Dean Smith - Confirmed

[dave.woodhall]

If you're managing Burnley you can get away with being relegated and keep your job (well, then, you probably wouldn't now). Not at a club of our size. It would be ridiculous to stand by him in those circumstances.

What makes us so important?

[Legion]

Smith was the right appointment at the time. Same as MON was, similar to BFR and Brian Little.
Things just don't work out sometimes...

In hindsight, Smith turned out to be a good choice to get us up, but at the time of the appointment he wasn't an obvious choice; other than Brentford played some good football some of the time (notably against us) and he was a Villa fan.

His credentials and results, whilst very respectable for the clubs concerned, weren't screaming out and weren't particularly progressive :
Walsall League 1
2012 - 19th
2013 - 9th
2014 - 13th
2015 - 14th
2015-16 started season well
Brentford Championship
2016 - 9th
2017- 10th
2018 - 9th

Overall, it would seem thus far, he's had just the one outstanding season as a manager.

Even so, I was hoping for something better this season.

Being totally pedantic here and no bearing on the smith in or out debate, but didn’t he get Walsall to the play offs one season? I’m sure they lost to Barnsley in the league one semis, same year they got to a cup final and lost.

It was a cup game. I went. They were shit. Got thrashed 4-0 I think.

[The_ads]

If you're managing Burnley you can get away with being relegated and keep your job (well, then, you probably wouldn't now). Not at a club of our size. It would be ridiculous to stand by him in those circumstances.

What makes us so important?

An awful lot of things as you well know

[dave.woodhall]

If you're managing Burnley you can get away with being relegated and keep your job (well, then, you probably wouldn't now). Not at a club of our size. It would be ridiculous to stand by him in those circumstances.

What makes us so important?

An awful lot of things as you well know

And how many of them are relevant right this minute? This is the sort of thing we slaughter other clubs' supporters for saying.

[kippaxvilla2]

And why we sometimes rightly get ridiculed for.  We’ve been absolutely shocking for 10 years.  All driven by one short term decision or another.  I’ve no idea what is the best option these days.  Nothing seems to work for very long.

[dave.woodhall]

And why we sometimes rightly get ridiculed for.  We’ve been absolutely shocking for 10 years.  All driven by one short term decision or another.  I’ve no idea what is the best option these days.  Nothing seems to work for very long.

That's the absolute crux - short-term. The only time we've ever thought long-term this century was under Houlier, and he was getting dog's abuse for it.

[Legion]

Agreed. I liked him.

[kippaxvilla2]

I liked what he was trying to do.  It’s amazing how much the players are never accountable.  Fancy him asking Dunne and Collins to look after themselves and be more professional.

[cdbearsfan]

Houllier was shite, he took a team that wasn't too far away from winning two cups and finishing in the top four, minus one player, and had them stinking out the bottom half of the league all season.

Sacking a manager that fails miserably, as Smith will have done this season if he gets us relegated, and appointing a manager who can have success with us long term aren't mutually exclusive options.

I'd be very tempted to get rid of Smith even if we stay up, as the performances have totally failed to match the level of investment. Sticking by him if we go down would be the sort of nonsense teams like Barnsley or Small Heath, happy just to have had a season playing at big grounds, would do.

If we want to get back to the sort of level where we want to be, we have to aspire to have the best manager we can get. A man that couldn't even finish in the top seventeen would, demonstrably, not be that man.

[hilts_coolerking]

And why we sometimes rightly get ridiculed for.  We’ve been absolutely shocking for 10 years.  All driven by one short term decision or another.  I’ve no idea what is the best option these days.  Nothing seems to work for very long.

That's the absolute crux - short-term. The only time we've ever thought long-term this century was under Houlier, and he was getting dog's abuse for it.

It didn't work though.

[dave.woodhall]

Houllier was shite, he took a team that wasn't too far away from winning two cups and finishing in the top four, minus one player, and had them stinking out the bottom half of the league all season.

My point entirely.

[cdbearsfan]

I'm still gutted we let Billy McNeill slip through our fingers. We should have offered him a ten year extended deal the second relegation was confirmed.

[kippaxvilla2]

He was trying to change MO’N’s anti football style with a more modern one and he was trying to do it with MO’N’s players.  Towards the end of that season we were starting to play some very good stuff as he started to bring his own signings in.  But then he had a coronary.

[KevinGage]

Houllier wasn't thinking long term at all.  Not about us anyway. Maybe his pension pot.

He was in no rush to take the job in the first instance, had little interest in the youth or academy players and gave the air of pure O'Leary smug mode reminiscing about his old club pretty much from the outset.  Every day in the job he was doing us a favour. At least O'Leary gave us that promising first year.

Darren Bent was signed at his peak for a club record fee and the players Houllier had lined up in the summer were   closer to the age group O'Neill was tapping up. The money he burned through for pretty average players at Liverpool should give some indication what he was about. He was blessed with two natural talents in Gerrard and Owen coming through at roughly the same time and Carragher and Fowler as good as anything in the country to offset the El Haddj Diouf/ Cisse and other shite deals. He didn't have that luxury with us, so I don't see how it could have worked based purely on his own deals.

He had Gabby, James Collins and Dicky Dunne's number pretty early on, so I'd credit him for that and little else.

[Sexual Ealing]

He was trying to change MO’N’s anti football style with a more modern one and he was trying to do it with MO’N’s players.  Towards the end of that season we were starting to play some very good stuff as he started to bring his own signings in.  But then he had a coronary.

From (possibly impaired) memory, we only started playing once McAllister took over, didn't we?