Return of O'Neill - divided opinion

[Archbishop Herbert Cockthrottle]

My favourite Villa manager.

Beautiful.

[Rip Van We Go Again]

Sunderland are going to be so fired up by Pubehead for this one.

He'll be desperate to try and help send us down.

[Phil from the upper holte]

O'neill was/is a good man motivator not a lot else, his signing record speaks for itself, he thinks he's Brian Clough. He's the reason were in the shit now, If I were going I would boo the ******, I'd actually sit in the trinity and Boo him and Mcshit

[Risso]

McLeish could do a lot worse than somehow inspire the team to roundly thrash Sunderland.  Can't see it happening, but if it did his credit would go up a bit.

[Rip Van We Go Again]

McLeish could do a lot worse than somehow inspire the team to roundly thrash Sunderland.  Can't see it happening, but if it did his credit would go up a bit.

Agree.
It would give him some credit.

[Somniloquism]

He had scored 3 league goals in 30 odd games the season before we signed him. The 20 goal season was in the Championship.

He'll be 33 later this year. Unless i'm mistaken, only once in his career has he scored more than 5 league goals in a season in our top flight.

I still can't believe we ever signed him.

Sorry, you are correct about the 20 odd but he did get the 14 PL goals the two seasons before.  But I was more comparing with RSC who has only got into double figures once whilst in his 12 seasons in Europe. I agree with you on the signing but he probably paid for his transfer fee as his 5 league goals must have got us a place or two in the league.

Surely the important thing isn't what MFH did at West Ham or what Santa Cruz did at Bayern, but what they did once they moved to their new club?

MFH was dreadful, Santa Cruz was a total success. Hughes identified a player who would fit in well and score goals, O'Neill didn't.

What happened before and after in their careers isn't particularly relevant to their respective merits that season.

What happened before is relevant, because unless managers can see into the future when they make a purchase, then the past record is normally something that should be considered.

MON bought Harewood as 3rd or 4th choice striker and 5 goals in mostly sub appearances wasn't a bad return for that type of player. But as with most of his purchases, he paid over the top for him.

Hughes bought RSC as he had no funds at Blackburn but took the £3.5 mill gamble which paid off for one season. He was essentially the striker equivalent of buying Martin Laursen.

[Somniloquism]

Harewood cost 4m, 27 grand a week wages for 3 years, and over a million quid signing on fee.

He started one league game in those 3 years.

How anyone can think his signing was anything but a huge waste of money is beyond me

He is precisely the type of signing that explains why we are in the shit now.

10 million pounds frittered away. And he was far from the only one.

Wasn't he on loan for almost half his contract which, at any decent club would mean most of his wages being paid for by the other club.

[ktvillan]

O'Neill should have been potted 5 seconds after walking through the door to ask for the funds to buy Marlon Harewood. 

Ha ha.

I know it was horrific at the time, but looking back, days like the day we signed Marlon were utter gold on here.

Up to a point.
I remember it well and it was volte faces ahoy, mere days after people were taking the piss and laughing when it seemed he might join the Blues.
When it became apparent he was coming here, there were a hell of a lot of posters saying how good he was.

That's largely what I was referring to, the volte face thing, plus the slow dawning realisation of what he'd done.

I don't even think it was days, by the way - didn't we get wind of Marlon going to see Wigan in the morning ("ha ha, he's shit and he's chosen Wigan ahead of Blues"), then the next thing we knew, he was turning around and heading for Bodymoor Heath?

At the time, not massively funny, but looking back far more so.

Ah, the bright new era. 

New badge, new Nike kit and the big name new signing modelling it...Marlon Harewood. 
And taking the no.9 shirt, no less.

Looking back, probably the first real indication that Martin wasn't so magic after all.

It was the day I saw through MON as not being the messiah type we hoped he might be.  The usual posters on here were trying to put a positive spin on it and saying give him a chance, but deep down we all knew it was a shit signing and that MON would not be taking us in the direction we'd hoped he would.   Coupled with signing Knight and selling Cahill it finished MON for me and I couldn't wait for him to go. 

[pauliewalnuts]

Harewood cost 4m, 27 grand a week wages for 3 years, and over a million quid signing on fee.

He started one league game in those 3 years.

How anyone can think his signing was anything but a huge waste of money is beyond me

He is precisely the type of signing that explains why we are in the shit now.

10 million pounds frittered away. And he was far from the only one.

Wasn't he on loan for almost half his contract which, at any decent club would mean most of his wages being paid for by the other club.

