Dean Smith - Confirmed

[N'ZMAV]

We are improving year on year, but it's clear that either Deano doesn't quite know how to mould the kind of precise-moving attacking unit the top of the modern game demands*, or some of the players have been made to look much, much better than they were by the best attacking player in the country. No shame in either necessarily, we'll keep on progressing I'm sure, but this run has been a bit of a wake-up call. Sheff U, Brighton, Newcastle, these are some tremendously shit teams we've failed to beat, and it's  pretty fucking worrying.

*Apologies for unforgivable slippage into Jonathan Wilson voice.

it's strange, some times I look at the season so far and I'm really pleased with what we've done....

We've won the three away games I was desperate for us to win: Leeds, Wolves & WBA...
But, then some of the basics in other performances and results have been toss.

If we can finish top half, it'll have been good - but something of a 'what might have been' is in mind too

[Monty]

The problem is that when you see how well we can play, it's hard to accept how badly we sometimes do play.

[Risso]

So none at all then, that's sort of what I thought.

Oh come on.
Its just round the corner though isn't it?
People are thinking it.
He's "Not a big name" so its not possible for him to be a success.
I don't see our owners having a problem at this moment in time though.

People might be thinking it but unless you've suddenly ganed the ability to read minds, I'm not sure how you've come to that conclusion. In any case, people thinking it is a world away from a ridiculous claim that "sack the manager" posts are now so common that they're monotonous.  Unless monotonous has been been redfined to mean "non-existent."

[villa for life]

I think one criticism that can be leveled at Smith is how and why he decided to turn McGinn, once one of the best attacking midfielders in the league,  into a very average defensive midfielder.

Moving McGinn further forward could help both  him and villa find their form again. Why doesn’t he do it?

[dave.woodhall]

So none at all then, that's sort of what I thought.

Oh come on.
Its just round the corner though isn't it?
People are thinking it.
He's "Not a big name" so its not possible for him to be a success.
I don't see our owners having a problem at this moment in time though.

People might be thinking it but unless you've suddenly ganed the ability to read minds, I'm not sure how you've come to that conclusion. In any case, people thinking it is a world away from a ridiculous claim that "sack the manager" posts are now so common that they're monotonous.  Unless monotonous has been been redfined to mean "non-existent."

Which isn't what I said at all.

[Sexual Ealing]

I think it strikes as self entitled to be honest. Very Wolves esq. levels of petulance. Stamping your feet and shouting "don't you know who I am?" achieves nothing.

There's more to the top half of this table than us. What has the team directly above us been doing in our lost decade? Winning the European Cup and title, by signing £60m players.

What about the one above? Developing the best centre forward in Europe, competing in the Champions League, getting rid of the best pound for pound manager in Europe and replacing him with a name as big as Mourinho. Moving into a £1bn stadium that holds 61,000.

What about the team above Spurs, what have they been doing in our lost decade? Spending half a billion and attracting one of the most successful managers in Europe, making preparations to build a new ground.

And West Ham? Getting a new ground for free that is 50% larger than ours. Being able to spend £40m on flops and finally, for this season at least, reinventing Everton of 2007 vintage.

And Chelsea? Winning titles, trophies, playing in Champions League football, spending hundreds of millions.

Leicester? Sliding doors and all that, but winning the title, spending and investing heavily. Showing an avenue to others like us of what can be achieved in time.

The Manchester clubs speak for themselves.

Yes we're loaded, yes we have Grealish, yes we are Aston fuckimg Villa. But glance in the mirror, see where we have been very recently and what clubs who can say "we're fucking Chelsea" or "we're fucking Everton" too and it makes the demands seem ridiculous. It has to be earned.

Ads, I don't know whether you've changed or I have, but I can't think of a time when I've agreed more with a post. Perhaps it's just that we're not in Off Topic!

[Risso]

What exactly did you mean by


"It's getting a bit monotonous now. We've had 2 1/2 years of almost unbroken progress yet every time we look poor in a couple of games it's sack the manager."


then?


