Tyrone Mings

[usav]

It's just great that he's actually, properly back.

I'll go with this.  I still want Pau in the team for the big games.

[UK Redsox]

Mings still has a brainfart in him (as we've seen in his brief return). However, he does provide the physical presence which Pau/Ezri don't have.

Also, while his passing might not be Pau standard, Mings is hardly of the 'James Collins hoof-ball ' type.

Plus, it's good to have two West Country lads in the team

[pelty]

'Not sure why there is such a need felt by some' not being snide at all!

Anyway, have your opinion. I absolutely love Mings. Not sure why there's such a need felt by some to bury the mainstay central defender for the year we finished fourth. Personally, I like that we have both the England international and the Spain international.

It is not so much a need to bury Pau as a desire to see some look past his ability on the ball, which is very good, and to allow that, as a defender, he is flawed. I am not even talking about people here as much as journos/pundits who notice his passing ability and composure but rarely acknowledge the fact that he is part of a back four that has not been great since the new year. Granted, some of that surely is on the absence of Kamara, and it certainly is by no means all on Pau, but there is no denying that we have had trouble defending set pieces and that Torres struggles against pace and strength (some might deny that, I suppose). For me, I want defenders to be best at defending and secondarily to be good at progressing the ball. And, as you say, it is not as though Mings is poor at passing and, to be fair, it equally is the case that Pau is not an abject disaster as a defender. However, until yesterday there was a sense that Pau was undroppable (Brugge aside) which, given our form and defensive frailty, was frustrating to me, at least, and perhaps some others on here as well. Speaking for myself, I desperately wanted to see the manager try something different and to revert to the CB pairing that was in place during our best defensive run in recent memory (the back end of the 22-23 season). It may turn out to be fool's gold, but we will not know until we try it for a run of games.

[Monty]

All of which makes sense, but keeping the ball is every bit as much a defensive necessity as an attacking one. At his best - hell, at his normal - Pau breaks the lines and everything, but he also neutralises opponents' pressing patterns, which especially last year was hugely useful. Everyone acknowledges his issues off the ball, though I do think our sometimes sleepy midfield played a bigger role than you might be allowing for.

Basically I'm happy to see them in any combination. I don't much care who plays at right back, which of the two lefties would play on the left, which of the two lefties plays if it's only one of them...these to me are all good options.

[amfy]

Another punditry masterclass from Eni Aluko last night I notice.

“Mings and Konsa’s partnership was crucial to their successful season last year.”

And then interviewing Emery: "how pleased were you that Watkins scored the penalty?". Devastated I imagine, managers absolutely hate it when their players score a goal.

She's easily the worst pundit there's even been, who on earth watches her performances back and decides to keep employing her?

I'm no fan of hers and think she is generally pretty poor, but pundits have asked that question in various forms for years and years. She is only taking a lead from the men who have gone ahead of her with that nonsense.

File it with 'Newcastle fans love a great number 9'. Yeah - cos if there's one thing the rest of us can't stand....

Commentators have always said stupid stuff. Women get pulled on it.

[Dave]

Another punditry masterclass from Eni Aluko last night I notice.

“Mings and Konsa’s partnership was crucial to their successful season last year.”

And then interviewing Emery: "how pleased were you that Watkins scored the penalty?". Devastated I imagine, managers absolutely hate it when their players score a goal.

She's easily the worst pundit there's even been, who on earth watches her performances back and decides to keep employing her?

I'm no fan of hers and think she is generally pretty poor, but pundits have asked that question in various forms for years and years. She is only taking a lead from the men who have gone ahead of her with that nonsense.

File it with 'Newcastle fans love a great number 9'. Yeah - cos if there's one thing the rest of us can't stand....

Commentators have always said stupid stuff. Women get pulled on it.

Also, on the Watkins / penalty question I reckon a lot of us were probably more pleased than for the average striker-taking-and-scoring-a-penalty, given both his and our propensity to miss nearly every penalty that we get these days.

