How do we change the 'cultural' make up of football crowds?

[KevinGage]

Based on the thread title, I was thinking that we should target Hoorah Henry's coming out of the latest Andrew Lloyd Webber borefest in the West End.  "Come to my Villa for vol au vents!"

Once we've enticed them in, the majestic displays of Ivanhoe and the taste of Balti Pies will hook them for life. I don't think ticket prices would be such an issue with this new demographic either. We can market (and what a wanky word that is when used in conjunction with football) Ivanhoe as a modern day Othello. Afterall, he dies in every performance. Nobody falls like the great Tumbling Bear.

[UsualSuspect]

The grounds of Aston Hall could be used as a runway for lear jets and a big H could be painted in the centre circle

[SteveD]

Another problem is the dearth of Asian or British-Asian footballers at the highest level.

This is I feel the major stumbling block. If we had a local young Asian lad who became a big Villa star it might change. Then give him a couple of years and ManU would tap him up.

Look around you, at any Premier game, and it's white and it's ageing. Not enough kids of any cultural background. Given the spaces in some of the stands, I'd like to see the club at least fill a few blocks with local school parties.

[QBVILLA]

In my opinion it's got nothing to do with colour,race or religion.For those like myself who started following Villa pre Sky TV, the only way we got to see them was actually getting down to the game, which was also affordable.Nowadays (assumption coming up) those who are under 30 were introduced by their Dad's,uncles,neighbours,mates etc.It's technology in my opinion which has had the greatest effect.Sky is a monster that keeps on growing and on top of that it appears everyone has internet access.Very rarely will Villa be playing and there not be an internet stream.Plenty of pubs show the game and for less than the price of a ticket you can have a day out on the lash and still get to watch the football.All seater stadiums have plenty of plus points but i can't be alone in thinking they've made the atmosphere worse.Sitting there in the freezing cold as opposed to a nice warm pub/comfy armchair and saving money is the option.

[Handsworth Wood Villa]

Just seen two different Asians in ManUre shirts 

[olaftab]

I started going to VP on a regular basis in 1971. Start of the second season in the old third division. It never occurred to me that I was not white and people all around me were white. To me they were all 1 colour ..well two...Claret & Blue. I was 13 and I went in secret without telling my Dad as he had banned me from going once he found out that the previous December I had gone to the League Cup semi final match. His reason for this ban was for my safety as skinheads were at large and of course very much involved in football violence. He was right as I had to leg it through Aston park after every game or go and hide in my mate's house in Holte road to get away from a severe beating. Now and than I got caught and got a smack or two but that did not deter me. It was all part of the fun. Once in the Holte End a big fat bloke turned around  when he saw me  and started with "what the fuck are you doing  here paki" and followed with the  most vitriolic  onslaught of profanities  you can imagine. I just moved to another part of HE and watched the game. This sort of thing happened quite often but not as vicious as on that occasion. However I was not going to let some wankers spoil what I loved doing. That being watch the Villa. Football crowds reflect Society so there will always be 10 to 20% who just don't like people because they are different. I would be doing a disservice to the other 80%+ by turning away from VP.
Of course 70's and 80's were bad and this was also the time when the Asian and Black community around VP grew. Almost all household eventually were occupied by them. When I talk to friends and family, who live in Aston and Witton, about Aston Villa all they remember is abuse they got from Villa supporters before and after the game. That therefore deterred them from "joining in" to the football community as they feared the worst and felt that they will not be accepted. In fact some of them were annoyed with me for doing what I was doing!
Things have improved a great deal since than. I see now that supporters, and I mean white, show a great deal of respect to the community.  Years ago walking through Upper Sutton Street etc was embarrassing as Villa supporters  would mouth off something abusive about an Asian household or coloured people walking past  will almost  always get pushed. Now days I have seen fans non abusive, more caring and sometimes stand aside if two or three locals have to walk past them.
However some elements and some people are not changing. A lot of people who consider themselves to be aracist adapt "pack mentality" and either join in or provide indirect encouragement to instances of racist behaviour. About 3 seasons ago we were playing Boro and losing. Mido was subbed and took an awful long time to walk off the pitch. A fellow ST holder about 2 seats away from me in centre Trinity shouted "Get off the pitch you fuckin terrorist" a slight pause followed by "Muslim bastard". Now this attracted a large amount of laughter from those around him which was disappointing and I personally found it hurtful.
 The one thing that would help a great deal is if those fellow supporters who regard themselves as decent non racist people had confronted him rather than providing encouragement by their reaction.
 
