Eric Black

[chrisw1]

Just to sumarise my thinking here.  I don't particularly like Black and and don't think he has done a great job.  But equally, he's been in charge for 6 games and took over an impossible position.  There are arguments for and against chucking in the kids, other than Toner he's chosen not to.  Whether I agree with that or not, I can understand why.

But my real point is I just think the level of vitriol and hate is massively disproportionate to his role in the total clusterfuck of this season.  And specifically, singling him out so much whilst Remi gets off the hook just seems entirely unreasonable.

[paul_e]

Just to sumarise my thinking here.  I don't particularly like Black and and don't think he has done a great job.  But equally, he's been in charge for 6 games and took over an impossible position.  There are arguments for and against chucking in the kids, other than Toner he's chosen not to.  Whether I agree with that or not, I can understand why.

But my real point is I just think the level of vitriol and hate is massively disproportionate to his role in the total clusterfuck of this season.  And specifically, singling him out so much whilst Remi gets off the hook just seems entirely unreasonable.

I don't hate him, I just think he's completely misunderstood the mood of the fans and the needs of the club and has created a lot more hostility than he needed to.  The difference between him and Garde is that you could see the point of what he was trying to do.  He didn't do it very well and he got sacked because of that but it was understandable.  What's not understandable is picking 5 at the back and 3 holding midfielders at home to a side that are in the bottom 3 when you're already relegated.  As you say that's his choice but it's one that the fans see as cowardly, to exacerbate that by not making any changes until the 85th minute just screams of surrender and after all the shit we've put up with that's just not acceptable.

[JUAN PABLO]

that team he picked for the last game of the season for the fans was an absolute disgrace

[chrisw1]

that team he picked for the last game of the season for the fans was an absolute disgrace

The team that got our first point in in the last 12 games?  The team that kept our first clean sheet since February?  The team that stopped Newcastle fans jubilantly dancing on our graves?  You mean that team?

[Witton Warrior]

If Black wanted to give Grealish a boost then maybe he could have given him some play time...

Maybe he isn't up to it at the moment?  He hasn't done anything all season and Remi didn't pick him either.  We really don't know the reasons do we?

Black says his decision not to pick him a personal one (by Black) - what the hell that is supposed to mean is anyone's guess. The issue I have with Black is that he opens his gob and muddies the waters even more - maybe he is just thick then?

[Witton Warrior]

that team he picked for the last game of the season for the fans was an absolute disgrace

The team that got our first point in in the last 12 games?  The team that kept our first clean sheet since February?  The team that stopped Newcastle fans jubilantly dancing on our graves?  You mean that team?

Roughly the same team that had lost every previous game Black was in charge of you mean? Was he training them up specifically for this last glorious effort?

I do agree with your comments on previous managers shortcomings however...

[chrisw1]

If Black wanted to give Grealish a boost then maybe he could have given him some play time...

Maybe he isn't up to it at the moment?  He hasn't done anything all season and Remi didn't pick him either.  We really don't know the reasons do we?

Black says his decision not to pick him a personal one (by Black) - what the hell that is supposed to mean is anyone's guess. The issue I have with Black is that he opens his gob and muddies the waters even more - maybe he is just thick then?

Would you prefer it if he said 'Jack just hasn't been trying in training' or 'Jack's confidence is so shot and he's a liability at the moment' or 'Jack turned up pissed the other day' etc.  All hypothetical of course but sometimes it's better to not say something.  We just don't know the facts, that's why I think it is harsh to crucify the guy for this one decision, particularly when Remi didn't fancy him either.

[mr underhill]

arguing over the required level of opprobrium for Garde v Black is like debating who is the taller dwarf. All I want now is for this dreadful season to be over with.

[peter w]

Just to sumarise my thinking here.  I don't particularly like Black and and don't think he has done a great job.  But equally, he's been in charge for 6 games and took over an impossible position.  There are arguments for and against chucking in the kids, other than Toner he's chosen not to.  Whether I agree with that or not, I can understand why.

But my real point is I just think the level of vitriol and hate is massively disproportionate to his role in the total clusterfuck of this season.  And specifically, singling him out so much whilst Remi gets off the hook just seems entirely unreasonable.

I don't hate him, I just think he's completely misunderstood the mood of the fans and the needs of the club and has created a lot more hostility than he needed to.  The difference between him and Garde is that you could see the point of what he was trying to do.  He didn't do it very well and he got sacked because of that but it was understandable.  What's not understandable is picking 5 at the back and 3 holding midfielders at home to a side that are in the bottom 3 when you're already relegated.  As you say that's his choice but it's one that the fans see as cowardly, to exacerbate that by not making any changes until the 85th minute just screams of surrender and after all the shit we've put up with that's just not acceptable.

So Black's job is simply to gauge and assuage the mood of the fans? That is simply not the case. Plus I think it's the other way round I can see what Black is trying to do with the team selections in trying to tighten us up whereas Garde , well i'm still not too sure what he tried to do. i don't necessarily blame the managers for that but the players at his disposal. no point playing wing-backs when you have Cissokho and Hutton. No point playing a 4 in midfield if you don't have natural width or players that can exact change when they get on the ball.

