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Author Topic: Chris Heck - President of Business Operations  (Read 309018 times)

Offline Dogtanian

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Re: Chris Heck - President of Business Operations
« Reply #1680 on: May 20, 2024, 01:11:26 PM »
As we we plan to compete with them, we will also have a plan to get our revenue up there too. I don't see how that's going to be possible without significant expansion to the stadium, so I am guessing they have an ultimate plan. They're just not telling us.

They have to be, or the deal with Atairos looks completely pointless.

Exactly.

Look how they're treating the Adidas deal. We've all known it's happening, but they're milking it for all the marketing impact they can. It will be the same when they announce whatever they're doing with the stadium, it will be when the plans are ready and at the right time to create the marketing buzz they need.

They don't need to be announcing anything like that now as we already have the marketing buzz and focus from Champions League qualification and the current Adidas reveal campaign.

Online Richard E

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Re: Chris Heck - President of Business Operations
« Reply #1681 on: May 20, 2024, 01:12:12 PM »
If the club buys a Euro Millions ticket once a season, and it is the sole winner of the main jackpot every year, it’ll go a long way towards bridging that revenue gap. And for minimal investment.

Offline chrisw1

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Re: Chris Heck - President of Business Operations
« Reply #1682 on: May 20, 2024, 01:12:55 PM »
Basically I agree with Ads on all this.  You can give it all the justifications and 'what ifs' you like, but in cold hard numbers Heck is doing a decent job.

The 'run based on efficiency rather than ambition' I'm sure strikes a chord with many.  I'm more of an Ellis apologist than most on here, but even I can see that the corner shop mentality - which needed to go out of the window in the early 90s and was blatantly outdated by the time Lerner pulled up - has held us back significantly.  The deals we seem to be doing with Adidas - especially with the seats and stuff - seem perfectly sensible.

I can also sit comfortably in saying that I thought (and said to anyone who'd listen to me) the new North Stand designs made Villa Park look like a bloody Asda at the time, and I still think they did now.  I'm glad they've been scrapped.  Hopefully the longer term plan is also based on ambition - to have the best ground in the country - rather than efficiency - to get to a 50k capacity ground 2 seasons quicker and a few million quid cheaper.

We would have been 50k by the 26/27 season.  We're going to have to sort something pretty damn quick if you think we'll be up to 50k+ 2 seasons after that.

Offline Rudy Can't Fail

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Re: Chris Heck - President of Business Operations
« Reply #1683 on: May 20, 2024, 01:21:18 PM »
I'm not as clever as you Chris, maybe use finger puppets or do a power point with them "whooooohes" to make it easier for me.

I fail to see the relevance of "position of strength". We're better than we were last year. We hadn't qualified for anything when these deals were agreed. They dwarf anything else. All factual, "easy" to follow stuff. Who cares who is in the seat*- it's Heck and good luck to him, as we're making more cash than we ever have and we absolutely need to as well.


* self evidently a few of you and I agree with LeeB.

Well we were in Europe for the first time and have hardly been out of the top 5 all season, so Europa League at the very least was looking likely.

Indeed. There will be clauses in the contracts that further reward our final league position. Standard practice.

Offline Smithy

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Re: Chris Heck - President of Business Operations
« Reply #1684 on: May 20, 2024, 01:35:34 PM »
As we we plan to compete with them, we will also have a plan to get our revenue up there too. I don't see how that's going to be possible without significant expansion to the stadium, so I am guessing they have an ultimate plan. They're just not telling us.

They have to be, or the deal with Atairos looks completely pointless.

Exactly.

Look how they're treating the Adidas deal. We've all known it's happening, but they're milking it for all the marketing impact they can. It will be the same when they announce whatever they're doing with the stadium, it will be when the plans are ready and at the right time to create the marketing buzz they need.

They don't need to be announcing anything like that now as we already have the marketing buzz and focus from Champions League qualification and the current Adidas reveal campaign.

Although I'm firmly in the camp that believes a new stadium is on the horizon, I do think people need to realise that selling out a 55,000 stadium for every home game only makes a SMALL dent in catching us up to the so-called "big 6" in terms of our ability to compete financially.

Selling out a big stadium was certainly a big factor in the wealth of a club 30 years ago, but these days it simply isn't.  Deloitte does their "Football money league" thing every year, and in 2023, the average revenue for the top 20 clubs in Europe was just over £500m.  Of that, less than £100m was "match day" revenue.  So call it 20% if we're being generous.  The other 80% is commercial and broadcast (both of which are over £200m on average).  It's those latter two on which we need to make significant strides. 

Now, Champions League qualification gives us a massive foot up, but we need to start making a serious dent in those areas, otherwise, we're always a 'slightly below average season' away from having to sell our best players.  Having a bigger VP, or another stadium is not going to bridge that gap. 

