Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Match Threads & Player Ratings => Topic started by: olaftab on March 17, 2024, 04:05:45 PM
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That seems like a win to me. 3 points clear of Spuds.
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A massive point
And deserved.
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A decent point.
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The big clubs always get the decisions.
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Very useful point. play well enough in the second half. Hopefully get Ramsey back next game. Thought Zaniolo did well when he came on.
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Hahaha! Point taken.
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Made it difficult for ourselves.
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Given everything that's a good point.
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Fuck West Ham.
Defend in numbers at home and then try to sneak it with a bit of basketball at the end.
Embarrassing to play that way in front of your own supporters.
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A point away. I'll take that.
UTV.
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That seems like a win to me. 3 points clear of Spuds.
They've got a game in hand.
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Gotsta love VAR ;D
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That was stressful.
Obviously it would have been great to win but West Ham are no idiots. A point here isn’t a terrible result at all. I’d certainly have taken gaining a point on Spurs this weekend, even if it does mean we might be nervously looking over our shoulder at Man United over the next few weeks.
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We missed McGinn. I have no idea why such an obvious handball at the end took nearly eight minutes to be given but they got it right in the end. Moyes has made a collection of decent West Ham players look massively dull though.
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That'll do.
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Diably man of the match, played excellent, chased back, tackled and tried to make things happen. He gave us some much needed intensity. With no McGinn or Ramsey we needed someone else with spirit.
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If you can't win, don't lose so that's a handy point.
Stupid defensive line up from Emery to start with, we could do with him not making our problems even worse with self inflicted daft decisions. But his subs improved us, and we were the better team second half, and deserved the point.
MOTM - VAR
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Well done Villa. They’re really good at home, I think they’ve only lost twice.
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If Diaby and Zaniolo find some form that could be the difference for us in the run in
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Massive point. We needed. West ham not easy place to go. 1st half awful. Second half deserved point. Diaby was motm
Special shout out to cash. My god what a block. Unbelievable from him. Welk done cashy
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Diaby should've started. Caused them endless issues in the second half and lovely assist.
Zaniolo is so Italian isn't he. Nice finish and then spends the rest of the game trying to get sent off.
Both "goals" were handball. Would've been a travesty to lose it after the second half.
Beat Wolves and this is a very good point. Spurs got West Ham away in two games and they'll certainly struggle with corners and their free kicks if they're whipping them under Vicario's crossbar.
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A brilliant point. Thought we’d get an absolute shoeing today. Well down Villa.
Get some players back now for the Dingles.
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West Ham really are the footballing equivalent of irritable bowel syndrome. Horrible club, horrible manager, vile place, crap stadium, entitled fans. Stay in your lane.
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better second half.
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Still raging at our non penalty award tbh.
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Phew.
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We really only have ourselves to blame for not returning with all 3 points. West Ham were there for the taking but we slept through the first half. Unai's team selections again raise a few questions. Thankfully we didn't get cheated at the end.
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So much time with VAR, then they show a clip that removed all doubt - why not start with that
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Delighted with that point, because we weren’t great again. Brilliant work from Diaby for the goal.
Could be a vital point, but bloody hell we need to up our performance levels. We spend so long being ponderous and lacking purpose. Hopefully the international break gives us a chance to reset a bit. Both disallowed goals are the right decision, but pretty lucky.
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Great point, Villa. I love this Villa team.
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Good point. Emery, stop f**King around with the starting line up.
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Really proud of this squad and the commitment they give.
It’s a very good point but not surprising as we have a fantastic coach.
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Thought as bad as we were in the first half (again looking tired after a European match) we were excellent in the second half, much more dominant and deserved the point in the end.
Now a 3 point gap to Spurs with their loss yesterday. We just have to keep picking up points however they come. Well done Villa.
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Poor first half, good second and all hail VAR which has never been crap.
However, we got away with it today, because in another game, VAR may have made a different call and given the benefit to the attackers. They at least got it right as far as the law stands, but for them to call it right twice is quite something (because they get it wrong so often). For me though, and for the love of McGrath, we really need to start defending set pieces properly. We invited unnecessary pressure by giving away cheap free kicks and corners but by also not dealing with them well enough. Another day at least one of those goals stands and we lose. Lets not put ourselves into that position where we're praying for VAR to save us.
Anyway, good result. Tielemens came into it in the second half after being absent in the first. Our substitutes turned the game. Diaby was good, Digne was a lot tidier at both ends than Moreno and Zaniolo grabbed the goal. Cash was excellent I thought.
Much needed break to recoup and lets hope no one gets injured on the break.
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If you can't win you don't lose. Onwards and upwards and of cource the so called 'Yid Army' can spend two weeks looking at the table.
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A good point, all things considered.
Can someone please suggest to Unai that, for the next game, he should start with his second half lineup? You know, the one he ends up with once he's sorted out the shit-show he creates with his initial selection.
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Good point, particulary without SJM and good to see Zaniolo scoring.
UP THE VILLA
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That was stressful.
Obviously it would have been great to win but West Ham are no idiots. A point here isn’t a terrible result at all. I’d certainly have taken gaining a point on Spurs this weekend, even if it does mean we might be nervously looking over our shoulder at Man United over the next few weeks.
Now supporting Man U in the cup as the distraction and fixture pile up would help with that!
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Much better after the substitutions but still not great.
For the love of Mcgrath can that please be the last we see of Lenglet in a Villa shirt
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A very decent point in the end that almost feels like a win. Really smart finish from Zaniolo.
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Much better after the substitutions but still not great.
For the love of Mcgrath can that please be the last we see of Lenglet in a Villa shirt
That’s a bit harsh. He was poor today, but he’s been decent in the main.
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That was stressful.
Obviously it would have been great to win but West Ham are no idiots. A point here isn’t a terrible result at all. I’d certainly have taken gaining a point on Spurs this weekend, even if it does mean we might be nervously looking over our shoulder at Man United over the next few weeks.
Now supporting Man U in the cup as the distraction and fixture pile up would help with that!
Interesting. I’ve been thinking if they get beat especially convincingly it will knock the stuffing out of them!
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Well that went well! Liverpool equalise!
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Much better after the substitutions but still not great.
For the love of Mcgrath can that please be the last we see of Lenglet in a Villa shirt
That’s a bit harsh. He was poor today, but he’s been decent in the main.
We've conceded a lot of goals with him in the team. He's just poor
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Well that VAR check almost gave me a heart attack. We deserved at least a point but we really have to sort out our set piece defending.
Diaby, Duran and Zaniolo all scoring this week could be huge for the run in. Our bench has looked light on in-form, quality options recently but if those three can keep coming on and making a difference, it will help us a lot.
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Decent point . Cash Diaby Zaniolo all did well when on
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That seems like a win to me. 3 points clear of Spuds.
They've got a game in hand.
It’s v Chelsea they won’t win that.
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If Diaby and Zaniolo find some form that could be the difference for us in the run in
Diaby looked more like his old self, played a lot more direct and purposeful.
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Much improved after the substitutions. Digne is vastly superior to Moreno right now and Diaby should have started too. Nice to see Zaniolo score. Not sure how Tielemans stayed on though.
A hard-earned point.
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Also bollocks to West Ham. They have loads of really talented players but their route to score is generally just borderline try and foul the keeper and bundle in the box.
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A good point, all things considered.
Can someone please suggest to Unai that, for the next game, he should start with his second half lineup? You know, the one he ends up with once he's sorted out the shit-show he creates with his initial selection.
I was amazed Diaby didn't start today.
Maybe it's a bit carrot and stick but we start him endlessly in the Winter when he was miles off form and now he played very well against Ajax and yet can't get in ahead of Rogers today?
Think with Bailey going off the boil a little and away with Jamaica we'll see Diaby in from the start v Wolves. It was a lovely assist.
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Also bollocks to West Ham. They have loads of really talented players but their route to score is generally just borderline try and foul the keeper and bundle in the box.
There's a decent side in there if they ever get rid of that dinosaur Moyes.
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Lenglent, for what he is costing us and who owns him is dreadful. Can’t pass, weak defensively. 5th choice centre back
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Much improved after the substitutions. Digne is vastly superior to Moreno right now and Diaby should have started too. Nice to see Zaniolo score. Not sure how Tielemans stayed on though.
A hard-earned point.
Invisible first half but I thought Tielemans was good second half and started to find pockets between the lines and dictating. That said I was hoping Tim would come on half time to fill the void Youri was leaving.
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FT: West Ham 1-1 Aston Villa
David Moyes asks a few questions of the officials in the middle before Pau Torres offers his opinions on the matter.
The goal was ruled out and the ball certainly seemed to hit the arm of Tomas Soucek. How much he knew about it is another question.
Doesn't matter BBC, doesn't matter.
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Also bollocks to West Ham. They have loads of really talented players but their route to score is generally just borderline try and foul the keeper and bundle in the box.
I was surprised just how poor they were. Far better on paper than the dross Moyes has them playing. Extremely sporting of Unai to give them 45 minutes to make it any kind of contest.
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Good point in the end and it sounded as though we got better as the second half progressed (the finale aside.) We need to make sure we bury the Dingles so deep in two weeks’ time that they wake up surrounded by oil and coal deposits.
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It got lost in the disallowed goal furore but that was a sensational block by Matty Cash from Ward Prowse as looked odds on they'd score from the break.
If we make top 4 by a point you look back to moments like that as that's the commitment required to make CL.
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FT: West Ham 1-1 Aston Villa
David Moyes asks a few questions of the officials in the middle before Pau Torres offers his opinions on the matter.
The goal was ruled out and the ball certainly seemed to hit the arm of Tomas Soucek. How much he knew about it is another question.
Doesn't matter BBC, doesn't matter.
It's just London bias from the BBC. They can fuck off. Clearly hit his arm. He was also lucky not to have got booked for pushing and shoving our players. Douglas Luiz getting booked for getting elbowed in the chest by Kudus? WTF!
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That seems like a win to me. 3 points clear of Spuds.
They've got a game in hand.
It’s v Chelsea they won’t win that.
You had to say it, didn't you?!
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It got lost in the disallowed goal furore but that was a sensational block by Matty Cash from Ward Prowse as looked odds on they'd score from the break.
If we make top 4 by a point you look back to moments like that as that's the commitment required to make CL.
Also got lost but Zaniolo through the ball away when they were given the freekick and already on a yellow.
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It got lost in the disallowed goal furore but that was a sensational block by Matty Cash from Ward Prowse as looked odds on they'd score from the break.
If we make top 4 by a point you look back to moments like that as that's the commitment required to make CL.
I actually shouted 'oh no' when I saw the ball break to them. I thought it was going to get smashed home. Fantastic block by Matty Cash.
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Good result
Really poor first half, well on top in second, do we not know how to defend those WP free kicks. He always gives us shit.
Best performance I have seen from Zaniolo
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I’m reading Sky’s report of the game saying our point was undeserved, what the fuck?!? So having the same shots and shots on goal whilst having 70% of posession as the away team doesn’t count as deserved?!? Fucking wankers
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70 points will do it, don't care how they get it, or against who, but it will get us a CL place....
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Does our "set-piece coach" McPhee ever do any work on defending set pieces, or just attacking from them?
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What I will say regarding both VARs but the second especially. If that was us, I'd be apoplectic. And just imagine the levels of incandescent rage a Hammers fan can reach. Streets of East Lahndan beware. It's also as much the amount of time it took. I saw that come off his arm in real-time.
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Also I like Moreno, he did great last year but my god he’s poor at the moment. Looks frustrated all the time too, so I imagine he’s aware.
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I’m reading Sky’s report of the game saying our point was undeserved, what the fuck?!? So having the same shots and shots on goal whilst having 70% of posession as the away team doesn’t count as deserved?!? Fucking wankers
Probably written by some biased prick from Essex or Kent (so could be either West Ham or ManUre), just ignore it.
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We are severely weakened these days particularly in midfield and some issues in defence so showing some grit to rescue a point is bloody good. Well done to Unai a as and team.
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Well worth our point, lacked a bit of composure in that final third throughout the game, with it we’d have won comfortably. Anyway, useful point as Spuds still 3 pts behind us.
Oh and you can see why with the resources at his disposal West Ham fans are less than impressed with Moyes. That was sub Pulis Stoke level eye bleeding football. The handballing cockney bastards.
Scores on doors for me:
Martinez - 6 - looks decidedly dodgy at the moment in set piece delivery but gets no protection.
Konsa - 6 - got better as it progressed as he was in the centre
Lenglet - 5 - looked a bit out of sorts today,
Lost possession on too many occasions
Torres - 7 - our best defender and I sensed he’s getting sharper as each game goes by.
Moreno - 5 - was ineffectual both backwards and forwards today
Tielemans - 6 - was a bit in and out today some
Lovely touches accompanied by some woeful turnovers of the ball and his stupid foul on Kudus.
Luiz - 6 - seems to be going through a bit of a dip in form at the moment but was very influential in the last 20-30mins
Bailey - 6 - poor for about 60mins then seemed to find his mojo and caused issues for the end of the game
Watkins - 6 - was needing to come wide to gain possession but the usual effort and application
Dhuran - 4 - hmmm back to the drawing board.
Rodgers - 5 - got in some good positions first half with driving runs but final touch or shot were poor
Subs
Cash - 7 - much needed impetus behind Bailey gave us so much more intensity.
