Eric Black

[chrisw1]

He had an impossible job. 

Disagree.  He came in for a few games in a no pressure situation.  He could have chosen to tray and give the whole place a lift, but instead went safety first and made some bizarre and infuriating team selections. 

As stated there are rational reasons for his team selections.  Just because you don't agree with them doesn't mean you're right and he's wrong.

[paul_e]

He had an impossible job. 

Disagree.  He came in for a few games in a no pressure situation.  He could have chosen to tray and give the whole place a lift, but instead went safety first and made some bizarre and infuriating team selections. 

As stated there are rational reasons for his team selections.  Just because you don't agree with them doesn't mean you're right and he's wrong.

No, but 4 defeats in 4 means he's clearly not right either.

So if we're going to lose lets do it in a way that the fans can at least see a point to, richardson is out of contract in a few weeks, why play him when we know he has no future here?  The same can be argued for all of the other players who the fans don't want, by picking them he makes his own job harder, that'as why people are angry with him.

[Ads]

I've been thinking that if I had been in the game a long time and had been brought up with iron ethos of discipline and effort, I would be tempted to hang those that can't be bothered out to dry and force them to endure the toxicity.

The players can hear it, make no mistake.

[brian green]

I hope you are right Ads but I suspect Black is a throwback to the "us and them" mindset of professional footballers towards fans.

Hillsborough has had me thinking all over again how abused and degraded football followers have always been in the media and in the corridors of power - political corridors and football corridors.

Black may be old school who, like O'Neill has a very low opinion of those who only watch the game.  MON is on record with his statement about about fans "giving you dog's abuse".  Black sees it as his duty to support his players and oppose those who criticise them.  He acknowledges no duty to the fans nor accepts that criticism of the players is very much deserved.

[peter w]

That's quite astounding, to criticise Black and use Hillsborough in any context whilst criticising him. Black is bad (not sure) but hillsborough and fans (oh, Black must be bad). Come on, that was cheap.

Look, Black is the side show. he is large;y irrelevant here. We've won 3 in the league all season and 5 all told. That he is playing Bacuna or not playing Adama, or sticks with lescott, and hasn't turned to Green really isn't the issue. Its like the soldiers on the front line at the Somme arguing that the Generals are using the rickety old ladders with 4 rungs to go over the top rather than the newly made 5 runged ladders that are more fit for purpose.

3 managers the season have failed which tends to tell us that the problem is deeper than just picking this player or that player. Black is a sideshow. The anger, ire, disapproval should be aimed towards where it matters.

[PaulWinch again]

He had an impossible job. 

Disagree.  He came in for a few games in a no pressure situation.  He could have chosen to tray and give the whole place a lift, but instead went safety first and made some bizarre and infuriating team selections. 

As stated there are rational reasons for his team selections.  Just because you don't agree with them doesn't mean you're right and he's wrong.

No, but 4 defeats in 4 means he's clearly not right either.

So if we're going to lose lets do it in a way that the fans can at least see a point to, richardson is out of contract in a few weeks, why play him when we know he has no future here?  The same can be argued for all of the other players who the fans don't want, by picking them he makes his own job harder, that'as why people are angry with him.

That is exactly my feeling as well. We might well still have lost all our games, but I guarentee seeing the likes of Traore and Green would make the fans much easier on the team and consequently improve the atmosphere.

[peter w]

You guarantee it?

[chrisw1]

That's quite astounding, to criticise Black and use Hillsborough in any context whilst criticising him. Black is bad (not sure) but hillsborough and fans (oh, Black must be bad). Come on, that was cheap.

Look, Black is the side show. he is large;y irrelevant here. We've won 3 in the league all season and 5 all told. That he is playing Bacuna or not playing Adama, or sticks with lescott, and hasn't turned to Green really isn't the issue. Its like the soldiers on the front line at the Somme arguing that the Generals are using the rickety old ladders with 4 rungs to go over the top rather than the newly made 5 runged ladders that are more fit for purpose.

3 managers the season have failed which tends to tell us that the problem is deeper than just picking this player or that player. Black is a sideshow. The anger, ire, disapproval should be aimed towards where it matters.

I've been finding myself agreeing with you a lot lately PW.

[chrisw1]

He had an impossible job. 

Disagree.  He came in for a few games in a no pressure situation.  He could have chosen to tray and give the whole place a lift, but instead went safety first and made some bizarre and infuriating team selections. 

As stated there are rational reasons for his team selections.  Just because you don't agree with them doesn't mean you're right and he's wrong.

No, but 4 defeats in 4 means he's clearly not right either.

So if we're going to lose lets do it in a way that the fans can at least see a point to, richardson is out of contract in a few weeks, why play him when we know he has no future here?  The same can be argued for all of the other players who the fans don't want, by picking them he makes his own job harder, that'as why people are angry with him.

