad that's desperately short on quality. I'm not surprised or too disappointed with todays result because it just seems a true reflection on where we are, but I feel we will need to start picking up some wins from the teams in our group VERY soon if the pressure isn't going to build on us again. Due to the make up of our team, which is built for long term development, and financial prudence, we are made up of young players and players without much premier league experience and I think it makes us particularly vulnerable to suffering under the pressure in the immediate short term.
I'm not panicking, but I think LAmbert has a massive job on his hands, bigger than I initially thought.
Great post mate.
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An hour on and only 8 pages of posts. I get the feeling that apathy is setting in. Better than caring I suppose.
That's what three difficult seasons does to you. The attendance of 34,000 against West Brom spoke volumes. The fans were given two fingers last season and it won't heal overnight. Sure we finished ninth in 2010/11 after winning our last two games. With four games to go that season we were still in a relegation scrap.
It will take some fighting performances and a signal that the board want us to be more than just also-rans for people to shake off the apathy.
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Just seen the highlights on cable over here and the thing that worries me is Benteke. He has missed easy chances in every game he has been involved in so far. It is early days i know,but the guy looks to be a young version of Heskey. If he had scored against the Albion and today ,the whole game changes.
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Just seen the highlights on cable over here and the thing that worries me is Benteke. He has missed easy chances in every game he has been involved in so far. It is early days i know,but the guy looks to be a young version of Heskey. If he had scored against the Albion and today ,the whole game changes.
He doesn't deserve to be starting games.
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How games have we actually won this calendar year? 4? 5 tops?
6 of the last 38.
Home - Swansea, Fulham, Norwich.
Away - Wolves, Bolton, Chelsea.
That truly is an awful statistic - Chelsea result aside - We are officially shit then?
Maybe the Baggs have a point..
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I am with you Matt Collins. We have to draw a line under manager bashing. I cannot be alone in thinking that I have had a bellyful of slagging off our managers. The last three years have been like being in a car full of back seat drivers. I have been as vocal as most in my criticism of O'Neill, Houllier and TSM but I want to follow Villa without rancour. I have followed them through infinitely worse periods and it is time for me give full and total support to the manager. I do not care very much what other fans either on here or in the general fan base want to see rectified. I only know what I feel. I miss being blind to Villa's shortcomings. Whatever the future holds, f*ck it, bring it on.
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Calm down. We did ok. Focus on winning the winnable games eg Norwich and Fulham
Absolutely, who do we think we are expecting to win against decent teams. TSM said the same last year and made everyone angry. Obviously we've lowered our expectations.
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I really hope that Benteke becomes our own Drogba and there is so much time for that to happen but he has a lot of ground to make up. At least his first touch today wasn't quite as bad as last week.
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The Post-Match threads are always hilarious to read after I've been out all day.
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There's no point getting upset about losing matches like this. We have a long way to go in our transition. Much further than the handful of games so far
One thing I will say is, whilst nobody wants a return to paying seasoned pros huge money to do fuck all, "young and hungry players" alone will get us nowhere.
We frequently look like a side that needs a bit more maturity, and the focus on young, untested players almost to the exclusion of all else strikes me as more than a bit risky.
If we spend in January it needs to be on proven quality.
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Lets face it most people expected us to lose 2-0 at least. The fact that the manager didnt select Bent meant our chances of scoring were minimal. He doesnt seem to like Bent which is not good news at all. Both Agbonlahor and Benteke had three good chances between them.They didnt convert them. Bent has a track record of doing so.
Its going to be a long hard season but we expected that. Paul Lambert is hopefully the new Ron Saunders.
At least I hope so.
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From the official site:
Lambert said:
"When you come to places like this, you have to take your chances.
"Their first goal was very fortunate for them. We had two chances beforehand - the header and the shot after the pull-back which went straight at the goalkeeper.
"I said to him just then that you have to score at this level. Christian has to hit the target with his header. They were terrific chances.
"He's only a young lad and he will learn every day but at this level you have to score.
"I thought we gave a very good account of ourselves.
"But, as I said, the big moments were when we had the chance to go one-up with Christian, not just once but twice with the shot and the header. I thought they were the massive moments.
"I can't fault the effort. That was there in abundance. We pick ourselves up and go again now.
"I am disappointed to lose but some of things in the game were really pleasing.
"The great thing is the lads kept on going, even with ten men. They never capitulated.
"They kept their hunger and desire. That's a big plus. We just pick ourselves up and go again."
Lambert revealed Joe Bennett has a gash on his leg after a slide across the track pitchside.
He hopes the left-back, who excelled in the game, will be fit in time for the Fulham game.
He added: "Joe is okay. He's got a gash on his leg which needs seeing to.
"But we have the international break now so hopefully he will be back. We will have to wait and see."
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Calm down. We did ok. Focus on winning the winnable games eg Norwich and Fulham
Absolutely, who do we think we are expecting to win against decent teams. TSM said the same last year and made everyone angry. Obviously we've lowered our expectations.
I'm with you Mike. Lambert's in it for the long-haul and I'm really happy to back that but what I absolutely cannot stand is the fans who think Villa are now just some two-bit club.
"Let's focus on beating Reading", "as long as we finish 17th"...
How quickly we have fallen that a couple of seasons ago we were disappointed with 6th now any old shit will do.
If the board senses this, it's just another excuse for them to not invest further.
Bringing in kids is fine but Villa (board and fans alike) must not lose their ambition or we're going to go the way of Forest sadly.
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"We pick ourselves up and go again"
Is anybody else getting a bit sick of hearing that?
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If Benteke had took his chances things might have been different but there will be plenty of teams who go to WHL and get nothing so I'm not worried yet we need to focus on the next three games and see if we can get something out of them.
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I'm happy that Bennett isn't badly injured. He has been impressive.
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"We pick ourselves up and go again"
Is anybody else getting a bit sick of hearing that?
No, what else is he supposed to say?
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Not much else he can say. He has been honest and upfront with what he expects of his strikers.
And if Bent had kept his mouth shut last week then he would have probably started today.
In Lambert we trust.
UTV!
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"We pick ourselves up and go again"
Is anybody else getting a bit sick of hearing that?
110% sick of it ?
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"We pick ourselves up and go again"
Is anybody else getting a bit sick of hearing that?
I'm sick of hearing it because it means we haven't won, but i don't think Lambert has put a foot wrong in what he's said so far.
I also think it's fair enough for him to stamp his authority on the squad by not putting Bent straight back in the team. Hopefully Bent will keep his trap shut now and will start the next game, but i thought it was disrespectful to moan so publicly after being dropped to the bench for one game. I can see Lambert has to show he's his own man. Bent backed him into a corner if anything.
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Calm down. We did ok. Focus on winning the winnable games eg Norwich and Fulham
Absolutely, who do we think we are expecting to win against decent teams. TSM said the same last year and made everyone angry. Obviously we've lowered our expectations.
I'm with you Mike. Lambert's in it for the long-haul and I'm really happy to back that but what I absolutely cannot stand is the fans who think Villa are now just some two-bit club.
"Let's focus on beating Reading", "as long as we finish 17th"...
How quickly we have fallen that a couple of seasons ago we were disappointed with 6th now any old shit will do.
If the board senses this, it's just another excuse for them to not invest further.
Bringing in kids is fine but Villa (board and fans alike) must not lose their ambition or we're going to go the way of Forest sadly.
Agree to an extent , but we are now light years away from a top 4 challenge and the finances of the top 4 are miles beyond our reach, under o Neill we had the chance but now we must look at competing with the likes of Newcastle and everton at best as a realistic target in the next 2or 3 yrs - the dream of top 4 is long gone and a cup run and shot at the Europa spots is as good as it will get in the foreseeable future.
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If buying players form the lower league and lesser known foreign players doesn't work and will only lead to relegation, I wish someone would tell the likes of Newcastle, Everton and Albion.
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Fair enough from Lambert. Positives: Guzan was okay, Bennett and Lowton did well, Vlaar was exceptional at times, Clark wasn't too bad. Some nice passing. Gabby and Benteke caused them problems.
Negatives: a bit powder-puff in midfield. We miss Ireland, and if Westwood really is a Carrick-type we need to get him in. Can't be pulling up any treesw in training though, else he'd have featured more.
Is NRC still single?
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I honestly think it will get worse than this before it gets better, but as long as I see small improvements along the way that's good enough for me.
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Calm down. We did ok. Focus on winning the winnable games eg Norwich and Fulham
Absolutely, who do we think we are expecting to win against decent teams. TSM said the same last year and made everyone angry. Obviously we've lowered our expectations.