Diaby - 8 - a real match change for us and really incisive and another assist
Zaniolo - 7 - cometh the hour, cometh the man!!
Digne - 7 - good balance up and down and so much more of a threat than Moreno currently.
Unai - 7 - could have been more if we’d have maybe committed a bit more first half. Needs to work on some of this defensive set piece play which is worryingly shit.
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A good point, all things considered.
Can someone please suggest to Unai that, for the next game, he should start with his second half lineup? You know, the one he ends up with once he's sorted out the shit-show he creates with his initial selection.
I was amazed Diaby didn't start today.
Maybe it's a bit carrot and stick but we start him endlessly in the Winter when he was miles off form and now he played very well against Ajax and yet can't get in ahead of Rogers today?
Think with Bailey going off the boil a little and away with Jamaica we'll see Diaby in from the start v Wolves. It was a lovely assist.
I'm sure I read somewhere that Bailey isn't involved with Jamaica this time round.
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I’m reading Sky’s report of the game saying our point was undeserved, what the fuck?!? So having the same shots and shots on goal whilst having 70% of posession as the away team doesn’t count as deserved?!? Fucking wankers
London-team goals count double and London-team cheating goals count triple, so we really should be grateful for a point :-[
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Hopefully that's the last we see or Lenglet.
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That second handball was incredibly obvious on the right angle, how it took so long I'll never know.
Battled for it, subs were good, happy for Zaniolo who played well generally (though quite what he was thinking throwing the ball away while on yellow...). Diaby too looked more like his old self, he has to start from now on I think. I like Rogers, but he always seems to want to beat one man too many.
All in all got a point back from last week's disaster which is fine. Bit of a missed opportunity though - really didn't give ourselves the best chance with that line-up, much though I liked the attacking intent.
Absolutely need to beat Wolves now.
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That was a brilliant second half performance. Absolutely brilliant
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Take the point and regroup. Need to win our next two home games and anything from the trip to the Etihad is a bonus.
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I’m reading Sky’s report of the game saying our point was undeserved, what the fuck?!? So having the same shots and shots on goal whilst having 70% of posession as the away team doesn’t count as deserved?!? Fucking wankers
It says we’re undeserving of 3 points and I’d say that’s fair.
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The thing about this game was just to get a result. 1-3 points. Chalk it up because Tottenham are liable to get all Spursy in games like Wolves and Fulham as we saw. And in fact, a point away at the Hammers is a decent result.
If we win our next three home games in the league, it should keep us in the driving seat and keep us well ahead of Utd. Not that we should write anything off but City Away is a banker for the FFP cheats. We're not gonna upset Liverpool or Arsenal I don't think. We won't have the legs to do it. Pick up points in everything else hopefully because Spurs have an awful 3 game run against the top 3 and I think they'll get picked apart.
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Hopefully that's the last we see or Lenglet.
That’s nog fair, he has done a decent job during our defensive injuries run.
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good point that - they have a good home record, we had 4 / 5 first teamer's out today, and i'd prefer the points to the game in hand. some of the criticism is mind boggling given what this manager and squad have done in the last 12 months.
Utd wont catch us. And after watching spurs implode yesterday, more confident than ever we will finish 4th
Happy tonight. UTV
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That seems like a win to me. 3 points clear of Spuds.
They've got a game in hand.
It’s v Chelsea they won’t win that.
Oh why did you go and say that??
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Lenglet didn't play for half a season and as a fifth choice centre half, has been fine and at times, very good. He didn't play well today but you could see some of that was attributable to playing on the right not left. Plus the centre halves all suffered on the ball because there was nobody to pass to first half.
I hate all this 'so and so gave one of the worst performances ever' or 'he should never play again' whenever a player has a poor game.
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Hopefully that's the last we see or Lenglet.
Not unless we’ve gone out and got another centre half.
It’s a squad game and everyone will play their part until the end of the season. The only cover we’ve got is Diego and he’s got legs made out of glass.
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good point that - they have a good home record, we had 4 / 5 first teamer's out today, and i'd prefer the points to the game in hand. some of the criticism is mind boggling given what this manager and squad have done in the last 12 months.
Utd wont catch us. And after watching spurs implode yesterday, more confident than ever we will finish 4th
Happy tonight. UTV
Couldn’t agree more.
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Much better second half after Unai made the changes, West Ham I thought were hanging on for the last 15 minutes yet they could have also nicked it.
West Ham are a boring team to watch and no wonder a lot of West Ham fans are not happy but it gets Moyes results.
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good point that - they have a good home record, we had 4 / 5 first teamer's out today, and i'd prefer the points to the game in hand. some of the criticism is mind boggling given what this manager and squad have done in the last 12 months.
Utd wont catch us. And after watching spurs implode yesterday, more confident than ever we will finish 4th
Happy tonight. UTV
Couldn’t agree more.
Wow an outburst of optimism on here, love it 👏🏻
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A good and deserved point in the end. Not a particularly good performance but we have a heavily depleted team. I didn’t enjoy much of it.
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That seems like a win to me. 3 points clear of Spuds.
They've got a game in hand.
It’s v Chelsea they won’t win that.
You had to say it, didn't you?!
Ooops….sorry. Golden rule never say what you’re thinking when it comes to favoured results.
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We missed McGinn. I have no idea why such an obvious handball at the end took nearly eight minutes to be given but they got it right in the end.
The blatant foul on Konsa was curiously ignored, shirt pulled. Both VAR decisions were correct but I thought we were soft as butter defending both set pieces.
We were fortunate to only be one down at half time. Rotten team selection corrected at half time and as a gutless West Ham team dropped back we owned the ball. Credit all the subs who made a big impression. Real quality assist from Diaby and Zaniolo with the break from midfield to score. Cash will a brilliant goal saving block, Digne was very good too.
Martinez 6 - could have been stronger at set pieces time and lucky to get away with the first VAR goal
Konsa 3 - appalling as always at right back, not great at centre back either, Cash saved his blushes after Kuddus destroyed him on that break
Lenglet 4 - poor but can blame Emery as he's only a RCB in an emergency. Right foot only for standing on and WHU clearly targeted him
Torres 4 - appalling first half and at fault for their goal. Playmaking skills to the fore in second half but one time he was ran at he couldn't cope, Moreno coming to the rescue. We missed Mings badly today
Moreno 5 - shite first half like everyone but maybe a bit harsh he was hooked early as he had improved
Luiz 7 - not sure if he broke sweat in the first half but dominated midfield in second. Gone a bit lazy with his tackling, gave away free kick at end
Tielemans 6 - genuine impression of a garden gnome in first half, much better in second but also very lucky to get away with losing the ball twice for two of their counters
Bailey 7 - always a threat I thought and worked hard too. Shooting was off today
Rogers 4 - turned his back on defending the cross for first goal, nice touches at times but miles off the standard
Duran 4 - ran around doing little or nothing. But more on Emery than him for the first half
Watkins 5 - bit lifeless today I thought
Cash 8 - extra point for saving that goal. Attacked well too. Struggles to pass the ball into midfield I've noticed
Diaby 8 - looked dangerous, worked hard and that was an assist of real quality
Zaniolo 7 - got the goal, we were crying out for someone to break from midfield and he did it, temperamental to put it mildly and should have got a second yellow
Digne 7 - just solid when he came on and gave us a constant outlet on left, poor decision not to start him
Emery 4 - got out of jail big time today. Wretched team selection and formatiom should have finished us. All the changes worked to get the point but should never have come it. He's tinkering far too much in recent games
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I’m reading Sky’s report of the game saying our point was undeserved, what the fuck?!? So having the same shots and shots on goal whilst having 70% of posession as the away team doesn’t count as deserved?!? Fucking wankers
Not sure what the problem was. The story is always going to be we "escaped with a point" when a last minute goal is disallowed for the opposition. If it had happened the other end, it would have been Villa were denied all three points. They even mention our penalty shout but mention we were not deserving of all three points, which is probably true.
And their highlights package covers us having all the best legal chances of the game with showing their goal and the two disallowed efforts.
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Deserved point, now have to hope all those on International duty come back without Injury. Diaby did well when he came on and made a nice pass for Zaniolas goal.
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Lenglet didn't play for half a season and as a fifth choice centre half, has been fine and at times, very good. He didn't play well today but you could see some of that was attributable to playing on the right not left. Plus the centre halves all suffered on the ball because there was nobody to pass to first half.
I hate all this 'so and so gave one of the worst performances ever' or 'he should never play again' whenever a player has a poor game.
Same here. Hyperbole bollox.
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Not really sure there’s any reason for starting Moreno ahead of Digne at the moment, he is well off his game.
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Not really sure there’s any reason for starting Moreno ahead of Digne at the moment, he is well off his game.
I’d concur with this, Moreno to be used as a
Sub if you’re looking for some attacking impetus in the final 20-30mins.
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Much better after the substitutions but still not great.
For the love of Mcgrath can that please be the last we see of Lenglet in a Villa shirt
That’s a bit harsh. He was poor today, but he’s been decent in the main.
We've conceded a lot of goals with him in the team. He's just poor
On that basis Martinez must be poor as well!
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Well I'd save Lenglet for the conference games then.
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Lenglet didn't play for half a season and as a fifth choice centre half, has been fine and at times, very good. He didn't play well today but you could see some of that was attributable to playing on the right not left. Plus the centre halves all suffered on the ball because there was nobody to pass to first half.
I hate all this 'so and so gave one of the worst performances ever' or 'he should never play again' whenever a player has a poor game.
Same here. Hyperbole bollox.
Lenglet is a loan backup due to Mings. He has been much better than Carlos.
Moreno has been poor against half decent teams since his injury.
Today we struggled at times without 2 of our best 3 midifeilders.
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Kit stealers should consider themselves lucky with the big decisions.
Any sort of handball (any intention or not) leading to a goal has to be disallowed, so there is no argument to be had about the two disallowed for them.
Other handball decisions are open to interpretation. They should consider themselves very very lucky that we were not given a penalty first half.
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There was absolutely no reason to start Lenglet today. He's been fine as a back up to Torres, but that's all he is. We looked so much better when we reverted to our best back four of Cash, Konsa, Torres and Digne. Moreno has been poor for ages now. He's more attacking than Digne, but he's about as good at defending as Bailey is. Duran showed that to be in this team, you've got to be able to add a lot more to proceedings and we looked miles better when Diaby came on.
Still, I'd have grudgingly settled for a point there, but for the second game in a row now, Emery has got the starting line up all wrong, and it's costing us.
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I was out so missed this one, sounds like it was a pretty stressful watch.
Only lost 3 at home haven't they? Decent point.
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Is Ramsey likely to be fit for the Wolves game?
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Lenglet didn't play for half a season and as a fifth choice centre half, has been fine and at times, very good. He didn't play well today but you could see some of that was attributable to playing on the right not left. Plus the centre halves all suffered on the ball because there was nobody to pass to first half.
I hate all this 'so and so gave one of the worst performances ever' or 'he should never play again' whenever a player has a poor game.
Me too. Some posters talk about certain squad players as though it's the 2015-16 squad. it is absolutely pathetic given the season we are having.
Zaniolo is another example. Gets dogs abuse here. Has won us two points this season with crucial goals and that ight be what gets us into the European cup for the first time since 1983.
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VAR got two decisions right and one wrong for me. Was a game of 3 handballs.
Cash, Konsa, Torres & Digne/Moreno - stop trying to shoe horn Lenglet in, if he was as good with the ball as he clearly thinks is he’d be captain of Barcelona not farmed out to us
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Also bollocks to West Ham. They have loads of really talented players but their route to score is generally just borderline try and foul the keeper and bundle in the box.
There's a decent side in there if they ever get rid of that dinosaur Moyes.
Three European quarter-finals in a row. That’s West Ham we’re talking about.
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Massive point. We needed. West ham not easy place to go. 1st half awful. Second half deserved point. Diaby was motm
Special shout out to cash. My god what a block. Unbelievable from him. Welk done cashy
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VAR got two decisions right and one wrong for me. Was a game of 3 handballs.
Cash, Konsa, Torres & Digne/Moreno - stop trying to shoe horn Lenglet in, if he was as good with the ball as he clearly thinks is he’d be captain of Barcelona not farmed out to us
The Spammers handball wasn't VAR but the ref. He was looking straight at it so told VAR he had seen it and didn't think it was deliberate. The players arm was out as he was pointing to his team mate and the ball was played against it. Not a natural position, but not deliberately lifted to block it so would always be on-field call.
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I’d have taken a point before the game so, all good with the 1-1.
I think that Duran, Rogers, Moreno and Lenglet should only be used as backups.
We’ve got a couple of weeks off now so, hope Ramsey will be back in contention and not get injured again in his first match back. Diaby getting back some form is vey welcome.
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Tielemans good as Kamaras stand in IMO. Havent read the whole thread but guess there is disagreement about that. Had taken one point more than spuds before the weekend. Wham difficult opponent, we where ok overall, a bit below our high standards might but CL hopes are still there on that showing IMO.
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Watching that Wham team, I was having flashbacks of us under O'Neill. And not in a good way.
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I’d have taken a point before the game so, all good with the 1-1.
I think that Duran, Rogers, Moreno and Lenglet should only be used as backups.
We’ve got a couple of weeks off now so, hope Ramsey will be back in contention and not get injured again in his first match back. Diaby getting back some form is vey welcome.
