Dean Smith - Confirmed

[ktvillan]

My point is that Grealish and Tuanzebe being missing should not affect the ability of other players to put in effort, control the football, pass and move etc.  Yet they aren't doing much of any of that.  Surely the Coach has to take some of the responsibility for that?

[Chris Smith]

Where Monk is doing a good job is that he is making good use of what he has and has found a style to suit the players at his disposal. Smith is trying to get the players to play how he wants and it is getting worse because the players can't do it.

Monk does not need to worry about building for the future because the club are prevented from doing so. Smith has joined at a time when new owners are looking at the bigger picture and creating something sustainable with an eye on bigger things. This will shape how they operate in the short term.

[Allan C]

From the post-match thread.

The team assembled by Dean Smith played the one he now manages off the park. It’s hardly stretching credulity to expect that when he has had time to implement his plans at Villa we will see similar performances.

Precisely.

He did almost say as much in the post-match interview but there's not much he can say to appease the fans is there?

I'm not sure why he should change the system to suit the players.

We HAVE to remember that we need to build for the future, not the present. He needs time to embed this system that he wants to play and whilst we have players who can't or won't, it's going to be ugly.

The players need practise to get better, and lets' face it for many of them it's yet another new style after their former clubs and/or our former managers. It takes time. I think the sooner we accept that this season is not one for achieving promotion the better, though I'm pissed off with that and am struggling to accept it.

Our owners and CEO have said promotion this season isn't essential, and I think that's because they understand it takes time. I hope they hold their nerve.

With peopel questioning Smith's ability and approach so soon into his tenure it seems that fans will start getting on his back soon and if that happens you can start preparing for Allardyce or similar and you can think about us getting new owners too.

We have to accept that our club has been rotten for years, trying to act all billy big bollocks buying all the talent and payign over the odds for it rather than developing a system, style and sustainable model. For examples of club's doing it see Brighton, Bournemouth, Huddersfield, Leicester, Wolves, Norwich, Watford and Burnley.

The advantage we have is that when we do it, and start improving, we have the advantage of our heritage, tradition and size to attract a better calibre of player to suit our system. See Man City for an example of buying the best to suit their system.

I dont' want Smith to abandon his principles and approach just because it's not working in the here and now. He's done it before, see Brentford as the key example. Players developed in a system, players brought in to replace them. When we lose Grealish, under a system we'd be able to replace him without huge disruption. Right now, because we're a shambles losing him will be dreadful (has been due to injury).

This is absolutely 100% spot on. This and the post match thread leave me in tears sometimes. In one sentence people are (rightly) scathing of the majority of the squad and the next appearing to blame Smith for the squad being rubbish. This is a bang average squad at the very best with the exception of Grealish McGinn Abraham Tuanzebe and now Mings. The rest will never in a million years be coached to play the way Smith is demanding because they can’t  its that simple. And yes, Smith does get a free pass from me this season because he needs time to bring his own players in and bed in his footballing philosophy to a club that hasn’t had such a thing for years. I’ve always estimated 3 windows at least. And if proof is required just look at last night. A Smith built and coached team played us off the park. I believe given the time he’ll do that here

[Toronto Villa]

Where Monk is doing a good job is that he is making good use of what he has and has found a style to suit the players at his disposal. Smith is trying to get the players to play how he wants and it is getting worse because the players can't do it.

Monk does not need to worry about building for the future because the club are prevented from doing so. Smith has joined at a time when new owners are looking at the bigger picture and creating something sustainable with an eye on bigger things. This will shape how they operate in the short term.

I agree. We have all said we should not keep switching systems and philosophies etc. I imagine that throughout the club he is trying in establish a way of playing, a culture, certain principles that are consistent across all of the age groups. It's not going to happen quickly and the in between stage, as this is, looks ugly.

[ASHTONVILLA]

Smith is driving me mad and looks lost at the moment but I don't believe we should make any changes. It's hard to bear at the moment but let's fast forward a month or so and things could look different with returning personel, a bit of luck and the warm spring sunshine

We were saying this before christmas, looking at improving when he had a transfer window. I thought it would get better but it is showing no sign whatsoever of it. The business in the window was not good and has not addressed any of the problems. We still have a dysfunctional midfield. £6m on a keeper no better than the several we have. We still have nothing at left back (despite buying two players there). We are still playing people out of position in defence.

He needs to show he can do better this season, before being given carte blanche for next season. If we carry on like this until the end of the season I am not convinced he should get the chance. He needs to show he can do better. And as for getting us to the level of Brentford - they are not that good we should be aspiring to being like them! He needs to show us that with better resource he can build a team far better than Brentford who look a million miles from a team that could be promoted.

[Allan C]

I don’t want him sacked but he needs to get more out of the players he’s currently got. We can’t keep saying that it’s not his team or players. If he has aspirations to be a successful manager then this excuse is just not good enough.

We can keep saying it until it is his team and his players. How would you get more out of Whelan for instance?? Or Hutton??

[Axl Rose]

I don’t want him sacked but he needs to get more out of the players he’s currently got. We can’t keep saying that it’s not his team or players. If he has aspirations to be a successful manager then this excuse is just not good enough.

We can keep saying it until it is his team and his players. How would you get more out of Whelan for instance?? Or Hutton??

I would fire the pair of them into the sun.

On a serious note, God only knows.

I basically just wouldn't play either of them. Ever. Awful awful awful players.

[ASHTONVILLA]

This is a bang average squad at the very best with the exception of Grealish McGinn Abraham Tuanzebe and now Mings. The rest will never in a million years be coached to play the way Smith is demanding because they can’t  its that simple.

The problem with this is that yes we have a bang average players - and he is getting them playing below average. We see other average squads getting better results week after week. An we have a few players that lift us above average in any event.

