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Author Topic: Dean Smith - Confirmed  (Read 892168 times)

Offline SoccerHQ

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Re: Dean Smith - Confirmed
« Reply #12075 on: April 11, 2021, 01:29:23 PM »
Think talk of a top 6 finish next season is pretty optimistic.

We would have to sign even better than last summer to have a chance of that.

This season our backline bar the odd individual error has generally performed out of their skins yet you can't just assume it will be as good next season as we saw in 09/10 and then six months later we have one of worst defences in league even though it was pretty much the same players. This due to injuries, lack of motivation etc.

We need far more goal power in final third. You look at Saint Maximn coming on for Newcastle just now and turning a 1-0 into 1-2 in five minutes, we desperately need that type of player aswell as Grealish in the team.

Then top 6 is possible but not before. A backup striker DS can actually trust to bring on every game regardless of score or opposition is also very much needed.

Would be more than happy with 8th and a very good cup run next season. Lower than that and think ownership will then have decision to make.

Offline Ketzster

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Re: Dean Smith - Confirmed
« Reply #12076 on: April 11, 2021, 01:41:56 PM »
We are talking about a mid table, maybe top half finish in the premier League as if it's a disappointment   

When did we last finish top half? Under Houllier? Ten years ago.

People seem obsessed with Leeds doing well, but so what. Good luck to them.

You could equally concentrate on Arsenal who the last time we were up were a CL side and had won 3 consecutive FA Cups. Now they're below us and having to borrow money from the Bank of England. Even clubs like Southampton have been consistently above us for getting on for a decade. There's lots of ebb and flow and we are on a very clear trajectory.

I hate Leeds as much as anybody else, and the Bielsa love in. But, one of my best friends is a Leeds fan and he says that he reckons quite a few in that squad are lower Championship/League 1 level. Liam Cooper for example. Stuart Dallas doing what he did yesterday?! I think weíve got better players than Leeds but we arenít coached as well as Leeds are and we often look like thereís no real plan. We keep hearing the squad etc. but having a good coach can make a huge difference. I think there are pretty big question marks over Dean Smiths coaching ability and Iím not sure how many other Premier League teams would take him as manager

Offline RamboandBruno

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Re: Dean Smith - Confirmed
« Reply #12077 on: April 11, 2021, 01:56:08 PM »
We are talking about a mid table, maybe top half finish in the premier League as if it's a disappointment   

When did we last finish top half? Under Houllier? Ten years ago.

People seem obsessed with Leeds doing well, but so what. Good luck to them.

You could equally concentrate on Arsenal who the last time we were up were a CL side and had won 3 consecutive FA Cups. Now they're below us and having to borrow money from the Bank of England. Even clubs like Southampton have been consistently above us for getting on for a decade. There's lots of ebb and flow and we are on a very clear trajectory.

I hate Leeds as much as anybody else, and the Bielsa love in. But, one of my best friends is a Leeds fan and he says that he reckons quite a few in that squad are lower Championship/League 1 level. Liam Cooper for example. Stuart Dallas doing what he did yesterday?! I think weíve got better players than Leeds but we arenít coached as well as Leeds are and we often look like thereís no real plan. We keep hearing the squad etc. but having a good coach can make a huge difference. I think there are pretty big question marks over Dean Smiths coaching ability and Iím not sure how many other Premier League teams would take him as manager

Iíve seen Leeds get mullered quite a few times this season, but Beilsa still get praised for his attacking intent, despite them being awful in those games.
They beat us heavily at home when we were playing well, but Iíve also seen us beat them away, when they never laid a glove on us and Smith out thought the great Beilsa.

Thereís every chance weíll finish higher than Leeds this season and probably more importantly Arsenal, in terms s of their time in the league. But still Smith gets called out.

Offline ez

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Re: Dean Smith - Confirmed
« Reply #12078 on: April 11, 2021, 01:56:31 PM »
We are talking about a mid table, maybe top half finish in the premier League as if it's a disappointment   

When did we last finish top half? Under Houllier? Ten years ago.

I don't think we're going to finish top half.  Maybe we will though, but we haven't yet, so to be comparing it to anybody else is a bit previous.

To finish bottom half would be unfair on the likes of Grealish, Martinez, and Watkins after all their efforts this season. They don't deserve to finish bottom half.

