Aston Villa v Sunderland Post-Match Thread

[olaftab]

This is bad ...really bad.

I did not want Houlier  however before tonight was of the opinion that we have to give him the season. Not any more.
First half was OK and Heskey  could have had us 2-0 up. Sunderland created nothing. Second half we were shambolic. Forget the sending off  we were abysmal. Petrov, Gabby, well everyone just aimless no direction no desire  no care.
Subs Rene fucking subs when?  60 mins NO 70 min NO 75 mins NO 80 mins NO 85 mins oh finally. FFS we were down to 10. Bring on fresh legs so that we have some energy?

Finally the shambolic sight of Ash Young and Albrighton playing at centre back whilse Dunne , Collins and Cuellar wander about in and around their penalty area  completely void of any  directin any coordination. Players getting in each others way not knowing where they should be playing  and out on the touchline we finally see Rene stand up and stand still. Nothing to  the  team no instructions no motivation.

ASTON VILLA deserves better Randy.

[monkeyboy]

New players is NOT the answer.
Think about it, any foreigners will need time to adapt to our game, and time is one thing we dont have... AND there are no guarantees anyone would actually turn things round for us.
British based players will be overpriced,cossetted and looking for a payday.
And ultimately, who, ANY GOOD, wants to sign for a club in the bottom 3.
No, the squad we have can get us up to at least 17/16/15...get a manager in who can motivate the current pricks to do what is needed. 

this - tragically

[BILL DE VALL]

Just back from VP
GH hasn't got it right
gabby on the left??
Downing on the right???
Ahs in the middle?

It wasn't working yet we stuck with it-until it was too late

Emile had a good game(exept for the miss)
petrov is useless-nothing new there
none of our midfield can head a ball with only NRC any good at tackling(woeful 1st touch)
4 centre backs in defence
Cuellar cannot cross a ball-especially with his left


we need investment

[Lobsterboy]

The manager is getting the flack - and rightly so, in regard to tactics and substitutions (or lack of)

BUT

the players deserve alot of critcism too .

Cuellar - woeful distribution

Petrov - anonymous

Reo Coker - limited

Downing - hid all game - wouldnt take players on 'one on one' but tried to when he had 3 round him

Gabby - dreadful - again. Wasted on the wing , no better centrally

Ash - all over the place( I expected him to take the goal kicks towards the end, he had every other dead ball)

The players need to take their share of the blame too. I am officially concerned. 

And Inspector Clueless must take the blame for playing 4 of the above named out of position...

[adam#1]

For four years we we're effectively Martin O'Neill FC. Everything seemed to be geared towards finding and developing players that suited the Martin O'Neill philosophy of football. It didn't work terribly well when we was in charge and now that he is gone it is a total disaster. It's going to take a total overhaul of the team to put this right.

One of the most depressing aspects of this whole scenario is that, far from diminishing O'Neill's reputation, it will make him even more of a legend in the eyes of the media. The Clough-protoge who took 'little' Aston Villa within ear shot of the Champions League...

But thats what he did. The stats are clear, he took over from a season where we finished 16th and took us to 3 successive 6th finishes involving a battle for 4th place, a cup semi final and a cup final.  The wage bill is managed by the executive board of the club, not the manager so thats not MON's fault.

Houllier meanwhile has pissed off half the players (including now the club captain who quite rightly looked well irritated to be subbed for a 5ft 6in 19 year old who seemed to end up playing half his time in central defence - must be his height and presence), taken the club into the relegation zone for the first time since when? Brian Little 13 years ago? His tactics are strange, the team are bereft of confidence and clearly don't want to play for him.

I'm all for giving managers time in the game to turn things around, but when it is so blatant that the Manager is this bad then its time for the board to man up and realise their mistake. Trouble is we've got Americans who are inexperienced in Association Football and an idiotic 17 year old YTS Chief Executive yes man who thinks its wise to make statements about supporting the manager through until next season after one half decent away performance against a team that Wolves can beat in their following match.

We're going down.

