Current media comments towards us

[old man villa fan]

Only history will tell us if the way the club have acted over the manager appointment was the right way or not.  What has happened over the last 5 or 6 weeks will not.

The trouble is today, we want it now and the steady Eddy controlled approach has been consigned to the dustbin.

I have read so much melodramatic rubbish from some on here it is no wonder the press have had a field day on us recently. We reap what we sow.

The number of people that have said, "I respect Randy but ........".  'BUT' - Do you really respect him or is it just hollow words.  Positive and fair criticism is one thing but stereotypical and xenophobic comments are another.

[WALTERS WARRIORS]

Only history will tell us if the way the club have acted over the manager appointment was the right way or not.  What has happened over the last 5 or 6 weeks will not.

The trouble is today, we want it now and the steady Eddy controlled approach has been consigned to the dustbin.

I have read so much melodramatic rubbish from some on here it is no wonder the press have had a field day on us recently. We reap what we sow.

The number of people that have said, "I respect Randy but ........".  'BUT' - Do you really respect him or is it just hollow words.  Positive and fair criticism is one thing but stereotypical and xenophobic comments are another.

Very well stated. We constantly challenge the contempt the way we are treated by the media. But they only have to take a look on this forum and see how we are so negative about almost everything. It really should come as no suprise .......

[Percy McCarthy]

Quality thread, best for ages.

[KevinGage]

That's something I have no doubt about. This media-spun perception that O'Neill quit in a fury because the goalposts moved at the last minute with the Milner deal and subsequent use of the funds... I've never bought that. It was publicly known that City had bid for Milner in May - and that was when it was publicly revealed. They may have signalled their intention or made a bid before then. So, to my mind, O'Neill exactly what the picture was regarding transfers, available funds. My hunch is he still expected to be able to spend despite not selling on those six players identified, and that's what triggered this. We'll (I'll) probably never know for sure but that would be my guess.

Anyway, not long to go now. Roll on Monday and the start of the GH era.

That has been my feelings on the situation as well Merv.

I can imagine it would have hit MON hard to sell players that he had spent a considerable amount on at far reduced fees.  It is almost an admission of failure.

Perhaps there was method in MON's madness of signing players late in transfer windows, knowing that there was insufficient time to sell others.

I just get the feeling that MON's budget for wages of incoming players was going to be the same as that of the players going out with Randy willing to invest more in transfer fees e.g. sell Heskey for, say, £2m and buy somebody for £10m as long as the wages were no more than Heskey's.  This would have left MON in an unusual position that didn't fit his modus operandi.  Perhaps he even tried to call Randys bluff and failed.

I remember reading similar elsewhere.

Can't remember if it was just speculation in a similar thread to this, or from a well placed source. The gist of it was MON fully accepted what he was told in March and then again confirmed in May - but hoped that he could work RL over between then and the end of the window. And that if RL had to side with one from MON and Faulkner it would be MON  everytime.

When RL indicated that he wouldn't be manipulated on this one and the wages issue would still need to be addressed around the weekend of the Valencia game (or soon after), MON felt the writing was on the wall. That combined with a feeling that he couldn't realistically improve on 6th with the progress of Spurs and Man Citeh and -for the sake of his reputation- felt maybe it was better to bail out now rather than at the end of a campaign that might result in his lowest league placing for three years.

He was also faced with the scenario of a number of unhappy players -players he signed- still on the books and obviously not as receptive to his ideas as they might have otherwise been. Luke Young turned down what looked like an attractive move to Liverpool and NRC was apparently quoted as telling Blackburn that he'd rather "sit and wait" as the feeling was something was in the offing at Villa.

[BannedUserIAT]

"Your last little snippet was, with respect, a kop out. If you've got answers to his points, then let's hear them. I'd be really interested to know why we had to sell Milner and why we haven't signed anyone. If there are good reasons then why hasn't anyone bothered to let us know?"

A fair criticism. I removed that portion of the post not to "kop out," but because I think it would go unheeded. Also, I am concerned about saying too much. Let me say this: I think Swain has it right in saying that the board allowed MON too much sway. Right or wrong, this is Randy's way. He hires the people he thinks are best and let's them get on with it; to my mind, MON needed more oversight, but look at how MON reacted when steps in this direction were made!

RE: Milner, I want to be careful. Let me put it this way, no one was more surprised by the comments made by MON in mid-July than the board *and* Milner. To my knowledge, things were NOT in motion prior to those comments. Why they were made? Who knows?