Offline ChicagoLion

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Re: Dean Smith - Confirmed
« Reply #12079 on: April 11, 2021, 02:04:31 PM »
But it wasn't game management at all. They scored because of an excellent finish and some unhurried closing from Ramsey,  in what was an isolated attack that actually brought about a rare save moments prior. Liverpool didn't look like or threaten to score at any point after their equaliser. We hadn't dropped deep, we'd just cocked up an attack ourselves 30 seconds to a minute before.
yes playing Ramsey right wing was a great game management.


The goal came centrally from a right back drifting off an inside left position (of the pitch). He wasn't Ramsey's man to mark, so his position is irrelevant. I keep asking, but I cannot fathom how you believe "game management" had anything to do with losing.
The manager had the ability to change tactics, system and players during the game.
Smith isnít very good at it.

Offline Ads

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Re: Dean Smith - Confirmed
« Reply #12080 on: April 11, 2021, 02:08:56 PM »
How did we lose yesterday because of an alleged absence of game management?

Offline paul_e

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Re: Dean Smith - Confirmed
« Reply #12081 on: April 11, 2021, 02:13:36 PM »
Think talk of a top 6 finish next season is pretty optimistic.

We would have to sign even better than last summer to have a chance of that.

This season our backline bar the odd individual error has generally performed out of their skins yet you can't just assume it will be as good next season as we saw in 09/10 and then six months later we have one of worst defences in league even though it was pretty much the same players. This due to injuries, lack of motivation etc.

We need far more goal power in final third. You look at Saint Maximn coming on for Newcastle just now and turning a 1-0 into 1-2 in five minutes, we desperately need that type of player aswell as Grealish in the team.

Then top 6 is possible but not before. A backup striker DS can actually trust to bring on every game regardless of score or opposition is also very much needed.

Would be more than happy with 8th and a very good cup run next season. Lower than that and think ownership will then have decision to make.

Trezeguet did exactly this a week ago. Over their 2 seasons in the league S-M has 6 goals and 8 assists, Trez has 8 goals and 2 assists. That doesn't scream upgrade to me, particularly given the likely £40m-ish price tag.

Offline olaftab

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Re: Dean Smith - Confirmed
« Reply #12082 on: April 11, 2021, 02:25:51 PM »
We are talking about a mid table, maybe top half finish in the premier League as if it's a disappointment   

When did we last finish top half? Under Houllier? Ten years ago.

People seem obsessed with Leeds doing well, but so what. Good luck to them.

You could equally concentrate on Arsenal who the last time we were up were a CL side and had won 3 consecutive FA Cups. Now they're below us and having to borrow money from the Bank of England. Even clubs like Southampton have been consistently above us for getting on for a decade. There's lots of ebb and flow and we are on a very clear trajectory.
Yes that's a cute approach. Just lower the standard if you can't achieve your goal.

Online SaddVillan

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Re: Dean Smith - Confirmed
« Reply #12083 on: April 11, 2021, 02:30:17 PM »
Smith was a tactical genius when we tonked Liverpool 7-2.

Now he's the village idiot when we lose at their place to a last minute shot with our best player out injured.


Online cdbullyweefan

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Re: Dean Smith - Confirmed
« Reply #12084 on: April 11, 2021, 02:33:22 PM »
The problem is is that it isnít just this season weíve struggled when Grealish has been out. The evidence for the people that say everything is down to Grealish is growing rather than the other way round. Of course it makes a difference, but Iím not sure that excuses having such long spells of poor form. At times, the way people talk youíd think that Smith is managing under owners who want out and havenít given him any money. There comes a point where you have to question these long spells of poor form without just keep saying ĎGrealish is out, what can anybody do?í. Itís the recurring nature of the problems that is the issue

As has bene said a number of times yesterday, this season the big drop off in form was the quarantine for covid shutting us down not Jack being out.

That doesn't stand up to any sort of scrutiny. Straight after the enforced covid break and until Jack was out, we won 3 out of 7 games, drew 1 and lost 3. Two of the defeats were against Man City, where we were robbed by the ref, and Burnley where we played well and should have 4-0 up at half time. West Ham was the only game we really deserved to lose. Since Jack has been out we've won two out of 8, and haven't played well in any of the games at all, apart from the odd patch.

You're both wrong I'm afraid, the decline started when somebody created a thread called "Champions League Maths". This was the league table at the time:




Offline aj2k77

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Re: Dean Smith - Confirmed
« Reply #12085 on: April 11, 2021, 02:34:10 PM »
He's never been a tactical genius. How many times do we change formation or plan to suit different teams? The basic plan, each week, is the same thing. Win, lose or draw. Tactics don't really come into it.

