Villa Park Redevelopment

[Risso]

If we don't think we can compete with Spurs, who haven't won the league since colour television was invented then I'm giving up football to go read through VillaDawgs posts on their accounts until I croak.

He obviously means on revenue from the ground, not in a footballing sense. I've said before, when we were there on the first day back in the Prem, I got talking to a Spurs supporter who'd spent £80K each for him and his son on two enhanced TV/LG type offerings for tens years, so £8K a season.

[LeeB]

I've always wanted to stay put and been proud of the history and high status the ground is held in by others, but the last 12 months have made me reflect on that and part of it was in the absence of actually competing anymore.

That's changed, we celebrate our wonderful history but we have that history because we were bold and thought big and we need to be that once more if we're going to sustain what we're doing now.

We're a football the club, the greatest of all, not a museum.

[Risso]

I'd be up for a new ground, either at VP or elsewhere, preferrably as close to the city centre as possible. But I just don't see it happening.

[Ads]

If we don't think we can compete with Spurs, who haven't won the league since colour television was invented then I'm giving up football to go read through VillaDawgs posts on their accounts until I croak.

He obviously means on revenue from the ground, not in a footballing sense. I've said before, when we were there on the first day back in the Prem, I got talking to a Spurs supporter who'd spent £80K each for him and his son on two enhanced TV/LG type offerings for tens years, so £8K a season.

A lot of cash. We have plenty of rich fans too that come from far and wide to watch us...

[Villan82]

It does come down to cost. Don't spend £100m to be left in a situation where the reault is unlikely to bring you any closer to bridging a gap between your rivals.

So spend £100m for 10,000 extra seats, or spend £1 billion for 20,000?

Spurs match day income is around £60m a season more now than it was at their old ground.

We aren't Spurs and we aren't London. My gut tells me one or two stands like that, for the moment, would suffice and rethink later.

If we don't think we can compete with Spurs, who haven't won the league since colour television was invented then I'm giving up football to go read through VillaDawgs posts on their accounts until I croak.

I meant in terms of London prosperity and what they can do. I feel we are a more working class club, and that sustained us through the grim years and we would do well to remember that

[chrisw1]

Although I'm pro the North Stand development, I think people are too optimistic about the likelihood of a Witton Stand redev to follow.  CPOing residential property is always very difficult, incredibly controversial and time-consuming.  And at current house prices, it would also be eye-wateringly expensive. 

[Ads]

I've always wanted to stay put and been proud of the history and high status the ground is held in by others, but the last 12 months have made me reflect on that and part of it was in the absence of actually competing anymore.

That's changed, we celebrate our wonderful history but we have that history because we were bold and thought big and we need to be that once more if we're going to sustain what we're doing now.

We're a football the club, the greatest of all, not a museum.

Exactly. The fact the ground is like Trigger's broom should alleviate sentimentality. A pointless emotion that anchors you from moving forwards. Stadiums are imperial. Nothing has changed since Vespasian built a pretty famous one in Rome. Villa Park is glorious, but its a faded legacy. Want to make a statement? Build and think bigger- a seemingly impossible task these days for the UK and lamentable self deprecating Brummies. Good job we have some Americans at the helm.

[Villan82]

Liverpool and Man United shouldn't be in the equation. Nobody else in the 92 can compete for tourism fan with them. Liverpool on match day is unreal when they're all about. They kick my mates out their season ticket seats for Europe to charge £700 for a package that includes a meal at Aintree and a coach to the ground and he just sits in a regular seat on the side. Ignore them, it's a whole different ball game.

Hang on! Aren't you contradicting yourself? You are saying we need to do a Spurs. build a 60k new stadium to absorb in more cash from hospitality and all the bells and whistles. We re countering- why can't we do a Liverpool and focus on developing our existing home and you are saying we can't do that because they are in a  different sphere?

[LeeB]

I'd be up for a new ground, either at VP or elsewhere, preferrably as close to the city centre as possible. But I just don't see it happening.

You may be right, I honestly think there's no decision either way but with the new investment they've decided to seriously look into it before going ahead with the North Stand.

