FFP

[Baldy]

Has anyone managed to put a positive spin on the numbers yet. (full stop)

I’ll give is a go, here are some positives:

1. We have rich owners that aren’t about to do runner and put the club in jeopardy so essentially the club is safe.
2. We must spend every penny of the £105m allowable losses in every three year period to maximise our chances of growth.
3. These figures largely relate to the Gerrard debacle where we were often 17th in the league.
4. Things have improved since, certainly income wise.
5. The burden of his transfer strategy will be largely flushed be through soon.
6. We now have a manager that is increasing the value of 80% of the squad.

To put it another way, the club is being as ambitious as the rules allow. Furthermore, just  imagine how bad the figures would look with Gerrard in charge, languishing in the bottom half and with no sellable assets.

Very true Dante Lavelli, I would also add the profile of the club seems to be already much higher throughout the world and this can only help on the commercial front.

The Premier League package is massive worldwide, we must be getting much more airtime and now appear in the part of the league tables that are shown (top 6, 8, 10 etc). I was chuffed to see the Ajax forum after the villa draw, they have thrown the towel in already!! Even in Greece, we have been noticed. Long may it continue and be capitalised upon.

[itbrvilla]

I went to a networking event a couple of weeks ago at Villa and the speaker was the club's new head of Strategy and Analytics. This role is looking at the non-playing-side data, amongst other things, doing what supermarkets do with your data through loyalty cards and how they profile your habits).

Anyway... he made some interesting points about measuring the average spend of supporters in the ground, what they spend on merch and food, the different trends and patterns. But importantly about whether the figures stacked up for the new stand - based on the spending power of current fans that this (alongside 1/3 of the ground being affected, transport etc) was one of the reasons it was stopped. Basically, there isn't enough demand (atm) to justify an increase of 2000-3000 premium seats.

Just adds to the challenge we face.

I also think it was/is the underlying reason why we didn;t prioritise the FA Cup and LEague cups - The Champions League position is obviously first, but even the Conference league - despite it being a lesser trophy, would generate £25m for the club if we won it. Could be very important for next season's accounts...

The average fucking spend would be so much more if they could only sort the fucking service out.

Pay staff triple what the current lot are on and you'll attract way better staff. They will more than triple the spend and the club would be quids in without even upping prices.

I'd be interested to know whether there is any difference between the spend by supporters in , for example, the Lower Holte, where in my experience it is easy to get food and drink pre match and the quality seems reasonable , and other areas which are still as rubbish for getting served.

I spent fuck all in the lower North vs Forest compared to about £25 in the Upper Holte vs Burnley.  Purely down to service.

[PeterWithe]

Lets not forget that Unai was hired on the basis of what he's done at clubs that routinely sell their best players and replace them successfully with emerging ones.

Also, someone posted on here that there was an area of North London close to Spurs that houses Europe's largest Korean community. They could come here if we signed someone that appealed to them, we wont be able to afford to attend soon by the sound of it.

[Drummond]

Just no.

To whom?

Whether your post was meant to be tongue in cheek, humorous or whatever, it made me feel uncomfortable. It was unnecessary.

[Risso]

Just no.

To whom?

Whether your post was meant to be tongue in cheek, humorous or whatever, it made me feel uncomfortable. It was unnecessary.

It was a crap attempt at a joke that he's already apologised for, so let's just move on.

[brontebilly]

Has anyone managed to put a positive spin on the numbers yet. (full stop)

I’ll give is a go, here are some positives:

1. We have rich owners that aren’t about to do runner and put the club in jeopardy so essentially the club is safe.
2. We must spend every penny of the £105m allowable losses in every three year period to maximise our chances of growth.
3. These figures largely relate to the Gerrard debacle where we were often 17th in the league.
4. Things have improved since, certainly income wise.
5. The burden of his transfer strategy will be largely flushed be through soon.
6. We now have a manager that is increasing the value of 80% of the squad.

To put it another way, the club is being as ambitious as the rules allow. Furthermore, just  imagine how bad the figures would look with Gerrard in charge, languishing in the bottom half and with no sellable assets.

Gerrard was only in charge for less than 12 months though. For every vanity signing like Coutinho that didn't work out, there was the likes of Kamara who must be a big positive for FFP. If our wage bill did go out of control under his tenure then it's Purslow that was asleep at the wheel.

While Emery has certainly improved the value of multiple players, that doesn't matter for FFP it seems unless we sell them. Another huge flaw. The transfer/asset value of Watkins and Luiz this summer must be around 80m each.

[Drummond]

Just no.

To whom?

Whether your post was meant to be tongue in cheek, humorous or whatever, it made me feel uncomfortable. It was unnecessary.

