Remi Garde - Departs Aston Villa

[themossman]

I desperately want him to be a success and hopefully he will be.  But really his CV offers little more than Garry Monks or Brendan Rogers

How do you work that out then?

he's had three years of moderate success in a French League.

Rogers and Monk have had periods of moderate success in the Premier League.

I think that's a bit harsh on him. His record in Europe looks a lot better than either of those 2 as well.

Rodgers had Suarez and a blank chequebook behind him at Liverpool and at Swansea both he and Monk had one of the best off the field set ups in football and a well managed transition into the role. Does that equip them as well as well as Remi for the job in hand?

[Villa in Denmark]

What a load of tripe.  More speculation there than the worst red tops

Edit re the post Leicester dressing room post

Thanks for your considered and constructive input.

There was a reason why it was prefaced with  (purely uneducated) guess.

If you'd like to offer a counter explanation as to a possible course of events where we went from doing sort of OK to a split dressing room, which Richards has as good as admitted is the case, with Leicester as the obvious fulcrum point, then feel free.

Why would I?  You've just completely made up a bullshit hypothetical scenario.  What's the point of that?

A bit of fun debate pontificating about what's gone on,(because something definitely has.)

Why you then need to get you knickers in a twist about something that was clearly marked as nothing other than that is a bit of a mystery.

Still look on the bright side. At least it might have distracted people from creaming their pants over the appointment of our new manager.

OK.  I just think Sherwood has taken enough stick based on factual matters that are there for all to see.  Completely making stuff up to give him a further beating just seems a bit unnecessary to me.

Given his levels of non-performance and disrespectful way he treated the club over his last 3-4 weeks with his interviews and press conferences, we could never stop beating him enough from my point of view.

My only hope for a possible return to Villa Park for him is that it's with a team he's had for more than 3-4 months.

With regards making stuff up, it was a hypothesis, something to be argued / debated, not taken as an assertion of fact.

Or should we really just believe that nothing happened in the dressing room to move from a team doing sort of OK but not great and looking like the new recruits were starting to get game time, to them all being ostracised as performances and results fell through the floor?

Of all the ifs, buts and maybes from Sherwood's brief reign, that's what I'd like to know more about.

the only ifs and buts you need worry about is he kept us in the premier league, when most on here thought all hope had gone, and we were nailed on for the drop
if you don't think he can never be beaten enough after he saved our bacon last term then you best crack on with that,

I'm glad hes gone, i'm glad we have Garde, but I wont forget as twatish as he ended up we owe Sherwood

The obvious counter argument there is that yes, he kept us up, but if he did it, then there must have been many others who could have, given what an absolute pigs ear he's made of everything else, and if he'd gone with a modicum of dignity I'd probably agree with you.

As it is, we owe him nothing. He took on a job, did that job and he was compensated for it. He's now put us in a position where we're a national joke on the pitch and that's before you get to tainting any goodwill with his self preservation bollocks from Leicester on.
I said at the time that he'd lost sight of the fact that the game's about the club and the players, not the manager but for him , as soon as it started going wrong he oscilated between "nothing to do with me gov" and "oh woe is poor little me, I couldn't buy the overpriced tat I wanted."

SGT on the other hand, we owe to this day, because he turned an entire disfunctional club around and saved us from God knows what.

Tim, you can file along with any of the other "relegation fire fighter" who can rabble rouse for a few months, but for God's sake don't ask them to think.

[ClaretAndBlueBlood]

Sorry if its already been mentioned, but does he remind anyone else of Gary Speed? One of my favourite non-Villa players. RIP Gary.

no. And you've misspelt bellend in your name (not an insult to you in case of any doubt)

[chrisw1]

I desperately want him to be a success and hopefully he will be.  But really his CV offers little more than Garry Monks or Brendan Rogers

How do you work that out then?

he's had three years of moderate success in a French League.

Rogers and Monk have had periods of moderate success in the Premier League.

Rodgers you could argue about, but with Monk you're having a laugh.
Monk - took over a stable club with a stable squad and kept them bobbing around midtable. Now in his second full year and with a squad that's becoming more his own, looks like he might be struggling a bit. (I hope not because he seems like a decent bloke, working for a well run club that plays pretty good football.)
Garde - took over a hitherto stable club that had had it's financial basis pulled from under it.  Kept the club up around the CL and Europa league places whilst turning the entire squad over and replacing just about anyone of saleable value with graduates from the academy and youth teams.

Yes you make a fair point.  But we've had so many false dawns I'm just a bit surprised at the levels of unconditional hope placed on a young and relatively untried manager.  Similar passion was shown by some for Solskjaer (who's prior success was of course in a poorer league still) who also had a fantastic youtube interview.  But that did't end so well in the PL.

Hopefully Garde will be a great success, but he is undoubtedly a gamble.  But maybe I'm just a bit more cautious given previous dashed hopes since Lerner joined.   