And be back to last seasons form and not this one. TBH, as a Ramsey backup, Rogers isn't too bad when on the ball. If he had Digne behind him or Moreno of last season, I don't think we would be too unhappy if he was still missing.
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I Can see us finished 4th with one point ahead now and would love that to piss off spurzzzz .
:)
oh did and soucak get booked for intentional hand ball into the net?
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(https://i.ibb.co/xq2c0L6/Screenshot-20240317-163209-Chrome.jpg) (https://ibb.co/xq2c0L6)
Incisive insight from Gabbidon there
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His insight was brilliant all match (if you want a laugh that is).
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Ollie (and the team) looked less effective with Duran alongside.
Cash and Digne clearly improved us, as did Diaby.
I like the look of Rogers. Still some way off being a regular starter, but looks to be a shrewd purchase and a player who has plenty of promise.
A good point and a decent few days following the disappointment of last weekend.
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Tielemans good as Kamaras stand in IMO. Havent read the whole thread but guess there is disagreement about that. Had taken one point more than spuds before the weekend. Wham difficult opponent, we where ok overall, a bit below our high standards might but CL hopes are still there on that showing IMO.
Sorry I was just amazed he wasn't subbed, especially after he got booked
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VAR got two decisions right and one wrong for me. Was a game of 3 handballs.
Cash, Konsa, Torres & Digne/Moreno - stop trying to shoe horn Lenglet in, if he was as good with the ball as he clearly thinks is he’d be captain of Barcelona not farmed out to us
The Spammers handball wasn't VAR but the ref. He was looking straight at it so told VAR he had seen it and didn't think it was deliberate. The players arm was out as he was pointing to his team mate and the ball was played against it. Not a natural position, but not deliberately lifted to block it so would always be on-field call.
I've only seen highlights and was wondering why we didn't get the pen because arm was definitely not in a natural position. But I take your point about Bailey deliberately hitting the ball at his arm so it was probably the correct decision in the end.
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Watching that Wham team, I was having flashbacks of us under O'Neill. And not in a good way.
Good call. I thought they were one of the poorest teams we've played this season which makes Unai's team selection even more frustrating. Bowen is the only player I'd want from them. A lot of talk this week on how Southgate should have selected James Ward-Prowse for his squad but it must have taken 70/80 minutes for me to register he was on the pitch. I assume he's had better days than today?
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Unbeaten in London - you'll never sing that!
(PS - How did we do in the Xg result?)
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We missed McGinn. I have no idea why such an obvious handball at the end took nearly eight minutes to be given but they got it right in the end.
Emery 4 - got out of jail big time today. Wretched team selection and formatiom should have finished us. All the changes worked to get the point but should never have come it. He's tinkering far too much in recent games
Games played - 43
Games left - at least 11.
ACLs - 3
Captain - suspended.
Why on earth is Emery ‘tinkering’ I wonder?
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Watching that Wham team, I was having flashbacks of us under O'Neill. And not in a good way.
Good call. I thought they were one of the poorest teams we've played this season which makes Unai's team selection even more frustrating. Bowen is the only player I'd want from them. A lot of talk this week on how Southgate should have selected James Ward-Prowse for his squad but it must have taken 70/80 minutes for me to register he was on the pitch. I assume he's had better days than today?
JWP came on for the last 10 minutes.
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We missed McGinn. I have no idea why such an obvious handball at the end took nearly eight minutes to be given but they got it right in the end.
Emery 4 - got out of jail big time today. Wretched team selection and formatiom should have finished us. All the changes worked to get the point but should never have come it. He's tinkering far too much in recent games
Games played - 43
Games left - at least 11.
ACLs - 3
Captain - suspended.
Why on earth is Emery ‘tinkering’ I wonder?
Precisely.
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Watching that Wham team, I was having flashbacks of us under O'Neill. And not in a good way.
Good call. I thought they were one of the poorest teams we've played this season which makes Unai's team selection even more frustrating. Bowen is the only player I'd want from them. A lot of talk this week on how Southgate should have selected James Ward-Prowse for his squad but it must have taken 70/80 minutes for me to register he was on the pitch. I assume he's had better days than today?
JWP came on for the last 10 minutes.
Ha! Glad to see my eyes aren't failing me.
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We missed McGinn. I have no idea why such an obvious handball at the end took nearly eight minutes to be given but they got it right in the end.
Emery 4 - got out of jail big time today. Wretched team selection and formatiom should have finished us. All the changes worked to get the point but should never have come it. He's tinkering far too much in recent games
Games played - 43
Games left - at least 11.
ACLs - 3
Captain - suspended.
Why on earth is Emery ‘tinkering’ I wonder?
Exactly…I don’t like Lenglet in there but can see exactly why Emery is selecting teams he is…4/10 is utterly ridiculous
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We missed McGinn. I have no idea why such an obvious handball at the end took nearly eight minutes to be given but they got it right in the end.
Emery 4 - got out of jail big time today. Wretched team selection and formatiom should have finished us. All the changes worked to get the point but should never have come it. He's tinkering far too much in recent games
Games played - 43
Games left - at least 11.
ACLs - 3
Captain - suspended.
Why on earth is Emery ‘tinkering’ I wonder?
Obviously we don't see what his reports see when he is decides the team and what he wants to exploit. However he could easily have stated this game with Cash at right back, Konsa, Torres and Moreno/ Digne at the back. Chambers or Tim with Luiz in front of the defence, Tielemans further forward in midfield and then Bailey, Watkins and either Rogers or Zani.
Instead he went with two strikers which actually nullifies Watkins as he can't make the runs and removed someone else from an already lightweight midfield.
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Fuck knows how ours wasn’t a pen. He had his arm out pointing.
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Fuck knows how ours wasn’t a pen. He had his arm out pointing.
Didn't Bailey deliberately flick the ball up to his arm?
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A good and deserved point in the end. Not a particularly good performance but we have a heavily depleted team. I didn’t enjoy much of it.
Until OnlytheZaniolney stepped-up!
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West Ham fans seem absolutely convinced that they're on the end of a vast conspiracy of the Premier League and the media because of how obviously rigged it all is, because everyone is desperate for us to finish in the top four. That's the narrative that they want.
So we're not the only club with nutty conspiracists who are sure that the world is out to get them.
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Fuck West Ham.
Defend in numbers at home and then try to sneak it with a bit of basketball at the end.
Embarrassing to play that way in front of your own supporters.
They were fools really. At 1-0 they were so on top, had us on the ropes, then sat back. We duly took advantage.
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West Ham fans seem absolutely convinced that they're on the end of a vast conspiracy of the Premier League and the media because of how obviously rigged it all is, because everyone is desperate for us to finish in the top four. That's the narrative that they want.
So we're not the only club with nutty conspiracists who are sure that the world is out to get them.
Wulvz are the current undisputed world champions at that, making it the second time they've been world champions if you listen to their idiot followers.
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We missed McGinn. I have no idea why such an obvious handball at the end took nearly eight minutes to be given but they got it right in the end.
Emery 4 - got out of jail big time today. Wretched team selection and formatiom should have finished us. All the changes worked to get the point but should never have come it. He's tinkering far too much in recent games
Games played - 43
Games left - at least 11.
ACLs - 3
Captain - suspended.
Why on earth is Emery ‘tinkering’ I wonder?
There is no justification for the back four that started today. Nor playing two up top. Konsa at RB, Lenglet at RCB 😕 Emery has plenty of credit in the bank, that goes without saying, but he's had a nightmare last two games..
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Fuck knows how ours wasn’t a pen. He had his arm out pointing.
Didn't Bailey deliberately flick the ball up to his arm?
I don't think it was deliberate as he was trying to play Konsa through who had made the run. But as the arm was out for the pointing before the ball was played, the ref decided it wasn't deliberate. Another day.......
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Watching that Wham team, I was having flashbacks of us under O'Neill. And not in a good way.
Good call. I thought they were one of the poorest teams we've played this season which makes Unai's team selection even more frustrating. Bowen is the only player I'd want from them. A lot of talk this week on how Southgate should have selected James Ward-Prowse for his squad but it must have taken 70/80 minutes for me to register he was on the pitch. I assume he's had better days than today?
JWP came on for the last 10 minutes.
Ha! Glad to see my eyes aren't failing me.
I’d be delighted to have Kudus and Paqueta in our squad too.
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We missed McGinn. I have no idea why such an obvious handball at the end took nearly eight minutes to be given but they got it right in the end.
Emery 4 - got out of jail big time today. Wretched team selection and formatiom should have finished us. All the changes worked to get the point but should never have come it. He's tinkering far too much in recent games
Games played - 43
Games left - at least 11.
ACLs - 3
Captain - suspended.
Why on earth is Emery ‘tinkering’ I wonder?
Obviously we don't see what his reports see when he is decides the team and what he wants to exploit. However he could easily have stated this game with Cash at right back, Konsa, Torres and Moreno/ Digne at the back. Chambers or Tim with Luiz in front of the defence, Tielemans further forward in midfield and then Bailey, Watkins and either Rogers or Zani.
Instead he went with two strikers which actually nullifies Watkins as he can't make the runs and removed someone else from an already lightweight midfield.
Sounds like a bit tinkery to me that does.
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We missed McGinn. I have no idea why such an obvious handball at the end took nearly eight minutes to be given but they got it right in the end.
Emery 4 - got out of jail big time today. Wretched team selection and formatiom should have finished us. All the changes worked to get the point but should never have come it. He's tinkering far too much in recent games
Games played - 43
Games left - at least 11.
ACLs - 3
Captain - suspended.
Why on earth is Emery ‘tinkering’ I wonder?
There is no justification for the back four that started today. Nor playing two up top. Konsa at RB, Lenglet at RCB 😕 Emery has plenty of credit in the bank, that goes without saying, but he's had a nightmare last two games..
4-0 & 1-1. Keep the nightmares coming Unai.
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He really is a shit manager..
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He really is a shit manager..
Dreadful.
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I think it’s ok to acknowledge Unai has made a few questionable decisions of late, without leaping to that meaning anyone is saying he’s hopeless or that type of nonsense. He’s been absolutely brilliant for us, he’s a top manager, but he’s not infallible. The last two league games there have been some odd tactical calls.
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There was absolutely no reason to start Lenglet today. He's been fine as a back up to Torres, but that's all he is. We looked so much better when we reverted to our best back four of Cash, Konsa, Torres and Digne. Moreno has been poor for ages now. He's more attacking than Digne, but he's about as good at defending as Bailey is. Duran showed that to be in this team, you've got to be able to add a lot more to proceedings and we looked miles better when Diaby came on.
Still, I'd have grudgingly settled for a point there, but for the second game in a row now, Emery has got the starting line up all wrong, and it's costing us.
Pretty accurate summary this. We did well in the end to get a point but you have to wonder what we'd have got if we started the game with cash Diaby Digne and Zaniolo on the field.
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Also I like Moreno, he did great last year but my god he’s poor at the moment. Looks frustrated all the time too, so I imagine he’s aware.
He’s missing that connection with Ramsey I reckon. They were good together and made each other look better. I’d certainly play Digne at the moment.
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We missed McGinn. I have no idea why such an obvious handball at the end took nearly eight minutes to be given but they got it right in the end.
Emery 4 - got out of jail big time today. Wretched team selection and formatiom should have finished us. All the changes worked to get the point but should never have come it. He's tinkering far too much in recent games
Games played - 43
Games left - at least 11.
ACLs - 3
Captain - suspended.
Why on earth is Emery ‘tinkering’ I wonder?
Stop being so logical!
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I think it’s ok to acknowledge Unai has made a few questionable decisions of late, without leaping to that meaning anyone is saying he’s hopeless or that type of nonsense. He’s been absolutely brilliant for us, he’s a top manager, but he’s not infallible. The last two league games there have been some odd tactical calls.
Or maybe he’s learned a thing or two about managing players’ minutes in the five long seasons he’s got to European finals and semi-finals with clubs the size of Villareal and Seville.
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Fuck knows how ours wasn’t a pen. He had his arm out pointing.
Didn't Bailey deliberately flick the ball up to his arm?
I don't think it was deliberate as he was trying to play Konsa through who had made the run. But as the arm was out for the pointing before the ball was played, the ref decided it wasn't deliberate. Another day.......
It just isn't a massive howler for me, if anything my instinct was that it wasn't a pen. I think a draw was probably a pretty fair result. A point away at 7th is fine.
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Please no more of Konsa at full back. Cash in, lesson learnt for the umpteenth time.
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Not a bad point on the whole to be honest. Puts us 3 points ahead of Spurs and 9 ahead of Manchester United, which is more like 10 given our much superior goal difference.
Second half was much improved after a largely poor first half and we could have even maybe nicked it. We do look increasingly shaky defending set pieces and suppose we were a bit lucky that those twins disallowed goals hot their arms when they might have bounced off anywhere.
Thought Diaby looked sharp again when he came on today and Cash also did well. Does raise the question of why both didn't start though.
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I think it’s ok to acknowledge Unai has made a few questionable decisions of late, without leaping to that meaning anyone is saying he’s hopeless or that type of nonsense. He’s been absolutely brilliant for us, he’s a top manager, but he’s not infallible. The last two league games there have been some odd tactical calls.
Or maybe he’s learned a thing or two about managing players’ minutes in the five long seasons he’s got to European finals and semi-finals with clubs the size of Villareal and Seville.
