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Author Topic: How would you feel....  (Read 170031 times)

Offline Monty

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Re: How would you feel....
« Reply #1110 on: January 16, 2014, 01:57:34 PM »
Again, a fairly astonishing case of aiming for the point and not even getting close. I know that midtable is the best we can do this season. It's not a brilliant time for the club in terms of the money available and the strength (and just quantity) of rivals for the top positions, so I'm fine with us not competing that much at the moment.

The problem is the sense of hopelessness, and this is because of the style of football on offer at VP. So we're not going to win the league, we know this - then what precisely is the point of us if we're also going to be unfathomably boring? It's not just that we're annoyed at results, it's that the team is so supine and devoid of skill or invention, so unable to do anything entertaining and just so monotonously bog-standard.

We can cope with not challenging for the top four positions, it's the tough truth of football and that's all there is. However, there really is no need to go about being so middling in such a nihilistically stodgy. It starts to feel a little pointless, and therein lies the frustration.

Offline not3bad

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Re: How would you feel....
« Reply #1111 on: January 16, 2014, 02:08:03 PM »
The problem is the sense of hopelessness, and this is because of the style of football on offer at VP. So we're not going to win the league, we know this - then what precisely is the point of us if we're also going to be unfathomably boring?

I'm hoping that the signing of the "No. 10" Lambert admits we need will improve things here.

Offline Monty

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Re: How would you feel....
« Reply #1112 on: January 16, 2014, 02:17:08 PM »
The problem is the sense of hopelessness, and this is because of the style of football on offer at VP. So we're not going to win the league, we know this - then what precisely is the point of us if we're also going to be unfathomably boring?

I'm hoping that the signing of the "No. 10" Lambert admits we need will improve things here.

See the Grant Holt thread for more details, but I think that there's only so much a number 10 can do if the ball keeps flying over his head.

Offline not3bad

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Re: How would you feel....
« Reply #1113 on: January 16, 2014, 02:21:24 PM »
I think the No 10 will be for the times we've seen plenty of this season where the midfield puts a string of sideways passes to each other before giving the ball back to the keeper because the opposition have packed their defence.  Something we've often seen at home.  The keeper then hoofs it.  If there is a midfielder that can create something in those moments then there will hopefully be less flying over of the heads.

Offline Monty

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Re: How would you feel....
« Reply #1114 on: January 16, 2014, 02:23:21 PM »
That's my argument though. If that's what we were doing, like Swansea, then the extra edge would solve all our problems. However, the real problem is that nobody moves on the pitch at all and that, far from having lots of inconsequential possession, we have the second-lowest possession average in the league. One player can't change that.

Offline not3bad

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Re: How would you feel....
« Reply #1115 on: January 16, 2014, 02:33:26 PM »
No, but one player can raise the quality and confidence of the others.  Matt Lowton, Ashley Westwood and Fabian Delph are not hoofers.  Besides which you can only raise the quality of a side one player at a time. So every step in the right direction is a step in the right direction.

Offline Monty

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Re: How would you feel....
« Reply #1116 on: January 16, 2014, 02:38:32 PM »
No, but one player can raise the quality and confidence of the others.  Matt Lowton, Ashley Westwood and Fabian Delph are not hoofers.  Besides which you can only raise the quality of a side one player at a time. So every step in the right direction is a step in the right direction.

Yep that's fair enough, but it seems to me a little like rearranging deckchairs on the Titanic. There is not a passing mentality in the side, and they have to do it as a team and completely as a team. They're not used to moving off the ball and they don't look like they practice it much. I really, really want to believe that Lambert is the man to bring these players together and get them passing and moving but, frankly, after 18 months of him getting his players to play his football, that particular aspect is just getting worse and worse.

