Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: wozwebs on November 13, 2013, 10:14:32 PM
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Lots of rumours on Twitter that Red Bull want to a) Buy us or b) the naming rights to Villa Park.
Seems someone read this in the Mirror and put our name in the mix and off it went into twitter overdrive
http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/red-bull-looking-buy-english-2366075
What if it were true though?
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Just a rumour. Everton sites had the same nonsense a few weeks back. As did we.
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It'll be nonsense. I saw that on twitter earlier, and it seems to have been resurrected by this:
Dave Beeston @mini_beest 2h
Intresting rumour of Red Bull & #avfc from @thebellsarering. Didnt collymore tweet something the other day about the name & colours?
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If you look at the account he mentions, they said this:
Belley @thebellsarering 2h
Anyone heard any rumours about Red Bull looking to buy naming rights for Villa Park?? #avfc
That's an account with 900 followers.
Following that, there's much chatter about Red Bull buying Villa, and it all stems from an article last month (by Alan Nixon, one of the least reliable "journalists" out there) in the Mirror, and some random bloke saying the above to resurrect it.
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Will they be in a timeshare with that Arab potentate who was buying us last year and the curry house owners from Sutton from the year before?
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They can buy Aston Villa just remember we won't change the colours, kit, team name or stadium name. and we demand Red Bull renamed to Gold Lion :)
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How can we sponsored by Red Bull with no wingers ?
I'll get my coat.
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We should hold out to become "Microsoft Villa" and play at "Budweiser Stadium at Villa Park".
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Red bullshit. I love Twitter. Not.
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The papers are convinced they want to buy an English club so expect to hear this rumour crop up on slow news days every other month for the rest of the season. On the alternative months it will be Everton they are buying. They might also throw Newcastle's name into the mix occasionally just to vary it a bit.
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Seems like a load of bull to me.
Maybe we can use our celeb fans to sway it our way - a few knighthoods ;)
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I reckon they'll either take over Orient and be Red Bull London or take on Middlesbrough and be Middlesbrough Red Bulls.
For no particular reason, except that if it now happens I can claim I was a genius all along.
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Cardiff Red Bulls.
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I reckon they'll either take over Orient and be Red Bull London or take on Middlesbrough and be Middlesbrough Red Bulls.
For no particular reason, except that if it now happens I can claim I was a genius all along.
I have a vision of West Ham's opening game in the Olympic Stadium being at home to Orient in the Championship.
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Whatb does Julie have to say on this?
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Claret n Blue Bull Villa?
Heard this rumour a couple of weeks ago. Apparently we are more attractive than other options. For a number of reasons.
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Whatb does Julie have to say on this?
I think she's in hiding after the absolute arse she made of herself in the summer.
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Red Bull Hull Tigers
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Red Bull Hull Tigers
Red Bhull Tigers
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In any case owners cannot just simply change the name of a team in England as it needs to go through a vetting process, which includes consultation with the fans. Personally, if we were given billions to spend they could dress us up in royal blue leotards and call us Red Bull whores FC...
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In any case owners cannot just simply change the name of a team in England as it needs to go through a vetting process, which includes consultation with the fans.
That said, I was listening to Talksport the night the Hull City name change confirmation broke and a Hull fan rang up and said he was part of a group who the club discussed their concerns with. It didn't seem to do them any good.
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In any case owners cannot just simply change the name of a team in England as it needs to go through a vetting process, which includes consultation with the fans.
That said, I was listening to Talksport the night the Hull City name change confirmation broke and a Hull fan rang up and said he was part of a group who the club discussed their concerns with. It didn't seem to do them any good.
I'd imagine it was along the lines of:
Club: "We're changing the name of the club to something really shit. What do you think?'
Fans: "We don't like it."
Cliub: "Ah well, them's the breaks."
Consultation over.
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This bull shit gives me red mist.
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What if Red Bull replace the logo with Bull instead of the Lions. Then buy Bull Ring and called it Red Bull Ring.
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The smell of that stuff always makes me want to puke.
Years ago, thought it was a good idea to spend a night on RB & Vodka's.
Villa Park would be stinking of the stuff if they did buy us - served at every outlet! Shudder....
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Taking it as certain that this is a load of Bull...
How would people feel if we did get taken over with someone willing to put big money in?
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The Red Bull Arena, home of Aston Villa.
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Whatb does Julie have to say on this?
They already own RB Leipzig. Same country that Kiyotake plays in. The connection is clear.
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The Red Bull Arena, home of Aston Villa.
Nein danke.
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Whatb does Julie have to say on this?
Probably some sort of really ill-advised nonsense about Hitler having been an Austrian therefore we shouldn't be surprised at the way they're acting in not buying us, and some sort of hint at Nazi era slavery. That kind of thing.
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How would people feel if we did get taken over with someone willing to put big money in?
It's a yes from me. We're not a tinpot club like City & Chelsea and have actually put the groundwork in. If billionaire investors = modern football then we need to just move with the times. The fact we're an attractive proposition in the first place says a lot about what we've already achieved. Everything is already in place for it.
I know it's hypocritical considering how much I slate Chelsea/City but we are a top 4 club and ought to be there, they were fucking nobodies.
Actually I've just seen the thread over on VT. If the club were rebranded in that way then it's a definite no.
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Amidst all this looking back at departed managers and this daft rumour is one question; would you sell the footballing soul of Aston Villa for a league title and european cup?
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Amidst all this looking back at departed managers and this daft rumour is one question; would you sell the footballing soul of Aston Villa for a league title and european cup?
No.
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As far as I'm concerned football lost it's soul years ago, and Villa are part of that whether we like it or not.
Fuck it, go for it, as selfish as this sounds to those who still invest a large part of their life and income into Aston Villa, it won't affect my part-time support one iota if we go down the Citeh and Chelsea route and at least I'll be able to bask in the reflected glory when the trophies start coming in.
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Keep the colours, name, badge and stadium and they can do what they like IMO
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As far as I'm concerned football lost it's soul years ago, and Villa are part of that whether we like it or not.
Fuck it, go for it, as selfish as this sounds to those who still invest a large part of their life and income into Aston Villa, it won't affect my part-time support one iota if we go down the Citeh and Chelsea route and at least I'll be able to bask in the reflected glory when the trophies start coming in.
I'm with you coops, if it means winning trophies, titles and European glory again I'd be prepared to see us go down the man city route .
Whatever anyone wanted to rename it it would still be villa park to us .
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If meant we could be competitive again. If it meant we could be a force in the game again. If it meant we would no longer be overtaken by clubs like Spurs.
I'd say, bring it on!
Rename the stadium ? It it meant we were competing, then so what.
I've been going to 'the villa' for nearly 40, years. It will always be 'the villa' to me.
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Think anyway forward has to be looked at. Villa park is world famous and has been the venue to some of the biggest events in football history along with concerts etc. But the clubs immediate success is measured by how the current team is performing and if names of multi billion pound sponsors can help with that so be it .......
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Amidst all this looking back at departed managers and this daft rumour is one question; would you sell the footballing soul of Aston Villa for a league title and european cup?
Yes
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If Red Bull wanted to give us 10m a year for say 5 years to rename the ground Red Bull Park i'd snap their hands off.
And here's why, IT WOULDN'T CHANGE A THING except give us 50m to hopefully buy something more than potential.
I'd still call it Villa Park, you'd still call it Villa Park and it would still be Villa Park.
No brainer.
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A world where everyone knows the cost of everything and the value of nothing.
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If Red Bull wanted to give us 10m a year for say 5 years to rename the ground Red Bull Park i'd snap their hands off.
And here's why, IT WOULDN'T CHANGE A THING except give us 50m to hopefully buy something more than potential.
I'd still call it Villa Park, you'd still call it Villa Park and it would still be Villa Park.
No brainer.
I get what you mean.
But it would regularly be referred to as Red Bull Arena (or similar) in print and on TV.
It's a no for me. Extra revenue? Yes please. But not at the expense of the name or colours or ground.
That kind of deal would suit a club with little > no history, so I don't see ourselves or Everton as candidates. Cardiff, Hull or MK Dons makes more sense. Areas with a sizeable population, but nondescript football clubs.
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A world where everyone knows the cost of everything and the value of nothing.
Yes, but this is a stark choice between selling your soul and having a chance of winning something again or being all moralistic about it all and knowing that the odd decent cup run and maybe a UEFA Cup spot is realistically the best we'll ever get from now on in.
And given that we are already (sort of) competing in a League that sold it's soul to the highest bidder years ago my current thinking is, fuck it, let's grab the cocaine and join the bloody party!
I once thought like you Lee, and I was amongst those who were convinced the Sky bubble would burst sooner rather than later, but unfortunately it's proving one hell of a sturdy bubble isn't it?
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If Red Bull wanted to give us 10m a year for say 5 years to rename the ground Red Bull Park i'd snap their hands off.
And here's why, IT WOULDN'T CHANGE A THING except give us 50m to hopefully buy something more than potential.
I'd still call it Villa Park, you'd still call it Villa Park and it would still be Villa Park.
No brainer.
I get what you mean.
But it would regularly be referred to as Red Bull Arena (or similar) in print and on TV.
It's a no for me. Extra revenue? Yes please. But not at the expense of the name or colours or ground.
That kind of deal would suit a club with little > no history, so I don't see ourselves or Everton as candidates. Cardiff, Hull or MK Dons makes more sense. Areas with a sizeable population, but nondescript football clubs.
I genuinely couldn't care less, it'd still be Villa Park to me and anyone else interested in football. Just as the NEC is still the NEC not the LG Arena, Bescot Stadium is still Bescot Stadum and so on and so on
You can't change peoples mindset just by sticking a new sign up on an old building and expect people to start calling it something new.
The Trough in Walsall became the Rising Sun but everyone i knew still called it the Trough, ditto the Wheatsheaf up the road. A name is not easily changed
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As far as I'm concerned as soon as we renamed the Witton Lane Stand we set a precedent, I'd rather we rename stands/the ground for profit rather than as an ego trip.
So long as a club called Aston villa play in claret and blue at a ground in Aston/Witton I couldn't care less about the rest.
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Our Monday Night Football comes to you from the Lillettes Arena it gives you wings, Aston Body Form take on the red devils of Mcdonalds United.
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I genuinely couldn't care less, it'd still be Villa Park to me and anyone else interested in football. Just as the NEC is still the NEC not the LG Arena, Bescot Stadium is still Bescot Stadum and so on and so on
You can't change peoples mindset just by sticking a new sign up on an old building and expect people to start calling it something new.
I think you're absolutely right, so with that in mind why would anybody bother paying us £10m in the first place for no benefit to themselves?
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I don't care how much money we're offered, I'd never be comfortable with a Villa Park name change. It would be different if we were to move to a new stadium as they'd be very little emotional attachment to it, but Villa Park is in our hearts and minds and is simply not for sale.
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I don't care how much money we're offered, I'd never be comfortable with a Villa Park name change. It would be different if we were to move to a new stadium as they'd be very little emotional attachment to it, but Villa Park is in our hearts and minds and is simply not for sale.
You won't have a lot of choice if the owner decides to sell the naming rights. You could whinge, throw a strop, chuck away your season ticket, but it'll still be renamed if that's what Randy decides.
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It would be interesting to see what would happens if George Ramsey and William MacGregor come back and see mega money in football and Aston Villa history over last 90 years.
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How much would it take for us to make a realistic challenge for top 4 again? £200 million? £300 million? Maybe even closer to £500 million, when you factor in wages (we'd need to pay above the going rate to give ourselves a chance of getting the better players to opt for us).
There is a debate to be had if any form of sponsorship/ naming rights came close to those figures. It would still be a no for me, but I can see why others might go for it.
However, £50 million wouldn't really go very far (as if to illustrate just how mental the game has gone).
it's the equivalent of about two and a half transfer windows for us, taking our business over the past two summers into account.
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How much would it take for us to make a realistic challenge for top 4 again? £200 million? £300 million? Maybe even closer to £500 million, when you factor in wages (we'd need to pay above the going rate to give ourselves a chance of getting the better players to opt for us).
There is a debate to be had if any form of sponsorship/ naming rights came close to those figures. It would still be a no for me, but I can see why others might go for it.
However, £50 million wouldn't really go very far (as if to illustrate just how mental the game has gone).
it's the equivalent of about two and a half transfer windows for us, taking our business over the past two summers into account.
True but the original question did say would you be prepared to go down that route if it meant winning the European cup and premiership title -in which case definately yes.
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All day long
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How much would it take for us to make a realistic challenge for top 4 again? £200 million? £300 million? Maybe even closer to £500 million, when you factor in wages (we'd need to pay above the going rate to give ourselves a chance of getting the better players to opt for us).
There is a debate to be had if any form of sponsorship/ naming rights came close to those figures. It would still be a no for me, but I can see why others might go for it.
However, £50 million wouldn't really go very far (as if to illustrate just how mental the game has gone).
it's the equivalent of about two and a half transfer windows for us, taking our business over the past two summers into account.
True but the original question did say would you be prepared to go down that route if it meant winning the European cup and premiership title -in which case definately yes.
I see Citehs' success as totally empty. I don't feel envy in the slightest, and I know I'd feel the same if it were us.
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How much would it take for us to make a realistic challenge for top 4 again? £200 million? £300 million? Maybe even closer to £500 million, when you factor in wages (we'd need to pay above the going rate to give ourselves a chance of getting the better players to opt for us).
There is a debate to be had if any form of sponsorship/ naming rights came close to those figures. It would still be a no for me, but I can see why others might go for it.
However, £50 million wouldn't really go very far (as if to illustrate just how mental the game has gone).
it's the equivalent of about two and a half transfer windows for us, taking our business over the past two summers into account.
True but the original question did say would you be prepared to go down that route if it meant winning the European cup and premiership title -in which case definately yes.
I see Citehs' success as totally empty. I don't feel envy in the slightest, and I know I'd feel the same if it were us.
To get success these days you have to sell yourself to the highest bidder. If we did that we would still have our history behind us. To see Villa competing with the best in Europe again would make me very happy.
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Seeing my club sold as a marketing vehicle for the likes of Mansoor, or a vanity project at the whim of an oligarch, would probably be the end for me.
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Seeing my club sold as a marketing vehicle for the likes of Mansoor, or a vanity project at the whim of an oligarch, would probably be the end for me.
To be fair to Mansoor, they've actually proved to be pretty good owners. They do decent work in the community in that part of Manchester, and don't seem like a bunch of fly by night shysters.
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The first two paragraphs should act as a warning/reminder of what challenging at the top would entail.
http://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2013/nov/16/manchester-fc-united-different-world?CMP=twt_gu
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Seeing my club sold as a marketing vehicle for the likes of Mansoor, or a vanity project at the whim of an oligarch, would probably be the end for me.
To be fair to Mansoor, they've actually proved to be pretty good owners. They do decent work in the community in that part of Manchester, and don't seem like a bunch of fly by night shysters.
Agreed. Pretty much a model owner to be fair.
For me I am neutral.
If I want pure football not soiled by the sin of money then I can go watch non league.
Every team in the premier league has bought its way there one way or another. If some crass commercialism can help us push on then so be it. Pointing to our history was nice for a few decades, but it is getting all a bit Notts Forest these days.
Time to win things again.
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The first two paragraphs should act as a warning/reminder of what challenging at the top would entail.
http://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2013/nov/16/manchester-fc-united-different-world?CMP=twt_gu
I'm sure I'd hate it. Which is why I said earlier that I'm being a bit selfish, because it wouldn't really change my Aston Villa viewing habits, I hardly go to Villa Park anyway, the Premier League and Sky killed my enthusiasm for top flight football years ago. I would just join the queue of gloryhunters scrabbling for Cup final tickets.
The problem I see with wanting to hold onto traditions and not sell the club to the highest bidders is that there are plenty of other clubs that will happily step in, so if we don't do it if a rich Arab decides they want us then they will go and look elsewhere and instead of the mid-table also-rans we are now, we'll find ourselves being overtaken by Southampton, Cardiff, Leicester, Nottingham Forest or whoever these rich bastards decide to buy.
Some will be fly-by-night shysters and will see clubs ruined but others will stick with it and their clubs will become the second-tier behind Man Utd, Citeh, Chelsea etc. Villa will not only remain also-rans, but we'll be also-rans with ever decreasing chances of finishing even in the top half of the table.
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There is little more lamentable in football than walking past the Liverpool Inc Warehouse on the way to Old Trafford. Past the half and half scraf sellers, the plethora of flag sellers, the myriad of accents, to cross past the back of the East Stand by the "Megastore", where I brake my habbits of quintessential English politeness and walk through the foreign tourist and day trippers taking photographs of themselves as if they were outside Big Ben.
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Seeing my club sold as a marketing vehicle for the likes of Mansoor, or a vanity project at the whim of an oligarch, would probably be the end for me.
So lets say if Randy Lerner had bought Man City instead of us, and their lot had bought us, pumped us full of cash and won the league, FA Cup, qualified for the CL every year etc, you'd be unhappy about it?
Sorry mate, I have a feeling you'd be in the minority there.
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It's a tough one. I want us to compete and win trophies as much as anyone on here. I'd just feel a little uncomfortable if we went down the route of selling our ground name just to keep up.
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It's a tough one. I want us to compete and win trophies as much as anyone on here. I'd just feel a little uncomfortable if we went down the route of selling our ground name just to keep up.
Not tough in the slightest - if it meant villa winning trophies and titles then they can call the ground what they like - to me it will still be villa park as it will to most others.
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It's a tough one. I want us to compete and win trophies as much as anyone on here. I'd just feel a little uncomfortable if we went down the route of selling our ground name just to keep up.
Not tough in the slightest - if it meant villa winning trophies and titles then they can call the ground what they like - to me it will still be villa park as it will to most others.
It may not be tough to you but others may feel uneasy about it.
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Given the choice, i would much rather football became more of a level playing field financially, so we could have a bit of variety in the league rather than a handful of clubs who can compete for the league, then a massive bunch who stay in the league year after year, then a clutch of yo yo clubs glad to be here.
We have a clutch of clubs - of whom we are one - who for over a century have been cornerstones of the game in this country, who have been "big", who have cultural resonance, but for whom it is no longer possible to win the league. Impossible.
That's no good, I'd love it to be all made more competitive. However, that isn't ever going to happen. In fact, with the new CL TV deal, it will almost certainly get worse.
We're not in a league where "money buys success" necessarily, because there are several clubs with huge amounts of money and they can't all win. However, we are in a league where, without huge amounts of money, you can't have success. I'm not talking about cup wins, either, I'm talking about winning the league.
Given that state of affairs, I would far rather we were the club with shed loads of money than bobbing along seeing the holy grail as finishing fourth.
I bet there were, for example, a lot of old school Man City fans who were apprehensive when their cash injection started. If I put myself in their position, I probably would have been, too. But then again, I'd now be watching players of the quality of Toure, Silva, Aguero and co week in, week out, playing in the CL and winning titles, rather than seeing 10th as a decent season.
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Sentiment and keeping things the same for the sake of it are not successful models for evolution though are they? Arsenal moved to the Emirates, and whilst leaving Highbury must have been hard, few can argue that it wasn't progression?
Playing Devils Advocate here, but as others have said- top level football has changed into something many of us are uneasy with- but if it's a case of move with the times, find ways to compete financially, or become obsolete, then maybe we have to be prepared to embrace change?
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I know I'm in the minority but I'd seriously rather watch Aston Villa play in claret & blue at Villa Park in the conference, than risk changing all of those things for a shot at winning the Champions League.
I don't know if it is that I have also developed an attachment to Preston over the last 10 years that gives me a different perspective.Maybe what it gives me is knowing there is more to Football than the premiership, the top four, and even winning trophies.
There are 4 (& more) divisions where most supporters manage to follow their team without expecting any of this stuff. Coops watches plenty of non-league football, yet sees things differently to me, so maybe it isn't a PNE thing, maybe it is just me.
We are already a club and set of Suppporters weighted down by expectation that often leaves us cursing what we don't have instead of enjoying what we have. A multi million pound sponsorship deal can only add to that expectation and make 'the bloke next to me' (figuratively & literally) even more mardy & annoying than he is already.
One thing I've realised over the years is that my best Villa moments come from the unexpected not the expected.
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When I see Man city on the TV in that shiny new stadium with their exotic (brilliant) players from all over the world it just looks too weird to me - it's like a totally new, manufactured club. A kind of 'boy-band' team. What the hell have those guys got to do with Manchester city? I always think to myself - thank God that didn't happen to Villa. I still think we can have success without a total sell out like like that.
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Some really good debate here, I can see arguments on both sides. - I decided to ask my boy ( who is eight and a half) - I gave him the option of Villa having loads of money to spend on better players but if we had that money, Villa Park would be called something else and maybe our club colours could change.
A bit dramatic maybe but his answer was to carry on as we are, not changing any names or colours! I'm quite happy with that.
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There are 4 (& more) divisions where most supporters manage to follow their team without expecting any of this stuff. Coops watches plenty of non-league football, yet sees things differently to me, so maybe it isn't a PNE thing, maybe it is just me.
It did seem a bit odd to me even as I was typing it, but I think as you go down the divisions expectations do get lower. There isn't the hype below the Championship (I think once teams are established at that level the whole "Must get into the Premier League" thing starts kicking in, hence the ludicrously hyped play-off culminating in the "Richest Game in Football" for the PO Final.).
I don't think there's so much of a dread of relegation, you know you can always get back, and if not there's all those new grounds to visit. If Villa go down it will be a disaster, if Tamworth go down I get to go to Stalybridge again.
There's no logic to it, and no right answer, it's just the way I feel personally.
I enjoy watching football, but toward the end of my time regularly watching Villa it was becoming a chore.
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I think an expectation of achieving things and a desire to see us do so are not necessarily the same things.
We haven't, for example, won anything for approaching 18 years now, and even that was the least important of the domestic competitions we enter every season. We haven't won the league for over 30 years, and the FA Cup for .... well, we all know that one.
We cant have any expectations re anything, really. We can have a desire, an understandable one, to compete, though, given that we have so much in the past. I don't think there's anything wrong with that, it is ultimately a large part of what it is all about.
I'd love us to receive an enormous cash injection, though. I'd love to see us win the league again in my lifetime, I'd love to see some of the best players in Europe playing for us, it would be brilliant. I've probably got about 30 years left (touch wood) in my life, it'd be nice to see some of these things in that time.
That doesn't necessarily have to mean us being renamed or moved, though. It didn't mean that for Man City, after all, so I don't see why it would have to for us.
Anyway, I suspect this is all hypothetical, as it's highly unlikely to ever happen.
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I've come to the conclusion that I wouldn't be too arsed as long as it led to success. I still abhor the way City have established themselves, but I still see kids walking around in City shirts with absolutely no self consciousness. All the whining in the world doesn't stop them winning trophies or signing brilliant players.
I want Villa to be successful in an organic way, but I don't think we will be, so any assistance we get I'm sure I'll live with.
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Seeing my club sold as a marketing vehicle for the likes of Mansoor, or a vanity project at the whim of an oligarch, would probably be the end for me.
Specially when their marketting men turn up and want to change the name to Birmingham Villa!
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Anyway, I suspect this is all hypothetical, as it's highly unlikely to ever happen.
I don't think it's that unlikely, after all we know there are some very rich people out there who would love the glory of owning a Premier League club. Look at the clubs available and ask yourself who would be the likely candidates with a big enough name that they are known globally and have the facilities already in place so that the new owner can pretty much chuck his cash at getting the players he wants.
Us, Newcastle, Liverpool, Sunderland maybe, Wet Spam once they are in the Olympic Stadium maybe...the list isn't endless.
It's not a given, but I reckon any billionaires looking to buy an English club will have Villa pencilled in on any list they make.
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I know I'm in the minority but I'd seriously rather watch Aston Villa play in claret & blue at Villa Park in the conference, than risk changing all of those things for a shot at winning the Champions League.
I fail to see how any of those things would change simply by someone calling the ground something else in exchange for a load of dosh ?
You'd still be going to Villa Park regardless.
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For me, probably the biggest thing I love about Aston Villa is our unique identity as a football club. Villa Park is a huge part of that and a source of immense pride for me, with it's history and grandeur. To see it re-named would be tragic for me.
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Seeing my club sold as a marketing vehicle for the likes of Mansoor, or a vanity project at the whim of an oligarch, would probably be the end for me.
Specially when their marketting men turn up and want to change the name to Birmingham Villa!
Come now affers, I can just see you preening yourself in your royal blue shirt with claret sleeves ;)
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Anyway, I suspect this is all hypothetical, as it's highly unlikely to ever happen.
I don't think it's that unlikely, after all we know there are some very rich people out there who would love the glory of owning a Premier League club. Look at the clubs available and ask yourself who would be the likely candidates with a big enough name that they are known globally and have the facilities already in place so that the new owner can pretty much chuck his cash at getting the players he wants.
Us, Newcastle, Liverpool, Sunderland maybe, Wet Spam once they are in the Olympic Stadium maybe...the list isn't endless.
It's not a given, but I reckon any billionaires looking to buy an English club will have Villa pencilled in on any list they make.
Villa, newcastle and everton are the three that spring to mind for me.
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From what I gather no-one really seems to know what Red Bull want. We don't know if they want Aston Villa, much less what strings might come with it. So it's just the stadium name? What else can go out the window for a bit of glory?
I don't even want us to play at The Red Bull Stadium personally. I don't care if we'd still call it Villa Park, I don't want to hear it called something else every time I watch a game in telly. I'm not even saying I'd stop going, or that it'd be the end for me - I am simply saying its not what I want.
For those who aren't bothered about what the rest if the world calls our ground, where is the line? Red Bull Villa or Aston Red Bulls? I'm sure we can find a way of living with all of it perfectly happily, and despite what I do or don't want in this scenario - I'd probably be at Wembley cheering as loudly as anyone when those orange & blue ribbons get put on the FA Cup.
It's just that I'd rather watch us build something of our own If we can. I like what we're trying to do now. I want to see if we can make it work. If we can't, then that's just how it is. Aston Villa being average in this division, or playing a couple of divisions lower would still be Aston Villa - I'm not sure who those orange & blue bastards are.
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Come now affers, I can just see you preening yourself in your royal blue shirt with claret sleeves ;)
Yes ok but I will need a blood transfusion because the red and white blood cells in my system are claret and blue!
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From what I gather no-one really seems to know what Red Bull want. We don't know if they want Aston Villa, much less what strings might come with it. So it's just the stadium name? What else can go out the window for a bit of glory?
I don't even want us to play at The Red Bull Stadium personally. I don't care if we'd still call it Villa Park, I don't want to hear it called something else every time I watch a game in telly. I'm not even saying I'd stop going, or that it'd be the end for me - I am simply saying its not what I want.
For those who aren't bothered about what the rest if the world calls our ground, where is the line? Red Bull Villa or Aston Red Bulls? I'm sure we can find a way of living with all of it perfectly happily, and despite what I do or don't want in this scenario - I'd probably be at Wembley cheering as loudly as anyone when those orange & blue ribbons get put on the FA Cup.
It's just that I'd rather watch us build something of our own If we can. I like what we're trying to do now. I want to see if we can make it work. If we can't, then that's just how it is. Aston Villa being average in this division, or playing a couple of divisions lower would still be Aston Villa - I'm not sure who those orange & blue bastards are.
Fair point amfy. Even if we did sell our soul to the highest bidder we would still be known as the team that plays at Villa Park. Even if it was renamed with some bullshit name like the Reebok, Bolton..... Madjeski, Etihad, the list goes on. It is not about what our stadium is called, it is about the people who fill it, Villa fans. Nobody can take that away from us, never. If we are going to progress into the bigtime then some sacrifices need to be made.
We will always be Aston Villa, always. That is ours to keep for ever and a day. But, we have to be realistic. To get to the top you have to be willing to sell your soul, ish. Will we do it ? I do not think so, in the immediate future but one day we will. Do us the Fans go with that decision, or, do we do a FC United of Manchester like Mr Woodhall posted earlier.? The World changes every day, football changes every day. I think that we should get used to the idea that the great game we grew up watching has nearly dissapeared, time to move on, unfortunately.
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Bang on dan!
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There are 4 (& more) divisions where most supporters manage to follow their team without expecting any of this stuff. Coops watches plenty of non-league football, yet sees things differently to me, so maybe it isn't a PNE thing, maybe it is just me.
It did seem a bit odd to me even as I was typing it, but I think as you go down the divisions expectations do get lower. There isn't the hype below the Championship (I think once teams are established at that level the whole "Must get into the Premier League" thing starts kicking in, hence the ludicrously hyped play-off culminating in the "Richest Game in Football" for the PO Final.).
I don't think there's so much of a dread of relegation, you know you can always get back, and if not there's all those new grounds to visit. If Villa go down it will be a disaster, if Tamworth go down I get to go to Stalybridge again.
There's no logic to it, and no right answer, it's just the way I feel personally.
I enjoy watching football, but toward the end of my time regularly watching Villa it was becoming a chore.
To echo those sentiments somewhat, I went to watch Oxford United at their old Manor Ground and the connection the fans had with the club was noticeably different. They even had a song for the St John's ambulance lady.
Ditto small intimate gigs versus epic stadium gigs, bigger does not necessarily mean better.
And IF "better" did come along you can guarantee we'd be moaning about the additional tourists, less songs, bigger egos, and a greater disconnect between the club and the average fan.
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Talk of us selling the naming rights to the ground is a little bit irrelevant. The stadium naming deals which have generated anything like a decent sum of money are always for new grounds where there isn't a current name. Villa Park has been called that for 100 years and for the reason lots have pointed out, sticking a glow-in-the-dark, Red Bull Arena sign on the side of it won't make a blind bit of difference to what it's called by the majority of people. As a result, that will mean people are willing to pay much, much less for the rights - certainly way below the level Randy would even think about it (I hope!).
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I wonder if we'll ever see the day when someone sponsors injury-time as they do at Hell City.
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From what I gather no-one really seems to know what Red Bull want. We don't know if they want Aston Villa, much less what strings might come with it. So it's just the stadium name? What else can go out the window for a bit of glory?
I don't even want us to play at The Red Bull Stadium personally. I don't care if we'd still call it Villa Park, I don't want to hear it called something else every time I watch a game in telly. I'm not even saying I'd stop going, or that it'd be the end for me - I am simply saying its not what I want.
For those who aren't bothered about what the rest if the world calls our ground, where is the line? Red Bull Villa or Aston Red Bulls? I'm sure we can find a way of living with all of it perfectly happily, and despite what I do or don't want in this scenario - I'd probably be at Wembley cheering as loudly as anyone when those orange & blue ribbons get put on the FA Cup.
It's just that I'd rather watch us build something of our own If we can. I like what we're trying to do now. I want to see if we can make it work. If we can't, then that's just how it is. Aston Villa being average in this division, or playing a couple of divisions lower would still be Aston Villa - I'm not sure who those orange & blue bastards are.
Fair point amfy. Even if we did sell our soul to the highest bidder we would still be known as the team that plays at Villa Park. Even if it was renamed with some bullshit name like the Reebok, Bolton..... Madjeski, Etihad, the list goes on. It is not about what our stadium is called, it is about the people who fill it, Villa fans. Nobody can take that away from us, never. If we are going to progress into the bigtime then some sacrifices need to be made.
We will always be Aston Villa, always. That is ours to keep for ever and a day. But, we have to be realistic. To get to the top you have to be willing to sell your soul, ish. Will we do it ? I do not think so, in the immediate future but one day we will. Do us the Fans go with that decision, or, do we do a FC United of Manchester like Mr Woodhall posted earlier.? The World changes every day, football changes every day. I think that we should get used to the idea that the great game we grew up watching has nearly dissapeared, time to move on, unfortunately.
Yet Spurs have managed to gradually build something that's putting them in amongst it now. I know they have spent more than many clubs, but we're not talking soul selling levels. We're talking about good steady investment, stability & a bit of luck.
If the only way we can ever win anything is oligarchs & sheiks, & it is completely impossible to simply build towards success, then I think I would rather be at Everton losing 4-1 & singing about programmes (the other thread I've posted on today), than trying to defend my support of a club that's bought everything it's won in the last 20 years. To me, that is actually more fun. I am a bit odd like that!
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For me, probably the biggest thing I love about Aston Villa is our unique identity as a football club. Villa Park is a huge part of that and a source of immense pride for me, with it's history and grandeur. To see it re-named would be tragic for me.
For that reason I think we'd be one of the least likely clubs to be taken over by Red Bull. Our name is so weird it makes a randoms like Tom Hanks decide to support us. Our heritage is probably our biggest selling point. Red Bull would have to spend a LOT of cash to re-brand villa whereas arguably they could spend a lot less at say Fulham for a bigger return.
Furthermore, Red Bull's motivation in this is not to win trophies. It is to raise the profile of their brand. So far they're rebranded Saltzburg (guaranteed champs league pretty much), NY (a new franchise), Leipzig (play on the 3rd division in Germany but have a big stadium which is good for concerts - i.e. Coventry City). They don't appear to have much history of ploughing cash into clubs to help them win things.
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For me, probably the biggest thing I love about Aston Villa is our unique identity as a football club. Villa Park is a huge part of that and a source of immense pride for me, with it's history and grandeur. To see it re-named would be tragic for me.
Couldn't have put it better myself pal
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for what its worth the Red Bull headquarters are based in Milton Keynes and I know someone who works on night security there and he said he's heard nothing
so I reckon its a load of old cobblers
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For those who aren't bothered about what the rest if the world calls our ground, where is the line? Red Bull Villa or Aston Red Bulls?
Surely there is an enormous difference between stadium naming rights and renaming the club?
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We are Aston Villa, always will be. We could play in Hongkong, we would still be Aston Villa, nobody can take that from us, nobody.
I just have this feeling that change is needed to take us to the next level. Should this change happen, then, me as a fan, ex season ticket holder, and my true passion, i would take it all. We have to move on to be competitive, it is just the way the game has changed, and we as a club are getting to far behind the rest of them.
Yes, we can except a mid table finish as progress, we can also accept the odd spot inside the top eight.
For me, with so much cash involved in the game, i want my team to try and be at the top, the very top.
Can we not Just go for it, or are we going to become the next SHA, Albion or Wolves ? Sheffield, both clubs ?
We deserve better, we will get better in the future. UTV.
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I wonder if we'll ever see the day when someone sponsors injury-time as they do at Hell City.
I can't remember where it was but we were at a game this season where the subs were sponsored. It might have been Hull actually.
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It was. Everything was.
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If you're a club the size of Hull and are paying Huddlestone the thick end of £90k a week you need all the money you can get.
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I was at the ATP Tour Finals the other week where aces were sponsored by Mercedes Benz and the ball boys and girls were sponsored by Barclays.
I felt like weeping!
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I wonder if we'll ever see the day when someone sponsors injury-time as they do at Hell City.
I can't remember where it was but we were at a game this season where the subs were sponsored. It might have been Hull actually.
That's something done at loads of clubs, a couple of seasons ago Tamworth had the time added on sponsored by Bank of Scotland business loans.
A few extra quid for the tannoy announcer to mention a company now and again, a bit like product placement.
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I wonder if we'll ever see the day when someone sponsors injury-time as they do at Hell City.
I can't remember where it was but we were at a game this season where the subs were sponsored. It might have been Hull actually.
Small Heath started it as soon as they were promoted to the Premier in 2002. Both subs and injury time.
No thanks.
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Were they so broke back then that they could only afford two subs? ;)
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The main thing is that we don't sell our soul or become a classless as Chelski.
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I wonder if we'll ever see the day when someone sponsors injury-time as they do at Hell City.
I can't remember where it was but we were at a game this season where the subs were sponsored. It might have been Hull actually.
Small Heath started it as soon as they were promoted to the Premier in 2002. Both subs and injury time.
No thanks.
Yet you'll happily walk around in a shirt advertising a betting company?
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I wonder if we'll ever see the day when someone sponsors injury-time as they do at Hell City.
I can't remember where it was but we were at a game this season where the subs were sponsored. It might have been Hull actually.
Small Heath started it as soon as they were promoted to the Premier in 2002. Both subs and injury time.
No thanks.
Yet you'll happily walk around in a shirt advertising a betting company?
I wouldn't be seen dead in any football shirt, and certainly not one with a gambling advertisement on it.
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From what I gather no-one really seems to know what Red Bull want. We don't know if they want Aston Villa, much less what strings might come with it. So it's just the stadium name? What else can go out the window for a bit of glory?
I don't even want us to play at The Red Bull Stadium personally. I don't care if we'd still call it Villa Park, I don't want to hear it called something else every time I watch a game in telly. I'm not even saying I'd stop going, or that it'd be the end for me - I am simply saying its not what I want.
For those who aren't bothered about what the rest if the world calls our ground, where is the line? Red Bull Villa or Aston Red Bulls? I'm sure we can find a way of living with all of it perfectly happily, and despite what I do or don't want in this scenario - I'd probably be at Wembley cheering as loudly as anyone when those orange & blue ribbons get put on the FA Cup.
It's just that I'd rather watch us build something of our own If we can. I like what we're trying to do now. I want to see if we can make it work. If we can't, then that's just how it is. Aston Villa being average in this division, or playing a couple of divisions lower would still be Aston Villa - I'm not sure who those orange & blue bastards are.
Fair point amfy. Even if we did sell our soul to the highest bidder we would still be known as the team that plays at Villa Park. Even if it was renamed with some bullshit name like the Reebok, Bolton..... Madjeski, Etihad, the list goes on. It is not about what our stadium is called, it is about the people who fill it, Villa fans. Nobody can take that away from us, never. If we are going to progress into the bigtime then some sacrifices need to be made.
We will always be Aston Villa, always. That is ours to keep for ever and a day. But, we have to be realistic. To get to the top you have to be willing to sell your soul, ish. Will we do it ? I do not think so, in the immediate future but one day we will. Do us the Fans go with that decision, or, do we do a FC United of Manchester like Mr Woodhall posted earlier.? The World changes every day, football changes every day. I think that we should get used to the idea that the great game we grew up watching has nearly dissapeared, time to move on, unfortunately.
Yet Spurs have managed to gradually build something that's putting them in amongst it now. I know they have spent more than many clubs, but we're not talking soul selling levels. We're talking about good steady investment, stability & a bit of luck.
If the only way we can ever win anything is oligarchs & sheiks, & it is completely impossible to simply build towards success, then I think I would rather be at Everton losing 4-1 & singing about programmes (the other thread I've posted on today), than trying to defend my support of a club that's bought everything it's won in the last 20 years. To me, that is actually more fun. I am a bit odd like that!
and if tottenham had have moved to a new stadium, what name do you think the club would give it? anything a sponsor wanted them to call it.yes, tottenham have more or less done it the 'right' way. but,as dan said it seems they are testing the water beforedeciding to really try to get up to the top teams. Football has become a business, some time soon naming of grounds after sponsors will be come the same as when sponsors first appeared on shirts. Its inevitable, its a shame, but I guess if thosewatching from the 1880s were watching the 1950s they would probably not recognise 'their' game. Football does move on.
But, it may not happen to us. But if not, we're risking consigning the name of the great Aston Villa to be forever a mediocre onlooker just trying to be relevant again. I want more than that.
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I want us to be a relevant force in the game again.
That will take a shit load of money, there is no way in getting away from that.
As much as love the history, aura and mystique around our club, I would welcome any investment that would bring us success.
I would consider taking massive investment not as 'selling out' but more as 'moving with the times'.
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I wonder if we'll ever see the day when someone sponsors injury-time as they do at Hell City.
I can't remember where it was but we were at a game this season where the subs were sponsored. It might have been Hull actually.
Small Heath started it as soon as they were promoted to the Premier in 2002. Both subs and injury time.
No thanks.
Yet you'll happily walk around in a shirt advertising a betting company?
I wouldn't be seen dead in any football shirt, and certainly not one with a gambling advertisement on it.
Fair enough, but the team you support are wearing them in every game they play.
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I wonder if we'll ever see the day when someone sponsors injury-time as they do at Hell City.
A few seasons ago we had Wrigley's Extra advertised on the big screen for the durations of injury time.
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I wonder if we'll ever see the day when someone sponsors injury-time as they do at Hell City.
I can't remember where it was but we were at a game this season where the subs were sponsored. It might have been Hull actually.
That's something done at loads of clubs, a couple of seasons ago Tamworth had the time added on sponsored by Bank of Scotland business loans.
A few extra quid for the tannoy announcer to mention a company now and again, a bit like product placement.
I can fully understand clubs like Tamworth doing it, they'd be stupid not to if it helps them financially. A Premiership club doing it seems wrong somehow.
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If you want to see/hear over the top advertising, try attending an Ice Hockey game in Coventry
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If it moves sponsor it , if it stands still sponsor it - it's the way to go - next step will be referees.
Phil dowd sponsored by durex condoms.
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If it moves sponsor it , if it stands still sponsor it - it's the way to go - next step will be referees.
Phil dowd sponsored by durex condoms.
Everyone knows it'll be an opticians that sponsors the refs, there are too many jokes in it for it not to happen.
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If it moves sponsor it , if it stands still sponsor it - it's the way to go - next step will be referees.
Phil dowd sponsored by durex condoms.
Everyone knows it'll be an opticians that sponsors the refs, there are too many jokes in it for it not to happen.
Specsavers have been sponsoring the referess in Scotland for a few years now. Perfect marketing for them.
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If it moves sponsor it , if it stands still sponsor it - it's the way to go - next step will be referees.