I'm with you Mike. Lambert's in it for the long-haul and I'm really happy to back that but what I absolutely cannot stand is the fans who think Villa are now just some two-bit club.
"Let's focus on beating Reading", "as long as we finish 17th"...
How quickly we have fallen that a couple of seasons ago we were disappointed with 6th now any old shit will do.
If the board senses this, it's just another excuse for them to not invest further.
Bringing in kids is fine but Villa (board and fans alike) must not lose their ambition or we're going to go the way of Forest sadly.
Agree to an extent , but we are now light years away from a top 4 challenge and the finances of the top 4 are miles beyond our reach, under o Neill we had the chance but now we must look at competing with the likes of Newcastle and everton at best as a realistic target in the next 2or 3 yrs - the dream of top 4 is long gone and a cup run and shot at the Europa spots is as good as it will get in the foreseeable future.
Good point Eastie but I don't have a problem with competing with Newcastle and Everton - it's the fact that some are happy to just survive relegation, that we're now on a par with the worst teams in the entire league.
I can see the thinking that this is a transitionary year but I think lowering expectations is a dangerous precedent and lowering them to such an extent is a painful one.
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We should have been 2-0 up when they scored but we really need to get some points on the board. Get Bent back in and play with wingers because creativity isn't there
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If buying players form the lower league and lesser known foreign players doesn't work and will only lead to relegation, I wish someone would tell the likes of Newcastle, Everton and Albion.
Cabaye, Tiote and Ben Arfa were hardly barely known when they signed them. Similarly Ba and Cisse.
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Our season won't be decided on away games at Spurs.
No one really expected us to get a result there and we didn't. Move along then, nothing to see here.
It's the home games against the mediocre and crap teams (like Swansea and the Baggies) that will determine our fate this season.
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I think another problem we face with the long-term plan is that there seem to be very few out and out shit teams this year. I'd put Reading and Wigan in that bracket and probably Norwich at this rate but not sure we'll be able to rely upon that like we did last year.
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If buying players form the lower league and lesser known foreign players doesn't work and will only lead to relegation, I wish someone would tell the likes of Newcastle, Everton and Albion.
Cabaye, Tiote and Ben Arfa were hardly barely known when they signed them. Similarly Ba and Cisse.
Neither then were Vlaar, Benteke, Holmann, KEA.
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I'm happy that Bennett isn't badly injured. He has been impressive.
Yes good news.
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I'd add QPR, southampton and maybe even Sunderland and Stoke to that list
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"We pick ourselves up and go again"
Is anybody else getting a bit sick of hearing that?
It's a young team , I think Lambert is careful not to be overly critical.I don't want to hear him say that every other week, but it could be worse. Remember O'Leary's can't compete with the likes of...I am only playing the kids because that's all we have got left in this squad.
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I'd add QPR, southampton and maybe even Sunderland and Stoke to that list
OK maybe but Southampton have already stuffed us!
I think perhaps Lambert had added a good young squad and perhaps we'll see one or two better quality players in January which will help boost us up the table.
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I think another problem we face with the long-term plan is that there seem to be very few out and out shit teams this year. I'd put Reading and Wigan in that bracket and probably Norwich at this rate but not sure we'll be able to rely upon that like we did last year.
It's so shit that we have to think like this yet again. It has been quite a prolonged dismal spell. Other shit years like 1994/95 or even the mid noughties always seemed to be unacceptable exceptions to the general rule of being villa.
We need to find that mentality again, we're too good and to proud a club for this crap of trying to get to forty points and thinking of possible teams that are worse than us.
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I think another problem we face with the long-term plan is that there seem to be very few out and out shit teams this year. I'd put Reading and Wigan in that bracket and probably Norwich at this rate but not sure we'll be able to rely upon that like we did last year.
It's so shit that we have to think like this yet again. It has been quite a prolonged dismal spell. Other shit years like 1994/95 or even the mid noughties always seemed to be unacceptable exceptions to the general rule of being villa.
We need to find that mentality again, we're too good and to proud a club for this crap.
Yes, we've finished in the bottom half for one year in a row.
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If buying players form the lower league and lesser known foreign players doesn't work and will only lead to relegation, I wish someone would tell the likes of Newcastle, Everton and Albion.
Cabaye, Tiote and Ben Arfa were hardly barely known when they signed them. Similarly Ba and Cisse.
Neither then were Vlaar, Benteke, Holmann, KEA.
Benteke is a kid, mind.
We look short of experienced heads, and to continue in that fashion strikes me as dangerous. If you want to make a comparison with Newcastle, I can't think of any inexperienced lower league players who went straight into their team.
Our squad looked incredibly weak at the end of last season, and we haven't added enough experience to it.
Dont get me wrong, Westwood, Benteke, Lowton, Bowery and Bennett might all turn out to be great buys.it is relying on them to do so that concerns me a bit, which is why I don't really get it when people tout having a squad of "young and hungry players" as a positive.
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I think another problem we face with the long-term plan is that there seem to be very few out and out shit teams this year. I'd put Reading and Wigan in that bracket and probably Norwich at this rate but not sure we'll be able to rely upon that like we did last year.
It's so shit that we have to think like this yet again. It has been quite a prolonged dismal spell. Other shit years like 1994/95 or even the mid noughties always seemed to be unacceptable exceptions to the general rule of being villa.
We need to find that mentality again, we're too good and to proud a club for this crap.
Yes, we've finished in the bottom half for one year in a row.
Some of our fans seem to think that's where we belong at the moment.
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(http://i.minus.com/iI04qBVyEBQp2.gif)
(http://i4.mirror.co.uk/incoming/article1366082.ece/ALTERNATES/s510b/Tottenham+Hotspur+v+Aston+Villa+-+Premier+League)
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That's right. He should not trot out some hackneyed old cliche like "pick ourselves up and go again". What we need is some fresh thinking like "we must all go home and hide under the stairs" or "we must go somewhere expensive and have a good fight". Lambert's use of language is dull, dull, dull. No wonder we are in deep shit.
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Cheat.
Ouch!
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I think another problem we face with the long-term plan is that there seem to be very few out and out shit teams this year. I'd put Reading and Wigan in that bracket and probably Norwich at this rate but not sure we'll be able to rely upon that like we did last year.
It's so shit that we have to think like this yet again. It has been quite a prolonged dismal spell. Other shit years like 1994/95 or even the mid noughties always seemed to be unacceptable exceptions to the general rule of being villa.
We need to find that mentality again, we're too good and to proud a club for this crap.
Yes, we've finished in the bottom half for one year in a row.
Psychologically we were in a relegation scrap for the whole of 2010/11. We jumped three or four places at the end of the season and were on 42 points with two games remaining! Wigan finished 16th on 42 points.
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If buying players form the lower league and lesser known foreign players doesn't work and will only lead to relegation, I wish someone would tell the likes of Newcastle, Everton and Albion.
Cabaye, Tiote and Ben Arfa were hardly barely known when they signed them. Similarly Ba and Cisse.
Neither then were Vlaar, Benteke, Holmann, KEA.
Benteke is a kid, mind.
We look short of experienced heads, and to continue in that fashion strikes me as dangerous. If you want to make a comparison with Newcastle, I can't think of any inexperienced lower league players who went straight into their team.
Our squad looked incredibly weak at the end of last season, and we haven't added enough experience to it.
Dont get me wrong, Westwood, Benteke, Lowton, Bowery and Bennett might all turn out to be great buys.it is relying on them to do so that concerns me a bit, which is why I don't really get it when people tout having a squad of "young and hungry players" as a positive.
He is, but every player was a kid once. We tried the buy supposedly proven players route and it didn't get us very far. A lot of people would have said "who?" with some of those Newcastle players, I don't remember many people saying what a great signing Tiote, Cabaye, Cisse were at the time.
And Everton and Albion are both currently in the top 6 with a number of what were unknown and lower league players. Both currently have the best sides i've seen them have for 20+ years. It can work but requires some patience not wrist slashing after 7 games.
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I think another problem we face with the long-term plan is that there seem to be very few out and out shit teams this year. I'd put Reading and Wigan in that bracket and probably Norwich at this rate but not sure we'll be able to rely upon that like we did last year.
It's so shit that we have to think like this yet again. It has been quite a prolonged dismal spell. Other shit years like 1994/95 or even the mid noughties always seemed to be unacceptable exceptions to the general rule of being villa.
We need to find that mentality again, we're too good and to proud a club for this crap.