Online Meanwood Villa

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Re: How would you feel....
« Reply #1117 on: January 16, 2014, 02:40:05 PM »
I've thought a few times this season about the level of expectations. The standard view on here seems to be that people are aware that mid-table is the best to hope for and that there will be ups and downs while we try to build something. Possibly a cup run, well, never mind. But on the league position everyone seems to broadly agree that 8th-12th will be job done this season.
What we are actually seeing is a marginal improvement in results, home form that would see us relegated, away form that would see us in the CL but the over-riding feeling is one of pessimism. This is mainly because for the majority of the season we have looked an incredibly poor team. I've only been a few times this season and I watch when we're on TV so haven't seen that many games but I certainly haven't seen us play well. In fact the last match I attended in person was Swansea at home which despite not losing was perhaps one of the most uninspiring and depressing performances I've seen. Enough to put me off going since.
Anyway, the point I want to raise is that given we all seem to accept we're an 8th-12th team is it really realistic to expect us to be any good? I know there's a lot of the season to go and things can get worse, they could also get better of course, but right now we're hitting the expected target of most people on the site (cup runs aside) Maybe it's the case that teams who finish 8th-12th in the table are crap and that's what we're seeing. Last season 8-12 was taken up in order by West Brom, Swansea, West Ham, Norwich, Fulham. Were any of these teams last season actually any better than we are now? Surely the fact that a team finishes halfway down a league table signifies that they're not very good? Can we really expect the fight, spirit, competency that people want to see without actually being a significantly better team and therefore in line to finish much higher in the table which we accept we can't achieve? It's a depressing prospect but if what we are is a mid table team then what we're seeing is how a mid table team play. Shit, isn't it?

Offline Dribbler

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Re: How would you feel....
« Reply #1118 on: January 16, 2014, 05:29:36 PM »
Anyway, the point I want to raise is that given we all seem to accept we're an 8th-12th team is it really realistic to expect us to be any good? I know there's a lot of the season to go and things can get worse, they could also get better of course, but right now we're hitting the expected target of most people on the site (cup runs aside) Maybe it's the case that teams who finish 8th-12th in the table are crap and that's what we're seeing.

Last season 8-12 was taken up in order by West Brom, Swansea, West Ham, Norwich, Fulham. Were any of these teams last season actually any better than we are now? Surely the fact that a team finishes halfway down a league table signifies that they're not very good? Can we really expect the fight, spirit, competency that people want to see without actually being a significantly better team and therefore in line to finish much higher in the table which we accept we can't achieve? It's a depressing prospect but if what we are is a mid table team then what we're seeing is how a mid table team play. Shit, isn't it?

Well it depends on what you mean by good? There isn't always a correlation between 'good football' and 'good results'. There are teams that have finished below us or around us playing much better football, but that obviously hasn't translated into results. I think we've been unlucky at Villa as supporters that we've rarely had both good football and good results. Under Mon we had good results, but the football was for the most part pretty poor (IMO), since then we've had poor football and poor results.

I think the frustration then at the moment is that after some very poor results last season, at least our football at times was looking up, and we played some exciting and good football, albeit still far too reliant on counter attacking. This season then people were hoping/expecting for relative mid-table mediocrity in terms of results, but that our performances would be getting better. We have however seen some of the most dismal performances ever even if the results are ever so slightly better than the mediocrity we served up for the majority of last season.
« Last Edit: January 16, 2014, 06:19:17 PM by Dribbler »

Offline eastie

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Re: How would you feel....
« Reply #1119 on: January 17, 2014, 08:16:36 AM »
Quote from:  the mirror

By Robbie Savage | 16/01/14 

What I’m about to say won't go down well with Aston Villa fans but, after watching yet another home defeat, against Arsenal on Monday, I fear Paul Lambert is running out of excuses about his team being young and ­inexperienced.

As a manager, I have the highest regard for Lambert. He worked miracles at Norwich and I like his energy on the touchline. The man is a class act.

He will be aware, though, of the growing anxiety among Villa supporters on phone-in lines and forums, who are increasingly fed up with his stock line about a young side still maturing.

