Standard of Refereeing

[LeeB]

The gap between the profesionalim of the sport and the competence of the officials is the greatest of any sport.
It looks like they have created through VAR and their new supposedly random interpretations of the laws the ability to arbitrarily decide the outcomes of games and to hide behind the vagueness of those interpretations.

Well put. A perfect example of this was the "offside" Liverpool goal at Fulham that was allowed to stand because apparently there's an inbuilt allowance of 5cm to account for imperfections in the var system. Strange that when in other games they're willing to use the width of a toe nail or a nasal hair to decide an outcome! I'm amazed that the multi billionaires that own some of the clubs allow VAR to affect the outcome of games depending on the whims of whoever happens to be in charge on the day.

It’s strange isn’t it that theses “ marginal “ decisions allways seem to favour certain clubs. Arsenal appear to be a main beneficiary.
As someone on here said, not sending Merino off meant there would not be the uproar if that had proved a pivotal decision. They gave the goal despite an obvious foul on Martinez.
Some of the stuff going on with PGMOL is incompetence but it’s beginning to look like more sinister motives are at play.

It's incompetence first and foremost, with a healthy dose of unconcious bias that we're all well capable of. But as they will not acknowledge said bias then they'll never take steps to counter it and it will always be there, and I sometimes feel those in charge like to leave a little grey area for this to manifest itself when required.

Put it this way, if unconcious bias led to ref's always favouring the underdog for some reason, it would be highlighted and stamped out immediately.

[aj2k77]

How many 50/50 decisions have seen one of the Sky 6 ripped off in favour of someone else? I can't recall many. It's another layer of bias to navigate in games against them. Was there some table last season that said we'd suffered the most incorrect VAR decisions, something like 9 of them.

[andyh]

This 5cm tolerance on tight offsides that VAR has seemingly just made up is absolute bollocks.
When has this ever been mentioned before ? What other teams have benefitted from it?

It absolutely stinks of fucking cheating to give the chosen ones the benefit of any doubt possible.

[Somniloquism]

It has been going for a few years in England, just not on the continent. My concern would be why the defenders foot did not not seem to be at the same angle in the SAOT graphic compared to when the frozen picture was done as that definitely made a lot of difference to the call.

[The Edge]

Offside check is a clear and obvious decision though. Someone either is or isn't and the offside flag on the field would only make a difference ONLY if the tech couldn't make a decision because of players blocking the camera views. I definitely wouldn't be basing a decision on lines of mowed grass or camera angles (unless fully lined up) as I doubt the groundsmen use use calibrated equipment to ensure a line is fully 90degrees to the sidelines.

Sorry but I disagree. When you say someone is either on or offside it's really not that simple. It can be that simple but only when they use the available technology that determines the exact moment that the ball leaves the passing players boot. That's what occurs across Europe but not in this country. It is still down to the discretion of whoever is in charge on the day as to which frame they use. Go forward one frame which is 1/100th of a second and a player is offside. Use the previous frame and hey presto he's onside. The question is this: Given that the PL is the richest league in the world why are we the only ones sticking to a "Semi automated system" when the technology is available to stop all this nonsense and you can rightly say "someone is either on or offside"

[Somniloquism]

For your first point, that is why additional line thickness was added at the request of the clubs. And I'm not sure on your last line as everyone's setup is SAOT, ie the computer works out where everyone is and tries to confirm offside, then the VAR person confirms it or overrides if there is an issue. Even with that system there is still the frame issue you are complaining about. But as we saw last season when ManU were given a last minute equaliser in the FA Cup when Maguire was a yard offside, I prefer VAR then not to stop those happening. If it means mm calls are still vague then I won't be complaining or stating the tech is not fit for purpose.

[aj2k77]

The picture they used for the decision does not look like the actual frame to me. Wirtz's knee is in a different position and so is the defenders foot.

[LeeB]

The picture they used for the decision does not look like the actual frame to me. Wirtz's knee is in a different position and so is the defenders foot.