Offline john e

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Re: Dean Smith - Confirmed
« Reply #12086 on: April 11, 2021, 02:41:00 PM »
Smith was a tactical genius when we tonked Liverpool 7-2.

Now he's the village idiot when we lose at their place to a last minute shot with our best player out injured.



Picking out results good or bad still doesnít answer the question of why we have the form of a relegation threatened side when we play without Grealish
And yet most people believe that our squad is far superior to most Other teams down there even without Jack

Offline olaftab

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Re: Dean Smith - Confirmed
« Reply #12087 on: April 11, 2021, 02:49:54 PM »
Smith was a tactical genius when we tonked Liverpool 7-2.

Now he's the village idiot when we lose at their place to a last minute shot with our best player out injured.
It's not that though is it? It's the fact that without our best player we have picked up 8 points from 8 games which is bang on relegation form and Smith has not been able to do anything about it so far.

Offline Toronto Villa

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Re: Dean Smith - Confirmed
« Reply #12088 on: April 11, 2021, 02:50:56 PM »
Smith was a tactical genius when we tonked Liverpool 7-2.

Now he's the village idiot when we lose at their place to a last minute shot with our best player out injured.



Picking out results good or bad still doesnít answer the question of why we have the form of a relegation threatened side when we play without Grealish
And yet most people believe that our squad is far superior to most Other teams down there even without Jack


Thatís what is most frustrating. Everyone accepts that there would be a drop off in performances. But that drop off should not be that great. The results with and without him should not change us from CL form to relegation form. And the manager upon realizing that should be able to make enough adjustments so that we donít go from 15-20 shots a game to less than 5 often against very average or even poor opponents. Also we have stuck to one formation throughout this.
Instead of introducing something new at the start of a game or during it we stick to the same thing over and over again. Coaches/scouts/analysts in this league, at this level figure things out. They know how we play and counter it. Thatís what has happened to us. This is no different to that time John Terry called out publicly what everyone knew. That a MON Villa team would be exhausted later in the season. This is the top end of the professional game. If you donít stay a step ahead youíre behind very quickly.

Offline algy

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Re: Dean Smith - Confirmed
« Reply #12089 on: April 11, 2021, 04:05:05 PM »
We've won 4 of the last 17 and scored more than once in just 3 of those. That's shit. Wake up Smith. It's not a ''blip'', that's half a season of results really. 5 very difficult fixtures remaining. He needs to learn how to put a cap on these poor runs we go on. You don't get COVID breaks every year to reevaluate where it's gone wrong. Sometimes he really does look like a rookie manager. He's in his 50's.

I guess most teams that finish mid table, say 9th to 12th, have really good runs and really poor runs in a season, itís why those teams arenít challenging at the top, but equally arent worried about a relegation fight. I think we just need to take it for what it is, a season of progress compared to last season and then we progress some more next season hopefully.
I can understand the obvious frustrations of some on here that we arenít progressing quick enough. But some of this smacks a bit of privilege and Ďdonít you know weíre Aston Villaí. Outside of the usual suspects of Liverpool, Manchester clubs, Chelsea and Spurs, teams like Leicester and Everton and even West Ham have infested heavily for the years we were ploughing our trade in the championship. All those clubs as well as Wolves, Leeds and Arsenal, have ambitions to be at the top table. Iím not sure where the idea comes from that because we have wealthy owners, we would turn into European certainties in our second season back comes from. There are also a lot of people who seem to have inside knowledge of what the owners are thinking, which is a bit bizarre and in some cases seems like wishful thinking in terms of using this apparent knowledge of the owners next move, to justify the fact that they themselves would quite like the manager out.

Pre season I would of took 10th this season, does it feel disappointing that, that will be our likely finishing spot after the excitement of the early months of the season, yes it does. Is it a bad second season back after a decade of shite, not in my book. We have the spine of an excellent team built by this management team. We are another forward, winger and midfield enforcer away from challenging.
Agree 100%.

You only have to look at how far we've come in the 2Ĺ years that Dean Smith's been in charge to see how good a manager he's been so far. I'm very happy with how things have gone under him, and feel with the right team behind him we'll be more than capable to challenge for the league title in due course. That won't be instant - there's still years, perhaps decades, of mismanagement to undo - but so long as we're heading in the right direction I think Dean should stay. Really think he could be as iconic for us as Alex Fergusson is to Manchester United.

 


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