Summer transfer, gossip, speculation and the usual butter ollocks thread

[OCD]

It's also quite an unfounded assumption to think that we would automatically draw a manager that would make targets stand up and take notice. Does it go that we could flick a switch and have someone like Poch join? What if then players still had the same thoughts ('do I want to play in a less fashionable city for a club who were in a relegation fight and only survived on the last day?' - Rashica argument).

[Sexual Ealing]

People are knocking me for saying that IF our targets don't want to sign for us because of Smith that he should be replaced.

If we are start this season with this squad it is entirely possible with our start that we will be bottom 3 heading into December. How many games do people think the board would give smith to turn it around with a 3rd of the season gone?

My follow up point about a new manager trying to rebuild in January is also totally valid. We can all love smith as much as we want but the football has been crap! He does not know what formation he wants to play and he can't attract his targets (supposedly).
Add to that we have one of the best players in the country shoe horned into the left wing position because that's the only option because we have mo other effective wingers.
I'm indifferent to Smith and have zero loyalty to him. He is going to be a flash in the pan of this club and he will be long gone by the time i meet my maker so why shouldn't I be more concerned with my club than some bloke who has had 2 extremely lucky end of season runs one to get us up and one to stay up. Nobody here can tell me it was his tactics that got us up and not the fact Jack came back from injury like a man possessed.

Anyway this is the transfer thread and a lot of what I have just said is hypothetical as was in my first post.
 I want us to be decisive and go get players ready for the first team not squad players and nothing we have been linked with seems to have any legs.
If we end up with another season of random players for all over Europe I will be worried. We need 2 more star players to go with Jack to kick on and 1 absolutely has to be a striker and 1 a winger. Until we have a solid link or an itsotp I'm going to remain concerned.

I'll leave you to continue sniping at posts you don't agree with. Enjoy

What if our targets don't want to come to Brum? Should we move to London?

Works for me.

[ktvillan]

Let's assume that we did get rid of a manager who allegedly can't attract top players (which in itself is the daftest reason I can think of).

Then let's imagine a conversation with a prospective replacement:

"How long was the last bloke in the job."

"One and a half seasons. He came in midway through the first one."

"What did he do then?"

"Took us from mid-table, broke an all-time club record for consecutive wins and got us promoted."

"And the season after?"

"Started off badly but kept us up with the best escape in Premier League history."

"I'll get back to you on that one."

Alternatively the prospective appointee might ask "then why have you got rid of him?" to which the answer might be "we feel that he has reached his ceiling in terms of ability and where he can take us and we want to go on to better things - preferably with you".

I'm not saying that's what we should do but I'd say there's a case for it given how lost and out of his depth Smith looked at times last season, and the fact that sometimes you have to be ruthless in the pursuit of success. 

However ultimately he didn't "underachieve" given that many of us would have taken/expected 17th at the start of last season, but it was very much skin of the teeth. 

So, for me,  he just about deserves a shot at the second season but I think he needs to display an early step up in performances and results if he is to still be in a job by Christmas.

[Villafirst]

Trouble is, quite rightly DS said he didn't want a Douglas Luiz situation where he signed just 2 days from the start of the new season. But that's starting to unfold again I'm afraid.

[dave.woodhall]

Let's assume that we did get rid of a manager who allegedly can't attract top players (which in itself is the daftest reason I can think of).

Then let's imagine a conversation with a prospective replacement:

"How long was the last bloke in the job."

"One and a half seasons. He came in midway through the first one."

"What did he do then?"

"Took us from mid-table, broke an all-time club record for consecutive wins and got us promoted."

"And the season after?"

"Started off badly but kept us up with the best escape in Premier League history."

"I'll get back to you on that one."

Alternatively the prospective appointee might ask "then why have you got rid of him?" to which the answer might be "we feel that he has reached his ceiling in terms of ability and where he can take us and we want to go on to better things - preferably with you".

I'm not saying that's what we should do but I'd say there's a case for it given how lost and out of his depth Smith looked at times last season, and the fact that sometimes you have to be ruthless in the pursuit of success. 

However ultimately he didn't "underachieve" given that many of us would have taken/expected 17th at the start of last season, but it was very much skin of the teeth. 

So, for me,  he just about deserves a shot at the second season but I think he needs to display an early step up in performances and results if he is to still be in a job by Christmas.

And so we go back to the same flawed argument from last season - get rid of a manager who has so far achieved every target set for him in the hope that someone better 'might' be available.

[ASHTONVILLA]

It's also quite an unfounded assumption to think that we would automatically draw a manager that would make targets stand up and take notice. Does it go that we could flick a switch and have someone like Poch join? What if then players still had the same thoughts ('do I want to play in a less fashionable city for a club who were in a relegation fight and only survived on the last day?' - Rashica argument).

If Everton can get Ancelotti, we could get Pocchettino.

