The Throstles v Aston Villa Post-Match Thread

[bertlambshank]

He's as mad as a bottle of cake

GM reckons Ashley Young has 'been outstanding' this season.That alone is an act of gross misconduct.

He's as mad as a bottle of cake

[Percy McCarthy]

I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.

Neither can I but you know they've been lying dormant for the past couple of weeks itching to give it another go. He wasn't at the game but somehow he caused our defeat. I find that kind of thinking borderline mental.

So a manager takes over a moderately successful football team and turns it into a shambles. He goes on the sick, leaving the assistant he appointed in charge, and surprise surprise, the football team continues to be a shambles. Who do you blame then?

so what business would you compare football to? When did managing football players or changing tactics in sport, versus people in an or factory become similar occupations?

I'm not here to tell you the garden is rosy. Far from it. I consider this a difficult period in the plan. But I'm certainly not about to claim the sky is falling in either which was absolutely guaranteed to be the position for some as soon as we lost a game.

Fixed.

[Toronto Villa]

I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.

Neither can I but you know they've been lying dormant for the past couple of weeks itching to give it another go. He wasn't at the game but somehow he caused our defeat. I find that kind of thinking borderline mental.

So a manager takes over a moderately successful football team and turns it into a shambles. He goes on the sick, leaving the assistant he appointed in charge, and surprise surprise, the football team continues to be a shambles. Who do you blame then?

so what business would you compare football to? When did managing football players or changing tactics in sport, versus people in an or factory become similar occupations?

I'm not here to tell you the garden is rosy. Far from it. I consider this a difficult period in the plan. But I'm certainly not about to claim the sky is falling in either which was absolutely guaranteed to be the position for some as soon as we lost a game.

Fixed.

yes, nothing like re-writing history to suit your argument. I think you can also find books on what cuddly bloke Hitler was written in 1943 Germany.

[Percy McCarthy]

I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.

Neither can I but you know they've been lying dormant for the past couple of weeks itching to give it another go. He wasn't at the game but somehow he caused our defeat. I find that kind of thinking borderline mental.

So a manager takes over a moderately successful football team and turns it into a shambles. He goes on the sick, leaving the assistant he appointed in charge, and surprise surprise, the football team continues to be a shambles. Who do you blame then?

so what business would you compare football to? When did managing football players or changing tactics in sport, versus people in an or factory become similar occupations?

I'm not here to tell you the garden is rosy. Far from it. I consider this a difficult period in the plan. But I'm certainly not about to claim the sky is falling in either which was absolutely guaranteed to be the position for some as soon as we lost a game.

Fixed.

yes, nothing like re-writing history to suit your argument. I think you can also find books on what cuddly bloke Hitler written in 1943 Germany.

I haven't re-written my argument at all, I just simplified it for you as you seemed to be having trouble understanding the analogy.

[barrysleftfoot]

  Tbh i think a lot of players are going through the motions, knowing/hopeing to be elsewhere next season, and they play like it.

 The worst thing that could have happened to us today was us scoring early.Then too many6 players thought it was over.The 1st half was all us, and if we was 2/3-0 up at h/t it would'nt have flattered us.2nd half we was probably as dominant, but 2 poor goals yet again, and not creating enough chances with the amount of posession yet again.

  JJ, you are right, we are not far away, and to be fair to GH, Bent and Walker have beenexcellant, as i think will be Makoun.

 MM might be right on VT, that some of the players who will be shipped out are destabilising the team.Mind you it is our 1st defeat in 5 games.

 

[Toronto Villa]

I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.

Neither can I but you know they've been lying dormant for the past couple of weeks itching to give it another go. He wasn't at the game but somehow he caused our defeat. I find that kind of thinking borderline mental.

So a manager takes over a moderately successful football team and turns it into a shambles. He goes on the sick, leaving the assistant he appointed in charge, and surprise surprise, the football team continues to be a shambles. Who do you blame then?

so what business would you compare football to? When did managing football players or changing tactics in sport, versus people in an or factory become similar occupations?