Yes, we've finished in the bottom half for one year in a row.
Psychologically we were in a relegation scrap for the whole of 2010/11. We jumped three or four places at the end of the season and were on 42 points with two games remaining! Wigan finished 16th on 42 points.
I couldn't care less what Wigan were or how many points they got. We've finished in the bottom half once during this "prolonged dismal spell." How you would have coped during some of the genuinely bad periods in our history I dread to think.
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In the final half of 2010/11 we produced top six form.
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We are getting handled by teams who we should be neck and neck with in the table. We can't even give a decent game to Everton or Spurs and we still have the big boys to play. I fail to see how anyone can be optimistic at the moment. I'm also going to start keeping track of how many times "Did you really expect to win against _________ FC at ______?" Hold those responsible for getting results to a higher standard. You bunch are rolling over for mediocre/above average clubs like we're a fucking Championship side.
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Dave, there's no need for that.
I only want the best for the club I support.
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No need for what?
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We are getting handled by teams who we should be neck and neck with in the table. We can't even give a decent game to Everton or Spurs and we still have the big boys to play. I fail to see how anyone can be optimistic at the moment. I'm also going to start keeping track of how many times "Did you really expect to win against _________ FC at ______?" Hold those responsible for getting results to a higher standard. You bunch are rolling over for mediocre/above average clubs like we're a fucking Championship side.
We should be in the top 5?
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We are getting handled by teams who we should be neck and neck with in the table. We can't even give a decent game to Everton or Spurs and we still have the big boys to play. I fail to see how anyone can be optimistic at the moment. I'm also going to start keeping track of how many times "Did you really expect to win against _________ FC at ______?" Hold those responsible for getting results to a higher standard. You bunch are rolling over for mediocre/above average clubs like we're a fucking Championship side.
And we publicly called TSM every foul word in the dictionary for saying the same.
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And Everton and Albion are both currently in the top 6 with a number of what were unknown and lower league players. Both currently have the best sides i've seen them have for 20+ years. It can work but requires some patience not wrist slashing after 7 games.
None of those teams sold all their decent players in the space of two years and failed to replace them with anybody as good. It's why we're struggling, we just don't have a very good team.
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Well said Delph and Irish, we're not over-reactionary fans like you see over on VT, we're behind the manager and embrace the changes he's implementing. Doesn't mean we should suddenly be happy to only compete with a handful of clubs in the league.
It's the fans expectations that worry me almost as much as the league table at the moment. I'm happy for us to build gradually and it's not the end of the world we're near the bottom but I won't be happy if it lasts all season.
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And Everton and Albion are both currently in the top 6 with a number of what were unknown and lower league players. Both currently have the best sides i've seen them have for 20+ years. It can work but requires some patience not wrist slashing after 7 games.
None of those teams sold all their decent players in the space of two years and failed to replace them with anybody as good. It's why we're struggling, we just don't have a very good team.
None of those teams is 7 games into starting that philosophy either. They are however starting to see potential reaping of rewards for a long term plan. Something we've lacked since the mid 90's.
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Well said Delph and Irish, we're not over-reactionary fans like you see over on VT, we're behind the manager and embrace the changes he's implementing. Doesn't mean we should suddenly be happy to only compete with a handful of clubs in the league.
It's the fans expectations that worry me almost as much as the league table at the moment. I'm happy for us to build gradually and it's not the end of the world we're near the bottom but I won't be happy if it lasts all season.
Neither will I be but I don't believe it will.
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Well said Delph and Irish, we're not over-reactionary fans like you see over on VT, we're behind the manager and embrace the changes he's implementing. Doesn't mean we should suddenly be happy to only compete with a handful of clubs in the league.
It's the fans expectations that worry me almost as much as the league table at the moment. I'm happy for us to build gradually and it's not the end of the world we're near the bottom but I won't be happy if it lasts all season.
None of us will be happy if it lasts all season, but some of us are patient enough to wait more than 7 games before declaring the end of Aston Villa.
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And Everton and Albion are both currently in the top 6 with a number of what were unknown and lower league players. Both currently have the best sides i've seen them have for 20+ years. It can work but requires some patience not wrist slashing after 7 games.
None of those teams sold all their decent players in the space of two years and failed to replace them with anybody as good. It's why we're struggling, we just don't have a very good team.
Everton have sold their best players ie, Rooney, lescott, arteta in similar ways to us but have kept moyes on board, I think lambert could be our moyes in the long term but we must accept that the days of dreaming of champions league are long gone and 6th to 12 th will be as good as it gets in the foreseeable future.
Sadly our expectations and ambitions have dipped a lot in the last couple of years.
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Well said Delph and Irish, we're not over-reactionary fans like you see over on VT, we're behind the manager and embrace the changes he's implementing. Doesn't mean we should suddenly be happy to only compete with a handful of clubs in the league.
It's the fans expectations that worry me almost as much as the league table at the moment. I'm happy for us to build gradually and it's not the end of the world we're near the bottom but I won't be happy if it lasts all season.
Neither will I be but I don't believe it will.
Fair enough Dave, I'm also hopeful.
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Well said Delph and Irish, we're not over-reactionary fans like you see over on VT, we're behind the manager and embrace the changes he's implementing. Doesn't mean we should suddenly be happy to only compete with a handful of clubs in the league.
It's the fans expectations that worry me almost as much as the league table at the moment. I'm happy for us to build gradually and it's not the end of the world we're near the bottom but I won't be happy if it lasts all season.
None of us will be happy if it lasts all season, but some of us are patient enough to wait more than 7 games before declaring the end of Aston Villa.
Not sure that's fair, I don't think anyone's saying that.
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It's truly scary he many of us have the mentality of "we weren't expected to win so it doesn't matter".
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And Everton and Albion are both currently in the top 6 with a number of what were unknown and lower league players. Both currently have the best sides i've seen them have for 20+ years. It can work but requires some patience not wrist slashing after 7 games.
None of those teams sold all their decent players in the space of two years and failed to replace them with anybody as good. It's why we're struggling, we just don't have a very good team.
...and made to awful managerial appointments in past few years - one flight risk who had a desk job with the French Football Fed, and another who got relegated 2 times in 3 seasons. It does need patience to turn the ship around from the pile of dog shit we were last season. Lambert is the best man to this from what we could realistically get in the summer - IMO.
Just wish he's drop Delph....
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Well said Delph and Irish, we're not over-reactionary fans like you see over on VT, we're behind the manager and embrace the changes he's implementing. Doesn't mean we should suddenly be happy to only compete with a handful of clubs in the league.
It's the fans expectations that worry me almost as much as the league table at the moment. I'm happy for us to build gradually and it's not the end of the world we're near the bottom but I won't be happy if it lasts all season.
None of us will be happy if it lasts all season, but some of us are patient enough to wait more than 7 games before declaring the end of Aston Villa.
Not sure that's fair, I don't think anyone's saying that.
Plenty of posts so far this season saying we are doomed, certs for the drop, Lambert is as bad as McLeish, shopping cheaply can only end in failure, we will be relegated if we don't sign more players in Jan and so on.
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Its the nature of being a passionate football fan to overreact, especially when things have not been going well.
Of course none of us want to appear as if we are lowering expectations or our ambitions for Aston Villa.
But also we must try and take a balanced view and not go into blind panic and be doom merchants every time we lose.
The answer for the management and players is hard work and professional application.
The answer for us fans is beer.
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There's no point getting upset about losing matches like this. We have a long way to go in our transition. Much further than the handful of games so far
One thing I will say is, whilst nobody wants a return to paying seasoned pros huge money to do fuck all, "young and hungry players" alone will get us nowhere.
We frequently look like a side that needs a bit more maturity, and the focus on young, untested players almost to the exclusion of all else strikes me as more than a bit risky.
If we spend in January it needs to be on proven quality.
Couldn't agree more mate and I think that just one midfielder with that experience and quality would make a massive difference. Still hoping Dunne can be more of a help than a hindrance when he returns to the fold as well.
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Its the nature of being a passionate football fan to overreact, especially when things have not been going well.
Of course none of us want to appear as if we are lowering expectations or our ambitions for Aston Villa.
But also we must try and take a balanced view and not go into blind panic and be doom merchants every time we lose.
The answer for the management and players is hard work and professional application.
The answer for us fans is beer.
Well said Mr Lochhead!
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Still much better than last season even if the table doesn't reflect it. Next two games are massive and we could do with 4 points minimum.
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I have read all 13 pages on this thread & some of the comments amaze me.