Why would Cash or Digne need their minutes managing?
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Watching that Wham team, I was having flashbacks of us under O'Neill. And not in a good way.
trying to work out who their Nigel Reo Coker was .
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Maybe he has, doesn’t change the fact we didn’t play particularly well in the league games. It’s ok to question decision making, without that being construed as being anti-Emery (which would be mental).
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I think it’s ok to acknowledge Unai has made a few questionable decisions of late, without leaping to that meaning anyone is saying he’s hopeless or that type of nonsense. He’s been absolutely brilliant for us, he’s a top manager, but he’s not infallible. The last two league games there have been some odd tactical calls.
Although as Fulham showed, taking the game to Spurs is better, the first half tactics were working to some extent. We had the better chances first half and Spurs had little. If we hadn't shit the bed straight into the second half and with Van der Ven going off, I think we would have done something in the match. Instead we were suddenly 2-0 down and chasing the game, McGinn had his rush of blood and that was the match thrown.
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Obviously would have been thrilled with 3 pijnts but a piint away at a tougb place isnt bad. Just hope west ham turn up vs spurs. Defensively i was very impressed with west ham they made it difficult
3 points ahead of spurs who have to go to chelsea who hate spurs so no gurantees they win there
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Did Zaniolo shush the Villa fans?
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What was their other disallowed goal chalked off for. Didn't go to VAR. Just wondered. Not easy to see from 5 miles away in Row 64...
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What was their other disallowed goal chalked off for. Didn't go to VAR. Just wondered. Not easy to see from 5 miles away in Row 64...
Handball
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What was their other disallowed goal chalked off for. Didn't go to VAR. Just wondered. Not easy to see from 5 miles away in Row 64...
They were both handball. And they were both clear and obvious on the replay whatever the press might say.
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Obviously would have been thrilled with 3 pijnts but a piint away at a tougb place isnt bad. Just hope west ham turn up vs spurs. Defensively i was very impressed with west ham they made it difficult
3 points ahead of spurs who have to go to chelsea who hate spurs so no gurantees they win there
Yeah don't like having to cheer on Chelsea but, just on this occasion
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Obviously would have been thrilled with 3 pijnts but a piint away at a tougb place isnt bad. Just hope west ham turn up vs spurs. Defensively i was very impressed with west ham they made it difficult
3 points ahead of spurs who have to go to chelsea who hate spurs so no gurantees they win there
How many pints did you end up having to speeel like that?
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He really is a shit manager..
Dreadful.
Awful. He's like cross between O'Leary and Lamberk. Bring back Bruceball.
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Hopefully that's the last we see or Lenglet.
Not his best day, but imagine if every wish like this after one bad performance came true, who would we have left? Probably Martinez on his own.
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Obviously would have been thrilled with 3 pijnts but a piint away at a tougb place isnt bad. Just hope west ham turn up vs spurs. Defensively i was very impressed with west ham they made it difficult
3 points ahead of spurs who have to go to chelsea who hate spurs so no gurantees they win there
How many pints did you end up having to speeel like that?
Quite a few actually 😂
Obviously would have been thrilled with 3 pijnts but a piint away at a tougb place isnt bad. Just hope west ham turn up vs spurs. Defensively i was very impressed with west ham they made it difficult
3 points ahead of spurs who have to go to chelsea who hate spurs so no gurantees they win there
Yeah don't like having to cheer on Chelsea but, just on this occasion
Agreed. I hope this game ia sandwiched between all their tough games. Would bw great if it was played in midweek before they play arsenal
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https://www.skysports.com/football/west-ham-vs-a-villa/report/482879
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Hopefully that's the last we see or Lenglet.
Not his best day, but imagine if every wish like this after one bad performance came true, who would we have left? Probably Martinez on his own.
He's been weak in quite a few games now . Probably why he's 5th choice . We could have started without him today and last weekend.
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Hopefully that's the last we see or Lenglet.
Not his best day, but imagine if every wish like this after one bad performance came true, who would we have left? Probably Martinez on his own.
He's been weak in quite a few games now . Probably why he's 5th choice . We could have started without him today and last weekend.
All the back four were awful in the first half. Leaving Cash on the bench so both Konsa and Lenglet could struggle out of position was bonkers stuff from Emery.
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I missed the majority of the first half so i cant comment too much. Thought we played alright in the second and should have won it. I'm not sure why it took so long for that var check to go through. It was a foul on Konsa and we should have had a foul before their free kick anyway. Still, a decent point bearing in mind we had three of our midfield out.
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Hopefully that's the last we see or Lenglet.
Not his best day, but imagine if every wish like this after one bad performance came true, who would we have left? Probably Martinez on his own.
He's been weak in quite a few games now . Probably why he's 5th choice . We could have started without him today and last weekend.
All the back four were awful in the first half. Leaving Cash on the bench so both Konsa and Lenglet could struggle out of position was bonkers stuff from Emery.
And yet, his in-game management saw what was happening and he had the bollocks to change it at half time. I'm happy to back a guy who has transformed this squad. He doesn't make mistakes, the players do.
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When my phone pinged to say we were 2-0 down, I went for a walk. Was quite pleased to later discover we had drawn 1-1.
Decent away point in the circumstances.
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Lenglet didn't play for half a season and as a fifth choice centre half, has been fine and at times, very good. He didn't play well today but you could see some of that was attributable to playing on the right not left. Plus the centre halves all suffered on the ball because there was nobody to pass to first half.
I hate all this 'so and so gave one of the worst performances ever' or 'he should never play again' whenever a player has a poor game.
Me too. Some posters talk about certain squad players as though it's the 2015-16 squad. it is absolutely pathetic given the season we are having.
Zaniolo is another example. Gets dogs abuse here. Has won us two points this season with crucial goals and that ight be what gets us into the European cup for the first time since 1983.
Love your positive posts on here dude. Keep the faith man!
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Thanks Wince, made my day! I didn't think anybody liked them at all!!
Edited to say I have seen a lot of bad managers at Villa, I just am desperate for us to appreciate the fact that we may well have a once in a generation one at the helm and to be patient. He is doing wonders for us
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Hopefully that's the last we see or Lenglet.
Not his best day, but imagine if every wish like this after one bad performance came true, who would we have left? Probably Martinez on his own.
He's been weak in quite a few games now . Probably why he's 5th choice . We could have started without him today and last weekend.
All the back four were awful in the first half. Leaving Cash on the bench so both Konsa and Lenglet could struggle out of position was bonkers stuff from Emery.
And yet, his in-game management saw what was happening and he had the bollocks to change it at half time. I'm happy to back a guy who has transformed this squad. He doesn't make mistakes, the players do.
He was only rectifying a mistake of his own making. We were appalling in that first half and WHU should have finished us. All managers make mistakes, Guardiola cost Man City at least one CL with madcap tactics for example, and Emery is no different.
He's itching to play this 3 x CB rubbish since pre season though and I really (really) wish he would finally stop it.
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Thought we were going to lose that. Moyes changed the tide with taking a forward off for a defender on 65 mins at home. Bizarre decision that played straight into our hands. Thought we were a bit fortunate with the first VAR call. Second one at the end was correct. A very useful point.
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Thought we were going to lose that. Moyes changed the tide with taking a forward off for a defender on 65 mins at home. Bizarre decision that played straight into our hands. Thought we were a bit fortunate with the first VAR call. Second one at the end was correct. A very useful point.
Antonio has confessed post match
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When my phone pinged to say we were 2-0 down, I went for a walk. Was quite pleased to later discover we had drawn 1-1.
Decent away point in the circumstances.
And a decent healthy walk for you. Win win as they say.
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Thought we were going to lose that. Moyes changed the tide with taking a forward off for a defender on 65 mins at home. Bizarre decision that played straight into our hands. Thought we were a bit fortunate with the first VAR call. Second one at the end was correct. A very useful point.
I thought West Ham's tactics in second half were so negative as to be untrue, especially considering how bad we were in the first half. They retreated from the off and let Tielemans and Luiz particularly dominate the ball under little pressure. Tielemans can't run or tackle but can play, seemed crazy to let him play himself into the game.
Kudus especially did cause us big problems on the counter and Bowen was always a threat. To be honest I wasn't surprised Antonio was hooked but only Moyes would bring on a right back for him. Seems like we mugged them off with Ings too, unused sub and if ever there was a forward unsuited to Moyes tactics it has to be Ings. The Kalvin Phillips loan must be going incredibly badly too if he wasn't worth bringing on to try and stop our dominance in midfield.
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What was Zaniolo's 'shush' in aid of?
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What was Zaniolo's 'shush' in aid of?
Eamonn slagging him off.
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What was Zaniolo's 'shush' in aid of?
Maybe he's been on here and looked in the Zaniolo thread.
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Thought we were going to lose that. Moyes changed the tide with taking a forward off for a defender on 65 mins at home. Bizarre decision that played straight into our hands. Thought we were a bit fortunate with the first VAR call. Second one at the end was correct. A very useful point.
Fortunate ? He practically threw it in .
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Thought we were going to lose that. Moyes changed the tide with taking a forward off for a defender on 65 mins at home. Bizarre decision that played straight into our hands. Thought we were a bit fortunate with the first VAR call. Second one at the end was correct. A very useful point.
Antonio has confessed post match
Fair enough.
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Thought we were going to lose that. Moyes changed the tide with taking a forward off for a defender on 65 mins at home. Bizarre decision that played straight into our hands. Thought we were a bit fortunate with the first VAR call. Second one at the end was correct. A very useful point.
Fortunate ? He practically threw it in .
I thought Martinez got caught out badly with the cross and was all over the place. I couldn’t see the handball clearly. Thankfully VAR did.
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Thanks Wince, made my day! I didn't think anybody liked them at all!!
Edited to say I have seen a lot of bad managers at Villa, I just am desperate for us to appreciate the fact that we may well have a once in a generation one at the helm and to be patient. He is doing wonders for us
No worries mate. I love your positivity
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When my phone pinged to say we were 2-0 down, I went for a walk. Was quite pleased to later discover we had drawn 1-1.
Decent away point in the circumstances.
And a decent healthy walk for you. Win win as they say.
Especially on a lovely spring afternoon, helps keep me slim and trim. :)
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What was Zaniolo's 'shush' in aid of?
Would have been worse if he did a 'Z' gesture.
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Thought we were going to lose that. Moyes changed the tide with taking a forward off for a defender on 65 mins at home. Bizarre decision that played straight into our hands. Thought we were a bit fortunate with the first VAR call. Second one at the end was correct. A very useful point.
Fortunate ? He practically threw it in .
I thought Martinez got caught out badly with the cross and was all over the place. I couldn’t see the handball clearly. Thankfully VAR did.
Wasn't his finest hour . We always seem sluggish straight after HT .
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That was a handball not given for usre.
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Block of the season from Cash.
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It was a great block from Cash. He does have some great positional sense for blocking shots.
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Moyse moaning about the disallowed goals “don’t know what we can do about it”. How about not cheating and actually scoring legal goals you twerp?
And why wasn’t Soucek booked for attempting to cheat?
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We do need to look at our defending on set pieces. Both the disallowed goals the defending is abysmal.
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Moyse moaning about the disallowed goals “don’t know what we can do about it”. How about not cheating and actually scoring legal goals you twerp?
And why wasn’t Soucek booked for attempting to cheat?
Don't handball then, you dinosaur of a manager.
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Moyse moaning about the disallowed goals “don’t know what we can do about it”. How about not cheating and actually scoring legal goals you twerp?
And why wasn’t Soucek booked for attempting to cheat?
I’m happy he isn’t booked, potentially suspended, as long as he scores against Spurs.
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Not sure if Emery is trying to prove a point with Konsa at full back, not sure what the point is as I have never seen him play well there. Emery saw his error and made the correct changes at half time, Lenglet being pilloried for being chosen to play out of position. All the subs made a difference, Zaniola for all the criticism played his part well. Diaby looked more like the player he was a few months ago and Cash saved the day and nearly won it for us.
Special mention to the female commentator who had far too much to say for a comments person usually to rubbish Villa.
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Tielemans should also get some credit for his ball to Diaby, perfect for Diaby and just out or reach of the defenders.
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What was Zaniolo's 'shush' in aid of?
Would have been worse if he did a 'Z' gesture.
😂
I thought he was good when he came on. Keep that form up please worldyorchiooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
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What was their other disallowed goal chalked off for. Didn't go to VAR. Just wondered. Not easy to see from 5 miles away in Row 64...
We were in row 53. It made me pine for the away end at Zrinjski
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We do need to look at our defending on set pieces. Both the disallowed goals the defending is abysmal.
It does show for all these set piece coaches clubs employ now that sometimes a good old fashioned diagonal inswinger into the six yard box can create havoc. Bowen and Ward Prowse get tremendous whip on them.
Good news is they've got Spurs in two weeks and their keeper badly struggles against corners that are whipped towards him so hopefully West Ham will get at least a point off them that way.
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We do need to look at our defending on set pieces. Both the disallowed goals the defending is abysmal.
It does show for all these set piece coaches clubs employ now that sometimes a good old fashioned diagonal inswinger into the six yard box can create havoc. Bowen and Ward Prowse get tremendous whip on them.
Good news is they've got Spurs in two weeks and their keeper badly struggles against corners that are whipped towards him so hopefully West Ham will get at least a point off them that way.