That is exactly my feeling as well. We might well still have lost all our games, but I guarentee seeing the likes of Traore and Green would make the fans much easier on the team and consequently improve the atmosphere.

I can pretty much guarantee if we were losing by a hatful and Traore was losing the ball for a 4th or 5th time in the game the crowd would have turned on him too.

[john e]

I hope you are right Ads but I suspect Black is a throwback to the "us and them" mindset of professional footballers towards fans.

Hillsborough has had me thinking all over again how abused and degraded football followers have always been in the media and in the corridors of power - political corridors and football corridors.

Black may be old school who, like O'Neill has a very low opinion of those who only watch the game.  MON is on record with his statement about about fans "giving you dog's abuse".  Black sees it as his duty to support his players and oppose those who criticise them.  He acknowledges no duty to the fans nor accepts that criticism of the players is very much deserved.

He's not supporting his players though, he's telling everyone how shit it is behind closed doors
I personally don't have a problem with this, but it's hardly siding with the players if he's openly slagging them

[peter w]

Without doubt

[PaulWinch again]

He had an impossible job. 

Disagree.  He came in for a few games in a no pressure situation.  He could have chosen to tray and give the whole place a lift, but instead went safety first and made some bizarre and infuriating team selections. 

As stated there are rational reasons for his team selections.  Just because you don't agree with them doesn't mean you're right and he's wrong.

No, but 4 defeats in 4 means he's clearly not right either.

So if we're going to lose lets do it in a way that the fans can at least see a point to, richardson is out of contract in a few weeks, why play him when we know he has no future here?  The same can be argued for all of the other players who the fans don't want, by picking them he makes his own job harder, that'as why people are angry with him.

That is exactly my feeling as well. We might well still have lost all our games, but I guarentee seeing the likes of Traore and Green would make the fans much easier on the team and consequently improve the atmosphere.

I can pretty much guarantee if we were losing by a hatful and Traore was losing the ball for a 4th or 5th time in the game the crowd would have turned on him too.

Maybe, but the crowd certainly would have started the game with a better mindset. Black's selections have been dreadfully negative and have brought no success. People are always prepared to forgive more when a manager shows a bit of adventure. Black has shown none at all, when it was what the club and the fans desperately needed.

[paul_e]

He had an impossible job. 

Disagree.  He came in for a few games in a no pressure situation.  He could have chosen to tray and give the whole place a lift, but instead went safety first and made some bizarre and infuriating team selections. 

As stated there are rational reasons for his team selections.  Just because you don't agree with them doesn't mean you're right and he's wrong.

No, but 4 defeats in 4 means he's clearly not right either.

So if we're going to lose lets do it in a way that the fans can at least see a point to, richardson is out of contract in a few weeks, why play him when we know he has no future here?  The same can be argued for all of the other players who the fans don't want, by picking them he makes his own job harder, that'as why people are angry with him.

That is exactly my feeling as well. We might well still have lost all our games, but I guarentee seeing the likes of Traore and Green would make the fans much easier on the team and consequently improve the atmosphere.

I can pretty much guarantee if we were losing by a hatful and Traore was losing the ball for a 4th or 5th time in the game the crowd would have turned on him too.

That really depends doesn't it and simplifying it down to the level that you have doesn't help anyone.  If after 20 minutes he run with it 5-6 times beaten a man everytime and got 1 decent cross in but lost it the other times I think the fans would be singing his name and wondering why he hadn't started a league game before because at least we'd be seeing someone try.  Ayew loses the ball a fair bit but he loses it because he's trying to make something happen and fans will respond to that.

[peter w]

That's not simplifying it that's amplifying exactly what would happen when you have a crowd that want blood. Not the kids, nor Adama, but anyones. As has been said if Adama played crap the fans would have no release valve. No, "he should be playing so and so" so the atmosphere could, and I suggest would, get even more poisonous. That could have deeper more long term implications.

Whatever you think for 3 games we should circle the wagons and be positive as much as possible in our support.

[old man villa fan]

That's not simplifying it that's amplifying exactly what would happen when you have a crowd that want blood. Not the kids, nor Adama, but anyones. As has been said if Adama played crap the fans would have no release valve. No, "he should be playing so and so" so the atmosphere could, and I suggest would, get even more poisonous. That could have deeper more long term implications.

Whatever you think for 3 games we should circle the wagons and be positive as much as possible in our support.

We are just drifting (sinking more like). The manager should be looking to get something positive out of the end of season,  however small.  Even if it just giving a couple more youngsters their debuts. Better now than next season.  Try different formations to put us more on the front foot. Anything but circle the wagons and just wait for the end of the season.