I don't care where are in the league table now nor do I care who is picked to play or not. I want the team in claret & blue to go out and give it their all and try to win the game.
I still get the buzz & excitement about going to watch the Villa (not as much as I'd like admittedly). Sure it hurts when we lose but that is tempered somewhat if the team actually putsome effort & graft in.
I am not worried about this season - I can see things settling down and getting much better.
I shall look forward to my next 'live' game at Sunderland with relish and will be as excited as ever setting off with my son even if we are in the bottom 3 that day!
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It's truly scary he many of us have the mentality of "we weren't expected to win so it doesn't matter".
It's not so much that, in my opinion, as it is 'Losing against so-and-so isn't a total disaster'. Plenty of teams will lose against Tottenham this year, as they're a good side.
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I thought we did pretty well today. Going in at half time we had given a very good spurs side a decent game.
I also thought Bent should have started but maybe Benteke has been incredible in training? We don't know the full story. Second half that header would have changed the game if gone in and then who know's what would have happened. Some of the doom and gloom posts on here are laughable.
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I couldn't care less what Wigan were or how many points they got. We've finished in the bottom half once during this "prolonged dismal spell." How you would have coped during some of the genuinely bad periods in our history I dread to think.
I think it's fair to say that the club has been on a fairly steep downward trajectory for two years.
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Fulham away and Norwich at home, must take a minimum of 4 points otherwise we're deep in the shit.
I agree, our season starts again at Fulham really so those two games are the real ones to judge as I expected to lose today.
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Cracking support by us today, put their lot to shame.
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Happy? Not!!
Nicest thing about today was meeting DC5 and Mrs before the game.
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Just been reading the comments on the match article from the Guardian (not my usual rag) and was pleasantly surprised by how decent the Spurs fans sounded. That plus the fact most of them were pretty complimentary about Villa's performance, saying it was miles better than last season (which luckily I didn't see) they were also saying how impressed they were with Bennet before he went off.
Perhaps some perspective from another point of view.
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They're right about Bennett, he looks a real find. Glad his injury is not as bad as I feared.
Tony Gale was quite complimentary about us too during the commentary I had, and not really in a patronising way either.
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I've posted the match report for the site I write for this evening. See what you think: http://pickourteam.com/premierleague/aston-villa/fansverdict/07-10-2012/tottenham-hotspur-vs-aston-villa
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It's truly scary he many of us have the mentality of "we weren't expected to win so it doesn't matter".
Why? Like it or not, we've got to realise where we are as a club at the moment. Slitting our wrists every time we lose away from home to a club that's spent the last decade in or around the European spots isn't a particularly rational reaction.
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It's truly scary he many of us have the mentality of "we weren't expected to win so it doesn't matter".
Why? Like it or not, we've got to realise where we are as a club at the moment. Slitting our wrists every time we lose away from home to a club that's spent the last decade in or around the European spots isn't a particularly rational reaction.
We've won 1 game in 7, what's your excuse for the other games we've lost, particularly getting walloped by Southampton.
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Please tell me that I'm not the only person who is concerned that we've been sold a dud in Benteke. He was awful today as he was last week. I really hope he proves me wrong but he is looking anything but a £7million striker at present.
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A thought occurred to me earlier that I'm trying to subdue, but I'm wondering if there's a touch of the McNeills about Lambert.
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Please tell me that I'm not the only person who is concerned that we've been sold a dud in Benteke. He was awful today as he was last week. I really hope he proves me wrong but he is looking anything but a £7million striker at present.
It's too early to say that he's a dud, but he's been rubbish the last two weeks. He's just looks like a big lump up front, and I think that Bent offers far more goal threat, and Weimann is a much better all round player, so why they've been dropped for him, is anybody's guess.
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Please tell me that I'm not the only person who is concerned that we've been sold a dud in Benteke. He was awful today as he was last week. I really hope he proves me wrong but he is looking anything but a £7million striker at present.
These things take time mate.
He's 21, he showed in 20 minutes against Swansea that he HAS got it in him - good control, good composure. Yes he missed a few chances today but that happens to even the best strikers in the world (look at Torres for God's sake!).
I don't think Lambert will be too worried, at 21, the guy is a solid investment, he's got the right attributes to make a real future for himself but he's only had a couple of games. Young kid, new country, new league, even if it takes him half or a whole season to settle in the long run he could be a real player.
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I thought Benteke had a good game and is only being criticised for his glaring miss (rightly so), however if he'd have put it in then we'd be talking about a good all round performance. He gets into some great scoring positions to which is no co-incidence, just needs to work on his composure.
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I thought last week that while Benteke fluffed his best chance against the Boggies, Bent wouldn't have chased the guy down and created the chance in the first place. Put simply, they both have to take the qualities of each other's games to play together
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I really do wonder sometimes. Lambert the new McNeill after 7 games. People doubting a 21 year old after 5 games in a new country. What happened to patience? What happened to the stuff people spouted under MON where they weren't satisfied with winning and wanted the team playing more proper football, even it mean winning less.
How about from last season, all the "I don't care if we lose so long as we have a go". And so on and so on. The simple fact is, some people are only happy when they can moan about the Villa.
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It's too early to say that he's a dud, but he's been rubbish the last two weeks. He's just looks like a big lump up front, and I think that Bent offers far more goal threat, and Weimann is a much better all round player, so why they've been dropped for him, is anybody's guess.
Probably cos the manager asked Lerner/Faulkner to buy the player and after an outlay of approx £10m (transfer plus the wages over the course of his contract) he's going to want to prove that his decision was correct. Not a good enough reason to keep Bent benched, mind.
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I think on reflection, we weren't too bad today. It was fairly even in the first half with Spurs having the better of the chances, in the second we should have been 2-0 up when they scored and they then bossed us. Bent should have started and we should be phasing Benteke into the side rather than throwing him in. KEA looked more combative today which is good and Bennett impressed me with the exception of the second goal. The defence needs to be more alert and Lambert needs to think about how he changes things tactically when we go behind. However I expected us to lose to a form Spurs side, and there were some positives. Moving forward though we need to start winning games to take pressure off the young players and allow them to express themselves.
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It's truly scary he many of us have the mentality of "we weren't expected to win so it doesn't matter".
Why? Like it or not, we've got to realise where we are as a club at the moment. Slitting our wrists every time we lose away from home to a club that's spent the last decade in or around the European spots isn't a particularly rational reaction.
We've won 1 game in 7, what's your excuse for the other games we've lost, particularly getting walloped by Southampton.
Well West Ham was Lambert's first game in charge and was away to a newly promoted side. In the past few seasons we've lost away to Stoke in their first home game in the top flight and got absolutely thumped by Newcastle in their first home game back in the top flight. Whilst not ideal, losing that game was hardly a massive surprise given the context.
Everton - in my view, Lambert got his tactics horribly wrong for the first half against an Everton side enjoying their best start to a season in decades.
Southampton - shocking 2nd half defensive performance. Unfortunately with a young defence who are still getting used to playing with one another there are going to be some shockers along the way.
So there are all the games we've lost this season other than today. Hardly a disaster is it?
On the flip side, we've gone up to the Premier League champions and beaten them there. We've got a solid home win against a Swansea side that played us off the park last year. And we put on a very professional performance against Tranmere when in similar situations over the course of the last 10 years we've made life very difficult for ourselves.
I reckon a psychiatrist would have a field day with the amount of bipolar disorder on display here - utter delight after Man City, absolute despair today.
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I've posted the match report for the site I write for this evening. See what you think: http://pickourteam.com/premierleague/aston-villa/fansverdict/07-10-2012/tottenham-hotspur-vs-aston-villa
Very good, albeit we lost 2-0 last season also, and not 2-1 as you suggest.
As for my views, Bent would surely have started had Lambert not needed to make a point to show who's boss.
Albrighton, Delph and Bannan are not good enough to be regular starters in the Premier League, but on recent form I think Bannan should have started.
We matched them until they scored, but the substitutions really didn't work today. Bent, Benteke and Gabby, once they were together, looked as though they all wanted to stand in the same position on the pitch! The midfield disappeared, compounded by Bannan having to play at left back once Bennett was carried off.
Guzan was very panicky with his distribution, releasing the ball far too early resulting in it going to a Spurs player several times, or off the pitch altogether.
Was disappointed that Lambert stayed in his seat for the last 15 minutes, indicating to the players that he had given up!
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It's truly scary he many of us have the mentality of "we weren't expected to win so it doesn't matter".
