Tony's Tweets

[Clampy]

so he was at it then, in a sense, as he was the club's only shareholder?

He didn't take any of it out, if that's what you mean.

I will criticise Lerner for many, many things, and we will probably regret his ownership of the club for years to come, but one thing that you absolutely cannot accuse him of is using the club for personal enrichment.  Rarely has one man spent so much money, so very badly.  From memory, he took £7m out in the first year, but that came back in about 30 times over.  It's is fair to say that the Lerner family trust took one hell of a battering from Randy's time with us, as did the club of course.  A spectacular disaster all round.

Indeed. My favourite quote is that it would have been cheaper for him to hand over a £20 note to everyone who came through the turnstiles at every game played at Villa Park during his ownership.

Out of interest, how much did Randy's ownership cost him?

The exact figure varies according to who you talk to, but something approaching £200 million is generally reckoned to be not far off.

"A fool and his money......."

At least he put it into our club, even if it didnt work out.

"Didn't work out"!?

He took us out of The PL, after breaking nearly every unwanted record in Villa's near 150 year history!

I know he's not Doug Ellis, but do me a favour.

Of course it wasn't great but it' s done. He was very naive in running a football club. I don't hold a grudge though, it's happened..

Blimey, I'd love to know what would have to happen to our club for you to hold a grudge if what Lerner did to us didn't even register.

I didn't say it didn't register, i said i don't hold a grudge.

[Sexual Ealing]

Sir Graham got us up in the first season.

He had a full season. He didn't takeover a team in October with one win in it's first eleven.

That's true. Perhaps he'd only have got us into the top six in those circumstances. I doubt we'd have finished in the bottom half of division two.

We'll never know we?

We'll have a pretty good guess.

[saunders_heroes]

Yeah that as well.

[Sexual Ealing]

Sir Graham got us up in the first season.

He had a full season. He didn't takeover a team in October with one win in it's first eleven.

That's true. Perhaps he'd only have got us into the top six in those circumstances. I doubt we'd have finished in the bottom half of division two.

Well first off I think Taylor was a far better manager than Bruce and secondly the club (in '87) wasn't in as big a mess as we were this time last year.

We certainly weren't in a position to spend more money than any club had ever spent in the division in 87.

[Clampy]

Sir Graham got us up in the first season.

He had a full season. He didn't takeover a team in October with one win in it's first eleven.

That's true. Perhaps he'd only have got us into the top six in those circumstances. I doubt we'd have finished in the bottom half of division two.

Well first off I think Taylor was a far better manager than Bruce and secondly the club (in '87) wasn't in as big a mess as we were this time last year.

We certainly weren't in a position to spend more money than any club had ever spent in the division in 87.

We were the best team in europe 5 Season's earlier. That's how far we had fallen.

[saunders_heroes]

Sir Graham got us up in the first season.

He had a full season. He didn't takeover a team in October with one win in it's first eleven.

That's true. Perhaps he'd only have got us into the top six in those circumstances. I doubt we'd have finished in the bottom half of division two.

Well first off I think Taylor was a far better manager than Bruce and secondly the club (in '87) wasn't in as big a mess as we were this time last year.

We certainly weren't in a position to spend more money than any club had ever spent in the division in 87.

But we didn't go into that season with our Division 1/PL infrastructure in complete tatters. In fact we had some really good players in '87. Far better than the lower league crap we packed our squad out with in '16.

[Sexual Ealing]

Sir Graham got us up in the first season.

He had a full season. He didn't takeover a team in October with one win in it's first eleven.

That's true. Perhaps he'd only have got us into the top six in those circumstances. I doubt we'd have finished in the bottom half of division two.

Well first off I think Taylor was a far better manager than Bruce and secondly the club (in '87) wasn't in as big a mess as we were this time last year.

We certainly weren't in a position to spend more money than any club had ever spent in the division in 87.

We were the best team in europe 5 Season's earlier. That's how far we had fallen.

I think we're agreeing with each other here.

[ktvillan]

It's just ticked into September. We're writing off a lot of sides aren't we, including us it seems.

Not writing them off just pointing out that radical improvement is required soon from them and us if any of us are going to challenge for the top 6.  Like Risso, I don't care if the others improve or not.  Another similar 5 games you may well be too late to catch up. Last season is not necessarily an indicator of who will challenge.  Didn't Huddersfield and Reading have poor seasons the year before last? 

[Damo70]

Sir Graham got us up in the first season.

He had a full season. He didn't takeover a team in October with one win in it's first eleven.

That's true. Perhaps he'd only have got us into the top six in those circumstances. I doubt we'd have finished in the bottom half of division two.

Well first off I think Taylor was a far better manager than Bruce and secondly the club (in '87) wasn't in as big a mess as we were this time last year.