Phil dowd sponsored by durex condoms.
Everyone knows it'll be an opticians that sponsors the refs, there are too many jokes in it for it not to happen.
Specsavers have been sponsoring the referess in Scotland for a few years now. Perfect marketing for them.
I thought I'd seen specsavers sponsoring refs somewhere, I actually wrote them specifically at first and then changed it because I thought I'd spotted them doing it already.
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I wonder if we'll ever see the day when someone sponsors injury-time as they do at Hell City.
I can't remember where it was but we were at a game this season where the subs were sponsored. It might have been Hull actually.
That's something done at loads of clubs, a couple of seasons ago Tamworth had the time added on sponsored by Bank of Scotland business loans.
A few extra quid for the tannoy announcer to mention a company now and again, a bit like product placement.
I can fully understand clubs like Tamworth doing it, they'd be stupid not to if it helps them financially. A Premiership club doing it seems wrong somehow.
I don't see what the problem is.
The club get some money, the company get a mention and all it is is: "Time added on, sponsored by Rolex, will be a minimum of 5 minutes".
Hardly obstrusive, if something like that annoys you then you must have very low tolerance levels.
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I wonder if we'll ever see the day when someone sponsors injury-time as they do at Hell City.
I can't remember where it was but we were at a game this season where the subs were sponsored. It might have been Hull actually.
That's something done at loads of clubs, a couple of seasons ago Tamworth had the time added on sponsored by Bank of Scotland business loans.
A few extra quid for the tannoy announcer to mention a company now and again, a bit like product placement.
I can fully understand clubs like Tamworth doing it, they'd be stupid not to if it helps them financially. A Premiership club doing it seems wrong somehow.
I don't see what the problem is.
The club get some money, the company get a mention and all it is is: "Time added on, sponsored by Rolex, will be a minimum of 5 minutes".
Hardly obstrusive, if something like that annoys you then you must have very low tolerance levels.
It dose'nt annoy me at all. I'm just surprised that a Premier league club with all the money they get feel the need to do it that's all.
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I wonder if we'll ever see the day when someone sponsors injury-time as they do at Hell City.
I can't remember where it was but we were at a game this season where the subs were sponsored. It might have been Hull actually.
That's something done at loads of clubs, a couple of seasons ago Tamworth had the time added on sponsored by Bank of Scotland business loans.
A few extra quid for the tannoy announcer to mention a company now and again, a bit like product placement.
I can fully understand clubs like Tamworth doing it, they'd be stupid not to if it helps them financially. A Premiership club doing it seems wrong somehow.
I don't see what the problem is.
The club get some money, the company get a mention and all it is is: "Time added on, sponsored by Rolex, will be a minimum of 5 minutes".
Hardly obstrusive, if something like that annoys you then you must have very low tolerance levels.
He can be a bit prickly at times , seems a decent enough chap though a tad emotional ;)
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I wonder if we'll ever see the day when someone sponsors injury-time as they do at Hell City.
I can't remember where it was but we were at a game this season where the subs were sponsored. It might have been Hull actually.
That's something done at loads of clubs, a couple of seasons ago Tamworth had the time added on sponsored by Bank of Scotland business loans.
A few extra quid for the tannoy announcer to mention a company now and again, a bit like product placement.
I can fully understand clubs like Tamworth doing it, they'd be stupid not to if it helps them financially. A Premiership club doing it seems wrong somehow.
I don't see what the problem is.
The club get some money, the company get a mention and all it is is: "Time added on, sponsored by Rolex, will be a minimum of 5 minutes".
Hardly obstrusive, if something like that annoys you then you must have very low tolerance levels.
He can be a bit prickly at times , seems a decent enough chap though a tad emotional ;)
And your point in that post was what?
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I wonder if we'll ever see the day when someone sponsors injury-time as they do at Hell City.
I can't remember where it was but we were at a game this season where the subs were sponsored. It might have been Hull actually.
That's something done at loads of clubs, a couple of seasons ago Tamworth had the time added on sponsored by Bank of Scotland business loans.
A few extra quid for the tannoy announcer to mention a company now and again, a bit like product placement.
I can fully understand clubs like Tamworth doing it, they'd be stupid not to if it helps them financially. A Premiership club doing it seems wrong somehow.
I don't see what the problem is.
The club get some money, the company get a mention and all it is is: "Time added on, sponsored by Rolex, will be a minimum of 5 minutes".
Hardly obstrusive, if something like that annoys you then you must have very low tolerance levels.
He can be a bit prickly at times , seems a decent enough chap though a tad emotional ;)
And your point in that post was what?
You just made it for me - apologies !
Back on topic- i honk we need to exploit any chance we can of increasing revenue- the financial gap is huge between those teams at the top and it will get bigger as the new tv deal kicks in - we need to compete as best we can .
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I wonder if we'll ever see the day when someone sponsors injury-time as they do at Hell City.
I can't remember where it was but we were at a game this season where the subs were sponsored. It might have been Hull actually.
That's something done at loads of clubs, a couple of seasons ago Tamworth had the time added on sponsored by Bank of Scotland business loans.
A few extra quid for the tannoy announcer to mention a company now and again, a bit like product placement.
I can fully understand clubs like Tamworth doing it, they'd be stupid not to if it helps them financially. A Premiership club doing it seems wrong somehow.
I don't see what the problem is.
The club get some money, the company get a mention and all it is is: "Time added on, sponsored by Rolex, will be a minimum of 5 minutes".
Hardly obstrusive, if something like that annoys you then you must have very low tolerance levels.
He can be a bit prickly at times , seems a decent enough chap though a tad emotional ;)
And your point in that post was what?
You just made it for me - apologies !
How creepy.
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Didn't we have individual sponsors of shorts, shirt and socks of players back in the 80s ?
I'm sure there was a time when david norton was the only player left available with kit to sponsor .
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I don't want to see Villa having sponsorship for anything that moves at Villa Park. Leave that to the likes of Small Heath. We're better than that.
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Football has already pretty much sold its soul so if we want to compete we either sponsor everything that moves or turn into another Chelski. These are the choices. Unless you want to stay mid table forever with the odd relegation fight to liven things up every few years.
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I don't want to see Villa having sponsorship for anything that moves at Villa Park. Leave that to the likes of Small Heath. We're better than that.
Need to move with the times tho Saunders or other will do and pass us by - the football world we loved and enjoyed back in the 70s and 80s has long gone sadly - now money dictates things far more.
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I wonder if we'll ever see the day when someone sponsors injury-time as they do at Hell City.
I can't remember where it was but we were at a game this season where the subs were sponsored. It might have been Hull actually.
That's something done at loads of clubs, a couple of seasons ago Tamworth had the time added on sponsored by Bank of Scotland business loans.
A few extra quid for the tannoy announcer to mention a company now and again, a bit like product placement.
I can fully understand clubs like Tamworth doing it, they'd be stupid not to if it helps them financially. A Premiership club doing it seems wrong somehow.
I don't see what the problem is.
The club get some money, the company get a mention and all it is is: "Time added on, sponsored by Rolex, will be a minimum of 5 minutes".
Hardly obstrusive, if something like that annoys you then you must have very low tolerance levels.
What I find strange about things like this is that you get people watching a team with sponsors on their shirt, in a ground with sponsors on boards all around, reading a program full of info about sponsors but the idea of mentioning a sponsor for injury time or the half time entertainment gets them really mad about how commercialised it all is.
Advertising is what it is, if everyone else is taking the money that comes from it then you have to go along with it (in the environment of premier league football club) no one will notice if we make a stand against it, we'll just end up with less money than the clubs around us. I wouldn't accept changing the name of the club or the club colours because they are the key points to our identity and significantly I don't see any good that can come from it.
I really don't like the approach Chelsea and Man City have taken, it feels like they've skipped a few steps so I wouldn't want the £100m a year on established players they've done but a couple of established players and a couple of the top rated youngsters from around the world for a couple of summers, with the wages that brings, would be good, basically an extension of what we're doing.
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Football has already pretty much sold its soul so if we want to compete we either sponsor everything that moves or turn into another Chelski. These are the choices. Unless you want to stay mid table forever with the odd relegation fight to liven things up every few years.
Sponsoring subs and injury time didn't save Small Heath from the drop and it didn't get them higher than mid table either. F#ck that, it's small time and undignified. We've always been a classy club and long may it continue.
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Football has already pretty much sold its soul so if we want to compete we either sponsor everything that moves or turn into another Chelski. These are the choices. Unless you want to stay mid table forever with the odd relegation fight to liven things up every few years.
Sponsoring subs and injury time didn't save Small Heath from the drop and it didn't get them higher than mid table either. F#ck that, it's small time and undignified. We've always been a classy club and long may it continue.
I'm 100% with you mate.
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Football has already pretty much sold its soul so if we want to compete we either sponsor everything that moves or turn into another Chelski. These are the choices. Unless you want to stay mid table forever with the odd relegation fight to liven things up every few years.
Sponsoring subs and injury time didn't save Small Heath from the drop and it didn't get them higher than mid table either. F#ck that, it's small time and undignified. We've always been a classy club and long may it continue.
I'm 100% with you mate.
"Time added on, sponsored by Rolex, will be a minimum of 5 minutes".
Hearing that will destroy your experience at Villa Park, will it?
The shirt sponsors, the advertising hoardings, the sponsored man of the match, they're all bearable, but this will be the straw that breaks the camel's back?
This will be where 140 years of history goes down the drain?
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Football has already pretty much sold its soul so if we want to compete we either sponsor everything that moves or turn into another Chelski. These are the choices. Unless you want to stay mid table forever with the odd relegation fight to liven things up every few years.
Sponsoring subs and injury time didn't save Small Heath from the drop and it didn't get them higher than mid table either. F#ck that, it's small time and undignified. We've always been a classy club and long may it continue.
Why is it small time and undignified to sponsor those things but having a bookie on the shirt is ok? Are Arsenal small time and undignified seeing as they're play in a stadium named after a sponsor? The BT deal for the champions league is a clear sign that the bubble is in no imminent danger, given that we need to play by the rules the league and other clubs are setting, if that means 'selling our soul' (which is complete nonsense btw) then we do what we have to do. I'd love Villa to turn around and go the other way, getting rid of all sponsorship around the ground, refuse to have the stupid advertising boards in the interview area, etc but it's not going to happen. If we try to deny commercialism in the game we'll sink like a stone, everyone knows that so all the 'classy' perception means is that we've drawn our line in the sand slightly further back than some others. That's not something to be singing from the rooftops about, if we stay as we are and win things we can be smug about it, but do you really think that will happen?
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Pretty much spot on that paul e - we cannot afford not to exploit all avenues of revenue available to us .
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I wonder if we'll ever see the day when someone sponsors injury-time as they do at Hell City.
I can't remember where it was but we were at a game this season where the subs were sponsored. It might have been Hull actually.
That's something done at loads of clubs, a couple of seasons ago Tamworth had the time added on sponsored by Bank of Scotland business loans.
A few extra quid for the tannoy announcer to mention a company now and again, a bit like product placement.
I can fully understand clubs like Tamworth doing it, they'd be stupid not to if it helps them financially. A Premiership club doing it seems wrong somehow.
I don't see what the problem is.
The club get some money, the company get a mention and all it is is: "Time added on, sponsored by Rolex, will be a minimum of 5 minutes".
Hardly obstrusive, if something like that annoys you then you must have very low tolerance levels.
It dose'nt annoy me at all. I'm just surprised that a Premier league club with all the money they get feel the need to do it that's all.
It is a business. A business has to make a profit and when they make one the owner(s) want to make a bigger one so they will do whatever is necessary to maximise income to make as large a profit as possible. All we do as spectators is go along and view the product. If we don't like what we see we don't return and the owners profit is reduced.
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Football has already pretty much sold its soul so if we want to compete we either sponsor everything that moves or turn into another Chelski. These are the choices. Unless you want to stay mid table forever with the odd relegation fight to liven things up every few years.
Sponsoring subs and injury time didn't save Small Heath from the drop and it didn't get them higher than mid table either. F#ck that, it's small time and undignified. We've always been a classy club and long may it continue.
Why is it small time and undignified to sponsor those things but having a bookie on the shirt is ok? Are Arsenal small time and undignified seeing as they're play in a stadium named after a sponsor? The BT deal for the champions league is a clear sign that the bubble is in no imminent danger, given that we need to play by the rules the league and other clubs are setting, if that means 'selling our soul' (which is complete nonsense btw) then we do what we have to do. I'd love Villa to turn around and go the other way, getting rid of all sponsorship around the ground, refuse to have the stupid advertising boards in the interview area, etc but it's not going to happen. If we try to deny commercialism in the game we'll sink like a stone, everyone knows that so all the 'classy' perception means is that we've drawn our line in the sand slightly further back than some others. That's not something to be singing from the rooftops about, if we stay as we are and win things we can be smug about it, but do you really think that will happen?
I think there's a big difference between selling stadium naming rights for huge amounts of money, which is totally understandable, and selling your substitutions (ie "your Aston Villa substitute is sponsored by Tiles R Us" over the tannoy as they are subbed).
Flogging sponsorship for large amounts of money is far more understandable - and acceptable - than the sort of piddling amounts of money low rent sponsorships like substitutes would bring in.
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Talking of squeezing everything you can from sponsors I wonder how much Vettel got for doing donuts by the "Fly Emirates" sign yesterday?
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Football has already pretty much sold its soul so if we want to compete we either sponsor everything that moves or turn into another Chelski. These are the choices. Unless you want to stay mid table forever with the odd relegation fight to liven things up every few years.
Sponsoring subs and injury time didn't save Small Heath from the drop and it didn't get them higher than mid table either. F#ck that, it's small time and undignified. We've always been a classy club and long may it continue.
Why is it small time and undignified to sponsor those things but having a bookie on the shirt is ok? Are Arsenal small time and undignified seeing as they're play in a stadium named after a sponsor? The BT deal for the champions league is a clear sign that the bubble is in no imminent danger, given that we need to play by the rules the league and other clubs are setting, if that means 'selling our soul' (which is complete nonsense btw) then we do what we have to do. I'd love Villa to turn around and go the other way, getting rid of all sponsorship around the ground, refuse to have the stupid advertising boards in the interview area, etc but it's not going to happen. If we try to deny commercialism in the game we'll sink like a stone, everyone knows that so all the 'classy' perception means is that we've drawn our line in the sand slightly further back than some others. That's not something to be singing from the rooftops about, if we stay as we are and win things we can be smug about it, but do you really think that will happen?
I think there's a big difference between selling stadium naming rights for huge amounts of money, which is totally understandable, and selling your substitutions (ie "your Aston Villa substitute is sponsored by Tiles R Us" over the tannoy as they are subbed).
Flogging sponsorship for large amounts of money is far more understandable - and acceptable - than the sort of piddling amounts of money low rent sponsorships like substitutes would bring in.
Ah, but it all depends, that's the point. Your 'line in the sand' is based on the value of the offering, not what it actually is. If red bull agreed to give us £10m a season to sponsor the subs, but only if they 'flew' onto the pitch in a harness I'd take it (so long as there was a reasonable health and safety review of the equipment of course) but £5000 a game from poundland wouldn't be worth it. This is the key thing and why we should explore it. If someone is willing to pay us a fortune to call the stadium something else then I don't see the issue (if someone offered us a packet of crisps to rename the witton lane stand I'd take it).
We have to dip the toes and see what we can get, if we can get 10-15m a year by sponsoring the stadium and the subs, and etc then we can offer slightly more in wages, we can go for slightly more expensive targets, etc and all without having to be subsidised by Randy. It doesn't have to be ground breaking figures, £15m this summer, for example, might have bought and paid the wages for kiyotake, would that not be a suitable trade off?
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I know it is based on the value of the offering, that's what I was getting at - let's be honest, sponsoring our substitutions is not going to bring us in millions of pounds a year, which is why saunders_heroes argument is understandable.
I wouldn't be against selling stadium naming rights on principle, but it has to bring in a decent sum if we are giving away a chunk of our identity.
Slight tangent, but I was just thining about the old Trinity Road stand.
If you ask most people on here about it, they'll get teary eyed (understandably) about it and lament its passing, yet for the last few years of its existence, it was plastered with advertising, including the gable.
That was about maximising revenue, too, in the Doug era. Were we right to criticise him for that?
It isn't just about the value of the offer, though, it is also about what it is, you can't divorce the two. It's not just about "we'll give you £10m", it is also about what you're giving them for that money.
I'd take £10m, for example, for stadium renaming, but I wouldn't take it for changing the name of the club to Red Bull Birmingham. Not in a million years.
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... and on that Birmingham Red Bulls thing, to Randy's credit, I don't think he'd take it in a million years, either.
The one thing I think he's been pretty much perfect on is understanding and respecting our tradition.
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I know it is based on the value of the offering, that's what I was getting at - let's be honest, sponsoring our substitutions is not going to bring us in millions of pounds a year, which is why saunders_heroes argument is understandable.
That's the point I was trying to make about Hull (is it Hull Tigers yet?) doing it.
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Absolutely, but, in a theoretical scenario, if the value is worth it there is nothing 'small time' about taking the money on offer, that's the bit I have objections to.
The commercial aspects of the club are very well managed as far as I'm concerned so, if we saw a sponsor for subs, I'd trust that it was good deal and I certainly wouldn't think we'd sold out and lost our dignity.
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I don't think Lerner would ever stoop so low as to flog sponsorships for subs, injury time etc. one thing I like about Lerner is the fact that other than pitch-side there are absolutely no advertisements at Villa Park. Other grounds fit in ads in every spare bit of space, but not Villa Park.
Fair play to him for that. Villa Park always was a classy place and we need it to continue. That's not to say I'd be against renaming if we ever left VP. We could flog it to the highest bidder then as they'd be little or no emotional attachment to it.
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Slight tangent, but I was just thining about the old Trinity Road stand.
If you ask most people on here about it, they'll get teary eyed (understandably) about it and lament its passing, yet for the last few years of its existence, it was plastered with advertising, including the gable.
Weren't the advertisements removed after a while though?
And I thought Villa were prostituting their pedigree when they painted OXO on the barrel-roofed former Witton stand over 100 years ago so I'll be fucked if we start thinking about flogging the stadium name or getting our bench-warmers sponsored
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I think in general there has to be some limit to what you'll flog, even if it is for good money.
Selling substitutions for next to nothing, on a purely financial sense, makes more sense than not selling them at all, but I totally understand the argument that it's a bit undignified, and I can understand the argument that it'd still be undignified even if it brought in decent cash.
Man United, for example, have this:
(http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2013/07/26/article-2378761-1AFCDB44000005DC-817_634x492.jpg)
Which I am sure makes financial sense for them and brings in big money, but that's a pretty undignified demonstration of flogging your brand, in my opinion.
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I think in general there has to be some limit to what you'll flog, even if it is for good money.
Selling substitutions for next to nothing, on a purely financial sense, makes more sense than not selling them at all, but I totally understand the argument that it's a bit undignified, and I can understand the argument that it'd still be undignified even if it brought in decent cash.
Man United, for example, have this:
(http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2013/07/26/article-2378761-1AFCDB44000005DC-817_634x492.jpg)
Which I am sure makes financial sense for them and brings in big money, but that's a pretty undignified demonstration of flogging your brand, in my opinion.
That's Man United's Mita photocopier moment
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Almost as undignified as pulling out of the F.A Cup and being allowed to.
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I don't think Lerner would ever stoop so low as to flog sponsorships for subs, injury time etc. one thing I like about Lerner is the fact that other than pitch-side there are absolutely no advertisements at Villa Park. Other grounds fit in ads in every spare bit of space, but not Villa Park.
Fair play to him for that. Villa Park always was a classy place and we need it to continue. That's not to say I'd be against renaming if we ever left VP. We could flog it to the highest bidder then as they'd be little or no emotional attachment to it.
Indeed. One of the things Lerner is good at is promoting the club's history. Doing up the Holte Pub, the mosaic on the Holte and using the original stained glass on the old Trinity in the new suggests to me that our club's history, colours and ground name won't be sacrificed under his watch.
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I think in general there has to be some limit to what you'll flog, even if it is for good money.
Selling substitutions for next to nothing, on a purely financial sense, makes more sense than not selling them at all, but I totally understand the argument that it's a bit undignified, and I can understand the argument that it'd still be undignified even if it brought in decent cash.
Man United, for example, have this:
(http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2013/07/26/article-2378761-1AFCDB44000005DC-817_634x492.jpg)
Which I am sure makes financial sense for them and brings in big money, but that's a pretty undignified demonstration of flogging your brand, in my opinion.
That's Man United's Mita photocopier moment
At least Mita were our shirt sponsors.
I might put in an offer to become Man United's "Official Being Increasingly Flabby and Lazy Partner".
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Almost as undignified as pulling out of the F.A Cup and being allowed to.
Much as it grieves me to defend them on that one, they didn't want to - the FA 'asked' them.
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Almost as undignified as pulling out of the F.A Cup and being allowed to.
Much as it grieves me to defend them on that one, they didn't want to - the FA 'asked' them.
Really? I thought it was the other way round. That's just as bad.
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Almost as undignified as pulling out of the F.A Cup and being allowed to.
Much as it grieves me to defend them on that one, they didn't want to - the FA 'asked' them.
Really? I thought it was the other way round. That's just as bad.
It was tied up with the World Cup bid. The FA wanted to help FIFA, much good it did them.
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Almost as undignified as pulling out of the F.A Cup and being allowed to.
Much as it grieves me to defend them on that one, they didn't want to - the FA 'asked' them.
Correct. David Davies. In an attempt to (foolishly) garner support for England's World Cup staging bid for the 2006 tournament.
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I think in general there has to be some limit to what you'll flog, even if it is for good money.
Selling substitutions for next to nothing, on a purely financial sense, makes more sense than not selling them at all, but I totally understand the argument that it's a bit undignified, and I can understand the argument that it'd still be undignified even if it brought in decent cash.
Man United, for example, have this:
(http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2013/07/26/article-2378761-1AFCDB44000005DC-817_634x492.jpg)
Which I am sure makes financial sense for them and brings in big money, but that's a pretty undignified demonstration of flogging your brand, in my opinion.
That's Man United's Mita photocopier moment
At least Mita were our shirt sponsors.
I might put in an offer to become Man United's "Official Being Increasingly Flabby and Lazy Partner".
An official Diesel engine partner? WTF.
How many diesel engines do Man U have that warrants them needing a partner?
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Almost as undignified as pulling out of the F.A Cup and being allowed to.
Much as it grieves me to defend them on that one, they didn't want to - the FA 'asked' them.
Really? I thought it was the other way round. That's just as bad.
It was tied up with the World Cup bid. The FA wanted to help FIFA, much good it did them.
The sad thing is, the F.A would probably do it again if the need arose.
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Almost as undignified as pulling out of the F.A Cup and being allowed to.
Much as it grieves me to defend them on that one, they didn't want to - the FA 'asked' them.
Really? I thought it was the other way round. That's just as bad.
It was tied up with the World Cup bid. The FA wanted to help FIFA, much good it did them.
The sad thing is, the F.A would probably do it again if the need arose.
Or just recruit a couple of exceedingly posh blokes who happen to be Villa fans, Prime Minister and Heir to the Throne respectively, to top up the World's most famous player presence and still lose miserabley to Putin's lot. Ho Hum.
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When Randy came in, he/we had links with that big sports agency (IMG?). One of the only notable things they said about the club was that there was too much random sponsorship. They wanted less names but better branding. You also see this in the champion's league where large chunks of the stadium (where sponsorship could be) is covered with their "stars" logo. Ditto - WC's limit the number of "partners" that they'll allow.
So in many ways the arguments that "we need to sell our soul to keep up" might be irrelevant as a more wholistic strategy with fewer sponsors might generate greater revenues anyway.
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... and on that Birmingham Red Bulls thing, to Randy's credit, I don't think he'd take it in a million years, either.
The one thing I think he's been pretty much perfect on is understanding and respecting our tradition.
I was thinking more if someone took over the club and randy was no longer a part of the equation .
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Randy may insist on the sale coming with restrictive covenants.
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Randy may insist on the sale coming with restrictive covenants.
Maybe but money talks , if the money is right can he turn it down ?
Whoever buys the club will likely want to do things their way and if it means taking us to the champions league and beyond then i think randy would be happy - you can't have your cake and eat it.
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If he has an emotional attachment to the club and has a respect for the history of the place, then he wouldn't sell to somebody wanting to change the name, colours, stadium name etc.
Even Herbie could smell a shyster when they came knocking and he had done his level best to bury the greatest achievements in the club’s history.
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What happens if they do buy us and then also finally realise their drink tastes like Piss and rebrand accordingly. Then we'll be known as Piss Villa.
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If he has an emotional attachment to the club and has a respect for the history of the place, then he wouldn't sell to somebody wanting to change the name, colours, stadium name etc.
Even Herbie could smell a shyster when they came knocking and he had done his level best to bury the greatest achievements in the club’s history.
Not sure why people think a big money buyer would change the name or colours - it didn't happen at Chelsea or man city - I'm sure randy would like to sell eventually to someone with the clubs history at heart although of course it depends how much he needs the money and what offer is made to him if he did ever decide to cash in.
There are other attractive clubs out there like everton and newcastle of similar size and potential.
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If a new owner changes the colours, name, stadium name etc, just don't go down anymore. The negative publicity of an empty ground wouldn't be wise.
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I want to go down and that is the problem.
I am not a customer, I am a supporter. Owners and the league in general know this and exploit us as fans because of this. If we were customers, then football would have packed up long ago.
What other customers would take changes to opening times to make them highly inconvenient and a hyperinflation of the product price way beyond an increase in the quality, to name but two issues with the game.
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I want to go down and that is the problem.
I am not a customer, I am a supporter. Owners and the league in general know this and exploit us as fans because of this. If we were customers, then football would have packed up long ago.
What other customers would take changes to opening times to make them highly inconvenient and a hyperinflation of the product price way beyond an increase in the quality, to name but two issues with the game.
people who queue outside the apple store for hours for a midnight opening to buy the latest iphone, which is almost exactly the same as the last iphone but has an 's' on the end?
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There is too much goodwill locked up in the name Aston Villa for our name to be changed. I can see Villa Park becoming Red Bull Park for the right amount of shekels though.
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There is too much goodwill locked up in the name Aston Villa for our name to be changed. I can see Villa Park becoming Red Bull Park for the right amount of shekels though.
Ditto the club colours, our kit is a big part of who we are and a lot of people know it. I have no worries about anyone buying us and changing either. If you're going to change things like that you buy a club without the history.
I really don't see an issue with the ground though.
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There is too much goodwill locked up in the name Aston Villa for our name to be changed. I can see Villa Park becoming Red Bull Park for the right amount of shekels though.
Ditto the club colours, our kit is a big part of who we are and a lot of people know it. I have no worries about anyone buying us and changing either. If you're going to change things like that you buy a club without the history.
I really don't see an issue with the ground though.
Cardiff ? Agree with you by the way.
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There is too much goodwill locked up in the name Aston Villa for our name to be changed. I can see Villa Park becoming Red Bull Park for the right amount of shekels though.
Ditto the club colours, our kit is a big part of who we are and a lot of people know it. I have no worries about anyone buying us and changing either. If you're going to change things like that you buy a club without the history.
I really don't see an issue with the ground though.
Cardiff ? Agree with you by the way.
The reasoning behind the cardiff change was to try to get the floating welsh support behind them agianst the English rather than for commercial reasons, don't think it went down very well though, from the comments by the cardiff fans I went to uni with at least.
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So blatant racism is alive and well in our Prem ?
Just as long as you do not make monkey sounds, or call somebody a ...., ?
But it is ok for some bloke to take over a club and target the anti English fraction, sorry, faction to make himself some sort of messiah ?
I don't buy that, or understand that, at all. Go and play in the league of Wales in that case.
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So blatant racism is alive and well in our Prem ?
Just as long as you do not make monkey sounds, or call somebody a ...., ?
But it is ok for some bloke to take over a club and target the anti English fraction, sorry, faction to make himself some sort of messiah ?
I don't buy that, or understand that, at all. Go and play in the league of Wales in that case.
Oh for goodness sake stop being so OTT.
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I want to go down and that is the problem.
I am not a customer, I am a supporter. Owners and the league in general know this and exploit us as fans because of this. If we were customers, then football would have packed up long ago.
What other customers would take changes to opening times to make them highly inconvenient and a hyperinflation of the product price way beyond an increase in the quality, to name but two issues with the game.
They stopped treating us like fans and more like customers years ago, that horse has already bolted.
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Really now, Welsh-English sporting rivalry is hardly the same as monkey chants against black players is it?
The reasoning behind the cardiff change was to try to get the floating welsh support behind them agianst the English rather than for commercial reasons, don't think it went down very well though, from the comments by the cardiff fans I went to uni with at least.
I hadn't thought of it that way. I thought the change was because Tan is Indonesian, and both the colour red and dragons have massive cultural significance and are symbols of luck and success in that part of Asia.
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I don't get it.
I thought the thing behind Tan changing Cardiff from blue to red was mostly because red is the colour associated with success in Asia, rather than something anti English.
Or am I missing something?
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I want to go down and that is the problem.
I am not a customer, I am a supporter. Owners and the league in general know this and exploit us as fans because of this. If we were customers, then football would have packed up long ago.
What other customers would take changes to opening times to make them highly inconvenient and a hyperinflation of the product price way beyond an increase in the quality, to name but two issues with the game.
They stopped treating us like fans and more like customers years ago, that horse has already bolted.
Its arguable though that its made the lower leagues better and more competitive. the Conference is mostly professional with a lot of established old league clubs in there. Clubs below that level, though, are more likely to go the wall with little backing or lending. But those clubs that prepare better forthe business/commercial age of football will survive better.
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Flogging sponsorship for large amounts of money is far more understandable - and acceptable - than the sort of piddling amounts of money low rent sponsorships like substitutes would bring in.
That piddling amount of money could be the difference between offering an academy player a contract or letting him go, that academy player could become the next Gary Shaw.
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I don't get it.
I thought the thing behind Tan changing Cardiff from blue to red was mostly because red is the colour associated with success in Asia, rather than something anti English.
Or am I missing something?
That's the official reason, but I personally don't know any Cardiff fans who buy it. South Wales is full of rugby fans and plastic man u and liverpool fans (I've played a lot of rugby down there). I don't know anyone who thinks the crest in particular has anything to do with any far east dragon, and the colour explanation doesn't really fit either.
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Flogging sponsorship for large amounts of money is far more understandable - and acceptable - than the sort of piddling amounts of money low rent sponsorships like substitutes would bring in.
That piddling amount of money could be the difference between offering an academy player a contract or letting him go, that academy player could become the next Gary Shaw.
But you could make the same argument about pretty much every other bit of revenue we have.
Effectively it is a 'take the money' argument - you could say the same thing if they put the prices up significantly every year, or if they decided to do a deal with a record company to play a One Direction song every time we scored (although if it were done on a "per play" basis, that wouldn't earn much etc etc etc).
You could have said the same thing about that iffy booking charge they started adding this season on ticket orders.
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So blatant racism is alive and well in our Prem ?
Just as long as you do not make monkey sounds, or call somebody a ...., ?
But it is ok for some bloke to take over a club and target the anti English fraction, sorry, faction to make himself some sort of messiah ?
I don't buy that, or understand that, at all. Go and play in the league of Wales in that case.
There must be a winter equivalent of sangria,down in Lanza, that you have been drinking today Dan?
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Flogging sponsorship for large amounts of money is far more understandable - and acceptable - than the sort of piddling amounts of money low rent sponsorships like substitutes would bring in.
That piddling amount of money could be the difference between offering an academy player a contract or letting him go, that academy player could become the next Gary Shaw.
But you could make the same argument about pretty much every other bit of revenue we have.
Effectively it is a 'take the money' argument - you could say the same thing if they put the prices up significantly every year, or if they decided to do a deal with a record company to play a One Direction song every time we scored (although if it were done on a "per play" basis, that wouldn't earn much etc etc etc).
You could have said the same thing about that iffy booking charge they started adding this season on ticket orders.
Yes, but those (especially One Direction) are all things that would (and did in the case of the booking fee) piss people off. I doubt anyone would really notice a sponsored substitution announcement after the first game or two, and as I said, if something like that pisses you off then maybe you need a gentler hobby than watching football!
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Can i ask seeing as we have had ten pages now is there any solid information that Red Bull wants to buy our club or is it just another rumour?
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Can i ask seeing as we have had ten pages now is there any solid information that Red Bull wants to buy our club or is it just another rumour?
It's not even a rumour.
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I was at Hull and they sponsor substitutions, added time and no doubt the pies have a sponsors name stamped on them. It's fucking tacky and shit.
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Can i ask seeing as we have had ten pages now is there any solid information that Red Bull wants to buy our club or is it just another rumour?
No solid information whatsoever.
That said, the fact that this rumour keeps popping up, and the fact that Red Bull have bought teams in several other countries, suggests to me that they probably do want to buy an English side. Theres no evidence that its going to be Villa though.
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But will Red Bull give us wins?
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But will Red Bull give us wins?
Judging by this thread they'll certainly give us whinge.
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But will Red Bull give us wins?
Judging by this thread they'll certainly give us whinge.
Or indeed (and with all due apologies to messrs AD and CD Villafan)
"And on the bench for Villa this afternoon, Number 13..."
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Can i ask seeing as we have had ten pages now is there any solid information that Red Bull wants to buy our club or is it just another rumour?
No solid information whatsoever.
That said, the fact that this rumour keeps popping up, and the fact that Red Bull have bought teams in several other countries, suggests to me that they probably do want to buy an English side. Theres no evidence that its going to be Villa though.
If we gave away the naming rights to Villa Park, I don't think I could go anymore.
I've always been proud of our heritage. To sell it sickens me.
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The name, colours and Villa Park should be ringfenced. Anything else is fair game for sponsorship.
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The name, colours and Villa Park should be ringfenced. Anything else is fair game for sponsorship.
Ah come on - the 'Villa Red Bulls' playing in a swanky red and blue kit at the new 'Red Bull Arena' by the NEC - what's not to like?
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The name, colours and Villa Park should be ringfenced. Anything else is fair game for sponsorship.
Ah come on - the 'Villa Red Bulls' playing in a swanky red and blue kit at the new 'Red Bull Arena' by the NEC - what's not to like?
Along with the new badge featuring a red bull next to Sebastian Vettel's face
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Danny Macaskill doing bunny hops on the pitch at half time...
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The name, colours and Villa Park should be ringfenced. Anything else is fair game for sponsorship.
Ah come on - the 'Villa Red Bulls' playing in a swanky red and blue kit at the new 'Red Bull Arena' by the NEC - what's not to like?
Along with the new badge featuring a red bull next to Sebastian Vettel's face
They'd probably fob us off and give us Webber or some crappy Toro Rosso driver.
Or, if they're like Nike, someone who drove for them a few years ago. Coulthard or something.
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But will Red Bull give us wins?
I don't think even a company with the sporting success track record of Red Bull could give us consistent wins at home.
I've come to accept it as something we won't have in my life time, it's up there with landing a man on mars, us winning the FA Cup, or HS2.
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Can i ask seeing as we have had ten pages now is there any solid information that Red Bull wants to buy our club or is it just another rumour?
No solid information whatsoever.
That said, the fact that this rumour keeps popping up, and the fact that Red Bull have bought teams in several other countries, suggests to me that they probably do want to buy an English side. Theres no evidence that its going to be Villa though.
To be fair, the rumour popping up again this time is down to some random punter on twitter asking if anyone had heard anything about it the other week.
There's not a hint of any truth whatsoever in this.
In my mind I am imagining Randy, back at home in his Long Island estate, sat reading this thread, pissing himself laughing.
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I can honestly say that I have never ever had any Red Bull, I have no idea what it tastes like
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I can honestly say that I have never ever had any Red Bull, I have no idea what it tastes like
It's putrid. Absolutely awful.
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If you wake up after a big night out and you can taste red bull, you know it got really messy towards the end. Then throughout the next day you'll get flashbacks of wierd stuff that you can't remember if it really happened or you dreamt it, every time it repeats on you. Or is that just me?
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Can i ask seeing as we have had ten pages now is there any solid information that Red Bull wants to buy our club or is it just another rumour?
No solid information whatsoever.
That said, the fact that this rumour keeps popping up, and the fact that Red Bull have bought teams in several other countries, suggests to me that they probably do want to buy an English side. Theres no evidence that its going to be Villa though.
To be fair, the rumour popping up again this time is down to some random punter on twitter asking if anyone had heard anything about it the other week.
There's not a hint of any truth whatsoever in this.
In my mind I am imagining Randy, back at home in his Long Island estate, sat reading this thread, pissing himself laughing.
There's a bit more to it that that...torygraph (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/10459627/Red-Bull-putting-their-name-to-a-Premier-League-team-would-be-another-step-in-commercialising-the-sport.html)
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Red Bull aren’t a ‘silent partner’ – if your club takes the Austrian schilling, it accepts the full bovine package.
The company owns, or is the major backer of, 15 sports teams around the world, including the hyper-successful Formula 1 team that bares its name. All five of its football teams – based in New York, Salzburg, Leipzig, Brazil and Ghana – boast the Red Bull brand.
When the company bought FC Salzburg in 2005, it changed the club’s name, management and staff, removed its previous violet colour from the badge and claimed it to be ‘a new club with no history’.
http://metro.co.uk/2013/11/18/why-aston-villa-fans-should-have-no-thirst-for-any-red-bull-takeover-4191426/?
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Can i ask seeing as we have had ten pages now is there any solid information that Red Bull wants to buy our club or is it just another rumour?
No solid information whatsoever.
That said, the fact that this rumour keeps popping up, and the fact that Red Bull have bought teams in several other countries, suggests to me that they probably do want to buy an English side. Theres no evidence that its going to be Villa though.
To be fair, the rumour popping up again this time is down to some random punter on twitter asking if anyone had heard anything about it the other week.
There's not a hint of any truth whatsoever in this.
In my mind I am imagining Randy, back at home in his Long Island estate, sat reading this thread, pissing himself laughing.
There's a bit more to it that that...torygraph (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/10459627/Red-Bull-putting-their-name-to-a-Premier-League-team-would-be-another-step-in-commercialising-the-sport.html)
In what way does the content of that article suggest they're interested in buying us?
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I can honestly say that I have never ever had any Red Bull, I have no idea what it tastes like
It's putrid. Absolutely awful.
It is one of the few things you can't mix with vodka to make a perfectly drinkable tipple.
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I can't drink vodka. Red Bull manages to make it taste worse.
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But will Red Bull give us wins?
Very good
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I can honestly say that I have never ever had any Red Bull, I have no idea what it tastes like
It's putrid. Absolutely awful.
It is one of the few things you can't mix with vodka to make a perfectly drinkable tipple.
Just the smell of it makes me want to heave.
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Can i ask seeing as we have had ten pages now is there any solid information that Red Bull wants to buy our club or is it just another rumour?
No solid information whatsoever.
That said, the fact that this rumour keeps popping up, and the fact that Red Bull have bought teams in several other countries, suggests to me that they probably do want to buy an English side. Theres no evidence that its going to be Villa though.
To be fair, the rumour popping up again this time is down to some random punter on twitter asking if anyone had heard anything about it the other week.
There's not a hint of any truth whatsoever in this.
In my mind I am imagining Randy, back at home in his Long Island estate, sat reading this thread, pissing himself laughing.
There's a bit more to it that that...torygraph (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/10459627/Red-Bull-putting-their-name-to-a-Premier-League-team-would-be-another-step-in-commercialising-the-sport.html)
In what way does the content of that article suggest they're interested in buying us?
I liked this comment though:
Aston Ginsters Cornish Pasties Villa.
It's got a certain ring to it I suppose.
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Can i ask seeing as we have had ten pages now is there any solid information that Red Bull wants to buy our club or is it just another rumour?
No solid information whatsoever.
That said, the fact that this rumour keeps popping up, and the fact that Red Bull have bought teams in several other countries, suggests to me that they probably do want to buy an English side. Theres no evidence that its going to be Villa though.
To be fair, the rumour popping up again this time is down to some random punter on twitter asking if anyone had heard anything about it the other week.
There's not a hint of any truth whatsoever in this.
In my mind I am imagining Randy, back at home in his Long Island estate, sat reading this thread, pissing himself laughing.
There's a bit more to it that that...torygraph (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/10459627/Red-Bull-putting-their-name-to-a-Premier-League-team-would-be-another-step-in-commercialising-the-sport.html)
In what way does the content of that article suggest they're interested in buying us?
Well it obviously does not say that specifically, but there's more to this story than "some random punter on twitter" causing all the fuss. Which is what you said.
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Well, is there?
It refers entirely to "rumours" which is precisely what it was that some guy on twitter resurrected last week. What's more, the only reference to us in there is one with us in with a bunch of other clubs, including the likes of Orient, with their names changed.
Other than referring to rumours, there's not a single thing there that suggests Red Bull want to buy an English team, let alone that it is us.
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where's there's smoke ;)
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I do think that if they were going to totally rebrand a club, pretend it has no history at all and is a brand new club, and then pour cash into it, they'd be better off buying a lower league club in a populous area and doing it.
Orient, oddly enough, wouldn't be too bad a choice. Or Crystal Palace, even, who have always (rightly or wrongly) struck me as an artificial, somewhat plastic club.