He had three months at Newcastle and two at Wolves, so nothing like that long, sadly.

[ktvillan]

Fact is all that's is history and MON has no bearing whatsoever on whats happening at Villa now.

So the massive wages we are still paying average/mediocre player like Beye, Heskey, Dunne, Warnock, Collins, and others,  have no bearing on our ongoing limited ability to recruit new players or the need to reduce the wage bill?  Not to mention the huge amounts wasted on players like Sidwell, Shorey, Davies and NRC who barely got a look in.  And that's before you look at the transfer fees as well - 8m for Warnock? 10m for Davies? It's not all O'Neill's fault, but to say he's not to blame for our current predicament at all is ludicrous.

We/he did put some poor to average players on too much money.  But I will defend him on fees given the money recouped on the players that left, meaning his 'net spend' was relatively small and shouldn't be having a longterm effect on the club.

We only recouped any money, profit at least,  on Young,  Milner and Downing.  Admittedly we made 30m but that's only three of his signings.  He wasted far more on dross than we made on those three.   

[Somniloquism]

Harewood cost 4m, 27 grand a week wages for 3 years, and over a million quid signing on fee.

He started one league game in those 3 years.

How anyone can think his signing was anything but a huge waste of money is beyond me

He is precisely the type of signing that explains why we are in the shit now.

10 million pounds frittered away. And he was far from the only one.

Wasn't he on loan for almost half his contract which, at any decent club would mean most of his wages being paid for by the other club.

He had three months at Newcastle and two at Wolves, so nothing like that long, sadly.

Yeah, when I looked it up after posting I realised it was only a 3 month loan at Newcastle and he was "injured" on his return. For some reason I always thought it was for the season, but I suppose once Carroll was up and running they didn't need him anymore.

[pauliewalnuts]

Yeah, when I looked it up after posting I realised it was only a 3 month loan at Newcastle and he was "injured" on his return. For some reason I always thought it was for the season, but I suppose once Carroll was up and running they didn't need him anymore.

I'm pretty sure there was a long spell (may have been after that Spurs game) when MON totally ignored him, wouldn't even let him near the bench. He disappeared so thoroughly from view in that spell, it'd be easy to think he must have been on loan or something.

[Somniloquism]

Yeah, when I looked it up after posting I realised it was only a 3 month loan at Newcastle and he was "injured" on his return. For some reason I always thought it was for the season, but I suppose once Carroll was up and running they didn't need him anymore.

I'm pretty sure there was a long spell (may have been after that Spurs game) when MON totally ignored him, wouldn't even let him near the bench. He disappeared so thoroughly from view in that spell, it'd be easy to think he must have been on loan or something.

I think that was the worst thing from MON. Yes he overspent on players but it was more the fact that he would buy players and then fuck them off to the detriment of the team and the club. Would people be calling Beye a wanker and a c*** if he was allowed to play more. Cueller wasn't played until we needed a right back. We were desperate for a natural Left back but MON cold shouldered Shorey. Even Harewood who was getting a record of 1 in 2 matches for Newcastle on loan wasn't even considered for playing.

[DR PETERS]

McLeish could do a lot worse than somehow inspire the team to roundly thrash Sunderland.  Can't see it happening, but if it did his credit would go up a bit.

It should go something like this:
"The manager in the other dugout left this great football club because the chairman refused to give him any more money and he felt the players he already had, namely most of you, were not good enough. Go and prove him wrong !"

As for some of the other things spouted about O'Neill,  relatively small net spend, yes if you call £85M small ! He was a great motivator ? Really did do much motivating when we were 12 points clear in third, threw away a 2 goal lead at home to Stoke and the wheels came off did he.

I have seen many Villa managers come and go, some of those have made signings which have surprised me, but with almost every O'Neill signing I tried to convince myself as well as anyone else who would listen that their was a good reason for it, I failed on most occasions ! How many of those players chose us over another club ? Not many would be my guess

[DR PETERS]

I think that was the worst thing from MON. Yes he overspent on players but it was more the fact that he would buy players and then fuck them off to the detriment of the team and the club. Would people be calling Beye a wanker and a c*** if he was allowed to play more. Cueller wasn't played until we needed a right back. We were desperate for a natural Left back but MON cold shouldered Shorey. Even Harewood who was getting a record of 1 in 2 matches for Newcastle on loan wasn't even considered for playing.
[/quote]

Could not agree more and I would imagine this is why the money stopped he spent lots of money on players he would even consider for selection and would rather play someone else out of position.

I need to stop reading this thread its making me so angry - lol