Remi Garde - Departs Aston Villa

[brontebilly]

The similarity to the Houlier reign when some of the senior players were acting like twats and there was obvious disharmony in the dressing room.

I think the comparison can be extended to the guy that he replaced too.  Whilst MON may not have been the 'banter king' that Sherwood thought he was, I suspect that MON allowed for a pretty relaxed atmosphere and training that lacked intensity.

Wasn't O'Neill's philosophy something like "when the team is winning, the players are in charge.  When the team us losing, I'm in charge."

While handsomely rewarding average British players with little resale value with crazy contracts. His limited philosophy saw us become a competitive outfit again but there wasn't much sustainable about it.

He left Glasgow Celtic, Leceister and Sunderland in similar situations. Signed Fletcher and Johnson for about 25m combined not too long ago don't forget.

However our appalling efforts to get back on track are not down to MON but the responsibility of Randy Lerner and his cheerleading sycophants.

[pauliewalnuts]

The similarity to the Houlier reign when some of the senior players were acting like twats and there was obvious disharmony in the dressing room.

I think the comparison can be extended to the guy that he replaced too.  Whilst MON may not have been the 'banter king' that Sherwood thought he was, I suspect that MON allowed for a pretty relaxed atmosphere and training that lacked intensity.

Wasn't O'Neill's philosophy something like "when the team is winning, the players are in charge.  When the team us losing, I'm in charge."

Or something like "Unless it's Wednesday, I'm not here, so Bibs and Cones are in charge"*




* Bibs and Cones being what the players referred to John Robertson and Steve Walford as behind their backs

[tomd2103]

The similarity to the Houlier reign when some of the senior players were acting like twats and there was obvious disharmony in the dressing room.

I think the comparison can be extended to the guy that he replaced too.  Whilst MON may not have been the 'banter king' that Sherwood thought he was, I suspect that MON allowed for a pretty relaxed atmosphere and training that lacked intensity.

Wasn't O'Neill's philosophy something like "when the team is winning, the players are in charge.  When the team us losing, I'm in charge."

Or something like "Unless it's Wednesday, I'm not here, so Bibs and Cones are in charge"*




* Bibs and Cones being what the players referred to John Robertson and Steve Walford as behind their backs

I watched "I Believe in Miracles" on BT Sport the other day and in many of the interviews (some with MON himself) on there ex-players referred to how little they trained under Brian Clough.  I remember reading Roy Keane once saying that if he had played well for Forest on a Saturday Clough would tell him to get himself back home to Ireland and he would see him the following Thursday or Friday.  If rumours are to be believed, then you can see where MON got it from.     

[Holte L2]

The similarity to the Houlier reign when some of the senior players were acting like twats and there was obvious disharmony in the dressing room.

I think the comparison can be extended to the guy that he replaced too.  Whilst MON may not have been the 'banter king' that Sherwood thought he was, I suspect that MON allowed for a pretty relaxed atmosphere and training that lacked intensity.

Wasn't O'Neill's philosophy something like "when the team is winning, the players are in charge.  When the team us losing, I'm in charge."

Or something like "Unless it's Wednesday, I'm not here, so Bibs and Cones are in charge"*




* Bibs and Cones being what the players referred to John Robertson and Steve Walford as behind their backs

I watched "I Believe in Miracles" on BT Sport the other day and in many of the interviews (some with MON himself) on there referred to how little they trained under Brian Clough.  I remember reading Roy Keane once saying that if he had played well for Forest on a Saturday Clough would tell him to get himself back home to Ireland and he would see him the following Thursday or Friday.  If rumours are to be believed, then you can see where MON got it from.     

That's a cracking documentary. I've got it on DVD.

[tomd2103]

The similarity to the Houlier reign when some of the senior players were acting like twats and there was obvious disharmony in the dressing room.

I think the comparison can be extended to the guy that he replaced too.  Whilst MON may not have been the 'banter king' that Sherwood thought he was, I suspect that MON allowed for a pretty relaxed atmosphere and training that lacked intensity.