The corner for disallowed goal 1 is fairly standard. We dealt with it badly and love him to bits best keeper in the world for me , he's not dealt with that but the boxer is interfering with him again.
Disallowed goal 2 is just messy , yes it's a lovely whipped cross but we are weak dealing with it .
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Not sure if Emery is trying to prove a point with Konsa at full back, not sure what the point is as I have never seen him play well there.
He’s been brilliant there on lots of occasions. Was shit there today though.
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Not sure if Emery is trying to prove a point with Konsa at full back, not sure what the point is as I have never seen him play well there.
He’s been brilliant there on lots of occasions. Was shit there today though.
Emery is a pioneer of this 3 CB at the back thing so he may be showing a stubborn side. To his absolute credit , he changes it in game if he needs to .
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What was Zaniolo's 'shush' in aid of?
Would have been worse if he did a 'Z' gesture.
😂
I thought he was good when he came on. Keep that form up please worldyorchiooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
I noticed that the rest of the team barely celebrated with him
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I think the three centre backs thing is an attempt to adjust for Kamara's absence. Earlier in the season Kamara dropped in when we were defending allowing the fullbacks to push up a little higher.
Also there was that weird decision by the ref to give a free kick to West Ham for a foul by Soucek on Tielemans. Tielemans clearly got the ball and Soucek clearly caught him with a high foot.
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Anyway, that's one of worst away visits over for another season. Why is the trudge back to Stratford always twice as long as the trudge there? And the stadium and whole area around it is so sucked of soul and atmosphere...
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Anyway, that's one of worst away visits over for another season. Why is the trudge back to Stratford always twice as long as the trudge there? And the stadium and whole area around it is so sucked of soul and atmosphere...
I worked near there for a few months, desperate place. Lived in that premier inn on the shopping centre.
Absolute travesty West Ham were sucked out of their home to that place. Enjoyed the character of the old ground and the pubs (Boleyn Arms Etc) .
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Absolute travesty West Ham were sucked out of their home to that place. Enjoyed the character of the old ground and the pubs (Boleyn Arms Etc).
Hopefully, away fans won't be saying the same about us in 10 or 20 years' time.
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VAR got two decisions right and one wrong for me. Was a game of 3 handballs.
Cash, Konsa, Torres & Digne/Moreno - stop trying to shoe horn Lenglet in, if he was as good with the ball as he clearly thinks is he’d be captain of Barcelona not farmed out to us
The Spammers handball wasn't VAR but the ref. He was looking straight at it so told VAR he had seen it and didn't think it was deliberate. The players arm was out as he was pointing to his team mate and the ball was played against it. Not a natural position, but not deliberately lifted to block it so would always be on-field call.
This means nothing. One takes a chance when sticking the arm out for any reason. His arm stopped a pass in the box and it was out because he decided to stick it out to point. Bad choice in that situation and absolutely should have been called a hand ball. One of the worst decisions I have ever seen.
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I dont think zaniolo is shushing the fans , if you look at a still picture his finger is bent suggesting he is having a cigar !!
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Not sure if Emery is trying to prove a point with Konsa at full back, not sure what the point is as I have never seen him play well there.
He’s been brilliant there on lots of occasions. Was shit there today though.
I wouldn't say lots of occasions. Most of the time it stifles the attacking play completely down our right hand side as teams are happy for him to be the outlet ball. Konsa is our best CB at actually defending. He needs to be in that position.
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VAR got two decisions right and one wrong for me. Was a game of 3 handballs.
Cash, Konsa, Torres & Digne/Moreno - stop trying to shoe horn Lenglet in, if he was as good with the ball as he clearly thinks is he’d be captain of Barcelona not farmed out to us
The Spammers handball wasn't VAR but the ref. He was looking straight at it so told VAR he had seen it and didn't think it was deliberate. The players arm was out as he was pointing to his team mate and the ball was played against it. Not a natural position, but not deliberately lifted to block it so would always be on-field call.
This means nothing. One takes a chance when sticking the arm out for any reason. His arm stopped a pass in the box and it was out because he decided to stick it out to point. Bad choice in that situation and absolutely should have been called a hand ball. One of the worst decisions I have ever seen.
It means everything when it is a subjective decision and not an absolute like goal scoring handball. The ref decided the arm was already there and the ball then hit the arm. The last minute goal was reviewed by the ref because the ball came off Bowen last. If it hadn't have touched him and went in off Soucek, it was an absolute and would have been called by VAR. But as the handball was the goal scorer, the ref had to make the call because it was subjective handball. And they all rightly concluded that Soucek deliberately moved his arm to push it in / away from the defender.
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It was hand ball pure and simple. The West Ham luvvies on Talk Shite didn't agree. They think that because the checks took so long it wasn't a clear and obvious error. Apparently VAR and match officials are following orders off the Premier league to stop Wet Spam catching Man Yoo. The female presenter was also convinced that Jeff Stelling had it in for them. Jeez they're a paranoid lot.
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Let's be honest we would have been fuming if either of those two VAR goals had been given against us but that's the rule. With all the furore about the handball for the second one, they missed Soucek pulling back Konsa. Looking back Martinez was awful for the first and maybe should be coming for the second too. None of our three centre backs looked like winning a header all game. Granted it's where WHU are strong but teams are exposing us a lot now at set pieces.
Bailey's one was a penalty too, the defender was an idiot with his arm outstretched like that.
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Let's be honest we would have been fuming if either of those two VAR goals had been given against us but that's the rule. With all the furore about the handball for the second one, they missed Soucek pulling back Konsa. Looking back Martinez was awful for the first and maybe should be coming for the second too. None of our three centre backs looked like winning a header all game. Granted it's where WHU are strong but teams are exposing us a lot now at set pieces.
Bailey's one was a penalty too, the defender was an idiot with his arm outstretched like that.
Yeah watching MOTD2 last night they looked at it and said his arm was in a "natural position" What?
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Let's be honest we would have been fuming if either of those two VAR goals had been given against us but that's the rule. With all the furore about the handball for the second one, they missed Soucek pulling back Konsa. Looking back Martinez was awful for the first and maybe should be coming for the second too. None of our three centre backs looked like winning a header all game. Granted it's where WHU are strong but teams are exposing us a lot now at set pieces.
Bailey's one was a penalty too, the defender was an idiot with his arm outstretched like that.
Yeah watching MOTD2 last night they looked at it and said his arm was in a "natural position" What?
He was actually pointing to the defender behind him where to cover as that's where he anticipated the ball being played. Indeed it was but he had his arm in the fucking way!
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It was hand ball pure and simple. The West Ham luvvies on Talk Shite didn't agree. They think that because the checks took so long it wasn't a clear and obvious error. Apparently VAR and match officials are following orders off the Premier league to stop Wet Spam catching Man Yoo. The female presenter was also convinced that Jeff Stelling had it in for them. Jeez they're a paranoid lot.
I thought it was Soucek who had scored it which is why I was confused it took so long. I expect the VAR operative saw the handball and were trying to confirm if it hit Bowen before goal or not. Once they deduced it had, the Ref was then needed as VAR couldn't call a non-scoring handball themselves. As was mentioned, the foul on Konsa didn't seem to be counted, maybe the ref would have been shown that as well as the handball?
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He was actually pointing to the defender behind him where to cover as that's where he anticipated the ball being played. Indeed it was but he had his arm in the fucking way!
He was pointing that Konsa was running through. If the arm had moved after ball was played, it would be no contest but handball is not a call, deliberate handball is and ref didn't think it was.
It is an offence if a player:
- deliberately touches the ball with their hand/arm, for example moving the hand/arm towards the ball
- touches the ball with their hand/arm when it has made their body unnaturally bigger.
A player is considered to have made their body unnaturally bigger when the position of their hand/arm is not a consequence of, or justifiable by, the player’s body movement for that specific situation. By having their hand/arm in such a position, the player takes a risk of their hand/arm being hit by the ball and being penalised
Point one doesn't take affect as he didn't move it towards the ball as it was in that position before the ball was struck.
Obviously the ref justified that the arm being out was justifiable in the situation as he was pointing out the runner. If he hadn't have pointed with it then it might have been given as well. But as the law states, it is a risk and he took it and won this time around. A different ref on a different day.........
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I'll take a point it was hard work.
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If we'd be fuming for those goals to be ruled out we'd be idiots. Antonio straightforwardly elbows it in, while Soucek gives the thing a forearm smash Kendo Nagasaki would have been proud of. It's the first time the law as it stands actually made sense to me - you can't have goals being scored with your hands.
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Anyway, that's one of worst away visits over for another season. Why is the trudge back to Stratford always twice as long as the trudge there? And the stadium and whole area around it is so sucked of soul and atmosphere...
Noticed yesterday - and every time we’ve played there - a fair few empty seats all around the stadium.
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Moyes' reasoning was that they've had some handballs go against them recently so these should be over-looked to more or less even it up......
It was 2 handballs for fucks sake.
Can everyone else have three ACL's next season to even things up for us.
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Went down to this one and can confirm the souless bowl experience many have talked about before. Was in the upper tier which was marginally better than below.
Anyway great day out nonetheless but jaded today.
I thought we dominated possession for the first twenty without creating anything, then allowed them back in the game through our want to keep giving them ball. Thought Cash for Lenglet and Diaby for Dhuran needed to happen and that’s exactly what did and it changed the game. I thought we totally dominated the second half and it would of been a travesty if we’d lost, saying that the VAR call being so late, almost made it feel like a win.
There very agricultural and it must be a horrible soul destroying experience watching that football in that stadium every other week. Still their seventh and with 3 out of 4 of our starting midfield out, I think its a good point.
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They can fuck off anyway, the penalty they got down there last season was a joke and robbed us of two points.
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Bowen would be good at the Villa. He's wasted being the ammo loader for a load of corners for their bunch of Fellaini's to throw themselves at.
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Went down to this one and can confirm the souless bowl experience many have talked about before. Was in the upper tier which was marginally better than below.
Indeed, hope people realise the grass is not always greener.
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Bowen would be good at the Villa. He's wasted being the ammo loader for a load of corners for their bunch of Fellaini's to throw themselves at.
They're exactly the same team Everton were under him 15 years ago, aren't they? No wonder a lot of their fans have had enough, I don't blame them.
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It's what you get if you have all that attacking talent and you choose to play load-the-cannons football. Your best idea is 'cause chaos', well the chaos cuts both ways mate.
Also both 'goals' should've been ruled out for absolutely massive fouls anyway, so Christ knows what they're moaning about, the absolute melters.
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i didnt complain about the line up yesterday because it showed adventure and i could see Unai was looking to nulify the physical and height threat from WH
however it didnt work so he changed it
for the life of me i cant see why he persists on playing Konsa at RB, it very rarely works Konsa is a fish out of water, all this he keeps his posision and doesnt get forward which provides more stability is just rubbish because he's not good enough or flexible enough to play there, so the goals go in against us and then we have to change it
i know its worked on occasion but its pretty obvious it weakens us as a team
also the stick Cash gets on here is ridiculous in my opinion it actually reminds me of the criticism Mcginn used to get, yes he makes mistakes and has the odd bad game which people love pointing out and piling on but like yesterday he can make the difference, and even when he's not on it he's still better than Konsa playing there
Moreno is a worry, doesnt seem to be able to get past his man anymore and get a cross in nearly every ball blocked, he was first choice but now Digne is the better player of the 2 on form at the moment
Rogers, i've said before a few nice touches but looks to me like a mid table plodder and i still dont get the reason we signed him but will look forward to be proved wrong
Zaniololiol he doesnt hide makes a few mistakes gets booked but has also got us out of trouble on at least 2 occasions, i like his energy and positivity when he comes on, offers more than Rogers at the moment
happy to end up with a point in the end at WH which i thought was the fair result
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It was hand ball pure and simple. The West Ham luvvies on Talk Shite didn't agree. They think that because the checks took so long it wasn't a clear and obvious error. Apparently VAR and match officials are following orders off the Premier league to stop Wet Spam catching Man Yoo. The female presenter was also convinced that Jeff Stelling had it in for them. Jeez they're a paranoid lot.
If the female presenter was Bianca Westwood, then shes probably correct about Stelling.
You could tell that he didn't like her. And she didn't appear to like him either. So six of one, half a dozen of the other.
And despite the London media love-in for West Ham, including West Ham fan Westwood, the big decisions were correct except for the pen.
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Konsa at right back/right center back worked when Carlos played well, and would presumably work if Mings weren't out. The trouble is with Lenglet inside being too easily bullied defending counters.
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Konsa at right back/right center back worked when Carlos played well, and would presumably work if Mings weren't out. The trouble is with Lenglet inside being too easily bullied defending counters.
not a right back for me
he has limited technical ability and shows very little forward progresion with the ball and just doesnt look comfortable there because i dont think its his position
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For the goal, it's Lenglet caught faffing about down by the corner flag , west ham win possession and quickly switch the ball to the other flank, then Rogers is a bit late getting to block the cross and then Konsa is caught napping .
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Konsa at right back/right center back worked when Carlos played well, and would presumably work if Mings weren't out. The trouble is with Lenglet inside being too easily bullied defending counters.
not a right back for me
he has limited technical ability and shows very little forward progresion with the ball and just doesnt look comfortable there because i dont think its his position
He's not meant to get forward, it's not an orthodox right back role. The idea of having him there is that, in possession, he and the two centre backs shuffle across to make a three leaving the left back free to go very far forward indeed. Emery didn't invent this, though he did win more than one Europa League with it, and it worked great when we beat Man City and Arsenal inside a week.