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I don't for one minute think they will buy us, as I doubt RL would sell to a company that would almost certainly re brand the entire club.
If he's shown one thing the history of the club means something to him.
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I do think that if they were going to totally rebrand a club, pretend it has no history at all and is a brand new club, and then pour cash into it, they'd be better off buying a lower league club in a populous area and doing it.
Orient, oddly enough, wouldn't be too bad a choice. Or Crystal Palace, even, who have always (rightly or wrongly) struck me as an artificial, somewhat plastic club.
I think they'll buy Newcastle.
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I do think that if they were going to totally rebrand a club, pretend it has no history at all and is a brand new club, and then pour cash into it, they'd be better off buying a lower league club in a populous area and doing it.
Orient, oddly enough, wouldn't be too bad a choice. Or Crystal Palace, even, who have always (rightly or wrongly) struck me as an artificial, somewhat plastic club.
On that criteria MK Dons would be a stand out favourite, and red bull are already based there
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I do think that if they were going to totally rebrand a club, pretend it has no history at all and is a brand new club, and then pour cash into it, they'd be better off buying a lower league club in a populous area and doing it.
Orient, oddly enough, wouldn't be too bad a choice. Or Crystal Palace, even, who have always (rightly or wrongly) struck me as an artificial, somewhat plastic club.
On that criteria MK Dons would be a stand out favourite, and red bull are already based there
Good shout.
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I do think that if they were going to totally rebrand a club, pretend it has no history at all and is a brand new club, and then pour cash into it, they'd be better off buying a lower league club in a populous area and doing it.
Orient, oddly enough, wouldn't be too bad a choice. Or Crystal Palace, even, who have always (rightly or wrongly) struck me as an artificial, somewhat plastic club.
On that criteria MK Dons would be a stand out favourite, and red bull are already based there
Good shout.
Or Cardiff. The current blokes already changed their colours.
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I don't for one minute think they will buy us, as I doubt RL would sell to a company that would almost certainly re brand the entire club.
If he's shown one thing the history of the club means something to him.
If and when Randy does decide to sell us, do you think that anything other than the amount offered will really matter to him?
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I don't for one minute think they will buy us, as I doubt RL would sell to a company that would almost certainly re brand the entire club.
If he's shown one thing the history of the club means something to him.
If and when Randy does decide to sell us, do you think that anything other than the amount offered will really matter to him?
That's harsh.
It mattered to Doug, so why wouldn't it matter to Randy?
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But will Red Bull give us wins?
Judging by this thread they'll certainly give us whinge.
Or indeed (and with all due apologies to messrs AD and CD Villafan)
"And on the bench for Villa this afternoon, Number 13..."
Whenever I hear that tune, I picture Partridge jumping on his bed and eventually whacking his head off a table.
JET!
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Can i ask seeing as we have had ten pages now is there any solid information that Red Bull wants to buy our club or is it just another rumour?
No solid information whatsoever.
That said, the fact that this rumour keeps popping up, and the fact that Red Bull have bought teams in several other countries, suggests to me that they probably do want to buy an English side. Theres no evidence that its going to be Villa though.
To be fair, the rumour popping up again this time is down to some random punter on twitter asking if anyone had heard anything about it the other week.
There's not a hint of any truth whatsoever in this.
In my mind I am imagining Randy, back at home in his Long Island estate, sat reading this thread, pissing himself laughing.
There's a bit more to it that that...torygraph (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/10459627/Red-Bull-putting-their-name-to-a-Premier-League-team-would-be-another-step-in-commercialising-the-sport.html)
In what way does the content of that article suggest they're interested in buying us?
I liked this comment though:
Aston Ginsters Cornish Pasties Villa.
It's got a certain ring to it I suppose.
Only if we beef up the defence and have a cheesy entrance song .
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I don't for one minute think they will buy us, as I doubt RL would sell to a company that would almost certainly re brand the entire club.
If he's shown one thing the history of the club means something to him.
If and when Randy does decide to sell us, do you think that anything other than the amount offered will really matter to him?
That's harsh.
It mattered to Doug, so why wouldn't it matter to Randy?
I'm not sure it mattered to Doug did it?
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I don't for one minute think they will buy us, as I doubt RL would sell to a company that would almost certainly re brand the entire club.
If he's shown one thing the history of the club means something to him.
If and when Randy does decide to sell us, do you think that anything other than the amount offered will really matter to him?
That's harsh.
It mattered to Doug, so why wouldn't it matter to Randy?
I'm not sure it mattered to Doug did it?
Well, if you believe him talking about Gillet and Hicks, it did:
I could have sold to them for a lot more money..made a bigger profit for myself. However, in the process I would have put a millstone round the neck of Aston Villa due to them taking a dividend to make interest payments. Randy Lerner didn't want to do this and I'm glad I sold to him rather than Gillett'
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I do think that if they were going to totally rebrand a club, pretend it has no history at all and is a brand new club, and then pour cash into it, they'd be better off buying a lower league club in a populous area and doing it.
Orient, oddly enough, wouldn't be too bad a choice. Or Crystal Palace, even, who have always (rightly or wrongly) struck me as an artificial, somewhat plastic club.
On that criteria MK Dons would be a stand out favourite, and red bull are already based there
Good shout.
Or Cardiff. The current blokes already changed their colours.
Bristol Red Bull Rovers
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I don't for one minute think they will buy us, as I doubt RL would sell to a company that would almost certainly re brand the entire club.
If he's shown one thing the history of the club means something to him.
If and when Randy does decide to sell us, do you think that anything other than the amount offered will really matter to him?
That's harsh.
It mattered to Doug, so why wouldn't it matter to Randy?
I'm not sure it mattered to Doug did it?
Well, if you believe him talking about Gillet and Hicks, it did:
I could have sold to them for a lot more money..made a bigger profit for myself. However, in the process I would have put a millstone round the neck of Aston Villa due to them taking a dividend to make interest payments. Randy Lerner didn't want to do this and I'm glad I sold to him rather than Gillett'
I guess we will never know for sure but he did like building his own legend status
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I'm currently drinking a full fat red bull. The big can.
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One thing I wouldn't be able to stomach if we were to become a glamour side, would be the day trippers and Johnny Come Lately types that infest the top sides.
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I don't for one minute think they will buy us, as I doubt RL would sell to a company that would almost certainly re brand the entire club.
If he's shown one thing the history of the club means something to him.
If and when Randy does decide to sell us, do you think that anything other than the amount offered will really matter to him?
As it happens yes.
I think he sees himself as a custodian of the club. He's obviously a businessman but I genuinely believe he would only sell to people who have the best interests of the club at heart.
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I don't for one minute think they will buy us, as I doubt RL would sell to a company that would almost certainly re brand the entire club.
If he's shown one thing the history of the club means something to him.
If and when Randy does decide to sell us, do you think that anything other than the amount offered will really matter to him?
That's harsh.
It mattered to Doug, so why wouldn't it matter to Randy?
I'm not sure it mattered to Doug did it?
Well, if you believe him talking about Gillet and Hicks, it did:
I could have sold to them for a lot more money..made a bigger profit for myself. However, in the process I would have put a millstone round the neck of Aston Villa due to them taking a dividend to make interest payments. Randy Lerner didn't want to do this and I'm glad I sold to him rather than Gillett'
I guess we will never know for sure but he did like building his own legend status
Whether it's true about the gruesome twosome from Liverpool or not, Ray Ransom was publicly begging to buy the club around that time and got told where to go, in part because of what he'd contributed to Leeds demise by providing Ridsdale with finance.
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One thing I wouldn't be able to stomach if we were to become a glamour side, would be the day trippers and Johnny Come Lately types that infest the top sides.
Me too.
Then we'd sign Falcao and Zlatan, win the league, and get over it pretty quickly.
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One thing I wouldn't be able to stomach if we were to become a glamour side, would be the day trippers and Johnny Come Lately types that infest the top sides.
Yes, thank goodness I've kept all my old scarves and worn shirts. I have a nice old scarf from circa 1978 with the original round Villa badge we all love sewn on to it as a patch. That would keep my street cred intact, or what little I have left!
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Several websites and Media outlets are carrying a story about Red Bull being interested in buying us, apparently they are known to be intent on buying a premiership club, their "Director of football" is a bloke called Gerard Houllier, interesting if its true. How would we feel if it Happened??. Good-bye Villa park, hello Red Bull Arena, etc`.
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Has there been any further development since the last time this was discussed or you just felt like posting a thread?
Not being an arse, just there was already a thread is all.
Anyway, my opinion can be summed up here: If they changed our colours or name then I don't care how much they invest. Can rename the stadium if they like, nobody would refer to it as the Red Bull Arena.
To be honest gut feeling is a no even with investment. Just don't like the idea of someone like Red Bull taking over us.
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Well if Redbull is supposed to give you wings I suspect Grant Holt is going to have to drink a shed load to lift his tub of lard off the ground.
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If they're ambitious, then yeah, I'm all for it. However, I don't want us to change our name, colours, and I really don't want a new stadium.
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FC_Red_Bull_Salzburg
"The Red Bull company bought the club on 6 April 2005 and rebranded it. After the takeover, Red Bull changed the club's name, management, and staff, declaring "this is a new club with no history." Red Bull initially claimed on the club website that the club was founded in 2005, but was ordered to remove this claim by the Austrian F.A. The new authority removed all trace of violet from the club logo and the team now play in the colours of red and white, to the consternation of much of the club's traditional support.[19] A small pair of wings form the motif of the new club crest, displayed on the team jersey, in accordance with Red Bull's commercial slogan at the time: "It gives you wings." This complete re-branding of the team proved very similar to Red Bull's treatment of its two Formula One racing teams, Red Bull Racing and Scuderia Toro Rosso. However, Red Bull would not completely follow this precedent when it acquired the MetroStars club in Major League Soccer in the United States; while it rebranded the team as the New York Red Bulls, it chose to recognise the MetroStars' history.
The traditional supporters tried to resist the radical changes and formed their own movement in order to regain some of the tradition. Several fan-clubs throughout Europe voiced their support in what they saw as a fight against the growing commercialisation of football. However, after five months of protests and talks between the club owners and traditional fans, no compromise was reached. On 15 September 2005, the 'violet' supporters stated that the talks had irreversibly broken down and efforts to reach an agreement would be terminated.
This gave rise to two separate fan groups: the 'Red-Whites', who support 'Red Bull Salzburg' and the 'Violet-Whites', who want to preserve the 72-year-old tradition and refuse to support the rebranded club. The Violet-Whites ultimately formed a new club, SV Austria Salzburg."
So it's Goodbye "Aston Red Bulls", hello "AFC Aston Villa".
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Is it time for this one again? I can never remember whether we have to talk about it every six months or every three months.
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Here's the thing - I'd be surprised if Randy sold up to these people.
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Has there been any further development since the last time this was discussed or you just felt like posting a thread?
Not being an arse, just there was already a thread is all.
Anyway, my opinion can be summed up here: If they changed our colours or name then I don't care how much they invest. Can rename the stadium if they like, nobody would refer to it as the Red Bull Arena.
To be honest gut feeling is a no even with investment. Just don't like the idea of someone like Red Bull taking over us.
Havn`t seen a thread elswhere (on H&V) and no i didn`t "Just feel like posting a thread".
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Merged with the old thread.
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I'd be interested to know which media outlets are carrying this.
And who is saying it on Twitter.
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One thing I wouldn't be able to stomach if we were to become a glamour side, would be the day trippers and Johnny Come Lately types that infest the top sides.
Me too.
Then we'd sign Falcao and Zlatan, win the league, and get over it pretty quickly.
We'd be as obnoxious as Yanited fans away from home, I am sure. But wouldn't you feel compelled, in every conversation about football, to mention that you have been going down the Villa for X amount of years? The thought of being seen as JCL gloryhunter would bother me, knowing how much disdain I hold Brummie Reds in etc.
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I'd be interested to know which media outlets are carrying this.
And who is saying it on Twitter.
Sherlocknuts do your thang.
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I'd be interested to know which media outlets are carrying this.
And who is saying it on Twitter.
Sherlocknuts do your thang.
No need, I can guess. The media outlets will turn out to be eatdrinksleepfootybanter.com and the like, and the people on twitter will be 12 year olds saying "are red bull going to take over the Villa?" which then gets turned into "lots of talk on Twitter that Red Bull are buying us".
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I moan a lot about ambition etc but I'd choose where we are now over any of that bull that could come with a takeover like that.
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One thing I wouldn't be able to stomach if we were to become a glamour side, would be the day trippers and Johnny Come Lately types that infest the top sides.
Me too.
Then we'd sign Falcao and Zlatan, win the league, and get over it pretty quickly.
We'd be as obnoxious as Yanited fans away from home, I am sure. But wouldn't you feel compelled, in every conversation about football, to mention that you have been going down the Villa for X amount of years? The thought of being seen as JCL gloryhunter would bother me, knowing how much disdain I hold Brummie Reds in etc.
I'd rather not get people assuming that, but I'd rather win an avalanche of silverware and put up with it than otherwise.
That makes no sense, but you know what I mean.
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Thinking about all the glory hunting twats who would join is, I think I would rather be in Division Four.
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Thinking about all the glory hunting twats who would join is, I think I would rather be in Division Four.
Maybe that's why Yanited fans try and act the twat so much away from home? Its the only place they can enjoy their success free of the smear of all the hangers-on.
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Thinking about all the glory hunting twats who would join is, I think I would rather be in Division Four.
Maybe that's why Yanited fans try and act the twat so much away from home? Its the only place they can enjoy their success free of the smear of all the hangers-on.
Part that, part rules are for other people.
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Thinking about all the glory hunting twats who would join is, I think I would rather be in Division Four.
Maybe that's why Yanited fans try and act the twat so much away from home? Its the only place they can enjoy their success free of the smear of all the hangers-on.
Part that, part rules are for other people.
They're proper try hards aren't they? The uniformity of wearing black, while trying to look as moody as possible as they chuck bins and beers around at half time never seems to get old.
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It would be selling the soul of the club for a few tin pots. I am an Aston Villa fan, through good or bad. And what the hell would we all talk about if this happened? Picking the bones out of the good old days when things were a bit rubbish so we could have a good moan? Not for me.
And no to Aston Red Bulls, Red Bull Villa etc.
There are much more likely candidates than Villa though.
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Thinking about all the glory hunting twats who would join is, I think I would rather be in Division Four.
Maybe that's why Yanited fans try and act the twat so much away from home? Its the only place they can enjoy their success free of the smear of all the hangers-on.
The other thing that they have is a ballot system for away tickets. That would finish me going if I couldn't guarantee a ticket after all these years. Maybe go for the day out and deaf the match.
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I'd be interested to know which media outlets are carrying this.
And who is saying it on Twitter.
Just google red bull and villa, talk sport have referred to it, first i heard was monday night before the game in the pub!!.
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Thinking about all the glory hunting twats who would join is, I think I would rather be in Division Four.
Maybe that's why Yanited fans try and act the twat so much away from home? Its the only place they can enjoy their success free of the smear of all the hangers-on.
The other thing that they have is a ballot system for away tickets. That would finish me going if I couldn't guarantee a ticket after all these years. Maybe go for the day out and deaf the match.
Interesting on the money side of things don't Man City have the cheapest Season tickets in the PL? Also, they still don't sell out all their away games e.g. they took 1000 to Swansea over the Xmas break. I don't see us having thousands of gloryhunters at all - leave that with Liverpool, Yanited and Chelsea.
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Its why they have such excellent numbers away from home, as you will take your tickets when you can, where it is and whatever the price, as you're never guaranteed to be able to go to the next away game.
Although a few friends of mine only ever seem to miss out on a handful each year. It would drive me insane with the tension!
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Thinking about all the glory hunting twats who would join is, I think I would rather be in Division Four.
Maybe that's why Yanited fans try and act the twat so much away from home? Its the only place they can enjoy their success free of the smear of all the hangers-on.
The other thing that they have is a ballot system for away tickets. That would finish me going if I couldn't guarantee a ticket after all these years. Maybe go for the day out and deaf the match.
Interesting on the money side of things don't Man City have the cheapest Season tickets in the PL? Also, they still don't sell out all their away games e.g. they took 1000 to Swansea over the Xmas break. I don't see us having thousands of gloryhunters at all - leave that with Liverpool, Yanited and Chelsea.
We'd get plent of day trippers at home (with half and half scarves) but Villa's away support is pretty good anyway isn't it? So it probably would become a bit more like Manure's.
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Thinking about all the glory hunting twats who would join is, I think I would rather be in Division Four.
Maybe that's why Yanited fans try and act the twat so much away from home? Its the only place they can enjoy their success free of the smear of all the hangers-on.
The other thing that they have is a ballot system for away tickets. That would finish me going if I couldn't guarantee a ticket after all these years. Maybe go for the day out and deaf the match.
Interesting on the money side of things don't Man City have the cheapest Season tickets in the PL? Also, they still don't sell out all their away games e.g. they took 1000 to Swansea over the Xmas break. I don't see us having thousands of gloryhunters at all - leave that with Liverpool, Yanited and Chelsea.
Bloody hell, give 'em a break.
Televised lunchtime KO on New Years Day and I imagine the public transport options between North West England and South Wales weren't that plentiful.
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Thinking about all the glory hunting twats who would join is, I think I would rather be in Division Four.
Maybe that's why Yanited fans try and act the twat so much away from home? Its the only place they can enjoy their success free of the smear of all the hangers-on.
The other thing that they have is a ballot system for away tickets. That would finish me going if I couldn't guarantee a ticket after all these years. Maybe go for the day out and deaf the match.
Interesting on the money side of things don't Man City have the cheapest Season tickets in the PL? Also, they still don't sell out all their away games e.g. they took 1000 to Swansea over the Xmas break. I don't see us having thousands of gloryhunters at all - leave that with Liverpool, Yanited and Chelsea.
Bloody hell, give 'em a break.
Televised lunchtime KO on New Years Day and I imagine the public transport options between North West England and South Wales weren't that plentiful.
I was trying to stress that as yet there aren't hoards of gloryhunters from around the UK following Citeh. My son coaches kids 5-15 and aswell as the usual red gloryhunters and Chelsea only a couple of Citeh tops have appeared to date.
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If they bought us and invested money, I would buy the red away kit , happily refer to the red bull arena (traditional home of aston villa) AND sing "Red Bull! Barmy Army!" with the new Villa glory hunter fans.
If thats what it takes to bloody win things and play some great football then I will do it, with alacrity.
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If they bought us and invested money, I would buy the red away kit , happily refer to the red bull arena (traditional home of aston villa) AND sing "Red Bull! Barmy Army!" with the new Villa glory hunter fans.
If thats what it takes to bloody win things and play some great football then I will do it, with alacrity.
See the reason I couldn't do this is because it just wouldn't be Aston Villa anymore. I support this club, the things which have remained continuous whoever the owner, manager or players have been, wherever they've trained and what shape the badge took. If they came in and did to us what they've done to Salzburg, it wouldn't be Aston Villa winning things anymore.
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If they bought us and invested money, I would buy the red away kit , happily refer to the red bull arena (traditional home of aston villa) AND sing "Red Bull! Barmy Army!" with the new Villa glory hunter fans.
If thats what it takes to bloody win things and play some great football then I will do it, with alacrity.
See the reason I couldn't do this is because it just wouldn't be Aston Villa anymore. I support this club, the things which have remained continuous whoever the owner, manager or players have been, wherever they've trained and what shape the badge took. If they came in and did to us what they've done to Salzburg, it wouldn't be Aston Villa winning things anymore.
My sentiments exactly.
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If they bought us and invested money, I would buy the red away kit , happily refer to the red bull arena (traditional home of aston villa) AND sing "Red Bull! Barmy Army!" with the new Villa glory hunter fans.
If thats what it takes to bloody win things and play some great football then I will do it, with alacrity.
See the reason I couldn't do this is because it just wouldn't be Aston Villa anymore. I support this club, the things which have remained continuous whoever the owner, manager or players have been, wherever they've trained and what shape the badge took. If they came in and did to us what they've done to Salzburg, it wouldn't be Aston Villa winning things anymore.
My sentiments exactly.
I respect that, but it wouldnt bother me one jot. Such trapping are completely temporary. Renaming Villa park or wearing red away are as irrelevant to me as what betting firm is on our shirt this season. They will all change in a few years and Villa will go on.
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They're very committed to sport and excellence so in that regard I think it would be great. It goes without saying that nobody wants people fucking with our identity. I doubt they'd even try.
Mass sponsorship, a themed away kit, stand renaming and so on, sure. To be honest, if they could bring entertainment and belief back to this club I could swallow almost anything at the moment. It's not like the premier league is a noble institution that is respectful of history and traditions.
A new injection of ambition, nous and resources would be great. Any other issues, well, that's a matter for when and if they arose. I hope there's something in this but I'm not getting too ahead of myself.
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The thing is, Randy is many things, but like I've said I doubt he's the kind of guy to sell the club to people who plan to do away with all of our traditions. Randy has never been anything other than enthusiastically supportive of our traditions.
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They're very committed to sport and excellence so in that regard I think it would be great. It goes without saying that nobody wants people fucking with our identity. I doubt they'd even try.
Mass sponsorship, a themed away kit, stand renaming and so on, sure. To be honest, if they could bring entertainment and belief back to this club I could swallow almost anything at the moment. It's not like the premier league is a noble institution that is respectful of history and traditions.
A new injection of ambition, nous and resources would be great. Any other issues, well, that's a matter for when and if they arose. I hope there's something in this but I'm not getting too ahead of myself.
Like when IMG were going to buy us Ronaldo?
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No problem with them sponsoring us. No problem with the 'Red Bull North Stand' or whatever. No problem with a different-coloured away kit as there have been a few with a difference. Big problem with renaming the ground and/or the team.
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I could possibly live with renaming the ground as we'd still call it Villa Park. I doubt many would consider that Bayern Munich and Arsenal have sold their soul for playing in sponsored stadia. Admittedly they moved into a new ground rather than renaming an existing one but I don't see a whole lot of difference.
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Seems like we have all ironed out the details. The deal can go ahead now Randy.
Sorted.
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The thing is, Randy is many things, but like I've said I doubt he's the kind of guy to sell the club to people who plan to do away with all of our traditions. Randy has never been anything other than enthusiastically supportive of our traditions.
If the money is right and he feels the buyer could take villa back to competing at the highest level and be a force again then who knows - probably all pie in the sky anyway but if it did happen I doubt anyone would want to change the name of the club - as others have said the ground will always be villa park to us anyway whatever anyone else calls it .
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No problem with them sponsoring us. No problem with the 'Red Bull North Stand' or whatever. No problem with a different-coloured away kit as there have been a few with a difference. Big problem with renaming the ground and/or the team.
That's pretty much my position. The club and the ground have names among the oldest in the sport. We should not change that now.
Also, an away kit which looked like the Red Bull F1 car, with the navy blue and red trim, would be quite natty.
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If it meant a half 'Red Bull' half 'Villa' scarf, then count me in.
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The thing is, Randy is many things, but like I've said I doubt he's the kind of guy to sell the club to people who plan to do away with all of our traditions. Randy has never been anything other than enthusiastically supportive of our traditions.
i agree.
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So do I.
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I'm sure I've said this before but for me the 'sacred' bits are:
Club name has to be Aston Villa (I could probably come to terms with Aston Villa Red Bulls though)
Lion on the badge (couldn't give a toss if they changed the shape, they wanna put a lion on a blue and white quartered circle with wings behind it's not that different to any of the other badge changes we've seen)
Claret and Blue home kit (not as tied to tradition as some so I don't insist on claret body and blue sleeves but the colours are our main identity)
For me any complaints about the ground or stand names died in the 90s when we announced the new name for witton lane and any advertising they want to shove over the ground/training ground is ok by me, it's not like we don't have adverts everywhere anyway.
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No, we're Aston Villa. Not Aston Villa Red Bulls. Aston Villa sponsored by Red Bull would be fine.
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Correct its Aston Villa nothing else
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As said, I could probably learn to live that as the very extreme.
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I'm sure I've said this before but for me the 'sacred' bits are:
Club name has to be Aston Villa (I could probably come to terms with Aston Villa Red Bulls though)
Lion on the badge (couldn't give a toss if they changed the shape, they wanna put a lion on a blue and white quartered circle with wings behind it's not that different to any of the other badge changes we've seen)
Claret and Blue home kit (not as tied to tradition as some so I don't insist on claret body and blue sleeves but the colours are our main identity)
For me any complaints about the ground or stand names died in the 90s when we announced the new name for witton lane and any advertising they want to shove over the ground/training ground is ok by me, it's not like we don't have adverts everywhere anyway.
Agreed on all of those points, to be honest my main concern would be them renaming the Holte End.
If we get a shed load of free Red Bull before game I'll be happy.
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As said, I could probably learn to live that as the very extreme.
I couldn't. AVFC, not AVRBFC.
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My guess would be IF the takeover happened that lots of promises would be made not to change names etc but over time the promises would be gradually broken.
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What if they tried to name us Birmingham Red Bulls?
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What if they tried to name us Birmingham Red Bulls?
No bloody chance.
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They have a couple of teams where no mention of the city or region is made in the name... Red Bull Ghana and Red Bull Brasil.
So Red Bull UK or Red Bull GB is as likely as Birmingham Red Bulls.
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What if they tried to name us Birmingham Red Bulls?
dirty splitters - just let them try.
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What if they tried to name us Birmingham Red Bulls?
Never.
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As Legion said Aston Villa sponsored by Red Bulls wouldn't be that bad as it raises the profile for both parties. But I don't see that would be enough for the investment they would put in.
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How about Red Bull adopt our historic, world famous colours.
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If Lerner, in the form a Faulkner, was to allow Red Bull (or any other organisation) sully the name of Aston Villa with their name I would ram my season ticket card up his fundamental orifice so far he would be chewing my client reference number.
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Birmingham and Bull enjoy alliterative cachet.
I can see the attraction of renaming.
They can still go forth and multiply, though.
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I can't.
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I meant the attraction to the Red Bull franchise, not me!
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Thinking about all the glory hunting twats who would join is, I think I would rather be in Division Four.
Maybe that's why Yanited fans try and act the twat so much away from home? Its the only place they can enjoy their success free of the smear of all the hangers-on.
The other thing that they have is a ballot system for away tickets. That would finish me going if I couldn't guarantee a ticket after all these years. Maybe go for the day out and deaf the match.
Interesting on the money side of things don't Man City have the cheapest Season tickets in the PL? Also, they still don't sell out all their away games e.g. they took 1000 to Swansea over the Xmas break. I don't see us having thousands of gloryhunters at all - leave that with Liverpool, Yanited and Chelsea.
We'd get plent of day trippers at home (with half and half scarves) but Villa's away support is pretty good anyway isn't it? So it probably would become a bit more like Manure's.
Just like to say, i think Villa's away support is easily in the top 3 in the prem. Just my view, but we do travel with good numbers of fans at every away game. I remember going to Nnewcastle on a freezing winters night, Monday night if i am not wrong, 5-6 years ago, and we took 2000 fans. We were loud and proud, as usual. Villa's away support is the envy of most clubs in the prem, fact.
Oh, Red Bull can buy us if they want and give us shite loads of cash, so we can compete with the other top clubs. Just try and rename our stadium or our club and you will wish that caffeine drinks had been invented by some fu..er else, and lodge that up your corporate arse.
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OK not that any of it is palatable but what about if they kept the name as it is but changed the kit colours to RB corporate colours?
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OK not that any of it is palatable but what about if they kept the name as it is but changed the kit colours to RB corporate colours?
No problem with the away strip.
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OK not that any of it is palatable but what about if they kept the name as it is but changed the kit colours to RB corporate colours?
No fucking way olaftab. Just no.
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OK not that any of it is palatable but what about if they kept the name as it is but changed the kit colours to RB corporate colours?
No fucking way olaftab. Just no.
No, our claret and blue is not for sale.
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They're very committed to sport and excellence so in that regard I think it would be great. It goes without saying that nobody wants people fucking with our identity. I doubt they'd even try.
Mass sponsorship, a themed away kit, stand renaming and so on, sure. To be honest, if they could bring entertainment and belief back to this club I could swallow almost anything at the moment. It's not like the premier league is a noble institution that is respectful of history and traditions.
A new injection of ambition, nous and resources would be great. Any other issues, well, that's a matter for when and if they arose. I hope there's something in this but I'm not getting too ahead of myself.
Like when IMG were going to buy us Ronaldo?
Our link to them was... disappointing.
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Any chance of a poll on this.? A simple for or against. Even if it is all hypothetical.
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OK.
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OK not that any of it is palatable but what about if they kept the name as it is but changed the kit colours to RB corporate colours?
No problem with the away strip.
That's actually a very good idea.
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OK not that any of it is palatable but what about if they kept the name as it is but changed the kit colours to RB corporate colours?
No fucking way olaftab. Just no.
No, our claret and blue is not for sale.
Yes it is claret blue we all fell in love with.
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OK not that any of it is palatable but what about if they kept the name as it is but changed the kit colours to RB corporate colours?
I think the colours would get my vote to be kept if it was a choice between the 2, our kit, for me, is one of the most iconic in the sport, that's why so many of our fans are so set on it being exactly right. I don't think many other clubs as so tied to the home kit.
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if it happened and they changed the name of the team would people really stop following the club? I think there would be a lot of anger and fist pounding, and some would call it quits I'm sure. But would the majority? Wouldn't it still be Aston Villa and Villa Park to those of us who have always known it that way? It's not like if it happened I'd have the option of following someone else.
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They're very committed to sport and excellence so in that regard I think it would be great. It goes without saying that nobody wants people fucking with our identity. I doubt they'd even try.
Mass sponsorship, a themed away kit, stand renaming and so on, sure. To be honest, if they could bring entertainment and belief back to this club I could swallow almost anything at the moment. It's not like the premier league is a noble institution that is respectful of history and traditions.
A new injection of ambition, nous and resources would be great. Any other issues, well, that's a matter for when and if they arose. I hope there's something in this but I'm not getting too ahead of myself.
Like when IMG were going to buy us Ronaldo?
Our link to them was... disappointing.
Mazrim does have a point. The options are hope that we find the next mercurial manager that can work wonders with a budget way less than the current big boys or we are taken over by somebody with large funds. Red Bull are no fools but it would be a case of how far they take away the identify of the club that would be palatable to us older fans
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I would. We're Aston Villa.
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If Randy doesn't stay, then the owners to avoid are
Red Bull because there is no way the corporate colours would be kept for away days. Their team, their colours. Their name, their identity, including Birmingham. Their agenda.
Anybody from a folk tradition which values anything other than Claret and Blue for success.
If the logic from those traditions was carried through, the entire bloody league would play in red.
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Apologies if I've missed it but is there anything new to justify dragging up this thread again?!
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Apologies if I've missed it but is there anything new to justify dragging up this thread again?!
We are just bored?
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Apologies if I've missed it but is there anything new to justify dragging up this thread again?!
We are just bored?
Fair enough. As long as I haven't missed anything.
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OK not that any of it is palatable but what about if they kept the name as it is but changed the kit colours to RB corporate colours?
No fucking way olaftab. Just no.
No, our claret and blue is not for sale.
Yes it is claret blue we all fell in love with.
Yep, it's something very special.
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The poll should not just be Yes or No.
This goes far deeper than just yes or no.
Would we like to become the next Man City- YES
Will we have our stadium name changed, ie Etihad, Emirates, new grounds, i know.
Would we re-locate to a state of the art stadia-60,000 plus- No
If we were to be taken over would we have any choice in the matter ? No
Whatever happens would you still follow The Villa ?-Yes.
Always remember that we have never been a Sky TV plastic fan club. Our fan base was there for decades before Sky got involved. We are a solid club with solid fans. You are either Villa or you ain't, simple.
Even if some crazy multi billionaire decided to come and take us over, as a club, we will still be the fans. We may become a slight more popular within the foreign market, when we beat Bayern in the 2017 Champions league final. You know what i mean.
Serious investment would be very welcome, to compete at the very top. Sell our soul ? Never, never never.
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The poll should not just be Yes or No.
This goes far deeper than just yes or no.
Would we like to become the next Man City- YES
Will we have our stadium name changed, ie Etihad, Emirates, new grounds, i know.
Would we re-locate to a state of the art stadia-60,000 plus- No
If we were to be taken over would we have any choice in the matter ? No
Whatever happens would you still follow The Villa ?-Yes.
Always remember that we have never been a Sky TV plastic fan club. Our fan base was there for decades before Sky got involved. We are a solid club with solid fans. You are either Villa or you ain't, simple.
Even if some crazy multi billionaire decided to come and take us over, as a club, we will still be the fans. We may become a slight more popular within the foreign market, when we beat Bayern in the 2017 Champions league final. You know what i mean.
Serious investment would be very welcome, to compete at the very top. Sell our soul ? Never, never never.
"You are either Villa or you ain't, simple"
Probably the best comment of the night! Too true. UTV
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Apologies if I've missed it but is there anything new to justify dragging up this thread again?!
We are just bored?
Fair enough. As long as I haven't missed anything.
Stan Collymore tweeted this week that he had heard a rumour about Red Bull and Villa.
Means nothing of course but gives us some cover to discuss it again :)
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The only problem with a for/against poll is that, personally my answer is 'within reason'. There are a lot of good things about the brand and their approach to sporting excellence, the success of that approach is unquestionable and doesn't involve chelsea/man city levels of over-funding. I'd happily buy into that culture. I'd also happily see some commercial changes, but without knowing the extent of those it's tough to decide for or against.
On balance I'll say for because you wouldn't buy a club which has such a deep history and then shit all over it, it's not like we'd be ridiculously cheap. If you really want to buy a premier league club you'd look at someone like Southampton who have a largely disinterested owner (which is apparently why Cortese has left), similar colours, less history to be weighed down by and, I'd guess, a ground that will be a lot easier to expand.
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I'd rather they bought the Blues, flattened it and built a pop factory.
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I'd rather they bought the Blues, flattened it and built a pop factory.
Nah.. just leave them where they are.
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They could do whatever they liked. As long as they don't re-name the Doug Ellis Stand.
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Doug invented Red Bull you know. Only he called it Aston Best Bitter.
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They could do whatever they liked. As long as they don't re-name the Doug Ellis Stand.
Ha ha. Very Good.
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if it happened and they changed the name of the team would people really stop following the club? I think there would be a lot of anger and fist pounding, and some would call it quits I'm sure. But would the majority? Wouldn't it still be Aston Villa and Villa Park to those of us who have always known it that way? It's not like if it happened I'd have the option of following someone else.
I would. Stop, I mean.
A large part of the reason I follow the club at all is because it is engrained in my family right back to shortly after they moved to Aston from the country side in the mid-late 19th century.
Get it changing to a corporate themed kit, change its name to Red Bull Birmingham or whatever, and we'd be trampling over a huge slice of history - the history of the game, the league, of this city, of the sport, and of my family.
It would be the most grotesque defiling of sporting history that this country has seen.
Maybe that sounds somewhat over-emotional, but I honestly believe that.
What would be the point any more?
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And it is that defiling of sporting history which means it'd never actually happen, thankfully.
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It wouldn't be Aston Villa, they wouldn't play in claret and blue at Villa Park. There wouldn't be a Villa left to support.
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if it happened and they changed the name of the team would people really stop following the club? I think there would be a lot of anger and fist pounding, and some would call it quits I'm sure. But would the majority? Wouldn't it still be Aston Villa and Villa Park to those of us who have always known it that way? It's not like if it happened I'd have the option of following someone else.
I would. Stop, I mean.
A large part of the reason I follow the club at all is because it is engrained in my family right back to shortly after they moved to Aston from the country side in the mid-late 19th century.
Get it changing to a corporate themed kit, change its name to Red Bull Birmingham or whatever, and we'd be trampling over a huge slice of history - the history of the game, the league, of this city, of the sport, and of my family.
It would be the most grotesque defiling of sporting history that this country has seen.
Maybe that sounds somewhat over-emotional, but I honestly believe that.
What would be the point any more?
Totally agree with Paulie here.
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If they are interested though do you genuinely think they'd want to do that? I just can't see it, we're far from the cheapest club in the league, you'd be looking at £250m for us you' get other clubs for half and have a lot less anger if you did come in and make it a new 'franchise'. I just don't think any interest in us would be built around changing things to that extent.
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The name and the colours ARE the club.
Change those and the club disappears.
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I don't think there's any truth in it whatsoever.
If they were going to be interested in us, they'd doubtless operate as they do their other sports clubs, and want to change the name. It makes no sense to buy a club like Villa. Why bother? Buy MK Dons - which for RB would be a no brainer on about ten different levels - and save yourself a huge amount of money.
It makes no sense from any angle, and in this whole saga there hasn't been one single credible piece of evidence, or link, or quote, or anything to suggest it is going to happen.
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Not sure if I'm for or against.
If they don't change the name or colors, the can rebrand the sponsorship and I'd even consider a name change from Villa Park (as we'd ignore the new name anyway) then fine.
If they want a name change, team colors change etc then it's a death warrant.
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Big investment from a big company/owner would be the only way we (or any other club) is going to compete at the level that has been created by UEFA/Sky/EPL etc.
(My colleague who is a Man City fan used to be quite pleasant and humble and chatty - now he talks about every other club as if they're poor relations, shit and not worthy of his breath to bother passing comment: "Admit it, you'd love all our money" he said last season. As far as his team goes - he attends two games a season - at VP and The Whorespawns - "because we're always on Sky and I don't have to but tickets for my team's games"- as if that's something to be proud of!!!)
In the "modern era" it's the way the game is going - the supporters don't have a voice/influence - see: ManU/ManC/Chelski/Arse - and I suppose it's almost inevitable that other clubs will be taken over and given similar treatment. I don't want us to change colours, name of club, ground, stands etc, but if they've got the money, they will call the tune, end of.
If things could be done in accordance with our great tradition that would be perfect. But doubtful?
Until there is something definite, I ain't gonna get myself too worked up about our beautiful colours being ditched or Villa Park being flattened and reborn as the Birmingham Red Bull Arena.
I naively think that the club will still be The Villa whatever happens. I couldn't see me suddenly changing my allegiance to any other club instead/in protest.
UTV!
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If this happens I will rip my dick off and send it to Button Moon in a horse and cart powered by my own jizz.
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If this happens I will rip my dick off and send it to Button Moon in a horse and cart powered by my own jizz.
I'd rather stay as we are than sell our soul and become another Red Bull sports franchise. Our name, stadium and colours are what we are. It's what defines us. Change any part of it and it wouldn't be Aston Villa anymore.
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If this happens I will rip my dick off and send it to Button Moon in a horse and cart powered by my own jizz.
I'd rather stay as we are than sell our soul and become another Red Bull sports franchise. Our name, stadium and colours are what we are. It's what defines us. Change any part of it and it wouldn't be Aston Villa anymore.
I'm not sure why you quoted him to post that but it's a good idea, it's keep the evidence just in case
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If this happens I will rip my dick off and send it to Button Moon in a horse and cart powered by my own jizz.
I'd rather stay as we are than sell our soul and become another Red Bull sports franchise. Our name, stadium and colours are what we are. It's what defines us. Change any part of it and it wouldn't be Aston Villa anymore.
I'm not sure why you quoted him to post that but it's a good idea, it's keep the evidence just in case
I've no idea what you're talking about.
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If this happens I will rip my dick off and send it to Button Moon in a horse and cart powered by my own jizz.
I'd rather stay as we are than sell our soul and become another Red Bull sports franchise. Our name, stadium and colours are what we are. It's what defines us. Change any part of it and it wouldn't be Aston Villa anymore.
I'm not sure why you quoted him to post that but it's a good idea, it's keep the evidence just in case
I am 100% convinced they would buy a Championship club than us.A lot cheaper,easier to change the name and they could move the club anywhere they wanted.
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I'm not sure about the last 2 parts of that but I agree, I've said before we're not even the most obvious choice in Birmingham let alone England.
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I'm not sure about the last 2 parts of that but I agree, I've said before we're not even the most obvious choice in Birmingham let alone England.
The football League would let them do whatever they wanted.Ask any Coventry City fan.
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I'm not sure about the last 2 parts of that but I agree, I've said before we're not even the most obvious choice in Birmingham let alone England.
The football League would let them do whatever they wanted.Ask any Coventry City fan.
Perhaps they'll buy Small Heath and move them to the Isle of Man? I'm sure that would go down well.
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There might - possibly - be a difference between the Football League and the Premier League.
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Head spinning having read all this.
In reflection. Please let us stay as Aston Villa. (the famous Aston Villa). Beautiful..
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if it happened and they changed the name of the team would people really stop following the club? I think there would be a lot of anger and fist pounding, and some would call it quits I'm sure. But would the majority? Wouldn't it still be Aston Villa and Villa Park to those of us who have always known it that way? It's not like if it happened I'd have the option of following someone else.
I would. Stop, I mean.
A large part of the reason I follow the club at all is because it is engrained in my family right back to shortly after they moved to Aston from the country side in the mid-late 19th century.
Get it changing to a corporate themed kit, change its name to Red Bull Birmingham or whatever, and we'd be trampling over a huge slice of history - the history of the game, the league, of this city, of the sport, and of my family.
It would be the most grotesque defiling of sporting history that this country has seen.
Maybe that sounds somewhat over-emotional, but I honestly believe that.
What would be the point any more?