We've looked poor in the last two games, and indeed, four of the last five, but nobody to my knowledge has actually said "sack the manager." For something to be monotonous it usually has to be repetitious.  "Every time" would certainly point to that.

[JuanMartinez]

I think it strikes as self entitled to be honest. Very Wolves esq. levels of petulance. Stamping your feet and shouting "don't you know who I am?" achieves nothing.

There's more to the top half of this table than us. What has the team directly above us been doing in our lost decade? Winning the European Cup and title, by signing £60m players.

What about the one above? Developing the best centre forward in Europe, competing in the Champions League, getting rid of the best pound for pound manager in Europe and replacing him with a name as big as Mourinho. Moving into a £1bn stadium that holds 61,000.

What about the team above Spurs, what have they been doing in our lost decade? Spending half a billion and attracting one of the most successful managers in Europe, making preparations to build a new ground.

And West Ham? Getting a new ground for free that is 50% larger than ours. Being able to spend £40m on flops and finally, for this season at least, reinventing Everton of 2007 vintage.

And Chelsea? Winning titles, trophies, playing in Champions League football, spending hundreds of millions.

Leicester? Sliding doors and all that, but winning the title, spending and investing heavily. Showing an avenue to others like us of what can be achieved in time.

The Manchester clubs speak for themselves.

Yes we're loaded, yes we have Grealish, yes we are Aston fuckimg Villa. But glance in the mirror, see where we have been very recently and what clubs who can say "we're fucking Chelsea" or "we're fucking Everton" too and it makes the demands seem ridiculous. It has to be earned.

You should be the official fans delegate club and us.

Absolutely nail on head.

[dave.woodhall]

What exactly did you mean by


"It's getting a bit monotonous now. We've had 2 1/2 years of almost unbroken progress yet every time we look poor in a couple of games it's sack the manager."


then?


We've looked poor in the last two games, and indeed, four of the last five, but nobody to my knowledge has actually said "sack the manager." For something to be monotonous it usually has to be repetitious.  "Every time" would certainly point to that.

Posters have recently said the manager should be replaced in the summer. You mentioned previous high-profile sackings. There are numerous previous examples of wanting him sacked, even a Smith out thread although I can't quite remember who started it. That's what I mean by monotonous.

[Mister E]

I think it strikes as self entitled to be honest. Very Wolves esq. levels of petulance. Stamping your feet and shouting "don't you know who I am?" achieves nothing.

There's more to the top half of this table than us. What has the team directly above us been doing in our lost decade? Winning the European Cup and title, by signing £60m players.

What about the one above? Developing the best centre forward in Europe, competing in the Champions League, getting rid of the best pound for pound manager in Europe and replacing him with a name as big as Mourinho. Moving into a £1bn stadium that holds 61,000.

What about the team above Spurs, what have they been doing in our lost decade? Spending half a billion and attracting one of the most successful managers in Europe, making preparations to build a new ground.

And West Ham? Getting a new ground for free that is 50% larger than ours. Being able to spend £40m on flops and finally, for this season at least, reinventing Everton of 2007 vintage.

And Chelsea? Winning titles, trophies, playing in Champions League football, spending hundreds of millions.

Leicester? Sliding doors and all that, but winning the title, spending and investing heavily. Showing an avenue to others like us of what can be achieved in time.

The Manchester clubs speak for themselves.

Yes we're loaded, yes we have Grealish, yes we are Aston fuckimg Villa. But glance in the mirror, see where we have been very recently and what clubs who can say "we're fucking Chelsea" or "we're fucking Everton" too and it makes the demands seem ridiculous. It has to be earned.

Good contextualisation - it takes time to build a top 6 squad.
Smith has does fine - it's this summer that will show whether we're 'up' for the next stage in the building programme.


I would add one point: with hindsight, I'd have pushed to bring in Benrahma rather than settle for Traore. I think for the extra dosh we'd have got someone better able to support Watkins and be a more classic winger-type.

