Anyone starting to get worried?

[chrisw1]

In all honesty, I can't see us staying up. There just doesn't seem to be anything extra to offer, and I can't see where a win is likely to come from.
Yesterday was only a point due to an error with the officials - yes we got a point, however in reality we lost the game as they got the ball over the line once more than we did. We got lucky, that's all.

However, in actual reality, we drew the game.

What I mean is that the ball got into our net, and it never got into theirs. Yes the actual final result suggested otherwise, but that didn't actually reflect what happened. And the suggestion that we could have come back after going a goal down - does anyone honestly believe we would have scored twice had we gone behind? We didn't manage 1 goal, I just can't see where 2 would have come from..?!?

Firstly, if their goal had been give why would we have needed to score twice to draw?
Secondly, we had one and arguably 2 stonewall penalties not given.  Isn't that technology also letting us down as VAR should have picked up on it?
If the phantom goal was in the 94th minute then you would have a point.  But it wasn't and you don't.

[tim]

All i'm saying is that from that game, we got a point due to luck as opposed to anything else. Hypothetically anything could have happened, but what actually happened was that we were lucky to get a point. There are plenty of games to go, but I think there will be tougher ones to come so we need to improve quickly if we are going to do well in them. I'm not being deliberately negative, I'm just struggling to see what else we can offer up to get through these games with a positive outcome. Hopefully I'm wrong and we'll be flying up the table in no time, but every game should be viewed as 'must win' until the points are there.

[dave.woodhall]

All i'm saying is that from that game, we got a point due to luck as opposed to anything else. Hypothetically anything could have happened, but what actually happened was that we were lucky to get a point. There are plenty of games to go, but I think there will be tougher ones to come so we need to improve quickly if we are going to do well in them. I'm not being deliberately negative, I'm just struggling to see what else we can offer up to get through these games with a positive outcome. Hopefully I'm wrong and we'll be flying up the table in no time, but every game should be viewed as 'must win' until the points are there.

I've never worked out why our supporters always seem to be so quick to pick up on our supposed luck, yet ignore what goes against us. We could have had two penalties, we had the most shots on target, we looked the better side, their man of the match was their keeper, yet we were the lucky ones.

[tim]

I've never worked out why our supporters always seem to be so quick to pick up on our supposed luck, yet ignore what goes against us. We could have had two penalties, we had the most shots on target, we looked the better side, their man of the match was their keeper, yet we were the lucky ones.

To be honest I don't tend to focus on luck normally - all i was suggesting was that the result was down to things outside of our control, as opposed to things that were. I think that the use of hypotheticals has derailed what i was originally trying to say. Yes we could have had two penalties, but we didn't get them. We also could have scored 10 goals, we didn't do that either. What actually happened was that we got a point due to an error on someone's else part rather than anything we did ourselves. That's all i was trying to say...

[dave.woodhall]

I've never worked out why our supporters always seem to be so quick to pick up on our supposed luck, yet ignore what goes against us. We could have had two penalties, we had the most shots on target, we looked the better side, their man of the match was their keeper, yet we were the lucky ones.

To be honest I don't tend to focus on luck normally - all i was suggesting was that the result was down to things outside of our control, as opposed to things that were. I think that the use of hypotheticals has derailed what i was originally trying to say. Yes we could have had two penalties, but we didn't get them. We also could have scored 10 goals, we didn't do that either. What actually happened was that we got a point due to an error on someone's else part rather than anything we did ourselves. That's all i was trying to say...

When it goes against us it's hypothetical. When it goes in our favour it's luck.

[cdbearsfan]

I never get why an incident a few mins before half time means it would be the final score. We may have gone on to lose but the second half would have been different to how it was if the goal had been given.

Indeed. Anything could have happened, however we can only judge what was presented to us, and that was what I commented on.

You didn't comment on what happened. You commented on some alternative reality where "we lost" because for some reason you've decided to award their goal and ignore any possibility that the game might not have finished one-nil had it counted.