We certainly weren't in a position to spend more money than any club had ever spent in the division in 87.

But we didn't go into that season with our Division 1/PL infrastructure in complete tatters. In fact we had some really good players in '87. Far better than the lower league crap we packed our squad out with in '16.

I'm not sure any manager other than SGT could have got that squad promoted. Dorigo sold and replaced by Bernie Gallagher, Elliott sold and replaced by Steve Sims. Blair and Hunt finished by injury. Evans, Daley, Thompson and McInally all injured for the first half of the season. The Gray twins only arrived in Nov/Dec and Platt in Feb.

And as for our so called infrastructure didn't our new manager take all of five minutes to evaluate things and describe the whole place as a shambles?

[dave.woodhall]

so he was at it then, in a sense, as he was the club's only shareholder?

He didn't take any of it out, if that's what you mean.

I sense we're on the slow boat to another Herbert discussion.

I fear you may be right.

[saunders_heroes]

Sir Graham got us up in the first season.

He had a full season. He didn't takeover a team in October with one win in it's first eleven.

That's true. Perhaps he'd only have got us into the top six in those circumstances. I doubt we'd have finished in the bottom half of division two.

Well first off I think Taylor was a far better manager than Bruce and secondly the club (in '87) wasn't in as big a mess as we were this time last year.

We certainly weren't in a position to spend more money than any club had ever spent in the division in 87.

But we didn't go into that season with our Division 1/PL infrastructure in complete tatters. In fact we had some really good players in '87. Far better than the lower league crap we packed our squad out with in '16.

I'm not sure any manager other than SGT could have got that squad promoted. Dorigo sold and replaced by Bernie Gallagher, Elliott sold and replaced by Steve Sims. Blair and Hunt finished by injury. Evans, Daley, Thompson and McInally all injured for the first half of the season. The Gray twins only arrived in Nov/Dec and Platt in Feb.

And as for our so called infrastructure didn't our new manager take all of five minutes to evaluate things and describe the whole place as a shambles?

I'd still say we had better players in '87 than we did in '16 even with the examples you give. Like it or not this club was in a quite diabolical condition last year, arguably the worst It's ever been. Certainly the most humiliated anyway. The only thing I will say is that Bruce just isn't and never will be the class of manager Taylor was.

[Villa75]

so he was at it then, in a sense, as he was the club's only shareholder?

He didn't take any of it out, if that's what you mean.

I sense we're on the slow boat to another Herbert discussion.

I fear you may be right.

I don't know about that. But I'm sure that there's one or two on here that would "hold a grudge"  if Ellis had broken all those unwanted records and taken us out of the PL.

Just because we lauded the arrival of Lerner as the coming of the Messiah and the death of the Antichrist, we don't have this pretend the reality was anything other that a complete disaster. Or do we?

[Steve67]

Personally, apart from a couple, I think the players we have now are better.  However, the manager we had back then is way, way better. 

[tomd2103]

It's just ticked into September. We're writing off a lot of sides aren't we, including us it seems.

And on another thread, Glen Whelan. The lack of patience is staggering.

Yes, I think Whelan has generally done OK so far. I'm not sure what people were expecting, he was never going to be Iniesta.

Whelan will be fine if used in the right role.  Playing him in a midfield two and expecting him to cover a lot of the pitch is not the right role.

He does generally play behind Hourihane and Onomah. I don't think he's ever played in a midfield two really.

He did when we played a 4-4-2 against Hull, Cardiff and Reading.  He ran out of steam badly in those games and there were players just walking by him.  He will be fine played in the holding role in the three man midfield you mention above. 

[ChicagoLion]

so he was at it then, in a sense, as he was the club's only shareholder?

He didn't take any of it out, if that's what you mean.

I will criticise Lerner for many, many things, and we will probably regret his ownership of the club for years to come, but one thing that you absolutely cannot accuse him of is using the club for personal enrichment.  Rarely has one man spent so much money, so very badly.  From memory, he took £7m out in the first year, but that came back in about 30 times over.  It's is fair to say that the Lerner family trust took one hell of a battering from Randy's time with us, as did the club of course.  A spectacular disaster all round.

Indeed. My favourite quote is that it would have been cheaper for him to hand over a £20 note to everyone who came through the turnstiles at every game played at Villa Park during his ownership.

Out of interest, how much did Randy's ownership cost him?

The exact figure varies according to who you talk to, but something approaching £200 million is generally reckoned to be not far off.

"A fool and his money......."

At least he put it into our club, even if it didnt work out.

"Didn't work out"!?

He took us out of The PL, after breaking nearly every unwanted record in Villa's near 150 year history!

I know he's not Doug Ellis, but do me a favour.

and he actually left us worse off than he found us, on and off the field.
So putting it into the club did us a lot of good.