[dave.woodhall]

It's ironic that the last time we were in this situation, back in 2007, it was generally accepted that we were doing it the right way, with steady growth rather than throwing Manchester City-style money around.

[Rudy Can't Fail]

The problem is that when you see how well we can play, it's hard to accept how badly we sometimes do play.

Agreed and that sometimes is becoming a nasty habit. After a great December we were robbed at Old Trafford on New Years Day, put in a decent performance against Man City but since then we've looked a completely different side. The results have generally hidden how poor the performances have become. Playing 6 games in 18 days (Man City to Arsenal away) obviously didn't help especially as we don't rotate much.

Even before Jack got injured the performances weren't great but Dean has still kept with the same formation, 4-3-3 even though it's no longer working. Einstein's attributed line: "Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results" very much comes to mind. Tactically it's backs to the wall, hoof it up front for Ollie to hold up, watch it come back, repeat and hope to get a snatch and grab win. As you said, it's frustrating 'when you see how well we can play'.

[tomd2103]

We are improving year on year, but it's clear that either Deano doesn't quite know how to mould the kind of precise-moving attacking unit the top of the modern game demands*, or some of the players have been made to look much, much better than they were by the best attacking player in the country. No shame in either necessarily, we'll keep on progressing I'm sure, but this run has been a bit of a wake-up call. Sheff U, Brighton, Newcastle, these are some tremendously shit teams we've failed to beat, and it's  pretty fucking worrying.

*Apologies for unforgivable slippage into Jonathan Wilson voice.

it's strange, some times I look at the season so far and I'm really pleased with what we've done....

We've won the three away games I was desperate for us to win: Leeds, Wolves & WBA...
But, then some of the basics in other performances and results have been toss.

If we can finish top half, it'll have been good - but something of a 'what might have been' is in mind too

Yep, wins against Sheffield United and last night would have seen us in 6th. 

[Risso]

What exactly did you mean by


"It's getting a bit monotonous now. We've had 2 1/2 years of almost unbroken progress yet every time we look poor in a couple of games it's sack the manager."


then?


We've looked poor in the last two games, and indeed, four of the last five, but nobody to my knowledge has actually said "sack the manager." For something to be monotonous it usually has to be repetitious.  "Every time" would certainly point to that.

Posters have recently said the manager should be replaced in the summer. You mentioned previous high-profile sackings. There are numerous previous examples of wanting him sacked, even a Smith out thread although I can't quite remember who started it. That's what I mean by monotonous.

Ah so now you're having to go back to last season before the coronavirus shut down to back up your "every time" non-argument? When we were genuinely atrocious, and according to most journalists when Smith only stayed in a job because the Chelsea game was cancelled. So monotonous now means "not mentioned at all recently, but was nearly 18 months ago." Gotcha.

[dave.woodhall]

What exactly did you mean by


"It's getting a bit monotonous now. We've had 2 1/2 years of almost unbroken progress yet every time we look poor in a couple of games it's sack the manager."


then?


We've looked poor in the last two games, and indeed, four of the last five, but nobody to my knowledge has actually said "sack the manager." For something to be monotonous it usually has to be repetitious.  "Every time" would certainly point to that.

Posters have recently said the manager should be replaced in the summer. You mentioned previous high-profile sackings. There are numerous previous examples of wanting him sacked, even a Smith out thread although I can't quite remember who started it. That's what I mean by monotonous.

Ah so now you're having to go back to last season before the coronavirus shut down to back up your "every time" non-argument? When we were genuinely atrocious, and according to most journalists when Smith only stayed in a job because the Chelsea game was cancelled. So monotonous now means "not mentioned at all recently, but was nearly 18 months ago." Gotcha.

Funnily enough I am going back to last season because guess what? Last season was part of the timeframe I was talking about, as was the season before that, last week and last night. Not "nearly 18 months ago" at all.