If we're going to compete financially with those "top 20" clubs, then we'll do it by improving our off the field activities, not by filling our ground every match day.

Offline OCD

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Re: Chris Heck - President of Business Operations
« Reply #1685 on: May 20, 2024, 01:38:51 PM »
To re-enforce Smithy's point, Stamford Bridge has a capacity smaller than our current capacity and has a turnover above £500m.

Offline Smithy

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Re: Chris Heck - President of Business Operations
« Reply #1686 on: May 20, 2024, 01:40:02 PM »
To clarify, I'm not saying we shouldn't improve the ground, or move to a new stadium. It's not an either/or situation, I was merely pointing out that a new stadium or increased capacity at VP, even with higher London-style ticket prices, doesn't fix our revenue problem.

I want our stadium improved (or a new one) alongside all the other improvements, absolutely, but I also recognise that if the aim is to compete financially, there is a LOT we can do to help ourselves before a single brick is laid.

Offline Dogtanian

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Re: Chris Heck - President of Business Operations
« Reply #1687 on: May 20, 2024, 01:48:22 PM »
As we we plan to compete with them, we will also have a plan to get our revenue up there too. I don't see how that's going to be possible without significant expansion to the stadium, so I am guessing they have an ultimate plan. They're just not telling us.

They have to be, or the deal with Atairos looks completely pointless.

Exactly.

Look how they're treating the Adidas deal. We've all known it's happening, but they're milking it for all the marketing impact they can. It will be the same when they announce whatever they're doing with the stadium, it will be when the plans are ready and at the right time to create the marketing buzz they need.

They don't need to be announcing anything like that now as we already have the marketing buzz and focus from Champions League qualification and the current Adidas reveal campaign.

Although I'm firmly in the camp that believes a new stadium is on the horizon, I do think people need to realise that selling out a 55,000 stadium for every home game only makes a SMALL dent in catching us up to the so-called "big 6" in terms of our ability to compete financially.

Selling out a big stadium was certainly a big factor in the wealth of a club 30 years ago, but these days it simply isn't.  Deloitte does their "Football money league" thing every year, and in 2023, the average revenue for the top 20 clubs in Europe was just over £500m.  Of that, less than £100m was "match day" revenue.  So call it 20% if we're being generous.  The other 80% is commercial and broadcast (both of which are over £200m on average).  It's those latter two on which we need to make significant strides. 

Now, Champions League qualification gives us a massive foot up, but we need to start making a serious dent in those areas, otherwise, we're always a 'slightly below average season' away from having to sell our best players.  Having a bigger VP, or another stadium is not going to bridge that gap. 

If we're going to compete financially with those "top 20" clubs, then we'll do it by improving our off the field activities, not by filling our ground every match day.

You're right, it's not at all about the seats, it's about the overall revenue generation. Which you do need a new stadium for.

Chelsea have a great turnover for their stadium size, but their matchday revenue is not on the level of Spurs and Arsenal, two clubs who have far less revenue than them. They're the exception, not the standard.

Offline Risso

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Re: Chris Heck - President of Business Operations
« Reply #1688 on: May 20, 2024, 01:49:18 PM »
We need to be doing everything we can to increase total turnover, and matchday revenue is a big part of that. We might have a similar size stadium to Chelsea, but they make nearly £60m a year more from it than we do. Of course being in a rich area of London helps massively, but it's all the more reason why we shouldn't just be doing minor works to old, outdated stands at Villa Park. It's just tinkering around the edges and it's not enough.

Offline London Villan

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Re: Chris Heck - President of Business Operations
« Reply #1689 on: May 20, 2024, 01:53:37 PM »
Being able to sell a match ticket for £5000 per match also helps...

I do wonder who buys at that price - a Tom Boley-owned hospitality business that then re-sells it at a more believable figure??

Offline Risso

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Re: Chris Heck - President of Business Operations
« Reply #1690 on: May 20, 2024, 01:56:00 PM »
Being able to sell a match ticket for £5000 per match also helps...

I do wonder who buys at that price - a Tom Boley-owned hospitality business that then re-sells it at a more believable figure??

London is absolutely dripping in ridiculous wealth. It's why modest terraced houses in quite nice areas sell for millions of pounds.

Offline Smithy

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Re: Chris Heck - President of Business Operations
« Reply #1691 on: May 20, 2024, 02:00:36 PM »
As we we plan to compete with them, we will also have a plan to get our revenue up there too. I don't see how that's going to be possible without significant expansion to the stadium, so I am guessing they have an ultimate plan. They're just not telling us.

They have to be, or the deal with Atairos looks completely pointless.

Exactly.

Look how they're treating the Adidas deal. We've all known it's happening, but they're milking it for all the marketing impact they can. It will be the same when they announce whatever they're doing with the stadium, it will be when the plans are ready and at the right time to create the marketing buzz they need.

