The International Cricket Thread

[olaftab]

Bairstow, Roy and Buttler (despite getting some runs in this Test match) must be dropped. Root needs to give up captaincy  for two reasons. He's an atrociously reactive captain and not very good at that and the impact on his batting has been terrible.
However there are two very poor Test teams and one is winning because of one man.

[Monty]

I don't think Buttler warrants dropping yet. He showed that he's learning from his errors today, and that's something to build on.

[Chinchilla Bathhouse]

What baffles me more than the undroppability is that the players we seem determined to persist with have so little potential; we've given countless chances to Denly, Malan, Vince and Roy, who are in their thirties or nearing them. If they're not the answer now they're never likely to be.

If we're going to give such long runs in the team regardless of form lets look to the future and give these generous opportunities to Hain or Sibley or Pope, for example. Players at the start of their careers who'd benefit from the experience and could be the spine of the team for the next decade. They could hardly do any worse.

[Steve67]

Lots of flaws with the batting. Archer was crap. I'd say our coaching needs an overhaul.  Its not like this Aussie team has the class of years gone by, Smith and Cummins apart. Root needs to step down. Give Jimmy the bowling coach role.  Just my immediate thoughts. Massive disappointment.

[AVH87]

Bairstow, Roy and Buttler (despite getting some runs in this Test match) must be dropped. Root needs to give up captaincy  for two reasons. He's an atrociously reactive captain and not very good at that and the impact on his batting has been terrible.
However there are two very poor Test teams and one is winning because of one man.

I'm not sure we can call Australia a poor team, they can take their pick of 3 seamers from world class options in Cummins (best bowler in the world), Hazelwood, Starc and Pattinson. They have the best batsman in the world, David Warner has been great over the years but is terrible in English conditions (against Broad mainly).

I'd say we have bigger problems given the ages of Broad and Anderson and our flaky batting options.

[tomd2103]

Bairstow, Roy and Buttler (despite getting some runs in this Test match) must be dropped. Root needs to give up captaincy  for two reasons. He's an atrociously reactive captain and not very good at that and the impact on his batting has been terrible.
However there are two very poor Test teams and one is winning because of one man.

I'm not sure we can call Australia a poor team, they can take their pick of 3 seamers from world class options in Cummins (best bowler in the world), Hazelwood, Starc and Pattinson. They have the best batsman in the world, David Warner has been great over the years but is terrible in English conditions (against Broad mainly).

I'd say we have bigger problems given the ages of Broad and Anderson and our flaky batting options.

I agree about Australia.  Smith aside, their batting line up looks fragile although Labuschange looks a good find for them.  Their bowling attack, however, is a very good unit even if they are missing a genuine all-rounder. 

We have got to make some changes in the final test though.  Bring in a new opener, shift Denly to 3, Root to 4 and give Pope a chance at 6.  Like others have said  I would also bring Foakes in at 7 and keeper. 

[Steve67]

I think their bowlers are far more disciplined than ours and that's what has won them the ashes, as well as Smith. Labushange has been prepared by us too having spent his early season acclimatising in England!  Will we ever learn.

[hilts_coolerking]

Yes, I think the Aussie pace attack - including Siddle and Pattinson - are being underestimated by some.  Hazlewood and Cummins would get into any Test side, and Lyon would get into most.

That said, we've competed at times but have run into a guy who's scored nearly 700 runs in three games.  In all honesty, the game he missed we should have lost too.

[paul_e]

Not underestimated, I just think Jimmy, Broad, Stokes and Archer/Woakes/Curran are as good as them. Losing Anderson, had a massive impact because he's bene the leader of our attack for years in tests. We need to replace him because he's on the verge of retiring, but perfect case scenario he bowls this series, takes another 25ish wickets and retires before the winter tours. Giving us time to get Archer 3-4 tests as a 2nd change bowler getting through 10-12 overs a day and easing into test match cricket.

Lyon is more a difference because Whilst Moeen has been solid at home for a few years he was never world class. We need to find a way to get some of our young spinners bowling a lot more deliveries in the county game they should be bowling 4-5000 deliveries a summer but someone like Leach is 28 and has 'only' bowled 16000 first class and test deliveries. Lyon is 31 and has bowled 60000. That difference in experience is massive.

What we really don't have though is a top order batsman that just takes the game away from teams, Root should be that player but he doesn't convert 50s often enough and he's getting worse since he became the captain.

On the team, I agree on Sibley coming in and I agree on Pope coming in. Foakes I'm 50/50 about. I'd consider Crawley instead (Pope or Buttler can keep wicket in that case). I like Foakes as an option but there's a couple of things about his batting which worry me and I think he might well get found out pretty quickly. I have a few concerns with Pope as well but he's younger and has by all accounts addressed many of the problems.

[taylorsworkrate]

Pope averages 60 in first class cricket. We need to get him in and give him at least the winter tours and next summer batting in his preferred position.

[OzVilla]

Australia were also way more prepared than us. All of their focus for the last 18 months has been about this series, they made sure players had experience of English conditions via the County matches, they used the Duke ball in the Sheffield Shield so batsmen and bowlers had a chance to have good centre wicket experience with it and they built a horses for courses attack which rotated Siddle, Pattinson and Starc depending on their experience at certain venues/conditions (Siddle and Pattinson having stints at Notts both played at Trent Bridge for example). 

This is the kind of thinking England must try and replicate for the next tour to Australia, the only time we've really done our homework was in 2010/11 which we won.   Clearly we need the personnel too but the old adage of 'failure to prepare equals prepare to fail' is quite apt here.

[UK Redsox]

I'd rest (drop) Root for the New Zealand tour and let Stokes captain the side for the two tests in his homeland.
Only for those two matches, I don't see him as a long term solution


Then make a decision about whether Root returns as captain for the SA tour

[hilts_coolerking]

Excellent piece on cricinfo: https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id/27571263/england-not-good-think-are

[Monty]

Unchanged squad. For goodness' sake.

[Risso]

So many probelms for whoever replaces Bayliss to have to deal with.  The main factor being that we just don't appear to have ANY batsmen suited to the test game at the moment.  Then we have a captain in woeful batting form, and even worse form as a captain.  The middle order that got us out of jail so many times in recent order has gone to pot.  Then he'll have to replace Anderson soon, and try to find a decent spinner from somewhere.  Chinchilla is right in what he says above.  English cricket needs a rethink and some mid to long term planning brought in, otherwise the test game, still the pinnacle of cricket for me, will soon become just a sideshow.