[Villa in Denmark]

I desperately want him to be a success and hopefully he will be.  But really his CV offers little more than Garry Monks or Brendan Rogers

How do you work that out then?

he's had three years of moderate success in a French League.

Rogers and Monk have had periods of moderate success in the Premier League.

Rodgers you could argue about, but with Monk you're having a laugh.
Monk - took over a stable club with a stable squad and kept them bobbing around midtable. Now in his second full year and with a squad that's becoming more his own, looks like he might be struggling a bit. (I hope not because he seems like a decent bloke, working for a well run club that plays pretty good football.)
Garde - took over a hitherto stable club that had had it's financial basis pulled from under it.  Kept the club up around the CL and Europa league places whilst turning the entire squad over and replacing just about anyone of saleable value with graduates from the academy and youth teams.

Yes you make a fair point.  But we've had so many false dawns I'm just a bit surprised at the levels of unconditional hope placed on a young and relatively untried manager.  Similar passion was shown by some for Solskjær (who's prior success was of course in a poorer league still) who also had a fantastic youtube interview.  But that did't end so well in the PL.

Hopefully Garde will be a great success, but he is undoubtedly a gamble.  But maybe I'm just a bit more cautious given previous dashed hopes since Lerner joined. 

I think that's fair enough. Only we could have made such a mess of having a billionaire owner 9 years ago, or have written off £250M to be worse off than when we started.

On the flip side, if we're going to get out of this, it was always going to be with a coach of Garde's ilk and he does seem like a pretty good match in terms of what he brings coaching wise and where the strengths within the squad lie.

Right now I'd settle for him keeping us in touch by January and then let him bring in 2 or 3 players to have an immediate impact, which I'm guessing would be a centre forward, a goalkeeper and a left sided centre back. I genuinely think we're alright everywhere else, if they're set up and coached properly

[john e]

What a load of tripe.  More speculation there than the worst red tops

Edit re the post Leicester dressing room post

Thanks for your considered and constructive input.

There was a reason why it was prefaced with  (purely uneducated) guess.

If you'd like to offer a counter explanation as to a possible course of events where we went from doing sort of OK to a split dressing room, which Richards has as good as admitted is the case, with Leicester as the obvious fulcrum point, then feel free.

Why would I?  You've just completely made up a bullshit hypothetical scenario.  What's the point of that?

A bit of fun debate pontificating about what's gone on,(because something definitely has.)

Why you then need to get you knickers in a twist about something that was clearly marked as nothing other than that is a bit of a mystery.

Still look on the bright side. At least it might have distracted people from creaming their pants over the appointment of our new manager.

OK.  I just think Sherwood has taken enough stick based on factual matters that are there for all to see.  Completely making stuff up to give him a further beating just seems a bit unnecessary to me.

Given his levels of non-performance and disrespectful way he treated the club over his last 3-4 weeks with his interviews and press conferences, we could never stop beating him enough from my point of view.

My only hope for a possible return to Villa Park for him is that it's with a team he's had for more than 3-4 months.

With regards making stuff up, it was a hypothesis, something to be argued / debated, not taken as an assertion of fact.

Or should we really just believe that nothing happened in the dressing room to move from a team doing sort of OK but not great and looking like the new recruits were starting to get game time, to them all being ostracised as performances and results fell through the floor?

Of all the ifs, buts and maybes from Sherwood's brief reign, that's what I'd like to know more about.

the only ifs and buts you need worry about is he kept us in the premier league, when most on here thought all hope had gone, and we were nailed on for the drop
if you don't think he can never be beaten enough after he saved our bacon last term then you best crack on with that,

I'm glad hes gone, i'm glad we have Garde, but I wont forget as twatish as he ended up we owe Sherwood

The obvious counter argument there is that yes, he kept us up, but if he did it, then there must have been many others who could have, given what an absolute pigs ear he's made of everything else, and if he'd gone with a modicum of dignity I'd probably agree with you.

As it is, we owe him nothing. He took on a job, did that job and he was compensated for it. He's now put us in a position where we're a national joke on the pitch and that's before you get to tainting any goodwill with his self preservation bollocks from Leicester on.
I said at the time that he'd lost sight of the fact that the game's about the club and the players, not the manager but for him , as soon as it started going wrong he oscilated between "nothing to do with me gov" and "oh woe is poor little me, I couldn't buy the overpriced tat I wanted."

SGT on the other hand, we owe to this day, because he turned an entire disfunctional club around and saved us from God knows what.

Tim, you can file along with any of the other "relegation fire fighter" who can rabble rouse for a few months, but for God's sake don't ask them to think.

if you go back and look at the state we were in at the time, look at the posts including your own about how bleak everything was, the absolute despairing shit hole we were camped in

and now you say there were probably 'many' others who could have got us out of it

I think I will leave it there as someone else has pointed out you are obviously someone who just makes stuff up as you go along to suit your own interests,
I'm not keen on debating things with people who just  brush the facts aside as if they never happened

[Dave]

Hopefully Garde will be a great success, but he is undoubtedly a gamble.