[Ads]

On this basis we got a point against Palace.
We scored that penalty late on at Arsenal.
We got a penalty at 1-0 opening day that saw us through.
Stirling was offside at Man City so our goal difference is better.
We took it to penalties against Man City in the cup.

[LeeB]

On this basis we got a point against Palace.
We scored that penalty late on at Arsenal.
We got a penalty at 1-0 opening day that saw us through.
Stirling was offside at Man City so our goal difference is better.
We took it to penalties against Man City in the cup.

Our goal difference is better also thanks to the 3-1 win at home to Brighton and the 3-1 away win at Burnley.

[tim]

I never get why an incident a few mins before half time means it would be the final score. We may have gone on to lose but the second half would have been different to how it was if the goal had been given.

Indeed. Anything could have happened, however we can only judge what was presented to us, and that was what I commented on.

You didn't comment on what happened. You commented on some alternative reality where "we lost" because for some reason you've decided to award their goal and ignore any possibility that the game might not have finished one-nil had it counted.

I haven't decided to award them anything - we got a draw and a point. Great. All i was saying was that the ball went in our goal more times that it did theirs. In any other scenario that would have meant we lost the game. We didn't, although that wasn't of our making - and that's my point. Regardless of how things could have gone, the simple facts are at the end of the game, the ball was in our net more times than theirs. 
Hypothetical penalties don't mean anything as they are not a guaranteed goal and as these things didn't happen, it's impossible to say how it would have changed things. 

Ha ha - does no-one get where i'm coming from?

[dave.woodhall]

Whatever happened to the idea that the referee is always right, especially when he's wrong?

[chrisw1]

I've never worked out why our supporters always seem to be so quick to pick up on our supposed luck, yet ignore what goes against us. We could have had two penalties, we had the most shots on target, we looked the better side, their man of the match was their keeper, yet we were the lucky ones.

To be honest I don't tend to focus on luck normally - all i was suggesting was that the result was down to things outside of our control, as opposed to things that were. I think that the use of hypotheticals has derailed what i was originally trying to say. Yes we could have had two penalties, but we didn't get them. We also could have scored 10 goals, we didn't do that either. What actually happened was that we got a point due to an error on someone's else part rather than anything we did ourselves. That's all i was trying to say...

We also didn't get two penalties, so Sheffield got a point due to an error on someone's else part rather than anything they did themselves. 

How can you not see this?

[cdbearsfan]

Ha ha - does no-one get where i'm coming from?

Nah, not really. 😁

[tim]

I've never worked out why our supporters always seem to be so quick to pick up on our supposed luck, yet ignore what goes against us. We could have had two penalties, we had the most shots on target, we looked the better side, their man of the match was their keeper, yet we were the lucky ones.

To be honest I don't tend to focus on luck normally - all i was suggesting was that the result was down to things outside of our control, as opposed to things that were. I think that the use of hypotheticals has derailed what i was originally trying to say. Yes we could have had two penalties, but we didn't get them. We also could have scored 10 goals, we didn't do that either. What actually happened was that we got a point due to an error on someone's else part rather than anything we did ourselves. That's all i was trying to say...

We also didn't get two penalties, so Sheffield got a point due to an error on someone's else part rather than anything they did themselves. 

How can you not see this?

The difference is that being awarded 2 penalties does not mean 2 goals. They had an actual goal not given - there is a difference in an actual thing that happened compared to a "what might have been". How can you not see that?

[chrisw1]

You're talking absolute nonsence.  There were three poor decisions in that game.  One should have resulted in a goal for them and two should have resulted in two penalties for us.  I'd take those odds any day on us getting at least a draw and probably a win.   

[tim]

You're talking absolute nonsence.  There were three poor decisions in that game.  One should have resulted in a goal for them and two should have resulted in two penalties for us.  I'd take those odds any day on us getting at least a draw and probably a win.   

I totally get what you're saying - the penalties would almost certainly have changed the game, but I guess we'll never know for sure. :-)