I'm not here to tell you the garden is rosy. Far from it. I consider this a difficult period in the plan. But I'm certainly not about to claim the sky is falling in either which was absolutely guaranteed to be the position for some as soon as we lost a game.

Fixed.

yes, nothing like re-writing history to suit your argument. I think you can also find books on what cuddly bloke Hitler written in 1943 Germany.

I haven't re-written my argument at all, I just simplified it for you as you seemed to be having trouble understanding the analogy.

Not having trouble understanding it at all Percy. I'm just not ready to jump into the lifeboat with you. I'm not happy about today, but I don't think today displays close to the end product. Where was this outpouring of anger yesterday? We had the same manager, assistant, coaches and players. Where was the panic then? One game shouldn't change the way people feel about the entire situation.

[pauliewalnuts]

Toronto - "a difficult period in the plan" - isn't that putting it somewhat lightly?

This is year five and in playing terms, we're more or less where we were in 2006, except with a really expensive striker, and having spent a gigantic amount of money.

The anger has been there all season, so it's a little unfair to ask where it was yesterday or the day before. Pick a match thread at random from this season and you'll see the same old problems over and over. The problems have been there the whole time. Today was a reminder that they're *still* there, and it's really not good enough.

[eamonn]

I didn't see much wrong in McAllister's post-match interview on the beeb or in the Pravda article (apart from giving Young and Downing too much credit). The interviewer on the BBC was sucking-up to him if anything - ''a game I thought you dominated'', ''they scored against the run of play'' but in fairness to McAllister he said he thought our passing was too pedestrian and defending was slack for the goals...Houllier isn't usually critical of our play when talking to the media.

If anything though, the fact that he knows what our faults are but isn't able to rectify them suggest he isn't cut-out for an assistant managerial/caretaker position.

[Toronto Villa]

Toronto - "a difficult period in the plan" - isn't that putting it somewhat lightly?

This is year five and in playing terms, we're more or less where we were in 2006, except with a really expensive striker, and having spent a gigantic amount of money.

The anger has been there all season, so it's a little unfair to ask where it was yesterday or the day before. Pick a match thread at random from this season and you'll see the same old problems over and over. The problems have been there the whole time. Today was a reminder that they're *still* there, and it's really not good enough.

And the problems will be there until he can rid the club of the players that cannot do the job. It's all good and well throwing bombs at the manager. But some of the players have simply not done the job.

[Jimbo]

I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.

Neither can I but you know they've been lying dormant for the past couple of weeks itching to give it another go. He wasn't at the game but somehow he caused our defeat. I find that kind of thinking borderline mental.

So a manager takes over a moderately successful business and turns it into a shambles. He goes on the sick, leaving the assistant he appointed in charge, and surprise surprise, the business continues to be a shambles. Who do you blame then?

so what business would you compare football to? When did managing football players or changing tactics in sport, versus people in an or factory become similar occupations?

I'm not here to tell you the garden is rosy. Far from it. I consider this a difficult period in the plan. But I'm certainly not about to claim the sky is falling in either which was absolutely guaranteed to be the position for some as soon as we lost a game.

Now this is the thing, it's not just after losing a game is it? It's after losing many games. It's after losing derby games against our three closest rivals in one season. It's after the Anfield fiasco. It's after the Man City/FA Cup capitulation. It's after playing Young and Gabby out of position again and again. It's after a solid defence has been transformed into one of the worst in the Premier League. It's after Robert Pires. It's after Gary McAllister. It's after performances that are consistently as hapless as they are toothless. It's after watching us try to play a system with players that cannot play that system. It's after watching our players pass the ball back and forth just in front of their own box without going anywhere. It's after being mathematically unsafe with just three games to go before the end of the season. It's after seeing us go from 6th place and two Wembley appearances, to flirting with relegation in less than a year. It's after all this that some of us are saying "wake the fuck up, this isn't working." 

[TopDeck113]

One game shouldn't change the way people feel about the entire situation.

