Brigada Corner

[TheSandman]

And if the supermarket turns a blind eye, every week, to customers slipping chocolate bars into their pockets but then singles out one specific group on one occasion who do, isn't that total bollox and no pretty basic logic at all?

Which I imagine is why some people suspect that there is more to this than merely persistent standing? As Dave says, the club have treated fans well so it seems odd that they would do something like this in such an arbitrary fashion.

[dave.woodhall]

I'm relatively new to this site so forgive my ignorance but is there some history between H&V and Brigada ?? Seems very political / defensive / aggressive ?? Or am I wrong ?

We have done nothing but support them since they began - including throughout this thread.

[paul_e]

Have you been in L8 lately or is it just what you have heard?

Why do I need to go in there?

I've explained far more times than I should have to why I don't think you can complain about the club in this.  I'm sure in the section they're having great fun, but it's irrelevant to the point I'm making.

And if the supermarket turns a blind eye, every week, to customers slipping chocolate bars into their pockets but then singles out one specific group on one occasion who do, isn't that total bollox and no pretty basic logic at all?

If you've gone in and told them you're going to steal it and then do you' will get punished, if you steal it and hope no one notices you might get away with it, that's pretty much the point, if you're going to break rules you don't advertise the fact and you certainly don't then get all incredulous because you're being punished over it.

Simple situation, someone at the council whose job is to monitor the adherence to rules at public venues goes on the Brigada site.  When his sight returns and he cleans up the blood he asks to review CCTV footage of the section they stand in from a few games.  After watching he informs the club they either deal with it or the section is closed.  Is the club in the wrong to eject those people if they refuse to sit down?  Or would it be better to have part of the holte end closed over safety concerns and force anyone else sitting there to move to other areas of the ground.

[frankmosswasmyuncle]

I appreciate you explaining it to me so eloquently, Doorbell.
Until now I thought I we all had an understanding of logic ( involving a large slice of personal opinion of what that logic is).
I now understand that only one other poster knows what logic is and the rest of us are clearly fu**ing clueless.
If only you'd told me this years ago. ;-)

[silhillvilla]

I'm relatively new to this site so forgive my ignorance but is there some history between H&V and Brigada ?? Seems very political / defensive / aggressive ?? Or am I wrong ?

We have done nothing but support them since they began - including throughout this thread.

Thanks for clarifying.

[bertlambshank]

I spent 2 of the cup games in L8 last season,harmless fun is the best to describe it.Just some young lads getting behind our team.

And girls.
When Brigada were in the lower north there were always a couple of girls in amongst it singing their hearts out. Banning this lot is a real shame.

Some on here would them hanging by the neck.

Who would they be then?

Go back a bit in the thread.

[Doorbell]

I appreciate you explaining it to me so eloquently, Doorbell.
Until now I thought I we all had an understanding of logic ( involving a large slice of personal opinion of what that logic is).
I now understand that only one other poster knows what logic is and the rest of us are clearly fu**ing clueless.
If only you'd told me this years ago. ;-)

Glad to be of assistance.

[frankmosswasmyuncle]

So at some time in the (near) future the police will tell us why.(?)
In the meantime we all have no idea what it is what we're not allowed to do!?
To give them time to make something up?
The rules should be applied across the board, to all present at the venue, not hidden away so that we are uncertain of what's tolerated, or not, sometimes but not all the time!
An announcement over the PA system to inform/remind all of the rules and possible action is perfectly reasonable and even expected.
But not in this case apparently.
Clearly there was a hidden agenda that the stewards and police were aware of but no-one else? 

Oh come on!
You absolutely know that you are not allowed to stand consistently during the game, to pretend you don't know that is bollocks. You don't need a tannoy announcement to tell you.
I agree that the rule isn't applied consistently or even fairly, but no one picked up on it can really complain that they didn't know they were breaking any rules!

Not trying to be awkward Plumbutt.
We all know we are not allowed to stand, but we all do it, in every ground that I know of.
No one is pretending not to know that. My point is that it goes on all the time and it's never a problem, is tolerated and all seem fine with that.
If it's suddenly going to become an issue then an announcement is only reasonable in my view. To be ejected for something thousands of fans do at every ground, every week, seems a bit harsh.
Making it "public" makes it clear to all at the moment in time rather than suddenly enforcing a rule that nobody seems to have bothered with, on all sides, for years!

[bertlambshank]

Have you been in L8 lately or is it just what you have heard?

Why do I need to go in there?

I've explained far more times than I should have to why I don't think you can complain about the club in this.  I'm sure in the section they're having great fun, but it's irrelevant to the point I'm making.

And if the supermarket turns a blind eye, every week, to customers slipping chocolate bars into their pockets but then singles out one specific group on one occasion who do, isn't that total bollox and no pretty basic logic at all?