Why? Like it or not, we've got to realise where we are as a club at the moment. Slitting our wrists every time we lose away from home to a club that's spent the last decade in or around the European spots isn't a particularly rational reaction.
We've won 1 game in 7, what's your excuse for the other games we've lost, particularly getting walloped by Southampton.
That's fair comment, the results aren't brilliant, but what is the answer?
You can moan about winning 1 in 7 and nobody will say they're happy with that sort of record, but other than having faith and giving the manager time to get it right, what else do you do?
Sack him? Sack Faulkner? Put Lerner in the stocks and pelt him with rotten tomatoes?
There isn't a quick, easy answer. We've (and you and I were amongst the most vocal on here) complained about how utterly shit things were for two years now. We were right to complain at the time, because it truly was utter shite.
The flip side of that is that, with it being so poor, the problems are not going to go away after seven league games of the new season.
Like it or not, we are going to have a season of massively up and down results. We'll have days that show lots of promise (Swansea, Man City), we'll have days of averageness (Albion), and we'll have days when we feel miserable as fuck (Everton), but over the course of the season, beyond making sure we don't get relegated, we just need to start to identify where we need to improve, and start to do it.
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I'm feeling pretty laid back about things at the moment . In fact Que sera sera , if we did end up going down I would still trust Lambert to get things right in the end. I'm pissed off with feeling pissed off with the Villa most of the time I'm just going to prepare myself for the worst and anything better than that will be a bonus
I think the wine is helping
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Crap! I knew I'd got it mixed up with the season before! Ah well, it was written on the train back home I guess...
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I'm feeling pretty laid back about things at the moment . In fact Que sera sera , if we did end up going down I would still trust Lambert to get things right in the end. I'm pissed off with feeling pissed off with the Villa most of the time I'm just going to prepare myself for the worst and anything better than that will be a bonus
I think the wine is helping
Same here.
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Bales pathetic dive was harmless and "you've got to laugh about it" according to Lawrenson and the un-funny Irish one.
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Yeah, hilarious....
(http://i.minus.com/iI04qBVyEBQp2.gif)
Really he should be ashamed.
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Yeah, hilarious....
(http://i.minus.com/iI04qBVyEBQp2.gif)
Really he should be ashamed.
He's probably not ashamed though.
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Suarez is of course a cheat on the other hand Bale was just being a bit silly....
The Liverpool player may have a case for unequal treatment.
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Yeah, hilarious....
(http://i.minus.com/iI04qBVyEBQp2.gif)
Really he should be ashamed.
If only the FA had the balls to punish.
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Bales pathetic dive was harmless and "you've got to laugh about it" according to Lawrenson and the un-funny Irish one.
Bale's a cheating twat - I really do despise him.
Just watched the highlights on MOTD and I know you don't get a lot from that but a couple of observations:
- Delph: how many times does he have to get caught on the ball in front of our back 4 before he gets dropped? I just don't think he's good enough - he's been around too long for us to keep talking about his potential.
- Bennett: I was very impressed by him against the Baggies but he was at fault for both goals today. I'm not for one minute suggesting we drop him but with the kids we're going to get this inconsistency and it would be nice to have an alternative which I don't think we do at the moment.
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Yeah, hilarious....
(http://i.minus.com/iI04qBVyEBQp2.gif)
Really he should be ashamed.
If only the FA had the balls to punish.
Agreed , a few retroactive punishments and this stuff would be a little easier to bear, hell it might even reduce it.
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I'm feeling pretty laid back about things at the moment . In fact Que sera sera , if we did end up going down I would still trust Lambert to get things right in the end. I'm pissed off with feeling pissed off with the Villa most of the time I'm just going to prepare myself for the worst and anything better than that will be a bonus
I think the wine is helping
Same here.
40 points, however we get there, ok.
Agree about the wine.
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Yeah, hilarious....
(http://i.minus.com/iI04qBVyEBQp2.gif)
Really he should be ashamed.
If only the FA had the balls to punish.
Agreed , a few retroactive punishments and this stuff would be a little easier to bear, hell it might even reduce it.
I'm going to be a complete hypocrite now as i've just saw Suarez's dive and almost pissed myself laughing, that was utterly embarrasing.
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The F.A. have balls? No chance of that ever happening.It's blatant fucking cheating so ban the diving shite for 3 years and that might send out a message to all other diving shites. No , bollocks make that 4 years !
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That's why Lawro said Bale's dive was funny - because he knew he was going to have laugh off Suarez cheating later.
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Was Bale booked for the dive?
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No.
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Was Bale booked for the dive?
No he wasn't, even though it happened 5 yards from the linesman.
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No.
Fuckin joke. Start with the retrospective bans and it'll soon stop.
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It's truly scary he many of us have the mentality of "we weren't expected to win so it doesn't matter".
Why? Like it or not, we've got to realise where we are as a club at the moment. Slitting our wrists every time we lose away from home to a club that's spent the last decade in or around the European spots isn't a particularly rational reaction.
Because there are 20 teams in this league and each team, on it's day, can and ultimately will beat any of the other 19 teams.
We evidently, man for man, are no match for Tottenham but we could have beaten them today to relieve any pressure that has built up on us.
We cannot treat any game in the kind of manner I referred to in my original post, christ, we may as well have McLeish in charge if we do.
You are correct when you state that we shouldn't slit our wrists but take a look at table and the teams we have faced so far.
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Was Bale booked for the dive?
No he wasn't, even though it happened 5 yards from the linesman.
Who gave us a throw in and not a free kick. He had a better view than us and it was obvious to us it was a dive.
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I'm feeling pretty laid back about things at the moment . In fact Que sera sera , if we did end up going down I would still trust Lambert to get things right in the end. I'm pissed off with feeling pissed off with the Villa most of the time I'm just going to prepare myself for the worst and anything better than that will be a bonus
I think the wine is helping
Same here.
40 points, however we get there, ok.
Agree about the wine.
It's ok for you you can all go shopping for shoes if we are relegated. What are us blokes supposed to do if it comes to be?
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Share the shoes
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You are correct when you state that we shouldn't slit our wrists but take a look at table and the teams we have faced so far.
Quite - we've played 4th, 5th, 6th, 8th, 10th, 11th and 17th. I'd hardly call that an easy run of fixtures.
If we're still in 16th after we've played QPR, Norwich, Reading and Wigan then I'll join you on the edge of the bridge.
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You are correct when you state that we shouldn't slit our wrists but take a look at table and the teams we have faced so far.
Quite - we've played 4th, 5th, 6th, 8th, 10th, 11th and 17th. I'd hardly call that an easy run of fixtures.
If we're still in 16th after we've played QPR, Norwich, Reading and Wigan then I'll join you on the edge of the bridge.
You could jump with Justin Lee Collins.
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You are correct when you state that we shouldn't slit our wrists but take a look at table and the teams we have faced so far.
Quite - we've played 4th, 5th, 6th, 8th, 10th, 11th and 17th. I'd hardly call that an easy run of fixtures.
If we're still in 16th after we've played QPR, Norwich, Reading and Wigan then I'll join you on the edge of the bridge.
Quite where i have stated i am anything approaching suicidal i don't know.
If you are happy with 16th after games against West Ham, Everton, Newcastle, Swansea, Southampton, West Brom and Tottenham then i applaud your level of contentment.
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Was Bale booked for the dive?
He got 10 10 10 9 10 from the judges
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You are correct when you state that we shouldn't slit our wrists but take a look at table and the teams we have faced so far.
Quite - we've played 4th, 5th, 6th, 8th, 10th, 11th and 17th. I'd hardly call that an easy run of fixtures.
If we're still in 16th after we've played QPR, Norwich, Reading and Wigan then I'll join you on the edge of the bridge.
Quite where i have stated i am anything approaching suicidal i don't know.
If you are happy with 16th after games against West Ham, Everton, Newcastle, Swansea, Southampton, West Brom and Tottenham then i applaud your level of contentment.
I certainly expected us to have a better points haul after these games then we actually have. We can talk about learning curves and us being a work in progress all we like, it's true to a degree, but I think 5 points from a possible 21 having still not played a top four side is a nightmare start.
I still havn't lost faith the Lambert is the right man for the job long term but we need a win - quickly.
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Losing at Spurs isn't the complete disaster some are making out. Even a few Spurs fans have said to me we were decent in the first half and the better side. We just needed to take our chances...
We weren't the best team in the league after we beat Man City or Swansea or drew with Stripey Filth and Barcodes and we certainly aren't the worst by losing at Spurs.
Gonna be a bumpy ride this season but we have to trust PL to get it right. I'm confident he will.
