Sack the Manager?

[ozzjim]

I actually agree to an extend Greg. I think MON had his followers, and is still in contact with them without a doubt, and it splits the camp. Certainly Dunne, Collins, Gabby, Petrov etc are loyal MON henchmen, likely Friedel too. It is impossible for GH to do a good job with the majority still around, but he has to show he can stir a big performance out of them. If ever we needed a season changing display it is up at Goodison in a couple of weeks. I would banish Dunne until the summer, get the back 4 of Walker, Collins, Cuellar, Delph working daily in training at being a unit, work on the first 11 and get a unity in it for that game. And make NRC captain for the remaining games.

A new manager will have the same issues unless he is a big enough name or character to overcome them. Allardyce would get the short term results, but no one would want him long term would they?

[eastie]

Offer big Sam £1m bonus to keep us up and then go and get coyle or moyes in the summer - I think both might be tempted to come here , moyes is at the stage where I think he could do with a new challenge and coyle I'm sure would jump at the villa job if we stay up.

[WikiVilla]

Moyes will not make a sideways move to Villa
He'll be on to bigger / better projects if he ever moves on

Coyle may be gettable

[Phil from the upper holte]

Eastie, if fat Sam came to Villa I would never go again!!

[phantom limb]

Ashley Young - player manager. After all, he does everything else.

[Greg N'Ash]

felt today's result was coming i must say after all that crap last week. just so angry that certain individuals seem to be determined to undermine the manager even if it costs us our premiership status. Wolves couldn't believe their luck playing us with all this crap going on in the background

[eastie]

Phil , we are talking temporary here, 8 games- offer him £1m bonus to keep us up and I'm sure sam would take the bait and we would stay up.

Coyle is gettable I'm sure, but I really think moyes will part with everton this summer and don't see him getting a top 5 job ! We need a manager who can motivate and instill passion and organisation in the players .

[Ian.]

What a terrible week at Villa. After that nonsense during the week the players had to perform today.

I don't know whether we should sack Houllier I'm extremely confused by this whole situation to be honest.
My mind is telling me he is a good manager and will get it right, in time.
My heart is saying he has made too many mistakes like the Liverpool and Man City gaffe and with all the in-house fighting he has too much to do to win back the fans and playing staff. I wouldn't like to be Randy Learner right now.

[KevinGage]

Devils advocate

What could Houllier do ?

It was clear to anyone with eyes that stuff had started to go wrong even before MON left.

Carew had fallen out, Milner said he wanted to leave, NRC had him round the throat it went on and on - there was loads of stuff.

The turning point, and people including me said it at the time was the Cup Final. Casts your mind back, how many people said on here week after week "I am now sick and tired of MON STILL moaning about the ref at Wembley" - from that moment we went downhill , as did the players - Warnock was finished after that game. We had the 7-0 drubbing as well for good measure

McDonald took over, and we were poor (not as poor as now granted) we had a 6-0 drubbing, we had a Stoke collapse as well as others (surrender in Europe !)

Houllier took over, he made and makes mistakes - but we have a transfer window, his hands are tied, he has to work with what hes got

January came, he got Bent - I for one am ecstatic, he got Makoun (I for one am underwhelmed), He got Walker (I for one will be gutted when he is the best RB in the country but unfortunatly in a white shirt ! - more importantly, he shipped out some known trouble makers.

He did what he could in the 31 days he had.

So I just dont know how much you can blame Houllier, it must have been like taking over a club in turmoil.

I say keep him for next season, but with all the public relaton gaffes like Liverpool, Man City, his comments when he joined - I can understand why people want him gone

Doesn't really stand up to rigorous examination, that.  Or any type of examination for that matter.

We were facked after the cup final in Feb yet we took the challenge for 4th into the penultimate week of the season?

7-1 drubbing at Chelsea is confirmation, yet we won three league games on the bounce soon after?

There were things we needed to address squad and tactics wise last summer, I think most would agree on that.

Common consensus was we needed a goalscorer and a genuine CM. If you'd told me last summer that we'd have Darren Bent and Jean Makoun on board (and Stephen Ireland for that matter) nevermind 6th, I'd have fancied us to have a dart at 4th. Even with the loss of Milner. Seeing Tottenham on 49 points going into April -when we had 50+ on the board back in Feb 09- illustrates how open at the top it is this year.

It wasn't in GH's control that the first two of those have only been an option since Jan, it's true.  But this is not a squad that should be even entertaining notions of the drop.

[hawkeye]

We are drinking  in the last chance saloon, there isnt an appointment we can make right now that will save the season and be the right person to take us forward.
So its a question of a Red O Dare type appointment or leaving Houlier to try to get 3 wins from 8 games.
My guess is that RL will stick with Houlier, I cant see how with all of the stuff that has been going on today how he can turn this around. My thoughts before todays game were if we lose this then we are fucked. I havent changed my mind after seeing it.

[ozzjim]

Said to my wife as I left, if we lose today, and I think we will, that we will go down. I am still indecided on Houllier, and was very much for him before today, but genuinely for the first time today I just felt like the players had deserted him completely. Makoun looked really poor yet stayed on, and Gabby came on down the wing when we really needed Heskey for the route 1 option to bully them a bit. Maybe they are just good at closing out sides who try to play a bit and we will have more joy against others, get the wins and all will be jolly, but we lay down today and looked very poor. Definitely moved from keep to would not be gutted if he went, even if I do like him and his ideas on how the game should be played. He is missing he coaches that have helped him to success though, and it is clear he is not a one man band.

[TheSandman]

We are drinking  in the last chance saloon, there isnt an appointment we can make right now that will save the season and be the right person to take us forward.
So its a question of a Red O Dare type appointment or leaving Houlier to try to get 3 wins from 8 games.
My guess is that RL will stick with Houlier, I cant see how with all of the stuff that has been going on today how he can turn this around. My thoughts before todays game were if we lose this then we are fucked. I havent changed my mind after seeing it.

This. Until today I wasn't even countenancing the thought that we might go down. Unless something happens, probably a miracle I don't see us picking up enough points. I was expecting a bit of a disappointing season even before MoN left but nothing in the league of this.

[Irish villain]

Most the players have been a disgrace under both managements this season, why will it be any different if we sack Houllier now for another?

You're right about the players. I mean, we know they care damn all for our club but you'd think they'd have some pride in themselves. Do they not realise their value and their wages will drop substantially if we go down? Maybe that message should be drilled into them to get them to pull their collective fingers out.

[OzVilla]

I just think if he stays we'll get relegated - ofcourse i'm not certain but this just looks like the more likely outcome right now.

This is a team that who whatever reason do not want to play for Houllier and although I agree some players do need to be outed from the Club, the facts are that this appointment hasn't worked on every level possible.

We are now in the invidious position where whatever we do it's a gamble.  My money is on relegation if we do nothing - and it's been that way for a while.

Dreadful appointment that Randy must take responsibility for.

[pauliewalnuts]

Phil , we are talking temporary here, 8 games- offer him £1m bonus to keep us up and I'm sure sam would take the bait and we would stay up.

Offering Sam Allardyce a million pounds to keep us up is right up there with flattening Villa Park and building a Netto there in terms of ways to move the club forward.