For the most part, DL / El Ghazi = expectation is they'll score, it's just what they do. Watkins = expectation is he'll miss, so when he doesn't the surprise makes it more pleasing.

(not that I think any of that was the subtext of Aluko's question or Emery's answer)

[pelty]

All of which makes sense, but keeping the ball is every bit as much a defensive necessity as an attacking one. At his best - hell, at his normal - Pau breaks the lines and everything, but he also neutralises opponents' pressing patterns, which especially last year was hugely useful. Everyone acknowledges his issues off the ball, though I do think our sometimes sleepy midfield played a bigger role than you might be allowing for.

Basically I'm happy to see them in any combination. I don't much care who plays at right back, which of the two lefties would play on the left, which of the two lefties plays if it's only one of them...these to me are all good options.

I am reading you as saying that you would not mind seeing both on the back line. If that is a correct reading, then I think that would be ideal. I am not sure how it would work as I do prefer to see Konsa as a CB, but if there is a way to do it that does not require Pau to be a wing back, I am all for it.

I take your point about keeping the ball, but I thought we were very good at that toward the back end of the 22-23 season as the team grew more comfortable playing from the back. For me, the delta between Mings' and Pau's passing/keeping the ball abilities are less than that between their respective abilities as out-and-out defenders. But if there is a world where we can have them both on the pitch while still having some width and pace on the wings, that is ideal (from my perspective).

[brontebilly]

Another big plus from Mings return is that Carlos has been pushed down the pecking order and Konsa is back at RCB where he belongs.

There's no way Mateta for Palace would have been pushing Mings around the way he did with Torres.

[Dave]

There's no way Mateta for Palace would have been pushing Mings around the way he did with Torres.

But there's also no way that Mings bypasses Palace's midfield to get the ball to McGinn which resulted in our equaliser, like Torres did.

[Richard]

Horses for courses as always. Torres in the CL games looks the better option, Mings when we play teams like Forest. Rotation is key with plenty of games to go this season in 3 competitions. Be good when Onana and Ramsey return too so that SJM and Youri get a breather.

[Border villan]

We should play Tyrone against Southampton and also against Forest where Woods will be to physical for Torres.

[Risso]

There's no way Mateta for Palace would have been pushing Mings around the way he did with Torres.

But there's also no way that Mings bypasses Palace's midfield to get the ball to McGinn which resulted in our equaliser, like Torres did.

He's not going to do it as often, but yesterday on about 14 minutes, Mings played an absolutely delightful defence splitting pass that led to a really good shooting opportunity for Watkins. But as a more general point, at the moment I'd be content with us being more defensively sound, with Mings and Konsa leaving the pretty stuff to Tielemans (whose passing was back to his very best) and Kamara (who is getting forward a lot more).

[Dave]

There's no way Mateta for Palace would have been pushing Mings around the way he did with Torres.

But there's also no way that Mings bypasses Palace's midfield to get the ball to McGinn which resulted in our equaliser, like Torres did.

He's not going to do it as often, but yesterday on about 14 minutes, Mings played an absolutely delightful defence splitting pass that led to a really good shooting opportunity for Watkins. But as a more general point, at the moment I'd be content with us being more defensively sound, with Mings and Konsa leaving the pretty stuff to Tielemans (whose passing was back to his very best) and Kamara (who is getting forward a lot more).

Sure, I've got no issues at all with that. Not sure if you was you or someone else on the match thread last night said that returning to Emi - Cash - Konsa - Mings - Digne with Kamara screening them basically felt like putting on a pair of really comfy slippers.

And if we're shipping loads of goals and being a bit rubbish, returning to the principles that made us good in the first place seems like a sensible place to go.

[Risso]

Think it might have been me, I was a few glasses of wine to the good though.

[caster troy]

Of all Gerrard's crimes, stripping Mings of the captaincy must be the worst. Shameful.