Also, had it not been a bit of a pain in the arse regarding moving the infrastructure under it and they could have got away with keeping a good chunk open through construction they might have gone ahead anyway.

[Gareth]

If my ST goes up as expected next season I'll be bailing out.  £70 per match is beyond my threshold.

I will be very surprised if season tickets don't go up again next season.

I still think that is what a lot of this is about, they will test the existing fanbase and the waiting list to its extremes to see if there is the appetite to fill a 50k ground game after game paying premium prices.

Suspect there will be a good few in the same position as Des if they ramp 10-15% or even more of n certain sections - but they don’t care less if a customer is 50 years loyal been to one game…it’s the customers money they want

[Ads]

Liverpool and Man United shouldn't be in the equation. Nobody else in the 92 can compete for tourism fan with them. Liverpool on match day is unreal when they're all about. They kick my mates out their season ticket seats for Europe to charge £700 for a package that includes a meal at Aintree and a coach to the ground and he just sits in a regular seat on the side. Ignore them, it's a whole different ball game.

Hang on! Aren't you contradicting yourself? You are saying we need to do a Spurs. build a 60k new stadium to absorb in more cash from hospitality and all the bells and whistles. We re countering- why can't we do a Liverpool and focus on developing our existing home and you are saying we can't do that because they are in a  different sphere?

As we haven't had a campaign to turn L4 into an incredibly unsafe place for 15 years like something out of season 5 Sopranos, driving down pretty cheap land prices anyway (in an already rough area) to get what we want. And no, saying we cannot compete with Liverpool isn't a contradiction. We can't. Nobody but Man United, Real Madrid, Barca etc can.

[AV82EC]

It does come down to cost. Don't spend £100m to be left in a situation where the reault is unlikely to bring you any closer to bridging a gap between your rivals.

So spend £100m for 10,000 extra seats, or spend £1 billion for 20,000?

Spurs match day income is around £60m a season more now than it was at their old ground.

We aren't Spurs and we aren't London. My gut tells me one or two stands like that, for the moment, would suffice and rethink later.

If we don't think we can compete with Spurs, who haven't won the league since colour television was invented then I'm giving up football to go read through VillaDawgs posts on their accounts until I croak.

I meant in terms of London prosperity and what they can do. I feel we are a more working class club, and that sustained us through the grim years and we would do well to remember that

You may feel we’re a working class club but would the actual data back that up. And what does working class mean anymore anyway? The demographic consensus of working/middle/upper
Class has been blown out of the water over the past 40 years it’s hardly worth the paper it’s written on. We attract support from all sorts of people across the economic spectrum I’d rather we avoided lumping ourselves in with that lot over the road who seem to take some perverse pride in describing themselves as working class. And I’m as middle class as they come and I’ve done just as much as anyone to sustain us through the grim years as any working class fan.

[Drummond]

Ask fans of other clubs which grounds they like the best and Villa Park is always in the mix as a favourite, regardless of the shit service etc.

They don't have to put up with the shit service for 19 games a year. I quite like Everton as an old historic ground, but it's a terrible experience actually going there. It's like driving a classic car. You can admire the polished walnut dash but the lack of aircon and satnav is going to piss you off if you drove it every day.

Yet will fill* the ground every match, regardless. The club are on to a winner, or at least should be if they actually pulled their fingers out with the service etc.




*apart from 200 odd seats TV and LG etc.

We'd fill the Sty twice over. Doesn't make it a good ground.

I guess it depends what experience you want at a football match. Ultimately, I want to stand, be able to get a beer (other drinks would also be good) and a bite to eat without too much trouble. A roof would be preferable if it's raining too. We have the facilities, we just don't have the service.

I've never understood why they don't pay staff double what they're on and employ double the number because the profits from sales of food and drink would go up exponentially.

[Ads]

Although I'm pro the North Stand development, I think people are too optimistic about the likelihood of a Witton Stand redev to follow.  CPOing residential property is always very difficult, incredibly controversial and time-consuming.  And at current house prices, it would also be eye-wateringly expensive. 

The houses are about 160-180k around the ground.

[Ads]

Good point AV82EC- what on earth is the going definition of working class? I follow us everywhere, does that make me working class? Middle class?