Villa Park: a managerial graveyard?

[Meanwood Villa]

There's a lot of revisionism going on with Houllier just because the season he was manager for some of the time (lest we forget the results before he arrived and after he was ill were better than when he was in charge) wasn't as godawful as what's followed. He was old, semi-retired, out of touch and as it turned out not physically capable of being the manager of an ambitious club competing for European football. It was a bad appointment. Just because what followed was worse doesn't make it better.

There's no revisionism - just plain fact. We finished ninth, and for the last time until now there seemed to be some plan emerging.

I'm not really convinced he had a masterplan as such. I think he had the remnants of MON's successful team and was allowed to buy Darren Bent and he (and Gary McAllister) just about did OK with it. Was he a better mamager than McLeish? Undoubtedly. Was he a wtf appointment that didn't really work? Very much so.

[AV82EC]

He undertook a revolution of our playing style in one season against a backdrop of his unprofessional defenders and Gabby in open revolt, massive injury issues and an owner losing interest. As others have said he made massive mistakes and didn't really get the club but he was one of the few managers we've had who was ruthless in his desire for us to play modern attractive passing football.

What I will always remember from that season is 30 minutes against Man United and with a patched up team and Hogg/Bannon in centre mid we ripped them apart and in typical Villa fashion ended up hanging on for a draw!!! I dared to dream at that point and ended up disappointed and thinking what might have been had we shoved him upstairs and bought in a decent 1st team coach.

Instead we got McLeish....make your own punchline.

[VillaAlways]

He undertook a revolution of our playing style in one season against a backdrop of his unprofessional defenders and Gabby in open revolt, massive injury issues and an owner losing interest. As others have said he made massive mistakes and didn't really get the club but he was one of the few managers we've had who was ruthless in his desire for us to play modern attractive passing football.

What I will always remember from that season is 30 minutes against Man United and with a patched up team and Hogg/Bannon in centre mid we ripped them apart and in typical Villa fashion ended up hanging on for a draw!!! I dared to dream at that point and ended up disappointed and thinking what might have been had we shoved him upstairs and bought in a decent 1st team coach.

Instead we got McLeish....make your own punchline.

Absolutely spot on

[robbo1874]

I rated Houllier at the time and as Dave said, there did look to be the semblance of a plan in place and a steady improvement towards the end of the season. Who wouldn't take those two things right now? Some credit should go to McAllister for the fact we ended up finishing 9th, when really 16th looked on the cards at one point. I've said it a few times, but if Houllier's health had have held up, I'd have liked to have seen what he and Mcallister could have achieved with him as DOF and Mcallister as manager.

[Rudy65]

He undertook a revolution of our playing style in one season against a backdrop of his unprofessional defenders and Gabby in open revolt, massive injury issues and an owner losing interest. As others have said he made massive mistakes and didn't really get the club but he was one of the few managers we've had who was ruthless in his desire for us to play modern attractive passing football.

What I will always remember from that season is 30 minutes against Man United and with a patched up team and Hogg/Bannon in centre mid we ripped them apart and in typical Villa fashion ended up hanging on for a draw!!! I dared to dream at that point and ended up disappointed and thinking what might have been had we shoved him upstairs and bought in a decent 1st team coach.

Instead we got McLeish....make your own punchline.

Cracking game that. Ashley was also superb that day. Then bloody Vidic had to ruin it

[passitsideways]

The concern I had with Houllier's going-forward plan was mostly to do with whether there was enough money to complete the side. I mean, the players we were linked to in midfield were always very encouraging: we'd added Makoun in January, and apparently we were pretty close in on players like Gago and Cabaye - not exactly a physically imposing lot, but midfield players who'd experienced success at the top level and who could actually control the game with their passing and skill; but the defence was rather shambolic and needed an overhaul of its own, especially given the unprofessionalism of the two starting CBs. I don't think there was enough money to do all that, even accounting for Ashley's impending sale.

Also, my far-fetched theory was that Lerner gave up after that entire sequence where Houllier had to leave, and then we failed to get Martinez, in that he basically decided if we were going to go through the same nonsense again, at least do it on the cheap.

[Nelly]

Also, I seem to remember Bannan and Albrighton being excellent in that Man U game. I was up for the Houllier appointment, I thought had he stayed on he would have brought our club up to a better standard. He's the last serious manager we've had, and yes, the last time we seemed to have a semblance of a plan.

I think we could do with that now - a manager with broad enough shoulders to inspire players and fans.

[SoccerHQ]

He undertook a revolution of our playing style in one season against a backdrop of his unprofessional defenders and Gabby in open revolt, massive injury issues and an owner losing interest. As others have said he made massive mistakes and didn't really get the club but he was one of the few managers we've had who was ruthless in his desire for us to play modern attractive passing football.

What I will always remember from that season is 30 minutes against Man United and with a patched up team and Hogg/Bannon in centre mid we ripped them apart and in typical Villa fashion ended up hanging on for a draw!!! I dared to dream at that point and ended up disappointed and thinking what might have been had we shoved him upstairs and bought in a decent 1st team coach.