I was wondering how older Salzburg fans felt when Red Bull took over. It's not like their association with Red Bull has made them into a European power. I also then realized that as a club they've changed their name 3 times in their history, so maybe Red Bull only appeals to clubs that are willing to sell themselves out or don't have any kind of regard for tradition.
I don't know what I'd do. I barely watch football now except our games. Life as neutral football fan hold very little appeal to me.
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I'm not sure about the last 2 parts of that but I agree, I've said before we're not even the most obvious choice in Birmingham let alone England.
No not
Blue Bull Shit
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I'm not sure about the last 2 parts of that but I agree, I've said before we're not even the most obvious choice in Birmingham let alone England.
The football League would let them do whatever they wanted.Ask any Coventry City fan.
The league might, but I'm not sure the press or fans (in general) would. SISU had managed to fly under the radar until this year but since they took the club to Northampton they've started getting a lot more bad press and this is, supposedly, only temporary. A permanent move would be an incredibly brave thing to do, it took MK Dons a few years to recover from the fallout when they did it and their reasons were a hell of a lot more legitimate (no ground and nothing like the money to build one where they came from) than anything red bull could offer.
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I'm not sure about the last 2 parts of that but I agree, I've said before we're not even the most obvious choice in Birmingham let alone England.
No not
Blue Bull Shit
Bring it on. Like Barry Fry almost 20 years ago. "one day we will bigger than the Villa!"
Still makes me laugh as he walked through the carpark at St Andrews. What a TV programme that was . Them losing to KIddie was the best after KB thought it was an easy tie. Anybody got that programme? Would be welcomed relief???
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I live in the Coventry area,zero chance of Cov moving back to Coventry.
They are a club that owe SISU upwards of £60 million,a merger with Nuneaton Town who are also up to necks in it looks a real possibility.
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if it happened and they changed the name of the team would people really stop following the club? I think there would be a lot of anger and fist pounding, and some would call it quits I'm sure. But would the majority? Wouldn't it still be Aston Villa and Villa Park to those of us who have always known it that way? It's not like if it happened I'd have the option of following someone else.
I would. Stop, I mean.
A large part of the reason I follow the club at all is because it is engrained in my family right back to shortly after they moved to Aston from the country side in the mid-late 19th century.
Get it changing to a corporate themed kit, change its name to Red Bull Birmingham or whatever, and we'd be trampling over a huge slice of history - the history of the game, the league, of this city, of the sport, and of my family.
It would be the most grotesque defiling of sporting history that this country has seen.
Maybe that sounds somewhat over-emotional, but I honestly believe that.
What would be the point any more?
I was wondering how older Salzburg fans felt when Red Bull took over. It's not like their association with Red Bull has made them into a European power. I also then realized that as a club they've changed their name 3 times in their history, so maybe Red Bull only appeals to clubs that are willing to sell themselves out or don't have any kind of regard for tradition.
I don't know what I'd do. I barely watch football now except our games. Life as neutral football fan hold very little appeal to me.
In a way, the only positive that would come out of it would be the perfect chance to totally cut the umbilical chord and forget the Premier League even exists for the rest of my life. It's a tiny positive, but that's probably what I'd do.
I think most fans of other clubs would be the same. My brother in law is a Hull fan. They've not been a successful club, but they've been around over a century and now have a spoiled, used to getting his own way millionaire insisting he'll change the name of the club, won't be told otherwise.
Their fans are distinctly unhappy, as you'd imagine.
it's the arrogance of it, really, nothing has a value to some people, they know the price of everything and the value of nothing.
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for all the things Randy might have done better, the one situation I can never imagine us being in is what you're seeing at Cardiff, Hull and Southampton. Sometimes it is better not know the colour of the grass on the other side of the fence.
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I bet if Mike Ashley thought he could get away with it the Toon would be called Sports Direct.com United.
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I live in the Coventry area,zero chance of Cov moving back to Coventry.
They are a club that owe SISU upwards of £60 million,a merger with Nuneaton Town who are also up to necks in it looks a real possibility.
Hence the supposedly, I agree completely that unless something drastic happens they won't be going back to Coventry any time soon.
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for all the things Randy might have done better, the one situation I can never imagine us being in is what you're seeing at Cardiff, Hull and Southampton. Sometimes it is better not know the colour of the grass on the other side of the fence.
Red.
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I live in the Coventry area,zero chance of Cov moving back to Coventry.
They are a club that owe SISU upwards of £60 million,a merger with Nuneaton Town who are also up to necks in it looks a real possibility.
Hence the supposedly, I agree completely that unless something drastic happens they won't be going back to Coventry any time soon.
Your right,no plans for a new ground and no land to put it on.
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for all the things Randy might have done better, the one situation I can never imagine us being in is what you're seeing at Cardiff, Hull and Southampton. Sometimes it is better not know the colour of the grass on the other side of the fence.
I think right now despite the turmoil I would rather be in Southampton's position than ours. They might not know the chairmans ambitions for the clubs but they are comfortable in the PL and have a number of players who would walk into our side.
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for all the things Randy might have done better, the one situation I can never imagine us being in is what you're seeing at Cardiff, Hull and Southampton. Sometimes it is better not know the colour of the grass on the other side of the fence.
I think right now despite the turmoil I would rather be in Southampton's position than ours. They might not know the chairmans ambitions for the clubs but they are comfortable in the PL and have a number of players who would walk into our side.
Maybe, but those players may be about to walk into someone else's side.
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Bring them on! Keep the name and claret and blue at home, other than that I couldn't give a fuck, We are seriously in decline, If we carry on as we are there is only one place were heading!
I watched Man City last night and I'd love players like that down Villa Park..
having said that I think it's bollocks
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I love this idea that we're in decline and doomed when we're better off in every way than this time last year and the only way said seemingly-irreversible decline can be reversed is by clutching at the straw of a non-existent takeover.
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I love this idea that we're in decline and doomed when we're better off in every way than this time last year and the only way said seemingly-irreversible decline can be reversed is by clutching at the straw of a non-existent takeover.
To quote Haley Joel Osment in The Sixth Sense, "People only see what they want to see."
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I agree. But at least they have them now and would receive significant cash in return. Don't get me wrong I don't want to be Southampton but I guess the dilemma is that as you can't build a side challenging for the top places without investment there are very few models which make that investment "risk free" to the fabric of the football club. It's easy to snigger at Southampton's ambition of CL but at least they had ambition above survival.
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I love this idea that we're in decline and doomed when we're better off in every way than this time last year and the only way said seemingly-irreversible decline can be reversed is by clutching at the straw of a non-existent takeover.
To quote Haley Joel Osment in The Sixth Sense, "People only see what they want to see."
I want to see us not humiliated at home. Is that too much to ask?
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Of course we are in a better position than last year. I don't think many dispute that. It's a question of whether that's enough. For some it's not. If it is for you the bonus is you should have no problem getting tickets.
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I love this idea that we're in decline and doomed when we're better off in every way than this time last year and the only way said seemingly-irreversible decline can be reversed is by clutching at the straw of a non-existent takeover.
I'm not clutching myself, however if you think were on the up then I think you're in for a shock
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Of course we are in a better position than last year. I don't think many dispute that. It's a question of whether that's enough. For some it's not. If it is for you the bonus is you should have no problem getting tickets.
We're Aston Villa, so of course it's not enough. It is, however, enough for this season as long as we maintain, or even slightly improve upon, our present midtable position.
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I love this idea that we're in decline and doomed when we're better off in every way than this time last year and the only way said seemingly-irreversible decline can be reversed is by clutching at the straw of a non-existent takeover.
To quote Haley Joel Osment in The Sixth Sense, "People only see what they want to see."
I want to see us not humiliated at home. Is that too much to ask?
I felt humiliated by Monday’s game. I was looking for the rope and couldn't help but think how far we have fallen and what has happened to our once great club? It wouldn't have been like this under Ellis.
I am on the brink of tears here.
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Of course we are in a better position than last year. I don't think many dispute that. It's a question of whether that's enough. For some it's not. If it is for you the bonus is you should have no problem getting tickets.
I don't suppose anyone is happy with our current position and neither do they want it to be the extent of our ambition - and contrary to some perceived wisdom that includes the board.
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I love this idea that we're in decline and doomed when we're better off in every way than this time last year and the only way said seemingly-irreversible decline can be reversed is by clutching at the straw of a non-existent takeover.
I agree with the comment Dave, but I also think even though were better off points and player wise the performances have been terrible and I feel were in about to get dragged into the relegation fight again.
That saying I wouldn't want to get taken over by Red Bull which as you say is a non-existent story anyway.
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I agree with the comment Dave, but I also think even though were better off points and player wise the performances have been terrible and I feel were in about to get dragged into the relegation fight again.That saying I wouldn't want to get taken over by Red Bull which as you say is a non-existent story anyway.
This is the bit I don't get.
I agree we're playing badly, but have managed to keep the points total ticking over. Why? Because we have a much improved defense and players capable to scoring a goal or two. So, even if the poor performances continue, those two facts should still apply and keep us clear. And what's to say we won't turn a corner performance wise and start showing what we've done in flashes this season and the latter part of 12/13, which would probably see us climb up the table from where we are now?
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I'd rather be crap and sign Grant Holt than have the club truly lose its heart and soul, it wouldn't be the club I fell for in the first place.
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I agree with the comment Dave, but I also think even though were better off points and player wise the performances have been terrible and I feel were in about to get dragged into the relegation fight again.That saying I wouldn't want to get taken over by Red Bull which as you say is a non-existent story anyway.
And what's to say we won't turn a corner performance wise and start showing what we've done in flashes this season and the latter part of 12/13, which would probably see us climb up the table from where we are now?
I think that needs to happen sooner rather than later to be honest. Whilst things are not as bad as some people would want you to believe, losing to three lower league teams two seasons on the trot is a bit concerning.
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Whilst the board may no doubt wish us to be in a better position, actions speak a lot louder than words and the perception right now (which is based on matters on the field and football transfers off it) is that we seem more than happy to tootle along with poor quality football and un-ambitious signings. It’s little wonder therefore that fans start yearning for better signs and non-existent takeovers.
If the rumours are true of transfer funds being made available, but Lambert choosing to doggedly stick to his plan, then I sincerely hope that Faulkner and Lerner have had a series of very frank conversations with Lambert about the consequences of his actions; given that his master plan is currently showing signs of coming off the rails.
I am very much on the moderate and patient side when it comes to Villa, but this season so far and the backwards steps following an amazing start at Arsenal, are making me seriously question where we are going and I am questioning both Lambert and Lerner when it comes to this.
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I love this idea that we're in decline and doomed when we're better off in every way than this time last year and the only way said seemingly-irreversible decline can be reversed is by clutching at the straw of a non-existent takeover.
To quote Haley Joel Osment in The Sixth Sense, "People only see what they want to see."
I want to see us not humiliated at home. Is that too much to ask?
I felt humiliated by Monday’s game. I was looking for the rope and couldn't help but think how far we have fallen and what has happened to our once great club? It wouldn't have been like this under Ellis.
I am on the brink of tears here.
Quite right. Ellis would have sacked Lambert by now. And rightly so.
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Going back on topic, I'd weclome any investment into the club, provided it comes with a healthy respect for our history and the fans.
Change the name? No
Change the kit coulours? No
Naming right to the stadium? I can live with that
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I love this idea that we're in decline and doomed when we're better off in every way than this time last year and the only way said seemingly-irreversible decline can be reversed is by clutching at the straw of a non-existent takeover.
To quote Haley Joel Osment in The Sixth Sense, "People only see what they want to see."
I want to see us not humiliated at home. Is that too much to ask?
I felt humiliated by Monday’s game. I was looking for the rope and couldn't help but think how far we have fallen and what has happened to our once great club? It wouldn't have been like this under Ellis.
I am on the brink of tears here.
Really? I have felt humiliated a few times in recent seasons, but not on Monday.
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I think the problem seems to be that, whilst nobody at the club will admit it, the extreme austerity measures being taken have transformed us into a very poor squad with no obvious means or intent to improve. We are at times depressingly short of premiership quality, and our position in the table is by no means as secure as 11th suggests. If there is a plan to at some point start buying players of suitable quality again, be it now or in the summer, it would be nice to be told?
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I think the problem seems to be that, whilst nobody at the club will admit it, the extreme austerity measures being taken have transformed us into a very poor squad with no obvious means or intent to improve. We are at times depressingly short of premiership quality, and our position in the table is by no means as secure as 11th suggests. If there is a plan to at some point start buying players of suitable quality again, be it now or in the summer, it would be nice to be told?
Wouldn't doing that say to the players we are signing that they're not good enough?
As usual, the club plays everything close to their chest, so while frustrating, we're never going to hear things like that from them.
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Would you rather have the humiliation of playing at the Red Bull Stadium or getting hammered 8-0 by Chelsea every couple of years?
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Would you rather have the humiliation of playing at the Red Bull Stadium or getting hammered 8-0 by Chelsea every couple of years?
That's not the point though is it? If it's Aston Villa Red Bulls then it's not Aston Villa - it's some other club, avoiding 8-0 thrashings at the Red Bull Stadium.
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Would you rather have the humiliation of playing at the Red Bull Stadium or getting hammered 8-0 by Chelsea every couple of years?
With twats on BMX's doing the figure of eight.
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Would you rather have the humiliation of playing at the Red Bull Stadium or getting hammered 8-0 by Chelsea every couple of years?
That's not the point though is it? If it's Aston Villa Red Bulls then it's not Aston Villa - it's some other club, avoiding 8-0 thrashings at the Red Bull Stadium.
How does it make a difference.
Spurs, Arsenal and United have all lost 6-0 plus in the last couple of years. Tonkings happen, even to good sides.
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I love this idea that we're in decline and doomed when we're better off in every way than this time last year and the only way said seemingly-irreversible decline can be reversed is by clutching at the straw of a non-existent takeover.
To quote Haley Joel Osment in The Sixth Sense, "People only see what they want to see."
I want to see us not humiliated at home. Is that too much to ask?
I felt humiliated by Monday’s game. I was looking for the rope and couldn't help but think how far we have fallen and what has happened to our once great club? It wouldn't have been like this under Ellis.
I am on the brink of tears here.
Really? I have felt humiliated a few times in recent seasons, but not on Monday.
Sarcasm doesn't scan well on the net. I was taking the piss out of all the weeping clichéd shite that we read on here day in day out at the moment.
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Would you rather have the humiliation of playing at the Red Bull Stadium or getting hammered 8-0 by Chelsea every couple of years?
That's not the point though is it? If it's Aston Villa Red Bulls then it's not Aston Villa - it's some other club, avoiding 8-0 thrashings at the Red Bull Stadium.
How does it make a difference.
Spurs, Arsenal and United have all lost 6-0 plus in the last couple of years. Tonkings happen, even to good sides.
If you could carry on watching the GB branch of the Red Bulls international sporting franchise as if it's Aston Villa then that's fine. In this situation we'd all have to make up our own minds, and I'm not sure it would feel enough like the same club for me.
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I love this idea that we're in decline and doomed when we're better off in every way than this time last year and the only way said seemingly-irreversible decline can be reversed is by clutching at the straw of a non-existent takeover.
To quote Haley Joel Osment in The Sixth Sense, "People only see what they want to see."
I want to see us not humiliated at home. Is that too much to ask?
I felt humiliated by Monday’s game. I was looking for the rope and couldn't help but think how far we have fallen and what has happened to our once great club? It wouldn't have been like this under Ellis.
I am on the brink of tears here.
Really? I have felt humiliated a few times in recent seasons, but not on Monday.
Sarcasm doesn't scan well on the net. I was taking the piss out of all the weeping clichéd shite that we read on here day in day out at the moment.
And I was taking the piss out of the clichéd head buried in sand type shit from the posters on here who are so desperate to tell us all is well at Villa Park.
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Would you rather have the humiliation of playing at the Red Bull Stadium or getting hammered 8-0 by Chelsea every couple of years?
That's not the point though is it? If it's Aston Villa Red Bulls then it's not Aston Villa - it's some other club, avoiding 8-0 thrashings at the Red Bull Stadium.
If Aston Villa Red Bulls did happen then I'd be supporting someone like Aston Unity outside the league. So in thats sense yes, no more 8-0 hammerings by Chelsea.
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Would you rather have the humiliation of playing at the Red Bull Stadium or getting hammered 8-0 by Chelsea every couple of years?
That's not the point though is it? If it's Aston Villa Red Bulls then it's not Aston Villa - it's some other club, avoiding 8-0 thrashings at the Red Bull Stadium.
How does it make a difference.
Spurs, Arsenal and United have all lost 6-0 plus in the last couple of years. Tonkings happen, even to good sides.
If you could carry on watching the GB branch of the Red Bulls international sporting franchise as if it's Aston Villa then that's fine. In this situation we'd all have to make up our own minds, and I'm not sure it would feel enough like the same club for me.
That's because it wouldn't be the same club. We'd have sold our soul and it's not something I'd want any part of.
It's not gonna happen anyway so I don't know what all the fuss is about really.
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I'm realistic. I'm not demanding a top 4 finish anytime soon. But is it really that unrealistic not to be at least at Newcastle's level e.g. a team in and around the top 6 with some quality players in their starting 11?
And they have Joe fcuking Kinnear as their DOF.
Them, Everton and Saints haven't spent the earth but they're all in better states we're in, playing better football and actually being teams who matter in this league.
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Would you rather have the humiliation of playing at the Red Bull Stadium or getting hammered 8-0 by Chelsea every couple of years?
That's not the point though is it? If it's Aston Villa Red Bulls then it's not Aston Villa - it's some other club, avoiding 8-0 thrashings at the Red Bull Stadium.
How does it make a difference.
Spurs, Arsenal and United have all lost 6-0 plus in the last couple of years. Tonkings happen, even to good sides.
If you could carry on watching the GB branch of the Red Bulls international sporting franchise as if it's Aston Villa then that's fine. In this situation we'd all have to make up our own minds, and I'm not sure it would feel enough like the same club for me.
That's because it wouldn't be the same club. We'd have sold our soul and it's not something I'd want any part of.
It's not gonna happen anyway so I don't know what all the fuss is about really.
Very much agreed, on both points.
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Teams that matter?
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Of course we are in a better position than last year. I don't think many dispute that. It's a question of whether that's enough. For some it's not. If it is for you the bonus is you should have no problem getting tickets.
I don't suppose anyone is happy with our current position and neither do they want it to be the extent of our ambition - and contrary to some perceived wisdom that includes the board.
So what do you think they ( the board) should do about it ?
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We're in a mid table group that probably won't go down but will struggle to finish any higher than 10th.
Southampton and Newcastle are in the top 9 and both still have a small chance of top 6 if either hit some form so yep competiting for european qualification matters slightly more than the mid table nothingness/relegation battles we're getting year in year out.
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Both were in a relegation battle last season. Why is it that half a season makes them "sides that matter"?
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O.k in relation to this season both sides matter. I wouldn't mind watching a midfield of Cabaye, Sissoko, Ben Arfa personally or one with Lallana, Ward-Prowse in it. They simply have better quality players in more areas of the pitch than we do. If KEA plodding along in every single home game floats your boat, fair enough.
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I was wondering how older Salzburg fans felt when Red Bull took over. It's not like their association with Red Bull has made them into a European power. I also then realized that as a club they've changed their name 3 times in their history, so maybe Red Bull only appeals to clubs that are willing to sell themselves out or don't have any kind of regard for tradition.
I don't know what I'd do. I barely watch football now except our games. Life as neutral football fan hold very little appeal to me.
The problem with Red Bull take over is that they are a business corporation run by an Exec Board with normal business targets. Mainly to extract as much profit as possible by selling their beverages. Therefore their investment in a football club will be limited to a payback scenario. It's not going to be endless bags of money being poured in. For that you need an individual with loads of dirty money and complete autonomy as to how they spend it. In other words an Arab or a Russian oligarch.
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I want us to be as good as we can and better than Mickey Mouse clubs like Southampton et al for sure. I personally don't think they're a million miles in front of us.
It's the sides that matter comment that got me. Matter to who? The fans? Surely all 20 clubs matter to the fans? Matter to the media? If you had seen Sky's advert for their weekend games and Monday night football, then would need no reminding of what small clutch of clubs actually matter.
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That pissed me off as well Ads. Look at the games we have on this weekend. They are great because we are showing Man City, Liverpool and Arsenal.
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I love this idea that we're in decline and doomed when we're better off in every way than this time last year and the only way said seemingly-irreversible decline can be reversed is by clutching at the straw of a non-existent takeover.
To quote Haley Joel Osment in The Sixth Sense, "People only see what they want to see."
I want to see us not humiliated at home. Is that too much to ask?
I felt humiliated by Monday’s game. I was looking for the rope and couldn't help but think how far we have fallen and what has happened to our once great club? It wouldn't have been like this under Ellis.
I am on the brink of tears here.
Really? I have felt humiliated a few times in recent seasons, but not on Monday.
Sarcasm doesn't scan well on the net. I was taking the piss out of all the weeping clichéd shite that we read on here day in day out at the moment.
And I was taking the piss out of the clichéd head buried in sand type shit from the posters on here who are so desperate to tell us all is well at Villa Park.
and at the same time continuing to prove that you have no concept of balance, to clarify thinking it's not quite the end of the world doesn't mean 'all is well', there's a hell of a lot of opinions that fit in between those viewpoints but when you get so far to one side it's easy to lose sight of that. Performances this season have been poor, no one denies that, but that doesn't automatically mean that we're in the middle of the relegation battle with a shit manager and a squad full of championship players. Our midfield isn't right, hat much is obvious, lets fix that problem and then see where we are before we throw everything away.
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You're wasting your time, paul, it's like a broken record.
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And I was taking the piss out of the clichéd head buried in sand type shit from the posters on here who are so desperate to tell us all is well at Villa Park.
Don't be a whopper.
Nobody at all has said they are happy with how things are. Why lie?
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I love this idea that we're in decline and doomed when we're better off in every way than this time last year and the only way said seemingly-irreversible decline can be reversed is by clutching at the straw of a non-existent takeover.
To quote Haley Joel Osment in The Sixth Sense, "People only see what they want to see."
I want to see us not humiliated at home. Is that too much to ask?
I felt humiliated by Monday’s game. I was looking for the rope and couldn't help but think how far we have fallen and what has happened to our once great club? It wouldn't have been like this under Ellis.
I am on the brink of tears here.
Really? I have felt humiliated a few times in recent seasons, but not on Monday.
Sarcasm doesn't scan well on the net. I was taking the piss out of all the weeping clichéd shite that we read on here day in day out at the moment.
And I was taking the piss out of the clichéd head buried in sand type shit from the posters on here who are so desperate to tell us all is well at Villa Park.
What were you saying on another thread about being able to have an opinion?
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If you're not sticking your head in the oven, its only because you have it in the sand apparently.
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I want us to be as good as we can and better than Mickey Mouse clubs like Southampton et al for sure. I personally don't think they're a million miles in front of us.
It's the sides that matter comment that got me. Matter to who? The fans? Surely all 20 clubs matter to the fans? Matter to the media? If you had seen Sky's advert for their weekend games and Monday night football, then would need no reminding of what small clutch of clubs actually matter.
Oh I agree, with Liebrah's pulling out and Pochettino probably leaving in 6 months they do have a Pompey feel about them.
It goes back to what we would need Red Bull for, to win the league yes. To be back in the top 6 and be back playing regularly in europe, surely not. Just because MON had to spend 200m dosen't mean other managers would have to.
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The whole pointing at recently promoted clubs as shining examples of what we should be aiming at gets my goat. Wigan in the Jewell era were a good example of that phenomenon.
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The whole pointing at recently promoted clubs as shining examples of what we should be aiming at gets my goat. Wigan in the Jewell era were a good example of that phenomenon.
This is it. Only the truly big clubs really stick around forever.
If the past 20 years are anything to go by, and past action tends to be a good indicator of the future, then over the next 20 years how many times will the likes of West Brom, Southampton, Swansea, Norwich, West Ham etc have bounced up and down the leagues?
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Wigan will do a bolton.
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RB in football terms I have not followed other than JPA and Henry lining up for their New York team and I belive Xavi is joining next season.
My exposure to them is through F1 in which since coming in they have dominated by hiring the best people in key roles and that's perhaps the area they could improve us in.Lerner pumped in millions but we now have very little to show for it.So if RB where an option to come in and did put a good board together ,good management and fund then that is a positive move in my eyes.
Football is changing with new FFP rules we are seeing likes of Liverpool today signing deals with Dunkin Doughnuts to bring in revenue as that is the only way you can spend.So Red Bull or who ever coming in won't necessarily translate into free spending ,though anything would be an improvement on right now.So either way I think we are looking at a slow transition to catch up with the top 6 but that would be helped by a more knowledgeable board running the show.
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I see no reason to be pointing fingers at the board from a commercial point of view. They appear to have come on leaps and bounds from what was there before.
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RB in football terms I have not followed other than JPA and Henry lining up for their New York team and I belive Xavi is joining next season.
My exposure to them is through F1 in which since coming in they have dominated by hiring the best people in key roles and that's perhaps the area they could improve us in.Lerner pumped in millions but we now have very little to show for it.So if RB where an option to come in and did put a good board together ,good management and fund then that is a positive move in my eyes.
Football is changing with new FFP rules we are seeing likes of Liverpool today signing deals with Dunkin Doughnuts to bring in revenue as that is the only way you can spend.So Red Bull or who ever coming in won't necessarily translate into free spending ,though anything would be an improvement on right now.So either way I think we are looking at a slow transition to catch up with the top 6 but that would be helped by a more knowledgeable board running the show.
I think this is a good point, and they will potentially also raise our profile internationally. We might also find that the clubs they sponsor start to collaborate in terms of loanees, marketing partners, etc.
In the end, it all depends what their motives might be for taking an interest in Villa.
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I've not been following this story very closely,
can someone tell me if there is any solid reason to why red bull might buy us or even where the initial rumour started from if there is one,
thanks in advance
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No there is not. It is also odd seeing this regurgitated after I did an article for the mag a while ago on its first airing.
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Collymore tweeted that it was a rumour on Monday so it all started up again.
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That pissed me off as well Ads. Look at the games we have on this weekend. They are great because we are showing Man City, Liverpool and Arsenal.
That's it really and it hurts me that a great football club like Aston Villa is treated like a nonentity by all out there. Sometimes I could scream.
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I'm realistic. I'm not demanding a top 4 finish anytime soon. But is it really that unrealistic not to be at least at Newcastle's level e.g. a team in and around the top 6 with some quality players in their starting 11?
Newcastle have a squad which is way better than ours. That wasn't the case three or four years ago, but it most certainly is now.
Ultimately, the better the players you have, the more chance you have got of doing well. It's not a guarantee you'll do well, but not having many decent players is pretty much a guarantee you won't.
For all the dramatic nonsense going on here between the one end of the spectrum with the sarcy "yeah yeah, everything's shit here isn't it, blah blah" retorts, and the other end, with that patronising "OMG PULL YOUR HEADS OUT OF THE SAND" line, the true situation is probably somewhere in the middle.
We might not have a league one squad as some seem to think we do, but - regardless of where we are in the table at this point in time, what with nothing being decided in January - it strikes me that it is nigh on impossible to look at clubs we traditionally compete with and think our squad compares favourably.
How many of our first team do we think Newcastle or Spurs or Everton fans would want in their starting XI?
And before anyone goes on about Everton and Lukaku being on loan, so what? That's the system, they are using it. Like we are with Holt.
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Didn't you tip them to go down this year Paulie?!
Yep, pretty much all of Newcastle's midfield would walk into ours, only one is I'd probably have Delph over Tiote.
Our midfield option are embarrassing compared to most of the premier league really.
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We would have signed Cabaye had Houllier stayed.
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Didn't you tip them to go down this year Paulie?!
Not that I remember. I thought towards the end of last season they were playing abysmally enough to have been relegated, though. Looks as if they've got their act together again this season.
I do look at some of the talent there and wonder how come we're so much weaker.
Our midfield option are embarrassing compared to most of the premier league really.
Without a doubt. I just don't see a permutation from the options that we have which will work with any permanency, either.
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It's easy to snigger at Southampton's ambition of CL but at least they had ambition above survival.
So did we when Lerner first came in, then he allowed O'Neill to spunk millions up the wall on three different defences and Heskey and here's where we are.
Anyway, our "ambition" isn't about survival at all, our "reality" at he moment might be though.
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A long time ago, probably back in the last days of Ellis, Mac wrote a very eloquent post about what we as football fans expect. The gist of it was that like every fan in from Citeh to Port Vale or Ajax to FC Telstar (had to get a cheeky reference in for my Dutch team) we need hope. Sure each of one our hopes are different, dependant on the club you support. In the case of Telstar, the hope is that we will one day sneak into the Jupiler League play-offs. So what is the hope of Villa fans right now, that we will survive another season, that we will at least try and compete, that we will take one of the cups seriously?
This for me is the crux of why I am struggling so much right now to motivate myself to watch the club I love, because the hope that followed Lerner’s arrival has been pulled from under us and we as fans are now struggling to come to terms with it. Of course O’Neill wasted a golden chance to get into the Champions League and had we had a different manager, we probably would have achieved it. However, the speed at which we crumbled and the fact that we are still nowhere near recovering from the fallout has been extremely hard to deal with.
As a football club we have got to find our place soon again and give the fans something to hope for, other than blind devotion and a dream that it can’t go on forever.
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A long time ago, probably back in the last days of Ellis, Mac wrote a very eloquent post about what we as football fans expect. The gist of it was that like every fan in from Citeh to Port Vale or Ajax to FC Telstar (had to get a cheeky reference in for my Dutch team) we need hope. Sure each of one our hopes are different, dependant on the club you support. In the case of Telstar, the hope is that we will one day sneak into the Jupiler League play-offs. So what is the hope of Villa fans right now, that we will survive another season, that we will at least try and compete, that we will take one of the cups seriously?
This for me is the crux of why I am struggling so much right now to motivate myself to watch the club I love, because the hope that followed Lerner’s arrival has been pulled from under us and we as fans are now struggling to come to terms with it. Of course O’Neill wasted a golden chance to get into the Champions League and had we had a different manager, we probably would have achieved it. However, the speed at which we crumbled and the fact that we are still nowhere near recovering from the fallout has been extremely hard to deal with.
As a football club we have got to find our place soon again and give the fans something to hope for, other than blind devotion and a dream that it can’t go on forever.
Thanks Neil, I was feeling a bit down this morning but that's pepped me right up!
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Whilst I can understand the entrenchment in views over the club name, badge and kit colours, I don't really see why potential stadium sponsorship is such a big deal really. It is becoming commonplace nowadays and reluctance to it just seems very reactionary to me.
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It's common with new stadia, but not with the traditional older grounds.
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The ground will always be Villa Park whatever they did.
The colours need to be Aston Villa colours.
If they changed the club name, well that would be it for me. I honestly don't think I'd want to watch football again. Maybe non league but I know my heart wouldn't be in it.
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I think I could just about tolerate Villa Park the Red Bull Arena. But then again...
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There's a good piece about Cardiff's colour change in the current WSC. As they put it, when you had 8,000 watching you a few years ago and now get 25,000 in the Premier League, most of the JCLs won't care what you wear (or what your name is) because all they want is to be part of the Premier League.
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We already have the best name and the best colours. Good businesses know this.
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What is a JCL Dave?
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guessing its johnny come latelies
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Thanks danno. I think if I had to watch Cardiff every week I would not be able to come lately if at all.
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Having read about the things that Dietrich Mateschitz has done to Austria Salzburg and the way he's treated their fans i'd oppose any takeover by Red Bull. I think the club would be reduced to little more than a marketing wing of Red Bull GmbH based in Aston,
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It's common with new stadia, but not with the traditional older grounds.
Newcastle's ground, what's that called now? SportsDirect.com Bowl or something?
Dortmund - Westfalonstadion
Talk of Old Trafford selling it's naming rights too, that one is inevitable and will happen.
CoM Stadium - OK modern stadium but sold the rights when the Sheikhs came in.
Walsall
Bradford
You'll see it happening more and more from now. Personally I don't care. St. James's will always be St. James's, same for the others with the exception of the Etihad but that just shows how tinpot Manchester City are really.
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Dortmund is back to signal iduna park now I think but I get your point. St james having its name changed means nohing as almost everyone still sees it as st james. If red bull wanted to call Villa Park the puppy drowning arena I wouldnt give a flying **** as long as we get every single penny to spend on the playing staff. For too long we have been an after thought and I would like to see a return to the top end of the table and europe.
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No-one calls Westfalenstadion "Signal Iduna Park"! Even when Mainz05 (my German team) got a completly new stadium named after their sponsors "Coface", some people call it "das Stadion am Kreisel" - "The Stadium at the roundabout", rather than use the official name. Villa Park will still be Villa Park to everybody but those in the media who would be forced to call it "Vincent Tan's Redbull Wonga Emporium", or whatever.
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Dortmund is back to signal iduna park now I think but I get your point. St james having its name changed means nohing as almost everyone still sees it as st james. If red bull wanted to call Villa Park the puppy drowning arena I wouldnt give a flying **** as long as we get every single penny to spend on the playing staff. For too long we have been an after thought and I would like to see a return to the top end of the table and europe.
Sorry I meant, Westfalonstadion is what we all know it as, Signal Iduna Park, wouldn't have known that or been able to remember the company's name without you telling me or Googling. SIP is the sponsor name.
Agree with you anyway.
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More Twatter bullshit:
Lerner to sell to a Japanese business at end of season. No names mentioned (surprise, surprise!) but were at the Arsenal - Fulham game.
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More Twatter bullshit:
Lerner to sell to a Japanese business at end of season. No names mentioned (surprise, surprise!) but were at the Arsenal - Fulham game.
Why Re - broadcast it ?
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I still think Birmingham Council (phew I almost put the C word between those two words) should rename the Aston Expressway the Aston Villa Expressway.
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We have claret and blue library and gas towers
What more is needed
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More Twatter bullshit:
Lerner to sell to a Japanese business at end of season. No names mentioned (surprise, surprise!) but were at the Arsenal - Fulham game.
Why Re - broadcast it ?
Hopefully to wipe Red Bull as owner from our minds...
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mate has said there's rumours of new owners in town according to twittering trends has anyone heard owt ?
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Japanese billionaire, Mr Udigawa, has been spotted at the Hyatt on Broad Street according to Twitter sources. Overheard in the lift saying he much prefers it to Lassiters.
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mate has said there's rumours of new owners in town according to twittering trends has anyone heard owt ?
Yep.
I can't divulge too much, we have been sworn to secrecy, but the moderators were briefed on events this afternoon.
I have probably said too much already.
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I still think Birmingham Council (phew I almost put the C word between those two words) should rename the Aston Expressway the Aston Villa Expressway.
I like that.
Better than being sponsored by Cadbury's and called Bournville Bouvelard.
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I've sold out to them already.
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Japanese billionaire, Mr Udigawa, has been spotted at the Hyatt on Broad Street according to Twitter sources. Overheard in the lift saying he much prefers it to Lassiters.
A big round of applause to that man.
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Japanese billionaire, Mr Udigawa, has been spotted at the Hyatt on Broad Street according to Twitter sources. Overheard in the lift saying he much prefers it to Lassiters.
A big round of applause to that man.
i had almost already started googling Udigawa, then I hit the end of the post.
I'd totally forgotten that name.
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Japanese billionaire, Mr Udigawa, has been spotted at the Hyatt on Broad Street according to Twitter sources. Overheard in the lift saying he much prefers it to Lassiters.
Udigawa is only the middle man acting for Ichibum San who is impatient to get his hands on a PL club with potential.
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Let's sell up and get the bars stocked up with that non-alcoholic beers a la Phoenix Nights.
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mate has said there's rumours of new owners in town according to twittering trends has anyone heard owt ?
Yep.
I can't divulge too much, we have been sworn to secrecy, but the moderators were briefed on events this afternoon.
I have probably said too much already.
Bloody hell, we're going to be called Woodhall Villa aren't we?
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Where are those Balti Magnates when we need them?
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Aston Balti play at Poppadom Park. You should hear the Bhaji end roar when they get behind their team.
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Japanese billionaire, Mr Udigawa, has been spotted at the Hyatt on Broad Street according to Twitter sources. Overheard in the lift saying he much prefers it to Lassiters.
A big round of applause to that man.
Japanese billionaire, Mr Udigawa, has been spotted at the Hyatt on Broad Street according to Twitter sources. Overheard in the lift saying he much prefers it to Lassiters.
A big round of applause to that man.
i had almost already started googling Udigawa, then I hit the end of the post.
I'd totally forgotten that name.
That's a real memory blast.
See that Proust you loser? Two lines.
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Japanese billionaire, Mr Udigawa, has been spotted at the Hyatt on Broad Street according to Twitter sources. Overheard in the lift saying he much prefers it to Lassiters.
I remember a comedian's gag along the lines of:
"The good always die young. James Dean, Jimi Hendrix, Daphne off Neighbours"
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So no takeover bid and no real money to speak of to spend. Is it me or does it feel like this limbo will never end at the moment
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So no takeover bid and no real money to speak of to spend. Is it me or does it feel like this limbo will never end at the moment
'feeling hot hot hot'.
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Where are those Balti Magnates when we need them?
You've misquoted. It was Bali Midgets.
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http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/gerard-houllier-red-bull-not-6560487
Former Aston Villa manager Gerard Houllier has dismissed rumours that Red Bull are interested in taking over his old club.
Speculation has been rife across Twitter and internet message-boards in recent months that the energy drinks giants are preparing a bid for the claret and blues.
There was talk that Red Bull were keen to add Villa to their portfolio of football clubs, which currently includes Salzburg, New York, Leipzig and Brasil.
But Houllier, who is now the global sports director for Red Bull, insists there is no truth in the rumours about them wanting to buy out Villa’s American owner Randy Lerner.
“Red Bull does not have any intention of buying Aston Villa, not at all, so there is no truth in those rumours,” Houllier told the Birmingham Mail.
Houllier started his role with Red Bull in June 2012, around a year after his seven-month spell in charge of Villa was ended on the advice of doctors because of a serious heart complaint.
Red Bull took over SV Austria Salzburg in 2005, the New York MetroStars in 2006, founded Red Bull Brasil in Sao Paulo in 2007 and established RB Leipzig in Germany in 2009 and also had an academy in Ghana.
There have been mixed fortunes on the field with FC Red Bull Salzburg enjoying the most success with a series of Austrian domestic titles.
Red Bull caused controversy, particularly with Salzburg by changing the name of the team, swapping their traditional violet and white playing colours to the company’s red and white, incorporating the bull logo on the club’s badge and renaming the stadium the Red Bull arena.
The company also boast two Formula One teams: Red Bull Racing and Scuderia Toro Rosso.
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Red Bull caused controversy, particularly with Salzburg by changing the name of the team, swapping their traditional violet and white playing colours to the company’s red and white, incorporating the bull logo on the club’s badge and renaming the stadium the Red Bull arena.
Red Bull don't sound like the type of owners I'd like at Villa Park.
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Red Bull caused controversy, particularly with Salzburg by changing the name of the team, swapping their traditional violet and white playing colours to the company’s red and white, incorporating the bull logo on the club’s badge and renaming the stadium the Red Bull arena.
Red Bull don't sound like the type of owners I'd like at Villa Park.
seconded! I do want new owners but not at that price. Chance the stadium name by all means but not our colours and not our Name.
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Nice little article here - Which Club in the Premier League have kept their Original Name the Longest? (http://www.expressandstar.com/sport/2014/01/27/everton-aston-villa-west-brom-which-club-has-the-oldest-premier-league-name/?)
Southampton's original name I found amusing, and Liverpool's original name.
I must remember to refer to Albion as the Strollers more!
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Nice little article here - Which Club in the Premier League have kept their Original Name the Longest? (http://www.expressandstar.com/sport/2014/01/27/everton-aston-villa-west-brom-which-club-has-the-oldest-premier-league-name/?)
Southampton's original name I found amusing, and Liverpool's original name.
I must remember to refer to Albion as the Strollers more!
Love this. All clubs should revert to type, much more interesting. Makes me feel for Hull fans though, poor buggers.
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Aston Villa FC...1874 and still counting !
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There's never been any need to change the best team name in world football. Any prospective new owner should know this.
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Nice little article here - Which Club in the Premier League have kept their Original Name the Longest? (http://www.expressandstar.com/sport/2014/01/27/everton-aston-villa-west-brom-which-club-has-the-oldest-premier-league-name/?)
Southampton's original name I found amusing, and Liverpool's original name.
I must remember to refer to Albion as the Strollers more!
Fantastic. Love that table.
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New owners can come in and do what they want but we will always be aston villa, play at villa park, play in claret and blue and I will always be on the Holte end upper for games. Move this club to the planet zog if they want and I will still somehow make my way there but do not ever change any of the above.
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If they moved us to Planet Zog, how could we then play at Villa Park?
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If they moved us to Planet Zog, how could we then play at Villa Park?
I'm guessing anyone with the technology to move us to the planet zog would be able to displace the entirety of B6 as part of the move.
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Nice little article here - Which Club in the Premier League have kept their Original Name the Longest? (http://www.expressandstar.com/sport/2014/01/27/everton-aston-villa-west-brom-which-club-has-the-oldest-premier-league-name/?)
Southampton's original name I found amusing, and Liverpool's original name.
I must remember to refer to Albion as the Strollers more!
Fantastic. Love that table.
Forwarded this to my work colleagues and got this reply from a Greek..
