Summer Transfer Thread and Gustavo Cisneros Type Rumours.

[pauliewalnuts]

After their take-over, it took Man City three seasons to go from 9th (their last season pre oil money) to the top 4, and that's three years of spending god knows what on anyone they liked.  And it STILL took them three seasons to go up six league places.   Chelsea were already IN the top 4 when Abramovic took over.

We have to stop thinking that simply because we have rich owners, the top 4 is a foregone conclusion for us in the next couple of years.  The current mega-rich owners with Champions League clubs either inherited existing champions league positions, or took a number of seasons and from a starting point well ahead of us.  Leicester are the only team to have done what we want to do, and they haven't qualified for the champions league again since they won the league.

I love the ambition of the five-year plan to be challenging for the top 4 places, which means next season we WOULD be challenging, but I've always felt it was going to be much harder than some people seem to have assumed to get INTO the top 4.  I think we can definitely be challenging at that end by the end of next season, but 'challenging' doesn't mean being sat comfortably in the top 4.

I combine thinking we've missed an opportunity AND agreeing with the above.

I think we've got to be a bit more realistic - all the talk about breaking top four this season is way, way over the top in terms of what is realistic and what is not. It's going to take much longer than that.

[Vegas]

Agree Paulie. It’s maybe not quite what we all dreamed of in June, but finishing 10th this year following the loss of a world class player would be progress I think, and we’d be on a better FFP footing to spend big too.

The only challenge is whether that’s enough to keep Emi 1 (and maybe a couple of others) happy.

[ChicagoLion]

After their take-over, it took Man City three seasons to go from 9th (their last season pre oil money) to the top 4, and that's three years of spending god knows what on anyone they liked.  And it STILL took them three seasons to go up six league places.   Chelsea were already IN the top 4 when Abramovic took over.

We have to stop thinking that simply because we have rich owners, the top 4 is a foregone conclusion for us in the next couple of years.  The current mega-rich owners with Champions League clubs either inherited existing champions league positions, or took a number of seasons and from a starting point well ahead of us.  Leicester are the only team to have done what we want to do, and they haven't qualified for the champions league again since they won the league.

I love the ambition of the five-year plan to be challenging for the top 4 places, which means next season we WOULD be challenging, but I've always felt it was going to be much harder than some people seem to have assumed to get INTO the top 4.  I think we can definitely be challenging at that end by the end of next season, but 'challenging' doesn't mean being sat comfortably in the top 4.

I combine thinking we've missed an opportunity AND agreeing with the above.

I think we've got to be a bit more realistic - all the talk about breaking top four this season is way, way over the top in terms of what is realistic and what is not. It's going to take much longer than that.

The idiot leaving has put paid to any chance that we had of breaking into Top 4. With him and the players we signed we could have been up there or getting close enough to make the next step. Now we look like a club that are at the mercy of the "Big Clubs" I was hoping it was going to be different this time but the reality is we are with the pack.

[Risso]

Top 4 was never really realistic, as to compete over 38 games with the likes of Man U, Man City, Liverpool and Chelsea would take some doing. Outside of that though, it’s all pretty much of a muchness. Our main problem in my opinion is we’re saddled with a lower league manager who’s been given a third of a billion quid to spend but whose managerial ability really doesn’t warrant the faith the owners have shown him. He doesn’t have the tactical ability nor is he a draw for top players to get us into the top 6..

[London Villan]

When an opportunity presents itself you have to grasp it. The FFP rules, turmoil at other clubs and a bucketload of cash in the bank gave us the opportunity to do that this summer, but we havent been brave.

12 months time and a mid-table finish will see ambitious players look elsewhere and so the cycle continues.

[Steve67]

Top 4 was never really realistic, as to compete over 38 games with the likes of Man U, Man City, Liverpool and Chelsea would take some doing. Outside of that though, it’s all pretty much of a muchness. Our main problem in my opinion is we’re saddled with a lower league manager who’s been given a third of a billion quid to spend but whose managerial ability really doesn’t warrant the faith the owners have shown him. He doesn’t have the tactical ability nor is he a draw for top players to get us into the top 6..

Say what you really think Risso.  Joking aside, I have always wondered where Dean's ceiling will be.

[dave.woodhall]

Top 4 was never really realistic, as to compete over 38 games with the likes of Man U, Man City, Liverpool and Chelsea would take some doing. Outside of that though, it’s all pretty much of a muchness. Our main problem in my opinion is we’re saddled with a lower league manager who’s been given a third of a billion quid to spend but whose managerial ability really doesn’t warrant the faith the owners have shown him. He doesn’t have the tactical ability nor is he a draw for top players to get us into the top 6..

You keep on about Smith yet this lower league manager has improved us year on year for three seasons and every time he's supposedly incapable of something he's managed to do it.

[Monty]

Smith might have a ceiling, we'll see. I worry about it too. But I think the signings and the new coach point to a specific direction this season and we should see if it works. After all, who'd have predicted what David Moyes has managed to do with West Ham?