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There wasnt much in the game until they scored. We kind of collapsed after that. Vlaar had a much improved performance. Was happy defensively with both our full backs. Bennett was very unlucky with the second goal but he cant afford to let crosses bounce in the box like he did first. Two good chances created, the second was a sitter. But worrying we look a beaten side when we concede first. That is probably a hangover from last season that must to be rectified asap.
Very worrying is the complete lack of quality we have in midfield. Delph, Holman and Albrighton are incredibly limited players and the international break has come at a good time for El Ahmedi who was anonymous in the second half. Gabby tried hard but doesnt offer a goalscoring threat and wimped out of a chance in the first half. I thought Benteke was alright actually. Horrible miss from the header but led the line well generally.
Nzogbia did ok when he came on, enough to start the next day ahead of Albrighton anyway. We badly lack many things but someone from midfield needs to get beyond the strikers and break into the box more. Id have Herd in the side for sure. Clark was poor too I thought.
Long season ahead but getting Bent, Herd, Nzogbia and Ireland back in the side would improve matters.
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Thinking about yesterdays game overnight its quite simple. We were not at all bad but didnt take three chances. One was simple (Benteke) two were relatively easy (Benteke and Agbonlahor) for top flight players.
Spurs had one fluke and a good goal.
Bent would have scored the two Benteke missed but I feel Lambert has decided to play the hard man and show him who runs the team
Which is OK but there is no one else you would trust to score the goals.
and most certainly not Agbonlahor!
and I agree with the the previous poster Benteke did lead the line quite well and at this level he needs to learn but have we the time?
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Not sure if this has been mentioned already but weren't we in a similar position under O'Neill for a while? Bottom 6 at Christmas?
You can see what he's trying to do. We are playing better football and hopefully the goals and confidence will come. How long did it take Moyes to turn Everton around? You have to believe it'll get better or you may as well go and live in a cave till June.
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I'd love to live in a cave. I could decorate it with murals of Gareth Bale being kicked to death
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Thought we were good first half.
As soon as Benteke missed that header I knew it would cost us.
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Funny (not in a ha ha way) that, according to the Beeb today, the FA are likely to look at the Suarez dive and the Van Persie elbow incidents but not the Bale dive. What's the difference between Suarez's dive and Bale's? Other than the fact that Dame Lawro described Suarez as embarrassing and Bale as funny. Maybe Guzan should have had a go at the linesman to bring it to the ref's attention more
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Gareth Bale is untouchable whereas Louis Suarez is public enemy Nr 1, therein lieth the difference.
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Not sure if this has been mentioned already but weren't we in a similar position under O'Neill for a while? Bottom 6 at Christmas?
You can see what he's trying to do. We are playing better football and hopefully the goals and confidence will come. How long did it take Moyes to turn Everton around? You have to believe it'll get better or you may as well go and live in a cave till June.
If you mean his first season, weren't we unbeaten until something like the 11th game?
Losing at Spurs is no great blow to our season as we aren't good enough to say we should be expecting anything there. However, the same can't be said for the likes of West Ham or Southampton.
As long as we're out of the relegation places, which we are and also one win away from a comfortable midtable position, we need to give the manager time to get everything sorted.
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Most of which were draws, If I remember correctly.
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We were well and truely in the shit with DOL in his first season. I think we slipped into the bottom 3 at the start of december after a 2-1 loss at Spurs.
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Whilst i can see why he tried Benteke and Gabby again, at the end of the day if we're going to get anything out of games we need to start our best finisher. Bent would have put away one of those two chances Benteke had and we might have got something out of the game. He's not going to come off the bench and rescue us every week. Let's try Benteke and Bent for the Norwich game and have Gabby's pace for the last half hour.
The Bale dive was outrageous, he could have easily have got Guzan sent off and if Phil Dowd had been the ref it might have happened. Not much of a mention of it in today's papers mind. Mind you playing for Tottenham helps.
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The second goal came at the worst possible time because the subsitutes had just come on and we were reorganising. Having said that, unlike last week against West Brom, the subs made no difference and the game petered out with Spurs in control. Going down to 10 men didn't help, obviously, particularly given the seriousness of Joe Bennett's injury. Does anyone know the latest on this?
Noticed that Lambert is saying his decision to start with Bent as a sub was purely tactical.
I agree with those who say we shouldn't panic yet. I said a couple of days ago that it might not be until December that this team gels properly and Spurs are on fire right now. But we do need a win.
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Joe Bennett just has a gash and should be fine for Fulham away.
I think the substitutions were a big factor in their second goal. We had Benteke, Bent, N'Zogbia, Holman and Agbonlahor on at the same time and it was too much of a change. Really aggressive though - we wouldn't have seen that last season!
I can forgive him for a tactical mistake like that though. I thought his tactics of matching Spurs' shape worked really for about the first 60 minutes.
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Funny (not in a ha ha way) that, according to the Beeb today, the FA are likely to look at the Suarez dive and the Van Persie elbow incidents but not the Bale dive. What's the difference between Suarez's dive and Bale's? Other than the fact that Dame Lawro described Suarez as embarrassing and Bale as funny.
Think the main difference was that Suarez was in the penalty area and so in a dangerous position.
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Another depressingly predictable defeat. Sorry, but I think this is still a continuation of the gradual decline since MON left. A few seasons ago I'd expect to us to win at White Hart Lane and we often did, but Spurs and indeed Everton are streets ahead of us now, when we were slightly above or at least on a par with them. Their aspirations are vastly different to ours now - we've had our worst start since 1986-87 and we all know how that season ended up. I just think we haven't enough guile and quality, yes, you can graft, chase and harry the opposition, but ultimately you need that bit extra class. Hope I'm wrong, but I fear for us this season.
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A few seasons ago I'd expect to us to win at White Hart Lane and we often did,
Often?
Once in 12 seasons.
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A few seasons ago I'd expect to us to win at White Hart Lane and we often did,
Often?
Once in 12 seasons.
Ok, how often did we lose at WHL under MON? The difference is I'd EXPECT us to beat them in those days and they rarely troubled us at Villa Park, whereas now I don't expect us to beat them - they're way ahead of us now and if you fail to see that then you're just burying your head in the sand
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What he's saying is he'd expect us to beat them but he's crap at predictions.
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A few seasons ago I'd expect to us to win at White Hart Lane and we often did,
Often?
Once in 12 seasons.
Ok, how often did we lose at WHL under MON? The difference is I'd EXPECT us to beat them in those days and they rarely troubled us at Villa Park, whereas now I don't expect us to beat them - they're way ahead of us now and if you fail to see that then you're just burying your head in the sand
Tottenham are miles better than us, and I can live with that at the moment because they're constantly investing while we are not. The worrying part is that we're being beat by the likes of Southampton and West Ham.
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A few seasons ago I'd expect to us to win at White Hart Lane and we often did,
Often?
Once in 12 seasons.
Ok, how often did we lose at WHL under MON? The difference is I'd EXPECT us to beat them in those days and they rarely troubled us at Villa Park, whereas now I don't expect us to beat them - they're way ahead of us now and if you fail to see that then you're just burying your head in the sand
I don't know why you're going on about burying your head in the sand.
My point was that, while you might have "expected" to beat them, it certainly wasn't based on us "often" doing so, as we only actually have done that once in twelve years.
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A few seasons ago I'd expect to us to win at White Hart Lane and we often did,
Often?
Once in 12 seasons.
Ok, how often did we lose at WHL under MON? The difference is I'd EXPECT us to beat them in those days and they rarely troubled us at Villa Park
From the moment Rednapp took over at Spurs they looked stronger than us, and MON was still in charge then. They just looked like a stronger footballing side. We'd come away with a point but we'd always look like we were hanging on.
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Haven't seen enough footy this season to make a call so soon. However, can't help think that Delph is never going to cut it and that Beneke should be dropped.
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A few seasons ago I'd expect to us to win at White Hart Lane and we often did,
Often?
Once in 12 seasons.
Ok, how often did we lose at WHL under MON? The difference is I'd EXPECT us to beat them in those days and they rarely troubled us at Villa Park, whereas now I don't expect us to beat them - they're way ahead of us now and if you fail to see that then you're just burying your head in the sand
I don't know why you're going on about burying your head in the sand.
My point was that, while you might have "expected" to beat them, it certainly wasn't based on us "often" doing so, as we only actually have done that once in twelve years.
I suppose the gist of my argument is that Spurs are in with a shout of Champions League football and we're heading for the Championship. It's just a general decline since August 2010.