Villa sounds very much like Greece: glorious past, disappointing present, uncertain future. I think I should start rooting for you!
Vasilis
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Dalian Wanda Group is looking to invest in the UK. Maybe a football club would be a good vehicle to form a centre piece to their enterprise? Maybe in an area in need of regeneration? A potentially powerful commercial asset to have a bit of fun with? They denied being interested in Southampton but fell short of denying interest in any other club and they could easily have done so if they wanted to nip any speculation in the bud.
I'm not saying they're interested in us but, well, you never know. I do honestly believe we're up for sale in principle so it wouldn't be the strangest thing.
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Dalian Wanda Group is looking to invest in the UK. Maybe a football club would be a good vehicle to form a centre piece to their enterprise? Maybe in an area in need of regeneration? A potentially powerful commercial asset to have a bit of fun with? They denied being interested in Southampton but fell short of denying interest in any other club and they could easily have done so if they wanted to nip any speculation in the bud.
I'm not saying they're interested in us but, well, you never know. I do honestly believe we're up for sale in principle so it wouldn't be the strangest thing.
Who the bloody hell are the Dalian Wanda Group ? Disco lot from the 70's ?
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A massive Chinese owned group with interests in real estate, entertainment and Christ knows what else. Very powerful. Owned by China's richest man.
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A massive Chinese owned group with interests in real estate, entertainment and Christ knows what else. Very powerful. Owned by China's richest man.
Own Sun seeker who make Boats for billionaires.
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I have a mate who works for Sunseeker (after working for Bentley). I've had a few good hospitality days out as a result.
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I have a mate who works for Sunseeker (after working for Bentley). I've had a few good hospitality days out as a result.
Have a word then.
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Picked this off another forum:
"As usual it's probably a load of rubbish, but has anyone else heard the new rumours about Villa being sold to DWG (Dalian Wanda Group), the huge Chinese consortium. They are headed by Wang Jianlin, who is apparently China's richest man. Dalian Wanda Group Corporation Limited is a conglomerate company with activities in real estate, tourism, hotels, and entertainment. The rumour, which apparently stems from a solicitor that has been acting on behalf of 'someone' at Villa Park, goes on to suggest that Dave Cameron has met with this Wang character, to discuss him pumping 3 billion into this country to invest. Perhaps someone has just put two and two together, Cameron well known for being a Villa fan, and come up with this story. Also worth a mention that the official Villa website stated in the last week that Villa's popularity in China has grown considerably. Who knows?! Anyway, thought I'd throw this out there. Anyone got any thoughts on this? As I say it's most likely a load of tosh... but it's certainly intriguing rumour."
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We're too late with this, as Blues already have circa 1 billion fans in China.
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One of our Chinese teachers is Chinese and her name is Wang. Maybe she knows him. I'll e-mail her.
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We're too late with this, as Blues already have circa 1 billion fans in China.
That made me laugh!
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I thought this was about Dalian Atkinson starting his own company. How disappointing!
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Picked this off another forum:
"As usual it's probably a load of rubbish, but has anyone else heard the new rumours about Villa being sold to DWG (Dalian Wanda Group), the huge Chinese consortium. They are headed by Wang Jianlin, who is apparently China's richest man. Dalian Wanda Group Corporation Limited is a conglomerate company with activities in real estate, tourism, hotels, and entertainment. The rumour, which apparently stems from a solicitor that has been acting on behalf of 'someone' at Villa Park, goes on to suggest that Dave Cameron has met with this Wang character, to discuss him pumping 3 billion into this country to invest. Perhaps someone has just put two and two together, Cameron well known for being a Villa fan, and come up with this story. Also worth a mention that the official Villa website stated in the last week that Villa's popularity in China has grown considerably. Who knows?! Anyway, thought I'd throw this out there. Anyone got any thoughts on this? As I say it's most likely a load of tosh... but it's certainly intriguing rumour."
just goes to show how this rubbish starts.
Yesterday, on another thread on this very forum:
Dalian Wanda Group is looking to invest in the UK. Maybe a football club would be a good vehicle to form a centre piece to their enterprise? Maybe in an area in need of regeneration? A potentially powerful commercial asset to have a bit of fun with? They denied being interested in Southampton but fell short of denying interest in any other club and they could easily have done so if they wanted to nip any speculation in the bud.
I'm not saying they're interested in us but, well, you never know. I do honestly believe we're up for sale in principle so it wouldn't be the strangest thing.
I think we can close this one down.
EDIT actually, I'll merge
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We're too late with this, as Blues already have circa 1 billion fans in China.
Bet they all work on match days...
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We're too late with this, as Blues already have circa 1 billion fans in China.
Bet they all work on match days...
Bet they fuck up Beijing Casuals when they are being propa naughty.
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One of our Chinese teachers is Chinese and her name is Wang. Maybe she knows him. I'll e-mail her.
two wangs don't make a right
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It must be true.
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There are 9 million bicycle kicks in Beijing, Doug taught them everything they know.
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All this talk of a chinese takeover has made me feel hungry
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All this talk of a chinese takeover has made me feel hungry
One fart and you'll be hungry again
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Hope he doesn't start farting spare ribs, dangerous.
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Must be true, I heard Randy posted the video for Help Me Wanda on his his FB page this morning.
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I guess he'd know our players by their numbers - "Number 53 is great when combining with 47".
I wonder if one of the take-outs of this would be that opposing fans sing "You're just a bunch of wangers" at us?
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One of our Chinese teachers is Chinese and her name is Wang. Maybe she knows him. I'll e-mail her.
two wangs don't make a right
That's made me laugh far more than it really should.
It would be great to have a Chinese Industrialist Meglomaniac owning us, I only hope he's got a cat to stroke whilst sitting in the directors box planning to take over the world.
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One of our Chinese teachers is Chinese and her name is Wang. Maybe she knows him. I'll e-mail her.
two wangs don't make a right
That's made me laugh far more than it really should.
It would be great to have a Chinese Industrialist Meglomaniac owning us, I only hope he's got a cat to stroke whilst sitting in the directors box planning to take over the world.
Just had an image in my head of Kim Jong Il singing "So Lonely" in Team America.
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Picked this off another forum:
"As usual it's probably a load of rubbish, but has anyone else heard the new rumours about Villa being sold to DWG (Dalian Wanda Group), the huge Chinese consortium. They are headed by Wang Jianlin, who is apparently China's richest man. Dalian Wanda Group Corporation Limited is a conglomerate company with activities in real estate, tourism, hotels, and entertainment. The rumour, which apparently stems from a solicitor that has been acting on behalf of 'someone' at Villa Park, goes on to suggest that Dave Cameron has met with this Wang character, to discuss him pumping 3 billion into this country to invest. Perhaps someone has just put two and two together, Cameron well known for being a Villa fan, and come up with this story. Also worth a mention that the official Villa website stated in the last week that Villa's popularity in China has grown considerably. Who knows?! Anyway, thought I'd throw this out there. Anyone got any thoughts on this? As I say it's most likely a load of tosh... but it's certainly intriguing rumour."
just goes to show how this rubbish starts.
Yesterday, on another thread on this very forum:
Dalian Wanda Group is looking to invest in the UK. Maybe a football club would be a good vehicle to form a centre piece to their enterprise? Maybe in an area in need of regeneration? A potentially powerful commercial asset to have a bit of fun with? They denied being interested in Southampton but fell short of denying interest in any other club and they could easily have done so if they wanted to nip any speculation in the bud.
I'm not saying they're interested in us but, well, you never know. I do honestly believe we're up for sale in principle so it wouldn't be the strangest thing.
I think we can close this one down.
EDIT actually, I'll merge
Thanks, PW, didn't realise there was a 'take over' thread
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If the megalomaniac Chinese industrialist has a cat he certainly won't be stroking it.
Interesting that the club say our profile is rising in China. I find that most Chinese fans know us by name but can't name a single player. I have yet to meet a Chinese Villa fan - most follow the glory teams and are happy to change colours from Real, to Barca to Bayern.
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While not giving this any credence, it must only be a matter of time before a Chinese group with actual money (rather than the tips jar from a Saturday morning's perming) bids for a Premier League side.
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who's buying us today?
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who's buying us today?
Lee Longlands
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Leave it!
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Don Amott, King of Caravans.
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If the megalomaniac Chinese industrialist has a cat he certainly won't be stroking it.
Interesting that the club say our profile is rising in China. I find that most Chinese fans know us by name but can't name a single player. I have yet to meet a Chinese Villa fan - most follow the glory teams and are happy to change colours from Real, to Barca to Bayern.
Quite a big following of Chinese students at the Uni.
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Hugely credible source, and it is paywalled anyway (and who would want to pay for that shit in the first place?) but:
http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/5416661/Randy-Lerner-ready-to-sell-Aston-Villa-for-%C2%A3200million.html
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Can someone who has paid for the pleasure of reading it please post the article?
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Hugely credible source, and it is paywalled anyway (and who would want to pay for that shit in the first place?) but:
http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/5416661/Randy-Lerner-ready-to-sell-Aston-Villa-for-%C2%A3200million.html (http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/5416661/Randy-Lerner-ready-to-sell-Aston-Villa-for-%C2%A3200million.html)
There is a quote from the article on Villatalk which a google search shows Lerner made in 2006:
'I'm what you call the custodian. There have been plenty of custodians of Aston Villa since 1874 and if I can't make it work, I will do what the others did, move on and let someone else try.'
'People like me come and go. The fans will always own Aston Villa because they never leave.'
Brum Mail 21 Aug 2006 (http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/oneill-can-be-saviour---lerner-25439)
EDIT: The quote on VT is NOT from the Sun article.
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I would be really worried if Randy sells us.
I dred the possibility of an owner like Cardiff, Hull or Blackburn.
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I don't think for a minute that the reason we've not been sold is because Randy doesn't want to sell. it's because nobody wants to buy. See also Everton.
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I can see no other logical reason for the hugely risky cost cutting that we've seen over the last few years other than RL preparing the club for sale
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It's a pity we weren't for sale when the Arabs were sniffing around Man City. Damn!
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I can see no other logical reason for the hugely risky cost cutting that we've seen over the last few years other than RL preparing the club for sale
How about because we were spending more than we were earning?
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I would be really worried if Randy sells us.
I dred the possibility of an owner like Cardiff, Hull or Blackburn.
We weren't worried when Ellis was looking to sell us, why should we be now?
Can't see him selling us to any Tom, Dick or Harry though.
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I don't think for a minute that the reason we've not been sold is because Randy doesn't want to sell. it's because nobody wants to buy. See also Everton.
Yep I think Randy would sell but there's no-one available to buy. I think we need a new owner or investment but I doubt it's out there.
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Good I hope he's got someone lined up as well.
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The last 4 years have been dreadful under his ownership, so I hope he sells.
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Yep I think Randy would sell but there's no-one available to buy. I think we need a new owner or investment but I doubt it's out there.
This is my take on it too.
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I was always one for old school building the team with cheap, young, hungry players....but seeing Chelsea and Man. City tear up the Premier League the last 10 odd years I now want a piece of that I'm afraid.
The next owner has to have billions of pounds this time, not billions of dollars.
But, if someone came in and was willing to throw £500 million into the club, how would that be possible with the financial fair play rules coming into effect?
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But, if someone came in and was willing to throw £500 million into the club, how would that be possible with the financial fair play rules coming into effect?
Easy, the new owner would just bribe and dodge their way around the FFP rules the same way all the other super rich clubs have.
Financial Fair Play was never designed to stop the likes of Man City/PSG or Chelsea from buying their way to success, it was designed to keep middling clubs uncompetitive against them. So far it looks like it will succeed in its aim.
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I can see no other logical reason for the hugely risky cost cutting that we've seen over the last few years other than RL preparing the club for sale
How about because we were spending more than we were earning?
Is that the case now?
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I can see no other logical reason for the hugely risky cost cutting that we've seen over the last few years other than RL preparing the club for sale
How about because we were spending more than we were earning?
Is that the case now?
Doubt it, how much do sky put in, then there is sponsor, ticket sales, corporate etc
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I can see no other logical reason for the hugely risky cost cutting that we've seen over the last few years other than RL preparing the club for sale
How about because we were spending more than we were earning?
Is that the case now?
Doubt it, how much do sky put in, then there is sponsor, ticket sales, corporate etc
Obviously I can't prove it but Randy must be making a fair bit of money these days. Doesn't he also charge a management fee?
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Just checked in 2011-2012 villa received over £42m from sky. Must be a lot more now. I don't know but I wouldn't be surprised
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I can see no other logical reason for the hugely risky cost cutting that we've seen over the last few years other than RL preparing the club for sale
How about because we were spending more than we were earning?
Is that the case now?
Doubt it, how much do sky put in, then there is sponsor, ticket sales, corporate etc
Obviously I can't prove it but Randy must be making a fair bit of money these days. Doesn't he also charge a management fee?
When Doug was running the club like a corner shop, ( ie cant spend more than you earn ), you were one of his harshest critics Dave, what's the difference now?
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The American tycoon, who bought the club from Doug Ellis for £63m in 2006, is actively looking for a new owner who can inject more funds into Villa and take them forward.
Lerner, 51, has been hoping for a wealthy United States investor to buy Villa. His inflated asking price takes into account the £250m he has spent on players, plus redeveloping facilities.
Lerner knows he will not recoup all the cash but has been encouraged by the £190m Mohamed Fayed received from Shahid Khan for Fulham.
A source said: “Randy has been open to offers for Villa from some time — but wants quite a lot of money from the club.
“He has seen the £190m sale of Fulham but about £35m of that was a premium for it being a London-based club.”
The value of Prem clubs is soaring because of the new TV deal which pays at least £40m a season.
A deal could take around three months to complete and any buyer would wait to be sure Villa will definitely be a top-flight side next season before finalising a deal.
Former Villa boss Gerard Houllier, global sports director for Red Bull, has already gone public to state his company are not interested in tabling a bid.
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I read somewhere that the £63m was for a stake and the actual deal was more like £100m is that correct? I can't understand why he wants so much? Surely it's better to get £100-£150m, get your money back then you don't have to put any more in. Who's got £200m? Then have to invest?
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Don Amott, King of Caravans.
The price is right, and the choice is yours
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It will be between 65 and 70 million from Sky. Top get about 100, made from a base, position amount and TV games.
I very much doubt Lerner is making a penny from the club, and frankly after putting the amount he has done into I think it is fair to criticise his decisions, but very unfair for people to have a pop at him personally.
If he wants out I trust him to sell to someone reputable, and wish him luck. I would sell in his position. It is a thankless task and one people are bloody insane to get involved in. 40k plus opinions on the idea you should be spending millions on over hyped pillocks that kick a ball around all day.
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I read somewhere that the £63m was for a stake and the actual deal was more like £100m is that correct? I can't understand why he wants so much? Surely it's better to get £100-£150m, get your money back then you don't have to put any more in. Who's got £200m? Then have to invest?
He has put in the initial 60 plus million, then propped the club to the tune of another 150 million plus since. Why would he not want that much. I may be coming across as terribly pro Lerner, I am not at all, I think he is right to sell if he has not got the money or will any more, but if you bought a house and then spent significant money on it, you would want that back in the sale. Even at that he might well make a heavy loss.
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But if you bought a house at the top of the property boom and then spent a load of money on stone cladding it you might well find yourself looking at loss when getting rid.
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I read somewhere that the £63m was for a stake and the actual deal was more like £100m is that correct? I can't understand why he wants so much? Surely it's better to get £100-£150m, get your money back then you don't have to put any more in. Who's got £200m? Then have to invest?
He has put in the initial 60 plus million, then propped the club to the tune of another 150 million plus since. Why would he not want that much. I may be coming across as terribly pro Lerner, I am not at all, I think he is right to sell if he has not got the money or will any more, but if you bought a house and then spent significant money on it, you would want that back in the sale. Even at that he might well make a heavy loss.
Isn't that business? You don't always get back what you put in
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I very much like Randy Lerner and I don't think it is lost on most of us that he is a man of integrity, far removed from some of the other shambolic owners doing the rounds. He has been good for the club in many ways.
But that said, something needs to change, the ambition has to come back to this club. We have the fanbase, the city, the stadium, the facilities and the history. We have to get back to aiming far higher than at present.
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I don't think Randy would sell us down the river either.
Just a hunch but he's not like Pornodwarf or Tumnus.
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I very much like Randy Lerner and I don't think it is lost on most of us that he is a man of integrity, far removed from some of the other shambolic owners doing the rounds. He has been good for the club in many ways.
But that said, something needs to change, the ambition has to come back to this club. We have the fanbase, the city, the stadium, the facilities and the history. We have to get back to aiming far higher than at present.
This.... but I hope Lerner makes sure if he does sell it must be to genuine, sensible, professional owners, unlike so many other clubs. He must do proper due diligence.
Much though I criticise Doug he did leave us in safe hands.
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I very much doubt we're spending anything like what our income is at present and the wage to turnover is probably quite low. One of the lowest. So there is money going somewhere, but I'm not throwing blame or accusations around and even if there is money going to Randy, it's nothing to what he's put in. He's entitled to take some back of course. But that all means we can't be competitive any more. So what's the point? Why merely tread water? Where's the fun for him now?
This is why I think a sale is coming soon. All the financial fat is being trimmed off. It's very risky as it means we're courting the disaster of relegation every season now. A new start can't come soon enough because 4 seasons of struggling is not worthy of this great club, which should be a powerhouse in this division.
It's not just about money. We need a team on and off the pitch that knows what it's doing. We need a long term plan, a philosophy, an identity. There is so much potential that is being squandered.
Randy isn't dumb, therefore I reckon he came to the conclusion he would move the club on a while ago. Now we just need the right package.
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I would be really worried if Randy sells us.
I dred the possibility of an owner like Cardiff, Hull or Blackburn.
I'm prepared to roll the dice because we'll soon end up like those three unless things change pretty damn urgently...
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I can see no other logical reason for the hugely risky cost cutting that we've seen over the last few years other than RL preparing the club for sale
How about because we were spending more than we were earning?
Are we spending more than we're earning though? The TV money has now become more ridiculous than the ridiculous levels we'd seen previously.
The club appears to be being run on a small budget. I'd go with the theory that Lerner wants to recoup his initial outlay if the new TV deal hadn't come along. Now that it has, surely he could sit back and just watch the money roll in?
Out of interest, does anyone know how many games Lerner has attended in the last twelve months?
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I very much doubt we're spending anything like what our income is at present and the wage to turnover is probably quite low. One of the lowest.
What's this based on? Other than guesswork.
The last accounts published were the ones for the TSM season and they showed our wages at almost 90% of turnover. We also posted a massive operating loss (ie before player trading and amortisation). So at that stage we were still spending way more than our income and our wage to turnover ratio was massive and probably higher than a good chunk of the league.
What's happened since then to mean our 'wage to turnover is one of the lowest' and we're not spending anything like our income?
And for those pointing to the new TV deal, that money is distributed through the end of season prize money, so we've seen none of that yet. Asking 'where it has gone' is pretty nonsensical.
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I very much doubt we're spending anything like what our income is at present and the wage to turnover is probably quite low. One of the lowest.
What's this based on? Other than guesswork.
The last accounts published were the ones for the TSM season and they showed our wages at almost 90% of turnover.
And since then we've off-loaded or are loaning out high-earners such as Darren Bent, Stephen Ireland, Richard Dunne and Shay Given. There are probably others as well that I've forgotten about. There is no way on this planet that the accounts for the current period will show wages accounting for anywhere near 90% of turnover.
As for the point about TV money being distributed at the end of the season, the clubs all know its coming, and many are spending with that knowledge.
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Exactly.
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Pat Murphy has been told the Sun's story is untrue.
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Randy was recently divorced so I would imagine his now ex wife is entitled to a % of his assets so perhaps if he were to sell he would have to sell at a market rate or be accused of losing her money?
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with hindsight, Randy had made his decision before O'Neill first looked like leaving.
We really had the full hollywood bullshit from these guys. Champions league trophy...how gullible.
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Pat Murphy has been told the Sun's story is untrue.
Howard Hodgson, who has recently been told he is no longer welcome in the director's box for comments made about Randy' s attendance ( or lack thereof), has stated that it IS true.
Believe what you will people, as is your right in a free and democratic country
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Lets not rewrite history, RL has given us some good times and we always do the right thing off the pitch, I reckon him a good bloke. He seems to have lost interest now but that happens and I wouldnt be against the right new owner coming in if he can be found. Slagging him off as some kind of opportunist is just plain wrong though.
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Lets not rewrite history, RL has given us some good times and we always do the right thing off the pitch, I reckon him a good bloke. He seems to have lost interest now but that happens and I wouldnt be against the right new owner coming in if he can be found. Slagging him off as some kind of opportunist is just plain wrong though.
It's been a long time since he gave us any good times though. These last 4 seasons have been appalling. If it was Ellis that was in charge now he'd have been hunted down and hung drawn and quartered by now.
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I can see no other logical reason for the hugely risky cost cutting that we've seen over the last few years other than RL preparing the club for sale
How about because we were spending more than we were earning?
Is that the case now?
Doubt it, how much do sky put in, then there is sponsor, ticket sales, corporate etc
Obviously I can't prove it but Randy must be making a fair bit of money these days. Doesn't he also charge a management fee?
Yet again - the club's accounts are freely available. Have a look at them and see if you can find this "fair bit of money".
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As for the point about TV money being distributed at the end of the season, the clubs all know its coming, and many are spending with that knowledge.
Why Lerner let his manager gamble with a major asset that he holds, by bringing in players with no proven pedigree was/is risky to say the least.
My view is that, from the beginning Randy thought that there were riches to be had by achieving the 'Holy Grail' of qualifying for the champions League. When that went tits up and O'Neill had spunked a good chunk of his money away, he knew that for a few years at least there would be no way to recover the majority of his outlay.
However, now I believe he see's his situation somewhat better financially and at this time probably thinks that the majority of his investment could be recouped even if we were to get relegated.
Maybe he is relaxed by it all. Whatever the outcome..
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I can see no other logical reason for the hugely risky cost cutting that we've seen over the last few years other than RL preparing the club for sale
How about because we were spending more than we were earning?
Is that the case now?
Doubt it, how much do sky put in, then there is sponsor, ticket sales, corporate etc
Obviously I can't prove it but Randy must be making a fair bit of money these days. Doesn't he also charge a management fee?
When Doug was running the club like a corner shop, ( ie cant spend more than you earn ), you were one of his harshest critics Dave, what's the difference now?
The main difference (apart from the European Cup-to-relegation in five years that Ellis always has to first be judged on) is that there were so many obvious things that were either done badly or not at all in his time. I expounded on this at length in the missed opportunities thread a few weeks ago, but basically, outside factors (football clubs briefly being the Stock Exchange darling, NTL, no local rivals worth bothering with, untapped markets to exploit) contributed to make it possible for us to get up there and stay. Maybe not at the level of Manchester United, but we could have certainly given Arsenal and Harding-era Chelsea a run for their money. As Bruce Langham said, "There's wriggle room here and we have to exploit it." The world has changed now and the things that are outside our control seem to work against us.
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I very much doubt we're spending anything like what our income is at present and the wage to turnover is probably quite low. One of the lowest.
What's this based on? Other than guesswork.
The last accounts published were the ones for the TSM season and they showed our wages at almost 90% of turnover.
And since then we've off-loaded or are loaning out high-earners such as Darren Bent, Stephen Ireland, Richard Dunne and Shay Given. There are probably others as well that I've forgotten about. There is no way on this planet that the accounts for the current period will show wages accounting for anywhere near 90% of turnover.
As for the point about TV money being distributed at the end of the season, the clubs all know its coming, and many are spending with that knowledge.
The ratio almost certainly won't be 90% but it also won't be one of the lowest in the league either. The players you've listed there were all on our books last season so we had another year of paying them what was probably an average of £50k each per week. That's £10m. At the same time, over the past season and a half we've bought in 18 players, excluding loan signings.
As for clubs spending the TV money up front - over the summer we had the 12th highest net spend in the league. In January only four clubs have bought anyone - Chelsea and Man U because they can; Fulham and Palace because they're desperate. So I don't exactly see the rest of the league throwing the new TV money around while Randy sits at home counting it.
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I don't think for a minute that the reason we've not been sold is because Randy doesn't want to sell. it's because nobody wants to buy. See also Everton.
Yep I think Randy would sell but there's no-one available to buy. I think we need a new owner or investment but I doubt it's out there.
As long as there exists such a place as Qatar, there is a potential buyer for a 'big' Premier League club.
This Everton comparison is a red herring, in my opinion. We might be similar in terms of history and size, but that's where the comparison ends. We're the number one team in the second largest city in the country. A city with the best transport links in the country. That city has a large migrant population with little or no affinity with the local clubs - yet. Until they start winning things. There's much greater potential here.
The right people could find everything they need to pitch against the big boys. It doesn't take long to turn a team around if you have all the money in the world to do it, and just like Man City, Qatar aren't looking for a financial return on their investment. They're looking for status, acceptance and respectability. Above all, legitimacy.
With our 'proud history', charity connections and track record of doing things the right way, we'd be perfect for them. All they'd have to do is follow the Man City model. Would many of us object to that?
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After reports in a tabloid newspaper that Aston Villa's American owner Randy Lerner is prepared to sell the club for £200m, BBC Sport's Pat Murphy tells BBC Radio 5 live: "Randy Lerner has treated that story with disdain.
"I have just spoken to Aston Villa's chief executive Paul Faulkner; he says he has spoken to Lerner and the story is nonsense, there's no truth in it.
"Faulkner says he speaks to Lerner three or four times a day and he watches every game, no matter where he is in the world.
"He (Faulkner) added that Lerner had put £250m into the club and has no intention of walking away."
Thoughts, Villa fans?
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I think the idea Faulkner talks to Randy 3 or 4 times a day sounds a bit far fetched!
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I think the idea Faulkner talks to Randy 3 or 4 times a day sounds a bit far fetched!
It wouldn't surprise me at all. Randy always seems to value personal relationships highly; when he arrived there was the story (if I remember it right) that he'd cancelled a lucrative TV contract because the station had intruded into his family over a fatal accident.
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Shame there is not 200 million of us on here as we could throw in a pound each to buy us.
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Why? If i owned the villa i would talk to my CEO at least that!
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Why? If i owned the villa i would talk to my CEO at least that!
If I spoke to my boss 3 or 4 times a day one of two things would happen - either he'd get so unbelievably pissed off that I was apparently incapable or making a decision alone he'd sack me, or I'd get so unbelievably pissed off my boss appeared to have absolutely no trust in me whatsoever I'd quit.
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The only real problem with Randy and Faulkner is that they don't appear to know very much about football. On commerce, they're fine; on tradition, exemplary; on spending, well, we can like it or not but they're not easing off without having thought hard about it. The only problem is that they appear to have a very poor understanding of the actual sport - they must do, or they'd never have entrusted MON with so much money having seen the earlier results of his overpriced Britisher splurges, nor hired McLeish having failed to hire Martinez (an entirely inexplicable and incongruous move). As a result, if Lambert goes to them and says '30% posssesion per match doesn't mean anything', they'll believe him. They're too trusting for their own good and their knowledge of the game always leaves them open to making really bad decisions.
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What if the relationship is not like that though?
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What if the relationship is not like that though?
3 or 4 phone calls a day - that's 1,000+ phone calls a year! They may well love working like that together - it just sounds pretty far fetched to me.
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@patmurphybbc: Paul Faulkner CEO of @AVFCOfficial has just told me he's spoken to Randy Lerner,who's rubbished stories that he's looking to sell up.
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Not sure how reliable it is but talksport reckon villa have had the fourth highest net spend since 2008.
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Not sure how reliable it is but talksport reckon villa have had the fourth highest net spend since 2008.
I reckon it will be not far off. We have just spent, prior to Lambert, abysmally. At least Lambert could sell his signings at a significant profit now.
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Not sure how reliable it is but talksport reckon villa have had the fourth highest net spend since 2008.
Sounds about right given how little we've recouped on players, and how much we spent. That would still include two summers of O Neill's spending. We made money on Young, Downing and Milner in that time, but our net despite that, must still be very high. Despite how little we've spent under Lambert, we've not really sold anyone for anything of note either.
Newcastle conversely had the lowest from the table I saw.
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Not sure how reliable it is but talksport reckon villa have had the fourth highest net spend since 2008.
Sounds about right given how little we've recouped on players, and how much we spent. That would still include two summers of O Neill's spending. We made money on Young, Downing and Milner in that time, but our net despite that, must still be very high. Despite how little we've spent under Lambert, we've not really sold anyone for anything of note either.
Newcastle conversely had the lowest from the table I saw.
That just goes to show how badly we have been run.
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I can see no other logical reason for the hugely risky cost cutting that we've seen over the last few years other than RL preparing the club for sale
i
How about because we were spending more than we were earning?
Is that the case now?
Doubt it, how much do sky put in, then there is sponsor, ticket sales, corporate etc
Obviously I can't prove it but Randy must be making a fair bit of money these days. Doesn't he also charge a management fee?
Yet again - the club's accounts are freely available. Have a look at them and see if you can find this "fair bit of money".
If we are still making a loss with our current wage bill and what we are prepared to pay for players then we must be in shit street.
How do other clubs sustain a squad on premiership wages?
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I hope Lerner is staying. He is trustworthy and there has been ample evidence that he 'gets' Aston Villa. If there are few out there that would spend 200 mill on mid table football club there will be even fewer that give a monkeys about what Villa stands for.
As an aside, if we're using the accounts from the McLeish year as a starting point, players who were then on the payroll but have since departed :-
Warnock, Collins, Dunne, Heskey, Bannan, Ireland, Delfouneso, Cuellar, Makoun, Beye
Pretty frightening when you consider what that group actually contributed on the field.
Petrov and Lichaj have also departed. I'd make getting on for 25 million in wages clawed back. I would be surprised if their replacements are being paid more than a third of that.
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I hope Lerner is staying. He is trustworthy and there has been ample evidence that he 'gets' Aston Villa. If there are few out there that would spend 200 mill on mid table football club there will be even fewer that give a monkeys about what Villa stands for.
As an aside, if we're using the accounts from the McLeish year as a starting point, players who were then on the payroll but have since departed :-
Warnock, Collins, Dunne, Heskey, Bannan, Ireland, Delfouneso, Cuellar, Makoun, Beye
Pretty frightening when you consider what that group actually contributed on the field.
Petrov and Lichaj have also departed. I'd make getting on for 25 million in wages clawed back. I would be surprised if their replacements are being paid more than a third of that.
I don't think it's quite £25m per year saved from that lot. Warnock, Collins, Dunne, Heskey, Ireland, Cuellar, and Beye probably averaged £40k a week. That would be almost £15m. Bannan and the Fonz won't have been on much as they're academy grads. Jean Deux won't have been on much either as he came from the French league.
That said, you need to add Bent and Given to that list too - both of whom were probably on £40k-£60k a week. I know they're both on loan officially but don't their contracts expire at the end of this season so we'll never see them again?
I think that by the end of this season the wages will be where Randy wants them to be. I think this Summer will be really interesting as a result.
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Jean 2M was on a decent whack, and Bannan was too. Add in Given and Bent and 25m is getting there. Heskey was on near 70 wasn't he?
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I can see no other logical reason for the hugely risky cost cutting that we've seen over the last few years other than RL preparing the club for sale
i
How about because we were spending more than we were earning?
Is that the case now?
Doubt it, how much do sky put in, then there is sponsor, ticket sales, corporate etc
Obviously I can't prove it but Randy must be making a fair bit of money these days. Doesn't he also charge a management fee?
Yet again - the club's accounts are freely available. Have a look at them and see if you can find this "fair bit of money".
If we are still making a loss with our current wage bill and what we are prepared to pay for players then we must be in shit street.
How do other clubs sustain a squad on premiership wages?
You were just asking about money that he's supposedly taking out. Nobody mentioned losses.
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Jean 2M was on a decent whack, and Bannan was too. Add in Given and Bent and 25m is getting there. Heskey was on near 70 wasn't he?
talking of Heskey did anyone see his sitter he missed :o
http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/video/terrible-miss-emile-heskey-180509493.html
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I can see no other logical reason for the hugely risky cost cutting that we've seen over the last few years other than RL preparing the club for sale
i
How about because we were spending more than we were earning?
Is that the case now?
Doubt it, how much do sky put in, then there is sponsor, ticket sales, corporate etc
Obviously I can't prove it but Randy must be making a fair bit of money these days. Doesn't he also charge a management fee?
Yet again - the club's accounts are freely available. Have a look at them and see if you can find this "fair bit of money".
If we are still making a loss with our current wage bill and what we are prepared to pay for players then we must be in shit street.
How do other clubs sustain a squad on premiership wages?
You were just asking about money that he's supposedly taking out. Nobody mentioned losses.
I think it's relevant to the discussion. If we are making money where is it going?
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I'm guessing the same as anyone else but I got 25 mill from
Warnock 2.5
Collins 2.5
Dunne 3
Heskey 3
Bannan 1
Ireland 3
Delfouneso 1
Cuellar 2.5
Makoun 1.5
Beye 2
Petrov 3
Lichaj bugger all
I may be a half a mill out here and there but the end result is still going to be about 25 mill in total.
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I can see no other logical reason for the hugely risky cost cutting that we've seen over the last few years other than RL preparing the club for sale
i
How about because we were spending more than we were earning?
Is that the case now?
Doubt it, how much do sky put in, then there is sponsor, ticket sales, corporate etc
Obviously I can't prove it but Randy must be making a fair bit of money these days. Doesn't he also charge a management fee?
Yet again - the club's accounts are freely available. Have a look at them and see if you can find this "fair bit of money".
If we are still making a loss with our current wage bill and what we are prepared to pay for players then we must be in shit street.
How do other clubs sustain a squad on premiership wages?
You were just asking about money that he's supposedly taking out. Nobody mentioned losses.
I think it's relevant to the discussion. If we are making money where is it going?
Nobody knows if we're making money or not until the accounts are published. Every set from previous years has shown that he has either put more in or cancelled what he was due to take out. You can blame him for many things but to keep insinuating, against all evidence, that he's making money out of the Villa is extremely wide of the mark.
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@patmurphybbc: To those @AVFCOfficial fans complaining about RL not selling up - don't blame me,I'm just the messenger.Reporters gather info where they can
@patmurphybbc: No point in asking me questions 2 put to Randy Lerner - hasn't given radio/TV interviews since buying @AVFCOfficial.Have 2 rely on soundings
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poor Pat.
And WTF does "don't blame me" mean? Has anyone actually blamed Pat Murphy for Randy not selling the club?
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poor Pat.
And WTF does "don't blame me" mean? Has anyone actually blamed Pat Murphy for Randy not selling the club?
He's probably getting moaned at for not getting any info from Lerner. All we seem to get is bland corporate speak from Faulkner that tells us sweet f#ck all.
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I can see no other logical reason for the hugely risky cost cutting that we've seen over the last few years other than RL preparing the club for sale
i
How about because we were spending more than we were earning?
Is that the case now?
Doubt it, how much do sky put in, then there is sponsor, ticket sales, corporate etc
Obviously I can't prove it but Randy must be making a fair bit of money these days. Doesn't he also charge a management fee?
Yet again - the club's accounts are freely available. Have a look at them and see if you can find this "fair bit of money".
If we are still making a loss with our current wage bill and what we are prepared to pay for players then we must be in shit street.
How do other clubs sustain a squad on premiership wages?
You were just asking about money that he's supposedly taking out. Nobody mentioned losses.
I think it's relevant to the discussion. If we are making money where is it going?
Nobody knows if we're making money or not until the accounts are published. Every set from previous years has shown that he has either put more in or cancelled what he was due to take out. You can blame him for many things but to keep insinuating, against all evidence, that he's making money out of the Villa is extremely wide of the mark.
I can see no other logical reason for the hugely risky cost cutting that we've seen over the last few years other than RL preparing the club for sale
i
How about because we were spending more than we were earning?
Is that the case now?
Doubt it, how much do sky put in, then there is sponsor, ticket sales, corporate etc
Obviously I can't prove it but Randy must be making a fair bit of money these days. Doesn't he also charge a management fee?
Yet again - the club's accounts are freely available. Have a look at them and see if you can find this "fair bit of money".
If we are still making a loss with our current wage bill and what we are prepared to pay for players then we must be in shit street.
How do other clubs sustain a squad on premiership wages?
You were just asking about money that he's supposedly taking out. Nobody mentioned losses.
I think it's relevant to the discussion. If we are making money where is it going?
Nobody knows if we're making money or not until the accounts are published. Every set from previous years has shown that he has either put more in or cancelled what he was due to take out. You can blame him for many things but to keep insinuating, against all evidence, that he's making money out of the Villa is extremely wide of the mark.
I can see no other logical reason for the hugely risky cost cutting that we've seen over the last few years other than RL preparing the club for sale
i
How about because we were spending more than we were earning?
Is that the case now?
Doubt it, how much do sky put in, then there is sponsor, ticket sales, corporate etc
Obviously I can't prove it but Randy must be making a fair bit of money these days. Doesn't he also charge a management fee?
Yet again - the club's accounts are freely available. Have a look at them and see if you can find this "fair bit of money".
If we are still making a loss with our current wage bill and what we are prepared to pay for players then we must be in shit street.
How do other clubs sustain a squad on premiership wages?
You were just asking about money that he's supposedly taking out. Nobody mentioned losses.
I think it's relevant to the discussion. If we are making money where is it going?
Nobody knows if we're making money or not until the accounts are published. Every set from previous years has shown that he has either put more in or cancelled what he was due to take out. You can blame him for many things but to keep insinuating, against all evidence, that he's making money out of the Villa is extremely wide of the mark.
I am insinuating nothing, just speculating and guessing. After all nobody is really IKN around here, so it's all guess work and supposition.
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So good I quoted it thrice :)
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I hope Lerner is staying. He is trustworthy and there has been ample evidence that he 'gets' Aston Villa. If there are few out there that would spend 200 mill on mid table football club there will be even fewer that give a monkeys about what Villa stands for.
As an aside, if we're using the accounts from the McLeish year as a starting point, players who were then on the payroll but have since departed :-
Warnock, Collins, Dunne, Heskey, Bannan, Ireland, Delfouneso, Cuellar, Makoun, Beye
Pretty frightening when you consider what that group actually contributed on the field.
Petrov and Lichaj have also departed. I'd make getting on for 25 million in wages clawed back. I would be surprised if their replacements are being paid more than a third of that.
I don't think it's quite £25m per year saved from that lot. Warnock, Collins, Dunne, Heskey, Ireland, Cuellar, and Beye probably averaged £40k a week. That would be almost £15m. Bannan and the Fonz won't have been on much as they're academy grads. Jean Deux won't have been on much either as he came from the French league.
That said, you need to add Bent and Given to that list too - both of whom were probably on £40k-£60k a week. I know they're both on loan officially but don't their contracts expire at the end of this season so we'll never see them again?
I think that by the end of this season the wages will be where Randy wants them to be. I think this Summer will be really interesting as a result.
I'd bump the figure up to 50k a week from that lot personally. You've also missed out the likes of Sidwell, NRC and Luke Young who all left us that summer officially as did Carew I think. Also remember that summer we sold Young and Downing so that was probably close to 100k a week for those two off the wage bill.
We have shed a load of high earning players off, of course there's still some lingering but not a huge amount anymore.
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I am insinuating nothing, just speculating and guessing. After all nobody is really IKN around here, so it's all guess work and supposition.
What's the point in speculating and guessing when there are actual financial facts which state that you're wrong?
I can think of lots of things to bemoan Randy for, but the one that he's taking money out / profiting from the club doesn't stand even the most cursory of examinations.
Yesterday I saw on twitter someone who was stupid enough to post "bought the club for 65m, sells for 200m, nice fat profit there".
How can you argue with people sufficiently stupid to think that's how it works? What about the tens of millions he has put in in the meantime? The losses he's financed year after year? The loans he's written off?
There's absolutely no point guessing, it is factually incorrect, wrong, not the truth. It's as simple as that.
Like I said, I think he's managed the money he has invested abysmally, and we are cutting back far too quickly now that he's personally lost interest, but to suggest he's made money from the club or is taking it out is incorrect - it isn't even a matter of opinion, it is a factual inaccuracy, but something which seems to get seized on by people sufficiently "black and white" to think "well, I don't like the way he runs the club, so every single thing which reflects badly on him must be correct".
It's not, it is totally, demonstratively, and factually not correct.
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I am insinuating nothing, just speculating and guessing. After all nobody is really IKN around here, so it's all guess work and supposition.
Oh, right.
With the wage bill having been slashed and the TV income up I think we must be very profitable at the moment. Is Randy trousering the profit or saving it for the summer? Or making what he can before he sells?
[
Because Randy is done with us and is only bothered about getting out with the most amount of cash he can. It looks like we are a safe bet to stay up so why waste money on players?
Obviously I can't prove it but Randy must be making a fair bit of money these days. Doesn't he also charge a management fee?
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I am insinuating nothing, just speculating and guessing. After all nobody is really IKN around here, so it's all guess work and supposition.
What's the point in speculating and guessing when there are actual financial facts which state that you're wrong?
I can think of lots of things to bemoan Randy for, but the one that he's taking money out / profiting from the club doesn't stand even the most cursory of examinations.
Yesterday I saw on twitter someone who was stupid enough to post "bought the club for 65m, sells for 200m, nice fat profit there".