[russon]

Maybe it's because the Liverpool and Man City surrenders are so recent but I didn't think we were that bad tonight, certainly for the first 65 mins, but then started to panic when our MOTM was ordered off. Dunne wasn't at all composed, Collins dodgy too, but we appeared at least competent going forward yet insist on checking back when a cross needs delivering (Downing, Young, Cuellar). Forgive me for stating the bleeding obvious but until we learn to shoot at goal we will not score, can't remember many shots tonight.

Albrighton deserves a regular start but him apart, you can't really argue with the 11 we put out, that's probably our best team for what that's worth. With 10 teams all within 5 points of each other I'm not bricking it just yet but can certainly hear my insides grumbling in the nether region.

[olaftab]

New players is NOT the answer.
Think about it, any foreigners will need time to adapt to our game, and time is one thing we dont have... AND there are no guarantees anyone would actually turn things round for us.
British based players will be overpriced,cossetted and looking for a payday.
And ultimately, who, ANY GOOD, wants to sign for a club in the bottom 3.
No, the squad we have can get us up to at least 17/16/15...get a manager in who can motivate the current pricks to do what is needed. 

I am with you Andy.

[pauliewalnuts]

The players do not want to play for the manager. That is wrong. It shouldn't be like that, but it quite clearly is, and as a result we are in big, big trouble.

Tonight was the night I realised that, actually, it's not going to get any better under GH, the players aren't going to suddenly find the passion under him, it just will not happen. Sometimes it is a case of wrong manager, wrong club, wrong time, and all three seem to have happened at the same time for us.

We genuinely are getting worse. It wasn't just that we were performing badly today, I couldn't even see what we were trying to do.

Clark looked out of his depth.
Collins just swung his leg at the ball every time he got within 5 yards of it.
Dunne seems unable to jump. How many balls flew past him?
Cuellar, after marauding forward in the first half like a(nother) winger, but then infuriatingly passing it back, went to shit in the second half.
Petrov and Reo-Coker were both absolutely rubbish. One (NRC) clearly doesn't care any more, the other is not good enough.
Gabby - I can't really tell what we were trying to do with him out there, but he might as well have been in the fucking stand.
Ashley - worked hard, but he must be getting dispirited, I'd be off if I were him.
Heskey - worked hard, but the miss of the season and then a truly fucking cretinous thing to get sent off.

Sitting there tonight, we looked in many senses like a club in decline. Vast swathes of empty seats, no atmosphere or spirit in the crowd, the team going through the motions but really not caring either, the manager sat impassively watching the game pass by us, the whole place has a horrible feeling of malaise. For those of you who watched on the telly or on the internet, it is difficult to properly convey just how wretched an experience that was.

I still think changing manager at this point is asking for it, and risking an awful lot, but after watching that, I can not see how it can be any worse than persisting with GH and GM.

We're going to have to take the plunge and get shot. If we don't do it now - right now - we'll lose at Sheffield United, lose to Man City (which we're bound to lose) and get beaten at Blues, so he'll go anyway. Better to do it now.

We need leadership somewhere. There is none at all on the pitch, and none from the bench. It needs to come from the very top.

Desperately, desperately depressing.

[Rich6by7]

Just got back. Worst I've been to for some time (although I don't get to go to many).

Negatives:

Selection and tactics were awful. Gabby on the wing? No subs until five minutes before the end? No Albrighton in the starting line up? C'mon Houllier, this is Sunderland at home, not away at the champions. 32,000 in the stands knew we needed to see some passion and commitment long before you troubled the fourth official.

One shot on target is all I remember, from Ash. Not good enough against an industrious, if ordinary, Sunderland team.

Collins, Dunne, Cuellar constantly giving the ball away. Again.

Our captain vanishing, along with Downing.

Positives:

Heskey. Missed sitter and red card notwithstanding, he's shown great commitment and desire.

Shiny badge.

[nicardinho]

I'm not convinced a sacking in the transfer window will be a good move, unless we've already got free agent Martin Jol lined up and ready.

[Fin Feds Dad]

The players do not want to play for the manager. That is wrong. It shouldn't be like that, but it quite clearly is, and as a result we are in big, big trouble.