[chrisw1]

It's also quite an unfounded assumption to think that we would automatically draw a manager that would make targets stand up and take notice. Does it go that we could flick a switch and have someone like Poch join? What if then players still had the same thoughts ('do I want to play in a less fashionable city for a club who were in a relegation fight and only survived on the last day?' - Rashica argument).

If Everton can get Ancelotti, we could get Pocchettino.

Because it's that easy.

[Sexual Ealing]

It's also quite an unfounded assumption to think that we would automatically draw a manager that would make targets stand up and take notice. Does it go that we could flick a switch and have someone like Poch join? What if then players still had the same thoughts ('do I want to play in a less fashionable city for a club who were in a relegation fight and only survived on the last day?' - Rashica argument).

If Everton can get Ancelotti, we could get Pocchettino.

Everton wouldn't have got Ancelotti at the height of his powers, and Villa won't be getting Pochettino at the height of his. Nor would Ireland have got Trapattoni when he was good, or Colchester with Teddy Sheringham.

[ktvillan]

Let's assume that we did get rid of a manager who allegedly can't attract top players (which in itself is the daftest reason I can think of).

Then let's imagine a conversation with a prospective replacement:

"How long was the last bloke in the job."

"One and a half seasons. He came in midway through the first one."

"What did he do then?"

"Took us from mid-table, broke an all-time club record for consecutive wins and got us promoted."

"And the season after?"

"Started off badly but kept us up with the best escape in Premier League history."

"I'll get back to you on that one."

Alternatively the prospective appointee might ask "then why have you got rid of him?" to which the answer might be "we feel that he has reached his ceiling in terms of ability and where he can take us and we want to go on to better things - preferably with you".

I'm not saying that's what we should do but I'd say there's a case for it given how lost and out of his depth Smith looked at times last season, and the fact that sometimes you have to be ruthless in the pursuit of success. 

However ultimately he didn't "underachieve" given that many of us would have taken/expected 17th at the start of last season, but it was very much skin of the teeth. 

So, for me,  he just about deserves a shot at the second season but I think he needs to display an early step up in performances and results if he is to still be in a job by Christmas.

And so we go back to the same flawed argument from last season - get rid of a manager who has so far achieved every target set for him in the hope that someone better 'might' be available.

It's not so much about what he's done so far - he probably over achieved by getting us promoted a year earlier than targeted - it's more about where we want to go and whether he is the man to take us there.    As I said I think he's just about earned the chance to have a go but I'm not convinced. 

Hope has nothing to do with it.  I wouldn't expect us to not have some possible replacements on the radar and/or sounded out if they did decide  it isn't working with Smith.  Good coaches are available now - Pochettino, Alegri, and Benitez might return if offered a good chunk of wedge and transfer funds.   They might not want to come to us but if Everton can get Ancelotti and Newcastle can get Benitez, who knows?  And I'd like to think Purslow and co. have knowledge of others that might see us as a step up.  Some will be available between now and December some might consider leaving their present clubs for a crack at the PL with a big club with huge potential.

Clubs like Spurs and Liverpool don't hesitate to get shot if they think someone is not up to getting them to the very top.  It sometimes doesn't work out, but I see it as a sign of calculated ruthless ambition rather than a flawed approach. 

[dave.woodhall]

And how exactly has that worked out for Spurs?

[VILLA MOLE]

I am not sure I subscribe to a new big name manager will bring in the big name players .  I want an up and coming manager who believes in a project and can unearth a few gems and make them by coaching into something special

[Rudy Can't Fail]

If Everton can get Ancelotti, we could get Pocchettino.

Barcelona couldn't get him last week (due to his love of neighbours Espanyol) so that's one point we have going for us. Sadly, in his case, it's probably our only attractive point right now. When we are in a position/need to bring in a top international coach, I hope we still have the money to spend. It's an expensive game now in the top half of the PL.

[ASHTONVILLA]

Swift was at Deanos Brentford  on loan from Chelsea.

Pochettino wouldn't know such gems as Konsa, Watkins and Swift .
I'm happy to keep Deano and his magic in  player squad development

it is not clear that Swift or Watkins are gems at Premier League level, they would be a punt. Neither would Pochettino be less likely to be aware of them. It is far from clear that Konsa is a gem too, for most of last season he looked like a dud we had overpaid for. Towards the end he was much improved but the jury is still out.

I think Smith has just about earned another go, but would not hesitate to replace him if a higher calibre manager like Pochettino was available.

[Drummond]

Preparing a bid is like doing a capex requisition.  You explain the rationale then send it to Risso who rejects it for a typo omission.

Preparing a bid is rather like making love to a beautiful woman. You have to get in there before somebody else does. Yes I have been watching repeats of The Fast Show on UK Gold.

You mean this week, you've been mostly watching repeats of  The Fast Show.

Which was nice.

What? With his reputation?

[ozzjim]

Konsa never looked a dud to me - for a kid of his age he looked like he had massive potential all season.

Watkins has all the attributes to make a good fist of the Prem too. Swift I don't have a clue, looks tidy enough on the ball.

I agree though, Poch was interested we should be ruthless and get him in.