How can you argue with people sufficiently stupid to think that's how it works? What about the tens of millions he has put in in the meantime? The losses he's financed year after year? The loans he's written off?
There's absolutely no point guessing, it is factually incorrect, wrong, not the truth. It's as simple as that.
Like I said, I think he's managed the money he has invested abysmally, and we are cutting back far too quickly now that he's personally lost interest, but to suggest he's made money from the club or is taking it out is incorrect - it isn't even a matter of opinion, it is a factual inaccuracy, but something which seems to get seized on by people sufficiently "black and white" to think "well, I don't like the way he runs the club, so every single thing which reflects badly on him must be correct".
It's not, it is totally, demonstratively, and factually not correct.
Yeah, well you can prove anything with facts, can't you.
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IKN ?
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In Kefalonia Now.
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I knob nuns
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poor Pat.
And WTF does "don't blame me" mean? Has anyone actually blamed Pat Murphy for Randy not selling the club?
He's probably getting moaned at for not getting any info from Lerner. All we seem to get is bland corporate speak from Faulkner that tells us sweet f#ck all.
No other journalist puts on a "woe is me" act like Murphy. Ironically for him the more he does the less chance there will ever be an audience with Lerner. He's hardly private and respectful about the entire thing. And even if he did get an interview what do you suppose Lerner will actually say? The other day when Faulkner spoke it was dissected within seconds and those who were sceptical before remained so and arguably became even more cynical. If Lerner said "ok, we're done with the cuts and now we're going to go big" who realistically will take him at face value? In fact I would argue there would be more detractors looking to read between the lines and pick holes in every second word. He's in a no win situation and Murphy just needs to get past not getting an interview. He just comes across as a whiny old man.
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Whether Lerner is selling or not he had to go through the cost-cutting exercise after the spend under O'Neill and Houllier. It's not rocket science.
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I am insinuating nothing, just speculating and guessing. After all nobody is really IKN around here, so it's all guess work and supposition.
Oh, right.
With the wage bill having been slashed and the TV income up I think we must be very profitable at the moment. Is Randy trousering the profit or saving it for the summer? Or making what he can before he sells?
[
Because Randy is done with us and is only bothered about getting out with the most amount of cash he can. It looks like we are a safe bet to stay up so why waste money on players?
Obviously I can't prove it but Randy must be making a fair bit of money these days. Doesn't he also charge a management fee?
Yep speculation all of it, and a few questions. So what?
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IKN ?
Well done for picking up on my typo, really impressive :)
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I knob nuns
Be careful doing that, you never know where the priests have been...
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poor Pat.
And WTF does "don't blame me" mean? Has anyone actually blamed Pat Murphy for Randy not selling the club?
He's probably getting moaned at for not getting any info from Lerner. All we seem to get is bland corporate speak from Faulkner that tells us sweet f#ck all.
No other journalist puts on a "woe is me" act like Murphy. Ironically for him the more he does the less chance there will ever be an audience with Lerner. He's hardly private and respectful about the entire thing. And even if he did get an interview what do you suppose Lerner will actually say? The other day when Faulkner spoke it was dissected within seconds and those who were sceptical before remained so and arguably became even more cynical. If Lerner said "ok, we're done with the cuts and now we're going to go big" who realistically will take him at face value? In fact I would argue there would be more detractors looking to read between the lines and pick holes in every second word. He's in a no win situation and Murphy just needs to get past not getting an interview. He just comes across as a whiny old man.
It would be nice to get even the slightest hint from the club that these cutbacks and bargain basement trash we've been signing for the last 4 seasons will eventually come to an end, but what do we get - bland corporate speak that tell us absolutely nothing. In fact it continues to feed the resentment from the fans, as we're the ones who have to put up with the rubbish we see on the pitch. Just the slightest hint that there may well be light at the end of the tunnel. Is that really too much to ask?
As for Murphy, why shouldn't be allowed to be pissed off for not getting any information out of the club? It's his job, so why should he be happy about it?
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I knob nuns
Be careful doing that, you never know where the priests have been...
Probably amongst the choirboys.
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I knob nuns
Be careful doing that, you never know where the priests have been...
not near the nuns I'm sure!
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I am insinuating nothing, just speculating and guessing. After all nobody is really IKN around here, so it's all guess work and supposition.
Oh, right.
With the wage bill having been slashed and the TV income up I think we must be very profitable at the moment. Is Randy trousering the profit or saving it for the summer? Or making what he can before he sells?
[
Because Randy is done with us and is only bothered about getting out with the most amount of cash he can. It looks like we are a safe bet to stay up so why waste money on players?
Obviously I can't prove it but Randy must be making a fair bit of money these days. Doesn't he also charge a management fee?
Yep speculation all of it, and a few questions. So what?
So you keep saying it, you keep getting told you're wrong and you keep saying it again.
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So, are we not allowed to speculate and go on and on about stuff on here?
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So, are we not allowed to speculate and go on and on about stuff on here?
Haven't heard that one for a few days.
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So, are we not allowed to speculate and go on and on about stuff on here?
Haven't heard that one for a few days.
I suppose I am trying to get to why Randy owns us.
Is it to build a successful football club? Not doing very well if that's his motivation.
Make money? If what I am told is true that's not working either.
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So, are we not allowed to speculate and go on and on about stuff on here?
Haven't heard that one for a few days.
I suppose I am trying to get to why Randy owns us.
Is it to build a successful football club? Not doing very well if that's his motivation.
Make money? If what I am told is true that's not working either.
Why do people buy anything?
There's an old saying that the two happiest men in the world are a man who's just bought a boat and the man who's just sold it to him. Sometimes you fall in love with a dream and the reality is very different.
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I assume he purchased the club in the hope of breaking into the Champions League a couple of years later (five year plan).
Then Man City's billions came along from nowhere and essentially blew Randy out of the water.
He had committed money to this plan which in the main was squandered by O'Neill.
From thereon in we had no chance.
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So, are we not allowed to speculate and go on and on about stuff on here?
Of course you are, but if you are going to speculate on Randy taking money out of, or making money from, Villa, then expect people to point out that you're factually incorrect - you might as well be arguing the moon is made of cheese.
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So, are we not allowed to speculate and go on and on about stuff on here?
Haven't heard that one for a few days.
I suppose I am trying to get to why Randy owns us.
Is it to build a successful football club? Not doing very well if that's his motivation.
Make money? If what I am told is true that's not working either.
Why do people buy anything?
There's an old saying that the two happiest men in the world are a man who's just bought a boat and the man who's just sold it to him. Sometimes you fall in love with a dream and the reality is very different.
Randy is a business man, not sure if he would let his heart rule his head. If he has fallen out of love with HMS Aston Villa what would he do? Cut his losses and get into the lifeboat.
Again it's only speculation on my part but I think that's what he is doing.
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HMT Aston Villa sank during the war.
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I think RL wants to "do the right thing". It would be unseemly to follow the oligarchs in their ostentatious displays of power and wealth, or the financial manipulators of his countrymen at Manure and RedScouse. He spent the money with MoN when the playing field was less ridiculously skewed, but now he is trying a new approach.
There is no way that he is going to abandon this project when it has hardly started. In PL, he has found somebody who is wholly committed to the plan, and who seems unstinting in his belief that it can work.
There will be no change in ownership or managership any time soon. IMHO, of course.
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So good I quoted it thrice :)
I think you should take a screenshot of that and sell it as modern art.
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poor Pat.
And WTF does "don't blame me" mean? Has anyone actually blamed Pat Murphy for Randy not selling the club?
He's probably getting moaned at for not getting any info from Lerner. All we seem to get is bland corporate speak from Faulkner that tells us sweet f#ck all.
No other journalist puts on a "woe is me" act like Murphy. Ironically for him the more he does the less chance there will ever be an audience with Lerner. He's hardly private and respectful about the entire thing. And even if he did get an interview what do you suppose Lerner will actually say? The other day when Faulkner spoke it was dissected within seconds and those who were sceptical before remained so and arguably became even more cynical. If Lerner said "ok, we're done with the cuts and now we're going to go big" who realistically will take him at face value? In fact I would argue there would be more detractors looking to read between the lines and pick holes in every second word. He's in a no win situation and Murphy just needs to get past not getting an interview. He just comes across as a whiny old man.
It would be nice to get even the slightest hint from the club that these cutbacks and bargain basement trash we've been signing for the last 4 seasons will eventually come to an end, but what do we get - bland corporate speak that tell us absolutely nothing. In fact it continues to feed the resentment from the fans, as we're the ones who have to put up with the rubbish we see on the pitch. Just the slightest hint that there may well be light at the end of the tunnel. Is that really too much to ask?
As for Murphy, why shouldn't be allowed to be pissed off for not getting any information out of the club? It's his job, so why should he be happy about it?
Call it what you want, but even if Randy came out and gave a speech from the heart would you believe him? And what if he said in this tell all interview, "I love the club, I don't want to sell but we can only afford x amount a year" when all of us know that x amount in todays PL will get us 7th to 10th at best. How do you think that truth gets interpreted? What people want him to say is the cuts are over and we are going for everything every season when quite frankly it's just not realistic. I can see us maybe getting back into the top six if the purse strings are loosened and competiting with Newcastle or Everton, possibly Spurs, but the other 4 or 5 teams have resources and revenue streams that the outside investment and the CL has created that we simply cannot compete against. And I don't know that him speaking frankly does anything good, and might even do more harm unless he tells us what we all want to hear and actually backs it up. He's certainly not going back to the spend more than we have/make days, so this is just my impression he is going to take the route of continued stability and increased but responsible investment. That takes time and patience which are in scarce supply in football.
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Very well put TV. Lerner has many flaws but I really believe his good intentions, and it's scurrilous and unfair to suggest otherwise.
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This is a very frustrating thread. Can we just close it please till something actually happens?
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No.
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I think RL wants to "do the right thing". It would be unseemly to follow the oligarchs in their ostentatious displays of power and wealth, or the financial manipulators of his countrymen at Manure and RedScouse. He spent the money with MoN when the playing field was less ridiculously skewed, but now he is trying a new approach.
There is no way that he is going to abandon this project when it has hardly started. In PL, he has found somebody who is wholly committed to the plan, and who seems unstinting in his belief that it can work.
There will be no change in ownership or managership any time soon. IMHO, of course.
Sadly, I agree with you. The only way I can see a change of manager is if we continue with our poor home form until the end of the season and there's a very low take up on 'early bird' season ticket renewals. Even then I not 100% convinced Lerner will look elsewhere. The costs are now manageable and everything is based on the hope Lambert can eventually get it right.
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How can we summize anything other than he wants to sell us?
He jettisoned the Browns and still shows little or no intent to finance a badly needed injection
Of quality in the areas we all know need strengthening on the pitch
We never see or hear a thing from him,he's overseen the worst home form in living memory
and he does nothing to ease the pain of us long suffering supporters
The transfer deadline day was a big frustration we now have to hope we win this 11 strong relegation league that the bottom half of the Premier has become,and if we get injuries to Vlaar and Gabby which we now have we are far less likely to win games.
Thanks a lot Randy!
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HMT Aston Villa sank during the war.
Very good...
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As I see it the simple truth is that if you want to own a premiership football club you have to have very deep pockets and you have to keep putting your hand in them. There is no so-far-and-no- further to owning a premiership club.
There is a casino in Shanghai where the minimum bet is one million US dollars. There are men and women out there with stupendous amounts of money at their disposal. The premiership is not for the faint hearted. There are massive amounts of money washing around in football but you have to put up the ante if you want some of it.
I like Randy Lerner, I always have. I loved the new hope he brought to the club and respect him for it but I think he has bottled it.
I fully understand and accept that he has poured a lot of money into the club and has continued to fund the club personally but he bought the club for a song and there is not the slightest doubt that he would make a thumping profit if he sold it. I don't want him to sell it but what I do want is some sort of stable middle ground between the excesses of the MON years and the current obsession with thrift.
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As I see it the simple truth is that if you want to own a premiership football club you have to have very deep pockets and you have to keep putting your hand in them. There is no so-far-and-no- further to owning a premiership club.
There is a casino in Shanghai where the minimum bet is one million US dollars. There are men and women out there with stupendous amounts of money at their disposal. The premiership is not for the faint hearted. There are massive amounts of money washing around in football but you have to put up the ante if you want some of it.
I like Randy Lerner, I always have. I loved the new hope he brought to the club and respect him for it but I think he has bottled it.
I fully understand and accept that he has poured a lot of money into the club and has continued to fund the club personally but he bought the club for a song and there is not the slightest doubt that he would make a thumping profit if he sold it. I don't want him to sell it but what I do want is some sort of stable middle ground between the excesses of the MON years and the current obsession with thrift.
That's pretty much my thinking, too, Brian
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My source informs me that this will definitely happen, sometime in the next 90 years. Probably.
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How can we summize anything other than he wants to sell us?
He jettisoned the Browns and still shows little or no intent to finance a badly needed injection
Of quality in the areas we all know need strengthening on the pitch
We never see or hear a thing from him,he's overseen the worst home form in living memory
and he does nothing to ease the pain of us long suffering supporters
The transfer deadline day was a big frustration we now have to hope we win this 11 strong relegation league that the bottom half of the Premier has become,and if we get injuries to Vlaar and Gabby which we now have we are far less likely to win games.
Thanks a lot Randy!
Got to be honest, I can remember worse home form than this, as I'm sure many others on here can.
To be fair, I would much rather have an owner/chairman who keeps himself out of the press and lets his employees do their jobs than a rentagob like Gold or Sullivan or an ego on the rampage wanting to change the name of the club or the colours of the home shirt.
Lerner has not got a bottomless pit of cash to throw at the club, I believe Lambert, Faulkner and Lerner do have a plan based on a sensible business model and steadily improving the team.
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Whilst Randy is not everyone's cup of tea you only have to look at Leeds and Cardiff to realise there are much worse owners out there. Better the devil you know.
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They may well have a plan but without considerable investment on the team it will only take us so far , the rich are getting richer and grabbing the better players - we may well have a plan that will see us achieve perhaps a top 8 finish but I think to compete at the top end of the table would take huge cash investment once again.
When randy took over he gave it his best shot , probably his finances have been hit in recent years with the recession and his divorce too and I can understand him not being able to compete with the rich cats of the premier league.
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Whilst Randy is not everyone's cup of tea you only have to look at Leeds and Cardiff to realise there are much worse owners out there. Better the devil you know.
No thanks, I'd rather take a chance with someone else rather stick with a man that has sold nearly every decent player at the club and replaced them with inferior ones.
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Whilst Randy is not everyone's cup of tea you only have to look at Leeds and Cardiff to realise there are much worse owners out there. Better the devil you know.
No thanks, I'd rather take a chance with someone else rather stick with a man that has sold nearly every decent player at the club and replaced them with inferior ones.
And here's me thinking it was the managers doing that.
If it was Randy, then you'll have to thank him for buying them all in the first place.
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As I see it the simple truth is that if you want to own a premiership football club you have to have very deep pockets and you have to keep putting your hand in them. There is no so-far-and-no- further to owning a premiership club.
There is a casino in Shanghai where the minimum bet is one million US dollars. There are men and women out there with stupendous amounts of money at their disposal. The premiership is not for the faint hearted. There are massive amounts of money washing around in football but you have to put up the ante if you want some of it.
Interesting post Brian but there are no (legal) casinos in Shanghai. I assume the casino you refer to would be in Macau.
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Whilst Randy is not everyone's cup of tea you only have to look at Leeds and Cardiff to realise there are much worse owners out there. Better the devil you know.
No thanks, I'd rather take a chance with someone else rather stick with a man that has sold nearly every decent player at the club and replaced them with inferior ones.
Same here. His strategy when he arrived was to invest in quality players in order to be successful in the league. He did that and got results to some extent.
I don't buy that its all nasty Mr O'neills fault. Randy knew the transfer fees and also the wages that went with them.
What did happen was that new owners arrived, also armed with shit loads of cash and he didn't want to waste more money.
Now Randy wants us to be self-sufficient. I'd have bought that if it was his initial strategy.
He's not trying to do it for the good of the fans, he's stream lining for a sale.
Hope it works.
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(http://i1289.photobucket.com/albums/b518/Andy_Lochhead_in_the_air/5510961_450_450_676_0_fit_6_bcd9e9c61199d3bcbc83223c05c93fb6_zpsb849461f.jpg)
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I like Randy Lerner, I always have. I loved the new hope he brought to the club and respect him for it but I think he has bottled it.
What I think is sad is to compare the atmosphere in 2006, when he was quite clearly loving it, and continued to do so, with now, when he goes an entire year without going to a match.
Dress it up how you like, but that says something, really. In fact, it probably says more than the financial situation does.
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Whilst Randy is not everyone's cup of tea you only have to look at Leeds and Cardiff to realise there are much worse owners out there. Better the devil you know.
No thanks, I'd rather take a chance with someone else rather stick with a man that has sold nearly every decent player at the club and replaced them with inferior ones.
And here's me thinking it was the managers doing that.
If it was Randy, then you'll have to thank him for buying them all in the first place.
Of course it's the managers who have sold our best players and replaced them with inferior ones. Lerner had nothing to do with it whatsoever! Ha!
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Is it really a year since Lerner has been to a match?
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Maybe, I know someone who had a very brief conversation with him in the summer so its not like hes not been over here at all.
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Maybe, I know someone who had a very brief conversation with him in the summer so its not like hes not been over here at all.
Edited, sorry!
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Tomorrow's Mirror are saying that Lerner is NOT looking to sell the club but is looking for new fund raising ideas to help the club, including stadium naming rights. They also report the North Stand will be rebuilt.
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That Nursey article sounds like it is just cobbled together from shit he's read on forums.
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Tomorrow's Mirror are saying that Lerner is NOT looking to sell the club but is looking for new fund raising ideas to help the club, including stadium naming rights. They also report the North Stand will be rebuilt.
Fund raising ideas? So we can have the potential to finish 8th. What's the point? Either stick with it or sell up.
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That Nursey article sounds like it is just cobbled together from shit he's read on forums.
Faulkner has said tonight that Lerner categorically denied he has put us up for sale. If this is true then surely sooner rather than later he has to rediscover his ambition for the club.
Well I hope so anyway.
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That Nursey article sounds like it is just cobbled together from shit he's read on forums.
Are you suggesting that James Nursey, the HL Mencken of Villa-connected journalism, is somehow not just one big ball of integrity?
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Randy Lerner will NOT sell Aston Villa - but may sell naming rights to Villa Park to earn club cash
Feb 02, 2014 22:30 By James Nursey 0 Comments
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The Villa owner does not want to sell the club, despite the fact he has had to scale back investment since the 2007 financial crisis
Going nowhere: Lerner will not sell Aston Villa
Getty
Aston Villa owner Randy Lerner insists he has no plans to sell up and is looking for new fund-raising ideas to help the club.
Villa’s American chairman has scaled back investment in the club since the credit crunch struck in 2007.
The wage bill has been slashed and they only brought in two loans in the January window.
Villa have slid down the table since three successive sixth-place finishes from 2007 to 2010. Lerner, who bought Villa in 2006 for £62million, is rarely seen in Birmingham nowadays.
He sold his Cleveland Browns NFL team in 2012, but is said to be “disdainful” of reports he might also offload Villa.
Lerner is looking into selling naming rights to Villa Park to raise revenue and expanding the stadium’s North Stand.
FROM AROUND THE WEB:
http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/randy-lerner-not-sell-aston-3106566#ixzz2sD6jk6zq
Follow us: @DailyMirror on Twitter | DailyMirror on Facebook
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How much would naming rights bring in ..?
Not surprised he is looking , Prem league FFP rules are seeing clubs find other sources of income see Liverpool's 2 recent commercial deals Dunkin Doughnuts coffee and pastry supplier and Garuda Airlines training kit sponsorship.
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Not that it's definitive proof on anything, but Lerner denied that the Browns were up for sale very shortly before selling the Browns, so I'm not taking anything as gospel. All I can say is that it looks and feels like the club us being prepped for sale. And if it isn't, then finding alternative revenue streams is good news, if it's spent wisely.
I'm sure the quality of play on the pitch is pretty much all most of us care about.
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If the right offer comes in for anything material in your possession you are going to consider selling it. If Randy could guarantee that the next owner met his price, was actually minted with real money not a bunch of IOU's, had good intentions for the club and will not end up in the locker like the bloke down the road, I'm sure he's be tempted to sell. Until then I imagine Aston Villa will belong to him.
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Lerner was unlucky in fact we all were that MON became manager, it seemed great at the time but we were all fooled. How much did he pay Heskey? and he is just one example. So many times we have been one or two quality players short of a very good team wasn't there one decent midfielder we could have got in?
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Spot on Robbo with the observation that Randy Lerner was unlucky to get O'Neill to manage his launch into football ownership. Paradoxically the rumour circulated that the attempt by O'Neill to get in Parker on 100k plus a week was the straw that broke the camel's back but you are right. We were only a couple of players off an outstanding side.
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Spot on Robbo with the observation that Randy Lerner was unlucky to get O'Neill to manage his launch into football ownership. Paradoxically the rumour circulated that the attempt by O'Neill to get in Parker on 100k plus a week was the straw that broke the camel's back but you are right. We were only a couple of players off an outstanding side.
A couple of players short of outstanding, exactly. We were in that position because of the investment.
Of course he lined the squad with high earners and a few that really didn't merit it.
But we are where we are because of the purging of that squad. Whats the next step then....
Spend money on good players, there isn't any way around it in this game.
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Thats not quite right at the time we had Young, Milner and Barry all of them paid less than Heskey the amount of money paid out to what i refer to as Journeymen players was scandalous and the fact that some he bought he very soon fell out with and never picked them again.We all thought we were doing great getting MON in but for Randy, Aston Villa and its supporters it was a disaster. I m hard pressed to come up with the name of a manager who could have done worse than MON given the money he had to spend and the crap he left us with when he walked out.
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Randy knew the score with these players however, we were never likely to see any future fees from Heskey, Dunne or Friedel.
Heskey has always been shit. But rightly or wrongly many in the game thought he was one of the best players in England. So he warranted his wages.
Curtis was his biggest flop, but at the time many thought he was the next Ferdinand.
What was his overall net transfer total - £70 million? What did we sell on after he left - Milner £26 million, Young £17 million, Downing £20 million, Curtis £3.5million, Young £2million, Collins £2.5 million. Shorey £1.5 million.
Randy sanctioned the wages. All I actually believe were more or less market value for the players, maybe with Beye as a major exception!
So thats £72 odd million back in transfer fees.
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Maybe take a look at what harry Rednapp has left behind at his old clubs. MON is maybe not the worst. Kenny Dalglish anyone?
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I suggest Randy should think about what happened after O'neill left: Ireland £8million huge wages, Makoun £6million, Bent £18million, huge wages, N'zogbia £10million.
Mcleish appointment.
I personally think we did fairly well under Martin, the league positions probably reflected the money we spent. (that you need to spend)
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Whilst Randy is not everyone's cup of tea you only have to look at Leeds and Cardiff to realise there are much worse owners out there. Better the devil you know.
No thanks, I'd rather take a chance with someone else rather stick with a man that has sold nearly every decent player at the club and replaced them with inferior ones.
And here's me thinking it was the managers doing that.
If it was Randy, then you'll have to thank him for buying them all in the first place.
Of course it's the managers who have sold our best players and replaced them with inferior ones. Lerner had nothing to do with it whatsoever! Ha!
So you credit him with buying all those good players too?
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IKN ?
Well done for picking up on my typo, really impressive :)
didn't know it was a typo, thought it was a new thing with a meaning
that's why I asked so I could be up to date with the in crowd,
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I thought it was I Know Nothing (hence the speculation).
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Maybe take a look at what harry Rednapp has left behind at his old clubs. MON is maybe not the worst. Kenny Dalglish anyone?
Won more in both his spells at Liverpool than most of our managers.
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I thought it was I Know Nothing (hence the speculation).
Me too.
It's like the site's version of an ITK - an IKN, totally not ITK.
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I thought it was I Know Nothing (hence the speculation).
Me too.
It's like the site's version of an ITK - an IKN, totally not ITK.
As reported by Damon on ITN ?
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I thought it was I Know Nothing (hence the speculation).
Me too.
It's like the site's version of an ITK - an IKN, totally not ITK.
As reported by Damon on ITN ?
"Damon Green, ITN, in a flooded field. Unhappy".
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Whilst Randy is not everyone's cup of tea you only have to look at Leeds and Cardiff to realise there are much worse owners out there. Better the devil you know.
No thanks, I'd rather take a chance with someone else rather stick with a man that has sold nearly every decent player at the club and replaced them with inferior ones.
Same here. His strategy when he arrived was to invest in quality players in order to be successful in the league. He did that and got results to some extent.
I don't buy that its all nasty Mr O'neills fault. Randy knew the transfer fees and also the wages that went with them.
What did happen was that new owners arrived, also armed with shit loads of cash and he didn't want to waste more money.
Now Randy wants us to be self-sufficient. I'd have bought that if it was his initial strategy.
He's not trying to do it for the good of the fans, he's stream lining for a sale.
Hope it works.
Unfortunately for us, Man City came along and we are arguably the club that has suffered most from that. We were already aiming to sneak into 4th with Man Utd, Chelsea and Arsenal out of sight. When citee came into the money, they took our 2 best players and the 3 Champs League closed shop became 4 meaning that without further even bigger investment we weren't going to make it to the promised land of the Champs League.
If I was in Lerners shoes, I would have done the same with respect to cutting down on investment. The ship sailed and we missed it. As painful as it is now, I don't think there is any real alternative. Either start again and build from the bottom ala Everton or, possibly make the club sellable and attract someone with serious money who will fund a punt on the Champs League.
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Whilst Randy is not everyone's cup of tea you only have to look at Leeds and Cardiff to realise there are much worse owners out there. Better the devil you know.
No thanks, I'd rather take a chance with someone else rather stick with a man that has sold nearly every decent player at the club and replaced them with inferior ones.
Same here. His strategy when he arrived was to invest in quality players in order to be successful in the league. He did that and got results to some extent.
I don't buy that its all nasty Mr O'neills fault. Randy knew the transfer fees and also the wages that went with them.
What did happen was that new owners arrived, also armed with shit loads of cash and he didn't want to waste more money.
Now Randy wants us to be self-sufficient. I'd have bought that if it was his initial strategy.
He's not trying to do it for the good of the fans, he's stream lining for a sale.
Hope it works.
Unfortunately for us, Man City came along and we are arguably the club that has suffered most from that. We were already aiming to sneak into 4th with Man Utd, Chelsea and Arsenal out of sight. When citee came into the money, they took our 2 best players and the 3 Champs League closed shop became 4 meaning that without further even bigger investment we weren't going to make it to the promised land of the Champs League.
If I was in Lerners shoes, I would have done the same with respect to cutting down on investment. The ship sailed and we missed it. As painful as it is now, I don't think there is any real alternative. Either start again and build from the bottom ala Everton or, possibly make the club sellable and attract someone with serious money who will fund a punt on the Champs League.
Spot on in my view mate.
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So how would we feel if an unknown Chinese consortium became owners?
The next major purchaser of a PL club is most likely to be Chinese, probably linked to a Major Chinese corporation.
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Whilst Randy is not everyone's cup of tea you only have to look at Leeds and Cardiff to realise there are much worse owners out there. Better the devil you know.
No thanks, I'd rather take a chance with someone else rather stick with a man that has sold nearly every decent player at the club and replaced them with inferior ones.
Same here. His strategy when he arrived was to invest in quality players in order to be successful in the league. He did that and got results to some extent.
I don't buy that its all nasty Mr O'neills fault. Randy knew the transfer fees and also the wages that went with them.
What did happen was that new owners arrived, also armed with shit loads of cash and he didn't want to waste more money.
Now Randy wants us to be self-sufficient. I'd have bought that if it was his initial strategy.He's not trying to do it for the good of the fans, he's stream lining for a sale.
Hope it works.
I think it was, but that self sufficiency was intended to be based on CL money, which never happened. That is now harder than ever to get hold of, so our self sufficiency needs to come at a lower level and then grow more organically to have another go at it.
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So how would we feel if an unknown Chinese consortium became owners?
The next major purchaser of a PL club is most likely to be Chinese, probably linked to a Major Chinese corporation.
Speaking for myself, I have no issue wioth Chinese owners, Chinese consortiums or Chinese corporations. However, I do have an issue with the 'unknown' bit. If they're above board with noble intentions, they wouldn't need anonymity.
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I would hope whoever took over the club would do so with the finance and aim to compete at the very highest level wherever they are from.
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Maybe Brand Beckham would be interested ?
Install Sven as manager. Job done.
Can't see the allure of Florida over Aston myself. ::)
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the worst possible scenario is that PF was telling the truth; Randy isn't gearing up to sell, and it's business as has been usual, for the past four years.
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Was on talk sport at about 4pm that aston villa had denied rumours that randy Lerner was looking to sell.
No smoke without fire
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there is a big difference in someone coming along and offering Randy a load of money for the club and Randy actually putting the club up for sale
I don't believe for one minute Randy has put the club up for sale or is even actively looking to sell, PF has said as much and I believe him, that doesn't mean he wouldnt if he got a massive offer,
but lets face it that's highly unlikely
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Whether it is in Randy's mind to sell or not and my opinion is that it is - the more it gets talked about the more Villa will flag up on the radar of the mega wealthy world wide as a possible take over target and the thing will gather its own momentum. As for the chinese connection my business partner and I had a small bit of business going with them last year selling them a horse to race in Hong Kong and we found them less concerned with the asking price than the quality of what they were paying for. I would expect a potential chinese buyer for Villa to find the club clean, straight, honourable and buyable.
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Isn't what is happening exactly what supporters of the American team he owns said would happen? I'm sure they implied he would lose interest sooner or later.
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I wish I was young again when I didn't give two hoots about who the chairman or the owner was. I remember being on the Holte one night joining in with "we won the league we won the cup then Ronnie Bendall f***ed it up" then not spending any time seriously thinking about it
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Tomorrow's Mirror are saying that Lerner is NOT looking to sell the club but is looking for new fund raising ideas to help the club, including stadium naming rights. They also report the North Stand will be rebuilt.
He could always sell some of the shares he bought when he was billy-big-bollocks with his 100% buy-out.
Or maybe he would be a bit wary of serious investors scrutinising the management team's record.
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Why was he being a billy big bollocks?
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Why was he being a billy big bollocks?
Because he could only execute his grand plan if he had full share ownership.
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Why was he being a billy big bollocks?
everyone who had villa shares had to sell them to Randy or they would become worthless
I think that's what he's meaning
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It would be nice to know what Randy's plans are rather than what they aren't.
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It would be nice to know what Randy's plans are rather than what they aren't.
He's Mr Micawber - hoping something will turn up to release him of his debts.
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Unfortunately for us, Man City came along and we are arguably the club that has suffered most from that. We were already aiming to sneak into 4th with Man Utd, Chelsea and Arsenal out of sight. When citee came into the money, they took our 2 best players and the 3 Champs League closed shop became 4 meaning that without further even bigger investment we weren't going to make it to the promised land of the Champs League.
If I was in Lerners shoes, I would have done the same with respect to cutting down on investment. The ship sailed and we missed it. As painful as it is now, I don't think there is any real alternative. Either start again and build from the bottom ala Everton or, possibly make the club sellable and attract someone with serious money who will fund a punt on the Champs League.
For a short period, Arsenal weren't out of sight, we were ahead of them around Christmas/January 2008/09. That was the time to invest in the superstar player that could make the difference. Instead, we bought Heskey. They bought Arshavin.
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Not sure it's been mentioned already but we shouldn't forget Lerner lost a fortune back in 2007/2008 with the banking meltdown. He may have recouped some value but I doubt he's anywhere close to where he was before the crash. Only a mad man would kept throwing money at us when all around him was collapsing.
We as supporters want everything; star signings, cheap tickets, a winning team, entertaining football and above all, a cup or two. I'd imagine Lerner thought he needs to regroup, get the house in order and build from a solid base rather than trying to buy success. A key factor to making the club financially strong and bringing in additional revenue is filling Villa Park, yet I'm struggling to remember a game where we've sold out or where those wonderful corporate seats in the Trinity have been filled.
Right now it looks like we're just about treading water, just enough not to get relegated but not enough to make a splash in the top half of the table. We're the best of the relegation group and despite being 10th, it's hardly the kind of position to be that will attract potential new owners, nevermind top players. For now we are what we are, just like most - making up the numbers.
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Not sure it's been mentioned already but we shouldn't forget Lerner lost a fortune back in 2007/2008 with the banking meltdown. He may have recouped some value but I doubt he's anywhere close to where he was before the crash. Only a mad man would kept throwing money at us when all around him was collapsing.
We as supporters want everything; star signings, cheap tickets, a winning team, entertaining football and above all, a cup or two. I'd imagine Lerner thought he needs to regroup, get the house in order and build from a solid base rather than trying to buy success. A key factor to making the club financially strong and bringing in additional revenue is filling Villa Park, yet I'm struggling to remember a game where we've sold out or where those wonderful corporate seats in the Trinity have been filled.
Right now it looks like we're just about treading water, just enough not to get relegated but not enough to make a splash in the top half of the table. We're the best of the relegation group and despite being 10th, it's hardly the kind of position to be that will attract potential new owners, nevermind top players. For now we are what we are, just like most - making up the numbers.
Do we know how much he sold the browns for?
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But you can't say we didn't spend money - I bet we paid Heskey not much a dissimilar wage to that Arsenal paid to Arshavin.
It's Martin O'Neill. It was always Martin O'Neill. For all his good points, it was he who was entrusted with large amounts of money to establish us in the top tier of football, and he pissed it away on inadequate plodders and played the most retrograde, consciously, brutishly stupid football anyone in his position could possibly have played.
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But you can't say we didn't spend money - I bet we paid Heskey not much a dissimilar wage to that Arsenal paid to Arshavin.
It's Martin O'Neill. It was always Martin O'Neill. For all his good points, it was he who was entrusted with large amounts of money to establish us in the top tier of football, and he pissed it away on inadequate plodders and played the most retrograde, consciously, brutishly stupid football anyone in his position could possibly have played.
I think its harsh to blame it all on mon - I think there lies differing portions of blame with faulkner, lerner, o Neill, houllier, Mcleish as well as a lot of players who were happy to take the cash and not deliver the goods.
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But you can't say we didn't spend money - I bet we paid Heskey not much a dissimilar wage to that Arsenal paid to Arshavin.
It's Martin O'Neill. It was always Martin O'Neill. For all his good points, it was he who was entrusted with large amounts of money to establish us in the top tier of football, and he pissed it away on inadequate plodders and played the most retrograde, consciously, brutishly stupid football anyone in his position could possibly have played.
I think its harsh to blame it all on mon - I think there lies differing portions of blame with faulkner, lerner, o Neill, houllier, Mcleish as well as a lot of players who were happy to take the cash and not deliver the goods.
Of course, a lot of subsequent chaos hasn't been literally his doing, but that team of arseholes he assembled, spending all the money that we had, that's unforgivable.
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But you can't say we didn't spend money - I bet we paid Heskey not much a dissimilar wage to that Arsenal paid to Arshavin.
It's Martin O'Neill. It was always Martin O'Neill. For all his good points, it was he who was entrusted with large amounts of money to establish us in the top tier of football, and he pissed it away on inadequate plodders and played the most retrograde, consciously, brutishly stupid football anyone in his position could possibly have played.
This will inevitably start the old arguments but I do find it strange that O'Neill's getting shit yet he was the last manager who had us anywhere near being a half decent side on the pitch.
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But you can't say we didn't spend money - I bet we paid Heskey not much a dissimilar wage to that Arsenal paid to Arshavin.
It's Martin O'Neill. It was always Martin O'Neill. For all his good points, it was he who was entrusted with large amounts of money to establish us in the top tier of football, and he pissed it away on inadequate plodders and played the most retrograde, consciously, brutishly stupid football anyone in his position could possibly have played.
This will inevitably start the old arguments but I do find it strange that O'Neill's getting shit yet he was the last manager who had us anywhere near being a half decent side on the pitch.
With loads and loads of money, though. He did quite well, but look at what another manager who didn't think that it was perfectly acceptable for a side with Champions' League ambitions to do practically everything as if it were the 70s: long balls, not much training, playing the same team every week, rock-rigid 4-4-2, exclusively British players - you could go on and on. MON was inadequate in every area of football except motivating his inner clique to get fired up once a week - charismatic, sure, but in the end well short of good enough for the top level we were supposed to want to get into, and was never going to be good enough.
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Out of interest then, how have Cleveland fared (in comparison) since Randy fucked them off.
I'd look it up myself but I'm not sure whether getting more 'downs' is an improvement or not.
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But you can't say we didn't spend money - I bet we paid Heskey not much a dissimilar wage to that Arsenal paid to Arshavin.
It's Martin O'Neill. It was always Martin O'Neill. For all his good points, it was he who was entrusted with large amounts of money to establish us in the top tier of football, and he pissed it away on inadequate plodders and played the most retrograde, consciously, brutishly stupid football anyone in his position could possibly have played.
This will inevitably start the old arguments but I do find it strange that O'Neill's getting shit yet he was the last manager who had us anywhere near being a half decent side on the pitch.
That's the problem though, MON made a team with a short shelf life, and then took his ball and left when it started to go a bit rotten. Spending the amounts he did on players who were 28+ wasn't going to be sustainable, and he gave them all big enough contracts that they were never going to be easy to get rid of. I do wonder how he'd have handled that if he had made the top 4, I can only assume he thought he'd be able to buy a whole new squad and leave that lot sitting on the bench.
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Yes Martin O'Neill was arrogant enough to believe not only was he the manager he was in full charge of the club in every respect.
The club owner let it go on far too long. He was well meaning but naive in the extreme and was taught a harsh lesson.
But if MON had bought Darren Bent instead of Heskey we could have made the promised land of top European competition.
He didn't and we didn't .
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Those are all valid criticisms of him and the failure to make the champions league is a mark against him but we've been pretty much useless on the pitch since he left and I don't see how it's fair to blame him for that. When he was actually at the club we were better.
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I do wonder how he'd have handled that if he had made the top 4, I can only assume he thought he'd be able to buy a whole new squad and leave that lot sitting on the bench.
Ha! One thing's for sure, we'd have been knocked out in the first round of the Champions League qualifier. His football was from the Dark Ages.
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But MON had two rocket boosters behind him namely Randy's money and the departure of Doug Ellis. I have thought a lot about this - just like you have - and I have concluded that any competent manager from those available when Lerner bought the club would have done at least as well as O'Neill and probably better. Three sixth place finishes was, in my opinion, a poor return for the once in a lifetime uplift the club experienced when Randy Lerner came.
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Those are all valid criticisms of him and the failure to make the champions league is a mark against him but we've been pretty much useless on the pitch since he left and I don't see how it's fair to blame him for that. When he was actually at the club we were better.
He achieved 3 top 6 finishes and got us to a cup final but given the situation at the time and the money at his disposal he underachieved in my view .
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People always say that about Darren Bent, but we actually didn't create enough chances to justify needing an extra finisher. We didn't need another striker that window, we needed a creative midfielder as we always have done, but MON wanted to revert to 4-4-2 from the 4-3-3 which was actually working well because...you know...4-4-2. It was screamworthy.
Those are all valid criticisms of him and the failure to make the champions league is a mark against him but we've been pretty much useless on the pitch since he left and I don't see how it's fair to blame him for that. When he was actually at the club we were better.
Because he had all the money to spend! Almost any manager in the top two divisions could have got somewhere with that cash. A lot of the players he signed have been useless since he left because he bought them when they were at or just over their peak on big wages and long contracts, and we couldn't shift the now useless (and, in the bargain, thuggish, unprofessional and arseholeish) wage-drains we had hanging around the club and lost even more money. He was an inadequate scheister who got found out.
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But MON had two rocket boosters behind him namely Randy's money and the departure of Doug Ellis. I have thought a lot about this - just like you have - and I have concluded that any competent manager from those available when Lerner bought the club would have done at least as well as O'Neill and probably better. Three sixth place finishes was, in my opinion, a poor return for the once in a lifetime uplift the club experienced when Randy Lerner came.
I agree totally, he spent a lot of money in his last 2 summers (not counting the one where he flounced off) with a net spend of £65m. Even with the Crazy Man City money now I'd expect that kind of spending, on a side who had finished 6th, to do more than 2 more 6th place finishes. In truth mon can have no excuses for not making the champions league places in those seasons, the real reason for it was that he ran the team into the ground and every year we limped over the line whilst teams around us were getting stronger.
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As it stands the team that's been variously described as arseholes, thuggish and unprofessional are our last vaguely successful team. What does that make the current mob? No one knows whether any other manager would have done better, it is just guesswork to say that someone would. I don't like O'Neill for leaving when he did and his later career does suggest he'd lost it but really nearly 4 years down the line how is he still getting the blame for the dross currently on offer?
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Well, we didn't have a bottomless pit of money and he spent it all on those players. And yes - Dunne and Collins physically threatened a Villa legend, for one thing, and they and Warnock spent a lot of the GH and Eck years mouthing off at the young players whenever he messed up. Those three were a poisonous influence, for which privilege, thanks to MON, we paid six figures a week. The current mob are just cheap and trying their best. That's not to mention the money spent on the likes of Sidwell, Heskey, Harewood, Shorey, Carson, Davies, Knight. Yes he also signed good players, but they were hardly amazing finds - everyone in the league knew about Milner and Young, and he inherited Stan Petrov at Celtic, he didn't go out to find him, as he inherited Henrik Larsson, Martin Laursen and Gareth Barry. His scouting was UKIP-esque and his spending was like Mike Tyson's circa 1995.
