Randy Lerner

[villa `cross the mersey]

What happened to the pots of cash he was supposed to be spending on the Villa as a result of selling the Browns?

Didn't he have a really expensive divorce?
Maybe the former Mrs. Lerner would like to buy us ?

It would appear that the only thing "going down on him " this year is the Villa

[Ad@m]

He is letting us down badly at the moment, he has less than a week to start rectifying that. It's as simple as that.

I'm positive he will, but it will be to protect his investment not enhance it.

What investment?  The club's pretty much worthless as it stands - he's invested £250m in a team he purchased when it was battling relegation and has managed to get us to the point where we're battling relegation.  His investment has just ended up in the pockets of the overvalued players we've seen on the pitch (or not in the case of lots of MONs signings) over the past 5 years.

The only way Lerner will get anything back for what he's put in is to make us successful.  That's why he argued against some form of FFP rules for the Premier League - if such a thing came in he'd never get his money back.

I think he realises relegation would be bad but I'm not sure he sees it's any worse than running a club at a £50m annual loss as was the case by the end of the MON era.

[leylandalbion]

I got an email from the club thanking me for my support. That's better than any marque signing

[Malandro]

He is letting us down badly at the moment, he has less than a week to start rectifying that. It's as simple as that.

I'm positive he will, but it will be to protect his investment not enhance it.

What investment?  The club's pretty much worthless as it stands - he's invested £250m in a team he purchased when it was battling relegation and has managed to get us to the point where we're battling relegation.  His investment has just ended up in the pockets of the overvalued players we've seen on the pitch (or not in the case of lots of MONs signings) over the past 5 years.

The only way Lerner will get anything back for what he's put in is to make us successful.  That's why he argued against some form of FFP rules for the Premier League - if such a thing came in he'd never get his money back.

I think he realises relegation would be bad but I'm not sure he sees it's any worse than running a club at a £50m annual loss as was the case by the end of the MON era.

His investment in the club.

Do you think he wouldn't get anything back from the sale of Aston Villa?! I'm not saying he's made or lost money (He hasn't actually, until the club is sold)

Its like the housing market. I may have spent 'x' on renovating my house, it may be worth less, it may be worth more. It doesn't really matter as I'm staying put. Time will tell.

What do people actually think the club is worth now? (if we stay in the same league)


- What I'm trying to say (badly) is that he is probably willing to spend some money, because the club is worth far more in this league than out

[Jon Crofts]

In the grand scheme of things, the Villa franchise is the pot in which he pisses, it's a blip on his balance sheet, he's worth over a $Billion, what makes you think he gives two fucks about something he paid £65 million for, apart from that stupid tattoo?  Invested £250 million? Write it off, I bet he'll get cashback on it.  He could let this club rot, would it mean anything to him?  He has nobody to answer to but the big man himself.

[Ad@m]

His investment in the club.

Do you think he wouldn't get anything back from the sale of Aston Villa?! I'm not saying he's made or lost money (He hasn't actually, until the club is sold)

Its like the housing market. I may have spent 'x' on renovating my house, it may be worth less, it may be worth more. It doesn't really matter as I'm staying put. Time will tell.

What do people actually think the club is worth now? (if we stay in the same league)

Whilst he hasn't realised any loss until he sells up I think it's pretty clear the club is worth less than when he bought it.

Think about it.  He paid Doug £63m to buy a club with no debt.  Since then he's put c.£200m-£250m - half as equity (ie money he may or may not get back on a sale) and half as debt (money any purchaser would have to cough up as part of a sale).

Whilst there have been some superficial improvements to VP (renovating the Trinity Road Stand, etc) there has been very little long term investment in the infrastructure.  The only things I can think about are the redevelopment of Bodymoor which I don't think cost more than £5m and the renovation of the Holte Pub which can't have cost too much.

The vast majority of the £200m-£250m has therefore gone on player transfer fees, wages, and manager compensation.  The whole idea of a football club is that investment in the playing squad improves the income the club generates but the last set of accounts (to May 2011) showed the club lost a lot of cash over that season.

For him to get his money back a potential purchaser would have to come up with over £300m.  Can you see anyone paying that for a club which is no further on that it was 5 years ago when Randy paid £63m?

I think this proves he's lost money and explains why he stopped throwing money at the club.

[Ad@m]

In the grand scheme of things, the Villa franchise is the pot in which he pisses, it's a blip on his balance sheet, he's worth over a $Billion, what makes you think he gives two fucks about something he paid £65 million for, apart from that stupid tattoo?  Invested £250 million? Write it off, I bet he'll get cashback on it.  He could let this club rot, would it mean anything to him?  He has nobody to answer to but the big man himself.

I know his money is not earned as such but rich people don't get rich by writing off £300m here and there.  My experience is that the richer someone is the tighter they are.  I know someone who used to work in Opus (fancy restaurant in town) which Randy tends to frequent and he told me Randy was one of the tightest people in there when it came to tipping.

Anyway, didn't his divorce cost him half his money?  Wasn't that the catalyst for him selling the Browns?

[Chrisupnorth]

I got an email from the club thanking me for my support. That's better than any marque signing

Don't forget your free flag.

