Villa Park Redevelopment

[chrisw1]

Incidentally a few months ago we resubmitted the plans without Villa Live.

Why didn’t we pause the whole thing then?

They wanted to downgrade Villa Live.  There was no reason not to resubmit the stand at the same time to retain the planning permission.

What I mean is - downgraded Villa Live, then shortly after pause the entire thing. It can't be that they've had some sort of epiphany between that and now?

Just pause it there and then.

There's something afoot.

Because they didn't need to.  Why not just keep the planning permission alive at no extra effort or cost?

We still have planning permission now even though we've canned it. Our intention is immaterial.

The discussion from Paulie was why not can it at the point of downgrading the Villa Live planning.  My point was just that there was no need to.

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Incidentally a few months ago we resubmitted the plans without Villa Live.

Why didn’t we pause the whole thing then?

They wanted to downgrade Villa Live.  There was no reason not to resubmit the stand at the same time to retain the planning permission.

What I mean is - downgraded Villa Live, then shortly after pause the entire thing. It can't be that they've had some sort of epiphany between that and now?

Just pause it there and then.

There's something afoot.

Exactly. The GA+ is more popular now than October. But what has changed since we amended planning?

Probably the most important off the field matter since 2018 with Comcast investment vehicle de facto buying into our club by purchasing a portion of NWSE, with all their stadium owning and stadium building exprience.

But its all about 200 tickets, too fast etc etc. Sure, sure, sure.

[Villan82]

The thing is, the thought of a brand new Villa Park on the existing site is really exciting, even it would mean playing our home games in Leicester or Wolverhampton for a couple of years.

We're going to have 10,000 fewer seats than Everton (Everton, ffs), probably 20k fewer than Newcastle will when they extend / move, 20k fewer than West Ham, 18k fewer than Spurs, and we'll be in a stadium where two of the stands are genuinely not fit for purpose.

I have a problem with how utterly small time that is.

That's why redeveloping the North Stand made sense. Get us to 50k and all the bells and whistles in a new stand. Reassess and then see what can be done with the Witton. By all accounts we do pretty good hospitality in the Trinity. Keep the Holte as the stand of the die hard fans.

We'd still have a smaller ground than the aforementioned and we'd lack seriously behind the majority facility wise and money generation potential as a result. It makes no sense when you consider it from that point of view.

You then do a deal with the council and you focus on building over Witton Lane as your next project after the North is rebuilt and you start the lower tier of the new Witton closer to the pitch- there is wasted space at the front of the current Witton.

It's probably as cost effective to buy the houses and go back three times further than the current Witton footprint as it is to spunk over a billion on a new build 60,000 stadium

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The thing is, the thought of a brand new Villa Park on the existing site is really exciting, even it would mean playing our home games in Leicester or Wolverhampton for a couple of years.

We're going to have 10,000 fewer seats than Everton (Everton, ffs), probably 20k fewer than Newcastle will when they extend / move, 20k fewer than West Ham, 18k fewer than Spurs, and we'll be in a stadium where two of the stands are genuinely not fit for purpose.

I have a problem with how utterly small time that is.

That's why redeveloping the North Stand made sense. Get us to 50k and all the bells and whistles in a new stand. Reassess and then see what can be done with the Witton. By all accounts we do pretty good hospitality in the Trinity. Keep the Holte as the stand of the die hard fans.

We'd still have a smaller ground than the aforementioned and we'd lack seriously behind the majority facility wise and money generation potential as a result. It makes no sense when you consider it from that point of view.

You then do a deal with the council and you focus on building over Witton Lane as your next project after the North is rebuilt and you start the lower tier of the new Witton closer tot he pitch- there is wasted space at the front of the current Witton.

And what sort of deal do you do to make the Trinity offer up more space for facilities for GA, add the volume of corporate to it that makes it compete with our contemporaries?

Villa Park is inadequate to compete with Everton, West Ham, Arsenal, Spurs, Man City etc etc etc

[chrisw1]

I think you're going to be very disappointed ADS.

[Villan82]

As far as I remember Ads, the North Stand plans included revamp of the Trinity to maximise that space so in my vision you have three sides of the existing ground brought into the 21st century in terms of offerings and you retain the magnificent Holte End as the stand for the diehard fan. Also, every other club fanbase is jealous that we end up with a modern stadium that still retains history, heritage and character. People always remark on Villa Park. It is a unique place.

And we get to keep playing at Villa Park while its done. And it is achievable.

I think some of Everton's issues were caused by how big an undertaking their full rebuild turned out to be. Arsenal have never been quite the same since losing Highbury and Spurs, yeah, it worked out well for them but then again WHL was never in the same bracket as Villa Park, Highbury, Goodison etc.

[PeterWithesShin]

I reckon that the odds of us spending 3-4 years playing at another ground while VP is completely rebuilt are zero.

[Dogtanian]

I am sure they're looking at a new stadium. Everything make sense, and it's the only way the Comcast deal makes sense.

Comcast are listed on the Nasdaq. I'm pretty sure they don't want Villa making comments about the potential of them funding a new stadium, sure to be a billion dollar project, before all the options are explored and they have something to present in a controlled and investor-friendly fashion.

Just imagine the sell frenzy when they see the state of our new badge.

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I think you're going to be very disappointed ADS.

Why do you think Comcast investment vehicle has bought into the parent group? Do you find it coincidental that the plans are almost immediately halted to rebuild the North? Did you believe the rebuild would provide parity with Everton/Spurs?

For avoidance of doubt, Oliver Stone is a crank and LHO shot Kennedy on his own, like the good Marine marksman he was. But this doesn't require a 200 ticket Zapurder film on the grassy knoll in Aston Park.

[Risso]

I reckon that the odds of us spending 3-4 years playing at another ground while VP is completely rebuilt are zero.

Why would it have to be that long? The Spurs ground was shifted slightly off its original footprint so that construction could begin with the old stadium still in use. They then knocked all of WHL down in June 2017. The stadium was built by September 2018, but problems meant it wasn't properly open until April 19. Without the electrical problems it would have been a year, but even so it was still less than two.

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For all the heritage, I'm mid 30s and since my first game, 75% of that Villa Park no longer exists. Trigger's broom and a that.

[nick harper]

Am I right in saying we have committed to hosting games at the Euros? If that’s the case, no rebuild on the site could start for another 4.5 years at least. A 3 year build would take us to 2031, so a long time to be behind other clubs in terms of development and size. Unai might not see any of this.

[Villan82]

I reckon that the odds of us spending 3-4 years playing at another ground while VP is completely rebuilt are zero.

Why would it have to be that long? The Spurs ground was shifted slightly off its original footprint so that construction could begin with the old stadium still in use. They then knocked all of WHL down in June 2017. The stadium was built by September 2018, but problems meant it wasn't properly open until April 19. Without the electrical problems it would have been a year, but even so it was still less than two.

Looking at google maps, you could shift us back a bit towards Witton but it would be a hell of a big undertaking for the sake of a slightly squarer Trinity Holte Corner (Witton Lane still hems us in at the other end) and I like the chracter of the Holte Witton corner.

I still prefer the idea of a new North and a new Witton after that.

[Villan82]

Didn't Heck say they are doubling the size of the existing club shop? Seems to rule out rebuilding further back on the current site?

[Dogtanian]

Didn't Heck say they are doubling the size of the existing club shop? Seems to rule out rebuilding further back on the current site?

Isn't that building on two floors? There's also the ticket office in there. Again, planning permission would have had to be put in by now if they were going to do anything other than shifting things about in existing buildings any time soon.