That's my main criticism of Mr Lerner to be honest.  Yes I was a massive critic of O'Neill, but in the final analysis it was Randy signing the cheques and giving O'Neill more or less carte blanche to do what he wanted.  Having said that, for many years under Ellis all we really wanted was an owner prepared to back his manager's judgement to the hilt.

My main worry now is that O'Neill wasted so much money that he's effectively stymied our ambition for good.  Did the alarm bells not start ringing at board level, when having bought defenders like Cuellar, Davies and Shorey, O'Neill then went out and still had to spend millions on Dunne, Collins and Warnock?  Or when we effectively made the 31 year old Heskey our highest paid player, despite him having a less than brilliant reputation?

So, in other words, Randy's damned if he does and damned if he doesn't?
What if Houllier starts getting in some French players that we believe are a little suspect, maybe being paid too much or perhaps not suited to the premiership? Should Randy start questioning Houllier's decisions after the MoN experience? Or should he, once again, put his money where his mouth is and give the manager some faith?

Is it possible to have a chairman that 'kind of' interferes? That 'sort of' questions the manager? That trusts him but 'well, no not really'? And at what point does that little bit of interference become too much? How does Randy go about knocking on Houllier's office door with suggestions that, as the last manager blew wads of dough on utter shit, he'd like to look over any potential players himself rather than put complete trust in the manager and /or his scouting system?

Does he stay at arms length from all of this and get Faulkner to do his dirty work for him (again?) and, should worse come to worse, he can kick one or both to the curb and still maintain respect from the fans.

As I say, he's damned if he does and damned if he doesn't.

[Chris Harte]

So, in other words, Randy's damned if he does and damned if he doesn't?
What if Houllier starts getting in some French players that we believe are a little suspect, maybe being paid too much or perhaps not suited to the premiership? Should Randy start questioning Houllier's decisions after the MoN experience? Or should he, once again, put his money where his mouth is and give the manager some faith?

I'd imagine he'd get some freedom to take chances on French players - as long as its not Mattieu Berson again.

[Neil Hawkes]

I heard us described today as an absolute embarrassment, by a journalist on the radio

An embarassment to who, exactly? I'm not embarrassed by my Club, as I can see the long term goal is still to compete without sacrificing their integrity.

[Hookeysmith]

I started this in regard to the way the media are having a real negative go at the club, the board and even the fans in some quarters.

My biggest concern also is our communication and how we conduct ourselves in the media - I thought we were quiet when we had Phil Mepham on board - but the new guy (whoever he  / she is) is astoundingly quiet. Surely it is their remit to filter information out and to ensure that the club is seen in a good light - even in shit times a good PR man will spin it to be a positive. I am proud that randy keeps a low profile (Especially after Doug who would do anything to get in the press) but it does create a monster with the press so to combat that we need a media / PR man with the skills and knowledge of the process like Max Clifford.
To organise a press conference without a firm employment date was niave at best and incompetent at worst. This is what the media have picked up on and this is what is continuing to hurt us - the same goes with the 2nd in command and support team for GH, even if it took a little longer the whole set up should have been sorted before the press were allowed to know who had turned us down. Lets just get it done so we can all focus on getting the club kick started again - the season is not over (as some would believe) it really has only just begun

Lets get behind our club and stop slagging it off - as to do so only fuels these fuckwits in the press to put us down even further

Pelty

I really appreciate your input and insight into this thread and other aspects of our great club - keep it going

[ktvillan]

I take your point about the timing Pelty -  It certainly made it difficult to even consider Hughes and Hodgson (who would probably have gone to Liverpool anyway) and probably Jol who was close to taking the Fulham job but probably thought it too late to ditch Ajax by the time we were looking.   I'd like to think we at least approached him nonetheless.  And it's worth bearing in mind though that often a big pot of financial compensation has been known to alleviate many a "timing difficulty".

Not in these instances. Money was not the issue for any of them.

I was thinking more about the clubs receiving compensation for losing their manager.

[jembob]

I heard us described today as an absolute embarrassment, by a journalist on the radio

These people will say any old crap to get a response. They love it when fans take the bait and inundate them with complaints and arguments. If nobody took any notice of them, they would just go away.

[jonzy85]

Whilst i appreciate we have had a difficult time since MON left us in the shit i find it amazing how the media have really started to talk about us like we are a pub team.