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Konsa at right back/right center back worked when Carlos played well, and would presumably work if Mings weren't out. The trouble is with Lenglet inside being too easily bullied defending counters.
not a right back for me
he has limited technical ability and shows very little forward progresion with the ball and just doesnt look comfortable there because i dont think its his position
Watching Emery at Villa for almost 18 months do we not know his system? his system is for the left back to bomb forward and the right back to tuck in almost as a third centre back.
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It was hand ball pure and simple. The West Ham luvvies on Talk Shite didn't agree. They think that because the checks took so long it wasn't a clear and obvious error. Apparently VAR and match officials are following orders off the Premier league to stop Wet Spam catching Man Yoo. The female presenter was also convinced that Jeff Stelling had it in for them. Jeez they're a paranoid lot.
If the female presenter was Bianca Westwood, then shes probably correct about Stelling.
You could tell that he didn't like her. And she didn't appear to like him either. So six of one, half a dozen of the other.
And despite the London media love-in for West Ham, including West Ham fan Westwood, the big decisions were correct except for the pen.
She was working with Jeff for the first time in ages and they have the bantz going so I don't think there is much more to it. She has this as her pinned tweet for 10 years working together and both gave as good as they got. And he was probably able to get his own back after she reported 6-1 against Hartlepool the one year.
https://twitter.com/beewestwood/status/1580487426425823232
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Yup and hence only injury stopping us buying that defensive Argentinian (?) left back so that he could do exactly the same on the other side with Cash playing much further forward.
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Cash had a really good game yesterday. If he could add consistency to his game he'd be great.
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For the goal, it's Lenglet caught faffing about down by the corner flag , west ham win possession and quickly switch the ball to the other flank, then Rogers is a bit late getting to block the cross and then Konsa is caught napping .
Even then, there was a chance to catch them offside from the cross but the blessed Pau dropped too deep.
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For the goal, it's Lenglet caught faffing about down by the corner flag , west ham win possession and quickly switch the ball to the other flank, then Rogers is a bit late getting to block the cross and then Konsa is caught napping .
Even then, there was a chance to catch them offside from the cross but the blessed Pau dropped too deep.
They mentioned that on the stream I watched it on but I didn’t agree as Pau wasn’t the only player between him and the goal line. It was just a really good cross.
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It was hand ball pure and simple. The West Ham luvvies on Talk Shite didn't agree. They think that because the checks took so long it wasn't a clear and obvious error. Apparently VAR and match officials are following orders off the Premier league to stop Wet Spam catching Man Yoo. The female presenter was also convinced that Jeff Stelling had it in for them. Jeez they're a paranoid lot.
If the female presenter was Bianca Westwood, then shes probably correct about Stelling.
You could tell that he didn't like her. And she didn't appear to like him either. So six of one, half a dozen of the other.
And despite the London media love-in for West Ham, including West Ham fan Westwood, the big decisions were correct except for the pen.
She was working with Jeff for the first time in ages and they have the bantz going so I don't think there is much more to it. She has this as her pinned tweet for 10 years working together and both gave as good as they got. And he was probably able to get his own back after she reported 6-1 against Hartlepool the one year.
https://twitter.com/beewestwood/status/1580487426425823232
Bantz of the epic nature. Fair enough... 👍
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To be honest I thought the analysis by Warnock (S) on MOTD was spot on. Invariably we were picking the wrong pass at the back or players weren’t creating enough space. You could see from the analysis that the right pass would have created the opportunity to cut through West Ham.
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To be honest I thought the analysis by Warnock (S) on MOTD was spot on. Invariably we were picking the wrong pass at the back or players weren’t creating enough space. You could see from the analysis that the right pass would have created the opportunity to cut through West Ham.
It was much better 2nd half, Luiz & Tielemans were dominating the middle of the pitch and we were basically all over them.
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To be honest I thought the analysis by Warnock (S) on MOTD was spot on. Invariably we were picking the wrong pass at the back or players weren’t creating enough space. You could see from the analysis that the right pass would have created the opportunity to cut through West Ham.
On the ball, the biggest difference in the second half was Diaby coming on for Duran. He was dropping deep and giving us the extra option where Duran was stuck forlornly up top, and it changed all the angles. Extremely weird that he didn't start with this.
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Cash had a really good game yesterday. If he could add consistency to his game he'd be great.
When he's played as a right back in a back 4 he's consistently good.
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Cash had a really good game yesterday. If he could add consistency to his game he'd be great.
When he's played as a right back in a back 4 he's consistently good.
He's consistently...iffy. He struggles to move the ball into midfield, he tends to hold it for too long, concedes a lot of needless throw-ins, and is very often the one failing to step up to make the offside trap.
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Cash had a really good game yesterday. If he could add consistency to his game he'd be great.
He did. However there was a break in the 2nd half where he really should have shot, but pulled it back to no-one.
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I really hope in the next game we get the starting line up right. It was great that Unai’s subs changed it, but it would be nice to get the combinations right from the start.
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Cash had a really good game yesterday. If he could add consistency to his game he'd be great.
He did. However there was a break in the 2nd half where he really should have shot, but pulled it back to no-one.
That was a great run though but yeah chose the wrong option in the end.
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Guardian: '“We think they are goals but VAR are the ones who decide, not us,” said David Moyes, attempting to keep his own counsel though increasingly agitated. “The referee I think chose good because there was a handball,” said the Villa goalscorer, Nicolò Zaniolo. Conclusion: VAR decisions remain forever in the eye of the beholder.'
No, Zaniolo's right because there was a handball and Moyes is just sulking. I mean, it's literally the rule.
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Guardian: '“We think they are goals but VAR are the ones who decide, not us,” said David Moyes, attempting to keep his own counsel though increasingly agitated. “The referee I think chose good because there was a handball,” said the Villa goalscorer, Nicolò Zaniolo. Conclusion: VAR decisions remain forever in the eye of the beholder.'
No, Zaniolo's right because there was a handball and Moyes is just sulking. I mean, it's literally the rule.
That wound me up reading it this morning, proper 'both sides' bollocks. The talking points should be why the officials missed two blatant offences when they happened.
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It was the most stick on handball you'll see all season. How we didn't get a penalty God only knows.
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Did Leon intentionally play it onto the defender's arm to try and win the penalty? I'm not saying that negates the shout for it, just that it didn't look like a great pass regardless of the contact.
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Cash had a really good game yesterday. If he could add consistency to his game he'd be great.
When he's played as a right back in a back 4 he's consistently good.
He's consistently...iffy. He struggles to move the ball into midfield, he tends to hold it for too long, concedes a lot of needless throw-ins, and is very often the one failing to step up to make the offside trap.
Not great against decent wingers, But we were better with him yesterday.
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Did Leon intentionally play it onto the defender's arm to try and win the penalty? I'm not saying that negates the shout for it, just that it didn't look like a great pass regardless of the contact.
That thought did cross my mind.
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Konsa at right back/right center back worked when Carlos played well, and would presumably work if Mings weren't out. The trouble is with Lenglet inside being too easily bullied defending counters.
not a right back for me
he has limited technical ability and shows very little forward progresion with the ball and just doesnt look comfortable there because i dont think its his position
He's not meant to get forward, it's not an orthodox right back role. The idea of having him there is that, in possession, he and the two centre backs shuffle across to make a three leaving the left back free to go very far forward indeed. Emery didn't invent this, though he did win more than one Europa League with it, and it worked great when we beat Man City and Arsenal inside a week.
Fair enough, I can see the reasons he plays it sometimes I just don’t think he is a good enough player in that position
You’re happy to see him play there I’m not it’s just the way it is with Football opinions
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I think it goes wrong when the centre-backs inside either aren't up to it or have a bad day. Konsa is our best recovery defender against counters while Tyrone's out, and though Carlos is capable physically he has his brainless days while Lenglet really ought to only deputise Pau's role.
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Did Leon intentionally play it onto the defender's arm to try and win the penalty? I'm not saying that negates the shout for it, just that it didn't look like a great pass regardless of the contact.
It looked that way , a little flick up not sure what else that pass was meant for .
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Did Leon intentionally play it onto the defender's arm to try and win the penalty? I'm not saying that negates the shout for it, just that it didn't look like a great pass regardless of the contact.
It looked that way , a little flick up not sure what else that pass was meant for .
The only way their defender could have been asking for it more was if he'd held a banner out saying "hit me here".
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Did Leon intentionally play it onto the defender's arm to try and win the penalty? I'm not saying that negates the shout for it, just that it didn't look like a great pass regardless of the contact.
Without doubt, which brings into question the arm to ball argument.
Although i have no idea what constitutes a penalty decision these days, its random.
On this subject, I keep hearing them go on about deliberate handball for their second disallowed goal, I thought the law was, if the ball touches the part of hand /arm in the build up to a goal its is handball regardless of intent.
Or have they changed it again?
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Whatever Bailey's intention, a handball for me.
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Did Leon intentionally play it onto the defender's arm to try and win the penalty? I'm not saying that negates the shout for it, just that it didn't look like a great pass regardless of the contact.
Without doubt, which brings into question the arm to ball argument.
Although i have no idea what constitutes a penalty decision these days, its random.
On this subject, I keep hearing them go on about deliberate handball for their second disallowed goal, I thought the law was, if the ball touches the part of hand /arm in the build up to a goal its is handball regardless of intent.
Or have they changed it again?
I think its handball if it hits the goals scorers hand in the act of scoring (accidentally or not), if it accidentally hits a players hand then someone else scores it is ok.
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Did Leon intentionally play it onto the defender's arm to try and win the penalty? I'm not saying that negates the shout for it, just that it didn't look like a great pass regardless of the contact.
Without doubt, which brings into question the arm to ball argument.
Although i have no idea what constitutes a penalty decision these days, its random.
On this subject, I keep hearing them go on about deliberate handball for their second disallowed goal, I thought the law was, if the ball touches the part of hand /arm in the build up to a goal its is handball regardless of intent.
Or have they changed it again?
I'd have been angry if that handball had been given against us to be honest. His arm was already in that position, he didn't move towards the ball and was quite close.
I think those considerations should be some kind of benchmark for decisions going forward. Had his arm or body moved after Bailey had flicked the ball up then definitely a pen.
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I thought he was trying to dink it through to Konsa who had come into the box
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All the palaver about the disallowed goal, could have been avoided if Dougie hadn't given away a needless free kick, I love the bloke, but the one thing I don't like is the number of needless free kicks he gives away in dangerous areas, in a season.
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Cash had a really good game yesterday. If he could add consistency to his game he'd be great.
When he's played as a right back in a back 4 he's consistently good.
He's consistently...iffy. He struggles to move the ball into midfield, he tends to hold it for too long, concedes a lot of needless throw-ins, and is very often the one failing to step up to make the offside trap.
Believe it or not but most other RBs in world football do this. Do Arsenal or Man. City RBs never concede throw ins? Not sure what the definition of needless is here really?
Not stepping up for offside can happen for anyone. Pau moved into space yesterday to try to cut out the cross but he misread the flight and it just sailed over him onto Antonio's head so that's a world class defender just mis-reading a situation, it happens.
Cash is alright. Might not be good enough for CL next year but generally he's served us very well over last four years and been a regular part of some very solid defensive units.
He's proven himself so bit bemusing the amount of stick he gets.
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Did Leon intentionally play it onto the defender's arm to try and win the penalty? I'm not saying that negates the shout for it, just that it didn't look like a great pass regardless of the contact.
It looked that way , a little flick up not sure what else that pass was meant for .
Konsa had made a run into the box so it was a chipped pass going to him.
I thought it was a penalty and very surprised it didn't go to the screen. West Ham conceded a similar one two weeks ago when Zouma handled at Everton from a similar distance.
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If its a deliberate handball, which it clearly was (he's trying to Jay Rodriguez the ball over the line) then you disallow it regardless of where else it goes before it pops in during that phase.
Both decisions were clear and correct.
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Cash had a really good game yesterday. If he could add consistency to his game he'd be great.
When he's played as a right back in a back 4 he's consistently good.
He's consistently...iffy. He struggles to move the ball into midfield, he tends to hold it for too long, concedes a lot of needless throw-ins, and is very often the one failing to step up to make the offside trap.
Believe it or not but most other RBs in world football do this. Do Arsenal or Man. City RBs never concede throw ins? Not sure what the definition of needless is here really?
Not stepping up for offside can happen for anyone. Pau moved into space yesterday to try to cut out the cross but he misread the flight and it just sailed over him onto Antonio's head so that's a world class defender just mis-reading a situation, it happens.
Cash is alright. Might not be good enough for CL next year but generally he's served us very well over last four years and been a regular part of some very solid defensive units.
He's proven himself so bit bemusing the amount of stick he gets.
Needless because if he were technically better he could get out of the situations he finds himself in. I like him, I think he's absolutely fine, and his passion and hard work aren't just endearing but point-winning (i.e. that massive block late on), but he does have some notable deficiencies.
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I think he suffers more from "noted" deficiencies. He's one of those whose mistakes are highlighted, while others - Luiz say - are under a less critical microscope. I don't even think it's personal, just a weird football thing.