The question I ask, Ladies and Gentlemen, is:
Would you guys do the right thing in a similar situation?

[amfy]

I have done but as a female i am less likely to get hit! Having said that, when you challenge someone like that, you often find that a lot of people will join in with you. It often just takes the first person to stand up.

[Steve R]

Most blacks and Asians don't support a local club anyway...

Of those that actually follow football, pretty much all of them will support a team that appears regularly - and most positively - in the corner of their living room.

How local do you want?

The problem the cub has is a bit like trying to get people to forsake social networking sites and go down the pub instead.

[Handsworth Wood Villa]

Most blacks and Asians don't support a local club anyway...

Of those that actually follow football, pretty much all of them will support a team that appears regularly - and most positively - in the corner of their living room.

How local do you want?

The problem the cub has is a bit like trying to get people to forsake social networking sites and go down the pub instead.

Villa, Blues and Albion are shunned in favour of United, Liverpool and Arsenal.

[Lowendbehold]

I started going to VP on a regular basis in 1971. Start of the second season in the old third division. It never occurred to me that I was not white and people all around me were white. To me they were all 1 colour ..well two...Claret & Blue. I was 13 and I went in secret without telling my Dad as he had banned me from going once he found out that the previous December I had gone to the League Cup semi final match. His reason for this ban was for my safety as skinheads were at large and of course very much involved in football violence. He was right as I had to leg it through Aston park after every game or go and hide in my mate's house in Holte road to get away from a severe beating. Now and than I got caught and got a smack or two but that did not deter me. It was all part of the fun. Once in the Holte End a big fat bloke turned around  when he saw me  and started with "what the fuck are you doing  here paki" and followed with the  most vitriolic  onslaught of profanities  you can imagine. I just moved to another part of HE and watched the game. This sort of thing happened quite often but not as vicious as on that occasion. However I was not going to let some wankers spoil what I loved doing. That being watch the Villa. Football crowds reflect Society so there will always be 10 to 20% who just don't like people because they are different. I would be doing a disservice to the other 80%+ by turning away from VP.
Of course 70's and 80's were bad and this was also the time when the Asian and Black community around VP grew. Almost all household eventually were occupied by them. When I talk to friends and family, who live in Aston and Witton, about Aston Villa all they remember is abuse they got from Villa supporters before and after the game. That therefore deterred them from "joining in" to the football community as they feared the worst and felt that they will not be accepted. In fact some of them were annoyed with me for doing what I was doing!
Things have improved a great deal since than. I see now that supporters, and I mean white, show a great deal of respect to the community.  Years ago walking through Upper Sutton Street etc was embarrassing as Villa supporters  would mouth off something abusive about an Asian household or coloured people walking past  will almost  always get pushed. Now days I have seen fans non abusive, more caring and sometimes stand aside if two or three locals have to walk past them.
However some elements and some people are not changing. A lot of people who consider themselves to be aracist adapt "pack mentality" and either join in or provide indirect encouragement to instances of racist behaviour. About 3 seasons ago we were playing Boro and losing. Mido was subbed and took an awful long time to walk off the pitch. A fellow ST holder about 2 seats away from me in centre Trinity shouted "Get off the pitch you fuckin terrorist" a slight pause followed by "Muslim bastard". Now this attracted a large amount of laughter from those around him which was disappointing and I personally found it hurtful.
 The one thing that would help a great deal is if those fellow supporters who regard themselves as decent non racist people had confronted him rather than providing encouragement by their reaction.
 
The question I ask, Ladies and Gentlemen, is:
Would you guys do the right thing in a similar situation?

Thats a great insight, thanks.

What DW said below, about targeting local people is I think the right approach too.  When Villa was at its peak in the 1920s the houses surrounding Villa Park were I suspect occupied exclusively by working class white families. On a Saturday afternoon the men would put on their caps and scarfs and walk to the ground with their sons.  We had attendances of 50,000+.  It's that group we have lost.

Just as we have become a far more tolerant society than we were in the 60's and 70's, so all of those houses are now occupied by an entirely different ethnic mix.  The older generation might be reluctant to come to VP for all the reason given by Aftab235 but the younger generations will have a different call on things.