As for guesswork, well, look at Moyes and Pardew - hardly the game's greatest thinkers but they assembled teams more cheaply than MON which played better football, had better squad depth and finished higher.
Martin O'Neill wasted the best opportunity this club had had in years, and he did so in such a spectacularly obnoxious, gratingly dislikable and flouncingly prima-donna-ish way that I can't believe he still has even one defender among Villa fans.
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Well, we didn't have a bottomless pit of money and he spent it all on those players. And yes - Dunne and Collins physically threatened a Villa legend, for one thing, and they and Warnock spent a lot of the GH and Eck years mouthing off at the young players whenever he messed up. Those three were a poisonous influence, for which privilege, thanks to MON, we paid six figures a week. The current mob are just cheap and trying their best. That's not to mention the money spent on the likes of Sidwell, Heskey, Harewood, Shorey, Carson, Davies, Knight. Yes he also signed good players, but they were hardly amazing finds - everyone in the league knew about Milner and Young, and he inherited Stan Petrov at Celtic, he didn't go out to find him, as he inherited Henrik Larsson, Martin Laursen and Gareth Barry. His scouting was UKIP-esque and his spending was like Mike Tyson's circa 1995.
As for guesswork, well, look at Moyes and Pardew - hardly the game's greatest thinkers but they assembled teams more cheaply than MON which played better football, had better squad depth and finished higher.
Martin O'Neill wasted the best opportunity this club had had in years, and he did so in such a spectacularly obnoxious, gratingly dislikable and flouncingly prima-donna-ish way that I can't believe he still has even one defender among Villa fans.
(http://watchdog.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/blogs.dir/1/files/2013/11/slow-clap-gif.gif)
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What Monty said, I don't understand how people don't see that. MON was exactly what we wanted after DOL but was also the last thing we needed.
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I feel dirty and used knowing I have to agree with the Pardew comment. Urgh.
Mind you, its been proven you can spend well over 100 million on a squad and go backwards. Take a bow Levy, take a bow son. When do we next get to compare our wages with Spurzzzzz
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You wonder if any PL club is particularly attractive to the super rich any more, by definition they are used to being top dogs, anyone with that mindset would have to invest 400m to see a team in the top 4, for those kind of folk why spend that to finish 4th, why not invest in a club in a country where you could spend a lot less and challenge, and more importantly, be adored?
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Well, we didn't have a bottomless pit of money and he spent it all on those players. And yes - Dunne and Collins physically threatened a Villa legend, for one thing, and they and Warnock spent a lot of the GH and Eck years mouthing off at the young players whenever he messed up. Those three were a poisonous influence, for which privilege, thanks to MON, we paid six figures a week. The current mob are just cheap and trying their best. That's not to mention the money spent on the likes of Sidwell, Heskey, Harewood, Shorey, Carson, Davies, Knight. Yes he also signed good players, but they were hardly amazing finds - everyone in the league knew about Milner and Young, and he inherited Stan Petrov at Celtic, he didn't go out to find him, as he inherited Henrik Larsson, Martin Laursen and Gareth Barry. His scouting was UKIP-esque and his spending was like Mike Tyson's circa 1995.
As for guesswork, well, look at Moyes and Pardew - hardly the game's greatest thinkers but they assembled teams more cheaply than MON which played better football, had better squad depth and finished higher.
Martin O'Neill wasted the best opportunity this club had had in years, and he did so in such a spectacularly obnoxious, gratingly dislikable and flouncingly prima-donna-ish way that I can't believe he still has even one defender among Villa fans.
(http://watchdog.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/blogs.dir/1/files/2013/11/slow-clap-gif.gif)
Amen to that.
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Well, we didn't have a bottomless pit of money and he spent it all on those players. And yes - Dunne and Collins physically threatened a Villa legend, for one thing, and they and Warnock spent a lot of the GH and Eck years mouthing off at the young players whenever he messed up. Those three were a poisonous influence, for which privilege, thanks to MON, we paid six figures a week. The current mob are just cheap and trying their best. That's not to mention the money spent on the likes of Sidwell, Heskey, Harewood, Shorey, Carson, Davies, Knight. Yes he also signed good players, but they were hardly amazing finds - everyone in the league knew about Milner and Young, and he inherited Stan Petrov at Celtic, he didn't go out to find him, as he inherited Henrik Larsson, Martin Laursen and Gareth Barry. His scouting was UKIP-esque and his spending was like Mike Tyson's circa 1995.
As for guesswork, well, look at Moyes and Pardew - hardly the game's greatest thinkers but they assembled teams more cheaply than MON which played better football, had better squad depth and finished higher.
Martin O'Neill wasted the best opportunity this club had had in years, and he did so in such a spectacularly obnoxious, gratingly dislikable and flouncingly prima-donna-ish way that I can't believe he still has even one defender among Villa fans.
(http://watchdog.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/blogs.dir/1/files/2013/11/slow-clap-gif.gif)
luckily he doesnt have a defender left in the squad either
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There isn't same prestige in most leagues, france and spain have their 2 big clubs each who are likely to dominate for a while now, Germany has it's own big 2, one who are already mega rich and the other who, whilst an option, don't fit with the ego boost that would be expected. That leaves Italy really and I'm not sure how attractive any of the top clubs there would be, given the associated costs. I doubt there are many sides higher up the list than us, Everton maybe, but as has been said, they share a catchment area with 3 of the 5 biggest clubs in England right now, which makes them a tough sell to anyone.
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O'Neill spent money he was given by the owner. Clearly you believe he wasted it and you're not alone. Personally I don't think it's a given another manager would have done any better. The decision not to give subsequent managers a similar level of cash is Lerner's. I would therefore apportion the blame for that decision, if you believe it to be a poor one, to that same person rather than someone's who's not even at the club.
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O'Neill spent money he was given by the owner. Clearly you believe he wasted it and you're not alone. Personally I don't think it's a given another manager would have done any better. The decision not to give subsequent managers a similar level of cash is Lerner's. I would therefore apportion the blame for that decision, if you believe it to be a poor one, to that same person rather than someone's who's not even at the club.
Do you think he spent the money well and left a club in a better state than he found it?
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Oh, Lerner made and continues to make stupid decisions. Appointing McLeish was pretty amazingly stupid. The thing is though that Lerner seems well-intentioned even at his worst - MON was all about himself, and failed in a snarky, arrogant way.
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Personally I don't think it's a given another manager would have done any better.
Following the same logic, I assume you think it's a given another manager wouldn't have done worse?
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Mon`s stock has well and truly fallen following his fall from grace at Sunderland - I don`t watch too much TV these days so I do not know if his smug face still gets aired as a so called pundit. All his cronies at the BBC - Lineker, Hansen et al put him on a pedestal for so long - I wonder if they still hold him in such esteem now that his style of management has been sussed as "dated".
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His scouting was UKIP-esque..
Ten minutes later and I'm still sniggering away like Mutley. Thanks, Monty.
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I would add Monty that he compounded all of the damage by turning his departure into a premeditated strike against the club which had given him so much. So much money, so much power and so much freedom.
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Tomorrow, I'll be plagiarising that.
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I would add Monty that he compounded all of the damage by turning his departure into a premeditated strike against the club which had given him so much. So much money, so much power and so much freedom.
Doing what he did 5 days before the start of the season was a disgrace. Pre-meditated and totally out of order. I'll never forgive him for that.
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Personally I don't think it's a given another manager would have done any better.
Following the same logic, I assume you think it's a given another manager wouldn't have done worse?
I think no-one knows what would have happened with another manager, better or worse. To read some opinions on here you'd think we were a shoe-in for the top 4 and O'Neill blew it. I don't think that's necessarily the case. Yes another manager might have done better but it's not guaranteed.
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He knew he was bust, hence the reason for chucking the toys out when he wasn't given a few more million. Like a gambler asking for one more spin...
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O'Neill spent money he was given by the owner. Clearly you believe he wasted it and you're not alone. Personally I don't think it's a given another manager would have done any better. The decision not to give subsequent managers a similar level of cash is Lerner's. I would therefore apportion the blame for that decision, if you believe it to be a poor one, to that same person rather than someone's who's not even at the club.
Do you think he spent the money well and left a club in a better state than he found it?
He could have spent the money better no doubt. I think he did leave the club in a better state he found it. We were 16th under O'Leary before he came. We were 6th and had reached a cup final when he left.
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No, Moyes left his club in a stronger state than he found it. Our subsequent crises and stagnations following his departure suggests that MON left the club pretty much exactly as he found it.
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I cannot think of any football manager past or present who has ever done anything as damaging to his club as walking out without warning five days before the start of a season. That was pure unadulterated spite.
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I cannot think of any football manager past or present who has ever done anything as damaging to his club as walking out without warning five days before the start of a season. That was pure unadulterated spite.
Calculated and pre-meditated aswell.
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No, Moyes left his club in a stronger state than he found it. Our subsequent crises and stagnations following his departure suggests that MON left the club pretty much exactly as he found it.
Exactly, add in that he spent over £100m achieving that as well and you get a manager who failed to achieve what he should have given the resources and managed to salt the field on the way out.
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I cannot think of any football manager past or present who has ever done anything as damaging to his club as walking out without warning five days before the start of a season. That was pure unadulterated spite.
Calculated and pre-meditated aswell.
Dont forget Moscow
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I think Moyes needs to cash in on that right now, I dont think his credit is rising at the moment. "Moyes...better than ONeill"
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I cannot think of any football manager past or present who has ever done anything as damaging to his club as walking out without warning five days before the start of a season. That was pure unadulterated spite.
Calculated and pre-meditated aswell.
Dont forget Moscow
That was the beginning of the end.
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MON left us in a worse position, before he became manager our wages were under control Doug made sure of that, when he left our wages were unsustainable with several players on the books we couldn't get rid of because
no other club would be stupid enough to pay them what MON did. The guy is all about himself and he has been foud out at last, i doubt he will ever manage a premiership side again.
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Moyes is on Mission Impossible. When Busby retired it was just the same' he would not give his successor the privilege of the focus of attention. He was always casting his shadow across the team. Two things Yanited need to do which would take courage they don't have. Tell Ferguson and Charlton to play golf on match days and get rid of Rooney. Sorry, off thread. It was the implication that Moyes is no better than MON.
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Well, we didn't have a bottomless pit of money and he spent it all on those players. And yes - Dunne and Collins physically threatened a Villa legend, for one thing, and they and Warnock spent a lot of the GH and Eck years mouthing off at the young players whenever he messed up. Those three were a poisonous influence, for which privilege, thanks to MON, we paid six figures a week. The current mob are just cheap and trying their best. That's not to mention the money spent on the likes of Sidwell, Heskey, Harewood, Shorey, Carson, Davies, Knight. Yes he also signed good players, but they were hardly amazing finds - everyone in the league knew about Milner and Young, and he inherited Stan Petrov at Celtic, he didn't go out to find him, as he inherited Henrik Larsson, Martin Laursen and Gareth Barry. His scouting was UKIP-esque and his spending was like Mike Tyson's circa 1995.
As for guesswork, well, look at Moyes and Pardew - hardly the game's greatest thinkers but they assembled teams more cheaply than MON which played better football, had better squad depth and finished higher.
Martin O'Neill wasted the best opportunity this club had had in years, and he did so in such a spectacularly obnoxious, gratingly dislikable and flouncingly prima-donna-ish way that I can't believe he still has even one defender among Villa fans.
Spot on Monty.
Yes,we finished 6th under MON.
Yes we spent like a big club in those first few years.
Yes it was exciting, even exhilarating at the time, but.......
As others have said, we could have achieved the same on far less money. Why the hell we needed so many expensive non playing squad members, when baring injury, if you were one of the favoured 11, your job was safer than a bank director in the early 2000s.
The one thing that's been missing from day 1, has been someone with oversight of the squad and managing the value of these assets, because that is precisely what a player registration is, an asset that is dropping in value from day 1of the contract. Unfortunately that's something that MONs ego would never have accepted.
With regards to the funding, I may be mistaken, but I'm sure I remember reading that funding wasn't from Randy's personal fortune, but from the Lerner family trust, in which case it's not solely Randy who's making the decisions.
I'm convinced that the plan (somewhat naively) was to qualify for the Champions League within 4 to 5 years by investing in the 1st team squad.
When it became apparent that this wasn't going to happen with MON they didn't know what to do.
That particular problem solved itself, but created a new one. I know he wasn't popular at the time, but I think that Houllier was a pretty good shout at the time. And although he never really "got us", he had the right idea and had identified the bad eggs in the squad pretty quickly. The same bad eggs that we have spent 3 years cleaning out.
It's with the exit of Houllier, that I think it really went to ratshit, with the decision that will never be understood.
Again the lack of oversight of the management of the squad showed itself, with the drastic change of direction to a manager whose "style" was completely inappropriate for the squad that was in place.
The constant changes of managers and style have had the inevitable effect on performance, and with each fall in performance, came further retrenchment as the desire to get the wages down to a percentage of turnover, until you end where we are today.
I said under McLeish, that the problem was, that as performances fall, so does the income, which leads to further cuts in wages, which results in poorer performances etc. Repeat until relegated, unless you can find someone who can get a group of lower quality players to over perform,which is pretty much where we are now.
The truly interesting point will come if we do finish 10-12th, if that will induce an increase in spending again.
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I cannot think of any football manager past or present who has ever done anything as damaging to his club as walking out without warning five days before the start of a season. That was pure unadulterated spite.
Calculated and pre-meditated aswell.
Dont forget Moscow
That was the beginning of the end.
The meal still makes me laugh though.
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I'm still amazed our income has dropped despite the massive increase in TV revenue.
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The TV money won't appear on balance sheets until the April accounts.
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It is off the thread, but people judging how Everton was left by Moyes are seeing them as now. And their two most influential players according to my ST holding mates are Barry and Lukaku. I dont think Moyes's team with no changes would be anywhere near as high up the league as the Martinez version. But Moyes is better than ONeill, granted.
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I cannot think of any football manager past or present who has ever done anything as damaging to his club as walking out without warning five days before the start of a season. That was pure unadulterated spite.
Calculated and pre-meditated aswell.
Dont forget Moscow
That was the beginning of the end.
The meal still makes me laugh though.
O'Neill was a twat that night as well.
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Told my mate Terry to shut up. Wanker.
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Cockweasel.
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Just voted no in the poll, as there is the high risk of a name change and kit colour change and that's a huge no for me. If there was some kind of guarantee they wouldn't fuck withe name or the colours, then I'd say yes.
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Well, we didn't have a bottomless pit of money and he spent it all on those players. And yes - Dunne and Collins physically threatened a Villa legend, for one thing, and they and Warnock spent a lot of the GH and Eck years mouthing off at the young players whenever he messed up. Those three were a poisonous influence, for which privilege, thanks to MON, we paid six figures a week. The current mob are just cheap and trying their best. That's not to mention the money spent on the likes of Sidwell, Heskey, Harewood, Shorey, Carson, Davies, Knight. Yes he also signed good players, but they were hardly amazing finds - everyone in the league knew about Milner and Young, and he inherited Stan Petrov at Celtic, he didn't go out to find him, as he inherited Henrik Larsson, Martin Laursen and Gareth Barry. His scouting was UKIP-esque and his spending was like Mike Tyson's circa 1995.
As for guesswork, well, look at Moyes and Pardew - hardly the game's greatest thinkers but they assembled teams more cheaply than MON which played better football, had better squad depth and finished higher.
Martin O'Neill wasted the best opportunity this club had had in years, and he did so in such a spectacularly obnoxious, gratingly dislikable and flouncingly prima-donna-ish way that I can't believe he still has even one defender among Villa fans.
I'm welling up here.
Spot on.
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Well, we didn't have a bottomless pit of money and he spent it all on those players. And yes - Dunne and Collins physically threatened a Villa legend, for one thing, and they and Warnock spent a lot of the GH and Eck years mouthing off at the young players whenever he messed up. Those three were a poisonous influence, for which privilege, thanks to MON, we paid six figures a week. The current mob are just cheap and trying their best. That's not to mention the money spent on the likes of Sidwell, Heskey, Harewood, Shorey, Carson, Davies, Knight. Yes he also signed good players, but they were hardly amazing finds - everyone in the league knew about Milner and Young, and he inherited Stan Petrov at Celtic, he didn't go out to find him, as he inherited Henrik Larsson, Martin Laursen and Gareth Barry. His scouting was UKIP-esque and his spending was like Mike Tyson's circa 1995.
As for guesswork, well, look at Moyes and Pardew - hardly the game's greatest thinkers but they assembled teams more cheaply than MON which played better football, had better squad depth and finished higher.
Martin O'Neill wasted the best opportunity this club had had in years, and he did so in such a spectacularly obnoxious, gratingly dislikable and flouncingly prima-donna-ish way that I can't believe he still has even one defender among Villa fans.
Spot on.
Brilliantly summed up.
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As it stands the team that's been variously described as arseholes, thuggish and unprofessional are our last vaguely successful team. What does that make the current mob? No one knows whether any other manager would have done better, it is just guesswork to say that someone would. I don't like O'Neill for leaving when he did and his later career does suggest he'd lost it but really nearly 4 years down the line how is he still getting the blame for the dross currently on offer?
because we are still suffering from his overspend and the non-sustainable squad that he left behind. We have limped along for a couple of seasons since he left and then gone right the way back to basics, rebuilding the entire squad. That's why we are where we are, it's a long road back and I would say we have probably got at least another season of this before we can start considering ourselves as being away from the relegation group and into the group that is solidly in the top half and in with a chance of contesting the uefa places, ie 6-9
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Martin O'Neill wasted the best opportunity this club had had in years, and he did so in such a spectacularly obnoxious, gratingly dislikable and flouncingly prima-donna-ish way that I can't believe he still has even one defender among Villa fans.
apart from that he was ok tho :-)
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IKN ?
Well done for picking up on my typo, really impressive :)
didn't know it was a typo, thought it was a new thing with a meaning
that's why I asked so I could be up to date with the in crowd,
If you want too be up with the in crowd FFS son't copy me...
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Those are all valid criticisms of him and the failure to make the champions league is a mark against him but we've been pretty much useless on the pitch since he left and I don't see how it's fair to blame him for that. When he was actually at the club we were better.
He achieved 3 top 6 finishes and got us to a cup final but given the situation at the time and the money at his disposal he underachieved in my view .
We would have been better off keeping DoL :)
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Martin O'Neill wasted the best opportunity this club had had in years, and he did so in such a spectacularly obnoxious, gratingly dislikable and flouncingly prima-donna-ish way that I can't believe he still has even one defender among Villa fans.
apart from that he was ok tho :-)
Yep. Apart from the fact that he got us 3 consecutive top 6 finishes.
Now we're perennial relegation strugglers.
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Martin O'Neill wasted the best opportunity this club had had in years, and he did so in such a spectacularly obnoxious, gratingly dislikable and flouncingly prima-donna-ish way that I can't believe he still has even one defender among Villa fans.
apart from that he was ok tho :-)
Yep. Apart from the fact that he got us 3 consecutive top 6 finishes.
Now we're perennial relegation strugglers.
Although let's not forget, if we're "perennial" relegation strugglers, based on the three and a bit seasons since he flounced out, then a good deal of that is down to the state he had to get us into to finish top six in the first place.
I'm aware that that fades with every year that passes, as finances improve a bit, but even so, if you're classing the last three years as "perennial" you can't ignore his "contribution" to it.
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There isn't same prestige in most leagues, france and spain have their 2 big clubs each who are likely to dominate for a while now, Germany has it's own big 2, one who are already mega rich and the other who, whilst an option, don't fit with the ego boost that would be expected. That leaves Italy really and I'm not sure how attractive any of the top clubs there would be, given the associated costs. I doubt there are many sides higher up the list than us, Everton maybe, but as has been said, they share a catchment area with 3 of the 5 biggest clubs in England right now, which makes them a tough sell to anyone.
I would say that Newcastle and West Ham are probably as attractive to buyers as us, Newcastle because of the ground and big crowds, West Ham because of being in London and having a shiny new prestigious ground being bestowed upon them
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There isn't same prestige in most leagues, france and spain have their 2 big clubs each who are likely to dominate for a while now, Germany has it's own big 2, one who are already mega rich and the other who, whilst an option, don't fit with the ego boost that would be expected. That leaves Italy really and I'm not sure how attractive any of the top clubs there would be, given the associated costs. I doubt there are many sides higher up the list than us, Everton maybe, but as has been said, they share a catchment area with 3 of the 5 biggest clubs in England right now, which makes them a tough sell to anyone.
I would say that Newcastle and West Ham are probably as attractive to buyers as us, Newcastle because of the ground and big crowds, West Ham because of being in London and having a shiny new prestigious ground being bestowed upon them
And owners that would sell each other for the right price.
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There isn't same prestige in most leagues, france and spain have their 2 big clubs each who are likely to dominate for a while now, Germany has it's own big 2, one who are already mega rich and the other who, whilst an option, don't fit with the ego boost that would be expected. That leaves Italy really and I'm not sure how attractive any of the top clubs there would be, given the associated costs. I doubt there are many sides higher up the list than us, Everton maybe, but as has been said, they share a catchment area with 3 of the 5 biggest clubs in England right now, which makes them a tough sell to anyone.
I would say that Newcastle and West Ham are probably as attractive to buyers as us, Newcastle because of the ground and big crowds, West Ham because of being in London and having a shiny new prestigious ground being bestowed upon them
They're both close I guess but Newcastle were available previously and he totally overvalued them (the rumour I remember seeing was that the asking price was £200m after we relegated them). West ham, similar to Everton, have potential but the catchment isn't that great. Locals will generally have a club already and newcomers to London will either bring a club with them or will plump for Arsenal, Chelsea or Spurs first. I think the first season at the Olympic Stadium will be enlightening but I really wouldn't be surprised if they're playing to a half empty ground pretty regularly. Now clearly new owners and big spending would address that but I don't know if it's such a big deal as we might think.
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Disagree with the statement about east London locals - West Ham fans tend to view their support of the team as a visible badge of what it means to be from east London. Their support, and that identity, stretches right out to the hinterlands of Essex and Kent, too. They have a strong support base and could surprise a few people when they have a big, free stadium. The potential is there.
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Disagree with the statement about east London locals - West Ham fans tend to view their support of the team as a visible badge of what it means to be from east London. Their support, and that identity, stretches right out to the hinterlands of Essex and Kent, too. They have a strong support base and could surprise a few people when they have a big, free stadium. The potential is there.
Totally agree. West Ham are like us in that their traditional fanbase has moved away from the ground, but unlike ours they've retained their sense of roots; all that Ronnie & Reggie, spirit of the blitz, knees up muvver Brahn stuff. Never underestimate the tourist influence either. Selling the chance to go to London, and watch the Premier League at the Olympic Stadium - it's a travel agent's dream.
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I cannot think of any football manager past or present who has ever done anything as damaging to his club as walking out without warning five days before the start of a season. That was pure unadulterated spite.
maximum damage to the club and maximum media effect for him.....the odious toad.
UTV
The Doc
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It pisses me off the number of times I see people wearing Claret & Blue here, only to discover that it is West Ham.
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It pisses me off the number of times I see people wearing Claret & Blue here, only to discover that it is West Ham.
I have a theory on that, and you know what I think the biggest influence for West Ham is on the continent (and particularly Italy for some reason)?
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I cannot think of any football manager past or present who has ever done anything as damaging to his club as walking out without warning five days before the start of a season. That was pure unadulterated spite.
Not so sure it was pre- planned , more than likely something happened to top him over the edge and he'd had enough - he said at the time something like they no longer shared the same vision for the club - one day he may reveal what actually happened .
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It pisses me off the number of times I see people wearing Claret & Blue here, only to discover that it is West Ham.
I have a theory on that, and you know what I think the biggest influence for West Ham is on the continent (and particularly Italy for some reason)?
Zola and di canio both have west ham links - may have picked up a few followers as a result.
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It pisses me off the number of times I see people wearing Claret & Blue here, only to discover that it is West Ham.
I have a theory on that, and you know what I think the biggest influence for West Ham is on the continent (and particularly Italy for some reason)?
Go on, Dave. Let's hear it!
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It pisses me off the number of times I see people wearing Claret & Blue here, only to discover that it is West Ham.
It always pissed me off as a kid when I got a birthday card from my mum or aunt to find Billy Bonds or Alvin Martin on the front.
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Hooliganism?
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It pisses me off the number of times I see people wearing Claret & Blue here, only to discover that it is West Ham.
I have a theory on that, and you know what I think the biggest influence for West Ham is on the continent (and particularly Italy for some reason)?
Go on, Dave. Let's hear it!
The Cockney Rejects. Loads of wannabe hooligans/skinheads/lads love all that East End violence mythology bollocks. I've worked at big punk gigs where about 90% of the skins have been foreign.
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It pisses me off the number of times I see people wearing Claret & Blue here, only to discover that it is West Ham.
It always pissed me off as a kid when I got a birthday card from my mum or aunt to find Billy Bonds or Alvin Martin on the front.
Ha ha! Or Geoff Pike!
That happened a lot!
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It pisses me off the number of times I see people wearing Claret & Blue here, only to discover that it is West Ham.
I have a theory on that, and you know what I think the biggest influence for West Ham is on the continent (and particularly Italy for some reason)?
Go on, Dave. Let's hear it!
The Cockney Rejects. Loads of wannabe hooligans/skinheads/lads love all that East End violence mythology bollocks. I've worked at big punk gigs where about 90% of the skins have been foreign.
Very interesting, Dave.
I see a lot of lads wearing the colours who would be too young to have been influenced by that, but I can well imagine their dad's being into it.
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It pisses me off the number of times I see people wearing Claret & Blue here, only to discover that it is West Ham.
I have a theory on that, and you know what I think the biggest influence for West Ham is on the continent (and particularly Italy for some reason)?
Go on, Dave. Let's hear it!
The Cockney Rejects. Loads of wannabe hooligans/skinheads/lads love all that East End violence mythology bollocks. I've worked at big punk gigs where about 90% of the skins have been foreign.
Very interesting, Dave.
I see a lot of lads wearing the colours who would be too young to have been influenced by that, but I can well imagine their dad's being into it.
Too young? They play bigger gigs now than they ever did.
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It pisses me off the number of times I see people wearing Claret & Blue here, only to discover that it is West Ham.
I have a theory on that, and you know what I think the biggest influence for West Ham is on the continent (and particularly Italy for some reason)?
Go on, Dave. Let's hear it!
The Cockney Rejects. Loads of wannabe hooligans/skinheads/lads love all that East End violence mythology bollocks. I've worked at big punk gigs where about 90% of the skins have been foreign.
Very interesting, Dave.
I see a lot of lads wearing the colours who would be too young to have been influenced by that, but I can well imagine their dad's being into it.
Too young? They play bigger gigs now than they ever did.
You'll have to forgive my ignorance, Dave. I've not lived in the UK for 13 years now, so have these big cultural voids in some areas.
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Slight aside.
I went to see Blur play in Milan once. Years ago, 97 or so. Was surprised how many Italian kids in the audience dressed in skinhead gear. They'd clearly only heard the earlier albums. Certainly not that one where they turned into Pavement, anyway.
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I hope this doesn't come across as ignorance, but a lot of young foreigners, especially Italians for some reason, seem to love to ape British culture, and the most extreme versions of this are violence, which to them means skinheads, which means the Rejects.
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What's the Italian for "I like punk and I like Sham I got nicked over West Ham"?
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What's the Italian for "I like punk and I like Sham I got nicked over West Ham"?
Mi piace il punk e mi piace Sham avuto scalfito nel West Ham
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That kind of thing was rife at the Spartak Moscow game I went to at the Luzhniki in Moscow. Loads of Lonsdale-wearing wannabe Russian hoolies saying "Oright mite!"
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What's the Italian for "I like punk and I like Sham I got nicked over West Ham"?
'Mi piace il punk e mi piacciono gli Sham e mi hanno arrestato làggiu a West Ham'
You need to pronounce 'punk' as 'pank'.
You weren't too far off, Dave!
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Didn't jimmy Pursey receive a police caution for indecent assault on a young girl? And does he still live in Stourbridge? my mate is a postman and he once delivered an ironing board to Pursey. Rock and roll
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...I'm still reeling from Dave Woodhall "totally agreeing" with one of my posts.
A proud first for Glenn Peen.
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What's the Italian for "I like punk and I like Sham I got nicked over West Ham"?
'Mi piace il punk e mi piacciono gli Sham e mi hanno arrestato làggiu a West Ham'
You need to pronounce 'punk' as 'pank'.
You weren't too far off, Dave!
Thanks, I'm singing that while trying to make the veins on my forehead bulge. The cat has left home in disgust.
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Disagree with the statement about east London locals - West Ham fans tend to view their support of the team as a visible badge of what it means to be from east London. Their support, and that identity, stretches right out to the hinterlands of Essex and Kent, too. They have a strong support base and could surprise a few people when they have a big, free stadium. The potential is there.
I'd say that West Ham's fanbase is more Essex and East Anglia, not Kent. The hordes of white-flight Millwall fans have colonised the Kentish hinterlands. Dirty barstards, dirty fackin' rotters....
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That kind of thing was rife at the Spartak Moscow game I went to at the Luzhniki in Moscow. Loads of Lonsdale-wearing wannabe Russian hoolies saying "Oright mite!"
Did you get asked for the time?
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What's the Italian for "I like punk and I like Sham I got nicked over West Ham"?
'Mi piace il punk e mi piacciono gli Sham e mi hanno arrestato làggiu a West Ham'
You need to pronounce 'punk' as 'pank'.
You weren't too far off, Dave!
Thanks, I'm singing that while trying to make the veins on my forehead bulge. The cat has left home in disgust.
No worries, Chris. I'm sure the cat will be back.
On the back of Dave's insight, I've just found a book on the history of punk in Bologna. I might well have a read and see if it meshes with his thoughts.
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What's the Italian for "I like punk and I like Sham I got nicked over West Ham"?
'Mi piace il punk e mi piacciono gli Sham e mi hanno arrestato làggiu a West Ham'
You need to pronounce 'punk' as 'pank'.
You weren't too far off, Dave!
Thanks, I'm singing that while trying to make the veins on my forehead bulge. The cat has left home in disgust.
No worries, Chris. I'm sure the cat will be back.
On the back of Dave's insight, I've just found a book on the history of punk in Bologna. I might well have a read and see if it meshes with his thoughts.
Could be different because Bologna's left-wing isn't it?
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Slight aside.
I went to see Blur play in Milan once. Years ago, 97 or so. Was surprised how many Italian kids in the audience dressed in skinhead gear. They'd clearly only heard the earlier albums. Certainly not that one where they turned into Pavement, anyway.
Were they skins or punkabbestia, Paulie?
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What's the Italian for "I like punk and I like Sham I got nicked over West Ham"?
'Mi piace il punk e mi piacciono gli Sham e mi hanno arrestato làggiu a West Ham'
You need to pronounce 'punk' as 'pank'.
You weren't too far off, Dave!
Thanks, I'm singing that while trying to make the veins on my forehead bulge. The cat has left home in disgust.
No worries, Chris. I'm sure the cat will be back.
On the back of Dave's insight, I've just found a book on the history of punk in Bologna. I might well have a read and see if it meshes with his thoughts.
Could be different because Bologna's left-wing isn't it?
Yes it is, but there is a heavy anarchist vein, which is likely a distant relation to it in some way. I'm just hypothesising though.
I'm in Pisa, which is very left wing as well, but I still see a fair amount of West Ham about.
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That kind of thing was rife at the Spartak Moscow game I went to at the Luzhniki in Moscow. Loads of Lonsdale-wearing wannabe Russian hoolies saying "Oright mite!"
Did you get asked for the time?
No, but they were very interested in my St Pauli top, in a we-will-kill-you-for-wearing-this-left-wing-shit kind of way.
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Disagree with the statement about east London locals - West Ham fans tend to view their support of the team as a visible badge of what it means to be from east London. Their support, and that identity, stretches right out to the hinterlands of Essex and Kent, too. They have a strong support base and could surprise a few people when they have a big, free stadium. The potential is there.
I'd say that West Ham's fanbase is more Essex and East Anglia, not Kent. The hordes of white-flight Millwall fans have colonised the Kentish hinterlands. Dirty barstards, dirty fackin' rotters....
loads of west 'am here in Cambridge.......should be intresting this week in the lead up to the game.
they won the world cup ya know and have THE academy that other teams especially Chelsea seem to get their youngsters off them...and Tevez loves em because he never scores against der ammerz and he makes that stupid crossed two armed/hand wanking sign that they do.....
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What's the Italian for "I like punk and I like Sham I got nicked over West Ham"?
'Mi piace il punk e mi piacciono gli Sham e mi hanno arrestato làggiu a West Ham'
You need to pronounce 'punk' as 'pank'.
You weren't too far off, Dave!
Thanks, I'm singing that while trying to make the veins on my forehead bulge. The cat has left home in disgust.
No worries, Chris. I'm sure the cat will be back.
On the back of Dave's insight, I've just found a book on the history of punk in Bologna. I might well have a read and see if it meshes with his thoughts.
Could be different because Bologna's left-wing isn't it?
Yes it is, but there is a heavy anarchist vein, which is likely a distant relation to it in some way. I'm just hypothesising though.
I'm in Pisa, which is very left wing as well, but I still see a fair amount of West Ham about.
so do you lean to the left too?
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What's the Italian for "I like punk and I like Sham I got nicked over West Ham"?
'Mi piace il punk e mi piacciono gli Sham e mi hanno arrestato làggiu a West Ham'
You need to pronounce 'punk' as 'pank'.
You weren't too far off, Dave!
Thanks, I'm singing that while trying to make the veins on my forehead bulge. The cat has left home in disgust.
No worries, Chris. I'm sure the cat will be back.
On the back of Dave's insight, I've just found a book on the history of punk in Bologna. I might well have a read and see if it meshes with his thoughts.
Could be different because Bologna's left-wing isn't it?
Yes it is, but there is a heavy anarchist vein, which is likely a distant relation to it in some way. I'm just hypothesising though.
I'm in Pisa, which is very left wing as well, but I still see a fair amount of West Ham about.
so do you lean to the left too?
Malandro, I'm in Pisa...everything leans! Including my house!
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ah well, might have worked ;)
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You don't know any Gabrielli's do you? My grandfather's family came from Italy.
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bagni di lucca
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bagni di lucca
You beat me to it!
I don't know any, no. It's not an uncommon surname though.
Bagni di Lucca is a very nice part of the world. Not far north of here, in Garfagnana.
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Ha. I'm going to try and have a holiday out there in the next year or so.
The Gabrielli's came over and ran a very successful Ice Cream company (how original!) in the north of England, eventually selling out to Wall's.
Got some great pictures.
I've also got a helluva nose from the genes!
* apologies for off topic, stop now!
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bagni di lucca
You beat me to it!
I don't know any, no. It's not an uncommon surname though.
Bagni di Lucca is a very nice part of the world. Not far north of here, in Garfagnana.
Nice place - used to visit an English friend who retired and bought a place in a village, Frazione Pallegio, just up the river from Bagni di Lucca. Sadly she is no longer with us - but think her family still own the house. Very relaxed pace of life. Friendly locals - but few spoke Inglese so it was fun trying to communicate.
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My wifes family are from Barga, are you far away?
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@MatKendrick: Above board: My take on Randy Lerner, sale rumours, no-sale statements, and The Plan for Aston Villa #avfc http://t.co/PnFC960rl8
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My wifes family are from Barga, are you far away?
Not far away, DBTW; it's not far from Bagni di Lucca either. It's also a very beautiful little town.
I have friends from Barga and normally go up there at least once a year to help with their olive and grape harvests.
Let me know if you are ever in this neck of the woods. Same to you, too, Malandro, or anyone else!
*** Sorry for going off topic! ***
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@MatKendrick: Above board: My take on Randy Lerner, sale rumours, no-sale statements, and The Plan for Aston Villa #avfc http://t.co/PnFC960rl8
Interesting to hear a substantial bid was made for a player last month far more substantial than the hoolihan bid but a deal could not be agreed .
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@MatKendrick: Above board: My take on Randy Lerner, sale rumours, no-sale statements, and The Plan for Aston Villa #avfc http://t.co/PnFC960rl8
That article for me sums up precisely why we need to see this through.
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Judging by the last few pages I am guessing we are being taken over by Italians who are going to appoint MON as manager.
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My wifes family are from Barga, are you far away?
Not far away, DBTW; it's not far from Bagni di Lucca either. It's also a very beautiful little town.
I have friends from Barga and normally go up there at least once a year to help with their olive and grape harvests.
Let me know if you are ever in this neck of the woods. Same to you, too, Malandro, or anyone else!
*** Sorry for going off topic! ***
ha, I'll send you a pm on here. cheers
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I'd always assumed that Pisa was mainly right-wing as they hate Livorno so much and Livorno are very left-wing?? Obviously not then.
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My wifes family are from Barga, are you far away?
Not far away, DBTW; it's not far from Bagni di Lucca either. It's also a very beautiful little town.
I have friends from Barga and normally go up there at least once a year to help with their olive and grape harvests.
Let me know if you are ever in this neck of the woods. Same to you, too, Malandro, or anyone else!
*** Sorry for going off topic! ***
ha, I'll send you a pm on here. cheers
Good stuff!
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My wifes family are from Barga, are you far away?
We are hoping to come over thisr year at some point, do you know of any houses with swimming pools to rent for a weekend or local hotels?
Not far away, DBTW; it's not far from Bagni di Lucca either. It's also a very beautiful little town.
I have friends from Barga and normally go up there at least once a year to help with their olive and grape harvests.
Let me know if you are ever in this neck of the woods. Same to you, too, Malandro, or anyone else!
*** Sorry for going off topic! ***
ha, I'll send you a pm on here. cheers
Good stuff!
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I'd always assumed that Pisa was mainly right-wing as they hate Livorno so much and Livorno are very left-wing?? Obviously not then.
Trust me, AD, inter-city rivalry in Italy overrides everything else.
For example, the cities surrounding Pisa have the following proverb:
'Meglio un morto in casa che un pisano all'uscio.' or 'Better a death in the family than a Pisan at the door.'
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We are hoping to come over thisr year at some point, do you know of any houses with swimming pools to rent for a weekend or local hotels?
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I'd always assumed that Pisa was mainly right-wing as they hate Livorno so much and Livorno are very left-wing?? Obviously not then.
Trust me, AD, inter-city rivalry in Italy overrides everything else.
For example, the cities surrounding Pisa have the following proverb:
'Meglio un morto in casa che un pisano all'uscio.' or 'Better a death in the family than a Pisan at the door.'
Interesting. Would you consider Torino fans to be particularly left or right-wing (or neither)?
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Is it me or has this thread gone slightly off-topic??
;-)
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'Yep. I know Rich and Sacro posted the link about this but as a Browns fan, I can confirm it. It was admitted after he sold the Browns, that they were never really "up for sale", but always listening to offers. It basically keeps Lerner in the power position to sell. If you put up a for sale sign, you won't get your desired number. If say "make a reasonable offer and I'll listen" the offers will be higher.
Everything Randy did in his final years with Cleveland, mirrors what he's done at Villa recently. Slash the wage budget (Browns had one if the lowest salary cap numbers in NFL), rebuild with youth (youngest team in NFL), and no big spending on talent.
Now the bad news: if you have any hopes that he will protect Villa in a sale, think again. He's gonna get his money. Browns were valued at $770M and he sold them for $1B. The new owner has already changed the stadium name, and would not commit to keeping the uniforms, with speculation that he will change them in 2015 when NFL liscenceing rules allow him to. To make things worse, he hired a front office to run the team who are completely incompetent. Arguments can easily be made that Browns are worse off under new owner.
My point is that Lerner didn't sell the Browns with the teams best intentions I mind. He cashed in. The tough part for me is that I don't want him here (if you can really say that he's "here"), but I'm not convinced he could sell to the right guy either. But if I had to guess, as a fan of both Villa and the Browns, I would say he's looking to sell. Faulkners denial is protection of their value. Lerner doesn't do business in public.'
This is the view of an American fan of ours and of The Browns. You may find it interesting.
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'Yep. I know Rich and Sacro posted the link about this but as a Browns fan, I can confirm it. It was admitted after he sold the Browns, that they were never really "up for sale", but always listening to offers. It basically keeps Lerner in the power position to sell. If you put up a for sale sign, you won't get your desired number. If say "make a reasonable offer and I'll listen" the offers will be higher.
Everything Randy did in his final years with Cleveland, mirrors what he's done at Villa recently. Slash the wage budget (Browns had one if the lowest salary cap numbers in NFL), rebuild with youth (youngest team in NFL), and no big spending on talent.
Now the bad news: if you have any hopes that he will protect Villa in a sale, think again. He's gonna get his money. Browns were valued at $770M and he sold them for $1B. The new owner has already changed the stadium name, and would not commit to keeping the uniforms, with speculation that he will change them in 2015 when NFL liscenceing rules allow him to. To make things worse, he hired a front office to run the team who are completely incompetent. Arguments can easily be made that Browns are worse off under new owner.
