Villa Park Redevelopment

[chrisw1]

It's not necessarily about corporate it's about GA+.  I believe the intention was for there to be a significant amount of GA+ seats in the new North.  I honestly think the take-up and attitude towards TV and LG has spooked them.

I keep seeing you use GA - does that mean General Admission (non-season ticket holders)? And what's GA+ ?!  I also keep thinking TV is referring to Toronto Villan and LG is Louis van Gaal. 2024 feels like it'll be a tough year for me.

It's the terminology Villa originally used.  (General admission plus).  I presume it's an Americanism.  Either way, it's clearly just premium add-ons for people in general seating as opposed to corporate boxes etc.

[Sexual Ealing]

Building a brand new ground at Villa Park means we'd have a long period where we wont have anywhere to play.  Spurs had Wembley, where would we go?

I was thinking about this. I know it'd be really shit for all concerned, but we might need to relocate to London for a couple of years. There's really nothing even vaguely local that will suffice.

That would never happen. Biggest local grounds are the Dogheads or Leicester at 32,000, which would at least accommodate all of our season ticket holders. The King Power will be 40,000 when they've finished the expansion. London is a two and a half dour drive with no traffic, which would easily become three hours plus if you factor in parking and getting to which ever ground it was. Trains wouldn't have the capacity or reliability at weekends to ship that many people down.

Before they plumped for Wembley, Spurs were considering using Milton Keynes which holds 31,000.

I think Sexual was being his playful self.

If this is about me getting caught wanking by my wife, I think it's unfair.

[LeeB]

It's not necessarily about corporate it's about GA+.  I believe the intention was for there to be a significant amount of GA+ seats in the new North.  I honestly think the take-up and attitude towards TV and LG has spooked them.

I keep seeing you use GA - does that mean General Admission (non-season ticket holders)? And what's GA+ ?!  I also keep thinking TV is referring to Toronto Villan and LG is Louis van Gaal. 2024 feels like it'll be a tough year for me.

Ah, see I didn't know that, I thought Id missed another name change to a suite at the ground

I thought this was some extra corporate thing including Groove Armada, where for only £50 pp you could listen to Hollyoaks-house whilst stuffing your face.

[VillaTim]

i thought GA+ was when Gabby turned on the afterburners

[paul_e]

All that time, effort and money to plan and submit for approval the new North Stand.

Then some tweaks, ie removing Villa Live. Then, one imagines, plenty of back and forth re the station improvements.

Then, a massive company with huge experience of media and stadiums / sports organisations becomes part owner of V Sports, in a move which the club described as about 'improving' infrastructure, AND IN THE VERY SAME WEEK Heck tells us that the North Stand rebuild is effectively cancelled.

I know they've said we're not moving etc etc but, tbh, I am now at the point where I don't trust much that Chris Heck says, and what's more, if we were considering moving or a new stadium - does anyone think they'd actually tell us that right now?

No, they'll say whatever they need to say to close the subject down so it doesn't become a distraction.

I mean, look at the utter, utter bullshit about collaboration with fans on this new badge, then the rubbish about binning the old new one after a year.

It's fundamentally untrue, so not sure why they'd tell us the truth about this.

Absolutely. No such thing as coincidences. It's a new build, whether on site or somewhere else in the city centre.

Saying we're not moving today means nothing for tomorrow when we might be. We had funding in place to rebuild the North. Why on earth would you need another £6bn fund unless you were going to go bigger? And why spend £100m to still be left behind by the inadequacies inherent to Villa Park.

New build all the live long day.

Yep, agreed.

Even when the initial plans were announced it was always termed as a phased upgrade to the whole ground (and 60k kicked about as the final result). I suspect they want to look at the options on whether doing it all at once is a better idea. When the Comcast partnership was announced one thing I mentioned was that it added expertise/knowledge that we might not have and by that I meant in building and maintaining stadiums. I get that right now everyone hates Heck and therefore want to assume that everything he's involved with is shit but we need to be careful not to get carried away with that.

I'd be amazed if they aren't, right now, working out the cost to develop on site and move us somewhere else for a year or 2 versus the cost to build a new stadium elsewhere. Either requires the purchase of a bunch of land/houses/etc though so I doubt we'd be starting the work for a while (2028 if we stay on site, a little sooner if we move), which is why we're getting the extra seats from reconfiguration and I suspect they'll tack on some facility improvements as well, all for a fraction of the cost the new stand would've been. If it is this I doubt we'll hear anything about it officially until next year at the earliest.

[Percy McCarthy]

All that time, effort and money to plan and submit for approval the new North Stand.

Then some tweaks, ie removing Villa Live. Then, one imagines, plenty of back and forth re the station improvements.

Then, a massive company with huge experience of media and stadiums / sports organisations becomes part owner of V Sports, in a move which the club described as about 'improving' infrastructure, AND IN THE VERY SAME WEEK Heck tells us that the North Stand rebuild is effectively cancelled.

I know they've said we're not moving etc etc but, tbh, I am now at the point where I don't trust much that Chris Heck says, and what's more, if we were considering moving or a new stadium - does anyone think they'd actually tell us that right now?

No, they'll say whatever they need to say to close the subject down so it doesn't become a distraction.

I mean, look at the utter, utter bullshit about collaboration with fans on this new badge, then the rubbish about binning the old new one after a year.

It's fundamentally untrue, so not sure why they'd tell us the truth about this.

Absolutely. No such thing as coincidences. It's a new build, whether on site or somewhere else in the city centre.