As I said earlier, a similar thing happened with one of theirs at Leeds.

[The Edge]

For your first point, that is why additional line thickness was added at the request of the clubs. And I'm not sure on your last line as everyone's setup is SAOT, ie the computer works out where everyone is and tries to confirm offside, then the VAR person confirms it or overrides if there is an issue. Even with that system there is still the frame issue you are complaining about. But as we saw last season when ManU were given a last minute equaliser in the FA Cup when Maguire was a yard offside, I prefer VAR then not to stop those happening. If it means mm calls are still vague then I won't be complaining or stating the tech is not fit for purpose.

The chip in the ball which we don't use in this country is crucial. That pinpoints the exact moment the ball is passed and identifies which frame they use. It's not up for debate or down to the discretion of someone sat in a cosy room a hundred miles away. That 50mm allowance is nonsense that's being spouted by VAR to cover up it's mistake. They are giving offsides for a nasal hair being offside but on this occasion they decided to implement the 5cm allowance rule.

[SaddVillan]

For your first point, that is why additional line thickness was added at the request of the clubs. And I'm not sure on your last line as everyone's setup is SAOT, ie the computer works out where everyone is and tries to confirm offside, then the VAR person confirms it or overrides if there is an issue. Even with that system there is still the frame issue you are complaining about. But as we saw last season when ManU were given a last minute equaliser in the FA Cup when Maguire was a yard offside, I prefer VAR then not to stop those happening. If it means mm calls are still vague then I won't be complaining or stating the tech is not fit for purpose.

The chip in the ball which we don't use in this country is crucial. That pinpoints the exact moment the ball is passed and identifies which frame they use. It's not up for debate or down to the discretion of someone sat in a cosy room a hundred miles away. That 50mm allowance is nonsense that's being spouted by VAR to cover up it's mistake. They are giving offsides for a nasal hair being offside but on this occasion they decided to implement the 5cm allowance rule.

Would the goal have been given if it had been scored by Fulham?

We all know the answer.

[Brend'Watkins]

For your first point, that is why additional line thickness was added at the request of the clubs. And I'm not sure on your last line as everyone's setup is SAOT, ie the computer works out where everyone is and tries to confirm offside, then the VAR person confirms it or overrides if there is an issue. Even with that system there is still the frame issue you are complaining about. But as we saw last season when ManU were given a last minute equaliser in the FA Cup when Maguire was a yard offside, I prefer VAR then not to stop those happening. If it means mm calls are still vague then I won't be complaining or stating the tech is not fit for purpose.

The chip in the ball which we don't use in this country is crucial. That pinpoints the exact moment the ball is passed and identifies which frame they use. It's not up for debate or down to the discretion of someone sat in a cosy room a hundred miles away. That 50mm allowance is nonsense that's being spouted by VAR to cover up it's mistake. They are giving offsides for a nasal hair being offside but on this occasion they decided to implement the 5cm allowance rule.

Yep, it’s making Var worse than a partially sighted lino. Absolute joke. If I was a Fulham fan I would be fuming.

[lovejoy]

When did this "we can be wrong by 5cm" come in and does it always favour the attacking team? A new one on me. I'm not sure its right either, it just means the offside line has moved 5cm so at 6cm you are off.
As ever the referees have a rule they pull out to defend themselves.

[andyh]

When did this "we can be wrong by 5cm" come in and does it always favour the attacking team? A new one on me. I'm not sure its right either, it just means the offside line has moved 5cm so at 6cm you are off.
As ever the referees have a rule they pull out to defend themselves.

Exactly.
Im sure we have had a couple of goals ruled out by millimetres in the past.

[LeeB]

Another one that gets me is using the defenders arm to make either player on or offside. You can't use your arms to score or defend so why are they in any way relevant?

[Clive W]

Another one that gets me is using the defenders arm to make either player on or offside. You can't use your arms to score or defend so why are they in any way relevant?

I thought the vertical line was from the armpit