As has been said a few times there isn't any manager that we could have hired that wouldn't be a gamble of sorts.

[Chico Hamilton III]

Butch is on Sky now with Gerry Francis. What a pair of freaks. Butch talking about what a professional outfit we are behind the scenes but saying we need to spend more money. Dunno what Francis is saying, every time the camera pans to him I think of Billy the Fish and start laughing.   

[Archbishop Herbert Cockthrottle]

Alan Brazil says can only see two losses

For some inexpicable reason, I can only see the name of the 1980-1981 First Division Champions: Aston Villa.

*smirk*

[Dave]

and now you say there were probably 'many' others who could have got us out of it

The consensus immediately prior to Lambert getting the chop was the manager was the problem, that the players were good enough to be better than they were showing and that pretty much anybody would do a better job. Somebody new came in and took us from 18th to 17th. Which needed to be done, but let's not dress it up as some sort of miracle.

I think I will leave it there as someone else has pointed out you are obviously someone who just makes stuff up as you go along to suit your own interests

Less of that please John.

[themossman]

See, I don't think your views are mutually exclusive. It's disingenuous to say anyone could have kept us up last season (or for that matter got us to the cup final). I think we needed a certain kind of manager, one who was very different from Lambert and could get an instant reaction from the players. For me Tim was as good as anyone around for that job. It's in the realms of the unknowable but I also suspect a better long term manager trying to address some of the bigger issues might have failed at the immediate task of keeping us in the league. It's also unfair to point at results like Southampton when we are already safe and focused on a cup final.

That all said, he was clearly not up the demands of a proper managerial role with all the complexities of squad management and transfers and I'm glad he's gone.

[damon loves JT]

Can't believe how carried away people are getting about this appointment and one interview where he speaks reasonable English and makes some pretty straightforward sensible comments.

I desperately want him to be a success and hopefully he will be.  But really his CV offers little more than Garry Monks or Brendan Rogers (and in an inferior league) who people didn't want to touch with a barge-pole.  Let's hope he's the new Wenger, Klopp of Pep, but it's probably a bit premature to be creaming your crackers about this appointment right now.

Don't worry the honeymoon period will be short lived

That's the spirit!

[Vegas]

[quote author=Chico Hamilton III link=topic=54969.msg2951457#msg2951457 date=1446631953Dunno what Francis is saying, every time the camera pans to him I think of Billy the Fish and start laughing.
[/quote]

I had never spotted that before, but it's bloody genius. I'm laughing without being able to see him.

[Dave]

I think we needed a certain kind of manager, one who was very different from Lambert and could get an instant reaction from the players. For me Tim was as good as anyone around for that job. It's in the realms of the unknowable but I also suspect a better long term manager trying to address some of the bigger issues might have failed at the immediate task of keeping us in the league. It's also unfair to point at results like Southampton when we are already safe and focused on a cup final.

When we played Southampton we weren't safe from relegation. If the excuse is that our minds were on the cup final, then it's yet more evidence of bad management. They shouldn't have been when it was still possible for us to go down. And yes, another manager might not have got the win against Everton or the win against Spurs. But then they might have managed to not pick an awful team to surrender at home to Burnley or have been one of only three managers to be beaten by a John Carver side.

And if we needed a certain type of manager to get us clear from relegation and that person wasn't Remi Garde last season why is it Remi Garde now (not necessarily in your mind, you may think that it shouldn't be him now - but in the opinion of the people employing them both)?

[Monty]

I think we needed a certain kind of manager, one who was very different from Lambert and could get an instant reaction from the players. For me Tim was as good as anyone around for that job. It's in the realms of the unknowable but I also suspect a better long term manager trying to address some of the bigger issues might have failed at the immediate task of keeping us in the league. It's also unfair to point at results like Southampton when we are already safe and focused on a cup final.

When we played Southampton we weren't safe from relegation. If the excuse is that our minds were on the cup final, then it's yet more evidence of bad management. They shouldn't have been when it was still possible for us to go down. And yes, another manager might not have got the win against Everton or the win against Spurs. But then they might have managed to not pick an awful team to surrender at home to Burnley or have been one of only three managers to be beaten by a John Carver side.

And if we needed a certain type of manager to get us clear from relegation and that person wasn't Remi Garde last season why is it Remi Garde now (not necessarily in your mind, you may think that it shouldn't be him now - but in the opinion of the people employing them both)?

There's an argument that the Sherwood method did actually work - just get them fucking up for it, tell Benteke he's amazing, and play Grealish (his only genuinely excellent move) - but we still lost more games than we won, so it was a risk. The Sherwood method worked, but perhaps other methods could have too. The players were clearly good enough.