For all its deficiencies, we have a better set of players than many teams that are doing better than us. Smith needs to set us up to get results with what we have. That is his job. He can move to a system that works with different players when he has them.

[Drummond]

I don’t want him sacked but he needs to get more out of the players he’s currently got. We can’t keep saying that it’s not his team or players. If he has aspirations to be a successful manager then this excuse is just not good enough.

We can keep saying that. Because it's true.

And people saying to change the system to suit the players are barking up the wrong tree. Why play Steve Bruce football again? It doesn't bloody work.

[XXVilla]

I don’t want him sacked but he needs to get more out of the players he’s currently got. We can’t keep saying that it’s not his team or players. If he has aspirations to be a successful manager then this excuse is just not good enough.

We can keep saying it until it is his team and his players. How would you get more out of Whelan for instance?? Or Hutton??

He’s got it from them already though hasn’t he? But he’s not getting it now.

[XXVilla]

I don’t want him sacked but he needs to get more out of the players he’s currently got. We can’t keep saying that it’s not his team or players. If he has aspirations to be a successful manager then this excuse is just not good enough.

We can keep saying that. Because it's true.

And people saying to change the system to suit the players are barking up the wrong tree. Why play Steve Bruce football again? It doesn't bloody work.

Well this doesnt bloody work either

[footyskillz]

Where Monk is doing a good job is that he is making good use of what he has and has found a style to suit the players at his disposal. Smith is trying to get the players to play how he wants and it is getting worse because the players can't do it.

Monk does not need to worry about building for the future because the club are prevented from doing so. Smith has joined at a time when new owners are looking at the bigger picture and creating something sustainable with an eye on bigger things. This will shape how they operate in the short term.

Sustainable yes but bigger things ?; Are we sure? For me that remains to be seen
Some of that talk is marketing and business .
It sounds good but let's judge them in a few years on their actions.

Business wise they want to be efficient and effective.

We already had Smith talk of market value of andre green potential.

It's not particularly ambitious from owners and CEO
And why would it be ?

Xia had dreams and ambitions and now the club is going in different directions .
Admittedly it's for reasons to adminstrative and be stable but can already see it's going to be down a route of a smaller scale club where loans and developing youth will be main areas along with bargain buys.

I unfortunately am very sceptical of the villa owners and CEO actual ambition. They who see villa as somewhere to make money on players and look at the business side of things primarily.
The football side has been put in hands of one of own and JT for appeasement.

Any other coach (or any ones without any villa connection) would be criticized by a lot more after the recent run


These owners aren't stupid .
They picked villa when they were vulnerable.
I think the phrase is over a barrell

It's been billed as some sort of development plan .
That's just a spin.

All clubs have development.
Villa have been choosing not to do that because players weren't up to grade.

Now seemingly come season end won't have a choice.

Likes of Tammy Abraham , JT , Snodgrass won't be coming to villa if we carry on like this.
There is a danger it's not just this season we fall by the way side.

[john e]

just put any of our players under pressure and they will lose the ball more often than not

teams know this, and that's what they do, press
last night was embarrassing watching them try and control and pass, absolute zero composure on the ball, zero

[Nelson Lodge]

I have decided to let go of thoughts of the play-offs and promotion being possible this season. I am certainly not going to get emotional, angry and despondent over further dismal displays and defeats. We have to rebuild from scratch, starting from square one, and try to be in position to go for the "Big Push" next season. At the end of this season we need to get rid of as many of the inadequates in the squad as possible. That includes those liabilities who spend more time in the treatment rooms than they do on the pitch.

In truth this is what should have been done immediately after relegation in 2016 instead of chucking bundles of cash on 'has beens' in futile attempts to shortcut a quick return to the Prem. We have lost 3 years due to a fatally flawed strategy, stupid tactical decisions and lack of foresight costing the club untold millions of £s. If by any outside chance promotion was achieved by a fluke it would be disastrous with the way the club is at present. It would be mission impossible in terns of time and money to recruit a new squad capable of survival.

Whether Smith & his assistants are capable of achieving the rebuilding job required remains to be seen. However, even if he is only able to build sound foundations (as those of a certain vintage will remember Vic Crowe doing) then that at least will be something for his successor to inherit and take forward.

[paul_e]

There's no guarantee that Smith is the answer. I think I've seen enough to make me hope and believe things can improve.

But, and the poster who wants him sacked now wanted him sacked a month or two back, would have seen Farke sacked long ago. Wilder sacked last season for their run of form. Johnson sacked numerous times over at Bristol. Wagnar sacked at Huddersfield for not improving them in year 1. Monk sacked at the Blues for their awful start.

At some point we've got to back a plan. It doesn't mean you accept the form or performances now, but you understand the context.

Cultural changes take time. China have been engaged in a cultural revolution since the 70s, building high rises to draw peasents out of the countryside, to live in cities and place a demand for an increase to the service economy for the new urban workers. Britain took 100 years in the 19th century to do the same. The leap from Bruce to modernity is on a similar scale.

A pre-season helps, but the more you look around this league the overwhelming difference is legs, running, ticker, whatever you want to call it. We're relying on full backs, central midfielders and wide men who have none.

The player threads are full of it and rightly so. We have the right idea, whether we have the right man time will tell.

I think it's foolish to accept the run, but doubly so to not afford this manager the opportunity of his peers. I think it will work out.

I agree with most of this.

Bruce was managing us transfer window to transfer window with no real thought of where things were going and it nearly worked but once it didn't we were, politely put, a bit fucked. When he was sacked the club appear to have taken the view that they want someone who's thinking slightly more long term and building a more sustainable squad. The difficulty is moving on the 30+ players and replacing them with 23-24 year olds takes a bit of time because the older players are hard to sell and for the younger players you have to scout them well to be sure they're a good fit.