FFP

[VillaTim]

This is from The Times and illustrates the challenge trying to compete….

Highest wage bills in the Premier League
2022-23 season. Starred is 21/22 season.
Man City (59% of turnover)
£422.9m
Liverpool (62%)
£373m
Chelsea (71%)*
£340m
Man Utd (51%)
£331.4m
Arsenal (51%)
£234.7m
Tottenham (47%)*
£209m
Aston Villa (89%)
£194.2m
Newcastle (75%)
£186m

Sorry to go back a couple of pages, but this really highlights the financial gap between the so called 'big six'.  The fact that Manchester City can have such a massive wage bill and for it to be such a relatively small percentage of their turnover (compared to others) is sobering really.

looks more like a BIG4 to me then there's a gap.

[Dogtanian]

Just thought that extending the financial year to end of June means they may be able to include more revenue that they get from the Foo Fighters singalong that month.

[Proposition Joe]

The thing about the 3 year rolling average... How can Forest be in trouble if they haven't been in the PL for three years yet?

[Risso]

Here's an idea. We're miles behind on the other top 6 teams for commercial revenue, but all deals have to be on commercial terms to satisfy the Premier League/UEFA. What would happen if say, an entirely unconnected Egyptian company (choosing a territory *completely* at random) was to buy £50m of shirts from us, for selling on in Africa and the middle east. Obviously they'd have to pay the going rate for the shirts. Past that though, we'd have no control over how many they sold or what happened to them next, so if they sat in a warehouse like all those crates at the end of Raiders of the Lost Ark gathering dust, then that wouldn't be our fault, surely?

Brilliant. Fancy dropping a line to Wes and Nas?

I will do, once I've finalised my idea of how to make it seem like a 3rd division Spanish club can afford to buy Coutinho and Duran for £50m. Also, we auction a special Golden Seat next to Unai in the dugout, starting bid £20m a year. I could see the winner being somebody called Des Ewens.

[Brazilian Villain]

Just thought that extending the financial year to end of June means they may be able to include more revenue that they get from the Foo Fighters singalong that month.

Or give us an extra month to accrue more losses.

[Risso]

The thing about the 3 year rolling average... How can Forest be in trouble if they haven't been in the PL for three years yet?

There are rules for promoted teams that are a mix of the EPL and PL rules.

[claret+blue ed]

Roughly, I can make out our P&S figures being

2023 -£96.7m
2022 +£20.7m
2021 -£22.8m   *I couldn't see the Women's team figure for 2021 in the reports so this is likely higher by at least £1m I'd say.

So that's -£98m across the 3 years, well within the £105m, even without the covid figure.

As we all thought, the issue is this year started off at -£76m - meaning we can only lose £29m this year.

We haven't done that in transfers thanks to the money from selling the younglings. So the risk is to do with how much revenue we've gone up by compared to how much we're paying on player salaries.

I'm pretty confident there isn't a huge issue at all.

This what i mentioned earlier, the 2022 figure everyone was mentioning was a £300k profit, but that was surely without any FFP allowable costs taken off, so it would actually show as more profit

[OCD]

Roughly, I can make out our P&S figures being

2023 -£96.7m
2022 +£20.7m
2021 -£22.8m   *I couldn't see the Women's team figure for 2021 in the reports so this is likely higher by at least £1m I'd say.

So that's -£98m across the 3 years, well within the £105m, even without the covid figure.

As we all thought, the issue is this year started off at -£76m - meaning we can only lose £29m this year.

We haven't done that in transfers thanks to the money from selling the younglings. So the risk is to do with how much revenue we've gone up by compared to how much we're paying on player salaries.

I'm pretty confident there isn't a huge issue at all.

This is my thinking too.

The women's team has been set-up as a different company.

[Villan82]

I'd love to know how our merch and replica kits etc are selling this year since the new President of Business basically came out last summer and said our new crest is horrible?

[Drummond]

I'd love to know how our merch and replica kits etc are selling this year since the new President of Business basically came out last summer and said our new crest is horrible?

The kids kits seems to be selling well, given the lack of stock in the club shop on matchdays. There's a really big sale of all the other stuff though.

I'm not sure it's just the crest thing either, Castore are getting binned too, so that will hold people back.

[Monty]

Man City's is just such a fucking obvious fiddle.

[darren woolley]

Man City's is just such a fucking obvious fiddle.

I agree with you.

[SamTheMouse]

Man City's is just such a fucking obvious fiddle.

It's the Trump approach. If you break the rules egregiously enough and lie brazenly enough, it just stuns everyone into submission.

It's basically a superpower.

[algy]

I'm not sure about all this inflation and FFP thing.

The big issue with FFP is buying players and paying them. Yes, stadium costs and paying catering staff and kit washers and retail people and everything goes up with inflation, but nobody is paying players more wages simply because the cost of the weekly shop has gone up £50. And Eric and Tina's wage for slowly selling pies and pints every other week are not tipping clubs into the abyss.

Raising the limit will just mean higher transfer fees and higher wages to soak it all up again and we're back where we started.

Agree 100% with this.

[tomd2103]

https://x.com/mattburton72/status/1765338645903347726?s=20

Nice thread and some calculations there...

Figures may not be exact, but that is about right isn't it?   Looks like it could be very tight this year, but it's the following year (24/25 season) that could see trouble. 

That £120m loss (even though it will be reduced for FFP purposes) is going to prove problematic isn't it, as it will be counted for another couple of years?