Aaron Tshibola

[Drummond]

But that's what most clubs do with young players, it's like saying Grealish was so good we sent him to Notts County and then we started to give him some games. Or Harry Kane was so good Spurs sent him out on loan 4 times. And when Tshibola was frozen out he wasn't competing with those players, it was Gardner, Bacuna and Westwood.

And he wasn't good enough so he's been shipped out.

[PeterWithesShin]

Even if he isn't, and I still think it's more off the pitch reasons why he's been frozen out, using him going to Hartlepool on loan as proof he wasn't very good doesn't hold up.

[RussellC]

I never met Platt but I have met Bosnich and he was great, really chatty and friendly.

Were his pupils dilated at the time...?

[RussellC]

Just because he's had a game or two in Scotland doesn't make him good enough for the Championship.

What about the spell he had playing well for Reading....in the Championship?

Oh yes, sorry, those 13 games were brilliant. So they loaned him out to Hartlepool.

Hmm. A bit of Bruce-esque revisionism here... He went on loan to Hartlepool in 2014/15, returning to Reading the following season, where he made 16 appearances in total.

I just don't understand why he wasn't given a chance in pre-season, when the squad was on its knees. Is it really better to persevere with a player like Henri Lansbury - who's barely ever broken sweat in a Villa shirt - than to try to get a tune of a young player who clearly has some ability?

Not revisionism, just a lazy post really.

My wording could have said. 'So good wa she that Reading loaned him out to play 23 games for Hartlepool then gave him 13 games themselves.' 'Then we flounced in with a load of dosh and bought the potential rather than any quality because we had a bit of cash.'

He's not done anything to evidence he's good enough, particularly to get in the side in front of Grealish, McGinn, Hourihane, etc.

As for Lansbury, career so far...

Senior career*
Years   Team   Apps   (Gls)
2007–2012   Arsenal   3   (0)
2009   → Scunthorpe United (loan)   16   (4)
2009–2010   → Watford (loan)   37   (5)
2010–2011   → Norwich City (loan)   23   (4)
2011–2012   → West Ham United (loan)   22   (1)
2012–2017   → Nottingham Forest   145   (32)
2017 –      → Aston Villa   26   (1)
National team
2005–2006   England U16   5   (0)
2006–2007   England U17   14   (4)
2007–2009   England U19   11   (4)
2009–2013   England U21      16    (5)

Well, if Arsenal loaned Lansbury to Scunthorpe, he can't be any good...right...?

[Dave P]

My memory of Tshibola is away to Cardiff in 16/17. We started with Gary Gardiner and Westwood who hardly touched the ball. Tshibola come on at half time and had more touches then both of them put together. Not saying we are missing him mind.

[Drummond]

Even if he isn't, and I still think it's more off the pitch reasons why he's been frozen out, using him going to Hartlepool on loan as proof he wasn't very good doesn't hold up.

He played some games for them, then a few at Reading. He hasn't set the world alight has he?

Lansbury went to Scunthorpe. Also not very good until you then see the other teams he played a lot of games for and did well in.

[Drummond]

Even if he isn't, and I still think it's more off the pitch reasons why he's been frozen out, using him going to Hartlepool on loan as proof he wasn't very good doesn't hold up.

My point is that 23 games for Hartlepool and 13 games for Reading isn't exactly the sort of career that evidences anything of a decent level. He's shown us fuck all too. He played some games for Kilmarnock which isn't exactly in a taxing league (McGinn had rave reviews from everyone up there and played for Scotland and was at a much higher performance level).

Would you say 23 games for Hartlepool was a good indicator?

[PeterWithesShin]

I've never said he has, but you're trying to use him going on loan to Hartlepool as a youngster as proof he was always crap. Which doesn't hold up. And Lansbury is 28 in a couple of weeks and can't get into the match day squad for a currently mid-table second division side. Maybe see where Tshibola is in 4 or 5 years time. Then we'll know if he was any good or not.

[PeterWithesShin]

To clarify, i'm saying that going on loan to Hartlepool doesn't prove anything as every year loads of players, some bad, some soon to be brilliant, are sent on loan to the lower leagues. I'm not saying that he's some super talent scandalously being overlooked.

[SoccerHQ]

Certainly a strange one.

I was impressed with him against Huddersfield just after he signed, might've been his home debut but he was box to box and passed o.k.

Think he got injured straight after that and fell out of favour and then we changed manager.

I'm sure I read a while back SB wasn't impressed at his attitude in reserve games.

What's beyond doubt is we paid miles over for him, 5m for a guy with just 20 pro games. Should've been 1-2m with then plenty of add ons if he did well for us.

[purpletrousers]

He didn't play more at Reading after his (very successful) loan that season as he got injured, so the 17games thing before he came to us isn't fair. He had potential, we overpaid for it, then didn't develop it, or give it chance to see if we could. Poor use of resources (expenditure) then poor handling of an asset. We've sadly specialised in this in recent years.

[Drummond]

To clarify, i'm saying that going on loan to Hartlepool doesn't prove anything as every year loads of players, some bad, some soon to be brilliant, are sent on loan to the lower leagues. I'm not saying that he's some super talent scandalously being overlooked.

OK, I get your point. I suppose what I'm trying to say is that so far the evidence in front of us is that he played well at Hartlepool, had a few games at Reading and has done ok for Kilmarnock.

It's not the best CV going is it? Yes, a lot of players go on loan at lower league clubs to improve, christ we've got and had enough of them the last couple of years and sent enough of ours out too. Clarke seems to be doing great at Port Vale, yet won't get in our team. Sulaiman is, by all accounts a great prospect too, but he's not evidenced it at a decent level yet.

I'm trying to say that Tshibola is just not proving enough to warrant getting into our side with the midfielders we've currently got.

[tomd2103]

To clarify, i'm saying that going on loan to Hartlepool doesn't prove anything as every year loads of players, some bad, some soon to be brilliant, are sent on loan to the lower leagues. I'm not saying that he's some super talent scandalously being overlooked.

OK, I get your point. I suppose what I'm trying to say is that so far the evidence in front of us is that he played well at Hartlepool, had a few games at Reading and has done ok for Kilmarnock.

It's not the best CV going is it? Yes, a lot of players go on loan at lower league clubs to improve, christ we've got and had enough of them the last couple of years and sent enough of ours out too. Clarke seems to be doing great at Port Vale, yet won't get in our team. Sulaiman is, by all accounts a great prospect too, but he's not evidenced it at a decent level yet.

I'm trying to say that Tshibola is just not proving enough to warrant getting into our side with the midfielders we've currently got.

Another one who needs a fresh start somewhere else, but like others I'm guessing we are paying him the kind of wages he has no chance of securing elsewhere.  As with the likes of Elphick, McCormack, De Laet etc. we are trapped in a circle where these players go out on loan only to come back and the whole process starts all over again until their contract eventually runs out.     

[paul_e]

That's the reason why I'd like to have seen him involved in pre-season and maybe a cup game or 2. He's not going to get in ahead of Grealish or McGinn but he it would've been worth seeing if he could compete with Hourihane/Whelan/Bjarnason for the 3rd spot in games where we needed a bit more presence in there.

Like a few players he seems to be one that Bruce has decided he doesn't like and there's nothing he can do to change that. Elphick, De Laet, Fat Ross, Lansbury and Bjarnason all seem to have the same problem.

[Clampy]

I don't see any point in keeping someone like him on the payroll if the manager does not rate him. Bruce didn't sign him and he hasn't exactly pulled up any trees anywhere else. It's just a case of moving a player on who he thinks he can do without, like Gary Gardner for instance. There's not problem with it for me.