It was a crap attempt at a joke that he's already apologised for, so let's just move on.

Yeah thanks for that. I was just responding to his post.

[Dogtanian]

I think there should be a mechanism in the P&S rules to claim back for long term injuries. Like for Mings and Buendia. Both of them are out for the entire season, yet they'll still be costing us a large amount of money for FFP themselves. Plus, on top of this we will have had to spend extra to get cover in.

If a player suffers long term injury that keeps them out for a season, you should be able to submit the relevant medical evidence and get an FFP credit.

[Risso]

While Emery has certainly improved the value of multiple players, that doesn't matter for FFP it seems unless we sell them. Another huge flaw. The transfer/asset value of Watkins and Luiz this summer must be around 80m each.

That's a reason that FFP is seriously flawed. In most other industries, you have to revalue your assets at 'fair value' periodically, so if you have a building rising in value, that gets reflected in the accounts. It doesn't happen with footballers, so we've got Kamara valued at nowt, when in reality to buy a player of his standing we'd be looking at shelling out c. £70m. And you could say the same about Luiz, McGinn, Martinez etc.

[Dick Edwards]

I think there should be a mechanism in the P&S rules to claim back for long term injuries. Like for Mings and Buendia. Both of them are out for the entire season, yet they'll still be costing us a large amount of money for FFP themselves. Plus, on top of this we will have had to spend extra to get cover in.

If a player suffers long term injury that keeps them out for a season, you should be able to submit the relevant medical evidence and get an FFP credit.

I agree with this 100%

[PeterWithe]

I was ruminating on FFP in the car and we have to be very careful about changes to the current rules don't we, as any relaxation would give us some wriggle room but it would also give free rein to those who pay a lot more in wages to try and get our players.

If the owners do want to compete with them, I just cant see any alternative to moving ground.

[chrisw1]

I think there should be a mechanism in the P&S rules to claim back for long term injuries. Like for Mings and Buendia. Both of them are out for the entire season, yet they'll still be costing us a large amount of money for FFP themselves. Plus, on top of this we will have had to spend extra to get cover in.

If a player suffers long term injury that keeps them out for a season, you should be able to submit the relevant medical evidence and get an FFP credit.

Very good idea, if possibly a bit vulnerable to exploitation and would bring up grey areas like Coutinho who couldn't stay fit.  May also create scenarios where we'd be better off declaring a player unfit than loaning him (as we can't get full wages covered) - like Coutinho I'd imagine.

[Sexual Ealing]

I think there should be a mechanism in the P&S rules to claim back for long term injuries. Like for Mings and Buendia. Both of them are out for the entire season, yet they'll still be costing us a large amount of money for FFP themselves. Plus, on top of this we will have had to spend extra to get cover in.

If a player suffers long term injury that keeps them out for a season, you should be able to submit the relevant medical evidence and get an FFP credit.

I agree with this 100%

Yes, that seems a very sensible suggestion to me.

[Sexual Ealing]

I think there should be a mechanism in the P&S rules to claim back for long term injuries. Like for Mings and Buendia. Both of them are out for the entire season, yet they'll still be costing us a large amount of money for FFP themselves. Plus, on top of this we will have had to spend extra to get cover in.

If a player suffers long term injury that keeps them out for a season, you should be able to submit the relevant medical evidence and get an FFP credit.

Very good idea, if possibly a bit vulnerable to exploitation and would bring up grey areas like Coutinho who couldn't stay fit.  May also create scenarios where we'd be better off declaring a player unfit than loaning him (as we can't get full wages covered) - like Coutinho I'd imagine.

The players would soon speak out if they were fit and clubs were saying otherwise. It would jeopardise their international careers for a start. A scenario like Coutinho is one where we just have to suck it up. We made a bad buy, that's it.

[caster troy]

It will be pretty disappointing if after many years of losing our best players because they want to play Champions League football we finally qualify for the Champions League and have to sell one of our best players.

I'm hoping we can avoid it by shifting to a new model where our reserves in each position are 'up and comers' either from our youth system or signings with potential, as opposed to players like Dendoncker, Augustinsson, Traore etc who would be on much higher wages. I really like Digne but I can see him being sacrificed, Olsen will probably go, Buendia will be back so no Zaniolo, Mings will be back so no Lenglet. From a wage bill perspective we should hopefully be a lot leaner after the summer. Based on the January signings of the two young full backs and keeper I think we are headed in that direction.

The positive for me is we aren't too far off where we need to be squad wise, without the injuries this season we'd probably still be in the title race. I'm not sure we need to make many signings in the summer.