Match Ticket Prices

[Phil from the upper holte]

We all clamour for hollywood signings but expect to pay low ST and entrance fees

Cant have one without the other

But where are they? Robbie keane & mcgeady aren't exactly the kind of player to entice me back. If they sign that mcgeady they can forget it completely

[Chris Smith]

Dave makes a distinction between people who can only afford the odd treat and people on pop-star wage.

As you well know I used "pop-star wages" as a throwaway line to indicate people with more disposable income than your average manual worker or (like me) office drone with a big mortgage, but you chose to highlight it because it better suits your strange argument.
 
 As for me going to Tamworth, yes I could forego that to watch Villa more, I could also not go to the pub or the cinema so often, or I could not do cricket in the summer and save that money too, but the fact remains that people like me are having to make a conscious decision about where we spend our spare cash, and the more Villa put up match-day prices, the less we are likely to bother. And if Villa start to lose casual fans because of high match-day prices where does that leave the legacy? Where are the next generation of fans coming from?

Don't we all have to make conscious decisions about how we spend our money? That seems a particularly weak argument. Cost is an an issue of course but other clubs seem to get by on higher prices than us so why do you think these modest rises make it more of an issue for Aston Villa than for them?

[Dave Cooper please]

Cost is an an issue of course but other clubs seem to get by on higher prices than us so why do you think these modest rises make it more of an issue for Aston Villa than for them?

I generally don't concern myself with what other Premier League clubs are doing, all I know is that Villa don't sell out the ground very often and raising match day prices will, in my opinion, see a lot more empty seats this season.
If other clubs are charging more and still getting the punters in then good on them, either they have better fans than us, or a bigger fanbase, or they are providing a better match-day experience that is attracting casual fans.

[remy]

For me and my 2 young sons to attend against wet spam are options are:

Cat 1 - £114
Cat 2 - £84
Cat 3 - £81
Cat 4 - £75
Cat 5 - £61
Cat 6 - £53

I earn the average wage, drink in moderation and supported Villa for 23 years now. I work some Saturdays so getting a season ticket is a non starter. However I try to get to go to as many games as my pocket and time allows.

And yet, this season the price is bordering on ridiculous BUT justified if we had a premium product. And that means to me - champions league level players and fast, attacking, winning football at HOME.

ManUre, Chelski, Arse - I would expect a premium price here.
Man City - Like kids in a sweet shop with their chq book and can sign any
                player and will.
Spuds - Just qualified for the Champions league, won 14 home games
            and scored 40 goals there.

And Villa - Scored 29 goals (lowest in the top 8) and won only a pitiful 8 games at home. Our best player Milner is about to leave and as per the norm there are no new signings on the horizon - yet.

We've improved year on year from the Clueless/Herbert double act which had brought us to our knees in 2006 and now were an established top 6 side for the 3rd consecutive year - of which I am now asked to pay top whack for. The Villa had my money, support and loyalty all this time and now Im being edged out and I dont feel its worth it anymore.

[remy]

Cost is an an issue of course but other clubs seem to get by on higher prices than us so why do you think these modest rises make it more of an issue for Aston Villa than for them?

I generally don't concern myself with what other Premier League clubs are doing, all I know is that Villa don't sell out the ground very often and raising match day prices will, in my opinion, see a lot more empty seats this season.
If other clubs are charging more and still getting the punters in then good on them, either they have better fans than us, or a bigger fanbase, or they are providing a better match-day experience that is attracting casual fans.

 =D>

[Chris Smith]

Cost is an an issue of course but other clubs seem to get by on higher prices than us so why do you think these modest rises make it more of an issue for Aston Villa than for them?

I generally don't concern myself with what other Premier League clubs are doing, all I know is that Villa don't sell out the ground very often and raising match day prices will, in my opinion, see a lot more empty seats this season.
If other clubs are charging more and still getting the punters in then good on them, either they have better fans than us, or a bigger fanbase, or they are providing a better match-day experience that is attracting casual fans.

We don't operate in a vacuum, what other clubs are doing is relevant as we have to try and compete with them which means trying to match their income. These small increases might cause a few to stop going or go less often which is of course a shame on an individual basis but I don't share your pessimism that it is enough to have a significant impact on overall crowds.

Is PL football too expensive? Of course it is. Can Aston Villa opt out of this and still try to compete with Spurs and Everton? Sadly, no.

[Dave Cooper please]

But do Villa, with their much vaunted new sponsorship deal, new corporate facilities, new shirt at £55 a pop every season etc. etc. etc., actually need the - what? - half a million pounds that the rise in ticket prices will generate in a season? It will end up less than that when they have to start flogging the bargains against the less attractive clubs. The amount gained is a drop in the ocean when compared to the Sky cash for instance.

I don't think the rise is warranted and I don't think Villa desperately need the equivalent of half of Heskey's wage to compete with Everton.

[Chris Smith]

But do Villa, with their much vaunted new sponsorship deal, new corporate facilities, new shirt at £55 a pop every season etc. etc. etc., actually need the - what? - half a million pounds that the rise in ticket prices will generate in a season? It will end up less than that when they have to start flogging the bargains against the less attractive clubs. The amount gained is a drop in the ocean when compared to the Sky cash for instance.

I don't think the rise is warranted and I don't think Villa desperately need the equivalent of half of Heskey's wage to compete with Everton.

It's a relatively modest increase but I don't know how much it will generate but if your doomsday predictions are right it will lose us money.