Tonight was the night I realised that, actually, it's not going to get any better under GH, the players aren't going to suddenly find the passion under him, it just will not happen. Sometimes it is a case of wrong manager, wrong club, wrong time, and all three seem to have happened at the same time for us.

We genuinely are getting worse. It wasn't just that we were performing badly today, I couldn't even see what we were trying to do.

Clark looked out of his depth.
Collins just swung his leg at the ball every time he got within 5 yards of it.
Dunne seems unable to jump. How many balls flew past him?
Cuellar, after marauding forward in the first half like a(nother) winger, but then infuriatingly passing it back, went to shit in the second half.
Petrov and Reo-Coker were both absolutely rubbish. One (NRC) clearly doesn't care any more, the other is not good enough.
Gabby - I can't really tell what we were trying to do with him out there, but he might as well have been in the fucking stand.
Ashley - worked hard, but he must be getting dispirited, I'd be off if I were him.
Heskey - worked hard, but the miss of the season and then a truly fucking cretinous thing to get sent off.

Sitting there tonight, we looked in many senses like a club in decline. Vast swathes of empty seats, no atmosphere or spirit in the crowd, the team going through the motions but really not caring either, the manager sat impassively watching the game pass by us, the whole place has a horrible feeling of malaise. For those of you who watched on the telly or on the internet, it is difficult to properly convey just how wretched an experience that was.

I still think changing manager at this point is asking for it, and risking an awful lot, but after watching that, I can not see how it can be any worse than persisting with GH and GM.

We're going to have to take the plunge and get shot. If we don't do it now - right now - we'll lose at Sheffield United, lose to Man City (which we're bound to lose) and get beaten at Blues, so he'll go anyway. Better to do it now.

We need leadership somewhere. There is none at all on the pitch, and none from the bench. It needs to come from the very top.

Desperately, desperately depressing.

Nail on head,  Paulie. 

[Jimbo]

Just got back. As insipid a performance as any I have ever seen from us since the Billy McNeill days. Heskey's ban could spell disaster for us (why aren't we buying players?), as we'll badly miss him against the knuckledraggers. That's another certain defeat if the current manager stays with us. He'll definitely have to go then, but it could be too late. Get rid of him immediately. He's a nice bloke and all that, but he's easily been the worst Villa manager since the aforementioned hapless Scot. A disastrous appointment.

[j66acd]

Everyone just calm down a bit.  Everyone is angry and directs it at houllier but sacking him isnt the way forward. If this lot wont play for him, ged needs to get rid and replace them. It looks like im a lone voice but im keeping the faith...

 I agree Matt. You are not alone in the wilderness.

i also agree

You lot are mad, you say that if the players don't want to play for the manager then get rid of them and get some new ones. It would be far easier to get a new manager in who the players want to play for and understand.

[Chris Harte]

After only a few months in the job I see no future for Gerard Houllier. And I say that in the knowledge that he's not had chance to bring his own players in, and that there have been horrendous injury problems as well.

The team was lop-sided tonight, and if a tactical dufus like myself can see that then, boy, are we in the shit. Most of the effective work came through the right side. This was because Gabby on the left wing is not a left-winger! Add to this the fact he put Ashley in the middle, and went one up front.

After Heskey had ruined a great performance by getting sent off and we slipped behind, Houllier throws on two talented, but inexperienced, kids to save the game. Fifteen minutes from time? Ten, maybe? No. These inexperienced kids had three minutes plus stoppage time to save us.

And at the end we had Ashley at centre-half and Dunne, Collins, et al in attack.

I wasn't one of the loons screaming "you'll be sacked in the morning" (a friend of mine had a furious row with someone that did) but I really am struggling to see a positive in all of this.

[Villafirst]

What do you expect when the last main signing was Sept 1st 2009 - Richard Dunne? Yes, we nearly fucked up that deal by leaving it until 5.29pm on August 31st! That was some 16 months ago. There will be no major investment again under RL - he hasn't the balls to speak to the fans and state his intentions - he needs to sell to someone who can take us forward. We are in free fall with no sign of turning it round.