Instead we got McLeish....make your own punchline.

The Man. United game was a really nice surprise and the nearest we've got to beating them at home since 2001 but what followed was a dismal xmas/new year period. We won 1 of our next 9 I think and then results picked up when we signed Bent which lifted morale.

However you only have to go to the post match threads archive search back for the 10/11 season and look after the game when we lost 1-0 at home to Wolves in March 2011 to see many on here weren't buying the Houllier fantasy football.

http://www.heroesandvillains.info/forumv3/index.php?topic=42767.0

Much the same as it is today.

Also this idea being peddled that long term we would've prospered under him....his age and health meant he was never going to be here 4 years like MON was.

It's easy with hindsight but I really think we should've kept McDonald as caretaker until a decent manager became available that year. I look at clubs getting ambitious young European managers to the prem like Pochettino and Bilic to the prem and think surely a top 6 regular with plenty of England internationals could've been capable of that?

That's why I was so underwhelmed with Houllier. He would've worked better if he'd came in as a DOF with a younger head coach in charge. Ironically Remi Garde in those days might've worked in that scenario if he had started managing then. Rudi Garcia that season won the double with Lille so another we maybe could've tempted.

[AV82EC]

And let's not forget some of that misbehaviour. The infamous swearing at Sid Cowans and associated fracas at a break at a Health Club, inferences of bullying of youth/reserve players with an alleged racist undertone, Gabby deciding to ruin his career by turning into a middleweight boxer, and there were numerous others, fatty Dunne & co moaning about training for one. I would never excuse Houllier for the Liverpool away game or his craven surrender at Citeh in the Cup but let's remember some of the shit our partly professional squad were providing.

[saunders_heroes]

There's a lot of revisionism going on with Houllier just because the season he was manager for some of the time (lest we forget the results before he arrived and after he was ill were better than when he was in charge) wasn't as godawful as what's followed. He was old, semi-retired, out of touch and as it turned out not physically capable of being the manager of an ambitious club competing for European football. It was a bad appointment. Just because what followed was worse doesn't make it better.

I agree with this. For the majority of that season we were awful and we were in a relegation battle till we rallied towards the end of the season. I don't think Houllier had a plan at all other than other than increasing his pension pot.

[mr underhill]

A bit harsh - I see it as foreshadowing what was to come years later with Garde - he tried to impose a different, more thoughtful and progressive style of play on a bunch of antediluvians who kicked, screamed and moaned, in remonstration. He tried to instil more enlightened coaching methods and they rebelled against that to - all this set against the toxic backdrop of Collins & Co.'s buffoonery and Gabby's 'I'm Mr Aston Villa, don't fuck with me shit'.

[Rudy Can't Fail]

He undertook a revolution of our playing style in one season against a backdrop of his unprofessional defenders and Gabby in open revolt, massive injury issues and an owner losing interest. As others have said he made massive mistakes and didn't really get the club but he was one of the few managers we've had who was ruthless in his desire for us to play modern attractive passing football.

What I will always remember from that season is 30 minutes against Man United and with a patched up team and Hogg/Bannon in centre mid we ripped them apart and in typical Villa fashion ended up hanging on for a draw!!! I dared to dream at that point and ended up disappointed and thinking what might have been had we shoved him upstairs and bought in a decent 1st team coach.

Instead we got McLeish....make your own punchline.

The Man. United game was a really nice surprise and the nearest we've got to beating them at home since 2001 but what followed was a dismal xmas/new year period. We won 1 of our next 9 I think and then results picked up when we signed Bent which lifted morale.

However you only have to go to the post match threads archive search back for the 10/11 season and look after the game when we lost 1-0 at home to Wolves in March 2011 to see many on here weren't buying the Houllier fantasy football.

http://www.heroesandvillains.info/forumv3/index.php?topic=42767.0

True but as some whippersnapper so well pointed out at the end of the season..

If the back 5 had shown this level of commitment with last ditch blocks in the dark days of December and January instead of just these last two games, then we'd have finished 6th no problem this season.

[SoccerHQ]

Ha I was actually going to put in one of my posts on this thread my abiding memory of seeing us win at Arsenal and Liverpool on the final day was wondering where the f**k that level of commitment had been for the previous 8 months of that season.

March 2011 was a very different world....the days of Owen Coyle being a decent and highly rated football manager for instance. I didn't post on that thread but I would've been with ozz and Tom Mc9 in wanting him as manager.

It's quite amusing seeing us all in rage after that Wolves game for what was at that point only a few months of bad premier league form and we still somehow finished in the top 10 that year.

No one could've foreseen the next 6 years.

[Rudy Can't Fail]

Ha I was actually going to put in one of my posts on this thread my abiding memory of seeing us win at Arsenal and Liverpool on the final day was wondering where the f**k that level of commitment had been for the previous 8 months of that season.

I have a feeling you may be posting similar come May. Watching us now it's like we're playing pre-season friendlies such is the level of commitment.

[passport1]

Houllier was the season I cancelled my season ticket. Haven't had one since. Enough said.