No point playing two up front if we don't pass or cross effectively. I think Black and Garde have tried to chop and change the starting line-up to try and luckily finds one that works. In all fairness we should have had 4 points from the last 2 games and we did play well at Watford (ish) and he did manage to avoid having the worst record in terms of consecutive defeats by being negative.

Going gung-ho would have been crazy, trying to attack more would have been crazy as we haven't shown that we're adept at very much all season.The mood of the crowd isn't going to be heightened by Black losing 7-1 every week even though we've attacked more and played more kids.

[paul_e]

Just to sumarise my thinking here.  I don't particularly like Black and and don't think he has done a great job.  But equally, he's been in charge for 6 games and took over an impossible position.  There are arguments for and against chucking in the kids, other than Toner he's chosen not to.  Whether I agree with that or not, I can understand why.

But my real point is I just think the level of vitriol and hate is massively disproportionate to his role in the total clusterfuck of this season.  And specifically, singling him out so much whilst Remi gets off the hook just seems entirely unreasonable.

I don't hate him, I just think he's completely misunderstood the mood of the fans and the needs of the club and has created a lot more hostility than he needed to.  The difference between him and Garde is that you could see the point of what he was trying to do.  He didn't do it very well and he got sacked because of that but it was understandable.  What's not understandable is picking 5 at the back and 3 holding midfielders at home to a side that are in the bottom 3 when you're already relegated.  As you say that's his choice but it's one that the fans see as cowardly, to exacerbate that by not making any changes until the 85th minute just screams of surrender and after all the shit we've put up with that's just not acceptable.

So Black's job is simply to gauge and assuage the mood of the fans? That is simply not the case. Plus I think it's the other way round I can see what Black is trying to do with the team selections in trying to tighten us up whereas Garde , well i'm still not too sure what he tried to do. i don't necessarily blame the managers for that but the players at his disposal. no point playing wing-backs when you have Cissokho and Hutton. No point playing a 4 in midfield if you don't have natural width or players that can exact change when they get on the ball.

No point playing two up front if we don't pass or cross effectively. I think Black and Garde have tried to chop and change the starting line-up to try and luckily finds one that works. In all fairness we should have had 4 points from the last 2 games and we did play well at Watford (ish) and he did manage to avoid having the worst record in terms of consecutive defeats by being negative.

Going gung-ho would have been crazy, trying to attack more would have been crazy as we haven't shown that we're adept at very much all season.The mood of the crowd isn't going to be heightened by Black losing 7-1 every week even though we've attacked more and played more kids.

Using the bold bit in defence of Black after that's exactly what he did against Watford.

Why do you assume people want gung-ho?  I just think not having a single shot on target at home to a team that are going down with you is shameful.

Oh and back to the first line, yes that is his job, he's a caretaker, his responsibility is to not make things worse but, by his selections, he's pissed the fans off enough to make the atmosphere worse than it needed to be.  On that measure he has failed in the 1 key thing he should be judged on.  Results, clean sheets, goals scored, none of those were going to make or break his reputation (unless he got a 100% win record and kept us up) but treating the fans like morons and picking a team that gets booed when it's announced has broken him as far as most Villa fans are concerned.

[aj2k77]

If Black wanted to give Grealish a boost then maybe he could have given him some play time...

Maybe he isn't up to it at the moment?  He hasn't done anything all season and Remi didn't pick him either.  We really don't know the reasons do we?

Maybe, but then again maybe you are making it up, we don't know. What we do know is he hasn't picked him and has picked complete plodders instead, all the facts from his team selections and ''tactics'' point to a safety first mentality.

[AVH87]

The least Black could have done was try and entertain the long suffering fans by picking Grealish and/or Traore in some of his home games, rather than the tried and failed Richardson, Sinclair, etc.

[chrisw1]

If Black wanted to give Grealish a boost then maybe he could have given him some play time...

Maybe he isn't up to it at the moment?  He hasn't done anything all season and Remi didn't pick him either.  We really don't know the reasons do we?

Maybe, but then again maybe you are making it up, we don't know. What we do know is he hasn't picked him and has picked complete plodders instead, all the facts from his team selections and ''tactics'' point to a safety first mentality.

I'm not making anything up.  I'm just saying we don't know why he hasn't picked him.  Maybe for similar reasons that Remi didn't pick him very much in the worst team in Villa history either?  He just hasn't done it this season for whatever reason.  Black has been gracious enough to try to give him a boost for next season and he gets pelters for it?  People need to get a grip.  Black isn't the reason we are where we are today.

[paul_e]

The least Black could have done was try and entertain the long suffering fans by picking Grealish and/or Traore in some of his home games, rather than the tried and failed Richardson, Sinclair, etc.

Even if he doesn't want to start them for some reason both have shown that they can come on and influence games and yet they've been given a few minutes each despite us looking incapable of creating anything like a decent chance.

[Risso]

that team he picked for the last game of the season for the fans was an absolute disgrace

The team that got our first point in in the last 12 games?  The team that kept our first clean sheet since February?  The team that stopped Newcastle fans jubilantly dancing on our graves?  You mean that team?

Wow, way to describe a dismal 0-0 with the next worst team in the league.