FFP

[Sexual Ealing]

The accounts are showing on Companies House, if anybody wants to see them.

I don't want to see them, but I would like you to take time out of your busy day to analyse them and summarise what it all means on here, please. This is an unpaid role.

[LeeB]

The accounts are showing on Companies House, if anybody wants to see them.

I don't want to see them, but I would like you to take time out of your busy day to analyse them and summarise what it all means on here, please. This is an unpaid role.

I second this motion.

[Beard82]

The accounts are showing on Companies House, if anybody wants to see them.

I don't want to see them, but I would like you to take time out of your busy day to analyse them and summarise what it all means on here, please. This is an unpaid role.

I second this motion.

I agree too.  I would happily do it but I don’t understand them. 

Don’t break your back doing - 20 or 30 animated PowerPoint slides would be enough

[PeterWithe]

Yes please, If SE can spare us the time to give us his thoughts on the latest developments in the world of plumbing, then a bit of financial analysis is the least you can do.

[Sexual Ealing]

And don't be disheartened about the unpaid thing. It'll be great exposure for your brand.

[Sexual Ealing]

Yes please, If SE can spare us the time to give us his thoughts on the latest developments in the world of plumbing, then a bit of financial analysis is the least you can do.

It's good to be appreciated. Thank you PW.

[Drummond]

The accounts are showing on Companies House, if anybody wants to see them.

I don't want to see them, but I would like you to take time out of your busy day to analyse them and summarise what it all means on here, please. This is an unpaid role.

I second this motion.

I agree too.  I would happily do it but I don’t understand them. 

Don’t break your back doing - 20 or 30 animated PowerPoint slides would be enough

I'm not sure I've ever encountered anyone asking an accountant for a powerpoint presentation before.

[danno]

At this point it would be a scandalous break of H+V tradition if Risso didn’t analyse them.

[chrisw1]

Yes please, If SE can spare us the time to give us his thoughts on the latest developments in the world of plumbing, then a bit of financial analysis is the least you can do.

Oh I missed this.  My fault for not venturing into off topic I guess, but if there's gems like that in there I may have to reconsider the use of my spare time.

[Risso]

I'll have a proper look later, but to be honest there isn't a lot that hasn't been said already. The two main differences between the current set of accounts and the year before is wages, at about £60m increase. The other big difference is that we obviously didn't get £100m for a player this year.

You can see that there's £4m of community expenditure, £14.5m youth team and £2.5m on the women's team,  so that's £21m that can be deducted for FFP purposes to start with.

[rougegorge]

I'll have a proper look later, but to be honest there isn't a lot that hasn't been said already. The two main differences between the current set of accounts and the year before is wages, at about £60m increase. The other big difference is that we obviously didn't get £100m for a player this year.

You can see that there's £4m of community expenditure, £14.5m youth team and £2.5m on the women's team,  so that's £21m that can be deducted for FFP purposes to start with.

If only that youth investment could result in just one or two players making the Premier League grade with us, we would have less to worry about.

[Dogtanian]

Roughly, I can make out our P&S figures being

2023 -£96.7m
2022 +£20.7m
2021 -£22.8m   *I couldn't see the Women's team figure for 2021 in the reports so this is likely higher by at least £1m I'd say.

So that's -£98m across the 3 years, well within the £105m, even without the covid figure.

As we all thought, the issue is this year started off at -£76m - meaning we can only lose £29m this year.

We haven't done that in transfers thanks to the money from selling the younglings. So the risk is to do with how much revenue we've gone up by compared to how much we're paying on player salaries.

I'm pretty confident there isn't a huge issue at all.

[Risso]

Here's an idea. We're miles behind on the other top 6 teams for commercial revenue, but all deals have to be on commercial terms to satisfy the Premier League/UEFA. What would happen if say, an entirely unconnected Egyptian company (choosing a territory *completely* at random) was to buy £50m of shirts from us, for selling on in Africa and the middle east. Obviously they'd have to pay the going rate for the shirts. Past that though, we'd have no control over how many they sold or what happened to them next, so if they sat in a warehouse like all those crates at the end of Raiders of the Lost Ark gathering dust, then that wouldn't be our fault, surely?

[Dogtanian]

Here's an idea. We're miles behind on the other top 6 teams for commercial revenue, but all deals have to be on commercial terms to satisfy the Premier League/UEFA. What would happen if say, an entirely unconnected Egyptian company (choosing a territory *completely* at random) was to buy £50m of shirts from us, for selling on in Africa and the middle east. Obviously they'd have to pay the going rate for the shirts. Past that though, we'd have no control over how many they sold or what happened to them next, so if they sat in a warehouse like all those crates at the end of Raiders of the Lost Ark gathering dust, then that wouldn't be our fault, surely?

I can certainly imagine the new crest burning into the wooden crates.

[brontebilly]

While Emery has certainly improved the value of multiple players, that doesn't matter for FFP it seems unless we sell them. Another huge flaw. The transfer/asset value of Watkins and Luiz this summer must be around 80m each.

That's a reason that FFP is seriously flawed. In most other industries, you have to revalue your assets at 'fair value' periodically, so if you have a building rising in value, that gets reflected in the accounts. It doesn't happen with footballers, so we've got Kamara valued at nowt, when in reality to buy a player of his standing we'd be looking at shelling out c. £70m. And you could say the same about Luiz, McGinn, Martinez etc.

I guess fair value in football would be challenging to agree on but without it the whole system is screwed. It's currently incentivising academy farms not player or club development.