Pau Torres

[jon collett]

I do wonder if Mings may be carrying an injury. He wasn’t in the squad at all for Manchester City.

I agree with most other comments. It seemed a no brainer for him to start yesterday. I had him in the team i posted on here in the preview.

I just wonder.

[VillaTim]

Ahh the 4th place trophy . Add it to the honors board .
He isn't good enough . Crap defender and zero leadership or organisation skills .

Every thread all the time, its boring

And the head in the sand defence from a couple of posters of a poor defender is boring . it's been obvious since the start he cannot defend , Burnley away the alarm bells started .

[HolteL4]

If I'm honest, I would consider selling him in the summer.  We need to bring in a real quality, physical presence back there, as we have seen the difference that it made to Liverpool, Arsenal and even Forest when they did the same. 

I like Pau Torres, but he'd be the one I'd look to move on come the summer as he'd probably be worth the most.  I would look to sign Disasi, as I think he's been fine at CB, would keep Konsa and Mings and then look at bringing in a real quality addition.

I reluctantly agree with this he isn't suited to English football, he has no speed to him and has no strength to him either, in this league you can get away with only having 1 of those attributes but you can't get away with having neither of them.  He's had 2 seasons now to either speed up or bulk up and he's done neither of them. We can't afford to have a player that is only good in European Football. He's a good passer but as a defender in this league you need more than that and he hasn't got that so I can't see any point in keeping him.

[brontebilly]

I do wonder if Mings may be carrying an injury. He wasn’t in the squad at all for Manchester City.

I agree with most other comments. It seemed a no brainer for him to start yesterday. I had him in the team i posted on here in the preview.

I just wonder.

Torres wasn't in the squad for the previous game I think nor Bailey. It was just an idiotic selection decision from Emery not to start Mings. Mings was just about the only centre half on our books that didn't play and he humiliated at Palace. He sat on the bench all game that night too while Konsa, Disasi and poor Bogarde were roasted.

Managers like players make mistakes, Emery made a massive one yesterday and a bit of a horror show with the subs and tactical setup at Man City. Mind you Newcastle was arguably his best game at the club.

I would look to move Torres on in the summer. He's a talented player ball at his feet for sure but his weaknesses defensively are exposed far too easily in the PL. He doesn't give the appearance of a man who spent his time off injured in the gym getting physically stronger, nor last summer. Emery made a point after Fulham earlier this season that he had to get stronger in his duels.

Id certainly keep Mings on. A big offer on Konsa (unlikely after this season) and Id consider it. Experienced centre backs at this level simply can't be babysat by their partner. Konsa should have stepped up this season but has regressed.

[PaulWinch again]

I do find it odd how people just walk past the fact that Pau has played in most of our most significant victories domestically and in Europe in his time at the club. He was also pretty much ever present in until run in the first half of last season that had us up there competing for the top of the league. He’s obviously not a combative centre half but to say he can’t defend is just nonsense.

It’s pretty evident that it’s a defensive combination/team structure thing more than it being about Pau.

[RamboandBruno]

I do find it odd how people just walk past the fact that Pau has played in most of our most significant victories domestically and in Europe in his time at the club. He was also pretty much ever present in until run in the first half of last season that had us up there competing for the top of the league. He’s obviously not a combative centre half but to say he can’t defend is just nonsense.

It’s pretty evident that it’s a defensive combination/team structure thing more than it being about Pau.

I think your speaking to deaf ears now to be honest Paul. The dye has been cast with many posters. Its easy to have a straight forward narrative where one particular player is the reason behind most of our defensive ills, easy to fix then hey.

Its hard to argue with some of the recent stats, but your right, its far more nuanced.

[ChicagoLion]

We seem to concede more goals with Torres’s in the team.
That is not nuance.
I don’t think anyone is saying we can’t play well or win with Torres in the team.
Of course not helped when we play Cash aswell.

[frank black]

I think there’s Pau games and there’s Mings games. It up to the gaffer to decide who is most appropriate. Saturdays match seemed like it would be a Mings game to most, but not Unai.

Personally I think Pau is a player that could be upgraded if the right person comes along, a stronger player with composure on the ball.

[Rigadon]

I think there’s Pau games and there’s Mings games. It up to the gaffer to decide who is most appropriate. Saturdays match seemed like it would be a Mings game to most, but not Unai.

Personally I think Pau is a player that could be upgraded if the right person comes along, a stronger player with composure on the ball.

I'd have thought that our defensive problems this season have been exacerbated, maybe even caused, by not having a settled central defensive pairing.  Centre halves tend to work in pairs and it isn't typically a position that many managers seem to rotate.  This has affected Martinez too I reckon.  The other thing is that our full backs seem incapable of stopping a cross from coming in - what is that all about?  The shape (narrow) or their defensive instincts?  I don't know, but the goals we concede all seem to be the same thing: cross / cut back, indecision, goal. 

I would play Mings and Konsa as CHs for all the remaining games.  I like Torres, but he looks very low on confidence.  If we had a better back up keeper, I think we would've seem him play by now too for the same reason. 

[LeeB]

There's an instinct to defending that Pau and to a lesser extent Konsa lack that's so evident once Mings starts in the team. The first goal against PSG and the late goal at Man City, there's no way Mings is letting the ball run past him like Pau did both times.

It builds confidence, when I'm watching you feel like the opposition could cross the ball in all day and it's no issue and it fuels our adventure going forward.

I think the reality is it needs to be Pau or Konsa plus Mings or expensive new Mings-a-like.

[oldhill_avfc]

It's got to the point where this isn't a Torres vs Mings thing.

Emry doesn't seem to want to play Mings in certain games, either because his distribution isn't up to it or there are fears around his fitness.  Unfortunately, Torres isn't up to it either in terms of pace and defensive ability. 

We've conceded far too many goals this year, the defence as a whole  needs a total rethink.

[LeeB]

I know the standards are demanding and everything, but like I think Monty said elsewhere I actually thnk Mings is pretty good with his distribution and it feels like it's underrated somewhat.

But I do concur that we need some work at the back, individually and as a unit.

[Drummond]

Since Torres and Mings both returned at the start of March (the Club Brugge away match):

Mings PL 7 W 7 Conceded 3
Torres PL 5 W 2 L3 Conceded 10

With Mings starting we’ve won our last 8, are unbeaten in 11, and lost once in 18.

Calm down weirdos, it doesn’t mean I fancy him.

Maybe not, but he's fit isn't he? ☺️

[London Villan]

Age-wise though it's Mings that needs the upgrade. Hard as nails, uncompromising defender, tough, leader, right-footed... That's the wish list - over to our scouting team.

[Drummond]

There's an instinct to defending that Pau and to a lesser extent Konsa lack that's so evident once Mings starts in the team. The first goal against PSG and the late goal at Man City, there's no way Mings is letting the ball run past him like Pau did both times.

It builds confidence, when I'm watching you feel like the opposition could cross the ball in all day and it's no issue and it fuels our adventure going forward.

I think the reality is it needs to be Pau or Konsa plus Mings or expensive new Mings-a-like.

And there it is, finally.

Konsa, Torres and Mings are all great players, unfortunately for us Konsa is better with Mings and Pau is better with a ball winner next to him.

I do think it odd that Mings didn't play on Saturday and perhaps that was injury related. Disasi obviously was Cup tied which negated that possibility.

Torres has been great for us, and will be in the future.