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A few seasons ago I'd expect to us to win at White Hart Lane and we often did,
Often?
Once in 12 seasons.
Ok, how often did we lose at WHL under MON? The difference is I'd EXPECT us to beat them in those days and they rarely troubled us at Villa Park, whereas now I don't expect us to beat them - they're way ahead of us now and if you fail to see that then you're just burying your head in the sand
I don't know why you're going on about burying your head in the sand.
My point was that, while you might have "expected" to beat them, it certainly wasn't based on us "often" doing so, as we only actually have done that once in twelve years.
I suppose the gist of my argument is that Spurs are in with a shout of Champions League football and we're heading for the Championship. It's just a general decline since August 2010.
We went from being in a decline to being in a nosedive in the last few months of last season. We're now trying to arrest that dive but it's not happening overnight.
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A few seasons ago I'd expect to us to win at White Hart Lane and we often did,
Often?
Once in 12 seasons.
Ok, how often did we lose at WHL under MON? The difference is I'd EXPECT us to beat them in those days and they rarely troubled us at Villa Park, whereas now I don't expect us to beat them - they're way ahead of us now and if you fail to see that then you're just burying your head in the sand
I don't know why you're going on about burying your head in the sand.
My point was that, while you might have "expected" to beat them, it certainly wasn't based on us "often" doing so, as we only actually have done that once in twelve years.
I suppose the gist of my argument is that Spurs are in with a shout of Champions League football and we're heading for the Championship. It's just a general decline since August 2010.
First, we're not 'headed for the Championship.' Second, some of our supporters have got this belief that where we are now is where we'll stay forever. You've just said yourself that a few years ago we were better than Spurs. Before that they were better than us, and so it goes on. In the future we'll be ahead of them again and clubs currently behind will be better than both of us. That's football.
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Lurching from the euphoric reaction to the Man City game to the wailing and gnashing of teeth following defeat away to a very good Spurs team just a few days later, might lead some people into thinking that pug nose might have had a point.
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Lurching from the euphoric reaction to the Man City game to the wailing and gnashing of teeth following defeat away to a very good Spurs team just a few days later, might lead some people into thinking that pug nose might have had a point.
It really is tiring isn’t it. We’re only ever as good as the last game, world-beaters one week and certs for the drop the other.
Without wishing to fill this site with a series of clichés, Lambert inherited an almighty mess that was started by O’Neill and exacerbated to a more or lesser degree by Houllier and TSM. If anyone thinks that this season is going to be anything more than simply a case of surviving and trying to build for the next future then I’m afraid they are not fully understanding how deep a crisis O’Neill left the club in.
We will survive this season; just. However it is going to take some time before we turn the corner. These are the games that we simply need to scratch off the fixture list as lost causes.
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Some people seem to be confusing "no disgrace in losing to Spurs" with "we can't expect to win at Spurs". TSM personified the latter statement and his "no point in trying, limit the damage" tactics and team selections reflected it. Lambert's tactics and selections are a very far cry from that. There really is no disgrace in losing to a very good team at their place if you have given it a go, and not exactly had the rub of the green (see the first goal). It happens. Just as we (used to) beat some good teams at our place.
Capitulating to a mediocre Southampton team is a different matter however.
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A few seasons ago I'd expect to us to win at White Hart Lane and we often did,
Often?
Once in 12 seasons.
Ok, how often did we lose at WHL under MON? The difference is I'd EXPECT us to beat them in those days and they rarely troubled us at Villa Park, whereas now I don't expect us to beat them - they're way ahead of us now and if you fail to see that then you're just burying your head in the sand
I don't know why you're going on about burying your head in the sand.
My point was that, while you might have "expected" to beat them, it certainly wasn't based on us "often" doing so, as we only actually have done that once in twelve years.
I suppose the gist of my argument is that Spurs are in with a shout of Champions League football and we're heading for the Championship. It's just a general decline since August 2010.
That's hard to disagree with.
The last two years, the club has been dreadfully managed, from football management upwards.
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I'd love to live in a cave. I could decorate it with murals of Gareth Bale being kicked to death/quote]
Lambeth bought a cave near Bodymoor Heath after Lerner told him the Villa job was a Mammoth task ;)
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Spurs are a good side. They have lightening fast wingers and a very good midfield three of Dempsey, Sandro and Dembelle.
They'll like as not finish in the top four again. Wankers.
I thought we held our own up until the lucky Spurs first goal. In fact we should have been two up. Lambert dropped a rick not starting Bent, as Benteke missed two sitters.
We didn't react to their goal though and it seemed to knock the stuffing right out of us.
The midfield is where we're losing it. KEA is a decent enough player, but looking over the squad, there isn't a player of good enough quality to fit in there. Come January, we must sign a dynamic, quality, box to box central midfielder.
I was very annoyed with the second goal. Lennon's left foot is for standing only and Bennett had to get tighter. Hope the lad is going to get back soonish mind.
Four defeats out of seven is worrying. That said, we're not in a rut. We're all over the place, sometimes inside 90 minutes as well.
I think we need 5 points from the next three games and we need to beat Norwich above all else, but we need to put points on the board and push away from the drop zone.
To do that, Bent and Gabby need to start up top, with Charlie in behind (I saw Charlie tracking back yesterday, going into sliding tackles and all sorts! The poor bugger also ended up completely isolated and surrounded by Spurs players though). Herd to partner KEA and then a toss up between Delph and Bannan. I think this paragraph renforces my point about a lack of quality in midfield.
We'll be alright. Norwich, Reading and Southampton will all go down. Swansea, QPR and Wigan will be close. We may well be too. I'm sick of us being complete pische though. I hate to sound like a Bin Dipper, but we cannot have a third season of the Villa struggling, its just not cricket.
The away support has been odd. Anything on a Saturday- sold out full allocation. Anything not- SHA level of support. Curious.
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Some people seem to be confusing "no disgrace in losing to Spurs" with "we can't expect to win at Spurs". TSM personified the latter statement and his "no point in trying, limit the damage" tactics and team selections reflected it. Lambert's tactics and selections are a very far cry from that.
Exactly. I haven't seen any of yesterday's match but from the gist of this thread and comments from my brother who did attend it would appear that we were actually in the game which is more than you can say about the debacle last season.
Capitulating to a mediocre Southampton team is a different matter however.
Hmmm, yeah, still not sure what happened there! Let's face it in terms of results it's been a crap start but we've got to give Lambert and the lads a chance. A few good results and the place will be bouncing again, the Swansea match showed that.
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To feel better about this game all I have to do is to remember the same fixture last year. Last year I was pissed off for days after this fixture - I've never been like that, normally I'm ok after a few hours even in the worst of circumstances. It wasn't because Spurs had beaten us but because there was absolutely no belief that we could get something. Hutton was playing right midfield, Heskey on the left, Spurs had all the possession and it was quite clear that the team had been sent out with an inferiority complex.
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There's a lot of truth in what has been said; same result as last year and same pickle as far as results go, but there is at least hope.
Tottenham away last season was the first time I awoke to the realisation that we were propper fucked.
I didn't get pinged for speeding coming back this time either, which is always a bonus.
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To feel better about this game all I have to do is to remember the same fixture last year. Last year I was pissed off for days after this fixture - I've never been like that, normally I'm ok after a few hours even in the worst of circumstances. It wasn't because Spurs had beaten us but because there was absolutely no belief that we could get something. Hutton was playing right midfield, Heskey on the left, Spurs had all the possession and it was quite clear that the team had been sent out with an inferiority complex.
Quite right.
Two beacons of hope.
This fixture, last season, we were beaten before we got on the coach, and put together the most embarassing, laughably negative performance I have seen from a Villa side in years. Not just shit, but utterly unambitious, it was humiliating to watch.
The season before last, we went to Man City in a cup, and not only did we put up a limp performance, given the attitude of the manager at the time, I would not be at all surprised if it turned out we'd written them a letter shortly after, apologising for wasting their time.
This season, we've gone to Man City, full of self belief, and won, and we've just been to Spurs and at least tried to win the game, and put in something that could be called a performance.
Nobody is deluding themselves that we don't need to win games soon - we do. it is also pretty obvious to most of us where we need more bodies, and how much we need them.
In the meantime, though, it is going to be a season of really volatile ups and downs. We'll have more results like Southampton, and we'll have more Swanseas, too.
The club has been an absolute shambles in many ways for over two years now. That isn't going to get fixed in a hurry. Panicking, saying we're "relegation certainties" as someone did two weeks ago, is not going to help.