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I think he suffers more from "noted" deficiencies. He's one of those whose mistakes are highlighted, while others - Luiz say - are under a less critical microscope. I don't even think it's personal, just a weird football thing.
Luiz is better than Cash.
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Just coming up to one.
It was a comparison of treatment, not ability.
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Did Leon intentionally play it onto the defender's arm to try and win the penalty? I'm not saying that negates the shout for it, just that it didn't look like a great pass regardless of the contact.
It looked that way , a little flick up not sure what else that pass was meant for .
Konsa had made a run into the box so it was a chipped pass going to him.
I thought it was a penalty and very surprised it didn't go to the screen. West Ham conceded a similar one two weeks ago when Zouma handled at Everton from a similar distance.
It didn't go to screen because the Ref would have told VAR he had seen it and didn't judge it as deliberate (Ball-2-hand, not hand-2-ball). IF he hadn't have seen it at all or said it came off the defenders chest, then VAR could have picked up the clear and obvious error.
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Just coming up to one.
It was a comparison of treatment, not ability.
We do like our scapegoats a bit, probably a football fan thing as you say. Everyone has that one player they love to single out whenever anything goes wrong whether it was their fault or not.
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All players can be upgraded, but Cash in a back four has been a big part of our success, and most of the times he's been less than stellar have been where Emery has messed arund with the formation. I'd say Moreno, Tielemans, Diaby, Lenglet, Zaniolo, and Carlos have all had more disappointing seasons and contributed less, for a variety of reasons.
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I've heard and even read some ridiculous reasons for why the pen wasn't given for Bailey's flick onto the defender's arm. The one regarding 'he wasn't playing the ball but pointing at something or other' being the most. So pointing at something and the ball hits your outstretched arm isn't a deliberate hand ball? He can carry out the pointing function but not pull his arm into his side to help prevent a hand ball? The proximity of Bailey's flick has nothing to do with it. His arm's outstretched and it's the most hand ball and pen of pens you will likely see. Christ knows what the ref was thinking.
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Whatever Bailey's intention, a handball for me.
Same here. It would be different if he'd flicked it to no one in particular, but it was heading towards the six-yard box.
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Re the Bailey pen….i can understand the excuse for not giving it being that he was too close but according to Dermot Gallagher it was a natual arm position because he was pointing for a team mate…what a load of nonsense, his arm is out to make him a bigger target to get past
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I've heard and even read some ridiculous reasons for why the pen wasn't given for Bailey's flick onto the defender's arm. The one regarding 'he wasn't playing the ball but pointing at something or other' being the most. So pointing at something and the ball hits your outstretched arm isn't a deliberate hand ball? He can carry out the pointing function but not pull his arm into his side to help prevent a hand ball? The proximity of Bailey's flick has nothing to do with it. His arm's outstretched and it's the most hand ball and pen of pens you will likely see. Christ knows what the ref was thinking.
The proximity one makes me laugh, like if a striker tries to turn the ball in on the six yard line and you fly across to palm it away that's ok because it was close?
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All players can be upgraded, but Cash in a back four has been a big part of our success, and most of the times he's been less than stellar have been where Emery has messed arund with the formation. I'd say Moreno, Tielemans, Diaby, Lenglet, Zaniolo, and Carlos have all had more disappointing seasons and contributed less, for a variety of reasons.
Agree with that list of players more disappointing than Cash overall, but his poorer performances absolutely have not just been down to the formation. His struggles with stepping up to hold the offside line have all been, naturally, while playing in his favoured role.
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All players can be upgraded, but Cash in a back four has been a big part of our success, and most of the times he's been less than stellar have been where Emery has messed arund with the formation. I'd say Moreno, Tielemans, Diaby, Lenglet, Zaniolo, and Carlos have all had more disappointing seasons and contributed less, for a variety of reasons.
Agree with that list of players more disappointing than Cash overall, but his poorer performances absolutely have not just been down to the formation. His struggles with stepping up to hold the offside line have all been, naturally, while playing in his favoured role.
I love him but he was shocking in both the Chelsea and Newcastle home defeats quite recently.
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Cash performed well yesterday and is an integral part of the squad. Can we improve on his position with a better standard of player? Too right we can and it's one area of the squad we need to look at. I'd still keep him mind>
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Did Leon intentionally play it onto the defender's arm to try and win the penalty? I'm not saying that negates the shout for it, just that it didn't look like a great pass regardless of the contact.
Without doubt, which brings into question the arm to ball argument.
Although i have no idea what constitutes a penalty decision these days, its random.
On this subject, I keep hearing them go on about deliberate handball for their second disallowed goal, I thought the law was, if the ball touches the part of hand /arm in the build up to a goal its is handball regardless of intent.
Or have they changed it again?
I'd have been angry if that handball had been given against us to be honest. His arm was already in that position, he didn't move towards the ball and was quite close.
I think those considerations should be some kind of benchmark for decisions going forward. Had his arm or body moved after Bailey had flicked the ball up then definitely a pen.
But you just know if Cash or Konsa stood with their arm out and ball hits it from a Man U, Liverpool, City, Arsenal cross that's a penalty.
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Be good to hear the VAR room and why they didn't give the Pen ?
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Be good to hear the VAR room and why they didn't give the Pen ?
That was the ref's call and he'd seen it, they're not going to overturn it, like if he'd given it they wouldn't have gone against that either.
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Be good to hear the VAR room and why they didn't give the Pen ?
That was the ref's call and he'd seen it, they're not going to overturn it, like if he'd given it they wouldn't have gone against that either.
Ah yeah , keep forgetting the process they follow.
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I noticed that the rest of the team barely celebrated with him
Martyn, there is no conspiracy theory potential here, the rest of the team didn't really want to have extended celebrations as their mindset to go again and get a winner.
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I love him but he was shocking in both the Chelsea and Newcastle home defeats quite recently.
And that placed lot of pressure on Moreno who had to be equally shocking to maintain balance ;D
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I love him but he was shocking in both the Chelsea and Newcastle home defeats quite recently.
And that placed lot of pressure on Moreno who had to be equally shocking to maintain balance ;D
Who did step up to the plate in that regard mind
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I think he suffers more from "noted" deficiencies. He's one of those whose mistakes are highlighted, while others - Luiz say - are under a less critical microscope. I don't even think it's personal, just a weird football thing.
Luiz is better than Cash.
Luiz still has his off nights. Him v Everton in the league cup was probably his worst game for us in three years so when he's off it the whole team dips compared to Cash.
Chambers in Warsaw remains the most horrific full back performance I've seen from one of ours since the dark times of the 2010s so while Cashy has his off days he's come nowhere near to that level of inteptness this season or last.
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To be honest I thought the analysis by Warnock (S) on MOTD was spot on. Invariably we were picking the wrong pass at the back or players weren’t creating enough space. You could see from the analysis that the right pass would have created the opportunity to cut through West Ham.
On the ball, the biggest difference in the second half was Diaby coming on for Duran. He was dropping deep and giving us the extra option where Duran was stuck forlornly up top, and it changed all the angles. Extremely weird that he didn't start with this.
What seems increasingly apparent this season is that Emery likes to try and keep it tight early on and then finish games off later. He's changing a few things around to try stuff out, and whilst it may not appear to be working, it's generally been effective.... to a point. I think yesterday was one of those games. I guess we could level an accusation that he is messing about too much, but also, I think he's trying not to be predictable, because we started to be found out a little with the high press when playing our usual way. With Kamara, McGinn and Ramsey out of midfield, we were a little light and trying Duran up front was trying to stretch the pitch a bit I think.
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I love him but he was shocking in both the Chelsea and Newcastle home defeats quite recently.
And that placed lot of pressure on Moreno who had to be equally shocking to maintain balance ;D
Who did step up to the plate in that regard mind
Yes there have been games where the whole team has just been off it, from the first minute to last. Thankfully they've been relatively rare, both halves against Spurs and the first against West Ham were dismal though.
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To be honest I thought the analysis by Warnock (S) on MOTD was spot on. Invariably we were picking the wrong pass at the back or players weren’t creating enough space. You could see from the analysis that the right pass would have created the opportunity to cut through West Ham.
On the ball, the biggest difference in the second half was Diaby coming on for Duran. He was dropping deep and giving us the extra option where Duran was stuck forlornly up top, and it changed all the angles. Extremely weird that he didn't start with this.
What seems increasingly apparent this season is that Emery likes to try and keep it tight early on and then finish games off later. He's changing a few things around to try stuff out, and whilst it may not appear to be working, it's generally been effective.... to a point. I think yesterday was one of those games. I guess we could level an accusation that he is messing about too much, but also, I think he's trying not to be predictable, because we started to be found out a little with the high press when playing our usual way. With Kamara, McGinn and Ramsey out of midfield, we were a little light and trying Duran up front was trying to stretch the pitch a bit I think.
Which is strange seeing as we are better going forwards than defensively and have blown numerous teams away by half time during Emery's reign. It's not a plan I like to see from us.
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First time I've been there and yes it's a horrible stadium. How many times was, I'm forever blowing bubbles played? Then there was Marlon Harewood predicting 4-1 to West Ham on the big screen before the game.
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Be good to hear the VAR room and why they didn't give the Pen ?
That was the ref's call and he'd seen it, they're not going to overturn it, like if he'd given it they wouldn't have gone against that either.
What happened to the clear and obvious error in this instance? It's the whole purpose of VAR is it not?
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Harewood has become one of their ambassadors instead of us? Gutted...thank God McGrath for Tayles and Elmo.
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VAR got two decisions right and one wrong for me. Was a game of 3 handballs.
Cash, Konsa, Torres & Digne/Moreno - stop trying to shoe horn Lenglet in, if he was as good with the ball as he clearly thinks is he’d be captain of Barcelona not farmed out to us
The Spammers handball wasn't VAR but the ref. He was looking straight at it so told VAR he had seen it and didn't think it was deliberate. The players arm was out as he was pointing to his team mate and the ball was played against it. Not a natural position, but not deliberately lifted to block it so would always be on-field call.
This means nothing. One takes a chance when sticking the arm out for any reason. His arm stopped a pass in the box and it was out because he decided to stick it out to point. Bad choice in that situation and absolutely should have been called a hand ball. One of the worst decisions I have ever seen.
I thought this whole 'deliberate' thing had been chucked out. If the ball hits an arm that is not tucked in, it's a foul.
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Harewood has become one of their ambassadors instead of us? Gutted...thank God McGrath for Tayles and Elmo.
Marlon I can't ever forgive for that game at Spurs when he came on when we're 4-1 as sub for the final 9 mins and it finished 4-4.
Like a reverse lucky charm.
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From the BBC Villa page, this is supposedly feedback from our fans....
Keith: We were lucky not to lose this game, but it was a very welcome point. Villa played well and were the better team. We have to be better in defence and, more importantly, in front of goal, if we are going to consolidate a fourth-place finish.
Brian: A poor first half for Villa, with some very sloppy work in defence. There were too many unforced errors. We looked like a different team in the second half but, in the end, we were lucky to come away with a point.
Paul: We dodged one at the end, but it was a fair result overall. I think West Ham were better in first half, but Villa were much better in the second half.
Pammy: As usual, a sub-standard and lethargic performance after a European tie. Far too casual in the first half, but thankfully a point rescued by the second half substitutes and change in formation. The Watkins-Duran idea just didn’t work and Rogers is not good enough. A decent point in the end and it keeps the pressure on Spurs and Manchester United. Another fairy step to a top-four finish!
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Harewood has become one of their ambassadors instead of us? Gutted...thank God McGrath for Tayles and Elmo.
Marlon I can't ever forgive for that game at Spurs when he came on when we're 4-1 as sub for the final 9 mins and it finished 4-4.
Like a reverse lucky charm.
I always had a soft spot for big Marlon. Wasn't there one season he was second only to Ronaldo in goals per minute* on the pitch?
*At least till fairly late in Premier League season.
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Did Leon intentionally play it onto the defender's arm to try and win the penalty? I'm not saying that negates the shout for it, just that it didn't look like a great pass regardless of the contact.
Without doubt, which brings into question the arm to ball argument.
Although i have no idea what constitutes a penalty decision these days, its random.
On this subject, I keep hearing them go on about deliberate handball for their second disallowed goal, I thought the law was, if the ball touches the part of hand /arm in the build up to a goal its is handball regardless of intent.
Or have they changed it again?
I think its handball if it hits the goals scorers hand in the act of scoring (accidentally or not), if it accidentally hits a players hand then someone else scores it is ok.
Yep. The WHAM first handball was deliberate, so no goal, then Bowen broke the accidental or not rule, so no goal, and Konsa was also fouled, so no goal. You’d have to be mad to think it was a goal.
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And feedback from West Ham fans...
West Ham fans
Jay: Absolutely robbed! VAR is ruining football. Taking 10 minutes to make a decision is not 'obvious' and it shouldn't count. VAR has robbed us in the past three games. The lads played unbelievably and Moyes should come out like this every week!
Dave: Yet again another Moyes cock up with the use of substitutes. Why, with a fair length of the game to go, does Moyes take off our main striker and put on a defender. It’s senseless when you have that much time left and are only one goal up. This is two points lost because of poor management. Hurry up and go, Moyes.
Richard: Moyes' tactics again. He took off Antonio and brought on a defender, Ben Johnson, who is arguably not Premier League quality anyway. If Antonio is tired, why not replace him with Danny Ings? 1-0 was not enough. We needed to attack, not defend the lead.