Saying we're not moving today means nothing for tomorrow when we might be. We had funding in place to rebuild the North. Why on earth would you need another £6bn fund unless you were going to go bigger? And why spend £100m to still be left behind by the inadequacies inherent to Villa Park.

New build all the live long day.

What’s this £6b fund?

[LeeB]

It's part man, part fund, and makes a beeping noise when it spots targets.

[Ads]

That's how much Comcast have in Atairos isn't it?

[jon collett]

. Either requires the purchase of a bunch of land/houses/etc though so I doubt we'd be starting the work for a while (2028 if we stay on site, a little sooner if we move), which is why we're getting the extra seats from reconfiguration and I suspect they'll tack on some facility improvements as well, all for a fraction of the cost the new stand would've been. If it is this I doubt we'll hear anything about it officially until next year at the earliest.

From What I can see reconfiguration can only happen if we take the roof, truss and goalposts off the North Stand which would be quite a major project.

[PeterWithesShin]

I really can't see us doing multiple stands at VP at the same time.

[exigo]

All that time, effort and money to plan and submit for approval the new North Stand.

Then some tweaks, ie removing Villa Live. Then, one imagines, plenty of back and forth re the station improvements.

Then, a massive company with huge experience of media and stadiums / sports organisations becomes part owner of V Sports, in a move which the club described as about 'improving' infrastructure, AND IN THE VERY SAME WEEK Heck tells us that the North Stand rebuild is effectively cancelled.

I know they've said we're not moving etc etc but, tbh, I am now at the point where I don't trust much that Chris Heck says, and what's more, if we were considering moving or a new stadium - does anyone think they'd actually tell us that right now?

No, they'll say whatever they need to say to close the subject down so it doesn't become a distraction.

I mean, look at the utter, utter bullshit about collaboration with fans on this new badge, then the rubbish about binning the old new one after a year.

It's fundamentally untrue, so not sure why they'd tell us the truth about this.

Absolutely. No such thing as coincidences. It's a new build, whether on site or somewhere else in the city centre.

Saying we're not moving today means nothing for tomorrow when we might be. We had funding in place to rebuild the North. Why on earth would you need another £6bn fund unless you were going to go bigger? And why spend £100m to still be left behind by the inadequacies inherent to Villa Park.

New build all the live long day.

Yep, agreed.

Even when the initial plans were announced it was always termed as a phased upgrade to the whole ground (and 60k kicked about as the final result). I suspect they want to look at the options on whether doing it all at once is a better idea. When the Comcast partnership was announced one thing I mentioned was that it added expertise/knowledge that we might not have and by that I meant in building and maintaining stadiums. I get that right now everyone hates Heck and therefore want to assume that everything he's involved with is shit but we need to be careful not to get carried away with that.

I'd be amazed if they aren't, right now, working out the cost to develop on site and move us somewhere else for a year or 2 versus the cost to build a new stadium elsewhere. Either requires the purchase of a bunch of land/houses/etc though so I doubt we'd be starting the work for a while (2028 if we stay on site, a little sooner if we move), which is why we're getting the extra seats from reconfiguration and I suspect they'll tack on some facility improvements as well, all for a fraction of the cost the new stand would've been. If it is this I doubt we'll hear anything about it officially until next year at the earliest.

All of this. Looking at the land registry, the houses on the end of Nelson Road are worth a maximum of £150k each – a company this size would have no qualms about making a very nice offer to those families, that would leave Villa with a bill of £5m max, to free up a much bigger footprint on the existing site for a rebuild.

[chrisw1]

I really can't see us doing multiple stands at VP at the same time.

Now the North is cancelled I think that will be pretty much it for 5-10 years.  Then we'll all start discussing potential new design and how filling in corners would be an outrage.

Rinse and repeat.

[The Edge]

. Either requires the purchase of a bunch of land/houses/etc though so I doubt we'd be starting the work for a while (2028 if we stay on site, a little sooner if we move), which is why we're getting the extra seats from reconfiguration and I suspect they'll tack on some facility improvements as well, all for a fraction of the cost the new stand would've been. If it is this I doubt we'll hear anything about it officially until next year at the earliest.

From What I can see reconfiguration can only happen if we take the roof, truss and goalposts off the North Stand which would be quite a major project.

I agree. I can't see how it's possible to shoehorn 3,000 more seats in the ground without using the North Stand corners. That's a big problem because those pillars are huge. So a new cantilever roof would be the only way to do it. This takes the ground to approx 45,000. Am I right in thinking we need 50,000  to host the Euro games in 2028? If that's true it raises even more questions because we have committed to Villa Park being one of the venues.

[oldhill_avfc]

To me cancelling the North Stand replacement makes sense.

If the owners are as ambitious as they seem and want to compete at the highest level, then a 60k stadium with commensurate GA+ (or whatever term they use) is an absolute necessity.

I think they value the heritage and history of Villa and Villa Park being a key asset.

The best option on moving forward as surely got to be buying up the 3 streets of housing between Witton Lane and the railway.

The council would likely be supportive - they need every bit of help in regeneration given the financial mess they’re in.

Perhaps this is the time to strike the right kind of deal with them - even including compulsory purchasing.

[Chris Harte]

The best option on moving forward as surely got to be buying up the 3 streets of housing between Witton Lane and the railway.

Not sure if anyone's mentioned it but if they're looking at a huge upgrade then as well as those three streets then maybe they'd be looking to buy up Nelson Rd and Jardine Rd on the opposite side.

As someone else did say, the ground doesn't just end at the extent of the stands.