The sooner we accept that this season is going to be a strange one, and that that also means losing matches, then it's going to be a lot more fun when we actually start winning a few.
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To feel better about this game all I have to do is to remember the same fixture last year. Last year I was pissed off for days after this fixture - I've never been like that, normally I'm ok after a few hours even in the worst of circumstances. It wasn't because Spurs had beaten us but because there was absolutely no belief that we could get something. Hutton was playing right midfield, Heskey on the left, Spurs had all the possession and it was quite clear that the team had been sent out with an inferiority complex.
Agree, although leaving out Bannan, Bent and N'Zogbia for more industrious players did give me a very slight feeling of deja vu. We need more creativity and a greater cutting edge still so i think these 3 and Ireland must feature prominently.
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I should also add that Gareth Bale is a diving ******.
He should be banned the cheating wanker. I could have driven a car through the gap between him and Guzan and the chimp faced cheating bastard wasn't even booked.
At least Suarez and Young have the decency to fall into defenders and goalkeepers.
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Some people seem to be confusing "no disgrace in losing to Spurs" with "we can't expect to win at Spurs". TSM personified the latter statement and his "no point in trying, limit the damage" tactics and team selections reflected it. Lambert's tactics and selections are a very far cry from that.
Exactly. I haven't seen any of yesterday's match but from the gist of this thread and comments from my brother who did attend it would appear that we were actually in the game which is more than you can say about the debacle last season.
We were a good match for them for an hour.
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You always got the impression that they were waiting to score, and that we were waiting for them to score.
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You always got the impression that they were waiting to score, and that we were waiting for them to score.
I didn't.
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McLeish got more out of a much more limited squad.
Trolling?
Put the bottle down mate and get a grip.
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You always got the impression that they were waiting to score, and that we were waiting for them to score.
I didn't , I thought we were in with as much chance of them until they scored, after the goal we fell away and spurs took control but we were not bad until then- if benteke had taken a chance we may have gone on to win so certainly not all doom and gloom.
Vlaar impressed as did the back four on the whole , albrighton is not up to it at this level I fear and not sure Delphi is either, gabby was lively and benteke is talented but raw- we need a quality experienced midfielder in January to help out the younger lads ad I'd like to see Westwood brought into the side at fulham along with bent .
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We've also got to remember that Lambert is still a fairly inexperienced manager, especially in terms of top flight football. He is still learning at this level, and is going to make mistakes and bad decisions from time to time as well.
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It's encouraging to see many positive posts after Saturday's result. Much better than some of those during the match.
No one would deny we need at least a couple of results in our favour before November, but we will surely be in mid table come next April as this side settles down, but a couple of decent signings in January would be welcome.
I just hope however, that PL and DB can sort things out, as we badly need someone to stick the ball in the net. I think Benteke will come good, but it might be later rather than sooner and I don't fancy going into the New Year in the bottom four.
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We matched them for the first 60 minutes, despite them fielding a team which not one of our players would get into. They even resorted to blatant cheating!
The game was lost when Benteke missed the golden chance. Had that gone in, we may have achieved a positive result.
All in all it was an enjoyable game (apart from the disgusting cheating already mentioned).
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I'm a bit uneasy with how comfortable people are about this defeat to be honest.
The last couple of years has lowered expectations so much now that we could easily sleep walk into major trouble.
5 points from the opening 7 games is a terrible start.
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I'm a bit uneasy with how comfortable people are about this defeat to be honest.
The last couple of years has lowered expectations so much now that we could easily sleep walk into major trouble.
5 points from the opening 7 games is a terrible start.
Don' t worry too much- we have played some nice football and there are positives, the team will improve and gel as the season goes along and I feel we will progress.
The games against Newcastle , Swansea and man city have given me plenty of hope since the opening 2 defeats.
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I'm a bit uneasy with how comfortable people are about this defeat to be honest.
Im comfortable with it because we could easily have drawn or even won that game if we'd taken our chances were as last season was just a surrender.
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5 points from the opening 7 games is a terrible start.
after 7 games last season we had 8 points....
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After 7 games under SGT1 we had 6 points and Beelzebub had just smacked in a hat-trick at Villa Park. We finished second. It's way too early to be reaching for the razor blades, but some just prefer to do that.
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It's way too early to be reaching for the razor blades, but some just prefer to do that.
Yep, and some people seem to be trying to convince themselves that we're having a fantastic start to the season.
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5 points from the opening 7 games is a terrible start.
after 7 games last season we had 8 points....
I make it 11 points and unbeaten in the league after 7 games 5 draws and 2 wins. We were mostly awful though and got progressively worse.
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You always got the impression that they were waiting to score, and that we were waiting for them to score.
I didn't , I thought we were in with as much chance of them until they scored, after the goal we fell away and spurs took control but we were not bad until then- if benteke had taken a chance we may have gone on to win so certainly not all doom and gloom.
Vlaar impressed as did the back four on the whole , albrighton is not up to it at this level I fear and not sure Delphi is either, gabby was lively and benteke is talented but raw- we need a quality experienced midfielder in January to help out the younger lads ad I'd like to see Westwood brought into the side at fulham along with bent .
The thing is, they missed chances too before they scored. But, for some reason, missing them wasn't a turning point for them. They kept plugging away until they scored. If I'm being totally honest with myself, even though we had chances, I didn't think we looked like putting any of them away. And we didn't. And somehow, not putting them away affected us so much that we crumpled. We know that we're going to concede away from home, we usually do, so it was just a matter of time before we did. And we did.
I don't take any pleasure in saying that, but I'm not going to blind myself to the reality of it.
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It's way too early to be reaching for the razor blades, but some just prefer to do that.
Yep, and some people seem to be trying to convince themselves that we're having a fantastic start to the season.
I haven't seen anyone say we've had a fantastic start. I'd be interested in you showing where anyone has said that.
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I haven't seen anyone say we've had a fantastic start. I'd be interested in you showing where anyone has said that
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Calm down you tart, I was using the technique of exaggeration to make my point. Like you were when you said I was reaching for razor blades.
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I haven't seen anyone say we've had a fantastic start. I'd be interested in you showing where anyone has said that
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Calm down you tart, I was using the technique of exaggeration to make my point. Like you were when you said I was reaching for razor blades.
I never said you were, I said people were. If I wanted to aim it at you i'd have quoted you, you tart.
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all the things that were said at the beginning of the season about this new team, young boys learning on the job and peaks and troughs etc etc are coming totally true, but we must have some bollocks and let lambert get on with remodelling the way our club performs. if the football was shit and the results were not there i would be more concerned but we are not far away!
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all the things that were said at the beginning of the season about this new team, young boys learning on the job and peaks and troughs etc etc are coming totally true, but we must have some bollocks and let lambert get on with remodelling the way our club performs. if the football was shit and the results were not there i would be more concerned but we are not far away!
*nods furiously*
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One win in seven says there have been rather more troughs than peaks so far.
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One win in seven says there have been rather more troughs than peaks so far.
Our last 7 games W3 D2 L2 says the troughs and peaks are pretty even. Basic stats over a short time frame can be used to show pretty much what you want them to show.
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One win in seven says there have been rather more troughs than peaks so far.
Our last 7 games W3 D2 L2 says the troughs and peaks are pretty even. Basic stats over a short time frame can be used to show pretty much what you want them to show.
Not in the league they don't, which is rather obviously what I was talking about with the one win in seven stat.
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You prefer the negative of 1 win in 7 in the league. I prefer the more positive of 2 defeats in our last 7. We're both right and neither stat proves anything as 7 games is too small a sample. Which all points to waiting a while for a bigger sample of games before deciding things are fine or shit when potential variables will also be less of a factor.
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The old saying you can't make an omelette without breaking an egg applies to us this season. Just be brave Villa boys and girls and we will eat a good breakfast in the coming seasons.
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You prefer the negative of 1 win in 7 in the league. I prefer the more positive of 2 defeats in our last 7. We're both right and neither stat proves anything as 7 games is too small a sample. Which all points to waiting a while for a bigger sample of games before deciding things are fine or shit when potential variables will also be less of a factor.
The league table says 1 win in 7, and right down at the wrong end of the table. I don't 'prefer' it at all, it's a piss poor state of affairs.
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We are in a bit of trouble, not because we lost to Spurs but because we lost to West Ham and Southampton. I dont think any one thought that we would only have 5 points after the first 7 games.
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. I dont think any one thought that we would only have 5 points after the first 7 games.
I'm not sure exactly what I thought we would have but I'm not surprised we only have 5 points.