If we targeted the younger kids in the immediate area, of whatever race and had an area of say the Upper North Stand for them, at a greatly reduced rate, I think we could encourage a lot to come, with or without their parents.  Just as Aftab came.

To all those who would protest at a reduced rate for those kids, I would say we already provide cheap family season tickets in that stand.  £880 for 2 adults and 2 Under 8s, £1,000 for 2 adults and 2 U16's.  We just provide the kids element of that price on a match by match basis.

[Dave Cooper please]

Great post Aftab.
And as much as I like to think I would always do the right thing when hearing or seeing racist abuse, I can also remember occasions when I have been too intimidated to  say anything. Yes it annoys me and makes me feel bad, but I'm not the confrontational type.

[Steve R]

.....

Villa, Blues and Albion are shunned in favour of United, Liverpool and Arsenal.

Which makes United, Liverpool,Arse, Chelsea their local teams, available in the corner of their living room.

[bertlambshank]

I can't remember the I heard anybody being racist at VP,that must be good thing.
The pub on the other hand.

[Villanation]

I started going to VP on a regular basis in 1971. Start of the second season in the old third division. It never occurred to me that I was not white and people all around me were white. To me they were all 1 colour ..well two...Claret & Blue. I was 13 and I went in secret without telling my Dad as he had banned me from going once he found out that the previous December I had gone to the League Cup semi final match. His reason for this ban was for my safety as skinheads were at large and of course very much involved in football violence. He was right as I had to leg it through Aston park after every game or go and hide in my mate's house in Holte road to get away from a severe beating. Now and than I got caught and got a smack or two but that did not deter me. It was all part of the fun. Once in the Holte End a big fat bloke turned around  when he saw me  and started with "what the fuck are you doing  here paki" and followed with the  most vitriolic  onslaught of profanities  you can imagine. I just moved to another part of HE and watched the game. This sort of thing happened quite often but not as vicious as on that occasion. However I was not going to let some wankers spoil what I loved doing. That being watch the Villa. Football crowds reflect Society so there will always be 10 to 20% who just don't like people because they are different. I would be doing a disservice to the other 80%+ by turning away from VP.
Of course 70's and 80's were bad and this was also the time when the Asian and Black community around VP grew. Almost all household eventually were occupied by them. When I talk to friends and family, who live in Aston and Witton, about Aston Villa all they remember is abuse they got from Villa supporters before and after the game. That therefore deterred them from "joining in" to the football community as they feared the worst and felt that they will not be accepted. In fact some of them were annoyed with me for doing what I was doing!
Things have improved a great deal since than. I see now that supporters, and I mean white, show a great deal of respect to the community.  Years ago walking through Upper Sutton Street etc was embarrassing as Villa supporters  would mouth off something abusive about an Asian household or coloured people walking past  will almost  always get pushed. Now days I have seen fans non abusive, more caring and sometimes stand aside if two or three locals have to walk past them.
However some elements and some people are not changing. A lot of people who consider themselves to be aracist adapt "pack mentality" and either join in or provide indirect encouragement to instances of racist behaviour. About 3 seasons ago we were playing Boro and losing. Mido was subbed and took an awful long time to walk off the pitch. A fellow ST holder about 2 seats away from me in centre Trinity shouted "Get off the pitch you fuckin terrorist" a slight pause followed by "Muslim bastard". Now this attracted a large amount of laughter from those around him which was disappointing and I personally found it hurtful.
 The one thing that would help a great deal is if those fellow supporters who regard themselves as decent non racist people had confronted him rather than providing encouragement by their reaction.
 
The question I ask, Ladies and Gentlemen, is:
Would you guys do the right thing in a similar situation?

Well I for one can only apologies for the big fat twat that subjected you to such crap and the bullying you also received by the yob culture......


For me possibly a good idea is to incorporate into the stadia some of the local culture and flavours (no i'm not talking Curry or Rice'n'Peas) from local neighbourhoods a kind of show, they have been doing this kind of thing in the US for donkey's years, because of such a mixed race society and the whole thing has developed into one big family affair, but do we want to go down that road of much hype and razzle dazzle.

Personally I think in order to make this work well you have to have the same kind of national pro active involvement and history  that occurs in Cricket. 

[Handsworth Wood Villa]

.....

Villa, Blues and Albion are shunned in favour of United, Liverpool and Arsenal.

Which makes United, Liverpool,Arse, Chelsea their local teams, available in the corner of their living room.

Makes me sick