If you've gone in and told them you're going to steal it and then do you' will get punished, if you steal it and hope no one notices you might get away with it, that's pretty much the point, if you're going to break rules you don't advertise the fact and you certainly don't then get all incredulous because you're being punished over it.

Simple situation, someone at the council whose job is to monitor the adherence to rules at public venues goes on the Brigada site.  When his sight returns and he cleans up the blood he asks to review CCTV footage of the section they stand in from a few games.  After watching he informs the club they either deal with it or the section is closed.  Is the club in the wrong to eject those people if they refuse to sit down?  Or would it be better to have part of the holte end closed over safety concerns and force anyone else sitting there to move to other areas of the ground.

Next time you plan to get to VP sit in L8,if there is any Brigada left take the time to say hello,you might be surprised by the experience I was.

[MonsXI]

I'm relatively new to this site so forgive my ignorance but is there some history between H&V and Brigada ?? Seems very political / defensive / aggressive ?? Or am I wrong ?

We have done nothing but support them since they began - including throughout this thread.

I can back that up 100% even allowing the lads to write an article for the fanzine

[paul_e]

I absolutely support the idea of Brigada, but I think trying to set it up without full discourse with the club was badly thought out and stating a principle online which is a breech of the rules at the ground is alarmingly naive.  I also think they have the worst website I've seen for years.

I appreciate you explaining it to me so eloquently, Doorbell.
Until now I thought I we all had an understanding of logic ( involving a large slice of personal opinion of what that logic is).
I now understand that only one other poster knows what logic is and the rest of us are clearly fu**ing clueless.
If only you'd told me this years ago. ;-)

right the logic of this:

A creates a rule under guidance from B and C
D forms and wants to ignore said rule and can either inform A, B and C of this or can keep it quiet
D chooses to inform A, b and C that they will ignore said rule
A has the choice to either punish D or accept consequences from B or C
A chooses to punish D

There's no personal opinion to that.

[paul_e]

Next time you plan to get to VP sit in L8,if there is any Brigada left take the time to say hello,you might be surprised by the experience I was.

Unfortunately it won't be this season, it's a bit expensive to get there from where I live.  As I've said though, I have nothing against them either as a group or as individuals, I just take great offense at the suggestion that the club is acting terribly, as premier league clubs go they're one of the best regarding the fans so to see a few people seem so eager to turn on them over this seems wrong.

[frankmosswasmyuncle]

I absolutely support the idea of Brigada, but I think trying to set it up without full discourse with the club was badly thought out and stating a principle online which is a breech of the rules at the ground is alarmingly naive.  I also think they have the worst website I've seen for years.

I appreciate you explaining it to me so eloquently, Doorbell.
Until now I thought I we all had an understanding of logic ( involving a large slice of personal opinion of what that logic is).
I now understand that only one other poster knows what logic is and the rest of us are clearly fu**ing clueless.
If only you'd told me this years ago. ;-)

right the logic of this:

A creates a rule under guidance from B and C
D forms and wants to ignore said rule and can either inform A, B and C of this or can keep it quiet
D chooses to inform A, b and C that they will ignore said rule
A has the choice to either punish D or accept consequences from B or C
A chooses to punish D

There's no personal opinion to that.

So if A ignores the rule it created in the first place but then randomly applies it, that's logic?

[paul_e]

I absolutely support the idea of Brigada, but I think trying to set it up without full discourse with the club was badly thought out and stating a principle online which is a breech of the rules at the ground is alarmingly naive.  I also think they have the worst website I've seen for years.

I appreciate you explaining it to me so eloquently, Doorbell.
Until now I thought I we all had an understanding of logic ( involving a large slice of personal opinion of what that logic is).
I now understand that only one other poster knows what logic is and the rest of us are clearly fu**ing clueless.
If only you'd told me this years ago. ;-)

right the logic of this:

A creates a rule under guidance from B and C
D forms and wants to ignore said rule and can either inform A, B and C of this or can keep it quiet
D chooses to inform A, b and C that they will ignore said rule
A has the choice to either punish D or accept consequences from B or C
A chooses to punish D

There's no personal opinion to that.

So if A ignores the rule it created in the first place but then randomly applies it, that's logic?

If you assume that A, B, C and E (that's every other fan) live in balance that whilst the rule isn't enforced by A if they were told they had to by B and C then E would abide by it.  By D stating that they're not going to abide by the rule they broke that balance.  By acting as they did  A satisfies B and C that it will enforce the rule and the balance is restored.

[TheSandman]

Most people who stand at the ground sit down when they are told, from what I gather Brigada refuse. I imagine the club have even taken steps before doing something so drastic, such as getting in touch with the group. What if requests made through such channels by the club were declined? All this could be going on and in the background the council may have threatened to order that L8 be shut if they don't get Brigada to toe the line.