You're right.  That's why some of us have banged on about it for the best part of six months.

Wrong manager, wrong assistant and - looking at how the same mistakes have been replicated over and over again - the wrong coaches.  And I don't care if that includes a playing legend. 

[WikiVilla]

Or indeed his man mangement skills
Criticising players in public is certainly route one to losing player respect, not that it matters now as this seems to have happened months ago

[andyh]

I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.

Neither can I but you know they've been lying dormant for the past couple of weeks itching to give it another go. He wasn't at the game but somehow he caused our defeat. I find that kind of thinking borderline mental.

So a manager takes over a moderately successful football team and turns it into a shambles. He goes on the sick, leaving the assistant he appointed in charge, and surprise surprise, the football team continues to be a shambles. Who do you blame then?

so what business would you compare football to? When did managing football players or changing tactics in sport, versus people in an or factory become similar occupations?

I'm not here to tell you the garden is rosy. Far from it. I consider this a difficult period in the plan. But I'm certainly not about to claim the sky is falling in either which was absolutely guaranteed to be the position for some as soon as we lost a game.

Fixed.

yes, nothing like re-writing history to suit your argument. I think you can also find books on what cuddly bloke Hitler written in 1943 Germany.

I haven't re-written my argument at all, I just simplified it for you as you seemed to be having trouble understanding the analogy.

Not having trouble understanding it at all Percy. I'm just not ready to jump into the lifeboat with you. I'm not happy about today, but I d
on't think today displays close to the end product. Where was this outpouring of anger yesterday? We had the same manager, assistant, coaches and players. Where was the panic then? One game shouldn't change the way people feel about the entire situation.

What today has re-affirmed is what we have all known for months.
The team is lost, floundering, and under performing.
It needs strong leadership, and we do not have it.
I agree that we have taken some steps forward. BUT, for every step forward, we seem to take 3 steps back.
We have no consistency.
If we agree that underneath everything there is a decent team in there, then you have to question why someone can't bring it out.
After all, The Baggies were in dire straits until they brought the right manager, for them.

[Rudy Can't Fail]

It's the accumulation of the season, VT. Today was just the last straw for me. Albion were crap and all 3 points were there for the taking and we just bottled it. You can carry on with your annual defence of the undefendable but the writing is clearly on the wall in big flashing neon letters. It's not a demand to go back to the shite of MON but just because we pass the ball about at the back, it doesn't mean we're moving in the right direction.

[hawkeye]

I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.

Neither can I but you know they've been lying dormant for the past couple of weeks itching to give it another go. He wasn't at the game but somehow he caused our defeat. I find that kind of thinking borderline mental.

So a manager takes over a moderately successful business and turns it into a shambles. He goes on the sick, leaving the assistant he appointed in charge, and surprise surprise, the business continues to be a shambles. Who do you blame then?

so what business would you compare football to? When did managing football players or changing tactics in sport, versus people in an or factory become similar occupations?

I'm not here to tell you the garden is rosy. Far from it. I consider this a difficult period in the plan. But I'm certainly not about to claim the sky is falling in either which was absolutely guaranteed to be the position for some as soon as we lost a game.

Now this is the thing, it's not just after losing a game is it? It's after losing many games. It's after losing derby games against our three closest rivals in one season. It's after the Anfield fiasco. It's after the Man City/FA Cup capitulation. It's after playing Young and Gabby out of position again and again. It's after a solid defence has been transformed into one of the worst in the Premier League. It's after Robert Pires. It's after Gary McAllister. It's after performances that are consistently as hapless as they are toothless. It's after watching us try to play a system with players that cannot play that system. It's after watching our players pass the ball back and forth just in front of their own box without going anywhere. It's after being mathematically unsafe with just three games to go before the end of the season. It's after seeing us go from 6th place and two Wembley appearances, to flirting with relegation in less than a year. It's after all this that some of us are saying "wake the fuck up, this isn't working." 

spot on Jimbo