Wasn't O'Neill's philosophy something like "when the team is winning, the players are in charge.  When the team us losing, I'm in charge."

While handsomely rewarding average British players with little resale value with crazy contracts. His limited philosophy saw us become a competitive outfit again but there wasn't much sustainable about it.

He left Glasgow Celtic, Leceister and Sunderland in similar situations. Signed Fletcher and Johnson for about 25m combined not too long ago don't forget.

However our appalling efforts to get back on track are not down to MON but the responsibility of Randy Lerner and his cheerleading sycophants.

Agree.  MON's departure sent us into a tailspin, but it should have been recoverable from there.  As it is, Lerner and co. are responsible for that tailspin turning into a massive crash.

[paul_e]

The similarity to the Houlier reign when some of the senior players were acting like twats and there was obvious disharmony in the dressing room.

I think the comparison can be extended to the guy that he replaced too.  Whilst MON may not have been the 'banter king' that Sherwood thought he was, I suspect that MON allowed for a pretty relaxed atmosphere and training that lacked intensity.

Wasn't O'Neill's philosophy something like "when the team is winning, the players are in charge.  When the team us losing, I'm in charge."

Or something like "Unless it's Wednesday, I'm not here, so Bibs and Cones are in charge"*




* Bibs and Cones being what the players referred to John Robertson and Steve Walford as behind their backs

I watched "I Believe in Miracles" on BT Sport the other day and in many of the interviews (some with MON himself) on there ex-players referred to how little they trained under Brian Clough.  I remember reading Roy Keane once saying that if he had played well for Forest on a Saturday Clough would tell him to get himself back home to Ireland and he would see him the following Thursday or Friday.  If rumours are to be believed, then you can see where MON got it from.     

I can fully believe that and in the 80s it was ok because despite football being 'professional' it wasn't very much so.  The fitness levels of players now completely eclipse those of players from even the turn of the millenium, go back to the 80s and it wasn't all that odd to see someone like Mick Quinn playing at the highest level and looking like he'd taken a break from a 3-4 day bender to make the game.

[eamonn]

And he still scored a hat-trick(?) against us, the fat funt.

Didn't realise we had a bid turned down from him by Newcastle when Coventry signed him. The same week Yanited bought Cantona from Leeds...sounds like that might have been our Heskey to us/Arshavin to Arsenal moment seventeen years prior...

[supertom]

Under O Neill we didn't suffer too much from injuries. We were also a fit side. Now of course we died on our ass in March, because he only used 14-15 players with any regularity, over the course of a season (watch Leicester in March-April) but still, up until the burnout (which even to the fittest bunch of players you could have, would be inevitable the way O Neill ran them), we lasted the distance in games and played at a high tempo.
Since O Neill left we've been cluster-fucked by injuries. We've been hampered with dire fitness in which, throughout the entire seasons, we've been outfought and outrun and outlasted by the vast majority of our opponents. We've spent 5 years playing like the wheezy kid at school who has to take a 10 minute break half way round an 400 metre lap run.

Our fitness levels still aren't good enough. Our injury record is a joke. I've no idea what our fitness team or medical team are doing. Whatever it is, it's not nearly warranting what they're getting paid.

[aj2k77]

Were we a fit side though? I'm sure I recall Terry saying in the press you just try to keep it tight for 70 mins against us and then we run out of steam? Before the cup semi I think? Which as much as he's a knob he was spot on that match about us.

[paul_e]

Under O Neill we didn't suffer too much from injuries. We were also a fit side. Now of course we died on our ass in March, because he only used 14-15 players with any regularity, over the course of a season (watch Leicester in March-April) but still, up until the burnout (which even to the fittest bunch of players you could have, would be inevitable the way O Neill ran them), we lasted the distance in games and played at a high tempo.
Since O Neill left we've been cluster-fucked by injuries. We've been hampered with dire fitness in which, throughout the entire seasons, we've been outfought and outrun and outlasted by the vast majority of our opponents. We've spent 5 years playing like the wheezy kid at school who has to take a 10 minute break half way round an 400 metre lap run.