Terms like, chaos, disgrace, shambles, dont know what they are doing

FFS we are 5th in the league losing 2 out of 5 games

we are above manshitty / Spurs yet the slag us off when we dont even have a manager in place yet

Really fucks me off - maybe if they rely on their info from message boards then maybe i should not be suprised as they can get all the nbegative vibes they want from off here for a start

Maybe its time we all stuck together and stood by the management / board and players and see them through this shit time

I bet MON is laughing his cock off as mission accomplished as far as he must be concnered

Are u taking the piss???

What is said on here dwarfs what the media are saying. They couldn't really give a shit!

Your MON conspiracy theory is getting a bit pathetic now

[dave.woodhall]

Your MON conspiracy theory is getting a bit pathetic now

It's not a conspiracy theory when only one man's involved and it's true.

[pauliewalnuts]

So, in other words, Randy's damned if he does and damned if he doesn't?
What if Houllier starts getting in some French players that we believe are a little suspect, maybe being paid too much or perhaps not suited to the premiership? Should Randy start questioning Houllier's decisions after the MoN experience? Or should he, once again, put his money where his mouth is and give the manager some faith?

Is it possible to have a chairman that 'kind of' interferes? That 'sort of' questions the manager? That trusts him but 'well, no not really'? And at what point does that little bit of interference become too much? How does Randy go about knocking on Houllier's office door with suggestions that, as the last manager blew wads of dough on utter shit, he'd like to look over any potential players himself rather than put complete trust in the manager and /or his scouting system?

Houllier is going to have time to make his mark on the club, and that will involve shaping the squad as he wants it - which is going to mean players moving on and others coming in.

It's naive to think that it is possible to have a chairman who doesn't interfere, because at the end of the day, they were the ones looking after the club's financial health and future. There's always going to be some involvement.

I don't think Randy's interference was on the basis of "you've bought Steve Sidwell, but he's shit, so sell him", rather he'd asked something to be done to work on the wage bill. In that context, he's bound to suggest the manager looks at moving on expensive players he never uses.

Is that interfering? I guess it is, but it is inevitable and it happens at every single PL club, bar possibly one.

[Mac]

Really enjoyed this thread, here's my first post.  It's a biggie.  Sorry


Could the appointment of a new manager been made more smoothly?  From the outside looking in, yes.  But who knows?  The constant calls from fans to know what was going on led to the “premature” appointment of Houllier, without a start date.  It seems silly that this could happen but wasn’t it the club just trying to provide what the fans were clambering for?

Of course, I’m not blaming the fans for wanting to know.  It’s just that sometimes the only thing worse than not getting what you want is getting what you want.

Some have sought to blame the CEO, Paul Faulkner.  “If only we had a ‘football man’ like Steve Stride it would have gone more smoothly.”  Who’s to know? Certainly we never had problems appointing a new manager when he was club secretary.  However, I can’t recall a manager walking out on us and taking his entire backroom staff with him 5 days before the start of the season.  The spiteful timing of Martin O’Neill’s resignation, plus his usual procrastination in the transfer market left the club in an impossible situation.  I seriously doubt Stephen Stride could have handled it any better.

Paul is Randy’s third CEO in 4 years.  I’ve always suspected that Martin O’Neill, in his quest for power at the club fell out with FitzGerald and (I forget what his name was).  Paul was Randy’s simple statement.  “You can’t find fault with this guy, because I know exactly what he’s like.  He’s served me well over previous years and I know what he’s capable of”. I don’t know Paul Faulkner’s job exactly, like I didn’t know Stephen Stride, but Randy’s no fool.  He’s not going to hand over running of the club to someone he doesn’t think is up to it.

Perhaps Paul does lack some of the contacts/friendships that Stephen Stride built up over 20 years – who doesn’t?  But I’m sure he doesn’t lack any of the ability to do the job and criticism of him has been unfair.

The parameters within he and the club have had to work to deliver a new manger have been almost impossible.  Or would people rather have us poach a manager of other clubs and leave them in the mess we were?  It’s a strange way to suddenly behave.  Have we not just held the moral high ground on giving away our shirt sponsorship to a children’s charity for two years?  Villa once again set the standard on how clubs should behave.  It's admiral and to be applauded. We should be proud.

Houllier could well turn out to be an inspired choice.  And it was messy getting to this point.  But we are not “a laughing stock”, we are not “a shambles”, the club is not “in crisis”.  The hyperbole is laughable.  A couple of wins under Gerard and we’ll be back to normal moaning about the manner of the victories and debating who should be in the team!

If I’ve failed to convince you and you’re still looking for someone to blame look no further than Martin O’Neill, the architect of the situation.

[dave.woodhall]

A very succinct summing-up.