[chrisw1]

Top 4 was never really realistic, as to compete over 38 games with the likes of Man U, Man City, Liverpool and Chelsea would take some doing. Outside of that though, it’s all pretty much of a muchness. Our main problem in my opinion is we’re saddled with a lower league manager who’s been given a third of a billion quid to spend but whose managerial ability really doesn’t warrant the faith the owners have shown him. He doesn’t have the tactical ability nor is he a draw for top players to get us into the top 6..

That's brutal.  I agree with quite a lot of what you say, but I think that's too far.  We don't know where Smith can get to, all managers have to start somewhere altgough admittedly some do get a big leg up.  I do think the point regarding attracting players could be an issue and losing Terry and Jack probably didn't help in that respect.

But we'll see.  Smith has still got credit in the bank for me.  As for the money spent, the players aren't solely his choice and other than Wes I don't think we've chucked too much money down the drain.

[john e]

Good example when you talk about managers ceilings Is Man United and Chelsea
Both got great squads brimming with talent

Who’s got the best chance of winning the league this season - Chelsea
Swap managers, Tuchel in at Man United and Ole in at Chelsea

Who’s got the best chance now

[Ketzster]

Top 4 was never really realistic, as to compete over 38 games with the likes of Man U, Man City, Liverpool and Chelsea would take some doing. Outside of that though, it’s all pretty much of a muchness. Our main problem in my opinion is we’re saddled with a lower league manager who’s been given a third of a billion quid to spend but whose managerial ability really doesn’t warrant the faith the owners have shown him. He doesn’t have the tactical ability nor is he a draw for top players to get us into the top 6..

I agree. We are wasting the opportunity we have at the moment

[RamboandBruno]

Top 4 was never really realistic, as to compete over 38 games with the likes of Man U, Man City, Liverpool and Chelsea would take some doing. Outside of that though, it’s all pretty much of a muchness. Our main problem in my opinion is we’re saddled with a lower league manager who’s been given a third of a billion quid to spend but whose managerial ability really doesn’t warrant the faith the owners have shown him. He doesn’t have the tactical ability nor is he a draw for top players to get us into the top 6..

That's brutal.  I agree with quite a lot of what you say, but I think that's too far.  We don't know where Smith can get to, all managers have to start somewhere altgough admittedly some do get a big leg up.  I do think the point regarding attracting players could be an issue and losing Terry and Jack probably didn't help in that respect.

But we'll see.  Smith has still got credit in the bank for me.  As for the money spent, the players aren't solely his choice and other than Wes I don't think we've chucked too much money down the drain.

It’s brutal and also in some parts just not right IMO. Whether Smith can get villa to where they want to be near the top of tree is open to debate and time will tell either way, but he’s already proved he’s not a lower league manager. And in what way doesn’t he warrant the faith, getting up, staying up, 11th, progress every step of the way. The next parts harder and will test him and he’ll either succeed or he won’t, but lower league manager is too harsh on him.

[Monty]

Good example when you talk about managers ceilings Is Man United and Chelsea
Both got great squads brimming with talent

Who’s got the best chance of winning the league this season - Chelsea
Swap managers, Tuchel in at Man United and Ole in at Chelsea

Who’s got the best chance now

But how about swapping Dean with Arteta, Nuno, Rodgers or Moyes? You could make an argument for a couple of them, but it's at best arguable. This is hardly as clear-cut as the Solskjaer business, IMO.

[john e]

Good example when you talk about managers ceilings Is Man United and Chelsea
Both got great squads brimming with talent

Who’s got the best chance of winning the league this season - Chelsea
Swap managers, Tuchel in at Man United and Ole in at Chelsea

Who’s got the best chance now

But how about swapping Dean with Arteta, Nuno, Rodgers or Moyes? You could make an argument for a couple of them, but it's at best arguable. This is hardly as clear-cut as the Solskjaer business, IMO.

Good example when you talk about managers ceilings Is Man United and Chelsea
Both got great squads brimming with talent

Who’s got the best chance of winning the league this season - Chelsea
Swap managers, Tuchel in at Man United and Ole in at Chelsea

Who’s got the best chance now

But how about swapping Dean with Arteta, Nuno, Rodgers or Moyes? You could make an argument for a couple of them, but it's at best arguable. This is hardly as clear-cut as the Solskjaer business, IMO.

It’s also only a perception as Solksjaer might go on to win the league as Smith might take us into Europe

[Ian.]

Top 4 was never really realistic, as to compete over 38 games with the likes of Man U, Man City, Liverpool and Chelsea would take some doing. Outside of that though, it’s all pretty much of a muchness. Our main problem in my opinion is we’re saddled with a lower league manager who’s been given a third of a billion quid to spend but whose managerial ability really doesn’t warrant the faith the owners have shown him. He doesn’t have the tactical ability nor is he a draw for top players to get us into the top 6..

Well this seasons a huge one for Smith and if he improves us yet again from the last, your view is flawed. If we manage to finish in the top half he’s done another remarkable job.

It was a mixed bag last year and he outwitted some of the best mangers, yet failed against others. So far he’s doing a fantastic job.