Our fitness levels still aren't good enough. Our injury record is a joke. I've no idea what our fitness team or medical team are doing. Whatever it is, it's not nearly warranting what they're getting paid.

I completely disagree.  We had some fit players (Milner and Young were the main ones but Gabby at that point would run all day as well) but as a squad I don't think we were at all.  We played a sit deep and counter style which is good if you have 2-3 attacking players like that and it masks how unfit the squad is.  John Terry made the state of squad quite clear by outright stating that their plan was to get to an hour safely and then watch us hit a wall.  That happened a fair few times under mon and not always in March.

The injuries under Houllier were a result of making those players train properly after a particularly poor summer (a lot of our team looked out of shape in the first few games of that season).  Since then you've had a combination of disrupted summers, poor coaching and a hell of a lot of bad luck (in terms of injuries whilst away with national teams, etc) and a higher than normal run of serious injuries which have meant 2-3 being out for the entire season every year, Kozak missing nearly 2 years is an example of just how hard that hit us, and losing Amavi when we did this year was a massive blow.

[Andy_Lochhead_in_the_air]

Q & A with Remi Garde today.

At the outset let me say he was an absolute gent and it was an open session with no vetting of questions beforehand.

Not verbatim but in summary.

Q.. I would not expect you to give up while we still have 36 points to fight for and I am sure you wont. However, because there was no activity during the transfer window many fans now feel that was a sign the Club has given up. Did we not bring anybody in because you were unable to find/persuade the players you wanted or was it because the Club wouldn't give you the backing you wanted ?

A.. Yes, there were players I wanted and tried to get but could not persuade because of the position we are in so they chose elsewhere.
      Yes, I would have wanted more but maybe the Club decided they want to provide what is available at a different time.

He also talked about being told after he arrived here that the average lifespan of a Premier manager is now about 14 months, an average which would be even lower if it was not for Arsene Wenger.
He was not directly asked if he would be here next season. However, he was asked how his team/player plans would be different if as likely we were outside the Premier next season. Unsurprisingly, he said he is focussed entirely on survival this campaign and would be until he saw league table that said we were mathematically down.

[cheltenhamlion]

Will try the same topic from the other side when I meet with Fox again next week.

[supertom]

Under O Neill we didn't suffer too much from injuries. We were also a fit side. Now of course we died on our ass in March, because he only used 14-15 players with any regularity, over the course of a season (watch Leicester in March-April) but still, up until the burnout (which even to the fittest bunch of players you could have, would be inevitable the way O Neill ran them), we lasted the distance in games and played at a high tempo.
Since O Neill left we've been cluster-fucked by injuries. We've been hampered with dire fitness in which, throughout the entire seasons, we've been outfought and outrun and outlasted by the vast majority of our opponents. We've spent 5 years playing like the wheezy kid at school who has to take a 10 minute break half way round an 400 metre lap run.

Our fitness levels still aren't good enough. Our injury record is a joke. I've no idea what our fitness team or medical team are doing. Whatever it is, it's not nearly warranting what they're getting paid.

I completely disagree.  We had some fit players (Milner and Young were the main ones but Gabby at that point would run all day as well) but as a squad I don't think we were at all.  We played a sit deep and counter style which is good if you have 2-3 attacking players like that and it masks how unfit the squad is.  John Terry made the state of squad quite clear by outright stating that their plan was to get to an hour safely and then watch us hit a wall.  That happened a fair few times under mon and not always in March.

The injuries under Houllier were a result of making those players train properly after a particularly poor summer (a lot of our team looked out of shape in the first few games of that season).  Since then you've had a combination of disrupted summers, poor coaching and a hell of a lot of bad luck (in terms of injuries whilst away with national teams, etc) and a higher than normal run of serious injuries which have meant 2-3 being out for the entire season every year, Kozak missing nearly 2 years is an example of just how hard that hit us, and losing Amavi when we did this year was a massive blow.