[Jon Crofts]

In the grand scheme of things, the Villa franchise is the pot in which he pisses, it's a blip on his balance sheet, he's worth over a $Billion, what makes you think he gives two fucks about something he paid £65 million for, apart from that stupid tattoo?  Invested £250 million? Write it off, I bet he'll get cashback on it.  He could let this club rot, would it mean anything to him?  He has nobody to answer to but the big man himself.

I know his money is not earned as such but rich people don't get rich by writing off £300m here and there.  My experience is that the richer someone is the tighter they are.  I know someone who used to work in Opus (fancy restaurant in town) which Randy tends to frequent and he told me Randy was one of the tightest people in there when it came to tipping.

Anyway, didn't his divorce cost him half his money?  Wasn't that the catalyst for him selling the Browns?

Doug MkII x 2 then!

The divorce may well have been the catalyst for selling, the similarities are just too horribly, well, similar, as for writing down millions in losses, I think you'd be surprised what rich people, tax accountants & lawyers can get away with, especially if it means he doesn't have to give away to his ex-wife even more money.

[Malandro]

His investment in the club.

Do you think he wouldn't get anything back from the sale of Aston Villa?! I'm not saying he's made or lost money (He hasn't actually, until the club is sold)

Its like the housing market. I may have spent 'x' on renovating my house, it may be worth less, it may be worth more. It doesn't really matter as I'm staying put. Time will tell.

What do people actually think the club is worth now? (if we stay in the same league)

Whilst he hasn't realised any loss until he sells up I think it's pretty clear the club is worth less than when he bought it.

Think about it.  He paid Doug £63m to buy a club with no debt.  Since then he's put c.£200m-£250m - half as equity (ie money he may or may not get back on a sale) and half as debt (money any purchaser would have to cough up as part of a sale).

Whilst there have been some superficial improvements to VP (renovating the Trinity Road Stand, etc) there has been very little long term investment in the infrastructure.  The only things I can think about are the redevelopment of Bodymoor which I don't think cost more than £5m and the renovation of the Holte Pub which can't have cost too much.

The vast majority of the £200m-£250m has therefore gone on player transfer fees, wages, and manager compensation.  The whole idea of a football club is that investment in the playing squad improves the income the club generates but the last set of accounts (to May 2011) showed the club lost a lot of cash over that season.

For him to get his money back a potential purchaser would have to come up with over £300m.  Can you see anyone paying that for a club which is no further on that it was 5 years ago when Randy paid £63m?

I think this proves he's lost money and explains why he stopped throwing money at the club.

But it doesn't mean he will not invest to try and maintain its biggest asset (its league status)

[Zakk Fatt]

To me Villa is priceless, so by my reckoning if Lerner will sell the club for £0.00 which is priceless I promise that I will turn it all around by renaming the Trinity Road, the 'Randy Lerner Tax Deductable Stand' and selling Darren Bent for 8 or 9 million, keeping Lambert on with the realistic objectives of:

1. Staying in the Championship.

2. Pushing for a play off place whilst cutting the collective wage bill to less than 100k a week.

I will of course keep the 8 or so million for Bent to cover my admin fee for conducting the sale of the club.

Please support me in my bid to become the most loved Chairman since Doug.

[Ad@m]

But it doesn't mean he will not invest to try and maintain its biggest asset (its league status)

True enough, but if maintaining that asset costs £54m a year (based on the 2011 accounts) and relegation costs less (I don't know if the numbers work like this) then he might think that relegation is the best way to set the wage level (which is the major issue) at a more appropriate base before having another crack at improving his investment.

[Zakk Fatt]

In a more serious tone I agree with Ad@m, yes if trimming the wage bill is a main objective then we have to go down and then rebuild.

Lambert's plan for the youth to come through fits in with this strategy which is maybe why the club have said that stay up or go down Lambert is safe.

[Malandro]

But it doesn't mean he will not invest to try and maintain its biggest asset (its league status)

True enough, but if maintaining that asset costs £54m a year (based on the 2011 accounts) and relegation costs less (I don't know if the numbers work like this) then he might think that relegation is the best way to set the wage level (which is the major issue) at a more appropriate base before having another crack at improving his investment.

I see what you mean. I wish I had his problem, I'd spunk it all on villa

[mr woo]

It's not what people want to hear Adam, but I think you're right.

Lerner bought the club with the idea of investing £Xmillion every year in order to win the Champions League qualification lottery. At which point, I assume he would have taken his profit and buggered off back to Cleveland with his leg-ink as a souvenir.

Now, for a multitude of reasons, things never quite worked out as the business plan forecast. The recession, his divorce, Man City, MONs mutiny, Houlliers heart, Fergies letter scam, Laursens injury, Phil Dowd, Redknapp going to Spurs, Chelsea sacking Scholari the week before we played them, Moscow and Stokes comeback. I'm sure there were others but you get the point. We had a real go in those 5 years and I still say we were close to cracking it, regardless of who you want to aim your bitterness at now.

So, as with many financial matters, following the boom comes the crunch. The bill. The settler. Lerner has withdrawn his golden tit and kicked Aston Villa into the street to fend for itself. We're back in the same boat we left in 2005, out of shape and wrestling with sharks that are even bigger and hungrier than they were 8 years ago.

So if the question is, does trying and failing make Randy Lerner a bad owner? I don't think theres a simple yes or no to it, but I do know the party is over under him, and crying for more money will achieve nothing in his eyes other than to make us look like spoilt little brats.