 I still say that we're still better than most other clubs but like everyone else Villa have increased costs to meet year on year before you even talk about transfers and wages.

However, my argument from the start was that I don't think it will have the significant impact that you think it will and as we won't know that for 6-9 months shall we just agree to disagree for now and see what happens?

[pauliewalnuts]

For me and my 2 young sons to attend against wet spam are options are:

Cat 1 - £114
Cat 2 - £84
Cat 3 - £81
Cat 4 - £75
Cat 5 - £61
Cat 6 - £53

I earn the average wage, drink in moderation and supported Villa for 23 years now. I work some Saturdays so getting a season ticket is a non starter. However I try to get to go to as many games as my pocket and time allows.

And yet, this season the price is bordering on ridiculous BUT justified if we had a premium product. And that means to me - champions league level players and fast, attacking, winning football at HOME.

ManUre, Chelski, Arse - I would expect a premium price here.
Man City - Like kids in a sweet shop with their chq book and can sign any
                player and will.
Spurs - Just qualified for the Champions league, won 14 home games
            and scored 40 goals there.

And Villa - Scored 29 goals (lowest in the top 8) and won only a pitiful 8 games at home. Our best player Milner is about to leave and as per the norm there are no new signings on the horizon - yet.

We've improved year on year from the Clueless/Herbert double act which had brought us to our knees in 2006 and now were an established top 6 side for the 3rd consecutive year - of which I am now asked to pay top whack for. The Villa had my money, support and loyalty all this time and now Im being edged out and I dont feel its worth it anymore.

What an excellent, logically explained, well thought-out post.

[TheSandman]

Cost is an an issue of course but other clubs seem to get by on higher prices than us so why do you think these modest rises make it more of an issue for Aston Villa than for them?

I generally don't concern myself with what other Premier League clubs are doing, all I know is that Villa don't sell out the ground very often and raising match day prices will, in my opinion, see a lot more empty seats this season.
If other clubs are charging more and still getting the punters in then good on them, either they have better fans than us, or a bigger fanbase, or they are providing a better match-day experience that is attracting casual fans.

Excellent points.

If you add to that the fact we are based in a not particularly well off city, with employment heavily based in a declining industrial sector and a public sector that will be cut and in a time of recession then people will be less likely to spend big on going to matches.

Compared to Spurs who someone once referred to as the only club where supporters are richer than the players we cannot charge anything like as much.

I understand we are comparatively fair in prices but regardless of this, with the limitations we have, in the current economic climate we will see fewer fans at the ground on match days.

[Ad@m]

I should probably keep out of this because I'm about to be on the "wrong" side, but I love a good underdog battle - that's what being a Villa fan's all about!

First thing's first, I completely agree that football is hugely expensive and the salaries players command are as extreme as it gets.

In terms of football in general, like it or not, all major forms of entertainment set their prices by comparing themselves to other forms of entertainment.  Some examples of other live entertainment I've seen recently or am about to see (and therefore a slightly eclectic selection) include:

England vs Pakistan @ Edgbaston - £60 for a day of "entertainment"
The theatre - c.£30 for a couple of hours
Wales Rally GB - £30 for a couple of hours across a day
Music concert - £20-£40 for a couple of hours

There are loads of examples and they’re just a few, but the thing that jumps out to me is that £30 is about the going rate for a couple of hours of live entertainment.  On that basis, football would seem overpriced but I suspect there are plenty of fans who expect football to be much less.

As for the Villa specifically, we can’t live in a bubble, ignoring what other clubs do.  For those that say, “leave the prices as they are this season – it won’t make that much difference to turnover”, if you apply that theory over several years the gap between our income and that of all clubs around us will just get larger.  The harsh reality if it does is that we’ll become worse and worse comparatively.  Before many seasons, it won’t be Spurs and Man City we’re comparing ourselves to, but West Ham and Blues!  I for one don’t want to be in that situation.

Ultimately success on the pitch is the result of loads of different factors, but the amount of money we have to play with is a massive one.  As Chris says, we just don’t know how much of an impact this increase will have until we’re a good way into the season.

I’m sure someone with a better grasp of economics and statistics would be able to explain how the fact the club segments the market through different ticket categories means the overall impact of price increases will be very low due to the majority of fans just downgrading to the next category if they have to.  If I try it, I’ll turn an already long message into a novel!

[Concrete John]

I understand we are comparatively fair in prices but regardless of this, with the limitations we have, in the current economic climate we will see fewer fans at the ground on match days.

When I hear about the price increase being needed to compete, I do wonder whether the maths bear this out.  For instance:-

Average price of £27 x average attendance of 35,000 x 19 home league games = £17.95m
 
Or

Average price of £30 x average attendance of 32,000 x 19 home league games = £18.24m

My figures are made up, but I think the extra 3,000 at games creating a better atmosphere is worth more than an extra £290,000 to us.

Having said all that, the blokes that run the club aren't fools so probably already know how much the increased pricing will effect attendances and income.

[Risso]

I think that the price elasticity of demand for Villa tickets is the key to all of this.

[Concrete John]

I think that the price elasticity of demand for Villa tickets is the key to all of this.

That's the phrase I couldn't remember - my old Economics tutor would be ashamed of me!

[TimTheVillain]

I think that the price elasticity of demand for Villa tickets is the key to all of this.

How do you view the macro picture though Risso ? ;-)