They don't need to be announcing anything like that now as we already have the marketing buzz and focus from Champions League qualification and the current Adidas reveal campaign.

Although I'm firmly in the camp that believes a new stadium is on the horizon, I do think people need to realise that selling out a 55,000 stadium for every home game only makes a SMALL dent in catching us up to the so-called "big 6" in terms of our ability to compete financially.

Selling out a big stadium was certainly a big factor in the wealth of a club 30 years ago, but these days it simply isn't.  Deloitte does their "Football money league" thing every year, and in 2023, the average revenue for the top 20 clubs in Europe was just over £500m.  Of that, less than £100m was "match day" revenue.  So call it 20% if we're being generous.  The other 80% is commercial and broadcast (both of which are over £200m on average).  It's those latter two on which we need to make significant strides. 

Now, Champions League qualification gives us a massive foot up, but we need to start making a serious dent in those areas, otherwise, we're always a 'slightly below average season' away from having to sell our best players.  Having a bigger VP, or another stadium is not going to bridge that gap. 

If we're going to compete financially with those "top 20" clubs, then we'll do it by improving our off the field activities, not by filling our ground every match day.

You're right, it's not at all about the seats, it's about the overall revenue generation. Which you do need a new stadium for.

Chelsea have a great turnover for their stadium size, but their matchday revenue is not on the level of Spurs and Arsenal, two clubs who have far less revenue than them. They're the exception, not the standard.

Of course, but Chelsea could close their stadium for an entire year, and their total commercial revenue would still be double our entire revenue. 

I certainly wasn't suggesting that we "don't need to improve our stadium situation because Chelsea do fine with 40k capacity", just that they're a perfect example of the fact that the stadium revenue isn't what gets you into that exclusive group of top revenue clubs.

In precisely the same way that if Spurs had their brilliant stadium and match-day revenue, but OUR commercial revenue, they wouldn't be able to compete and they'd drop out of the 20 richest clubs.

A new or improved stadium is absolutely critical if we're serious about being a top 4 club for the long term, because the ability to bring in new fans, and create a brilliant experience for those who attend - but it's not what will get us to that position. Far from it.

Offline Dogtanian

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Re: Chris Heck - President of Business Operations
« Reply #1692 on: May 20, 2024, 02:07:58 PM »
Of course, but Chelsea could close their stadium for an entire year, and their total commercial revenue would still be double our entire revenue. 

I certainly wasn't suggesting that we "don't need to improve our stadium situation because Chelsea do fine with 40k capacity", just that they're a perfect example of the fact that the stadium revenue isn't what gets you into that exclusive group of top revenue clubs.

In precisely the same way that if Spurs had their brilliant stadium and match-day revenue, but OUR commercial revenue, they wouldn't be able to compete and they'd drop out of the 20 richest clubs.

A new or improved stadium is absolutely critical if we're serious about being a top 4 club for the long term, because the ability to bring in new fans, and create a brilliant experience for those who attend - but it's not what will get us to that position. Far from it.

Yes, there is more than one way to skin a cat, but if you look at how Chelsea got there, that door is now closed.

They have a massive profile and following that started twenty years ago when Abromovich spent billions buying success. They've had such success now over such a sustained period that they can sign commercial deals we can only dream of right now. But it came from buying that success.

We can't do it that way round. We can't get the profile or the following to sign those deals without winning large amounts of silverware. And we can't do that without increasing our revenue first.

The stadium is something that is in our own hands to do to our timeline, independent of success on the pitch. That's why it makes so much sense to do it now.

Anything else requires so many factors outside of our direct control that it would be madness to rely on it.

Offline chrisw1

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Re: Chris Heck - President of Business Operations
« Reply #1693 on: May 20, 2024, 02:10:46 PM »
An extra 5k standard price seats doesn't do much.  An extra 5k corporate / GA+ seats does a lot.

The point of the North was we could add that amount of premium seats without hitting the general admission numbers.

I reckon the biggest downside of the current plan won't be so much the relocated season ticket holders, it will be the overall reduction in the number of available standard price tickets when demand is at it's absolute highest.  I fear how that may impact on attracting the next generation of fans.  Of course, the flip side is that it will push up demand for the GA+ spaces when that is all that's available.

Offline purpletrousers

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Re: Chris Heck - President of Business Operations
« Reply #1694 on: May 20, 2024, 02:34:28 PM »
An extra 5k standard price seats doesn't do much.  An extra 5k corporate / GA+ seats does a lot.

The point of the North was we could add that amount of premium seats without hitting the general admission numbers.

I reckon the biggest downside of the current plan won't be so much the relocated season ticket holders, it will be the overall reduction in the number of available standard price tickets when demand is at it's absolute highest.  I fear how that may impact on attracting the next generation of fans.  Of course, the flip side is that it will push up demand for the GA+ spaces when that is all that's available.

That feels like a sad reality.

 


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