My point is that Lerner didn't sell the Browns with the teams best intentions I mind. He cashed in. The tough part for me is that I don't want him here (if you can really say that he's "here"), but I'm not convinced he could sell to the right guy either. But if I had to guess, as a fan of both Villa and the Browns, I would say he's looking to sell. Faulkners denial is protection of their value. Lerner doesn't do business in public.'
This is the view of an American fan of ours and of The Browns. You may find it interesting.
Huh. Well that's interesting. Though I'm not sure if those Browns fans know about the potential redevelopment plans or giving the manager a new three year contract.
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If he's as good at choosing new owners as he is a choosing new managers, then we'll be ******!
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'Yep. I know Rich and Sacro posted the link about this but as a Browns fan, I can confirm it. It was admitted after he sold the Browns, that they were never really "up for sale", but always listening to offers. It basically keeps Lerner in the power position to sell. If you put up a for sale sign, you won't get your desired number. If say "make a reasonable offer and I'll listen" the offers will be higher.
Everything Randy did in his final years with Cleveland, mirrors what he's done at Villa recently. Slash the wage budget (Browns had one if the lowest salary cap numbers in NFL), rebuild with youth (youngest team in NFL), and no big spending on talent.
Now the bad news: if you have any hopes that he will protect Villa in a sale, think again. He's gonna get his money. Browns were valued at $770M and he sold them for $1B. The new owner has already changed the stadium name, and would not commit to keeping the uniforms, with speculation that he will change them in 2015 when NFL liscenceing rules allow him to. To make things worse, he hired a front office to run the team who are completely incompetent. Arguments can easily be made that Browns are worse off under new owner.
My point is that Lerner didn't sell the Browns with the teams best intentions I mind. He cashed in. The tough part for me is that I don't want him here (if you can really say that he's "here"), but I'm not convinced he could sell to the right guy either. But if I had to guess, as a fan of both Villa and the Browns, I would say he's looking to sell. Faulkners denial is protection of their value. Lerner doesn't do business in public.'
This is the view of an American fan of ours and of The Browns. You may find it interesting.
I'm in Cleveland right now. I come here every month because my employer is based here. I can tell you that lots of people would want Lerner back as owner given the mess that the new one has created. So it's not the view of all Browns fans at all. Lerner wasn't a perfect owner but he did his best while here to protect the image of the Browns and hired people to make them successfu. If you know anything about the Browns they even hired as GM one of the most respected names in the game in Mike Holmgren and it didn't work. So what he sold them for a profit? Was he expected not to do so? And buying an NFL team is not as easy as a one on one transaction. It had to be approved by the NFL board of governors which is essentially all of the other owners. Let's not make this into some Lerner the cash grabber type story because it isn't.
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'Yep. I know Rich and Sacro posted the link about this but as a Browns fan, I can confirm it. It was admitted after he sold the Browns, that they were never really "up for sale", but always listening to offers. It basically keeps Lerner in the power position to sell. If you put up a for sale sign, you won't get your desired number. If say "make a reasonable offer and I'll listen" the offers will be higher.
Everything Randy did in his final years with Cleveland, mirrors what he's done at Villa recently. Slash the wage budget (Browns had one if the lowest salary cap numbers in NFL), rebuild with youth (youngest team in NFL), and no big spending on talent.
Now the bad news: if you have any hopes that he will protect Villa in a sale, think again. He's gonna get his money. Browns were valued at $770M and he sold them for $1B. The new owner has already changed the stadium name, and would not commit to keeping the uniforms, with speculation that he will change them in 2015 when NFL liscenceing rules allow him to. To make things worse, he hired a front office to run the team who are completely incompetent. Arguments can easily be made that Browns are worse off under new owner.
My point is that Lerner didn't sell the Browns with the teams best intentions I mind. He cashed in. The tough part for me is that I don't want him here (if you can really say that he's "here"), but I'm not convinced he could sell to the right guy either. But if I had to guess, as a fan of both Villa and the Browns, I would say he's looking to sell. Faulkners denial is protection of their value. Lerner doesn't do business in public.'
This is the view of an American fan of ours and of The Browns. You may find it interesting.
I'm in Cleveland right now. I come here every month because my employer is based here. I can tell you that lots of people would want Lerner back as owner given the mess that the new one has created. So it's not the view of all Browns fans at all. Lerner wasn't a perfect owner but he did his best while here to protect the image of the Browns and hired people to make them successfu. If you know anything about the Browns they even hired as GM one of the most respected names in the game in Mike Holmgren and it didn't work. So what he sold them for a profit? Was he expected not to do so? And buying an NFL team is not as easy as a one on one transaction. It had to be approved by the NFL board of governors which is essentially all of the other owners. Let's not make this into some Lerner the cash grabber type story because it isn't.
I might be reading it incorrectly, but aren't you, in large part, saying more or less the same thing that Browns fan said - ie the new owner is shit, has fucked stuff up etc etc?
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Isn't the whole "are we or are we not up for sale" argument pretty empty and pointless?
He might not be actively seeking buyers (what does that even mean?), he might be, we don't know. He genuinely might have no intention whatsoever to sell, we don't know that, either. What it comes down to, regardless, is if there is someone around with a huge amount of money and the stupid, stupid urge to spunk it on a football club.
If that person is around, then the main question they'll be considering isn't so much whether the owner of target club wants to sell, it will be whether it is the club they want to buy. If they decide that this is the club, they'll make an offer. Randy can then accept it or reject it as he wants. It's not like selling a house where you advertise your desire to sell by engaging an estate agent.
He might have no intention to actively try to sell it, and I believe them when they say he doesn't, but that's not what matters. What matters is the availability of people with sufficiently vast amounts of cash to buy the club.
"I'm not interested in selling"
"I'll give you 350m (or whatever stupid sum over the estimated value you care to mention)"
"Done"
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If that person is around, then the main question they'll be considering isn't so much whether the owner of target club wants to sell, it will be whether it is the club they want to buy. If they decide that this is the club, they'll make an offer. Randy can then accept it or reject it as he wants. It's not like selling a house where you advertise your desire to sell by engaging an estate agent.
Didn't Doug take on a Merchant bank to find a buyer for the club? That would also be what 'actively seeking buyers' would involve.
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...I'm still reeling from Dave Woodhall "totally agreeing" with one of my posts.
A proud first for Glenn Peen.
I'm still reeling from the fact that nobody turfed one out in your original post!
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If that person is around, then the main question they'll be considering isn't so much whether the owner of target club wants to sell, it will be whether it is the club they want to buy. If they decide that this is the club, they'll make an offer. Randy can then accept it or reject it as he wants. It's not like selling a house where you advertise your desire to sell by engaging an estate agent.
Didn't Doug take on a Merchant bank to find a buyer for the club? That would also be what 'actively seeking buyers' would involve.
Probably, yes, but lots of people go on to sell something without going to those lengths to make its availability clear.
Football has changed a lot in the last 8 years, I think the main test of whether Lerner is amenable to selling the club will not be whether or not he's had a word with his mate Keith Harris at Seymour Pierce, and more about how he reacts if someone offers him a sufficiently large wad of cash.
In layman's terms, what I mean is, I'm not actively looking to sell my house at the moment, I've not engaged an estate agent, not put it up for sale, or done any of the usual things which happen when trying to sell a house, but if some mentalist were to find themselves particularly taken by the mixture of soulless turn of century "architecture", lack of community, woefully insufficient parking, noisy fuckwit neighbours and distance from the town centre, and as a result offered me 50k more than it's worth, I'd turn into an active seller pretty quickly.
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There's always next time, Nodge...
Until then, keep it brown in town.
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If any of us spot that bloke with the talking green duck and that grumpy talking monkey at the Wespt Ham game, please try and take a picture and post here. Then we'll know for sure we're up for grabs.
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http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/26084726
At least we're not this lot!
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http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/26084726
At least we're not this lot!
Bloody Hell. They'd let the bastard love child of Fred West and Jeffrey Skilling pass the fit and proper person test.
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http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/26084726
At least we're not this lot!
They've been well and truly screwed over since the days of Dolly and Ridsdale, to be sure.
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In layman's terms, what I mean is, I'm not actively looking to sell my house at the moment, I've not engaged an estate agent, not put it up for sale, or done any of the usual things which happen when trying to sell a house, but if some mentalist were to find themselves particularly taken by the mixture of soulless turn of century "architecture", lack of community, woefully insufficient parking, noisy fuckwit neighbours and distance from the town centre, and as a result offered me 50k more than it's worth, I'd turn into an active seller pretty quickly.
Ain't that the truth.
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Sounds like just the place I am looking for paulie.
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If that person is around, then the main question they'll be considering isn't so much whether the owner of target club wants to sell, it will be whether it is the club they want to buy. If they decide that this is the club, they'll make an offer. Randy can then accept it or reject it as he wants. It's not like selling a house where you advertise your desire to sell by engaging an estate agent.
Didn't Doug take on a Merchant bank to find a buyer for the club? That would also be what 'actively seeking buyers' would involve.
Probably, yes, but lots of people go on to sell something without going to those lengths to make its availability clear.
Football has changed a lot in the last 8 years, I think the main test of whether Lerner is amenable to selling the club will not be whether or not he's had a word with his mate Keith Harris at Seymour Pierce, and more about how he reacts if someone offers him a sufficiently large wad of cash.
In layman's terms, what I mean is, I'm not actively looking to sell my house at the moment, I've not engaged an estate agent, not put it up for sale, or done any of the usual things which happen when trying to sell a house, but if some mentalist were to find themselves particularly taken by the mixture of soulless turn of century "architecture", lack of community, woefully insufficient parking, noisy fuckwit neighbours and distance from the town centre, and as a result offered me 50k more than it's worth, I'd turn into an active seller pretty quickly.
which is precisely why I really don't see why some are so obsessed with his interest in the club and the infatuation as to whether he is selling or not. Like anybody, if the offer is too good to turn down it generally doesn't get turned down. You might love your house, every aspect of it and your neighbours but at the end of the day if the buyer offers you something nuts you'll consider it and likely take it. Or at would at least get your attention. That goes for Randy, heck it might even go for Sheik Mansoor. If Randy really wanted to sell he would and even if he watched every minute of every game.
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Maybe telling the world that the club isn't for sale is a way of advertising that the club is for sale !
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Maybe telling the world that the club isn't for sale is a way of advertising that the club is for sale !
Subtle.
I like it.
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It's time for this to go to the world famous Conspiracy theory thread i think.
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How very peculiar:
http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/lambert-villa-lucky-lerner-6685675
Paul Lambert insists Randy Lerner’s unseen efforts more than make up for him not being a visible presence at Villa Park – and revealed the secret billionaire had attended games this season.
During a week in which Villa have made it quite clear the club is not for sale, Lambert highlighted Lerner’s commitment to the claret and blue cause. And the manager believes Villa are fortunate to have a chairman who has invested so much into the club since taking control in August 2006, even if he prefers to keep a low profile.
“He’s been to games, there’s not an issue there,” said Lambert, speaking ahead of today’s home match against West Ham.
“If you’re asking me about criticism, think about what he’s done for this club. He’s built the training ground, he’s built the stadium, he’s put a lot of money in to the club. I don’t think anyone can criticise anybody for putting in that level of money.
“He’s done so much work for this area, let alone the football club. You can go through it, you can research it, but he’s done so much for this area as well, the Acorns, everything. You can look at that. You put a lot of money into a football club and that’s what he’s done.”
The suggestion is that Lerner has been to two home games and one away game this season, using his directors box at Villa Park and often attends the stadium and Bodymoor Heath on none matchdays.
He speaks to Lambert before and after games and has daily early-morning phone calls with chief executive Paul Faulkner. Villa keep his trips to matches private for security reasons.
Lambert joked that Lerner has attended games incognito and sat alongside him in the dugout.
Asked when the American owner last attended a Villa match, he replied: “I see him. He might not sit where you think he sits.
“I’m not going to tell you (when he last came). You say the word on the street is telling you that (he doesn’t attend).
“You can’t just say the ‘word on the street’, you need the facts of that. He sits beside me in the dugout!
“I don’t think he’s ever going to broadcast it is he, if he comes to a game.”
Lambert is of the opinion that most supporters respect Lerner’s privacy.
He added: “I think Villa fans are appreciative of what they have, the stadium and everything that’s there.
“I think anyone that is going to criticise him is way off the mark. He’s a private guy which he’s totally entitled to be.
“There’s not a problem on that side of it because Paul Faulkner’s here, who does great for the club.”
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Well hopefully we won't have to read the "At least Ellis used to turn up!!!111" garbage any more.
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Well hopefully we won't have to read the "At least Ellis used to turn up!!!111" garbage any more.
I'm sure there will be plenty of other garbage to read. Thanks for getting the ball rolling...
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Bit of a strange article to say the least.
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How so?
His boss has been coming in for loads of criticism, and he's come out with an argument for the defence.
To paraphrase:
Randy's done a lot of good of the pitch, not just investing in infrastructure for the club, but also for the community around the club , Acorns being the most high profile.
Randy, contrary to popular opinion is not disinterested, and remains in close contact with both Faulkner and Lambert. Despite not being recognised at games, he has been in attendance at a few games and is regularly at the club away from match days (something that has been quoted by various players now and then)
Randy is a private guy and leaves most of the day to day stuff to Faulkner.
Nothing new, odd or contentious other than Randy occasionally turns up incognito, which isn't that outrageous for a guy who values his privacy.
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How bizzare - I have visions of a guy with grey wig on, shades and long overcoat ( a la Michael Jackson) sitting in the dug out next to Lambert !!!What a load of old bollox !!!!
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He's built the Stadium ?
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He's built the Stadium ?
Yeah, what a load of bollocks.
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Randy's hand works in mysterious ways, you can't see him but he's there really. Hmm I'm sure I've heard that argument somewhere before!
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I'm quite sure he meant he's put a lot of money into the upkeep and improvements to the stadium as opposed to literally meaning he built the stadium. But I suppose if you are trying to pick holes in everything...
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I'm quite sure he meant he's put a lot of money into the upkeep and improvements to the stadium as opposed to literally meaning he built the stadium. But I suppose if you are trying to pick holes in everything...
It would help if Lambert mumbled something a bit more specific or at least allude to when Lerner was present ... all this talk of "security" is all very
odd. It all makes it sound like Lerner is on some kind of hit list? Does he still have the use of a private jet or was that part of the Cleveland Browns package?
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It would help if people just respected the fact he likes his privacy as opposed to wishing he was Dave Whelan. I honestly believe one of the big issues is that we went from Doug to Randy with nothing in between.
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Tongue-in-cheek comments do not come over very well in newspaper articles.
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It would help if people just respected the fact he likes his privacy as opposed to wishing he was Dave Whelan. I honestly believe one of the big issues is that we went from Doug to Randy with nothing in between.
One Dave Whelan is more than enough :)
Just a few lines or a statement would suffice.
I respect anyones`s privacy however why purchase something as high profile as a Premier League club in the first place?
Dont get me wrong - I respect the guy for all the "good stuff" - Acorns, Bodymoor etc, however the initial post Ellis era optimism has faded.
It would be great to hear a statement of intent from the guy himself or in the written form.
I am all for stability and long termism however I am not convinced that Lambert is the right manager to see us progress - that is based on the level of performances at home this season.
However come 5pm I will be happy to eat humble pie following a good win.
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It would help if people just respected the fact he likes his privacy as opposed to wishing he was Dave Whelan. I honestly believe one of the big issues is that we went from Doug to Randy with nothing in between.
I don't care what type of person the owner is so long as they are competent and we are watching the club become less and less of a draw under the current custodian's watch.
We were still a big club in 2006 and had just had an awful season two years after being Champions League contenders. Now every year is a bad season and we are facing into our third (I would argue fourth given that we were still deep in it with four games to go in 10/11) relegation scrap.
I really don't know where we go from here.
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I really don't know where we go from here.
[/quote]
Down, probably.
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You keep predicting it Levico, you never know, it might happen for you one year.
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I never had Paul Lambert down has a bullshitter but its there in black and white.
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Seems to be buttering lerner and Faulkner up and getting a new contract in the bargain - the emperor has no clothes!
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The best analogy I can come up with regarding what's going on with Aston Villa at the moment, and apologies to anyone who thinks it's out of context is: Goering told Hitler that no allied bombs would land on Berlin, result...annihilation. I'm sure Lambert has told Lerner that they will always be mid-table safe, result...inevitable relegation. Unless of course there is a drastic turnaround in attitudes and fortunes.
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The way things are going I will soon be able to afford to buy the club, and I cant afford a season ticket...
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You keep predicting it Levico, you never know, it might happen for you one year.
Absolutely, but I won't take any pleasure from being right.
What's your view on the likelihood of our relegation?
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I never had Paul Lambert down has a bullshitter but its there in black and white.
Eh, in which bit?
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Randy has put a lot of money in. That cannot be doubted. But the problem is that the money is and has been utterly squandered. And in the main, needlessly. And all for the want of some nous and forward planning.
So we find ourselves in a situation where we have bought two left backs and loaned a third to replace them, and we have no playmaker or reliable centre halves, For instance. That's not directly Randy's fault but it is certainly what happens when you have no clear long term plan or expertise in the right areas, which is his fault.
The legacy of stumbling from one mistake to the next. To quote Bowie, we're putting out fire with gasoline.
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I never had Paul Lambert down has a bullshitter but its there in black and white.
Eh, in which bit?
Read it again just about all of it.Randy hiding in different parts of the ground for a start,he has lost it I tell ya.
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there is very little to suggest he ever had it
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If he's been to a few home games it is even more incredible that he thinks a new contract for Lambert is a good idea. I don't know what's worse, an absent owner or one who is blind to our biggest problem.
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I never had Paul Lambert down has a bullshitter but its there in black and white.
Eh, in which bit?
Read it again just about all of it.Randy hiding in different parts of the ground for a start,he has lost it I tell ya.
I think you might find they were just 'Tongue in Cheek' comments.
Scottish sense of humour ;)
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So how would we feel if an unknown Chinese consortium became owners?
The next major purchaser of a PL club is most likely to be Chinese, probably linked to a Major Chinese corporation.
I have a feeling you might be getting warmer there ChicagoLion - where has Mr Lerner been flying to recently?
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So how would we feel if an unknown Chinese consortium became owners?
That is surely too general a question, isn't it?
Isn't the obvious answer that it depends who they are and what they do? What if it turned out to be the new Carson Yeung and Peter Pan or whatever his name is?
Or what if it turned out to be some group of incredibly socially aware, philanthropic billionaires with a proven record of running sport teams?
Both would be an unknown Chinese consortium (at least initially), but could be very different.
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It explains why Luna often looks so bad. Lambert is sending on Randy wearing Luna's shirt!
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So how would we feel if an unknown Chinese consortium became owners?
That is surely too general a question, isn't it?
Isn't the obvious answer that it depends who they are and what they do? What if it turned out to be the new Carson Yeung and Peter Pan or whatever his name is?
Or what if it turned out to be some group of incredibly socially aware, philanthropic billionaires with a proven record of running sport teams?
Both would be an unknown Chinese consortium (at least initially), but could be very different.
exactly. I don't see why anyone's nationality has anything to do with it. Because it's not like there aren't any shady English blokes running sports teams is there? It's all about intention and ambition and Randy showed plenty of it early on. I hope he gets back to it next season.
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So how would we feel if an unknown Chinese consortium became owners?
That is surely too general a question, isn't it?
Isn't the obvious answer that it depends who they are and what they do? What if it turned out to be the new Carson Yeung and Peter Pan or whatever his name is?
Or what if it turned out to be some group of incredibly socially aware, philanthropic billionaires with a proven record of running sport teams?
Both would be an unknown Chinese consortium (at least initially), but could be very different.
exactly. I don't see why anyone's nationality has anything to do with it. Because it's not like there aren't any shady English blokes running sports teams is there? It's all about intention and ambition and Randy showed plenty of it early on. I hope he gets back to it next season.
Quite. It's almost like there's a reason that Randy, a rich (but not super-rich) American (but not one of those brash, tasteless Americans) bought Aston Villa. We're a big (but not super-big) top-flght club who have potential (but not super-potential, like we're near the King's Road. But we do have history and a bit of style). He was always going to buy us and it was always going to be like this. We're Aston Villa, we bob around generally near-but-not-that-near-the-top. I blame Kaiser Willhelm.
People often compare the England national team to Villa because we were pioneers but have subsequently become also-rans. I'd go further and compare the entire nation of the UK to the Villa. We were quite seismic in terms of our impact at the forging of the modern world, and we're still allowed to sit at or near the top table on most occasions, but really we're just here to add some gilt and faux-gravitas to the grubby cash exchanges that we're ultimately responsible for the creation of.
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Nicely put.
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Nicely put.
Thanks. And I'd add that there's as little point us moaning about it as there is about a Telegraph-reader moaning about our being overtaken by China or Brazil. We had our time in the sun, most of us weren't born then. C'est la vie. Even if we had most of us would've been sweeping chimneys/...*metaphor breaks*.
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I think you've been reading too much bad Dominic Sandbrook. Randy thought he would make lots of money by gate-crashing the CL. He didn't. The end.
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Quote from: brian green on February 03, 2014, 08:21:29 PM
I cannot think of any football manager past or present who has ever done anything as damaging to his club as walking out without warning five days before the start of a season. That was pure unadulterated spite.
Not so sure it was pre- planned , more than likely something happened to top him over the edge and he'd had enough - he said at the time something like they no longer shared the same vision for the club - one day he may reveal what actually happened .
I work on the gas in Central London and was doing a massive job there outside harrods about 6 months after mon had thrown his teddy out the pram.
Who should walk down the street towards me only randy Lerner I vaulted the barriers like Sergei bubka and jumped in front of him.he must of thought he was going to get mugged then seen my villa hat and smiled. I shook his hand and thanked him for all he had done for the villa etc and we chatted for about 20 minutes about the villa. In that time his mobile must of rung 10 times and beeped about 10 more and he Looked at me and said they can wait your more important, Jesus Christ how did that make me feel a fookin million dollars and more.
In that time he told me how much waste he had to witness in the mon years and continually had to watch players being signed on big money which he thought would never add value to the squad. But he admitted he went along with it and he admitted he was glad when mon walked out. The final straw being the euro debacle in mon final season.
We could of been 2 normal villa fans and deep down we probably both was. Yea I know the plan for world domination has gone off the rails for while but that day I was made to feel like a Million dollars.
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Wow. Fantastic story.
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That is one of the best posts i've ever read on here. Hope it's true! ;-)
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Great read, like LV says hope it is true.
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that's a brilliant story and makes me feel even more optimistic that hasn't given up at all and that he has just hit the pause button until we got our house in order. You can see he got burnt but he obviously enjoys being the owner of Aston Villa. If he didn't give a shit he'd have walked on and not bothered discussing any of that. Pat Murphy would be livid if he found out about this interview.
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I don't doubt his good intentions and never have. Only his footballing judgements - his off-the-pitch stuff is better than any other owner I can think of.
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Wow that story is amazing. And I like to think its true. I am still amazed as a business man that he never brought in a director of football to guide him through his "new" business. Wage structure-scouting-etc Faulkner is also in a "new" business but seems to have learnt a lot quicker than Lerner about the way forward .......
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"But he admitted he went along with it and he admitted he was glad when mon walked out. The final straw being the euro debacle in mon final season."
After reading that, it makes me wonder if MO'N was close to getting the sack. He realised this so he walked.
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It would look better on him to walk away (despite the terrible timing) than to be sacked and deemed a failure.
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Something I've noticed about non villa fans and the media is they seem oblivious to the amount of money O'Neil spent. Its as if he got us to 6th place on a budget and we should be grateful.
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No wonder the gas takes so long sorting out leaks and digging up the roads.
I hope you were docked 20 minutes wages you bloody slacker.
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Great story from three years ago ... I wonder whether the same would happen now if Randy was 'accosted' on the street? I'd like to thinks so.
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Something I've noticed about non villa fans and the media is they seem oblivious to the amount of money O'Neil spent. Its as if he got us to 6th place on a budget and we should be grateful.
Didn't one of his acolytes in the nationals write something to the effect of his miraculous work on a shoestring?
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Great story from three years ago ... I wonder whether the same would happen now if Randy was 'accosted' on the street? I'd like to thinks so.
Personally I would rather converse about his taste in art than his stewardship of the greatest Football Club on this earth.
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Great story from three years ago ... I wonder whether the same would happen now if Randy was 'accosted' on the street? I'd like to thinks so.
Personally I would rather converse about his taste in art than his stewardship of the greatest Football Club on this earth.
However, it is nice to get a glimpse of how he feels and that it is possible, contrary to growing beliefs that he actually still cares for the well being of the club. I would also like to commend for his philanthropy and his continued support of Acorns.
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If the bit of stuff he was with when my son met him is anything to go by I would much prefer to discuss his taste in women.
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You wouldn't bat an eyelid if you heard it spoken but 'bit of stuff' seems like a strange phrase when you see it written down.
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That was a great story, glad to have read it! With me, as there is sometimes a void of meaningful information from the Club, it's hard to see if they see/feel what I do. This is a pretty strong indication that they do.
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I know its the job of the stadium tour to make you think everything is awesome and fine and dandy, but just chatting to the guide about Lerner and some of the behind the scenes stuff really made me think that his intentions are good, and he does in fact have a great deal of respect for the club and its traditions and so on.
Just a series of awful decisions made when it comes to football.
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Great story from three years ago ... I wonder whether the same would happen now if Randy was 'accosted' on the street? I'd like to thinks so.
It would have to be one of our American Villains doing the accosting though. ;)
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Promise you guys it's all 100% true it was actually outside the Rembrandt hotel just down from harrods just before the Kazakh embassy. Day before my Chelsea mate met obi mikel and lampard I said to him you lucky sod.
Next day that happened seen him 3-4 times walking about and poss know to within 100 yards where his pad is guy was an absolute diamond so sorry guys can never slag him off cause of that day. He made me feel like I was his right hand man.
Yea I think o"Neil was on borrowed time from what he was saying but he could not sack him because of our top 6 finishes and so the fan reaction.
How many times have we started a project with all good intentions throwing money at it(in my case my garden ) then lost a bit of interest. But you know you gotta get it done and one day you do.
Just hope randy don't take as long with the villa that I have with my garden though
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"But he admitted he went along with it and he admitted he was glad when mon walked out. The final straw being the euro debacle in mon final season."
After reading that, it makes me wonder if MO'N was close to getting the sack. He realised this so he walked.
Well he got paid off so whether he walked or was pushed, it's fairly acedemic.
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Yea I think o"Neil was on borrowed time from what he was saying but he could not sack him because of our top 6 finishes and so the fan reaction.
Very true. I wanted rid of MON the season before he left as I just couldn't see what he was trying to build and even if we had qualified for the CL we'd have been knocked out in the qualifying round, so poor was the football we played. It's encouraging to know Lerner wanted him out, it gives me a glimmer of hope he actually has a clue on the footballing side. On the club side he's faultless, the best owner we could ever hope for but it's the football that makes us junkies.
Saying that, I can not for the life of me understand why if the man has a knowledge of football he'd want to offer now a three year extension to Lambert. It just doesn't make any sense what-so-ever.
Great story, PBV.
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It isn't as if Lambert will have bigger clubs chasing him. A very strange happening it makes you wonder whether Randy has learned anything in the last six years.
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agreed. the glimmer of hope was in fact a man with a serious heart condition who still wished he was managing Liverpool followed by TSM.
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Great story from three years ago ... I wonder whether the same would happen now if Randy was 'accosted' on the street? I'd like to thinks so.
It would have to be one of our American Villains doing the accosting though. ;)
Or maybe one of our fans in Bejing ?
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You wouldn't bat an eyelid if you heard it spoken but 'bit of stuff' seems like a strange phrase when you see it written down.
© On the Buses 1974
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"But he admitted he went along with it and he admitted he was glad when mon walked out. The final straw being the euro debacle in mon final season."
After reading that, it makes me wonder if MO'N was close to getting the sack. He realised this so he walked.
Well he got paid off so whether he walked or was pushed, it's fairly acedemic.
Yes, I suppose it is, but, by walking he was able to push blame on to Lerner, and, he hasn't got 'sacked' on his CV.
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Sorry about the "bit of stuff" comment. I should have said early twenties, raven haired, doe eyed, long legged, perfest skinned Eurasian woman. Consider yourselves lucky I did not say "tart".
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Sorry about the "bit of stuff" comment. I should have said early twenties, raven haired, doe eyed, long legged, perfest skinned Eurasian woman. Consider yourselves lucky I did not say "tart".
Could have been a business associate ;)
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You wouldn't bat an eyelid if you heard it spoken but 'bit of stuff' seems like a strange phrase when you see it written down.
© On the Buses 1974
I always thought the Brummie version was "a bit of fluff"?
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Business associate or not she was not best pleased at the amount of time he spent talking about the Villa to somebody in a restaurant.
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Sorry about the "bit of stuff" comment. I should have said early twenties, raven haired, doe eyed, long legged, perfest skinned Eurasian woman. Consider yourselves lucky I did not say "tart".
Could have been a business associate ;)
"Are you Berlusconi in disguise?"
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Isn't Randy a regular in The Anglesey Arms when he's in town ? Or did I just dream that up ?
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Sorry about the "bit of stuff" comment. I should have said early twenties, raven haired, doe eyed, long legged, perfest skinned Eurasian woman. Consider yourselves lucky I did not say "tart".
Could have been a business associate ;)
"Are you Berlusconi in disguise?"
Most likely.
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Sorry about the "bit of stuff" comment. I should have said early twenties, raven haired, doe eyed, long legged, perfest skinned Eurasian woman. Consider yourselves lucky I did not say "tart".
Could have been a business associate ;)
"Are you Berlusconi in disguise?"
Only on a Wednesday ;)
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Bunga bunga
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Great thread this full of hallucinatory tales. All we need now is to join it all up with an African man reversing his car in a hurry up Trinity road having just been told by Lambert that Randy has signed the club over to him FOC.
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The concept of a man reversing up Trinity Road to acquire the club truly is surreal. Almost as surreal as the clip of a woman in a Holland shirt falling over in the street as the transfer window closed. We all took it as some kind of message from on high that Clarence Seedorf or Edgar Davids were about to join us but it was just a woman on an orange jumper falling over.
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Not seen the African Car Reverser thread, Brian?
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Not seen the African Car Reverser thread, Brian?
One of the truly great threads without doubt , all time classic.
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Up there with the "Fists all over you" baby competition.
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"But he admitted he went along with it and he admitted he was glad when mon walked out. The final straw being the euro debacle in mon final season."
After reading that, it makes me wonder if MO'N was close to getting the sack. He realised this so he walked.
Well he got paid off so whether he walked or was pushed, it's fairly acedemic.
Yes, I suppose it is, but, by walking he was able to push blame on to Lerner, and, he hasn't got 'sacked' on his CV.
Is it just me or is the "he went along with it" a bit worrying? Surely he shouldn't be just going along with anything, especially something it sounds like something hr didn't particularly agree with.
How much better off would we have been if he had called stop there?
Was he afraid of a fan backlash, because that doesn't tally with appointing McLeish.
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Maybe he thought that one more signing could just do it for us? But then o"Neil wanted one more signing then one more signing. Do you trust the manager that has got you top 6 finishes or do you say no then it's in the papers "randy refuses more money" because o"Neil had his friends in the media ,who the hell will know but the one thing he said was that the waste of money on players was wrong etc and seemed so passionate when he spoke
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Maybe he thought that one more signing could just do it for us? But then o"Neil wanted one more signing then one more signing. Do you trust the manager that has got you top 6 finishes or do you say no then it's in the papers "randy refuses more money" because o"Neil had his friends in the media ,who the hell will know but the one thing he said was that the waste of money on players was wrong etc and seemed so passionate when he spoke
You're probably right there. But again it suggests that the club would be better served if there was a football man and possibly a bit of a figurehead near the top of the pyramid so that the other side of the story can become part of the agenda, not just what MON (or any other manager) tells the media.
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Rumours doing the rounds (not for first time apparently) that Vince McMahon (owner of WWE) wants to buy Newcastle Utd.
I'd love to have him take over the Villa. Get Hulk Hogan as our new manager. Ricky The Dragon Steamboat as our fitness coach. The Big Show as our new experienced CH. Ric Flair as a coach, and he can teach us how to cheat and play dirty. We can also get The Ultimate Warrior to give our pre-match and half time team talks. He'd probably make more sense than Lambert too.
We'd win the league.
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Vince McMahon, Stephanie and Triple H. Those were the days.
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Dante lavelli
Spot on a ex villa man as a spokesman or figurehead someone like Ian Taylor, Dennis Mortimer etc just to drop to the media the clubs side of everything to even things up
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Love to see the undertaker and British bulldog in centre of midfield when we play the albion
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Love to see the undertaker and British bulldog in centre of midfield when we play the albion
On our budget we might have to settle for Koko B Ware and the Red Rooster.
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We need experience.
Jacky Pallo and Mick McManus
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We need experience.
Jacky Pallo and Mick McManus
Big John Studd to fill the void left by Big John Carew.
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A midfield pairing of Kid Chocolate and Goldbelt Brisn Maxine would be my choice.
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What a shame Big Daddy has already left us for QPR.
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Love to see the undertaker and British bulldog in centre of midfield when we play the albion
Unfortunately British Bulldog died about 12 years ago.
Tried so hard not to but....
He still couldn't do much worse than the current midfield
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I am glad we have got back to our favourite pastime of criticising MON in a way that only H&Vers can do!
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Andre the Giant
Jake the Snake Roberts. Big Show. Sid Vicious. Macho Man Randy Savage.
Ultimate Warrior. Ric Flair. Hulk Hogan. Stone Cold Steve Austin.
Undertaker. Bret the Hitman Hart.
Kane, Diesel, Triple H, Iron Sheikh, Sgt Slaughter, Legion of Doom.
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no place in the matchday squad for Scottie Too Hottie and Grandmaster Sexay ?
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Andre the Giant
Jake the Snake Roberts. Big Show. Sid Vicious. Macho Man Randy Savage.
Ultimate Warrior. Ric Flair. Hulk Hogan. Stone Cold Steve Austin.
Undertaker. Bret the Hitman Hart.
Kane, Diesel, Triple H, Iron Sheikh, Sgt Slaughter, Legion of Doom.
I'd be worried about a lack of pace on our wings. A few of the more agile WWE stars on the flanks would do me, maybe Shawn Michaels on one side and Ricky The Dragon on the other.
Andre the Giant in goal goes without saying of course.
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In all seriousness too, Hulk Hogan could probably outsprint El Ahmadi. ;)
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My main worry about that team is that I think 4 of them are dead.
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The list of dead wrestlers is pretty extensive.
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We would sign Johnny Saint...
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The list of dead wrestlers is pretty extensive.
It's almost ironic that The Undertaker is one of those who is actually still alive.
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I find it pretty amazing that grown men, on here, are reeling off names of wrestlers ;D
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I find it pretty amazing that grown men, on here, are reeling off names of wrestlers ;D
Amazing in a good way of course! ;)
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Are you sure they are dead.............or just pretending?
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I find it pretty amazing that grown men, on here, are reeling off names of wrestlers ;D
Now if we were talking Big Daddy, Mick McManus and Kendo Nagasaki then I'd be okay.
Afternoon grapple fans.
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Chyna would be a better option than KEA. Do you know she does porn now?
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We would sign Johnny Saint...
But more likely to get Doink the clown.
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My main worry about that team is that I think 4 of them are dead.
Three are definitely dead, Savage, Andre and Hawk from L.O.D. I would probably put Kofi Kingston on a wing for his pace and Inoki was good with his feet (look up his fight with Muhammed Ali where he spent most of the match lying on his back trying to kick Ali because some militants threatened to kill him if he laid a hand on him)
Sid was never the same after he broke his leg. Look up the Sid vid on YouTube
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My main worry about that team is that I think 4 of them are dead.
Three are definitely dead, Savage, Andre and Hawk from L.O.D. I would probably put Kofi Kingston on a wing for his pace and Inoki was good with his feet (look up his fight with Muhammed Ali where he spent most of the match lying on his back trying to kick Ali because some militants threatened to kill him if he laid a hand on him)
Sid was never the same after he broke his leg. Look up the Sid vid on YouTube
I had a feeling that the Iron Sheik was dead too, although he was over 65 (rare for wrestlers).
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Iron Sheik still alive. You're welcome. Oh and Hulk Hogan returns to the wwe/wwf next Monday.
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I thought I'd clicked on the transfer thread and some of villa kicks suggestions these last two pages. I've never heard of these people but then again it's a long time since I was 14.
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I thought I'd clicked on the transfer thread and some of villa kicks suggestions these last two pages. I've never heard of these people but then again it's a long time since I was 14.
You and me both.
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If Stephanie McMahon was our manager the football can be as shit as she wants but I would never slag her off
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This wrestling 'theme' seems to have been picked up elsewhere:
(https://scontent-a-lhr.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn2/t1/1780633_266483940179836_1274770558_n.jpg)
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Andre the Giant
Jake the Snake Roberts. Big Show. Sid Vicious. Macho Man Randy Savage.
Ultimate Warrior. Ric Flair. Hulk Hogan. Stone Cold Steve Austin.
Undertaker. Bret the Hitman Hart.
Kane, Diesel, Triple H, Iron Sheikh, Sgt Slaughter, Legion of Doom.
Is it really sad that I look at that and my main concern is that we're playing a 442 formation?
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Andre the Giant
Jake the Snake Roberts. Big Show. Sid Vicious. Macho Man Randy Savage.
Ultimate Warrior. Ric Flair. Hulk Hogan. Stone Cold Steve Austin.
Undertaker. Bret the Hitman Hart.
Kane, Diesel, Triple H, Iron Sheikh, Sgt Slaughter, Legion of Doom.
Is it really sad that I look at that and my main concern is that we're playing a 442 formation?
I think Bret Hart would be the number 10, playing of the Undertaker, who's the big target man.
Also surely Ric Flair should be on the wing and Stone Cold the midfield enforcer? Come on, the guy's name is Flair.
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Andre the Giant
Jake the Snake Roberts. Big Show. Sid Vicious. Macho Man Randy Savage.
Ultimate Warrior. Ric Flair. Hulk Hogan. Stone Cold Steve Austin.
Undertaker. Bret the Hitman Hart.
Kane, Diesel, Triple H, Iron Sheikh, Sgt Slaughter, Legion of Doom.
Is it really sad that I look at that and my main concern is that we're playing a 442 formation?
This wrestling 'theme' seems to have been picked up elsewhere:
(https://scontent-a-lhr.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn2/t1/1780633_266483940179836_1274770558_n.jpg)
Hahaha "Dust"
In all seriousness, Vince surely has better things to worry about than buying Newcastle
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Iron Sheik still alive. You're welcome. Oh and Hulk Hogan returns to the wwe/wwf next Monday.
The Iron Sheik is on twitter. He tweets like he speaks, but with a lot more swearing. https://twitter.com/the_ironsheik
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Iron Sheik still alive. You're welcome. Oh and Hulk Hogan returns to the wwe/wwf next Monday.
The Iron Sheik is on twitter. He tweets like he speaks, but with a lot more swearing. https://twitter.com/the_ironsheik
Haha:
Fuck you @sprite you worse than sheep piss
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My main worry about that team is that I think 4 of them are dead.
Semantics.
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My main worry about that team is that I think 4 of them are dead.
That doesn't necessarily mean they wouldn't be an upgrade on what we have now.
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Long before most of you were born we used to go to the wrestling at Gosta Green after Villa home games. The big stars were Count Bartelli and Man Mountain Benny. We have a great need for experience these days and both would be at least a hundred years old so I hope a place can be found for them.
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Iron Sheik still alive. You're welcome. Oh and Hulk Hogan returns to the wwe/wwf next Monday.
The Iron Sheik is on twitter. He tweets like he speaks, but with a lot more swearing. https://twitter.com/the_ironsheik
He break their back, make them humble.
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i don't know anything of this modern wrestling the kids are talking about on this thread, but I do remember 1970s wrestling, as a kid. I used to hate it, it was on Grandstand every fucking week. The televisual backdrop to Saturday afternoons.
The only thing worse than that which they used to show all the time was the fucking horse racing
All those things you get shared on Facebook, "Hurr hurr, modern kids do this" *insert picture of child staring blankly at ipad* "we used to do this " *insert photo of happy 1970s children kicking ball around the streets* are all well and good, but they don't communicate how monumentally fucking boring it was being a kid back then.
There wasn't anything on telly, there was nothing to do on a Sunday - nothing, no shops open, nothing - and it rained all the fucking time, as well*
"We had to make our own entertainment". Too right we did. Mostly crying or stealing things, because there was NOTHING else to do. I wish we'd had ipads.
* except 1976
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Grandstand? World of Sport surely?
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Grandstand? World of Sport surely?
Whichever. It was horrific, all the same.
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There was nothing more entertaining than watching Big Daddy hit a man twice his size with his belly and somehow triumph. Except everything else.
I only watched it to make sure I didn't miss any of Star Fleet. American rasslin was a lot more entertaining.
People used to say, "Why do you watch that wwf shit. It's so fake". I used to reply by asking them if they'd ever watched real wrestling. That's why the wwf existed. Well, saving endangered animals and making them pretend to fight each other in their pants too of course.
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One you might remember from Gosta Green was a then youthful stripling called Judo Al Hayes. On the whole I used to prefer going to watch Birmingham Bees speedway or Perry Barr dogs as the dessert after a feast at Villa Park (as if).