I would never take too much notice of what Terry said.

I do agree that we bought fit players though. Young, Gabby (before he became pregnant with quadruplets), Milner, Coker could all run all day.
If you put O Neill's side up against any of our sides since, his side would last the distance better, and probably play the highest tempo.
Of course we couldn't particularly last because O Neills style and inability to rotate (or make timely substitutions) even managed to tire out someone like Milner who makes superman look like a 30 stone geriatric on a treadmill.

I'm not claiming the man was a genius by any stretch, or even that he had it right. But we've got it monumentally wrong year on year since. Houlliers double sessions were overkill. I don't think Garde (and we've got the same fitness coach back from Gerrards reign now) has done them any favours.
It's not merely fitness though of course. We've also bought far too many players with a track record of injuries over the last few years. We've been asking for it. Buying players like Richardson, Senderos, Vlaar etc was a joke.

[tomd2103]

The similarity to the Houlier reign when some of the senior players were acting like twats and there was obvious disharmony in the dressing room.

I think the comparison can be extended to the guy that he replaced too.  Whilst MON may not have been the 'banter king' that Sherwood thought he was, I suspect that MON allowed for a pretty relaxed atmosphere and training that lacked intensity.

Wasn't O'Neill's philosophy something like "when the team is winning, the players are in charge.  When the team us losing, I'm in charge."

Or something like "Unless it's Wednesday, I'm not here, so Bibs and Cones are in charge"*




* Bibs and Cones being what the players referred to John Robertson and Steve Walford as behind their backs

I watched "I Believe in Miracles" on BT Sport the other day and in many of the interviews (some with MON himself) on there ex-players referred to how little they trained under Brian Clough.  I remember reading Roy Keane once saying that if he had played well for Forest on a Saturday Clough would tell him to get himself back home to Ireland and he would see him the following Thursday or Friday.  If rumours are to be believed, then you can see where MON got it from.     

I can fully believe that and in the 80s it was ok because despite football being 'professional' it wasn't very much so.  The fitness levels of players now completely eclipse those of players from even the turn of the millenium, go back to the 80s and it wasn't all that odd to see someone like Mick Quinn playing at the highest level and looking like he'd taken a break from a 3-4 day bender to make the game.

I read a really good book about Clough in which the author said that along with his alcoholism, his failure to adapt to the modern game was his undoing.  He said that it got to the point where coaches were having to slip pieces of paper to players in the dressing room on match days informing them of basic things like the formation of the opposition.

[ciggiesnbeer]

Q & A with Remi Garde today.

At the outset let me say he was an absolute gent and it was an open session with no vetting of questions beforehand.

Not verbatim but in summary.

Q.. I would not expect you to give up while we still have 36 points to fight for and I am sure you wont. However, because there was no activity during the transfer window many fans now feel that was a sign the Club has given up. Did we not bring anybody in because you were unable to find/persuade the players you wanted or was it because the Club wouldn't give you the backing you wanted ?

A.. Yes, there were players I wanted and tried to get but could not persuade because of the position we are in so they chose elsewhere.
      Yes, I would have wanted more but maybe the Club decided they want to provide what is available at a different time.

He also talked about being told after he arrived here that the average lifespan of a Premier manager is now about 14 months, an average which would be even lower if it was not for Arsene Wenger.
He was not directly asked if he would be here next season. However, he was asked how his team/player plans would be different if as likely we were outside the Premier next season. Unsurprisingly, he said he is focussed entirely on survival this campaign and would be until he saw league table that said we were mathematically down.

Well there you go. Thanks Lerner, Fox & Hollis. You not only gave up on our survival but you have also (probably) got our manager to walk at the end of the season in one fell stroke.

January 2016 is right up there with hiring McLeish in the "WHATTTT???" category of Villa history.