Ted: Once more, terrible officiating in the Premier League. The richest football league in the world. Awful officiating every week - week in and week out. The pundits and fans talk about the execrable referees and bizarre VAR.
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Forever blowing bubbles from their backsides.
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Just read that. Ridiculous, they’re clearly infringements.
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Interestingly Gallagher on Sky this morning said that if VAR had decided that the handball was not deliberate and so was a valid goal then they would have defaulted to did Souchek foul Konza which apparently thought was obvious when he saw it live. All comforting but if that the case why didn't they start there!
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Interestingly Gallagher on Sky this morning said that if VAR had decided that the handball was not deliberate and so was a valid goal then they would have defaulted to did Souchek foul Konza which apparently thought was obvious when he saw it live. All comforting but if that the case why didn't they start there!
HE would have done Konsa foul, not necessarily the refs on the pitch would have.
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He would have expected VAR to go back and look for interference yes because he thought it was a clear foul, but whether VAR having cleared the handball would have looked for anything else is doubtful. Unlike when Ings goal was chalked off at Old Trafford
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He would have expected VAR to go back and look for interference yes because he thought it was a clear foul, but whether VAR having cleared the handball would have looked for anything else is doubtful. Unlike when Ings goal was chalked off at Old Trafford
Yeah that still rankles with me. They were going to go back and find a reason to chalk that goal off no matter what. I thought 28 minutes was a bit much at the time and I stand by that.
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Re the Bailey pen….i can understand the excuse for not giving it being that he was too close but according to Dermot Gallagher it was a natual arm position because he was pointing for a team mate…what a load of nonsense, his arm is out to make him a bigger target to get past
I didn't mind it not being given for the reasons above, if that is a consistent benchmark that is used. You know full though that a pen will be given next week for something similar.
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Cash performed well yesterday and is an integral part of the squad. Can we improve on his position with a better standard of player? Too right we can and it's one area of the squad we need to look at. I'd still keep him mind>
Some of his better performances have been.when he has come on. I would probably keep him, but bring another RB in to mirror the Moreno / Digne combination on the left.
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Re the Bailey pen….i can understand the excuse for not giving it being that he was too close but according to Dermot Gallagher it was a natual arm position because he was pointing for a team mate…what a load of nonsense, his arm is out to make him a bigger target to get past
I didn't mind it not being given for the reasons above, if that is a consistent benchmark that is used. You know full though that a pen will be given next week for something similar.
But that is always the case for subjective decisions no matter what they are. We have seen at least 3 times Watkins pushed over when about to shoot and nothing given, this weekend it is a penalty and a red card. I expect in the recent case the ref explained he didn't see it and so VAR told him the error and he then could review and change his mind. In the other cases the Ref explained he had seen it and decided it didn't warrant anything and VAR can't over-rule the on field decision as it is not a definitive case.
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I think the pointing as being a “natural position” is just daft, because if that’s the case it’ll just get gamed.
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I think the pointing as being a “natural position” is just daft, because if that’s the case it’ll just get gamed.
Ashley Westwood could play for a thousand years and never concede a single penalty.
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I think the pointing as being a “natural position” is just daft, because if that’s the case it’ll just get gamed.
Can’t remember which Spurs defender gave away a penalty two minutes into the chimps league final in 2019 but he was waving a team mate to cover the other side of the box and handled the ball. The ref had no problem awarding that one ( can’t recall if VAR was in use by then)
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I think the pointing as being a “natural position” is just daft, because if that’s the case it’ll just get gamed.
Ashley Westwood could play for a thousand years and never concede a single penalty.
Ash didn't do his best pointing in either box.
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Can’t remember which Spurs defender gave away a penalty two minutes into the chimps league final in 2019 but he was waving a team mate to cover the other side of the box and handled the ball. The ref had no problem awarding that one ( can’t recall if VAR was in use by then)
30 seconds into the game Mane tried to flick the ball past Moussa Sissoko, it hit his chest and then onto his pointing arm. Ref gave a pen and VAR check confirmed it.
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Can’t remember which Spurs defender gave away a penalty two minutes into the chimps league final in 2019 but he was waving a team mate to cover the other side of the box and handled the ball. The ref had no problem awarding that one ( can’t recall if VAR was in use by then)
30 seconds into the game Mane tried to flick the ball past Moussa Sissoko, it hit his chest and then onto his pointing arm. Ref gave a pen and VAR check confirmed it.
Cheers Aftab. I had a Spurs supporting mate over from China for that and he was frothing at the mouth.
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Interestingly Gallagher on Sky this morning said that if VAR had decided that the handball was not deliberate and so was a valid goal then they would have defaulted to did Souchek foul Konza which apparently thought was obvious when he saw it live. All comforting but if that the case why didn't they start there!
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The rule is very clear; if a hand is used in a build up to a goal it’s no goal, even if its unavoidable. In the other box it’s different. Why can’t fans understand this. If you think it’s a shit rule, you may well be right, but VAR and the ref called it correct. They don’t set the rules. Of course it’s frustrating when you have a 97th minute winner ruled out, but it’s fair. What isn’t fair is making both sets of fans wait 7 minutes. Totally ridiculous.
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The rule is very clear; if a hand is used in a build up to a goal it’s no goal, even if its unavoidable. In the other box it’s different. Why can’t fans understand this. If you think it’s a shit rule, you may well be right, but VAR and the ref called it correct. They don’t set the rules. Of course it’s frustrating when you have a 97th minute winner ruled out, but it’s fair. What isn’t fair is making both sets of fans wait 7 minutes. Totally ridiculous.
Erm not quite now as they changed the any handball in a build up last year. If the hand is used by the goal scorer when in the act of scoring, either directly or indirectly then it is no goal. But if Soucek had the ball hit his arm without the conscious movement he made to play it, it might have still counted as it then hit Bowen before going in. Weird quirk that it is only the goal scorer who can't accidently handball it but any other player can if it hits another team mate. (Not sure on opposition defender but not keeper as they cover that).
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It's not exactly a surprise VAR takes so long when the rule is so complicated.
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There was also a lot to look at. Offside, handball by Bowen, handball by Soucek, did the ball go straight in off Soucek or hit Bowen first, and then the foul.
Gallagher seemed to indicate they checked the offside first, then worked their way backwards on each of the others. I expect the first two were definite so if one counted, on-field ref is not needed. Then the Soucek handball and foul on Konsa are subjective so needed to ensure they had video to send to the ref for clear and obvious decisions.
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It's all very long winded and boring. From Moyes' nonsensical ''were due a few handball goals'' to over examining West Wimbledon's piles of Uruk Hai scrambling around on the goal line trying to fist the ball over the line. It looked as ridiculous as their free Tory crony stadium.
Rule the goal out.
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There was also a lot to look at. Offside, handball by Bowen, handball by Soucek, did the ball go straight in off Soucek or hit Bowen first, and then the foul.
Gallagher seemed to indicate they checked the offside first, then worked their way backwards on each of the others. I expect the first two were definite so if one counted, on-field ref is not needed. Then the Soucek handball and foul on Konsa are subjective so needed to ensure they had video to send to the ref for clear and obvious decisions.
Darren Cann was in yesterday with our u18s. He was open to discussing the above and agreed the right decision was made. The ref was sent to the monitor because the goal was initially given and VAR suggested otherwise.
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For all the wheres and wherefores of the VAR decision and whether it was correct by the letter of the law, the fact of the matter is, it benefitted us, and thereby it is morally correct, which overrides anything you'll find in the laws of the game.
CASE CLOSED
*bangs gavel*
(yes, yes, I know they don't).
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For all the wheres and wherefores of the VAR decision and whether it was correct by the letter of the law, the fact of the matter is, it benefitted us, and thereby it is morally correct, which overrides anything you'll find in the laws of the game.
CASE CLOSED
*bangs gavel*
(yes, yes, I know they don't).
I bet they have the Union FLag behind when they do(n't)
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For all the wheres and wherefores of the VAR decision and whether it was correct by the letter of the law, the fact of the matter is, it benefitted us, and thereby it is morally correct, which overrides anything you'll find in the laws of the game.
CASE CLOSED
*bangs gavel*
(yes, yes, I know they don't).
I bet they have the Union FLag behind when they do(n't)
Probably upside down as well.
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For all the wheres and wherefores of the VAR decision and whether it was correct by the letter of the law, the fact of the matter is, it benefitted us, and thereby it is morally correct, which overrides anything you'll find in the laws of the game.
CASE CLOSED
*bangs gavel*
(yes, yes, I know they don't).
I bet they have the Union FLag behind when they do(n't)
It was a reference to the gavel. I am pretty sure that (the fact they don't use them in British courts) has been one of those "aha, yes, but" things on here before.
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For all the wheres and wherefores of the VAR decision and whether it was correct by the letter of the law, the fact of the matter is, it benefitted us, and thereby it is morally correct, which overrides anything you'll find in the laws of the game.
CASE CLOSED
*bangs gavel*
(yes, yes, I know they don't).
I bet they have the Union FLag behind when they do(n't)
It was a reference to the gavel. I am pretty sure that (the fact they don't use them in British courts) has been one of those "aha, yes, but" things on here before.
I know, I was just referencing your (very similar topic re flags) post of yesterday....
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Gotcha!
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Gotcha!
Thanks Noel.
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Aside from the VAR decisions, I thought our efforts defending those set pieces was piss poor. Their goal was appalling too, Rogers turning his back on the cross, Torres again caught behind the defensive line (same v Fulham for the late Traore chance) and Antonio scores.
Crosses are coming into our box too easy lately, see that Fulham goal or Man United winner. We are giving away set pieces too easy, stupid Luiz foul for the late VAR incident for example. Konsa gave away a ridiculous free kick for one of the Luton goals too. Even with 3 x CBs we can't defend them either. Discipline in and out of possession needs to improve, Wolves will target set pieces for sure.
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Aside from the VAR decisions, I thought our efforts defending those set pieces was piss poor. Their goal was appalling too, Rogers turning his back on the cross, Torres again caught behind the defensive line (same v Fulham for the late Traore chance) and Antonio scores.
Crosses are coming into our box too easy lately, see that Fulham goal or Man United winner. We are giving away set pieces too easy, stupid Luiz foul for the late VAR incident for example. Konsa gave away a ridiculous free kick for one of the Luton goals too. Even with 3 x CBs we can't defend them either. Discipline in and out of possession needs to improve, Wolves will target set pieces for sure.
Grim reading about a team in 4th place.
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I did hear about a team who got a set-piece coach in and the improvement in defending them was almost immediate. I listen to so many podcasts about this shit I can’t for the life of me remember who it was, but maybe we need one. AM seems okay at the attacking ones.
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Have we scored from many set pieces this season ? We seem to try lots of different innovative deliveries but I can't remember too many going in. Torres at Spurs springs to mind.
Watkins header at Luton too.
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Set piece goals this season.
1. Arsenal – 12 goals
2. Everton – 11 goals
3. Tottenham – 9 goals
=4. Wolves – 8 goals
=4. Luton – 8 goals
=4. Manchester City – 8 goals
=7. Newcastle – 7 goals
=7. Aston Villa – 7 goals
=9. West Ham – 6 goals
=9. Brentford – 6 goals
=11. Chelsea – 5 goals
=11. Liverpool – 5 goals
=11. Fulham – 5 goals
=14. Manchester United – 4 goals
=14. Bournemouth – 4 goals
16. Brighton – 3 goals
=17. Sheffield United – 2 goals
=17. Burnley – 2 goals
=17. Nottingham Forest – 2 goals
20. Crystal Palace – 1 goal
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Cheers , slightly above average then , unless that includes pens too.
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Cheers , slightly above average then , unless that includes pens too.
It doesn't include pens as Liverpool has been given 8 and scored 5 so that would mean they haven't scored from one corner or freekick routine.
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I did hear about a team who got a set-piece coach in and the improvement in defending them was almost immediate. I listen to so many podcasts about this shit I can’t for the life of me remember who it was, but maybe we need one. AM seems okay at the attacking ones.
I was listening to the Monday night club on 5 live and was surprised to discover that Shay Given has been a set piece coach. They also brought on a fella who had been the coach at Wimbledon ( I think ) to explain the role and how they prepare for games.
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Cheers , slightly above average then , unless that includes pens too.
It doesn't include pens as Liverpool has been given 8 and scored 5 so that would mean they haven't scored from one corner or freekick routine.
Cheers.
We've done some lovely intricate moves from set pieces and you just want one of them to come off as people will sit up and go wow !
Then there's the argument just get it in there and you see goals like Watkins at luton and Torres at Spurs.
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On Sky last night Howard Webb said that whilst his arm was in an unnatural position he didn’t move it towards the bell. All of this is true but a completely different penalty interpretation than we’ve been given before. They back fill the answer to the decision.
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Cheers , slightly above average then , unless that includes pens too.
It doesn't include pens as Liverpool has been given 8 and scored 5 so that would mean they haven't scored from one corner or freekick routine.
Cheers.
We've done some lovely intricate moves from set pieces and you just want one of them to come off as people will sit up and go wow !
Then there's the argument just get it in there and you see goals like Watkins at luton and Torres at Spurs.
So that’s the thing. To score goals like Ollie’s headers v Luton and Ajax we need teams to be fearful of our so called intricate set pieces and we slip a simple one in.