Champions League restructuring

[ChicagoLion]

It has gone away, they tried and failed.

But the problem hasn’t

[sickbeggar]

The big question for me is how much of this was totally greed motivated or was it accompanied with a fair amount of desperation . Obviously some of the clubs don't need the money but if those debts figures flying around for some of the clubs are correct did they look a year down the line and panic? Woodward apparently wasn't happy with FFP according to the UEFA bod. Was that in relation to others or Man U? If it was others then it would be odd to get into bed with them a day later. The Glazers only managed to buy the club using a scaled up version of a Ocean Finance package anyway so they're always vulnerable. Arsenal and Tottenham always give the impression they're not overflowing with the cash before COVID.  I can't imagine the Italian clubs are doing better than our clubs financially at the moment and the Spanish big two appear to be financial basket cases.  Last gasp of the old order perhaps with those clubs without the Sugardaddies realising they need to cut back spending big time or go tits up?

[cdbearsfan]

It just needs the banks to call in the debt of these clubs and they are gone.

Real would get a bail out again. I'll happily still sign Messi to help Barcelona.

[Brend'Watkins]

John Barnes spoke some sense this morning on the subject on BBC Breakfast.  Salary caps, Man City with an unfair advantage, proper socialist he was.

[sickbeggar]

John Barnes spoke some sense this morning on the subject on BBC Breakfast.  Salary caps, Man City with an unfair advantage, proper socialist he was.

yeah made a good point about how the remaining PL clubs would have jumped on the bandwagon if they'd been offered access to the ESL whatever their public spiel spouting about protecting the game/fans.

[ChicagoLion]

The big question for me is how much of this was totally greed motivated or was it accompanied with a fair amount of desperation . Obviously some of the clubs don't need the money but if those debts figures flying around for some of the clubs are correct did they look a year down the line and panic? Woodward apparently wasn't happy with FFP according to the UEFA bod. Was that in relation to others or Man U? If it was others then it would be odd to get into bed with them a day later. The Glazers only managed to buy the club using a scaled up version of a Ocean Finance package anyway so they're always vulnerable. Arsenal and Tottenham always give the impression they're not overflowing with the cash before COVID.  I can't imagine the Italian clubs are doing better than our clubs financially at the moment and the Spanish big two appear to be financial basket cases.  Last gasp of the old order perhaps with those clubs without the Sugardaddies realising they need to cut back spending big time or go tits up?

good post,
Many of these clubs are in Financial distress and this was driven by desperation more than greed.
There is a real possibility of Bankruptcy and why the offer of a huge cash payment via the JPM facility was a massive incentive.
The football authorities are mindful of contagion in the event of a big failure of a major club because of the money owed to other clubs. This is not dissimilar to the European Banking crisis because if one creditor defaults you set off the dominos.
The seriously indebted clubs may have no choice but to look to a restructuring process if they can not secure financial support.
Recent events is going to drive financial market reticence.

[Rico]

Maybe UEFA should just rebrand the Champions League as the Super League.  I mean the whole Champions League thing is a farce now anyway. The majority of the teams in it are not actually champions anyway. When did Tottenham last win  the league?

Instead of the crazy idea of the ESL maybe it would be better to go back to the straight forward honest to God knock out competition for champions only. It's got to be more exciting than the tedious never ending group stages.

At the end of the day this all comes down to the fact that Barca, Real Madrid and Juve are skint. Well tough shit. Barca and Real are probably the two most corrupt clubs on earth. If they can't get by with the incredible amounts of money that they generate then they will have to learn to cut their cloth accordingly.

[Clive W]

The big question for me is how much of this was totally greed motivated or was it accompanied with a fair amount of desperation . Obviously some of the clubs don't need the money but if those debts figures flying around for some of the clubs are correct did they look a year down the line and panic? Woodward apparently wasn't happy with FFP according to the UEFA bod. Was that in relation to others or Man U? If it was others then it would be odd to get into bed with them a day later. The Glazers only managed to buy the club using a scaled up version of a Ocean Finance package anyway so they're always vulnerable. Arsenal and Tottenham always give the impression they're not overflowing with the cash before COVID.  I can't imagine the Italian clubs are doing better than our clubs financially at the moment and the Spanish big two appear to be financial basket cases.  Last gasp of the old order perhaps with those clubs without the Sugardaddies realising they need to cut back spending big time or go tits up?

I think this was led by Perez at RM - which means that it was driven by desperation. By all normal laws of business and economics, RM and Barca should have been liquidated years ago.

Barca weren’t able to pay the wages in January and still owe other clubs £Ms in transfer fees. The fee for Coutinho (sp?) hasn’t been paid and he left 3 years ago.