Yes, it was unfortunate that Lambert had to change his formation when Nathan Baker was carried off with concussion, but there was enough experience on that pitch for Villa to give anybody a game.

Ron Vlaar, who defended well, Gabriel Agbonlahor, Karim El-Ahmadi and Brad Guzan have all got miles on the clock.

Villa fans don’t want to hear how young their team is any more – they want to hear how good they are.

In all honesty, Villa barely laid a glove on Arsenal. They had a real go in the last 15 minutes, after Christian Benteke pulled it back to 2-1, but they didn’t really create anything.

Lambert reckons they played well in the second half, but if that had been Stoke pumping long balls into the box, they would have been slaughtered for being so direct.

My biggest worry about Villa is their lack of creativity in midfield.

Ashley Westwood is neat and keeps the ball well, but Fabian Delph – who deserved an England call-up last year – has been hit-and-miss this season. I fear international recognition has passed him by.

And El-Ahmadi is busy, but there is little sign of him playing a killer pass and that lack of invention is worrying. I’m not sure that bringing Grant Holt in on loan from Wigan is ­necessarily the answer.

Obviously, Lambert got the best out of Holt when they worked together at Norwich, and I’m a big fan of players who work their way up through the leagues - as Holt did, from being a tyre-fitter in Workington to a Premier League striker.

But his arrival suggests Villa’s style will probably go even more direct – and it’s a leap of faith for Lambert to pin his hopes on a striker who has scored twice in the Championship this season and whose last goal was in August.

 

The way things are going in this transfer window, if Holt can get a move to Villa, then I could sign for Real Madrid before the end of January!

Seriously, though, it’s a great ­opportunity for Holt and I don’t blame him one moment for hooking up with Lambert again.

But, last season, I tipped Villa to go down and had to take mountainous portions of humble pie when they proved me wrong and finished five points clear of trouble.

This time, it could work the other way – after tipping them to be comfortable in mid-table, they could go down.

One way or another, they are bang in the middle of a relegation dogfight.

Villa’s home record – seven defeats and only eight goals in 11 games – is shocking, especially when you throw in the FA Cup third-round shock against Sheffield United.

For such a great club, with its tradition, fan base and heritage, Villa should be competing with Everton, Newcastle and Spurs for a place in Europe, or aiming for a top-half finish at the least.

It gives me no pleasure to see them struggling, but, sooner or later, Lambert will have to dispense with the excuses and deal with the facts.


Offline dekko

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Re: How would you feel....
« Reply #1120 on: January 17, 2014, 09:12:31 AM »
Well, he aint wrong, but its nothing we haven't heard before (or figured out for ourselves)

Offline Ads

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Re: How would you feel....
« Reply #1121 on: January 17, 2014, 09:17:09 AM »
Are we bang in the middle of a relegation fight? We kind of look on the periphery to me.

And no post on Savage should let slip the opportunity to call him an irksome Bluenose c***.

Online Clampy

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Re: How would you feel....
« Reply #1122 on: January 17, 2014, 10:09:27 AM »
I saw the author of the article and couldn't be bothered to read it to be honest.

Offline sirlordbaltimore

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Re: How would you feel....
« Reply #1123 on: January 17, 2014, 10:24:52 AM »

It's a sad day when Lily Savage writes a piece on your club which you can't but help to agree with. Spot on

Offline Dribbler

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Re: How would you feel....
« Reply #1124 on: January 17, 2014, 11:09:45 AM »
Are we bang in the middle of a relegation fight? We kind of look on the periphery to me.

Well i'd say that any club that is within 2 games (5-6 points) of dropping into a relegation spot is in danger of relegation. At the moment there are 5 points separating 10th from 20th, 6 points separating 10th from 18th, so all of those clubs are in the mix for relegation. At the moment it doesn't look like anyone is going to pull away from that group or that the bottom 3 are going to become isolated so i think it's going to be tight for a lot of clubs near the end of the season.

 


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