I’m not sure how these two clubs will recover from this -  but they undoubtedly will; propped up by more debt secured on ever diminishing assets

[Abbeyfealeavfc]

The scab 6 f-cked up, but I don't feel sorry for their fans. This has been coming for a long time, but I've never noticed them taking an active stance against sky, the premier league, the champions league, dodgy refs, ffp, var, biased coverage on tv and in newspapers etc because all those factors have kept them at the top of the pile at the expense of everyone else. Sure they did well voicing their concerns about the esl, but for me that's like bolting the stable door after the horse has bolted. I'd prefer to feel sorry for the fans of all other clubs not enticed by the esl. Do I think the 6 scum clubs should be punished? Yes. Will it happen? Probably not. Will the 6 continue to be pandered over by the rule makers and visual/written media? Yes.
Remember the champions league was contested by red scouse and spuds a couple of years ago who hadn't won their domestic league in approx 20+ years and 50+ years respectively. Champions of what exactly? The whole thing is a joke and isn't going to get any better. In a few days/weeks this will be brushed away and the likes of sky and the press will be doing the work of the scum 6 unsettling clubs and players again by "speculating" that red scouse want Ollie, or manure want Jack.
Sadly the withdrawal of the 6 from the esl is not the end of this matter. A huge overhaul is needed to ensure these 6 clubs are not favoured going forwards.

[oishiiniku]

I don't get the idea that 'these clubs shouldn't be punished because it hurts the fans more than the owners'. If a club went bankrupt, or fielded an ineligible player, or failed FFP they would potentially face a points deduction. Fans would have no say or responsibility in those matters either but that would make no difference to the severity of the punishment. What these clubs have done is WAY worse  than those examples - they've said that they are bigger and better than everyone else and tried to destroy football for the sake of their own greed for money and power - so why are we suddenly saying that it should all just be swept under the rug? I know that it's most likely that there will be no direct repercussions but personally I think that just shows how much power these big clubs have compared to the Premier League and UEFA.

[ChicagoLion]

The big question for me is how much of this was totally greed motivated or was it accompanied with a fair amount of desperation . Obviously some of the clubs don't need the money but if those debts figures flying around for some of the clubs are correct did they look a year down the line and panic? Woodward apparently wasn't happy with FFP according to the UEFA bod. Was that in relation to others or Man U? If it was others then it would be odd to get into bed with them a day later. The Glazers only managed to buy the club using a scaled up version of a Ocean Finance package anyway so they're always vulnerable. Arsenal and Tottenham always give the impression they're not overflowing with the cash before COVID.  I can't imagine the Italian clubs are doing better than our clubs financially at the moment and the Spanish big two appear to be financial basket cases.  Last gasp of the old order perhaps with those clubs without the Sugardaddies realising they need to cut back spending big time or go tits up?

I think this was led by Perez at RM - which means that it was driven by desperation. By all normal laws of business and economics, RM and Barca should have been liquidated years ago.

Barca weren’t able to pay the wages in January and still owe other clubs £Ms in transfer fees. The fee for Coutinho (sp?) hasn’t been paid and he left 3 years ago.

I’m not sure how these two clubs will recover from this -  but they undoubtedly will; propped up by more debt secured on ever diminishing assets

they ran out of road regarding assets that can be leveraged, the Spanish and Italian clubs are stacked with soft loans, Real has had Government support which is now supposedly ruled out. Manure has to roll over and supplement its Bond at higher cost and less favourable terms and that is before covenant breach.Spurs are fucked because of the stadium and Covid Arsenal have owners that won’t put their own money in.
Woodward is ex JPM

[Exeter 77]

Henry desperately trying to get Liverpool fans back onside.
https://twitter.com/LFC/status/1384763846557147142?s=19

[Drummond]

I quite like a Manure fan's suggestion that all teams be deducted 25 points, so Arsenal are relegated.

Fuck that. They can all go. Bunch of unscrupulous, self-centred, greedy wankers.

As for revamping Champions League, it should now revert to what it was before, the European Cup (I'd even be prepared to potentially allow a country more than one representative, for the defending champions, UEFA Cup winners and the national cup winners. Its the jeopardy of knockout that makes sport what it is.

I really don't think there will be any punishment, which is a shame. I suspect the reason Chelsea and Man City pulled out is because of the threat of losing a Semi Final place this season.

[Exeter 77]

I'm a bit surprised UEFA hasn't tried to restructure European club competitions in the small way as the Nations League.

[The Edge]

The scab 6 f-cked up, but I don't feel sorry for their fans. This has been coming for a long time, but I've never noticed them taking an active stance against sky, the premier league, the champions league, dodgy refs, ffp, var, biased coverage on tv and in newspapers etc because all those factors have kept them at the top of the pile at the expense of everyone else. Sure they did well voicing their concerns about the esl, but for me that's like bolting the stable door after the horse has bolted. I'd prefer to feel sorry for the fans of all other clubs not enticed by the esl. Do I think the 6 scum clubs should be punished? Yes. Will it happen? Probably not. Will the 6 continue to be pandered over by the rule makers and visual/written media? Yes.
Remember the champions league was contested by red scouse and spuds a couple of years ago who hadn't won their domestic league in approx 20+ years and 50+ years respectively. Champions of what exactly? The whole thing is a joke and isn't going to get any better. In a few days/weeks this will be brushed away and the likes of sky and the press will be doing the work of the scum 6 unsettling clubs and players again by "speculating" that red scouse want Ollie, or manure want Jack.
Sadly the withdrawal of the 6 from the esl is not the end of this matter. A huge overhaul is needed to ensure these 6 clubs are not favoured going forwards.

Excellent post Abbeyfeale